The books don't count Lucas says
Norm
The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
AMSNYD
*sigh* here comes another big canon argument.
--
Aaron Snyder
asn...@mail.usmo.com or ams...@aol.com
Member of the AAA
"I weigh about 140 pounds, naked. I mean, if that scale at the train station
is anything to go by." -Emo Phillips
Speculator
"Norm" <stor...@internetmcinospam.com>did you consider the great
discounts at the ORB while you wrote:
> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
>limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
Your point is?
The fact is, the novels and comics are sequels to the Original movies,
NOT the Special Editions.
Lucas' universe is the SE universe - the novels take place in a
different [and IMHO far preferable] timeline, where Greedo DOESN'T
shoot first.
mtfbwy,
Speculator.
e-mail: spec...@infoshop.u-net.com
business: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~lo386500/
Spec Fic: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~lo386500/specfic.htm
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The Official RASSM Bookstore ...
Services we provide include:
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- Excellent service
- Ship anywhere in the world!
bl...@popstar.com
In article <EtLG8...@news2.new-york.net>,
Card...@unix.asb.com (Rich Handley) wrote:
>
> "Norm" <stor...@internetmcinospam.com> wrote:
> > The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
> >limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
>
>
Rob looks at Rich.
Rich looks at Rob.
They both nod and roll their eyes.
Cheers,
Rob
--
Rob Irwin
Music Freak
Star Wars Fan Au-Go-Go
Journalist for PC Week & PC Magazine [Australia]
Love is drowning In a deep well
All the secrets And no one to tell
Take the money ... Honey ... Blindness
(U2 "Love Is Blindness" from Achtung Baby)
bl...@popstar.com r...@apnpc.com.au
[work web addresses = www.zdnet.com.au/pcweek & www.zdnet.com.au/pcm]
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
fr...@pathcom.com
In article <LTIa1.294$4l4.3...@news.internetmci.com>,
"Norm" <stor...@internetmcinospam.com> wrote:
>
> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
> limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
>
>
Okay, I can live with that...but exactly where did you hear this from...the
Insider? an Interview?
Sabrina
Wayne Poe
On Wed, 27 May 1998, Norm wrote:
> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
> limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
And this baseless statement comes from...?
Sean Walsh aka slw67
When did he say this?
Ted 3000
The Books and comics are licenced Star Wars products.
I have an old Darth Vader Pencil eraser.
Where does that fit into the continuity?
Star Wars is for your enjoyement, it is fiction.
In the books and comics, Hutts used to be big, imobile
creatures on repulsorsleds. Why? Becuase the Jabba
puppet in ROTJ was.
In the ANH Special Edition, Jabba was strutting his bad-ass
all over docking bay 94. Continuity is a fanboys equivalent
of reality, which does not exist in fiction.
Marvel SW comics rock. Dark Horse's recent crop are iffy.
That's my opinion. Here's a fact: If Lucas decides that, say,
Mynocks don't chew on power cables, get over it. It was never
"true" to begin with. It's a story, one he has the right to tell
and retell anyway he wants. The point is the main driving soul
of the story, not the picky little tech details and the peripheral
continuity of the comics and books. Or the erasers.
I always beleived Luke was grounded, and that Luke and Leia would
get together.
Ted 3000, Usenet Funkmaster!
Leader of The Lobot Fan Base
"Get off my back!!!" -Chuck Heston
http://members.aol.com/ted3000/robotx.html
Michael Mierzwa
John Wooten wrote:
>
> In article <EtLG8...@news2.new-york.net>, Card...@unix.asb.com (Rich Handley) wrote:
> >> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
> >>limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
> >
> >
>
Sure, but look around ... most things are right now!
To address this original post. I think if Lucas sees something he likes
he might borrow it.
What I'm split on is if or if not we will see a Headhunter in the
prequels. :/
If so, then the novels counted for something. Besides, we already have
seen the Outrider (a novel creation) appear in the films! Ditto for
swoops, a very early novel creation.
Michael Mierzwa
Norm
ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT A FEW YEARS AGO. THE REASON I WROTE THIS IS BECAUSE
I'M SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING, " IN THE BOOK IT SAYS"
THE BOOKS DON'T COUNT!!!
fr...@pathcom.com wrote in message <6kh05o$vat$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <LTIa1.294$4l4.3...@news.internetmci.com>,
> "Norm" <stor...@internetmcinospam.com> wrote:
>>
>> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
>> limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
>>
>>
>
Norm
A FEW YEARS AGO ON E.T.
Sean Walsh aka slw67 wrote in message <356C17...@ici.net>...
>When did he say this?
oblio-1
aeons ago, on the memorable date of Wed, 27 May 1998 22:03:08 GMT, Norm
wrote to all:
>>Okay, I can live with that...but exactly where did you hear this from...the
>>Insider? an Interview?
>ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT A FEW YEARS AGO. THE REASON I WROTE THIS IS BECAUSE
>I'M SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING, " IN THE BOOK IT SAYS"
>THE BOOKS DON'T COUNT!!!
ok slow down, take a breath, relax. what 'counts' to you, counts to you.
what counts to me, counts to me.
personally i only look at the movies as being canon (and a way of life)
and everything else is entertainment.
of course to my kids, everything is canon! so when i'm playing star wars
action figure wars, they're canon too. don't tell me you didn't know jedi
luke, hammer head, boba fett, and vader always hang out together. they
also hang out with batman.
oh and star tours is canon so you should all know, my son and i were there
when one of the death stars was blown up. it must be canon 'cos george
lucas was in it.
