The Gathering Storm - Review with SPOILERS
Mark Erikson
up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
since LoC. It had some really, really important and powerful scenes.
It had action, stuff happened, stuff concluded...but more importantly,
it had a glut of those moments that WOT was once really famous for,
but which have been sorely lacking over the last four or five books;
those moments where a character comes into their own, when something
they've been building up to gets its payoff, and its about as good a
payoff as you could imagine.
It was also written by two different authors. The awesome part is,
sometimes you can't tell. The shitty part is, sometimes you can. I'm
left wanting to know what was written by who, and Sanderson's Foreword
suggests he wants to tell us once he's finished all three books. But
I wonder, for instance, whether "The Last That Could Be Done" didn't
have quite as much impact as I felt that chapter should have because
Sanderson just didn't quite pull it off, or because Jordan didn't.
Similarly, I want to know if I can credit RJ with "A Halo of
Blackness" (my favourite chapter in this book, and in the series for
quite some time) or whether Sanderson was really just doing an awesome
job at this point.
So,
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RAND:
I'm a glutton for Rand chapters. He's always been my favourite
character - as you'd hope with the main character - but he hasn't done
much over the last few books other than order Lords, Ladies and Aes
Sedai around. This time, we actually get some really cool, and
chilling, Rand chapters. We get quite a lot of them.
This is an angle on Rand that I've actually been hoping for over the
last few books. Once upon a time, I hated that Rand was growing
unstable. Now, I can think of no other direction I would have
preferred his character to go in. Especially after the moment with
the Domination Band (cool name) and Rand drawing on the TP, becoming
the coldest, nastiest bastard around. This was the payoff I was after
for Rand - the one where he just goes too far, and becomes what he's
been trying to become. In fact, I wished for exactly this in my
review of KoD four years ago (towards the bottom of the page).
The escape of Semirhage, I felt, could have been handled better. I
didn't like that she was broken by Cadsuane just moments before her
escape, as it made the actual breaking pointless, and reduced her
scariness when she actuall had control of Rand. I also didn't like
that she was kept in the room next door to Rand. Surely, plotting
wise, it would have been just as easy to have the Aes Sedai Travel to
some remote prison to question her, and then have Elza lead Semi back
to Rand once she was free. Finally, I'm not sure I liked Shaidar
Haran taking a direct hand in freeing her. Although, I suspect the
whole point of the DO's plan here was not to get his Forsaken back,
but rather to drive Rand to touch the TP via whatever is linking him
to Moridin. The merging or whatever is going on between them.
I was also happy to see Rand go on to be an emotionless tyrant after
this. The death of Graendal[1] was not, for me, as disappointing as
others seem to have found it. I liked seeing Rand be both clever and
terrifying at the same time. His plan was actually quite neat. He
took a sword to the Gordian knot. And, it was also appropriately
chilling. As was his uncaring departure from Bandar Eban.
The ultimate climax of this was, of course, his meeting with Tam. For
the most part, it worked, and worked really well. Having him almost
become a Kinslayer, then attempt to continue on his course of
destruction, and finally confront himself on Dragonmount were all
appropriately epic. I'd found Moridin's revelation that he was
perfectly aware that the DO intended to destroy everything, including
his servants, to be appropriately awesome. Ishamael always sounded as
if he had a fairly complete understanding of how the Pattern worked,
and as Moridin he seems to think the good thing to do is to destroy
it. Not because he himself seeks oblivion, but because he has looked
at it philosophically and come away with the knowledge that the whole
thing is pointless.
To have Rand come to the same conclusion was only natural, the way he
was going. And he steps right to the brink of actually destroying the
Pattern. What's more, I agreed with him while I was reading it. The
book had, by this point, made a good case for Rand's actions. That
love was ultimately what made Rand step back was a little cheesy,
though right after it was a line that was affecting, and I think
Rand's whole final epiphany should have been distilled down to it: If
I live again, then maybe she does to. Ilyena gets another life.
Basically, Rand is choosing between life itself being worthwhile, or
pointless. The blather about love and joy and hope just clouded that
really simple choice with sappiness. However, I still got the point,
so I guess it worked.
I do not think the final tidbit from the Essanik Cycle actually
refered to this event, though. It doesn't quite fit. That wasn't the
"final storm", it was just a brief tempest Rand stirred up. Lews
Therin and Rand didn't join together, they were always the same person
(thus, Lews Therin was indeed real, insofar as Rand's soul can
remember the AoL, but also not real, insofar as he was just an element
of Rand's own psyche). And Rand was laughing, not weeping. I still
think he is going to go blind, and be a beggar (if his brief jaunt
through Ebou Dar in brown clothing was the fulfillment of that
particular prophecy, then why bother even prophecising it?) and
ultimately die. His soul will go into Logain's body, and he will weep
over his own grave.
Finally for Rand, his new sword. At first, I was baffled at how he
was supposed to remember a centuries old sword. But then the
suggestion that Falme reminded him of the sword was too obvious. So,
which one of the Heroes of the Horn does the sword belong to?
EGWENE:
It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
actually think of anything more to add, really.
Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
MAT:
I didn't like Mat's chapters. I didn't like how Mat's dialogue was
written (he seemed to be fine when he was just thinking, but the
moment he opened his mouth he just made me cringe). I thought there
would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was. I was
expecting Fain to pop up and reveal that he was corrupting the town or
something. Using the Pattern fraying as an excuse to throw in some
zombie chases was kinda...crap. Especially at this end of the story,
where I feel like everything that happens should be pointed in the
direction of the conclusion, not just there to squeeze in some more
zombies.
However, I have a suspicion that this was not a Sanderson idea. "The
Tipsy Gelding" did not suffer from unfunny Mat syndrome, and so I
think RJ may have written that chapter, with Sanderson writing the
follow up.
