Direct Order origins?

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J. Clarke

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Feb 21, 2022, 7:38:16 AMFeb 21
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I was watching "Raised By Wolves" last night and the phrase "Direct
Order" was used to instruct an android to do something it didn't want
to do.

The only other place I have seen that term used in that context is in
Mark Stanley's "Freefall" web comic, where it is used not only with
androids but with all AIs including organic ones.

I don't recall seeing it elsewhere. Does anybody have an earlier
usage?

Dimensional Traveler

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Feb 21, 2022, 10:18:42 AMFeb 21
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Its a military term (which I expect you know) so anything that involves
military probably will use the phrase at some point.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

J. Clarke

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Feb 21, 2022, 12:51:16 PMFeb 21
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On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 07:18:42 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
<dtr...@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 2/21/2022 4:38 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> I was watching "Raised By Wolves" last night and the phrase "Direct
>> Order" was used to instruct an android to do something it didn't want
>> to do.
>>
>> The only other place I have seen that term used in that context is in
>> Mark Stanley's "Freefall" web comic, where it is used not only with
>> androids but with all AIs including organic ones.
>>
>> I don't recall seeing it elsewhere. Does anybody have an earlier
>> usage?
>>
>Its a military term (which I expect you know) so anything that involves
>military probably will use the phrase at some point.

It's also a term of art in medicine. But neither the medical
establishment nor the military are staffed with androids or AIs at
this time. I'm curious about its history in that specific context.

Dimensional Traveler

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Feb 21, 2022, 1:35:33 PMFeb 21
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Then change "involves military" to "involves military androids or AIs".

J. Clarke

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Feb 21, 2022, 5:07:42 PMFeb 21
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On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 10:35:34 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
<dtr...@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 2/21/2022 9:51 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 07:18:42 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
>> <dtr...@sonic.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2/21/2022 4:38 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> I was watching "Raised By Wolves" last night and the phrase "Direct
>>>> Order" was used to instruct an android to do something it didn't want
>>>> to do.
>>>>
>>>> The only other place I have seen that term used in that context is in
>>>> Mark Stanley's "Freefall" web comic, where it is used not only with
>>>> androids but with all AIs including organic ones.
>>>>
>>>> I don't recall seeing it elsewhere. Does anybody have an earlier
>>>> usage?
>>>>
>>> Its a military term (which I expect you know) so anything that involves
>>> military probably will use the phrase at some point.
>>
>> It's also a term of art in medicine. But neither the medical
>> establishment nor the military are staffed with androids or AIs at
>> this time. I'm curious about its history in that specific context.
>
>Then change "involves military" to "involves military androids or AIs".

So do you have an actual example that predates "Freefall"?

Dorothy J Heydt

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Feb 22, 2022, 12:30:57 AMFeb 22
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In article <bt171hljuqivr80r0...@4ax.com>,
In the webcomic _Freefall_, humans command robots and other AIs
by surrounding them with the phrases "Direct order:" and "End
order." I borrowed them for a similar use in my space opera that
currently nears completion but will probably never see print.

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/

smw

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Feb 22, 2022, 3:09:32 AMFeb 22
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In <r7oxI...@kithrup.com> djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) writes:

>In the webcomic _Freefall_, humans command robots and other AIs
>by surrounding them with the phrases "Direct order:" and "End
>order."

...the very best example of which has to be this one:

http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1800/fc01780.htm

Note that the everyone on the right side of the fifth panel is compelled
to follow direct orders; in addition to Florence and Helix (the obvious
robot standing beside her), the three police officers are also robots.

This is the culmination of a sequence which begins 33 strips earlier, at

http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1800/fc01747.htm

...but I think it stands well enough on its own. :-)

- Steven
--
___________________________________________________________________________
Steven Winikoff | "The man who has ceased to learn ought
Montreal, QC, Canada | not to be allowed to wander around
s...@smwonline.ca | loose in these dangerous days."
http://smwonline.ca |
| - M. M. Coady

J. Clarke

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Feb 22, 2022, 7:23:46 AMFeb 22
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On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:09:30 -0000 (UTC), smw <s...@mort.smwonline.ca>
wrote:

>In <r7oxI...@kithrup.com> djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) writes:
>
>>In the webcomic _Freefall_, humans command robots and other AIs
>>by surrounding them with the phrases "Direct order:" and "End
>>order."
>
>...the very best example of which has to be this one:
>
> http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1800/fc01780.htm
>
>Note that the everyone on the right side of the fifth panel is compelled
>to follow direct orders; in addition to Florence and Helix (the obvious
>robot standing beside her), the three police officers are also robots.
>
>This is the culmination of a sequence which begins 33 strips earlier, at
>
> http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1800/fc01747.htm
>
>...but I think it stands well enough on its own. :-)

The thing is, I was wondering if it had been used anywhere in the
context of humans giving orders to robots or AIs _before_ "Freefall".

smw

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Feb 22, 2022, 12:47:29 PMFeb 22
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In <kcl91hh1tqjnjhot4...@4ax.com>
J. Clarke <jclarke...@gmail.com> writes:

>The thing is, I was wondering if it had been used anywhere in the
>context of humans giving orders to robots or AIs _before_ "Freefall".

I know, and I'm sorry I can't help with that. I just thought that cartoon
was far too good not to share.

- Steven
--
___________________________________________________________________________
Steven Winikoff | Sometimes the questions are complicated
Montreal, QC, Canada | and the answers are simple.
s...@smwonline.ca |
http://smwonline.ca | - Dr. Seuss

Michael F. Stemper

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Feb 22, 2022, 3:03:13 PMFeb 22
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> In <kcl91hh1tqjnjhot4...@4ax.com>
> J. Clarke <jclarke...@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> The thing is, I was wondering if it had been used anywhere in the
>> context of humans giving orders to robots or AIs _before_ "Freefall".

I just came across the term "direct order" in Vonnegut's _The
Sirens of Titan_ (1959), but it's a Martian giving an order
to a human conscripted into the Martian army.

So it's an older use of the term, and in SF.

Oh, and the human has just come out of a mind-wipe treatment,
so he's almost a robot. And the order is to strangle his best
friend. (Shades of _The Manchurian Candidate_!)


--
Michael F. Stemper
A preposition is something you should never end a sentence with.

Titus G

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Feb 22, 2022, 10:10:14 PMFeb 22
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On 23/02/22 09:02, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
>> In <kcl91hh1tqjnjhot4...@4ax.com>
>> J. Clarke <jclarke...@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> The thing is, I was wondering if it had been used anywhere in the
>>> context of humans giving orders to robots or AIs _before_ "Freefall".
>
> I just came across the term "direct order" in Vonnegut's _The
> Sirens of Titan_ (1959), but it's a Martian giving an order
> to a human conscripted into the Martian army.
>
> So it's an older use of the term, and in SF.
>
> Oh, and the human has just come out of a mind-wipe treatment,
> so he's almost a robot. And the order is to strangle his best
> friend. (Shades of _The Manchurian Candidate_!)
>
.
Vonnegut's _The Sirens of Titan_ was once my favourite book but much of
it is now forgotten unfortunately. I own less than 50 paper books that I
have bought for myself and Sirens is one of them, a cheap US Dell
edition, $2.25 ($2.75 in Canada). I have just got a copy for the Kindle
so will re-read it as I suspect it will pass the test of time, (fingers
crossed).

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