Somtow has left for Thailand

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Flaming Auto

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Sep 22, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/22/00
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Author S P Somtow left for Thailand, not long
after news broke the FBI had entered the Ed Kramer case.
Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie together
about little boys stranded in space.


mike weber

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Sep 22, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/22/00
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On 22 Sep 2000 19:45:03 GMT, Flaming Auto <flami...@yahoo.com>
typed

>Author S P Somtow

This little bit of data was e-mailed to me a while ago by an
acquaintance who said i could quote it online but to not use their
name.

I didn't; i didn't feel it was appropriate -- someone, however, under
a patent usename has decided to post it here.
--
"He had long ago come to the conclusion that there
were no 'things Man was Not Meant To Know'. He was willing
to believe that there were things Man was Too Dumb To
Figure Out." - Mike Kurland

<mike weber> <kras...@mindspring.com>
Ambitious Incomplete web site: http://weberworld.virtualave.net

Lawrence Person

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Sep 22, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/22/00
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In article <39CBB683...@yahoo.com>, Flaming Auto
<flami...@yahoo.com> wrote:

And from whence did this wild-eyed-speculation come? Is there an objective
source for this information other than some (ahem) flaming usenet yahoo?

The Locus web page (http://www.locusmag.com/2000/News/News09Log.html) has
a far more realistic-sounding take on the situation:

"On Sept. 15 HWA President S.P. Somtow distributed an e-mail letter to
fellow members urging calm and presumption of innocence, especially
considering the potential for the horror or gothic communities to be put
on trial, ''misunderstood and blamed for various societal ills''. A
principal piece of evidence is apparently a low-budget,
straight-to-Internet horror video (directed by Kramer, co-written with
Brad Linaweaver, and with music by Somtow) called ''Terror at Tate
Manor'', "in which a kid, in underwear, flees in terror from a nude woman
for fear of being seduced" (Somtow); the film can be viewed online."

--
Lawrence Person
lawrenc...@jump.net
Lame Excuse Books Now Online at: http://www.abebooks.com
Nova Express Website: http://www.delphi.com/sflit/novaexpress/

flami...@yahoo.com

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Sep 23, 2000, 9:48:49 PM9/23/00
to
Somtow sent a message from Thailand to the HWA (HWA Internet mailer #170)
which states:
"Right now I am in Bangkok again..."
I didn't make this up...you can check.

Ed Dravecky III

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Sep 23, 2000, 10:14:32 PM9/23/00
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flami...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Somtow sent a message from Thailand to the HWA (HWA Internet
> mailer #170) which states:
> "Right now I am in Bangkok again..."
> I didn't make this up...you can check.

You implied cause-and-effect without backing it up. Shortly
after the Kramer news broke, the US Ambassador to Israel was
recalled but I'd have a hard time connecting the two events.

--
Ed Dravecky III (ed3 at panix.com)
Webmaster of http://www.deathsheep.com/

flami...@yahoo.com

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Sep 23, 2000, 11:24:44 PM9/23/00
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Please refer to my first post on the matter. In it I said,

"Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie together
about little boys stranded in space."

Gary Farber

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Sep 24, 2000, 12:00:54 AM9/24/00
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In article <39CD73C0...@yahoo.com>,

flami...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Please refer to my first post on the matter.

Okay. The sentence "Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie
together about little boys stranded in space" has fifteen words.

I've now referred to your first post. So?

Possibly the phrase "refer to" does not mean what you think it means?

[. . . .]

--
Gary Farber New York
gfa...@panix.com 2000
garyf...@juno.com
gfa...@my-deja.com


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Kip Williams

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Sep 24, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/24/00
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Gary Farber wrote:
>
> In article <39CD73C0...@yahoo.com>,
> flami...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Please refer to my first post on the matter.
>
> Okay. The sentence "Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie
> together about little boys stranded in space" has fifteen words.
>
> I've now referred to your first post. So?
>
> Possibly the phrase "refer to" does not mean what you think it means?
>
> [. . . .]