PERRIN:
What's to say. Nothing happened. Although I did like that the death
of Rolan was actually addressed. I really was unhappy with how that
went down in KoD, so having Faile actually burning with guilt worked.
VERIN:
Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
Even cooler was her description of the Forsaken. Finally, an
explanation of why they just aren't anywhere near as scary as they
were described in tEotW. And one that makes the DO seem even more
scary. Just what is the ultimate goal of the DO?
SEANCHAN:
The Seanchan continue to be both hateable and likeable. Tuon is a
little shit, but I liked the implications of her deciding that Rand
had to be stopped. It was both a recognition of how powerful Rand has
become, and how terrible.
However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
Also, I hope Rand never bows before the Empress. It seems their
prophecies actually hold some truth - but I'm pretty sure that the
Guide explicitly said that Ishy altered them to say the Dragon Reborn
would bow, rather than bind them to him.
The Bloodknives were lame. I suspect they are a Sanderson creation.
They felt like something out of D&D with their super powers, and those
ter'angreal didn't behave like any others we've seen before (activated
by blood?). What can you do with a plot element like that? Have a
cool fight? Whatever.
FAIN:
Fain did not appear in this book, but I mention this because an
explanation of what Mordeth was, and how Shadar Logoth was the
opposite kind of evil to the DO, is probably my biggest desire for the
next two books. My pet theory is that Mordeth was something created
during the Breaking in an attempt to counter the taint, but it
seriously backfired.
TO SUM UP:
WOT still has, as far as stories go, the best one around. Sanderson
is not the author RJ was, but he's close enough. There are annoying
things in there. The characters still don't communicate very well for
plot reasons. They also repeat themselves, over and over and over.
But it isn't like this is anything new to WOT. And this is a damn
good WOT book. Hopefully, Towers of Midnight can continue this trend.
[1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
Pelle
> This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
> since LoC. It had some really, really important and powerful scenes.
> It had action, stuff happened, stuff concluded...but more importantly,
> it had a glut of those moments that WOT was once really famous for,
> but which have been sorely lacking over the last four or five books;
> those moments where a character comes into their own, when something
> they've been building up to gets its payoff, and its about as good a
> payoff as you could imagine.
Agreed completely. Not the best ending, but overall a very good book.
At least there wasn't a big cliff hanger like in the last two.
>
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> I was also happy to see Rand go on to be an emotionless tyrant after
> this. The death of Graendal[1] was not, for me, as disappointing as
> others seem to have found it. I liked seeing Rand be both clever and
> terrifying at the same time. His plan was actually quite neat. He
> took a sword to the Gordian knot. And, it was also appropriately
> chilling. As was his uncaring departure from Bandar Eban.
Hrm, it was a bit abrupt, but I guess you have a point. But I don't
really see the point of her POV with the other Forsaken when she's
just going to be killed right after. I guess it could've been to not
reveal too much about Demandred or Mesaana though, we haven't really
had much info about those two.
> His soul will go into Logain's body, and he will weep
> over his own grave.
I still hold to my old theory of him ending up in T'A'R when dying and
then getting pushed out in a similar way as Birgitte. Though the flaw
is of course who's gonna do the channeling. None of the good guys know
that weave (Nynaeve was blocked from seeing).
> EGWENE:
>
> Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
Well, they'll have to torture it out of her, but it probably won't
take long...
>
> MAT:
>
> I didn't like Mat's chapters. I didn't like how Mat's dialogue was
> written (he seemed to be fine when he was just thinking, but the
> moment he opened his mouth he just made me cringe).
Same here. He felt like Perrin used to feel to me, moaning about his
wife. Let's hope it was temporary.
> I thought there would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was.
It felt like a plot setup to me, to be revisited in later books.
People that dies there at nighttime comes back to life...
> PERRIN:
>
> What's to say. Nothing happened. Although I did like that the death
> of Rolan was actually addressed. I really was unhappy with how that
> went down in KoD, so having Faile actually burning with guilt worked.
I liked the Perrin chapters this time through, which is probably a
first for me. Glad to finally be rid of the prophet too.
> VERIN:
>
> Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
Verrin is always awesome. :)
> SEANCHAN:
>
> Also, I hope Rand never bows before the Empress. It seems their
> prophecies actually hold some truth - but I'm pretty sure that the
> Guide explicitly said that Ishy altered them to say the Dragon Reborn
> would bow, rather than bind them to him.
I can find no such mention in the guide in the chapters about
Seanchan, Profecies of the Dragon or Ishamael, but I only skimmed
them... In fact the chapter about Ishamael says "No such connections
[that Ishamael was free] exists during the War of the Hundred Years,
but it is hardly impossible given the other evidence."
Still, it's more easy to believe the Seanchan falsified the prophesies
than that Randland did. But I still think the most likely conclusion
is that both are true...
> TO SUM UP:
>
> WOT still has, as far as stories go, the best one around. Sanderson
> is not the author RJ was, but he's close enough. There are annoying
> things in there. The characters still don't communicate very well for
> plot reasons. They also repeat themselves, over and over and over.
> But it isn't like this is anything new to WOT. And this is a damn
> good WOT book. Hopefully, Towers of Midnight can continue this trend.
The Seanchan chapters in the guide did mention the Towers of Midnight
though, but maybe I'm the only one that didn't already knew that.
Quotes:
"For all her trouble Deain was rewarded with imprisonment of he own
device. She was, after all, Aes Sedai and thus not to be trusted. It
is said her screams 'shook the Towers of Midnight'"
"Imfaral [is the] location of the Towers of Midnight"
http://wot.wikia.com/wiki/Towers_of_Midnight knows even more though.
>
> [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
> into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
I'm not sure a big ray of balefire necessarily equals a strong one. I
don't think it'll undo anything we've seen so far.