--
oblio-1
www.iagrafx.com/oblio/rassm.html
Jeia622
"Norm" wrote:
>ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT A FEW YEARS AGO. THE REASON I WROTE THIS IS BECAUSE
>I'M SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING, " IN THE BOOK IT SAYS"
>THE BOOKS DON'T COUNT!!!
>
Anyway, my opinion is that if *you*, personally, believe the books don't count,
that's fine. But other people, myself included, belive that the books do
count. "Canon" is usually a fan's personal opinion.
Jeia
ChurroKing
Oblio wrote:
>of course to my kids, everything is canon! so when i'm playing star wars<BR>
>action figure wars, they're canon too. don't tell me you didn't know
>jedi<BR>
>luke, hammer head, boba fett, and vader always hang out together. they<BR>
>also hang out with batman.<BR>
LOL.....
.I had almost forgot, that when I was a kid, my Action Figures rode around in
my Space 1999 Space Ship ( remember that toy ) and the 12 inch Bionic Man
figurl was the Rebe'ls secret weapon and the Bionic Big Foot figure was the
Imperia's Secret Weapon...so that must be canon too !!!
...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
Things that make you go Hmmmm
----Kevin
Bea Arthur should never sing, let alone be part of the Star Wars Universe !!!
Andrew C. Schott
oblio-1 wrote:
> oh and star tours is canon so you should all know, my son and i were there
> when one of the death stars was blown up. it must be canon 'cos george
> lucas was in it.
So you're saying that there's a trench in the second Death Star? :)
--
Days left of being a Freshman: 2
Andy Schott
ICQ: 3308838
E-mail: <mailto:andrew...@rose-hulman.edu>
Homepage: http://www.rose-hulman.edu/~schottac/index.html
Anisa
In article <199805272322...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
> .I had almost forgot, that when I was a kid, my Action Figures rode around in
> my Space 1999 Space Ship ( remember that toy ) and the 12 inch Bionic Man
> figurl was the Rebe'ls secret weapon and the Bionic Big Foot figure was the
> Imperia's Secret Weapon...so that must be canon too !!!
>
The Bionic Man! Space 1999! Hey, cool! Another fellow old f**t!
>
> ...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
>
> Things that make you go Hmmmm
Canon!? No, y' see, it doesn't *exist*. It's like the Biggs cutscenes;
those of us who remember seeing it just have overly vivid imaginations.
And Luke and Leia were always meant to be brother and sister, and Greedo
was always meant to shoot first but they couldn't get it to work
technically. Anyhow, that's what GL would like us to believe.
>
> ----Kevin
>
> Bea Arthur should never sing, let alone be part of the Star Wars Universe !!!
Oh, come on! She was the best thing about that show! Of course, that
doesn't mean you're wrong...
--
Hace mucho tiempo en una galaxia lejana, muy lejana...
Wedge
Ted 3000 wrote:
>
> The Books and comics are licenced Star Wars products.
>
> I have an old Darth Vader Pencil eraser.
>
> Where does that fit into the continuity?
In a solemn moment, Luke would honour his father with a series of
collectable erasers...
Well, hey, it has to fit in somewhere right? :)
--
Matthew Ting
The Official RASSM Anti-Lobot
Gonkite At Large
ICQ no: 11501703
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Cavern/8894/ - My SW:CCG homepage!
And remember to send those card review requests!
*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*
|"Have you earned your air today?" - Dilbert |
*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*
Wedge
ChurroKing wrote:
>
> Oblio wrote:
>
> >of course to my kids, everything is canon! so when i'm playing star wars<BR>
> >action figure wars, they're canon too. don't tell me you didn't know
> >jedi<BR>
> >luke, hammer head, boba fett, and vader always hang out together. they<BR>
> >also hang out with batman.<BR>
>
> LOL.....
>
> my Space 1999 Space Ship ( remember that toy ) and the 12 inch Bionic Man
> figurl was the Rebe'ls secret weapon and the Bionic Big Foot figure was the
> Imperia's Secret Weapon...so that must be canon too !!!
Boba Fett was eaten by T-Rex, not a Sarlacc. Just to get the record
straight :)
oblio-1
aeons ago, on the memorable date of Wed, 27 May 1998 20:09:51 -0500,
the following words of "Andrew C. Schott"
<andrew...@rose-hulman.edu> fell upon all:
>oblio-1 wrote:
>
>> oh and star tours is canon so you should all know, my son and i were there
>> when one of the death stars was blown up. it must be canon 'cos george
>> lucas was in it.
>
>So you're saying that there's a trench in the second Death Star? :)
no, that is a new and a not-as-of-yet-declassified death star
--
oblio-1
Wooten
In article <356C82...@ix.netcom.com>, mmie...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>John Wooten wrote:
>>
>> In article <EtLG8...@news2.new-york.net>, Card...@unix.asb.com (Rich
> Handley) wrote:
>> >> The books don't count Lucas said, he will do what ever he wants & not be
>> >>limited by whats already in the books or comic books!
>> >
>> >
>>
>> At least it's on topic. :^)
>
>Sure, but look around ... most things are right now!
oh i know, i was just making a little jab at myself :^)
john
--"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."--Calvin
The Ohio Star Wars Collectors Club website: http://5ss.simplenet.com/swohio
The Star Wars Action Figure Web: http://5ss.simplenet.com/swafw
jbwhi...@sprintmail.com
In <anisa-27059...@dial-114-32.ots.utexas.edu>, an...@madeupaddress.com (Anisa) writes:
>In article <199805272322...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
>churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
>> my Space 1999 Space Ship ( remember that toy ) and the 12 inch Bionic Man
>> figurl was the Rebe'ls secret weapon and the Bionic Big Foot figure was the
>> Imperia's Secret Weapon...so that must be canon too !!!