Merriam-Webster's 10th Collegiate, gives us "to have recourse :
glance briefly <referred to his notes while speaking>." Did you
refer to the same dictionary as I used? I took it to mean 'go look
at' the post.

--
--Kip (Williams)
amusing the world at http://members.home.net/kipw/

Vicki Rosenzweig

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Sep 24, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/24/00
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Quoth flami...@yahoo.com on 24 Sep 2000 03:24:44 GMT:

>Please refer to my first post on the matter. In it I said,
>"Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie together
>about little boys stranded in space."

This is such classic attempted guilt-by-association that I'm
not surprised you're posting from an anonymous Yahoo account.
Lots of people have worked together on all sorts of things:
movies about children are fairly common, if only because people
of all ages, including children, like to see movies about
people like themselves.

Would you care to clarify what you're trying to say?


>
>Ed Dravecky III wrote:
>
>> flami...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> > Somtow sent a message from Thailand to the HWA (HWA Internet
>> > mailer #170) which states:
>> > "Right now I am in Bangkok again..."
>> > I didn't make this up...you can check.
>>
>> You implied cause-and-effect without backing it up. Shortly
>> after the Kramer news broke, the US Ambassador to Israel was
>> recalled but I'd have a hard time connecting the two events.
>>
>> --
>> Ed Dravecky III (ed3 at panix.com)
>> Webmaster of http://www.deathsheep.com/

--
Vicki Rosenzweig | v...@redbird.org
r.a.sf.f faq at http://www.redbird.org/rassef-faq.html

Loren MacGregor

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Sep 24, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/24/00
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Vicki Rosenzweig wrote:
>
> Quoth flami...@yahoo.com on 24 Sep 2000 03:24:44 GMT:
>
> >Please refer to my first post on the matter. In it I said,
> >"Somtow & Kramer had been working on a movie together
> >about little boys stranded in space."
>
> This is such classic attempted guilt-by-association that I'm
> not surprised you're posting from an anonymous Yahoo account.
> Lots of people have worked together on all sorts of things:
> movies about children are fairly common, if only because people
> of all ages, including children, like to see movies about
> people like themselves.

I've worked on a movie about David and Goliath, where we spent much
of our film budget filming David, clad only in a loin cloth, running
across sand dunes, silhouetted against a rising sun. (The director
was a perfectionist, and it was hard to get the shot exactly
right.) In Mr. Flamingauto's lexicon, that apparently makes me ripe
for the tar-and-chicken-feathers routine.

-- LJM

Elspeth Kovar

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Sep 25, 2000, 12:30:24 AM9/25/00
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mike weber wrote:

> I didn't; i didn't feel it was appropriate -- someone, however, under

> a patent usename has decided to post it here.

I did a DejaNews search, the results of which follow. For reasons that
may be apparent I did not look at this person's website nor at more than
two of his posts outside of rasff.

Elspeth

> There are 44 unique messages by
> flami...@yahoo.com
> (numbers may be slightly skewed by cross-postings)
> Get all 44 messages
>
>
> Number of Messages
> Forum
> 5
> rec.arts.sf.fandom
> 4
> alt.sadistic
> 3
> alt.cult-movies
> 3
> alt.sex.fetish.amputee
> 3
> rec.arts.movies.past-films
> 3
> alt.video.tape-trading
> 3
> rec.arts.movies.current-films
> 2
> alt.movies
> 2
> alt.sex.tasteless
> 2
> alt.tasteless.penis
> 2
> alt.movies.independent
> 1
> rec.music.marketplace.vinyl
> 1
> alt.sex.movies
> 1
> alt.fandom.cons
> 1
> rec.music.movies
> 1
> rec.music.marketplace.cd
> 1
> rec.music.industrial
> 1
> rec.music.marketplace.misc
> 1
> alt.marketplace.videotapes
> 1
> alt.cult-movies.erotica
> 1
> alt.music.industrial
> 1
> rec.arts.movies.misc
> 1
> alt.marketplace.compact-disc

som...@primenet.com

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Sep 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/25/00
to
Even though I'm trying to avoid commenting on this case one way or
another until I learn more, I can't help responding to this person's
somewhat innuendo-filled remarks ...sure, I'm in Thailand for a couple
more days. I go to Thailand practically every month as my opera is
premiering here in February and at the moment I'm making more of a living
from my day job with the Bangkok Symphony than from my writing. I own a
home here. But I'll be in Berkeley Sunday for a book signing.