--
Pelle Johansson
Mark Erikson
> On Nov 11, 6:28 am, Mark Erikson <mark.t.erik...@gmail.com> wrote:
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> > [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> > Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> > that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
> > into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
>
> I'm not sure a big ray of balefire necessarily equals a strong one. I
> don't think it'll undo anything we've seen so far.
This has been confirmed by Sanderson. He's said that even with the
full power of the Choedan Kal, the furthest back you could burn
someone's thread would be about nine days.
pbo...@aol.com
> Okay, I'm posting this to good old rasfwr-j just to see what it stirs
> up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
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Since I'm commenting on things in your intro with spoilers...
> This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
> since LoC. It had some really, really important and powerful scenes.
> It had action, stuff happened, stuff concluded...but more importantly,
> it had a glut of those moments that WOT was once really famous for,
> but which have been sorely lacking over the last four or five books;
> those moments where a character comes into their own, when something
> they've been building up to gets its payoff, and its about as good a
> payoff as you could imagine.
Agreed, with the exception of Graendal - after all the scheming we've
been anticipating she just gets wiped out without so much as a face-to-
face chat?
Overall, this is extremely strong - I actually felt genuine tension
reading the showdown with Semirhage, something I can't remember ever
getting from a book before. But with so much lag in the previous few
volumes it does rather show that Sanderson's rushing a bit too fast to
get things concluded - after a book or two in which Egwene achieved
nothing at all she sways Farene and the others so quickly I was
initially sure they must have been trying to set a trap for her. And
everyone gets majicked around the countryside by Travelling in one way
or another.
A lot of people were disappointed with the perfunctory way Semirhage
was dealt with in the last book, captured without any real fight, but
I thought it a very clever payoff for the Dark One to sacrifice her to
force Rand to use the True Power.
> EGWENE:
>
> It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
> chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
> badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
> actually think of anything more to add, really.
>
> Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
Only if they know Elaida can. Yes, I was mostly reading to get to the
next Egwene chapter most of the time, amazingly for a character I
never much liked! It was handled too quickly and neatly, tying up half
a dozen plot threads and Min's visions from her time in the Tower to
boot in a way that emphasised how little set-up the previous few books
had actually given this subplot, but Egwene was great. I found it
slightly disappointing to have no Elaida PoV chapters this time,
though - I didn't feel Sanderson handled her character terribly well
> MAT:
>
> I didn't like Mat's chapters. I didn't like how Mat's dialogue was
> written (he seemed to be fine when he was just thinking, but the
> moment he opened his mouth he just made me cringe).
Agreed - when did he become a cockney? It wasn't *as* bad as I'd heard
it might have been - just a bit of incongruous dialogue here or there.
I thought there
> would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was. I was
> expecting Fain to pop up and reveal that he was corrupting the town or
> something. Using the Pattern fraying as an excuse to throw in some
> zombie chases was kinda...crap. Especially at this end of the story,
> where I feel like everything that happens should be pointed in the
> direction of the conclusion, not just there to squeeze in some more
> zombies.
Yes, it did feel a lot like an event that belonged in an earlier book.
> However, I have a suspicion that this was not a Sanderson idea. "The
> Tipsy Gelding" did not suffer from unfunny Mat syndrome, and so I
> think RJ may have written that chapter, with Sanderson writing the
> follow up.
Really? Mat's suffered from unfunny Mat syndrome for about 11 books
under Jordan... His dialogue was pretty poor, but for a rarity he
actually came across as a character - in past books I've always found
him the least interesting of the three leads, the one who relies most
on having things happening around him to grab the attention because
the character himself has nothing to do so.
> VERIN:
>
> Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
Shame she had to die, though. I didn't have any preconceptions about
what to expect with Verin, although I doubted she was Black - during
the first part of her meeting I was expecting that to be some kind of
test. The explanation fit very well, however.
> Even cooler was her description of the Forsaken. Finally, an
> explanation of why they just aren't anywhere near as scary as they
> were described in tEotW.
Did we need one? It's been a longstanding motif of the series that
legends are different from the reality; the Forsaken were scary when
they were legends. It's been pointed out before that they're not
really anything more than very powerful Dreadlords.
> SEANCHAN:
>
> The Seanchan continue to be both hateable and likeable.
We didn't get to see any of the likeable ones, though... I was
surprised how far Tuon was ready to go to oppose Rand, though; I
hadn't expected her to be the one ordering the attack on the Tower.
> However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
> Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
> still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
I'd like to think it's not how Elaida will be written out of the
story, but I doubt we'll see her again.
> [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
> into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
I thought it was established Asmodean had been balefired - didn't the
Dark One say he'd died the final death, along with Rahvin? Though why
Graendal as the killer?
Phil
Brinner
> Okay, I'm posting this to good old rasfwr-j just to see what it stirs
> up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
>
> This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
> since LoC. It had some really, really important and powerful scenes.
> It had action, stuff happened, stuff concluded...but more importantly,
> it had a glut of those moments that WOT was once really famous for,
> but which have been sorely lacking over the last four or five books;
> those moments where a character comes into their own, when something
> they've been building up to gets its payoff, and its about as good a
> payoff as you could imagine.
>
Agreed, there was a wonderful pace to the book, nothing that seemed an
aside or unnecessary in any way. The only thing that bordered on a
disraction was the Mat chapters, but I suppose that led up to him
meeting Verin. I wonder what the letter says? I'm guessing
instructions on how to rescue Moirane.
> It was also written by two different authors. The awesome part is,
> sometimes you can't tell. The shitty part is, sometimes you can. I'm
> left wanting to know what was written by who, and Sanderson's Foreword
> suggests he wants to tell us once he's finished all three books. But
> I wonder, for instance, whether "The Last That Could Be Done" didn't
> have quite as much impact as I felt that chapter should have because
> Sanderson just didn't quite pull it off, or because Jordan didn't.
