Joe Christ Does Not Support Me In E-mail, But He Plans To Reprint YOURS

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mike weber

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Aug 10, 2001, 12:03:04 PM8/10/01
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Joe Christ objected to my post about why he and Nancy Collins are
trying to make sure Ed Kramer gets convicted, no matter what the
principle of a "Fair Trial" may say.

He explained that Ed didn't do anything to help them, that they
merely, out of their hearts, agreed to lend some "hip credibility" to
his activities, claiming that Nancy actually edited the anthologies
under Ed's name -- which might even be true...

Also he claims to have been brought into DragonCon by someone else; i
don't know about that, though i must say his isrt of thing sounds a
lot like what i know about Ed's tastes in general.

The concept, of course, that DragonCon, which has drawn mumblemumble
thousand every year for as long as i can recall noticing, needed help
from a marginal maker of sleezy films and an out-of-print horror
writer in establishing any kind of "credibility" is amusingly
arrogant.

Oh -- and i thought various people might like to know, he plans,
"...when Kramer is convicted..." to reprint the e-mails and newsgroup
postings which, in his words "defended" Kramer against Collins and
Christ.

I responded that he might like to reconsider that idea.

I don't know about others who have posted to Christ and Collins's
"Krucify Kramer" stuff, nor to the most recent "blubber" stuff [1]
taking Ed's side, but anyone who has might like to be aware that
Christ has this intent to reprint all of these e-mails and newsgroup
posts and, presumably, attempt to cause trouble for everyone who
disagreed with him.


[1]And, while i will not apologise for posting to that thread, i must
agree with Christ that anyone who talks that way about Nancy hasn't
looked around much at many conventions and i *do* object to that
particular characterisation. There are other things i might zap Nancy
about that hark back over twenty years or so of acquaintance (though
out-of-touch the last five or seven), that is one i would not -- and
certainly have no business to do so, given my own size, as anyone who
knows me will attest.
--
=============================================================
"They put manure in his well and they made him talk to lawyers!"
-- Cat Ballou
mike weber -- kras...@mindspring.com
Book Reviews & More -- http://electronictiger.com

Joel Rosenberg

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Aug 10, 2001, 12:20:18 PM8/10/01
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I don't think the threats, such as they are, much matter -- even if Ed
Kramer is justly convicted (as he may be, despite some disturbing reports
about how the police have behaved), I can't recall anybody "defending"
Kramer, other than to argue that he should, indeed, have a fair trial,
assuming that there is sufficient evidence to go to trial in the first
place.

I'm not ashamed to be in favor of fair trials; and I wonder who the comedy
act of Christ and Collins thinks should be ashamed to be in favor of a fair
trial for somebody accused of such horrible behavior as Ed Kramer clearly
has.

I'm also in favor of apple pie, too, no matter what the cost of admitting
that in public might be.

"mike weber" <kras...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
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Kevin J. Maroney

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Aug 10, 2001, 3:05:31 PM8/10/01
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"Joel Rosenberg" <jo...@winternet.com> wrote:
>I'm also in favor of apple pie, too, no matter what the cost of admitting
>that in public might be.

This has been duly noted in your Permanent Record. The Pie Police will
be watching.

--
Kevin Maroney | Unplugged Games | kmar...@ungames.com
If they keep you asking the wrong questions, they don't have
to worry about the answers. --Thomas Pynchon

Kevin J. Maroney

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Aug 10, 2001, 3:07:32 PM8/10/01
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kras...@mindspring.com (mike weber) wrote:
>He explained that Ed didn't do anything to help them, that they
>merely, out of their hearts, agreed to lend some "hip credibility" to
>his activities, claiming that Nancy actually edited the anthologies
>under Ed's name -- which might even be true...

It is conceivable that Nancy Collins did some work on some Kramer
anthologies, but there is ample evidence that Kramer did important
work on them, including work that does not bring one to view him in a
favorable light.

--
Kevin Maroney | kmar...@ungames.com
Kitchen Staff Supervisor, New York Review of Science Fiction
<http://www.nyrsf.com>

Marilee J. Layman

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Aug 10, 2001, 8:53:13 PM8/10/01
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On Fri, 10 Aug 2001 16:03:04 GMT, kras...@mindspring.com (mike
weber) wrote:

>Joe Christ objected to my post about why he and Nancy Collins are
>trying to make sure Ed Kramer gets convicted, no matter what the
>principle of a "Fair Trial" may say.
>
>He explained that Ed didn't do anything to help them, that they
>merely, out of their hearts, agreed to lend some "hip credibility" to
>his activities, claiming that Nancy actually edited the anthologies
>under Ed's name -- which might even be true...

The email he sent me said Kramer & GA were having a plea bargain. Not
that I trust him to tell the truth.

--
Marilee J. Layman
Bali Sterling Beads at Wholesale
http://www.basicbali.com

mike weber

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Aug 11, 2001, 12:52:45 AM8/11/01
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On Fri, 10 Aug 2001 11:20:18 -0500, "Joel Rosenberg"
<jo...@winternet.com> typed


>I'm not ashamed to be in favor of fair trials; and I wonder who the comedy
>act of Christ and Collins thinks should be ashamed to be in favor of a fair
>trial for somebody accused of such horrible behavior as Ed Kramer clearly
>has.

I am neither ashamed of nor embarrassed by my position and so on.

I just don't want them to use my e-mails as part of some on-going
attempt to cause trouble.

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