The Green Green Grass of Home.

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Ann Green

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May 14, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/14/98
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I'd had my suspicions of course. I always thought the world was a little
doolally. Now I _know_ reality has completely absented itself.
I live about a mile from the route all the cavalcades will travel as
they bring the most powerful world leaders from the airport to the G8
summit, and although it's nice to see Birmingham have a shower and
squirt on the metaphorical deodorant I am truly gobsmacked at the
lengths the City Council have gone to to make the place look good.

THERE ARE ABOUT A MILLION HELICOPTERS BUZZING AROUND UP THERE DESPITE
FOG THICK ENOUGH TO KNIT WITH, AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE
GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!

I'm going for a lie down; when the nurse comes with my medication please
tell him I'm in the teapot.....

Ann


Vicki Rosenzweig

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May 14, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/14/98
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I thought only the American government was that stupid.

Here, have a nice cup of tea, and don't look out the window for a while.
Can I give you a book to read? _Alice in Wonderland_ perhaps?

Vicki Rosenzweig
v...@interport.net | http://www.users.interport.net/~vr/
"Typos are Coyote padding through the language, grinning."
-- Susanna Sturgis


Avram Grumer

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May 14, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/14/98
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In article <6jg00l$gs_...@port.net.interport.net>, v...@interport.net (Vicki
Rosenzweig) wrote:

> >...AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE GRASS

> >VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>

> I thought only the American government was that stupid.

Oh, I don't know. I think a Potemkin lawn takes distant second to the
original Potemkin village.

--
Avram Grumer | av...@interport.net | http://www.users.interport.net/~avram/

"The Internet is not a separate 'cyberspace' reality. It is a new nervous
system for the physical world." -- Phil Agre

John Boston

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
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In article <avram-14059...@avram.port.net>, av...@interport.net
says...

>
>In article <6jg00l$gs_...@port.net.interport.net>, v...@interport.net (Vicki
>Rosenzweig) wrote:
>
>> In article <355B51...@virgin.net>, ghost...@virgin.net wrote:
>>
>> >...AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE GRASS
>> >VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>>
>> I thought only the American government was that stupid.
>
>Oh, I don't know. I think a Potemkin lawn takes distant second to the
>original Potemkin village.


Don't forget more recent Potemkin villages. In the 1980s, the New
York City government decided that all the burned-out and abandoned buildings
in the Bronx were bad for its image, so they put up decals. They boarded
over the windows and put up huge stickers over the plywood depicting urban
pastoral scenes like windowsills with plants, cats looking out, etc. Often
they would cover an entire building with identical decals so it looked like
a sheet of stamps. They were so happy with the results that they rolled out
the decal policy to other parts of the city, with amusing results. Once I
was taking a cab to Kennedy Airport and the driver went via side streets to
avoid some pocket apocalypse on the main roads, and we drove past some
decalled buildings that squatters had broken into, so two windows would have
a decal of fake plants and in the next one somebody would have ripped away
the plywood and they would have real plants; the next several would have
decals again. Very dialectical.

John Boston


Aria

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In article <6jg00l$gs_...@port.net.interport.net>,
v...@interport.net (Vicki Rosenzweig) wrote:
>In article <355B51...@virgin.net>, ghost...@virgin.net wrote:
<snip bits about world leaders and birmingham>

>>THERE ARE ABOUT A MILLION HELICOPTERS BUZZING AROUND UP THERE DESPITE
>>FOG THICK ENOUGH TO KNIT WITH, AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE

>>GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>>
>>I'm going for a lie down; when the nurse comes with my medication please
>>tell him I'm in the teapot.....
>>
>>Ann
>>
>
>I thought only the American government was that stupid.
>
Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about? (If it's obvious to everyone since
they know about this world leaders thing then never mind....the only news I
generally get in a week is on _Good News Week_ (aussie fans will know what I'm
on about...how about those dolphin fashion accessories eh?) I know of two
Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK...Ann doesn't have a
specific .uk email address so (as I've only started reading recently and don't
know everyone yet) which particular government is indulging in this insanity?
Aria

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Aria, sci-fi fan, astronomer, : Time paradoxes will have
and physicist! Yep, I'm mad. : given me a headache.
Email: wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu :
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do NOT send unsolicited commercial email. Add .au to address to reply.
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Ray Radlein

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

Ann Green wrote:
>
> I'd had my suspicions of course. I always thought the world was a
> little doolally. Now I _know_ reality has completely absented itself.
> I live about a mile from the route all the cavalcades will travel as
> they bring the most powerful world leaders from the airport to the G8
> summit, and although it's nice to see Birmingham have a shower and
> squirt on the metaphorical deodorant I am truly gobsmacked at the
> lengths the City Council have gone to to make the place look good.
>
> THERE ARE ABOUT A MILLION HELICOPTERS BUZZING AROUND UP THERE DESPITE
> FOG THICK ENOUGH TO KNIT WITH, AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE
> GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!

How soon is this summit? There is a type of liquid mixture of fertilizer
and grass seed which can be sprayed on bare (but otherwise acceptable)
ground and result in a nice verdant growth of grass in a relatively
short order. It is frequently green (I've boggled more than once at bare
hillsides by construction projects apparently painted green, only to
have them covered in grass the next time I drive by). If the summit is
not for a couple of weeks, it is possible that they are simply putting
down new grass, in effect.


- Ray R.


--
**********************************************************************
"Yes, orphan," Merlin said to Arthur, "you are now a True King; and it
is yourself that has made you so, as it must be. And now you realize
the second great truth -- that this is indeed the Magic Sword [...]
FOR THE MAGIC SWORD IS THE ONE WITH A TRUE KING AT THE HILT."