Ed Kramer was one of several people my producers had attempting to help
find financing for my film, LITTLE SAVAGES, after Porchlight
Entertainment, who originally owned the rights to my script, and which is
a company that ONLY produces family films and shows like 'Jay Jay the Jet
Plane', lost its option. The film has Gary Busey and Miko Hughes (of
Mercury Rising) attached. Hardly a sleazy project.


Best wishes

S.P. Somtow


In article <39CD5D44...@yahoo.com>,

Demian Phillips

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Sep 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/25/00
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Elspeth Kovar <EBur...@Radix.net> wrote:

>mike weber wrote:
>
>> I didn't; i didn't feel it was appropriate -- someone, however, under
>> a patent usename has decided to post it here.
>
>I did a DejaNews search, the results of which follow. For reasons that
>may be apparent I did not look at this person's website nor at more than
>two of his posts outside of rasff.
>
>Elspeth

Looks to me like a lame spammer/troll.

--
+---------------------+-------------------------------------------+
|^_^ |Well I've wrestled with reality for thirty |
|Demian Phillips |five years doctor, and I'm happy to say I |
|PGP KEY ID 0x5BC4FCB4|finally won out over it. - Elwood P. Dowd |


mike weber

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Sep 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/25/00
to
On Mon, 25 Sep 2000 00:30:24 -0400, Elspeth Kovar <EBur...@Radix.net>
typed

>mike weber wrote:
>
>> I didn't; i didn't feel it was appropriate -- someone, however, under
>> a patent usename has decided to post it here.
>
>I did a DejaNews search, the results of which follow. For reasons that
>may be apparent I did not look at this person's website nor at more than
>two of his posts outside of rasff.
>
>Elspeth
>
>> There are 44 unique messages by
>> flami...@yahoo.com
>> (numbers may be slightly skewed by cross-postings)
>> Get all 44 messages
>>
>>
>> Number of Messages
>> Forum
>> 5
>> rec.arts.sf.fandom
>> 4
>> alt.sadistic

<snip remaining list>

This list leads me to the suspicion that i could put a name (within
about two) to "flamingauto" but i won't.
--
"A cat who sits on a hot stove will never sit on a hot stove
again. She will also never sit on a cold one." Mark Twain

D. Potter

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Sep 26, 2000, 12:34:41 AM9/26/00
to
S. P. Somtow wrote:

>>"Even though I'm trying to avoid commenting on this case one way or
another until I learn more, I can't help responding to this person's
somewhat innuendo-filled remarks ...sure, I'm in Thailand for a couple
more days. I go to Thailand practically every month as my opera is
premiering here in February and at the moment I'm making more of a living
from my day job with the Bangkok Symphony than from my writing. I own a
home here. But I'll be in Berkeley Sunday for a book signing."<<

[other stuff snipped]

Howdy, stranger! Good to see you (as it were). Someone earlier commented that
the ambassador to Israel had also departed the same day, and why hadn't the
[excised pejorative] tried to connect *that*, which caused:

<Groucho>

They're in cahoots, MacBeth.

</Groucho>

I may actually get up to Berkeley for the signing, although inertia usually
claims me on weekends. What's the name of the opera, and is there any chance
it'll get to San Francisco?

D., typing under threat of Stoppardo

som...@primenet.com

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Sep 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/26/00
to

I can't speak for the Israeli Ambassador, but it wasn't me, honest. The
plot of the opera and other info can be found at www.somtow.com/
madana.html, which is a barely started-up web page about the opera, but I
hope to get more info out soon.