>>
>
Wagner was one hot babe).
Space 1999! Yes, I remember that series, too.
Gee, am I an old f**t, too? I'm only 27.
Oh, well, find me that Moonshadow and I'll take the Peace Train on outta here.
Brent White
Anncrispin
Gee, "Norm," you don't have to yell. If you don't like the books and don't
want them to count, hey, that's fine with us. Different strokes for different
folks, as they say.
So chill, guy. No need to get upset and holler.
-Ann C. Crispin
Michael Mierzwa
Norm wrote:
>
> ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT A FEW YEARS AGO. THE REASON I WROTE THIS IS BECAUSE
> I'M SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING, " IN THE BOOK IT SAYS"
> THE BOOKS DON'T COUNT!!!
Where is Chucky when you need him? I can almost hear him asking "ARE U
A CRISUN? I AM A CRISUN AND ..." ;)
Norm, it goes without say that Lucas will pick and choose what he likes
for the films.
In SOTE, one of the lead characters, Dash Rendar, has a ship called the
Outrider. It makes an appearance in the SW:SE! That is an example of
where Lucas decided something should "count".
As for people saying, "It says X in book Y." If you disagree, then all
you have to say is, "I disagree, because that book didn't feel right to
me." Lucas really doesn't even enter into the picture here.
BTW do you mind laying off the CAPS LOCK?
Also you might want to find out exactly what E.T. episode and what year
this was, so you can pull an exact quote. You'll find more people will
believe you then.
I mean I could say that President Regan said Russians are evil about 16
years ago on some PBS talk show. How many people are going to believe
me? How many people are going to care?
Michael Mierzwa
-I also hear on good authority that the moon is made of cheese! ;)
Norm
Anncrispin
>i never read the books
Well, that explains your very informed opinion then!
<vbg>
You have no idea whether you're missing something or you aren't.
I would say that you're missing something, but then everybody in here would say
that I'm prejudiced, and we'd all enjoy a good laugh.
(I realize you have no idea what I'm talking about, and what's funny about this
post. That's because you don't read the books.)
-Ann C. Crispin
Joe Mulei
Anncrispin wrote:
[Norm]
Well, if this is _the_ A. C. Crispin, the author of the Han Solo
Trilogy, then I'd like to start off by saying that, although I'm not
familiar with your work, I thought the three above mentioned novels were
very good. Thanks.
To Norm: I've only read three of the novels myself; but if I were you,
then I would at least consider taking Ms. Crispin's advice to heart --
as a Star Wars fan (I assume) you may be missing out on a lot if you
don't. I generally loathe derivative writing and avoid them like the
plague, but I picked up three of the novels despite my misgivings on the
off-chance that they would be good. Well, they were. Now I'm trying to
decide on which ones to get next.
Sure, the author's vision of the Star Wars milieu and characters isn't
likely to coincide _exactly_ with your own as gleaned from the movies;
but it'll probably not be too far off. Hell, even the creator's vision
is likely to be different than your own as movies (in many ways) leave
more to the imagination than books; but then, them's the breaks. Did you
start out thinking that Luke and Leia would be brother and sister? I
certainly didn't; but it worked and that's what matters.
I say give the books a chance and come to an informed conclusion. At
worst you'll be out a couple of bucks; but at best you'll entertained.
And that's what Star Wars is all about anyway.
GB
Michael Mierzwa
Joe Mulei wrote:
>
> Anncrispin wrote:
>
> [Norm]
> > >i never read the books
>
> > Well, that explains your very informed opinion then!
LOL Ann! :)
> To Norm: I've only read three of the novels myself; but if I were you,
> then I would at least consider taking Ms. Crispin's advice to heart --
> as a Star Wars fan (I assume) you may be missing out on a lot if you
> don't. I generally loathe derivative writing and avoid them like the
> plague, but I picked up three of the novels despite my misgivings on the
> off-chance that they would be good. Well, they were. Now I'm trying to
> decide on which ones to get next.
Actually the Novel Reading Group [NRG] has a series of threads that can
be read through dejanews to sample books and see what other people
think. I also post on roughly a monthly basis a [NRG] Ratings Update.
In it people actually rate the novels, what people can do is see if
there are people's whos opinions on novels they've read seem similar and
then try other books they rate highly! :)
> Sure, the author's vision of the Star Wars milieu and characters isn't
> likely to coincide _exactly_ with your own as gleaned from the movies;
> but it'll probably not be too far off. Hell, even the creator's vision
> is likely to be different than your own as movies (in many ways) leave
> more to the imagination than books; but then, them's the breaks. Did you
> start out thinking that Luke and Leia would be brother and sister? I
> certainly didn't; but it worked and that's what matters.
>
> I say give the books a chance and come to an informed conclusion. At
> worst you'll be out a couple of bucks; but at best you'll entertained.
> And that's what Star Wars is all about anyway.
Very well said.
Michael Mierzwa
Kentaro P Maeda
Wedge wrote:
>> I have an old Darth Vader Pencil eraser.
>>
>> Where does that fit into the continuity?
>
>In a solemn moment, Luke would honour his father with a series of
>collectable erasers...
>
>Well, hey, it has to fit in somewhere right? :)
an early version of the ROTJ script had the following lines:
LUKE: "there is still good in you. you allowed your likeness to be
on erasers, so kids all over the galaxy could make corrections on
their schoolwork!"