Ray Radlein - r...@learnlink.emory.edu
homepage coming soon! wooo, wooo.
**********************************************************************


Gary Farber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
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In <355BEB...@learnlink.emory.edu> Ray Radlein <r...@learnlink.emory.edu> wrote:
[. . .]

: How soon is this summit? There is a type of liquid mixture of fertilizer


: and grass seed which can be sprayed on bare (but otherwise acceptable)
: ground and result in a nice verdant growth of grass in a relatively
: short order. It is frequently green (I've boggled more than once at bare
: hillsides by construction projects apparently painted green, only to
: have them covered in grass the next time I drive by). If the summit is
: not for a couple of weeks, it is possible that they are simply putting
: down new grass, in effect.

No: according to the London TIMES, some of the grass turned yellow, so
they're hitting it with green dye.

--
--
Copyright 1998 by Gary Farber; Web Researcher; Nonfiction Writer,
Fiction and Nonfiction Editor; gfa...@panix.com; B'klyn, NYC, US

Morgan

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In this post <6jgiug$hkl$2...@newsman.murdoch.edu.au>, Aria

<wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu> said:
>Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about?


The real one!


<England!>


--
Morgan

"Come to the edge." he said. They said "We are afraid." "Come
to the edge." he said. They came. He pushed them...and they flew.

Gary Farber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
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In <THdQwMAS...@sidhen.demon.co.uk> Morgan <Mor...@sidhen.demon.co.uk> wrote:
: In this post <6jgiug$hkl$2...@newsman.murdoch.edu.au>, Aria

: <wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu> said:
:>Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about?

: The real one!

: <England!>

For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
President's advance folk said that the President and company always
started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
"bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.

Lawrence Watt-Evans

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

On Fri, 15 May 98 17:05:53 GMT, wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu (Aria) wrote:

> I know of two
>Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK..

Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.

(This may be nitpicking, but to me, "central" at its most generous
means between the Rockies and the Appalachians and no farther south
than Tennessee -- though curiously, I notice I have no northern limit
short of the Canadian border. Anyway, Alabama doesn't qualify.)


--

The Misenchanted Page: http://www.sff.net/people/LWE/ Last update 4/24/98

mike weber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence Watt-Evans) wrote:

>On Fri, 15 May 98 17:05:53 GMT, wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu (Aria) wrote:
>
>> I know of two
>>Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK..
>
>Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.
>
>(This may be nitpicking, but to me, "central" at its most generous
>means between the Rockies and the Appalachians and no farther south
>than Tennessee -- though curiously, I notice I have no northern limit
>short of the Canadian border. Anyway, Alabama doesn't qualify.)
>

My definition of "Central US" seems to begin a bit north of where
yours does, and runs south to the Gulf... Interesting.

Hadn't thought about it before now...

--
<mike weber> <emsh...@aol.com>
The history of exploration is mostly the history of finding
new ways to die unexpectedly -- JWCjr, on the Apollo 1 fire

mike weber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

Gary Farber <gfa...@panix2.panix.com> wrote:

>In <355BEB...@learnlink.emory.edu> Ray Radlein <r...@learnlink.emory.edu> wrote:
>[. . .]
>
>: How soon is this summit? There is a type of liquid mixture of fertilizer
>: and grass seed which can be sprayed on bare (but otherwise acceptable)
>: ground and result in a nice verdant growth of grass in a relatively
>: short order. It is frequently green (I've boggled more than once at bare
>: hillsides by construction projects apparently painted green, only to
>: have them covered in grass the next time I drive by). If the summit is
>: not for a couple of weeks, it is possible that they are simply putting
>: down new grass, in effect.
>
>No: according to the London TIMES, some of the grass turned yellow, so
>they're hitting it with green dye.
>

That's not unheard of here in the States, either -- just not terribly
common. When we lived in South Carolina, there was a Major Business
((May have been IBM's local HQ)) that painted its lawn green every
winter.

mike weber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

Ray Radlein <r...@learnlink.emory.edu> wrote:


>How soon is this summit? There is a type of liquid mixture of fertilizer
>and grass seed which can be sprayed on bare (but otherwise acceptable)
>ground and result in a nice verdant growth of grass in a relatively
>short order. It is frequently green (I've boggled more than once at bare
>hillsides by construction projects apparently painted green, only to
>have them covered in grass the next time I drive by). If the summit is
>not for a couple of weeks, it is possible that they are simply putting
>down new grass, in effect.
>

That kind of stuff is usually sprayed over ground covered in straw
mulch.

Chris Croughton

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

Gary Farber wrote:

> For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
> Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
> President's advance folk said that the President and company always
> started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
> The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
> "bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
> arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.

Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).

Chris C

Lawrence Watt-Evans

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

On Fri, 15 May 1998 15:25:37 GMT, emsh...@aol.com (mike weber)
wrote:

>lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence Watt-Evans) wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 15 May 98 17:05:53 GMT, wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu (Aria) wrote:
>>
>>> I know of two
>>>Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK..
>>
>>Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.
>>
>>(This may be nitpicking, but to me, "central" at its most generous
>>means between the Rockies and the Appalachians and no farther south
>>than Tennessee -- though curiously, I notice I have no northern limit
>>short of the Canadian border. Anyway, Alabama doesn't qualify.)
>>
>My definition of "Central US" seems to begin a bit north of where
>yours does, and runs south to the Gulf... Interesting.

You include parts of Canada in "central U.S."?

Gary Farber

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In <355C75...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
[. . .]
: Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth

: is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
: abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).

A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.