> Similarly, I want to know if I can credit RJ with "A Halo of
> Blackness" (my favourite chapter in this book, and in the series for
> quite some time) or whether Sanderson was really just doing an awesome
> job at this point.
>
I am planning on doing a full re read starting this week, I wonder how
much Sandersons writing will stand out once I've done that. While
reading the book, I couldn't really tell.
Well apart for the Bloodknives, that just seemed out of line with TWOT
in general. Although the Seanchan had been making Ter'angreal already.
> RAND:
>
> I'm a glutton for Rand chapters. He's always been my favourite
> character - as you'd hope with the main character - but he hasn't done
> much over the last few books other than order Lords, Ladies and Aes
> Sedai around. This time, we actually get some really cool, and
> chilling, Rand chapters. We get quite a lot of them.
>
Same here, I always look forward to Rand chapters more than any other.
Apart for losing a hand, he really didn't do much since cleansing
Saidin.
> This is an angle on Rand that I've actually been hoping for over the
> last few books. Once upon a time, I hated that Rand was growing
> unstable. Now, I can think of no other direction I would have
> preferred his character to go in. Especially after the moment with
> the Domination Band (cool name) and Rand drawing on the TP, becoming
> the coldest, nastiest bastard around. This was the payoff I was after
> for Rand - the one where he just goes too far, and becomes what he's
> been trying to become. In fact, I wished for exactly this in my
> review of KoD four years ago (towards the bottom of the page).
>
> The escape of Semirhage, I felt, could have been handled better. I
> didn't like that she was broken by Cadsuane just moments before her
> escape, as it made the actual breaking pointless, and reduced her
> scariness when she actuall had control of Rand. I also didn't like
> that she was kept in the room next door to Rand. Surely, plotting
> wise, it would have been just as easy to have the Aes Sedai Travel to
> some remote prison to question her, and then have Elza lead Semi back
> to Rand once she was free. Finally, I'm not sure I liked Shaidar
> Haran taking a direct hand in freeing her. Although, I suspect the
> whole point of the DO's plan here was not to get his Forsaken back,
> but rather to drive Rand to touch the TP via whatever is linking him
> to Moridin. The merging or whatever is going on between them.
>
The Semirhage escape was a bit disapointing alright, but once Rand
channeled the TP and went all dark, I definatly think it was part of
the DO's plan to have him channel the TP to escape and thereby driving
him close to the darkside.
Why do you think his soul will go into Logains body? Is Narishma not
the prophesised to be the one to "follow after " Rand?
> Finally for Rand, his new sword. At first, I was baffled at how he
> was supposed to remember a centuries old sword. But then the
> suggestion that Falme reminded him of the sword was too obvious. So,
> which one of the Heroes of the Horn does the sword belong to?
>
Artur Hawkwing I reckon. It'll come into play next time he meets the
Seanchan.
> EGWENE:
>
> It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
> chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
> badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
> actually think of anything more to add, really.
>
> Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
>
The Seanchan were going to get channeling sooner or later, it'll allow
them to turn up a the Last Battle in a surprise move. Like the
Roharrim in LOTR.
> MAT:
>
> PERRIN:
>
You could have done that for Mat and Perrin, no movement at all
really.
> VERIN:
>
> Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
>
Brilliant in fact.
> Even cooler was her description of the Forsaken. Finally, an
> explanation of why they just aren't anywhere near as scary as they
> were described in tEotW. And one that makes the DO seem even more
> scary. Just what is the ultimate goal of the DO?
To end it all, TWOT is his prison after all. Stop the wheel and he can
escape.
> SEANCHAN:
>
> The Seanchan continue to be both hateable and likeable. Tuon is a
> little shit, but I liked the implications of her deciding that Rand
> had to be stopped. It was both a recognition of how powerful Rand has
> become, and how terrible.
>
> However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
> Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
> still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
>
> Also, I hope Rand never bows before the Empress. It seems their
> prophecies actually hold some truth - but I'm pretty sure that the
> Guide explicitly said that Ishy altered them to say the Dragon Reborn
> would bow, rather than bind them to him.
>
I think the new laughing Rand will bow to Tuon, or whatever her new
name is, in a gesture of conciliation. He won't subgigate(sp?) himself
however.
> The Bloodknives were lame. I suspect they are a Sanderson creation.
> They felt like something out of D&D with their super powers, and those
> ter'angreal didn't behave like any others we've seen before (activated
> by blood?). What can you do with a plot element like that? Have a
> cool fight? Whatever.
>
> FAIN:
>
> Fain did not appear in this book, but I mention this because an
> explanation of what Mordeth was, and how Shadar Logoth was the
> opposite kind of evil to the DO, is probably my biggest desire for the
> next two books. My pet theory is that Mordeth was something created
> during the Breaking in an attempt to counter the taint, but it
> seriously backfired.
>
Interesting theory.
> TO SUM UP:
>
> WOT still has, as far as stories go, the best one around. Sanderson
> is not the author RJ was, but he's close enough. There are annoying
> things in there. The characters still don't communicate very well for
> plot reasons. They also repeat themselves, over and over and over.
> But it isn't like this is anything new to WOT. And this is a damn
> good WOT book. Hopefully, Towers of Midnight can continue this trend.
One can only hope, with 2 books left the pace needs to be kept high.
> [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
> into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
You little scamp.
Brinner
Kristoffer Björkman
70b968...@z41g2000yqz.googlegroups.com>, Pelle says...
> On Nov 11, 6:28 am, Mark Erikson <mark.t.erik...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I thought there would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was.
> It felt like a plot setup to me, to be revisited in later books.
Corroborated by Brandon's statement as reported in the Lexington Storm
Leader Report.
"Brandon says of the five Redarms that enter Hinderstap with Mat that
the three that seem unaccounted for when everyone else escapes are not
?forgotten? and their circumstances are RAFO."
http://www.dragonmount.com/News/?p=1031
//
--
This cookie has a scrap of paper inside. It reads:
N pelfgny cyngr znvy jvyy abg ehfg.