VADER: "it is too late for me, son... besides, i didn't sign that
merchandising deal out of altruism for my fans... the dark side has
made me concerned only for the almighty credit sign. those ewoks you
ran into earlier? the emperor created them solely as a marketing
gimmick"
LUKE: "wow, he IS evil!"
VADER: "yes... but i get this feeling he's going to ultimately
regret it... you think an ewok with a spear and a rock could beat an
armed stormtrooper in a fight?"
the elevator door opens, and an escort of stormtroopers walk out,
ready to take luke to meet the emperor. luke and vader look at the
escort, then each other. remembering vader's question, the two nod,
with luke rolling his eyes.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Ken Maeda ICQ#:11922363 University of Hawaii
ken...@hawaii.edu http://www2.hawaii.edu/~kentaro/home.html
"In order to know Godzilla, we've gotta look into his past."
"You know, studying genealogy is gonna be a blast!"
--------------------------------------------------------------
fr...@pathcom.com
And if we were to go to the official ET website and ask them about this
interview (www.etonline.com , btw) would they have any idea what we were
talking about?
Sabrina
In article <T50b1.277$mR4.5...@news.internetmci.com>,
bl...@popstar.com
In article <199805281629...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
anncr...@aol.com (Anncrispin) wrote:
>
> Gee, "Norm," you don't have to yell. If you don't like the books and don't
> want them to count, hey, that's fine with us. Different strokes for
different
> folks, as they say.
>
> So chill, guy. No need to get upset and holler.
>
> -Ann C. Crispin
>
*Rob adopts a Yoda-like voice
"Yes, yes ... to Ann C. Crispin you listen, mmmmm?"
To add my 2c - I've always thought that the books were a great, logical
extension of the SW universe. If George ever makes Episodes VII, VIII and IX
and they blow-away the themes and storylines of the novels - so be it.
Truth of the matter is, most of us would rather read some creative and
interesting Star Wars stories, than languish with a stagnant, and dare I say
it - long dead (if you don't count the prequels) - universe.
Goodnight & Thankyou,
Rob
--
Rob Irwin - Journalist
PC Week [Australia] PC Magazine [Australia]
Ph:+61 2 9936 8693 Fax:+61 2 9955 8871
www.zdnet.com.au/pcweek www.zdnet.com.au/pcm
Tommy Maguire
ET asked a representitive of Lucasfilm if GL would he be using information
from the books as a basis for his prequels or sequels. What he actually said
was something like this:
The novels are not George's vision of what was to happen before and after
the original trilogy. The fans demands however persuaded him to allow some
of the finest writers and artists to give an interpretation of other stories
surrounding Star Wars and the Star Wars universe.
He then went on to waffle about the S.E.'s and the start of production on
Episode 1. This was on satellite TV in the UK about maybe 6 - 7 months ago.
So it is can't be anymore than a year old. Also bear in mind that I have
not quoted exactly, just what I could from memory.
Rich Handley wrote in message ...
>Sean Walsh aka slw67 <sl...@ici.net> wrote:
>>When did he say this?
>
>
>He didn't, but a lot of people keep acting like he did.
Tommy Maguire
AMSNYD
>>Subject: Re: The books don't count Lucas says
From: fr...@pathcom.com
Date: Thu, May 28, 1998 7:16 PM
Message-id: <6kkuog$t1d$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>
And if we were to go to the official ET website and ask them about this
interview (www.etonline.com , btw) would they have any idea what we were
talking about?<<
No but it would be fun to thin of John Tesh sitting down for hours trying to
figure out why people would email them about having a canon in a Star Wars
novel.
--
Aaron Snyder
asn...@mail.usmo.com or ams...@aol.com
Member of the AAA
"I weigh about 140 pounds, naked. I mean, if that scale at the train station
is anything to go by." -Emo Phillips
Cheetah!
Anncrispin wrote:
>
> >i never read the books
>
> Well, that explains your very informed opinion then!
>
>
> You have no idea whether you're missing something or you aren't.
> I would say that you're missing something, but then everybody in here would say
> that I'm prejudiced, and we'd all enjoy a good laugh.
>
> (I realize you have no idea what I'm talking about, and what's funny about this
> post. That's because you don't read the books.)
Perhaps next time you could include some pictures... that'll get his
attention... =D
==> Cheetah! <==
... Endless Love: Stevie Wonder & Ray Charles playing tennis...
NHerr10280
I think what Lucas has said, is more like this: The movies come first, we're
not going to worry too much about the books. We won't go out of our way to
damage continuity, but we will if we have to.
That's what I've gathered. Lucas is not going to line up every single source
in the the Star Wars Galaxy handbook and make sure there are no continuity
mistakes. But, I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't that many changes.
Basically he's not going to worry about the books. But, if it's not to hard
he'll take something out or leave something in, etc. But, his main concern is
telling the story he wants to tell and keeping continuity with the three films.
After all , there was a swoop bike in the SE....?
I gather he respects the books, but he's not going to worry about them.
-Nate
Norm
I take that back I read "Splinter of the Minds Eye" in the 70s
Anncrispin wrote in message
<199805282247...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
>>i never read the books
>
>Well, that explains your very informed opinion then!
>
><vbg>
>
>You have no idea whether you're missing something or you aren't.
>I would say that you're missing something, but then everybody in here would
say
>that I'm prejudiced, and we'd all enjoy a good laugh.
>
>(I realize you have no idea what I'm talking about, and what's funny about
this
>post. That's because you don't read the books.)