Ann Green

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

Gary Farber wrote:

> :>Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about?
>
> : The real one!
>
> : <England!>
>

> For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
> Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
> President's advance folk said that the President and company always
> started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
> The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
> "bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
> arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.

This is, of course, a cunning yet rather lengthy assassination attempt
on the life of your priapic President. No noisy guns for us, ho no,
we've got LARD and we're not afraid to use it. Grab your arteries and
head for the bunker troops, that sausage might be loaded!

Still wibbling,

Ann


Ann Green

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE
> > GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>
> How soon is this summit?

Today!

Ann


David G. Bell

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In article <6jh704$2...@news1.panix.com>
gfa...@panix2.panix.com "Gary Farber" writes:

> In <355BEB...@learnlink.emory.edu> Ray Radlein <r...@learnlink.emory.edu>
> wrote:
> [. . .]
>

> : How soon is this summit? There is a type of liquid mixture of fertilizer


> : and grass seed which can be sprayed on bare (but otherwise acceptable)
> : ground and result in a nice verdant growth of grass in a relatively
> : short order. It is frequently green (I've boggled more than once at bare
> : hillsides by construction projects apparently painted green, only to
> : have them covered in grass the next time I drive by). If the summit is
> : not for a couple of weeks, it is possible that they are simply putting
> : down new grass, in effect.
>

> No: according to the London TIMES, some of the grass turned yellow, so
> they're hitting it with green dye.

It doesn't need dye, just the right nutrients. Or, possibly, better
drainage. The wet weather of the last couple of months did put crops
under a lot of stress, and delay fertiliser applications.

--
David G. Bell -- Farmer, SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.


David G. Bell

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In article <355C75...@amc.de> crou...@amc.de "Chris Croughton" writes:

> Gary Farber wrote:
>
> > For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
> > Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
> > President's advance folk said that the President and company always
> > started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
> > The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
> > "bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
> > arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.
>

> Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
> is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
> abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).

I hope somebody has warned the Secret Service about the potential
dangers of the President having a quick fag over his bagels and LOX.

Janice Gelb

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May 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/15/98
to

In article 2...@newsman.murdoch.edu.au, wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu (Aria) writes:
>>In article <355B51...@virgin.net>, ghost...@virgin.net wrote:
><snip bits about world leaders and birmingham>
>>>THERE ARE ABOUT A MILLION HELICOPTERS BUZZING AROUND UP THERE DESPITE
>>>FOG THICK ENOUGH TO KNIT WITH, AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE

>>>GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>>>
>>>I'm going for a lie down; when the nurse comes with my medication please
>>>tell him I'm in the teapot.....
>>>
>>
>Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about? (If it's obvious to everyone since
>they know about this world leaders thing then never mind....the only news I
>generally get in a week is on _Good News Week_ (aussie fans will know what I'm
>on about...how about those dolphin fashion accessories eh?) I know of two
>Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK...Ann doesn't have a
>specific .uk email address so (as I've only started reading recently and don't
>know everyone yet) which particular government is indulging in this insanity?
>Aria
>

I've never yet heard anyone from Alabama use the phrase "a lie down" and
so my guess would be it's the Birmingham in England.


********************************************************************************
Janice Gelb | The only connection Sun has with
janic...@eng.sun.com | this message is the return address.
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/8018/index.html

"Politics is show business for ugly people"
-- James Carville

********************************************************************************

mike weber

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence Watt-Evans) wrote:

>On Fri, 15 May 1998 15:25:37 GMT, emsh...@aol.com (mike weber)
>wrote:
>
>>lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence Watt-Evans) wrote:
>>
>>>(This may be nitpicking, but to me, "central" at its most generous
>>>means between the Rockies and the Appalachians and no farther south
>>>than Tennessee -- though curiously, I notice I have no northern limit
>>>short of the Canadian border. Anyway, Alabama doesn't qualify.)
>>>
>>My definition of "Central US" seems to begin a bit north of where
>>yours does, and runs south to the Gulf... Interesting.
>
>You include parts of Canada in "central U.S."?
>

*Sigh* This i get for not checking to see the post says what i meant
to say before hitting the "SEND" key. This i do not need.

What i -meant- to say was "... a bit north of where yours ends to the
South ..."

*Sigh*

[["Thank you, Mistress, may I have another?"]]

Ray Radlein

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote:
>
> wal...@fizzy.murdoch.edu (Aria) wrote:
>
> > I know of two Birminghams for sure, one in central USA and one in UK..
>
> Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.
>
> (This may be nitpicking, but to me, "central" at its most generous
> means between the Rockies and the Appalachians and no farther south
> than Tennessee -- though curiously, I notice I have no northern limit
> short of the Canadian border. Anyway, Alabama doesn't qualify.)

My notion of the Midwest -- more or less the same thing as "Central," I
suppose -- includes basically everything east of the Rockies, west of
the Appalacians and Ohio River, and north of Arkansas.


Speaking of geographical curiousities, the local newspaper had a whopper
on its Editorial page the other week, when someone made a reference to
"...the poorer parts of Appalachia, such as the Mississippi Delta..."

And I thought, "Why stop there? I bet there's even *less* economic
development a couple hundred miles out into the Gulf. That's a *really*
poor part of Appalachia."

It was only a week or two before that when the paper made a reference to
the genius of Benjamin Franklin, who "...invented bifocal lenses when he
wasn't busy writing the Declaration of Independence." Which is literally
true, I suppose, inasmuch as how Thomas Jefferson wrote it, giving Ben
Franklin plenty of time to do other things. For that matter, I
understand he invented the Franklin stove while he wasn't busy winning
the 1963 Nobel Prize for Literature, and he founded the first American
public library while he wasn't busy inventing the transistor.