Chucky@Work
> Okay, I'm posting this to good old rasfwr-j just to see what it stirs
> up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
Holy crap, it's Mr. Erikson.
> This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
> since LoC.
I'd have to concur.
> It was also written by two different authors. The awesome part is,
> sometimes you can't tell. The shitty part is, sometimes you can. I'm
> left wanting to know what was written by who, and Sanderson's Foreword
> suggests he wants to tell us once he's finished all three books.
I skipped that. Not really interested. But now that I've read the
story I would be interested to see how much of this was planned out,
how much of it was a Jordan-fuelled retcon, and how much was pure
Sanderson.
> But
> I wonder, for instance, whether "The Last That Could Be Done" didn't
> have quite as much impact as I felt that chapter should have because
> Sanderson just didn't quite pull it off, or because Jordan didn't.
I didn't get much of a sense of Rand having an epiphany here, myself.
His encounter with Tam later on was much closer.
> So,
>
> S
>
> P
>
> O
>
> I
>
> L
>
> E
>
> R
>
> S
>
> P
>
> A
>
> C
>
> E
>
> RAND:
>
> The escape of Semirhage, I felt, could have been handled better. I
> didn't like that she was broken by Cadsuane just moments before her
> escape, as it made the actual breaking pointless, and reduced her
> scariness when she actuall had control of Rand.
I didn't get that. If anything, her breaking was Cadsuane's finest
hour and definitely in the top ten of coolest scenes in this book. And
it made her *more* dangerous when she was let free.
Cadsuane making her cry didn't take away any of her skill or power.
Mind you, it also didn't provide them with any of the information they
needed, so it could have happened sooner. But if she had been broken
sooner, if she'd been giving up secrets and telling tales for several
weeks, maybe it *would* have detracted from her menace.
I got the distinct impression that as soon as she broke, Shadar Haran
turned up and gave her a little suicide mission. If she pulled it off,
fine. If not, then also fine. Either way, the pay-off was Rand
touching the True Power. Like you say further on down.
Shadar Haran was, I'm pretty sure, waiting to see if she would break
before giving her that assignment. Let's face it, he could have given
it to her the afternoon she was captured. Instead he gave it to her
the afternoon she finally broke under interrogation. As we rec.artists
love to say, coincidence? I think not!
> I also didn't like
> that she was kept in the room next door to Rand.
Heh, was she? I didn't catch that. Obviously didn't strike me as a
vital point, where she was. Not in a world with Traveling, as you say.
> Finally, I'm not sure I liked Shaidar
> Haran taking a direct hand in freeing her. Although, I suspect the
> whole point of the DO's plan here was not to get his Forsaken back,
> but rather to drive Rand to touch the TP via whatever is linking him
> to Moridin. The merging or whatever is going on between them.
Exactly so. I think Shadar Haran turned up at this particular time for
a very good reason.
> I was also happy to see Rand go on to be an emotionless tyrant after
> this. The death of Graendal[1] was not, for me, as disappointing as
> others seem to have found it.
They have? I haven't been reading the group much for fear of spoilers.
I have to say, I thought it was awesome.
> chilling. As was his uncaring departure from Bandar Eban.
Funny thing, in the scene when he leaves Bandar Eban, it says
something like "as soon as he stepped through the gateway, the crowd
erupted in cheers". I'm not sure if this was clumsily written on
purpose or not, but when I first read it, I thought it was the Domani
crowd bursting into cheers, not the Tairens.
> Not because he himself seeks oblivion, but because he has looked
> at it philosophically and come away with the knowledge that the whole
> thing is pointless.
>
> To have Rand come to the same conclusion was only natural, the way he
> was going.
Agreed.
> Finally for Rand, his new sword. At first, I was baffled at how he
> was supposed to remember a centuries old sword. But then the
> suggestion that Falme reminded him of the sword was too obvious. So,
> which one of the Heroes of the Horn does the sword belong to?
Hawkwing, obviously. I guess. I think.
> Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
I was half-hoping that Rand's final visit to the Seanchan base of
operations would end with him marching into the presence of the
Empress and kneeling before her, and saying "okay, fuck it, if one of
us has to be smart to save the universe, it's going to be me, so take
your arrogant moronity and choke on it, you tiny arrogant moron."
But this was before his big revelation on Dragonmount, so that
probably wasn't going to happen. Shame.
Maybe in the next book he'll get a chance to show Tuon what a fucking
twit she is.
> I thought there
> would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was.
Hinderstap was chilling, I liked all of the little bubbles of evil and
Pattern-rips that happened in this story. I like the way they're
growing. And is Rand's ta'veren effect purely causing bad things now
because of his merging with Moridin (the true meaning of the two faces
becoming one?) and his use of the True Power, or is it to do with his
decision to be cold as ice, or was it just nothing to do with him at
all?
> However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
> Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
> still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
Their insistence that all marath'damane have to be collared is going
to have to go. Or they'll be wiped off the face of the planet by
Egwene and Nynaeve. I just hope it happens sooner rather than later.
> Also, I hope Rand never bows before the Empress.
No no, I hope he does. That'll put her in her place. You know, bow to
her in a time and place of his choosing, it will actually leave him
more powerful.
> The Bloodknives were lame. I suspect they are a Sanderson creation.
Could've been cooler. Although it was a nice mix to show how a Warder
dealt with one.
> Fain did not appear in this book, but I mention this because an
> explanation of what Mordeth was, and how Shadar Logoth was the
> opposite kind of evil to the DO, is probably my biggest desire for the
> next two books. My pet theory is that Mordeth was something created
> during the Breaking in an attempt to counter the taint, but it
> seriously backfired.