You can come to the opera in Bangkok CHEAP, there's gonna be this "opera
tour" thing, for about a grand you get plane fare, hotel, elegant
cocktail with the divas and celebs such as they are, and ticket to the
premiere, best seats, as near to royalty as they dare.

Also, someone is looking into a SFO premiere some time next spring, and
trying to get the dough together to bring over the production.

Somtow


In article <20000926003441...@ng-me1.aol.com>,

Philip Chee

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Sep 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/26/00
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In article <8qq05g$7n3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com> som...@primenet.com writes:

>I can't speak for the Israeli Ambassador, but it wasn't me, honest. The
>plot of the opera and other info can be found at www.somtow.com/
>madana.html, which is a barely started-up web page about the opera, but I
>hope to get more info out soon.

>You can come to the opera in Bangkok CHEAP, there's gonna be this "opera
>tour" thing, for about a grand you get plane fare, hotel, elegant
>cocktail with the divas and celebs such as they are, and ticket to the
>premiere, best seats, as near to royalty as they dare.

Howdy neighbour,

Any chance of the opera sometime moving southwards across the border?

Phil

---=====================================================================---
Philip Chee: Tasek Corporation Berhad, P.O.Box 254, 30908 Ipoh, MALAYSIA
e-mail: phi...@aleytys.pc.my Voice:+60.5.291.1011 Fax:+60.5.291.9932
Guard us from the she-wolf and the wolf, and guard us from the thief,
oh Night, and so be good for us to pass.
---
ž 20328.57 ž Words are not food, though sometimes we must eat them.

Jacque

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Sep 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/27/00
to
In article <som...@primenet.com> wrote:
[...]
>
>Best wishes
>
>S.P. Somtow

[...]

Okay, in a ligher vein, I just have to ask: what does the "P" stand
for? <g,d&r>

--jm
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jacque Marshall jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net http://www.eskimo.com/~jacquem

Morris M. Keesan

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Sep 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/27/00
to
In article <8qtkhi$cjo$1...@og1.olagrande.net>,

Jacque <jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net> wrote:
>In article <som...@primenet.com> wrote:
>[...]
>>
>>Best wishes
>>
>>S.P. Somtow
>
>[...]
>
>Okay, in a ligher vein, I just have to ask: what does the "P" stand
>for? <g,d&r>

"Pseudonym"? Or maybe "Pen"?
--
Morris M. Keesan -- kee...@world.std.com
http://world.std.com/~keesan/ -- newest baby pictures added 9/13/2000

som...@primenet.com

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Sep 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/27/00
to
You know, the truth is, it stands for nothing at all, and neither does
the S; the name was created in response to my publisher wanting me to
have a name that "most Americans" could pronounce. However, the S could
be taken to stand for my last name, and the P could stand for my middle
name, Papinian.

SPS

In article <8qtkhi$cjo$1...@og1.olagrande.net>,


jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net wrote:
> In article <som...@primenet.com> wrote:
> [...]
> >
> >Best wishes
> >
> >S.P. Somtow
>
> [...]
>
> Okay, in a ligher vein, I just have to ask: what does the "P" stand
> for? <g,d&r>
>

> --jm
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Jacque Marshall jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net http://www.eskimo.com/~jacquem
>

Avedon Carol

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Sep 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/27/00
to
On Wed, 27 Sep 2000 22:18:50 GMT, kee...@world.std.com (Morris M.
Keesan) wrote:

>In article <8qtkhi$cjo$1...@og1.olagrande.net>,


>Jacque <jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net> wrote:
>>In article <som...@primenet.com> wrote:
>>[...]
>>>
>>>Best wishes
>>>
>>>S.P. Somtow
>>
>>[...]
>>
>>Okay, in a ligher vein, I just have to ask: what does the "P" stand
>>for? <g,d&r>
>

>"Pseudonym"? Or maybe "Pen"?