Avram Grumer

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355C75...@amc.de>, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:

> Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England,
> but what on earth is a 'schmear'?

Cream cheese.

Information wants to be wrong.

aRJay

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In an article using recycled electrons Gary Farber wrote :-

>:>Um, Which Birmingham is Ann talking about?
>
>: The real one!
>
>: <England!>


>
>For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
>Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
>President's advance folk said that the President and company always
>started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
>The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
>"bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
>arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.
>

Don't know about presidential breakfasts but there was some footage of
him on the news last night, he was having lunch in one of the waterside
pubs in Birmingham. Lunch was beer and chips (frys for our US readers)
on the veranda of this pub where it was implied that he' just stopped
off whilst out walking.
--
aRJay

Chris Croughton

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

David G. Bell wrote:
>
> In article <355C75...@amc.de> crou...@amc.de "Chris Croughton" writes:
>
> > Gary Farber wrote:
> >
> > > For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
> > > Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
> > > President's advance folk said that the President and company always
> > > started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
> > > The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
> > > "bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
> > > arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.
> >
> > Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
> > is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
> > abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
>
> I hope somebody has warned the Secret Service about the potential
> dangers of the President having a quick fag over his bagels and LOX.

I think the American newspapers would be interested in him having a fag,
quick or not ("Yes, I had a fag but I didn't Swallow!"). Perhaps we
should warn Teddy...

(Or perhaps a schmear test?)

Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat
pretzels hot or cold? The ones I've had in England have been served
cold, and I didn't much care for them, but in Germany they're generally
served hot (or at least warm) from the oven and are delicious. They
also do a sort of round bun made out of the same dough which are superb
eaten for breakfast...

Chris C

Chris Croughton

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Gary Farber wrote:
>
> In <355C75...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
> [. . .]
> : Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth

> : is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
> : abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
>
> A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.

Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something one
learns by experience? And does the lox go under the cream cheese or is
it a separate item?

Chris C

Lawrence Watt-Evans

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

On Sat, 16 May 1998 13:37:02 +0200, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de>
wrote:

>Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat
>pretzels hot or cold?

Both. Generally small hard ones are served cold (usually as a snack
with soda or beer), and big soft ones are served hot (especially by
street vendors and at sporting events).

Vicki Rosenzweig

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355C75...@amc.de>, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
>Gary Farber wrote:
>
>> For the summit of the G8. The Times of London also reported that the
>> Swallow Hotel, hosting Clinton and aides, was taken aback when the
>> President's advance folk said that the President and company always
>> started breakfast with bagels and a schmear, and of course they had this?
>> The Swallow was prepared to give a full English breakfast, and was found
>> "bagels" a strange exotically alien artifact, apparently, but they made
>> arrangements to find them, somewhere in Birmingham.
>
>Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
>is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
>abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
>

A "schmear" is cream cheese--I suspect it's a Yiddish-influenced form
of "smear," because you sort of smear the cream cheese onto the
bagel.

But am I the only person who thinks Clinton was pulling their leg?
The man is from Arkansas, used to jog to McDonald's for breakfast,
and has lived in Britain. I'm from New York, raised on bagels, and
had no trouble finding things to eat from a full English breakfast.
The only way this makes sense is that he figured "I'm the Leader
of the Free World, I can have whatever I want for breakfast, so
there!" <sound effect of foot stamping> Or that he figured it never
hurts to ask, and if they'd said "sorry, we don't have real bagels
in Birmingham" he might have been quite prepared to smile and
say "Okay, then, eggs, brown toast, ham, and mushrooms, please."

Vicki Rosenzweig
v...@interport.net | http://www.users.interport.net/~vr/
"Typos are Coyote padding through the language, grinning."
-- Susanna Sturgis


Chris Croughton

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote:
>
> On Sat, 16 May 1998 13:37:02 +0200, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de>
> wrote:
>
> >Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat
> >pretzels hot or cold?
>
> Both. Generally small hard ones are served cold (usually as a snack
> with soda or beer), and big soft ones are served hot (especially by
> street vendors and at sporting events).

It's the small hard ones I'm not keen on. The big soft hot ones are
very good, especially with butter (the Germans butter them, at least for
breakfast)...

Chris C

Chris Croughton

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Vicki Rosenzweig wrote:

> But am I the only person who thinks Clinton was pulling their leg?
> The man is from Arkansas, used to jog to McDonald's for breakfast,
> and has lived in Britain. I'm from New York, raised on bagels, and
> had no trouble finding things to eat from a full English breakfast.
> The only way this makes sense is that he figured "I'm the Leader
> of the Free World, I can have whatever I want for breakfast, so
> there!" <sound effect of foot stamping> Or that he figured it never
> hurts to ask, and if they'd said "sorry, we don't have real bagels
> in Birmingham" he might have been quite prepared to smile and
> say "Okay, then, eggs, brown toast, ham, and mushrooms, please."

I suspect the latter, he doesn't strike me as the sort of peson who'd
throw a temper tantrum over not getting his bagels. And the hotel might
have been having him on as well (or it might have been that they just
didn't have any atthat time and didn't have time to go out and get some)
because they're not unknown even in Birmingham.

Which president was it who refused to have broccoli served in the White
House because he'd been forced to eat it as a kid? I always thought
that was a nice human touch, the sort of thing we think as kids ("if I
was president I wouldn't have to eat broccoli")...

Chris C

Elisabeth Carey

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Chris Croughton wrote:

> Which president was it who refused to have broccoli served in the White
> House because he'd been forced to eat it as a kid? I always thought
> that was a nice human touch, the sort of thing we think as kids ("if I
> was president I wouldn't have to eat broccoli")...

