Remember when Olivia was the lead on Fringe?
Ken from Chicago
show and Olivia has been a distant third, a supporting character she
ostensibly led, even in episodes featuring her she seems be so passive, so
reactive to stuff and not taking much of the initiative this season.
Sure, I like Walter and Peter and the father / son chemistry is rare gem on
tv (like husband / dad who's competent at work, home and with kids), but I
want old Olivia back, when she was the one kicking in doors, hunting down
the truth no matter where it led and Walter, Peter, and even Broyles were
barely keeping up.
-- Ken from Chicago
David E. Powell
wrote:
Good point it was supposed to be lead driven, about her journey. Maybe
they are building things for another push down the road.
David Barnett
news:nY6dnbb0z_Z-89nW...@giganews.com...
I agree with all of that.
Also initially there was a sort of arc, but there have been a lot of
standalone episodes since.
--
David Barnett
WQ 3.0
> "Ken from Chicago" <kwicker1b_nos...@comcast.net> wrote in messagenews:nY6dnbb0z_Z-89nW...@giganews.com...
I think there's a problem with the Olivia character, specifically Anna
Torv. When I saw the pilot last year, I hated the show and especially
Torv. But I stuck with the show and once it found itself and I found
it finding itself, around the 5th episode, I was able to easier accept
Torv. But she still does have a limited range with her acting, being
too monotone. When mid-season came along, I told a niece of mine
about the series, which she still hadn't seen except for fleeting
glimpses. I said she should check it out, that she might like it.
Being as resourceful as 17-year-olds can be with 'puters, she managed
to find the first 10 episodes online that she could streamview. She
got hooked on the storylines, but she too had a problem with Torv as
Olivia, finding her, in her own words, sooooo boring, She loves the
Walter character and Peter also works for her, but Olivia was so
annoying for her that she couldn't even be bothered with watching any
of this season's episodes. I can understand where she's coming from.
I still have my problems with Torv, but oddly, at the same time, I
can't picture who else could play her part and do it more
interestingly. Or is the Olivia character meant to be interesting at
all? Maybe she's just supposed to be the boring normal counterpoint
to all the looniness that goes on around her. But yeah, aside from
that, she does seem to be more in the background this season, but
then, I think the show itself veered off track from where it left off
at the end of last season. Rather than use that season finale and
launch everybody onto a new level, all they did was just spit Olivia
back out to where she's been all along and it feels like no progress
has been made at all as to where the series is really headed, it's
just all felt kind of stagnant since the beginning of the season. It
also could have something to do with the show having about 20
producers. Does any show really need 20 producers?
Jim Gysin
Ken from Chicago sent the following on 1/6/2010 5:07 AM:
I agree, with my usual caveat about Peter. I can tolerate him if he's
playing off of Walter, but that's about it. I would be happier to see
Olivia and Walter interacting, and I'm already happier to see Astrid and
Walter getting along so well. But Olivia has definitely been pushed
aside quite a bit this season, and I'm not particularly happy about it.
--
Jim Gysin
Waukesha, WI
jojo
wrote:
I don't see how that's bad. Peter and Walter are more interesting than
her.
The problem with Fringe this season is that it became a Monster of The
Week show. That's all.
Mark Nobles
Chicago <kwicker1...@comcast.net> wrote:
But despite being less the action hero this season, she is still the
center around which all the rest of the story moves, even Walter. She
is the only person who seems to be able to move freely back and forth
between universes. Belly has moved across, but not without cost; he
does not move freely. Walter has made the round-trip, once, and Peter
made a one-way trip. She's the key, and not a little ball of swirling
green light either.
Ian Galbraith
[snipo]
> I agree, with my usual caveat about Peter. I can tolerate him if he's
> playing off of Walter, but that's about it. I would be happier to see
> Olivia and Walter interacting, and I'm already happier to see Astrid and
> Walter getting along so well. But Olivia has definitely been pushed
> aside quite a bit this season, and I'm not particularly happy about it.
Agree on Peter, Joshua Jackson is still not a good actor, Anna Torv may
be slightly wooden but thats preferable to Jackson.
--
"I survived aus.tv.buffy and all I got was this lousy sig." - Loki,
aus.tv.buffy
WQ 3.0
> On Thu, 07 Jan 2010 00:03:21 -0600, Jim Gysin wrote:
>
> [snipo]
>
> > I agree, with my usual caveat about Peter. I can tolerate him if he's
> > playing off of Walter, but that's about it. I would be happier to see
> > Olivia and Walter interacting, and I'm already happier to see Astrid and
> > Walter getting along so well. But Olivia has definitely been pushed
> > aside quite a bit this season, and I'm not particularly happy about it.
>
> Agree on Peter, Joshua Jackson is still not a good actor, Anna Torv may
> be slightly wooden but thats preferable to Jackson.
I initially thought Jackson was too young for the role, but his
characterization made him grow into it. His snide and sarcastic
deliveries are perfectly executed, being neither too subtle nor too
overt, and I think they're crucial in conveying the skepticism of his
character. Not everybody can do snide and sarcastic just right, and
in that sense, he gradually won me over. Torv only gets really wooden
when she has little to do or work with, but get her going and she's
fine.
Jim Gysin
Mark Nobles sent the following on 1/7/2010 11:49 AM:
> In article <nY6dnbb0z_Z-89nW...@giganews.com>, Ken from
> Chicago <kwicker1...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> That's what's been wrong this season on FRINGE. It's been the Walter / Peter
>> show and Olivia has been a distant third, a supporting character she
>> ostensibly led, even in episodes featuring her she seems be so passive, so
>> reactive to stuff and not taking much of the initiative this season.