Wasn't Mordeth the spirit of Shadar Logoth? We already got the story
behind that, way back in The Eye of the World.
But yeah, looking forward to Fain coming back and doing something
awful.
> The characters still don't communicate very well for
> plot reasons.
Huge improvements, though.
> [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> Rand balefire her?
Not far enough to bring him back, I think. Far enough to undo the
Compulsion on that dumbass courtier/lordling, but not much more than
that, I'd say. It would have undone too much.
But a good question ... the Pattern had a serious moment there, when
he balefired the whole fortress. What other repercussions will there
be?
> He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> that brought Mat back to life.
Rahvin had killed Mat a few minutes before, not months/years.
C@w
--
Asmodean wasn't even killed.
Chucky@Work
> Agreed, with the exception of Graendal - after all the scheming we've
> been anticipating she just gets wiped out without so much as a face-to-
> face chat?
Meh, we have enough evil genius monologuing from the other sources. I
liked the abruptness. It was a great solution, as Rand said, to facing
someone so much smarter than him.
> Overall, this is extremely strong - I actually felt genuine tension
> reading the showdown with Semirhage, something I can't remember ever
> getting from a book before. But with so much lag in the previous few
> volumes it does rather show that Sanderson's rushing a bit too fast to
> get things concluded - after a book or two in which Egwene achieved
> nothing at all she sways Farene and the others so quickly I was
> initially sure they must have been trying to set a trap for her. And
> everyone gets majicked around the countryside by Travelling in one way
> or another.
Well, to be fair, that's the way Traveling should have worked all
along. "People getting magicked around the countryside" is, I think,
what "Traveling" means in the Old Tongue.
> > Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> > changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
>
> Only if they know Elaida can.
Once they establish that she's not much good as a weapon, they'll
probably find it. I just hope we get some scenes mid- or post-breaking
so we can see her as a damane. Maybe when Egwene frees her. And then
stills and executes the fuck out of her.
> Yes, I was mostly reading to get to the
> next Egwene chapter most of the time, amazingly for a character I
> never much liked!
Hahahaha, me too. Amazing.
C@w
--
When's the next one out?
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
>
> So,
>
> S
>
> P
>
> O
>
> I
>
> L
>
> E
>
> R
>
> S
>
> P
>
> A
>
> C
>
> E
>
> RAND:
>
> The ultimate climax of this was, of course, his meeting with Tam. For
> the most part, it worked, and worked really well. Having him almost
> become a Kinslayer, then attempt to continue on his course of
> destruction, and finally confront himself on Dragonmount were all
> appropriately epic. I'd found Moridin's revelation that he was
> perfectly aware that the DO intended to destroy everything, including
> his servants, to be appropriately awesome. Ishamael always sounded as
> if he had a fairly complete understanding of how the Pattern worked,
> and as Moridin he seems to think the good thing to do is to destroy
> it. Not because he himself seeks oblivion, but because he has looked
> at it philosophically and come away with the knowledge that the whole
> thing is pointless.
>
> To have Rand come to the same conclusion was only natural, the way he
> was going. And he steps right to the brink of actually destroying the
> Pattern. What's more, I agreed with him while I was reading it. The
> book had, by this point, made a good case for Rand's actions. That
> love was ultimately what made Rand step back was a little cheesy,
> though right after it was a line that was affecting, and I think
> Rand's whole final epiphany should have been distilled down to it: If
> I live again, then maybe she does to. Ilyena gets another life.
Who is Ilyena reborn? Rand is in love with 3 women!
> Basically, Rand is choosing between life itself being worthwhile, or
> pointless. The blather about love and joy and hope just clouded that
> really simple choice with sappiness. However, I still got the point,
> so I guess it worked.
>
> I do not think the final tidbit from the Essanik Cycle actually
> refered to this event, though. It doesn't quite fit. That wasn't the
> "final storm", it was just a brief tempest Rand stirred up. Lews
> Therin and Rand didn't join together, they were always the same person
> (thus, Lews Therin was indeed real, insofar as Rand's soul can
> remember the AoL, but also not real, insofar as he was just an element
> of Rand's own psyche). And Rand was laughing, not weeping. I still
> think he is going to go blind, and be a beggar (if his brief jaunt
> through Ebou Dar in brown clothing was the fulfillment of that
> particular prophecy, then why bother even prophecising it?) and
> ultimately die. His soul will go into Logain's body, and he will weep
> over his own grave.
What will happen to Logain's own soul?
> EGWENE:
>
> It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
> chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
> badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
> actually think of anything more to add, really.
Egwene wonders if Mesaana is still hiding in the White Tower after all the
AS have been tested with the Oath Rod to verify that they are not
Darkfriends, meaning that Mesaana can defeat the Oath Rod. Why hasn't it
occured to Egwene that Mesaana might have completely concealed her ability
to channel. Didn't Nynaeve and Elayne tell Egwene about Moggy having done
so?
> [1] Okay, let's say Graendal killed Asmodean. Just how far back did
> Rand balefire her? He killed Rahvin with a much smaller beam, and
> that brought Mat back to life. Did Rand manage to balefire Asmo back
> into existence? Unless, of course, Asmo himself was balefired.
Asmo has been dead since the end of "Fires of Heaven". It would take
really strong balefire to bring him back!
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
Suppose we have 37 of the strongest women linked to 35 of the strongest men
and linked to the two Choedan Kals plus Callandor and the WT's fluted rod.
David DeLaney
>Mark Erikson wrote:
>> This has been confirmed by Sanderson. He's said that even with the
>> full power of the Choedan Kal, the furthest back you could burn
>> someone's thread would be about nine days.
>
>Suppose we have 37 of the strongest women linked to 35 of the strongest men
>and linked to the two Choedan Kals plus Callandor and the WT's fluted rod.
...worst WoT pornfic EVAR.
Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
> S
>
> P
>
> O
>
> I
>
> L
>
> E
>
> R
>
> S
>
> P
>
> A
>
> C
>
> E
>
> RAND:
>
> The ultimate climax of this was, of course, his meeting with Tam. For
> the most part, it worked, and worked really well. Having him almost
> become a Kinslayer, then attempt to continue on his course of
> destruction, and finally confront himself on Dragonmount were all
> appropriately epic. I'd found Moridin's revelation that he was
> perfectly aware that the DO intended to destroy everything, including
> his servants, to be appropriately awesome. Ishamael always sounded as
> if he had a fairly complete understanding of how the Pattern worked,
> and as Moridin he seems to think the good thing to do is to destroy
> it. Not because he himself seeks oblivion, but because he has looked
> at it philosophically and come away with the knowledge that the whole
> thing is pointless.
> VERIN:
>
> Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
>
> Even cooler was her description of the Forsaken. Finally, an
> explanation of why they just aren't anywhere near as scary as they
> were described in tEotW. And one that makes the DO seem even more
> scary. Just what is the ultimate goal of the DO?
According to Verin, the DO choose his top aides on the basis of their
selfishness. Meanwhile, the DO himself wants to completely destroy the
Pattern. Do all the Forsaken know this? Do any of the lower level
Darkfriends know this? I would expect a selfish person to object to total
destruction, since it would destroy said selfish person. How can you
enjoy your material possessions if the entire universe is destroyed?
I therefore urge that all the DFs be told that their master plans to
destroy the universe.
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
> MAT:
>
> I didn't like Mat's chapters. I didn't like how Mat's dialogue was
> written (he seemed to be fine when he was just thinking, but the
> moment he opened his mouth he just made me cringe). I thought there
> would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was. I was
> expecting Fain to pop up and reveal that he was corrupting the town or
> something. Using the Pattern fraying as an excuse to throw in some
> zombie chases was kinda...crap. Especially at this end of the story,
> where I feel like everything that happens should be pointed in the
> direction of the conclusion, not just there to squeeze in some more
> zombies.
Mat will soon be producing "nightflowers", which appear to be souped up
fireworks. This, combined with Traveling, will revolutionize warfare.
Imagine Rand's forces opening Gateways to Shayol Ghul and launching
rockets through the Gateways!
However, he needs mountains of bat guano, charcoal, sulfur, and all the
copper and tin the subcontinent can supply. Mat is going to have to go to
Rand for help in securing those supplies! When he does, I expect that
Rand will ask Mat why he kidnapped the Daughter of the Nine Moons, giving
Mat an opening to announce that he married her! Rand will then ask Mat to
go as his emissary to the DotNM to ask again for an Alliance.
Tim Bruening
Kristoffer Björkman wrote:
> In article <bef4de00-d074-40f9-abb2-
> 70b968...@z41g2000yqz.googlegroups.com>, Pelle says...
> > On Nov 11, 6:28 am, Mark Erikson <mark.t.erik...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I thought there would be more of a point to Hinderstap than there was.
> > It felt like a plot setup to me, to be revisited in later books.
>
> Corroborated by Brandon's statement as reported in the Lexington Storm
> Leader Report.
>
> "Brandon says of the five Redarms that enter Hinderstap with Mat that
> the three that seem unaccounted for when everyone else escapes are not
> ?forgotten? and their circumstances are RAFO."
> http://www.dragonmount.com/News/?p=1031
Might the residents of Hinderstap fight for the Shadow in Tarmon Gai'don?
Might Rand battle the DO in Hinderstap? Might other towns find themselves in
Hinderstap's circumstances?
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
> So,
>
> S
>
> P
>
> O
>
> I
>
> L
>
> E
>
> R
>
> S
>
> P
>
> A
>
> C
>
> E
>
> SEANCHAN:
>
> The Seanchan continue to be both hateable and likeable. Tuon is a
> little shit, but I liked the implications of her deciding that Rand
> had to be stopped. It was both a recognition of how powerful Rand has
> become, and how terrible.
>
> However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
> Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
> still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
I expect that Egwene will give the Hall a tongue lashing for giving up on
Elaida so easily, and point out that the White Tower has a responsibility
to the welfare of all AS and therefore a responsibility to rescue Elaida
and the other captives.
Tim Bruening
Brinner wrote:
> On Nov 11, 5:28 am, Mark Erikson <mark.t.erik...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Okay, I'm posting this to good old rasfwr-j just to see what it stirs
> > up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
> >
> > This is the best WOT book I've read in a zillion years. The best
> > since LoC. It had some really, really important and powerful scenes.
> > It had action, stuff happened, stuff concluded...but more importantly,
> > it had a glut of those moments that WOT was once really famous for,
> > but which have been sorely lacking over the last four or five books;
> > those moments where a character comes into their own, when something
> > they've been building up to gets its payoff, and its about as good a
> > payoff as you could imagine.
> >
>
> Agreed, there was a wonderful pace to the book, nothing that seemed an
> aside or unnecessary in any way. The only thing that bordered on a
> disraction was the Mat chapters, but I suppose that led up to him
> meeting Verin. I wonder what the letter says? I'm guessing
> instructions on how to rescue Moirane.
Why must Mat wait 10 days to open it?
> Same here, I always look forward to Rand chapters more than any other.
> Apart for losing a hand, he really didn't do much since cleansing
> Saidin.
I propose that a hand be harvested from a just killed man and Healed unto
Rand!
> > I do not think the final tidbit from the Essanik Cycle actually
> > refered to this event, though. It doesn't quite fit. That wasn't the
> > "final storm", it was just a brief tempest Rand stirred up. Lews
> > Therin and Rand didn't join together, they were always the same person
> > (thus, Lews Therin was indeed real, insofar as Rand's soul can
> > remember the AoL, but also not real, insofar as he was just an element
> > of Rand's own psyche). And Rand was laughing, not weeping. I still
> > think he is going to go blind, and be a beggar (if his brief jaunt
> > through Ebou Dar in brown clothing was the fulfillment of that
> > particular prophecy, then why bother even prophecising it?) and
> > ultimately die. His soul will go into Logain's body, and he will weep
> > over his own grave.