>
>-Ann C. Crispin
Michael Mierzwa
NHerr10280 wrote:
>
> I think what Lucas has said, is more like this: The movies come first, we're
> not going to worry too much about the books. We won't go out of our way to
> damage continuity, but we will if we have to.
> That's what I've gathered.
This makes perfect sense to me too and sounds more like what GL might
say (of course he changes his mind about these things too!). :)
> Lucas is not going to line up every single source
> in the the Star Wars Galaxy handbook and make sure there are no continuity
> mistakes. But, I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't that many changes.
> Basically he's not going to worry about the books. But, if it's not to hard
> he'll take something out or leave something in, etc. But, his main concern is
> telling the story he wants to tell and keeping continuity with the three films.
> After all , there was a swoop bike in the SE....?
> I gather he respects the books, but he's not going to worry about them.
That is exactly the way I feel about the relation of where the books lie
with respect to future movies.
As for the issue of "counting" or not. That is all in the eye of the
beholder. But to people who've not read them, there are plenty of us
who have and enjoy them. The best thing about them and other serialized
novels is they can bring some people who were otherwise not big time
SciFi readers into other more classical SciFi novels ... just like I
imagine some of us were brought into SciFi by either Star Wars or Star
Trek (or both)! :)
Michael Mierzwa
policraticus
Rich Handley wrote:
> NHerr10280 wrote:
> > I think what Lucas has said, is more like this: The movies come first, we're
> > not going to worry too much about the books. We won't go out of our way to
> > damage continuity, but we will if we have to.
> > That's what I've gathered.
>
> Yep, THAT's what was said, and it's a sensible policy, but people have
> often misconstrued that as meaning "Lucasfilm completely disregards
> the books." The latter is clearly is not the case, since they put the
> Outrider (from SOTE), the crashed ship/restaurant (from Tales From Mos
> Eisley), and Greedo as an inept twit (as he was in Tales From Mos
> Eisley) in the Special Edition.
Not to forget a little planet of Tim Zahn's called Coruscant :-)
Policrat'
Michael Mierzwa
Rich Handley wrote:
>
> NHerr10280 wrote:
> > I think what Lucas has said, is more like this: The movies come first, we're
> > not going to worry too much about the books. We won't go out of our way to
> > damage continuity, but we will if we have to.
> > That's what I've gathered.
>
> Yep, THAT's what was said, and it's a sensible policy, but people have
> often misconstrued that as meaning "Lucasfilm completely disregards
> the books." The latter is clearly is not the case, since they put the
> Outrider (from SOTE), the crashed ship/restaurant (from Tales From Mos
> Eisley), and Greedo as an inept twit (as he was in Tales From Mos
> Eisley) in the Special Edition.
I agree about the Outrider. Not sure about the crashed ship/restaurant
.... but it was a crashed ship alright. :)
But Greedo wasn't a twerp (Solo's words). He was spice addicted! :)
See folks, that is what happens to your aim and speech when you do
drugs. ;)
Michael Mierzwa
Bobby Cox
On 27 May 1998 19:02:15 GMT, ted...@aol.com (Ted 3000) jumped up and
announced to the general posting public:
>The Books and comics are licenced Star Wars products.
>
>I have an old Darth Vader Pencil eraser.
>
>Where does that fit into the continuity?
*mental image* ouch... :)
>Star Wars is for your enjoyement, it is fiction.
>In the books and comics, Hutts used to be big, imobile
>creatures on repulsorsleds. Why? Becuase the Jabba
>puppet in ROTJ was.
>
>In the ANH Special Edition, Jabba was strutting his bad-ass
>all over docking bay 94. Continuity is a fanboys equivalent
>of reality, which does not exist in fiction.
Ann Crispin explained that quite neatly in "The Hutt Gambit".
According to that, younger Hutts can use their powerful belly muscles
to slide around (like a snake), and prefer to do so in company of
their peers. Othertimes, they use their sleds, and older ones use the
sleds almost exclusively.
Anyways, we don't see Jabba move *at all in RotJ, so the ANH:SE scene
isn't totally implausible.
>Marvel SW comics rock. Dark Horse's recent crop are iffy.
>That's my opinion. Here's a fact: If Lucas decides that, say,
>Mynocks don't chew on power cables, get over it. It was never
>"true" to begin with. It's a story, one he has the right to tell
>and retell anyway he wants. The point is the main driving soul
>of the story, not the picky little tech details and the peripheral
>continuity of the comics and books. Or the erasers.
Persoanlly, I think he'll use some things out of the novels/comics -
they really flesh out the SWU. Some things I hope he bins.
>I always beleived Luke was grounded, and that Luke and Leia would
>get together.
Hmmm....
Bobby Cox
Representative of the Tirax System
"I hope so, Commander, for your sake. The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am."
"I'd just as soon kiss a Wookiee."
"I can arrange that. You could use a good kiss!"
Note: Reply-to address mangled to get rid of spamming mail-bots
I think you can figure out what to get rid of...
Douglas A. Hurstell
>Ann Crispin explained that quite neatly in "The Hutt Gambit".
>According to that, younger Hutts can use their powerful belly muscles
>to slide around (like a snake), and prefer to do so in company of
>their peers. Othertimes, they use their sleds, and older ones use the
>sleds almost exclusively.
>Anyways, we don't see Jabba move *at all in RotJ, so the ANH:SE scene
>isn't totally implausible.