>>
>> Sure, I like Walter and Peter and the father / son chemistry is rare gem on
>> tv (like husband / dad who's competent at work, home and with kids), but I
>> want old Olivia back, when she was the one kicking in doors, hunting down
>> the truth no matter where it led and Walter, Peter, and even Broyles were
>> barely keeping up.
>>
>> -- Ken from Chicago
>
> But despite being less the action hero this season, she is still the
> center around which all the rest of the story moves, even Walter.
She is? Heck, from my perspective in my own comfy chair, she's been
largely forgotten for weeks and weeks now. Even when she's sucking down
some vile concoction that Walter has cooked up, her part of the story
seems to get the least attention. And back when she *was* getting more
attention, they seemed committed to making her into Auntie Olivia with
the introduction of the sister and the niece, largely forgetting about
the tough federal agent I was introduced to in the show's pilot ep.
> She
> is the only person who seems to be able to move freely back and forth
> between universes.
But not without cost, apparently. Of course, it's been months since
they've made any progress on that particular plotline, which only speaks
to the larger complaint that I have about the show's priorities lately.
> Belly has moved across, but not without cost; he
> does not move freely. Walter has made the round-trip, once, and Peter
> made a one-way trip. She's the key, and not a little ball of swirling
> green light either.
If she's the key, then the writers have been doing a good job of burying
the lead.
Jim Gysin
Ian Galbraith sent the following on 1/7/2010 3:52 PM:
> On Thu, 07 Jan 2010 00:03:21 -0600, Jim Gysin wrote:
>
> [snipo]
>
>> I agree, with my usual caveat about Peter. I can tolerate him if he's
>> playing off of Walter, but that's about it. I would be happier to see
>> Olivia and Walter interacting, and I'm already happier to see Astrid and
>> Walter getting along so well. But Olivia has definitely been pushed
>> aside quite a bit this season, and I'm not particularly happy about it.
>
> Agree on Peter, Joshua Jackson is still not a good actor, Anna Torv may
> be slightly wooden but thats preferable to Jackson.
She's wooden when the writers and directors demand it, which seems to be
most of the time. But when given the chance on those few, rare
occasions, she has shown that she can easily move beyond that wooden
persona.
Zombie Elvis
No because I kept falling asleep during those early episodes.
I like Walter and Peter and enjoy them more than Olivia.
--
"I recall a time not long ago when a bullet in the chest meant a
sucking chest wound, not a quick bandage job and a climactic
final confrontation with a criminal mastermind atop an unfinished
skyscraper."
- Seen on The Onion
Roberto Castillo
roberto...@ameritech.net
http://mind-grapes.blogspot.com/
http://zombie-gulch.myminicity.com/
JM Morrison
Completely agreed. They seem to be trying to bring Peter in more, a
move I tend to agree with. But not at the cost of Olivia.
Overall the problem is that they are spinning their wheels too much. No
forward movement. We were told about Peter being abducted as a child
last season, but now they continue to tease us with the same
information. It's not a tease when you already know the reveal. It's
just annoying. We know about the other side and 'there's more than one
of everything'. Move o n.
I think if they want to keep the mytharc eps to 4-5 per season the way
XF did they will have to expand their world quite a bit. Not everything
is actually related to Belly and Walter and Massive Dynamic. So far
though, those episodes have been flatter compared to the mytharc ones.
-jmm
Adam H. Kerman
>On Thu, 07 Jan 2010 00:03:21 -0600, Jim Gysin wrote:
>>I agree, with my usual caveat about Peter. I can tolerate him if he's
>>playing off of Walter, but that's about it. I would be happier to see
>>Olivia and Walter interacting, and I'm already happier to see Astrid and
>>Walter getting along so well. But Olivia has definitely been pushed
>>aside quite a bit this season, and I'm not particularly happy about it.
>Agree on Peter, Joshua Jackson is still not a good actor, Anna Torv may
>be slightly wooden but thats preferable to Jackson.
I like him. He's a decent comic actor, and his timing is good. I've never
seen him in a role that would stretch his acting muscles.
How can we have a thread about "Fringe" without cow jokes?
Ken from Chicago
"Mark Nobles" <cmn-n...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:070120101149162631%cmn-n...@comcast.net...
Okay, first of all, leave Dawn Summers out of this. Second, at least
swirling around would be more active than Olivia's been this season. All the
action has been swirling around her and she doesn't seem to be doing much of
anything. She was the one leading the investigation into the Pattern
(remember when that was important) and obliquely into Massive Dynamics
(you'd barely know it was of any import this season given how rare it is
mentioned, even in connection to William Bell), and into the monster of the
week (she has to be assigned to cases and barely shows up at the end to deal
with them).
Long story short, Olivia has taken LESS initiative this season than her FBI
assistant last season (who was killed and replaced by a duplicant)--and he
was only a recurring character.
And being important doesn't mean being active. The Maltese Falcon was
important in the movie of the same name but it itself didn't do jack squat
in the movie. Everyone remember Bogie doing the actual work, but his
character was interesting enough to drive the movie forward, and it was only
a movie of a few hours.
A tv series has to have continuous drive to last the season and as much as
like Walter, and phenomenal performance by John Noble, his character is
actually limited into how much investigation into the Truth for fear of
Peter finding out and Peter, with a nice turn by Joshua Jackson, has been
fairly relaxed and nonchalant about any longterm investigation. Broyles,
played well by THE WIRE's Lance Reddick, but has he even mentioned The
Pattern this season? Allegedly that's why he brought Olivia to Fringe
Division last season and now ...?
The Arc stories happen, but that's just it, they happen, meanwhile Our
Heroes seem to be merely reacting, and even then not doing anything
long-term. They are not as listless as Stargate Universe characters in their
lack of longterm goals, but it's a huge drop from the first season.
-- Ken from Chicago
Pete B
kwicker1...@comcast.net says...
No no, we want the Cow to be the leader!