That was George Bush. He didn't originally set out to make
an issue of the matter. He just had one of those PR
exchanges with some school kids, and casually agreed with
one of the kids that no, he didn't like broccoli, either,
and he wouldn't have it served in the White House. The
broccoli growers expressed outrage, saying that the
_president_ shouldn't be saying things like that; it would
hurt their sales--and in a remarkably dimwitted PR exercise,
they sent a large truckload of fresh broccoli to the White
House, figuring that Bush would have to accept the "gift",
have the broccoli served at the White House, and it would be
a great PR coup for the broccoli growers.

But George Bush refused delivery, and said that he was the
President of the United States and _no one_ could force him
to eat broccoli.

Even I, a broccoli lover from way back, thought it was one
of his finest moments.

Lis Carey

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355c4528...@news.clark.net>, lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence
Watt-Evans) writes:

>Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.

It is if you operate on a sufficiently limited version of the
bicoastal model of the US.


"Yes, indeed, the Lord is a shoving leopard." -- Rev. W.A. Spooner
** Ulrika O'Brien-...@aol.com**

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <895262...@zhochaka.demon.co.uk>, db...@zhochaka.demon.co.uk

("David G. Bell") writes:

>I hope somebody has warned the Secret Service about the potential
>dangers of the President having a quick fag over his bagels and LOX.

It's okay, he only diddles female aides.

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355D25...@learnlink.emory.edu>, Ray Radlein
<r...@learnlink.emory.edu> writes:

>It was only a week or two before that when the paper made
>a reference to the genius of Benjamin Franklin, who "...invented >bifocal
lenses when he wasn't busy writing the Declaration of
>Independence." Which is literally true, I suppose, inasmuch as
>how Thomas Jefferson wrote it, giving Ben Franklin plenty of
>time to do other things. For that matter, I understand he invented
>the Franklin stove while he wasn't busy winning
>the 1963 Nobel Prize for Literature, and he founded the
>first American public library while he wasn't busy inventingt
>he transistor.

Come to think of it, I hardly do give out any RASFF awards,
do I? I'm never sure if I'm doing it right. But wotthehell.
Give that man a Rasseff award, with "Marry me?" clusters.

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355D7A...@amc.de>, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> writes:

>Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat

>pretzels hot or cold? The ones I've had in England have been served
>cold, and I didn't much care for them, but in Germany they're generally
>served hot (or at least warm) from the oven and are delicious. They
>also do a sort of round bun made out of the same dough which are >superb eaten
for breakfast...

Soft pretzels should be served hot, with mustard. I particularly
like the place in Fashion Island that serves different 'flavors'
like bagels, including garlic ones, which are especially nice.

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <355D7A...@amc.de>, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> writes:

>Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something
>one learns by experience? And does the lox go under the cream >cheese or is
it a separate item?

Lox *under* the cream cheese? Images of delicate flinders of
translucent smoked fish (I am, of course, really speaking of Nova,
rather than Lox, since Moshe May Be Lurking) being utterly pulped
into the bagel by the rock hard cream cheese which I forgot
(again) to take out in advance. No, lox definitely goes *on* *top*
of the cream cheese (or are we having Transatlantic Preposition
Problesm?). Sources differ about which order the tomato and red onion go on
in.

Ulrika

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In article <6jk38u$2m0...@port.net.interport.net>, v...@interport.net (Vicki
Rosenzweig) writes:

>The only way this makes sense is that he figured "I'm the Leader
>of the Free World, I can have whatever I want for breakfast, so
>there!"

Next he'll be wanting them to pick all the green M&M's out
of the bowls before putting them out in his hotel rooms.

James Nicoll

unread,
May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Chris Croughton wrote:
>
> Vicki Rosenzweig wrote:
>
> > But am I the only person who thinks Clinton was pulling their leg?
> > The man is from Arkansas, used to jog to McDonald's for breakfast,
> > and has lived in Britain. I'm from New York, raised on bagels, and
> > had no trouble finding things to eat from a full English breakfast.
> > The only way this makes sense is that he figured "I'm the Leader
> > of the Free World, I can have whatever I want for breakfast, so
> > there!" <sound effect of foot stamping> Or that he figured it never
> > hurts to ask, and if they'd said "sorry, we don't have real bagels
> > in Birmingham" he might have been quite prepared to smile and
> > say "Okay, then, eggs, brown toast, ham, and mushrooms, please."
>
> I suspect the latter, he doesn't strike me as the sort of peson who'd
> throw a temper tantrum over not getting his bagels. And the hotel might
> have been having him on as well (or it might have been that they just
> didn't have any atthat time and didn't have time to go out and get some)
> because they're not unknown even in Birmingham.
>
> Which president was it who refused to have broccoli served in the White
> House because he'd been forced to eat it as a kid? I always thought
> that was a nice human touch, the sort of thing we think as kids ("if I
> was president I wouldn't have to eat broccoli")...
>

George Bush. Pissed off a lot of broccoli growers,it did.

There's a book: Culinary oddities of the Presidents. You get
Bush and Broccoli, Ford and the WH cooks and so on. If you make it Heads
of State you get PM King and the Ladies of the Night.

James Nicoll

Gary Farber

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In <355D7A...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
[. . .]

: Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat
: pretzels hot or cold?

Yes. Also either hard or soft.

[. . . .]

Gary Farber

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

In <355D7A...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
: Gary Farber wrote:
:>
:> In <355C75...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
:> [. . .]
:> : Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth

:> : is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
:> : abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
:>
:> A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.

: Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something one
: learns by experience?