The difference between the young mobile Jabba whom Han steps on (SE, bad
call Lucas), and the much more corpulent version of ROTJ is entirely
explainable... Remember Jiliac fought Durga and she could get around pretty
well, she is MUCH older thah Jabba. Two things to remember here (okay
three)...
1) Dont forget about the time displacement between ANH and ROTJ. The
Mellinium Falcon had to fly across an asteroid field, and into another star
system to make Bespin from Hoth. If we scale that to our galaxy, at least
45 million light years to the nearest planet (new news from last week) now
we know the MF can go .5 past lightspeed... I am assuming that is with the
sublight engine...thats what makes her so special. So while even at .5 past
lightspeed in our galaxy you wouldnt make it to the nearest planet outside
our solar system. This doesnt translate well into real life, but I think I
have made my point... the journey from Hoth to Bespin took several months if
not longer (a working hyperspace engine probably reduces the trip to a few
days if you can avoid a large asteroid's gravity well).
2) According to Crispin, Hutts have growth spurts even as they approach a
mellinium (Jiliac incresed in size by 33% between visits from Han).
3) Luke Skywalker began, and underwent Jedi Training. While I, Jedi
describe's Corran Horn's studies as a Jedi to have lasted around 6-7 months,
he did not complete his training, and while Luke didnt finish his training
either, Luke was far more capable that Corran when he left Yoda... so lets
say maybe a year of training... (that may be a little high, but not much).
After Luke loses his hand we probably must figure on several months of
waiting to find Han Solo. Lando must successfully infiltrate Jabba's court
and become one of his trusted guards. This is significant because Lando
probably didnt know it was Jabba who had a bounty out on Han, he probably
would have guessed that it was Durga. He probably wouldve approached Jabba
asking for clues on where to find Boba Fett and Durga tha Hutt. That
wouldve made it all that much more difficult for Lando to infiltrate Jabba's
guard.
So my total estimation is that about one and a half years passes between our
visits with Jabba in the movie, plenty of time for Jabba to show the 20%
increase in size we notice from the movies. :)
--
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Dean
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The Honorable Dr. Ryskar "Scourge" Dlarit, Ph.D., DoS
Senator
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Office of the Fleet Commander:
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Join the Dark Lightning Strike Fleet
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Bobby Cox wrote in message <356e202b...@news.ix.net.au>...
G
> But Greedo wasn't a twerp (Solo's words). He was spice addicted! :)
> See folks, that is what happens to your aim and speech when you do
> drugs. ;)
where did it say that, I thought tales from the mos eisley cantina just
said he was inexperienced? and a twerp....
Michael Mierzwa
Between the lines. :)
Nobody could miss *unless* they were on drugs! ;)
Michael Mierzwa
-this is your brain (points to Greedo)
-this is your brain on drugs (points to a sizzled Greedo)
Cheetah!
Michael Mierzwa wrote:
> Michael Mierzwa
> -this is your brain (points to Greedo)
> -this is your brain on drugs (points to a sizzled Greedo)
--
ROTFL! Now go stand in the corner.. =)
==> Cheetah! <==
... F-16 Falcon: Worlds fastest distributor of Mig-29 Fulcrum parts.
G
> Between the lines. :)
>
> Nobody could miss *unless* they were on drugs! ;)
then I must be, I missed that one entirely
just call me Renton
Michael Mierzwa
Michael P. Kube-McDowell wrote:
>
> On 27 May 1998 23:22:01 GMT, churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
> >
> >...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
>
> In my original proposal to Bantam/Lucasfilm for the Black Fleet
> Crisis, I intended to give Chewie multiple wives--and make them the
> kick-ass volunteers who fill out the Falcon's crew for the rescue
> attempt. I was advised that Chewie already had a family, and I would
> have to use the existing characters (I thought I finessed that
> restriction rather neatly, but--). As a reference guide for the
> existing family, I was sent a copy of the Star Wars Storybook--a kids'
> picture book based on...the Holiday Special.
On a serious note, you might point out to people that you did bring back
a character (Cindle Towani) from the Ewok Adventure. That I liked
(using her, not the EA itself).
Michael Mierzwa
Michael P. Kube-McDowell
On 27 May 1998 23:22:01 GMT, churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
>...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
In my original proposal to Bantam/Lucasfilm for the Black Fleet
Crisis, I intended to give Chewie multiple wives--and make them the
kick-ass volunteers who fill out the Falcon's crew for the rescue
attempt. I was advised that Chewie already had a family, and I would
have to use the existing characters (I thought I finessed that
restriction rather neatly, but--). As a reference guide for the
existing family, I was sent a copy of the Star Wars Storybook--a kids'
picture book based on...the Holiday Special.
Best,
K-Mac
--
--] Michael Paul McDowell, writing as Michael P. Kube-McDowell
--] Member SFWA, Inc. * Member WGA, East, Inc.
--] Author of EXILE * THE QUIET POOLS * THE BLACK FLEET CRISIS
--] Web Site: http://www.sff.net/people/K-Mac [---
policraticus
Michael P. Kube-McDowell wrote:
>
> On 27 May 1998 23:22:01 GMT, churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
> >
> >...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
>
> In my original proposal to Bantam/Lucasfilm for the Black Fleet
> Crisis, I intended to give Chewie multiple wives--and make them the
> kick-ass volunteers who fill out the Falcon's crew for the rescue
> attempt. I was advised that Chewie already had a family, and I would
> have to use the existing characters (I thought I finessed that
> restriction rather neatly, but--). As a reference guide for the
> existing family, I was sent a copy of the Star Wars Storybook--a kids'
> picture book based on...the Holiday Special.