> >
> Why do you think his soul will go into Logains body? Is Narishma not
> the prophesised to be the one to "follow after " Rand?
Has anyone asked Logain or Narishma what they think of the above?
> > Finally for Rand, his new sword. At first, I was baffled at how he
> > was supposed to remember a centuries old sword. But then the
> > suggestion that Falme reminded him of the sword was too obvious. So,
> > which one of the Heroes of the Horn does the sword belong to?
> >
>
> Artur Hawkwing I reckon. It'll come into play next time he meets the
> Seanchan.
I propose that Mat blow the Horn of Valere and then order Artur Hawkwing to
talk sense to the Empress!
> > EGWENE:
> >
> > It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
> > chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
> > badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
> > actually think of anything more to add, really.
> >
> > Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> > changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
> >
>
> The Seanchan were going to get channeling sooner or later, it'll allow
> them to turn up a the Last Battle in a surprise move. Like the
> Roharrim in LOTR.
They have had channeling for over 1,000 years. When they get Traveling, I
imagine them making Gateways in the air and FLYING to'rakens and rakens
through!
> > VERIN:
> >
> > Yeah, Verrin was awesome. Very, very cool payoff.
> >
> Brilliant in fact.
>
> > Even cooler was her description of the Forsaken. Finally, an
> > explanation of why they just aren't anywhere near as scary as they
> > were described in tEotW. And one that makes the DO seem even more
> > scary. Just what is the ultimate goal of the DO?
>
> To end it all, TWOT is his prison after all. Stop the wheel and he can
> escape.
I bet that most DFs would oppose destroying the Pattern. When they learn
about the DO's total destruction plan, I expect some of them to revolt!
> > SEANCHAN:
> >
> > The Seanchan continue to be both hateable and likeable. Tuon is a
> > little shit, but I liked the implications of her deciding that Rand
> > had to be stopped. It was both a recognition of how powerful Rand has
> > become, and how terrible.
> >
> > However, I still hate the a'dam. I even felt a little sickened when
> > Elaida was caught. Something needs to be done about that. If they're
> > still leashing channelers after the Last Battle, I'll be pissed.
> >
> > Also, I hope Rand never bows before the Empress. It seems their
> > prophecies actually hold some truth - but I'm pretty sure that the
> > Guide explicitly said that Ishy altered them to say the Dragon Reborn
> > would bow, rather than bind them to him.
> >
>
> I think the new laughing Rand will bow to Tuon, or whatever her new
> name is, in a gesture of conciliation. He won't subgigate(sp?) himself
> however.
Seeing a maniacally laughing Rand might not reassure Fortuona.
I have wondered if Rand should deed Arad Doman to the Seanchan.
> > FAIN:
> >
> > Fain did not appear in this book, but I mention this because an
> > explanation of what Mordeth was, and how Shadar Logoth was the
> > opposite kind of evil to the DO, is probably my biggest desire for the
> > next two books. My pet theory is that Mordeth was something created
> > during the Breaking in an attempt to counter the taint, but it
> > seriously backfired.
> >
> Interesting theory.
Use Fain to plug the Bore?
Tim Bruening
"Chucky@Work" wrote:
> > Okay, I'm posting this to good old rasfwr-j just to see what it stirs
> > up. I suspect nothing good will come of this.
>
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> > RAND:
> >
> > The escape of Semirhage, I felt, could have been handled better. I
> > didn't like that she was broken by Cadsuane just moments before her
> > escape, as it made the actual breaking pointless, and reduced her
> > scariness when she actuall had control of Rand.
>
> I didn't get that. If anything, her breaking was Cadsuane's finest
> hour and definitely in the top ten of coolest scenes in this book. And
> it made her *more* dangerous when she was let free.
>
> Cadsuane making her cry didn't take away any of her skill or power.
>
> Mind you, it also didn't provide them with any of the information they
> needed, so it could have happened sooner. But if she had been broken
> sooner, if she'd been giving up secrets and telling tales for several
> weeks, maybe it *would* have detracted from her menace.
>
> I got the distinct impression that as soon as she broke, Shadar Haran
> turned up and gave her a little suicide mission. If she pulled it off,
> fine. If not, then also fine. Either way, the pay-off was Rand
> touching the True Power. Like you say further on down.
>
> Shadar Haran was, I'm pretty sure, waiting to see if she would break
> before giving her that assignment. Let's face it, he could have given
> it to her the afternoon she was captured. Instead he gave it to her
> the afternoon she finally broke under interrogation. As we rec.artists
> love to say, coincidence? I think not!
Why was it to Shadar Haran's advantage for Semirhage to break before giving
her the Rand capturing mission?
Tim Bruening
"Chucky@Work" wrote:
Why didn't Greandal anticipate Rand Balefiring her?
Tim Bruening
Mark Erikson wrote:
>
> So,
>
> S
>
> P
>
> O
>
> I
>
> L
>
> E
>
> R
>
> S
>
> P
>
> A
>
> C
>
> E
>
>
> EGWENE:
>
> It's hard to say anything here that hasn't already been said. Her
> chapters were great. It was awesome to see her finally being the
> badass she has been becoming over the last few books. I can't
> actually think of anything more to add, really.
>
> Except, maybe, that Elaida's capture by the Seanchan is pretty game-
> changing. The Seanchan can Travel, now.
How is Rand going to get Egwene to cooperate with the Seanchan?
Rand: We must all work together.
Egwene: But the Seanchan are holding several dozen of my daughters
captive, and so is the Black Tower!