Enough, to taste. One slices the bagel in half, lengthwise. Schmear on
enough cream cheese on each half to cover. Then either cover with lox and
eat, or cover one with lox, replace one half to cover, and slice in half
in other direction (like a sandwich), and eat.

: And does the lox go under the cream cheese or is
: it a separate item?

On top of cream cheese. If eating like a sandwich, be careful not to
squirt cream cheese and lox out the side. :-)

Rob Hansen

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

On 15 May 1998 17:35:14 GMT, Gary Farber <gfa...@panix2.panix.com>
wrote:

>In <355C75...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
>[. . .]
>: Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
>: is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
>: abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
>
>A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.

Oh, a cream cheese beigel! I had one of these for lunch this very day
(Friday), bought in the 24-hour, 365-day-a-year beigel bar at the top
of Brick Lane. Moshe gave the beigels the Feder seal of approval on
his last UK trip, too, something he rarely gives to any outside New
York (though he was highly dubious of the local Jews way of spelling
'beigel' - only Gentiles spell it 'bagel' over here).


Rob Hansen
================================================
My Home Page: http://www.fiawol.demon.co.uk/rob/
Feminists Against Censorship:
http://www.fiawol.demon.co.uk/FAC/

Loren MacGregor

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

On 15 May 1998 17:35:14 GMT, Gary Farber <gfa...@panix2.panix.com>
wrote:

>In <355C75...@amc.de> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
>[. . .]
>: Bagels can be bought in most supermarkets in England, but what on earth
>: is a 'schmear'? Lox I know (although in England it's also an
>: abbreviation for Liquid OXygen).
>
>A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.


'swhat I had for breakfast, too. Yum.

-- LJM


Pierre Jelenc

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> writes:

> Gary Farber wrote:
> >
> > A proper dollop of cream cheese smeared over the cut-in-half bagel.
>
> Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something one
> learns by experience?

It depends. In my neighborhood, where its is "Un bagel con shmeer, por
favor!", it's a layer about 1/2 inch thick. A bottle of malta is the
traditional accompaniment.

Pierre
--
Tired of TV reruns? Help is on the way!
New York City | Home Office
Beer Guide | Records
http://www.nycbeer.org/ | http://www.web-ho.com/

Alan Woodford

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

On Thu, 14 May 1998 21:16:47 +0100, Ann Green <ghost...@virgin.net>
wrote:

>I'd had my suspicions of course. I always thought the world was a little
>doolally. Now I _know_ reality has completely absented itself.
>I live about a mile from the route all the cavalcades will travel as
>they bring the most powerful world leaders from the airport to the G8
>summit, and although it's nice to see Birmingham have a shower and
>squirt on the metaphorical deodorant I am truly gobsmacked at the
>lengths the City Council have gone to to make the place look good.

>
>THERE ARE ABOUT A MILLION HELICOPTERS BUZZING AROUND UP THERE DESPITE
>FOG THICK ENOUGH TO KNIT WITH, AND THERE ARE GUYS SPRAY-PAINTING THE
>GRASS VERGES ALONG THE ROUTE A NICER COLOUR GREEN!!!!!!!
>
>I'm going for a lie down; when the nurse comes with my medication please
>tell him I'm in the teapot.....
>

>Ann
>

And just as a further data point, less than 10 miles from the centre
of Birmingham, the (unpainted) grass is currently still growing like
theres no tomorrow!

Alan "My word, that's work popping up again" Woodford

Men in Frocks, protecting the Earth with mystical flummery!

Cally Soukup

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

aRJay <aR...@escore.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Don't know about presidential breakfasts but there was some footage of
> him on the news last night, he was having lunch in one of the waterside
> pubs in Birmingham. Lunch was beer and chips (frys for our US readers)
> on the veranda of this pub where it was implied that he' just stopped
> off whilst out walking.

Yep, he's been known to do that sort of thing. Gives the Secret
Service fits, it does.

(Does anyone else think the Secret Service is a really stupid name
for the Presidental bodyguard? And that it's weird for the Treasury
Department to be guarding the Prez in the first place? Or do I have
it wrong, and the Secret Service isn't part of the Treasury
Department?)

--
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend
to the death your right to say it." -- Beatrice Hall
Cally Soukup ma...@mcs.com

Doug Berry

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

On Sat, 16 May 1998 13:38:26 +0200, Chris Croughton
<crou...@amc.de> wrote:

>Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something one

>learns by experience? And does the lox go under the cream cheese or is
>it a separate item?

I am informed by a reliable source that "schmear" has become
almost a trademrk of Noah's Bagels in the Pacific Northwest.

Also, the cream chesse goes underneath the lox. Why do we do
this? God tells us to. I'm sure it's in there somewhere...

--
Douglas E. Berry
dbe...@hooked.net
http://www.hooked.net/~dberry/

Proud Hooker since 1995.

Doug Berry

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Doug Berry

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to

Artis Trust (SF Central)

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May 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/16/98
to Lawrence Watt-Evans

The secret service is one of the oldest federal law enforcement branches, second
only to the US Marshals Service. The marshall at one time dealt mainly with
local law enforcement, and until 1972 (I beleive) all Deputy Marshalls were
hired from each fed. district. Originally when the USSS was created, the
largest threat to union was after the civil war when a large amount of conterfit
money existed. As time grew, the USSS became the main law enforcement arm of the
government.

Eventually, after the death of President William McKinley, the secret service
was assigned to protect the president, mainly because there was no other force
that existed in Washington. The USSS is involved with more than just playmoney.
They are involved with credit card fraud, hacking, computer fraud and almost
anything that involved computer/money transactions.