Argh! This is truly frightening. I can see mass suicides across RASSM!
Thought the BFC was brilliant, btw!
Policrat'
JackCamden
While I'm no fan of the Holiday Special (all those who are, raise your hands.
Anybody? Helloooo...), I thought Kube-McDowell did a terrific job with the
characters. The scenes between Chewie and Malla are sharp and poignant and
ADULT -- quite something considering Kube-McDowell was working with a kid's
book. The whole trilogy had terrific and bold characterizations, making Our
Heroes back into people again, but the Chewie/Malla scenes were IMHO the
boldest, most surprising and perhaps most successful.
Jack
James Watson
I think he did a great job too! Imagine having to take
the Holiday special and incorporate it into a book without
contradicting anything...
I'm impressed with how he handled Chewie's son's
name Lumpy.
--
wat...@iamerica.net (-o-)
AMSNYD
>>Subject: Holiday Special looks like canon from here (Was: The books don't
count Lucas says)
From: K-...@worldnet.att.net (Michael P. Kube-McDowell)
Date: Thu, Jun 11, 1998 12:00 AM
Message-id: <6lno9l$e...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>
On 27 May 1998 23:22:01 GMT, churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
>...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
In my original proposal to Bantam/Lucasfilm for the Black Fleet
Crisis, I intended to give Chewie multiple wives--and make them the
kick-ass volunteers who fill out the Falcon's crew for the rescue
attempt. I was advised that Chewie already had a family, and I would
have to use the existing characters (I thought I finessed that
restriction rather neatly, but--). As a reference guide for the
existing family, I was sent a copy of the Star Wars Storybook--a kids'
picture book based on...the Holiday Special.<<
Cool, is this book still in print? I'm the only person on this ng who actually
liked the special I beleive.
Galactica2
James Watson <wat...@iamerica.net> wrote:
>I think he did a great job too! Imagine having to take the Holiday special
>and incorporate it into a book without contradicting anything...
>I'm impressed with how he handled Chewie's son's name Lumpy.
Now I'm in suspense -- how did he handle it?
I've always thought that Lumpy was one of the more embarrassing names in the
Star Wars universe (and I'm kind of a Holiday Special fan).
Rich Handley
ams...@aol.com (AMSNYD) wrote:
>Cool, is this book still in print? I'm the only person on this ng who actually
>liked the special I beleive.
I don't know if it's in print, but it's a pretty fun book, and you can
probably get it from Lance Worth at Star Force Collectibles in El
Cajon, CA. E-mail him at TheSW...@aol.com.
Sincerely,
Rich Handley (Card...@unix.asb.com)
ChurroKing
HI everyone, Churroking (Kevin) here:
I just wanted to give credit where credit is due.
The way people are snipping posts is making me look like I authored the Black
Fleet Crisis books, which I did not do..Here is what I mean:
> On 27 May 1998 23:22:01 GMT, churr...@aol.com (ChurroKing) wrote:
>
> >
> >...The question is is that Darn Holliday Special canon ? It wasn't a book ?
>
> In my original proposal to Bantam/Lucasfilm for the Black Fleet
> Crisis, I intended to give Chewie multiple wives--and make them the
> kick-ass volunteers who fill out the Falcon's crew for the rescue
> attempt. I was advised that Chewie already had a family, and I would
> have to use the existing characters (I thought I finessed that
> restriction rather neatly, but--). As a reference guide for the
> existing family, I was sent a copy of the Star Wars Storybook--a kids'
> picture book based on...the Holiday Special.
I believe the Poster known as K-MAC is the author of the Black Fleet Crisis.
If I am wrong I do Apologise.
As a matter of fact My original post never even asked if the Holiday Special
was a book. That was someone elses addition to my post.
By the way the book was called "The Wookie Story Book", not the "Star Wars
Storybook" that is another book. I used to have the Wookie Storybook in 3rd
grade ( a long time ago in a galaxy far away...) , but Kimberly Anderson
stole it...that wench !!!
There I feel better now credit is given where it is due.
--Kevin
Rimrunner
In article <199806120731...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
He made "Lumpy" short for another name.
I do recommend reading the books, they're good, and you'll get to see for
yourself.
Rimrunner
big fan of reading for funsies
--
Murder of Crows official web site: http://www.nwlink.com/~noah/
Force This!: http://www.shavenwookie.com/rimrun
Pop-Culture Corn: http://www.pccmag.com
--
"Look, I don't know how they do things on your home planet, spaceman...but
here in Mayberry, we just don't talk to gun-toting, redneck, amphetamine
freaks that way." -- Milkman Dan, "Red Meat"
--
Rimrunner
In article <EuGKu...@news2.new-york.net>,
Rich Handley <Card...@NOSPAMunix.asb.com> wrote:>Actually, the longer names for Lumpy, Mala, and Itchy were taken from
>The Wookiee Storybook.
Really? I Did Not Know That! (tm)
Rimrunner
you learn something new every day
Rich Handley
Actually, the longer names for Lumpy, Mala, and Itchy were taken from
The Wookiee Storybook.
Sincerely,
Rich Handley (Card...@unix.asb.com)
James Watson
Rich Handley wrote:
>
> rim...@halcyon.com (Rimrunner) wrote:
> >He made "Lumpy" short for another name.
>
> Actually, the longer names for Lumpy, Mala, and Itchy were taken from
> The Wookiee Storybook.
I did not know that.
BTW, I'm starting to seriously worry about you when such
an obscure fact is remembered so easily, but you spell K-Mac's
name incorrectly...