The FBI was originally formed out of Secret Service Agents, btw which was
originally the Bureau of Investigation.

> On 16 May 1998 14:29:25 -0500, Cally Soukup <ma...@mcs.com> wrote:
>
> >(Does anyone else think the Secret Service is a really stupid name
> >for the Presidental bodyguard? And that it's weird for the Treasury
> >Department to be guarding the Prez in the first place? Or do I have
> >it wrong, and the Secret Service isn't part of the Treasury
> >Department?)
>

> It's the Treasury Department. The Secret Service has two major duties
> these days -- guarding the President is one, and dealing with
> counterfeiters is the other. The counterfeiting stuff obviously
> relates to the Treasury.
>
> Originally the Secret Service actually was a proper secret service,
> but their duties got shifted, rearranged, pre-empted, etc., until
> that's what they were left with.


>
> --
>
> The Misenchanted Page: http://www.sff.net/people/LWE/ Last update 4/24/98

--
Artis Trust | Editor, SF Central Project | http://www.sfcentral.com
Visit SF Central to win _Dry Water_ from Eric. S Nylund
---
Learn about Free SF&F Web Hosting/Pages
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Lawrence Watt-Evans

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Gary Farber

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

In <ZJcQ+TAB...@escore.demon.co.uk> aRJay <aR...@escore.demon.co.uk> wrote:
[. . .]
: Don't know about presidential breakfasts but there was some footage of

: him on the news last night, he was having lunch in one of the waterside
: pubs in Birmingham. Lunch was beer and chips (frys for our US readers)
: on the veranda of this pub where it was implied that he' just stopped
: off whilst out walking.

According to the Times of London, the real mystery is why, as the
President was leaving, one of the Presidential party came and took
Clinton's beer glass away: souvenir? Prevention of being finger-printed
and it being learned that he's a Clinton-double? Prevention of gaining
Presidential DNA for cloning?

You Decide.

mike weber

unread,
May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:

>Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote:


>>
>> On Sat, 16 May 1998 13:37:02 +0200, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do Americans eat
>> >pretzels hot or cold?
>>

>> Both. Generally small hard ones are served cold (usually as a snack
>> with soda or beer), and big soft ones are served hot (especially by
>> street vendors and at sporting events).
>
>It's the small hard ones I'm not keen on. The big soft hot ones are
>very good, especially with butter (the Germans butter them, at least for
>breakfast)...
>

Mustard is a common condiment with those over here...


--
<mike weber> <emsh...@aol.com>
The history of exploration is mostly the history of finding
new ways to die unexpectedly -- JWCjr, on the Apollo 1 fire

mike weber

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

ulr...@aol.com (Ulrika) wrote:

>In article <355D7A...@amc.de>, Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> writes:
>

>>Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something
>>one learns by experience? And does the lox go under the cream >cheese or is
>it a separate item?
>

>Lox *under* the cream cheese? Images of delicate flinders of
>translucent smoked fish (I am, of course, really speaking of Nova,
>rather than Lox, since Moshe May Be Lurking) being utterly pulped
>into the bagel by the rock hard cream cheese which I forgot
>(again) to take out in advance. No, lox definitely goes *on* *top*
>of the cream cheese (or are we having Transatlantic Preposition
>Problesm?). Sources differ about which order the tomato and red onion go on
>in.
>

What about the slice of Canadian Bacon?

Morgan

unread,
May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

In this post <6jlpac$e...@news1.panix.com>, Gary Farber

<gfa...@panix2.panix.com> said:
>In <ZJcQ+TAB...@escore.demon.co.uk> aRJay <aR...@escore.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>[. . .]
>: Don't know about presidential breakfasts but there was some footage of
>: him on the news last night, he was having lunch in one of the waterside
>: pubs in Birmingham. Lunch was beer and chips (frys for our US readers)
>: on the veranda of this pub where it was implied that he' just stopped
>: off whilst out walking.
>
>According to the Times of London, the real mystery is why, as the
>President was leaving, one of the Presidential party came and took
>Clinton's beer glass away: souvenir? Prevention of being finger-printed
>and it being learned that he's a Clinton-double? Prevention of gaining
>Presidential DNA for cloning?
>
>You Decide.
>

More likely to stop it being sold as a souivenier - thus spawing four
thousand 'true' beer glasses.

--
Morgan

"Come to the edge." he said. They said "We are afraid." "Come
to the edge." he said. They came. He pushed them...and they flew.

Artis Trust (SF Central)

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Oh... Maybe Gary has something there.

Actually, I am sure of the solution. Clinton has been taken over by an alien.

As for Presidential DNA, that doesn't seem to be a problem to get as he seems to
leave it on people's sweaters.


> According to the Times of London, the real mystery is why, as the
> President was leaving, one of the Presidential party came and took
> Clinton's beer glass away: souvenir? Prevention of being finger-printed
> and it being learned that he's a Clinton-double? Prevention of gaining
> Presidential DNA for cloning?
>
> You Decide.
>

> --
> Copyright 1998 by Gary Farber; Web Researcher; Nonfiction Writer,
> Fiction and Nonfiction Editor; gfa...@panix.com; B'klyn, NYC, US

--

Vicki Rosenzweig

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

In article <355fdc63...@news.wenet.net>, dbe...@hooked.net (Doug Berry) wrote:

>On Sat, 16 May 1998 13:38:26 +0200, Chris Croughton
><crou...@amc.de> wrote:
>
>>Is there a standard size for "a proper dollop", or is this something one
>>learns by experience? And does the lox go under the cream cheese or is
>>it a separate item?
>
>I am informed by a reliable source that "schmear" has become
>almost a trademrk of Noah's Bagels in the Pacific Northwest.
>
>Also, the cream chesse goes underneath the lox. Why do we do
>this? God tells us to. I'm sure it's in there somewhere...
>

My first thought is that the cream cheese goes underneath the lox
because it does. My second is that, as a purely practical matter,
it's got to be easier to spread cream cheese on a bagel and they
lay lox on top than to lay lox on the bagel and then try to spread
cream cheese on top (because the lox is smooth and even slippery).


Vicki Rosenzweig
v...@interport.net | http://www.users.interport.net/~vr/
"Typos are Coyote padding through the language, grinning."
-- Susanna Sturgis


P Nielsen Hayden

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

In article <6jgahg$ms7$1...@camel25.mindspring.com>, jbo...@mindspring.com (John Boston) wrote:

> Don't forget more recent Potemkin villages. In the 1980s, the New
>York City government decided that all the burned-out and abandoned buildings
>in the Bronx were bad for its image, so they put up decals. They boarded
>over the windows and put up huge stickers over the plywood depicting urban
>pastoral scenes like windowsills with plants, cats looking out, etc. Often
>they would cover an entire building with identical decals so it looked like
>a sheet of stamps. They were so happy with the results that they rolled out
>the decal policy to other parts of the city, with amusing results. Once I
>was taking a cab to Kennedy Airport and the driver went via side streets to
>avoid some pocket apocalypse on the main roads, and we drove past some
>decalled buildings that squatters had broken into, so two windows would have
>a decal of fake plants and in the next one somebody would have ripped away
>the plywood and they would have real plants; the next several would have
>decals again. Very dialectical.

Indeed. One of my fondest fannish memories is of taking Judith Hanna and
Joseph Nicholas on the Circle Line boat tour around Manhattan, and telling
this story to them as we chugged up the Harlem River between Harlem and the
South Bronx. The choking and gagging noises from Joseph in particular were
worth the cost of the Circle Line tickets.

However, I seem to recall that it was some kind of Federal agency's
initiative, not the New York City government's. I could be wrong about that.

-----
Patrick Nielsen Hayden : p...@panix.com : http://www.panix.com/~pnh

Ed Dravecky III

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Lawrence Watt-Evans (lawr...@clark.net) wrote:
> Chris Croughton <crou...@amc.de> wrote:
> > Totally unrelated (except that it's about food), do
> > Americans eat pretzels hot or cold?
>
> Both. Generally small hard ones are served cold (usually as
> a snack with soda or beer), and big soft ones are served hot
> (especially by street vendors and at sporting events).

We also have a couple of competing chains of stores that
specialize in serving big, hot pretzels in shopping malls and
airports across America. The bigger chains are Auntie Anne's
and Mr. Pretzel but your signage may vary.

I used to make a special point of visiting the Auntie Anne's
in the Pittsburgh airport whenever I had to fly US Air(ways).
Then I discovered a branch had opened at the mall near my
apartment. Now "hot pretzels" is an individual line-item in
my monthly budget (after "electricity" but before "cable TV").
--
Ed Dravecky <+> Dallas
dsheldon(at)netcom.com

Ed Dravecky III

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Ulrika (ulr...@aol.com) wrote:
> lawr...@clark.net (Lawrence Watt-Evans) writes:
> > Central USA? Alabama isn't central, it's deep south.
> It is if you operate on a sufficiently limited version of the
> bicoastal model of the US.

Ah, those of us from Alabama believed we were in the deep south
strongly enough to put "Heart of Dixie" on the license plates.

Perhaps "Central USA" refers to the fact that Alabama is in the
Central Time Zone?

Ed Dravecky III

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

mike weber (emsh...@aol.com) wrote:
(in response to discussion of Proper Bagel Construction)

> What about the slice of Canadian Bacon?

And the cheese. You can't forget the cheese...


(I'm only half-kidding. The fine folks at Jimmy Dean offer a
Canadian bacon-and-cheese-on-a-bagel as part of their line of
frozen breakfast foods. As a quick breakfast food it's not half
bad but I have my doubts about this being strictly kosher...)

Ed Dravecky III

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

Artis Trust (SF Central) (edi...@sfcentral.com) wrote:
> As for Presidential DNA, that doesn't seem to be a problem to get
> as he seems to leave it on people's sweaters.

Ignoring for a moment that this was a pure rumor with no basis
in truth or reality, YM "people's black or blue dresses". HTH!

Jo Walton

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98
to

In article <dsheldonE...@netcom.com>

dshe...@netcom.com "Ed Dravecky III" writes:

> mike weber (emsh...@aol.com) wrote:
> (in response to discussion of Proper Bagel Construction)
> > What about the slice of Canadian Bacon?
>
> And the cheese. You can't forget the cheese...
>
> (I'm only half-kidding. The fine folks at Jimmy Dean offer a
> Canadian bacon-and-cheese-on-a-bagel as part of their line of
> frozen breakfast foods. As a quick breakfast food it's not half
> bad but I have my doubts about this being strictly kosher...)

I believe it was established here that if it's treif you can't
make it double treif by mixing bacon and cheese, as bacon is
treif all on its own.

I really frequently eat bacon and cream-cheese (or chive primula)
bagels, which I consider delicious. Fortunately my religion has
no qualms whatsoever about this.

(Don't remind me about the pigs playing the puter games, OK?)

--
Jo - - I kissed a kif at Kefk - - J...@bluejo.demon.co.uk
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.bluejo.demon.co.uk - Blood of Kings Poetry; rasfw FAQ;
Reviews; Interstichia; Momentum - a paying market for real poetry.


Marilee J. Layman

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May 17, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/17/98