;)
(Bycer's not around to abuse... I have to annoy someone)
--
wat...@iamerica.net (-o-)
Rich Handley
James Watson <wat...@iamerica.net> wrote:
>> Actually, the longer names for Lumpy, Mala, and Itchy were taken from
>> The Wookiee Storybook.
> I did not know that.
> BTW, I'm starting to seriously worry about you when such
>an obscure fact is remembered so easily, but you spell K-Mac's
>name incorrectly...
Yeah, my wife is starting to worry as well. :) But, really, all it
comes down to is that I have the Wookiee Storybook, so I'd read those
names before K-Mac's books came out. I think he did some great stuff
with those characters, too -- for the first time, I gave a damn about
them! They appeared in issue 91 of the Marvel series as well, but
they didn't do much except stand around and get caught by slavers.
Ann also gave them some nice fleshing out. However, for some reason,
I've always had a soft spot for that Wookiee Storybook. It's fun --
and probably one of the few SW kids' books I'd actually show to my
daughter.
> (Bycer's not around to abuse... I have to annoy someone)
It's working. :)
Sincerely,
Rich Handley (Card...@unix.asb.com)
ro...@postoffice.swbell.net
However, for some reason,
> I've always had a soft spot for that Wookiee Storybook. It's fun --
> and probably one of the few SW kids' books I'd actually show to my
> daughter.
>
>
Yea I remember that book too and I need to find a copy of it and some of
the other little storybooks.
Have you ever noticed the last page of the book with the fireworks, look at
the planets don't they look familiar? I used to think the Wookiee world was
Neptune or Uranus (for about 5 minutes)
I actually like the Holiday Special for it's '70's cheezyness and slight
connection to ANH
Of course the cartoon rocks! I think it should be used as the first
encounter with Boba Fett cause it is a good solid SW adventure. I don't
really care for the idea of Solo and Fett having known each other before (to
much like ST type stories) I think it was better he was just notorious.
Also the scene in SWSE, although it was cool to see him, messed up the
continuity of the cartoon which could have still stood alone regardless of
the special.
What I would really like to see is George Lucas have a sense of humor about
it and let MST3K have fun with it (maybe let George do a disclaimer to state
his p.o.v. for everyone instead of trying to hide it and disown it) or even
just release it (I know he doesn't want to)to put the bootleggers out of
business with it. Obviously some fans don't mind paying too much for it so
why not make the money for himself.(I've tried suggesting both ideas to
Steve Sansweet but he still thinks the show is too awful).
At the very least Steve Sansweet's idea a SW Exotica (no not Erotica) tape
with various clips like Underoos commercials, old Kenner commercials, and
the Boba cartoon would be cool.
Another one with all the edited scenes complete and explained along with
other tidbits would be cool too.
What do you folks think about that?
rot6
Theez1s
>What I would really like to see is George Lucas have a sense of humor about
>it and let MST3K have fun with it
that's the best idea i've heard in a long time. i laugh thinking about it. ez
Speculator
>ams...@aol.com (AMSNYD) wrote:
>>Cool, is this book still in print? I'm the only person on this ng who actually
>>liked the special I beleive.
Card...@NOSPAMunix.asb.com (Rich Handley)did you consider the great
discounts at the ORB while you wrote:
>I don't know if it's in print, but it's a pretty fun book, and you can
>probably get it from Lance Worth at Star Force Collectibles in El
>Cajon, CA. E-mail him at TheSW...@aol.com.
Alternatively ya could check the ORB ...
mtfbwy,
Speculator.
e-mail: spec...@infoshop.u-net.com
business: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~lo386500/
Spec Fic: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~lo386500/specfic.htm
bookshop: http://subnet.virtual-pc.com/~lo386500/novels.htm
The Official RASSM Bookstore ...
Services we provide include:
- extensive range of Science Fiction and Fantasy novels
- Ordering from Amazon.Com
- On-line ordering
- Credit card acceptance
- 24 hour shipping with all purchases paid with money orders and credit cards
- Money back guarantee on almost all items
- Excellent service
- Ship anywhere in the world!
AMSNYD
>>Subject: Re: Holiday Special looks like canon from here (Was: The books don't
count Lucas says)
From: the...@aol.com (Theez1s)
Date: Sat, Jun 13, 1998 4:54 PM
Message-id: <199806132154...@ladder03.news.aol.com>
>What I would really like to see is George Lucas have a sense of humor about
>it and let MST3K have fun with it
that's the best idea i've heard in a long time. i laugh thinking about it.<<
Actually GL doesn't have the rights to the Star Wars Holiday Special (beleive
it or not). The rights to the special belong to Smith-Hemion productions (who
do the Tony awards). Which makes me think, legally could Smith-Hemion reair
the special w/o GL's permission?
Galactica2
ams...@aol.com (AMSNYD) wrote:
>Actually GL doesn't have the rights to the Star Wars Holiday Special
>(beleive it or not). The rights to the special belong to Smith-Hemion
>productions (who do the Tony awards). Which makes me think, legally
>could Smith-Hemion reair the special w/o GL's permission?
You may be right that Lucasfilm does not own the Holiday Special, I don't know.
But Lucasfilm definitely owns the rights to the characters depicted in the
Holiday Special, i.e. Luke, Han, Leia, Vader, Chewie, etc. The characters and
imagery of Star Wars were licensed to Smith-Hemion for the production and
broadcast of the special, and you can be sure that license ran out long ago or
S-H would have surely released it on video by now if they could. Smith-Hemion
may own the rights to the special, but they can't release it without
Lucasfilm's permission.