Ya beat me to it.

Avedon Carol

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Sep 27, 2000, 8:50:51 PM9/27/00
to
On Wed, 27 Sep 2000 23:40:14 GMT, som...@primenet.com wrote:

>You know, the truth is, it stands for nothing at all, and neither does
>the S; the name was created in response to my publisher wanting me to
>have a name that "most Americans" could pronounce. However, the S could
>be taken to stand for my last name, and the P could stand for my middle
>name, Papinian.

My god, you have an Armenian middle name!

Eva Whitley

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Sep 27, 2000, 8:14:38 PM9/27/00
to
Papian (I suspect I'm misspelling that).

I believe he was a Roman emperor. --Eva Whitley (but we just call him Unca
Sommy)


"Jacque" <jac...@UNSPAM.olagrande.net> wrote in message
news:8qtkhi$cjo$1...@og1.olagrande.net...


> In article <som...@primenet.com> wrote:
> [...]
> >
> >Best wishes
> >
> >S.P. Somtow
>
> [...]
>
> Okay, in a ligher vein, I just have to ask: what does the "P" stand
> for? <g,d&r>
>

> --jm
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------

som...@primenet.com

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
to
Let me just say this about that:

Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but at
the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all, at
the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because they
didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul, loser of
two Hugos.

Papinian was a Roman, but actually a lawgiver of some kind. He lived in
the reign of Caracalla, who built the baths, and was executed by him.

Hmm, of course he could have been part Armenian.

SP


In article <O3wA5.7129$g4.1...@skycache.prestige.net>,

Johan Anglemark

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
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som...@primenet.com wrote in <8qvc1c$rkq$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:

>Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but
>at the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all,
>at the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because
>they didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul,
>loser of two Hugos.

You are not kidding? Honestly not kidding? I have unfortunately not read
anything by you (yet), but hey, even I knew that.

Jeez.

-j
--
jo...@anglemark.pp.se --- www.bahnhof.se/~anglemar/
***** Upsala Science fiction-sällskap:
***** http://sfweb.dang.se/

James Nicoll

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
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In article <bb55ts015dvko4iea...@4ax.com>,
Don't let Mutlu know. Although ims he could turn any name into
an Armenian one by adding 'ian' to the end.

James Nicollian

No, that doesn't really work.

--
Much apologies but my return path is temporarily broken. Please
use jdni...@home.com instead.

som...@primenet.com

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
to
It's absolutely true. Well, then I covered up the S.P. on my name badge,
went back, and the person at the door went ... "Ooooooooooh YOU!" and
let me in.

SP


In article <8FBD96C59...@192.9.201.127>,

Cally Soukup

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote in article <8qu0gt$rm4$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:

> You know, the truth is, it stands for nothing at all, and neither does
> the S; the name was created in response to my publisher wanting me to
> have a name that "most Americans" could pronounce. However, the S could
> be taken to stand for my last name, and the P could stand for my middle
> name, Papinian.

I'd just learned how to pronounce your name (well, modulo actually
having you critique my pronounciation yourself) when you went and
changed it. This is a demonstration of the Perversity of the
Universe, or at least of publishers.

--
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend
to the death your right to say it." -- Beatrice Hall

Cally Soukup sou...@pobox.com

Jo Walton

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Sep 28, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/28/00
to
In article <8FBD96C59...@192.9.201.127>
j...@anglemark.pp.se "Johan Anglemark" writes:

> You are not kidding? Honestly not kidding? I have unfortunately not read
> anything by you (yet), but hey, even I knew that.

They're well worth looking for.

Let me just say -- :Jasmine Nights:.

It's wonderful. It's sort of like a Thai version of :To Kill a Mockingbird:,
and it's as good as that as well. It's in the small sub-genre of books
(with Ryman's :Was:) that turn out to be fantasy on the last page.

It's not in print, here anyway, I've been trying to buy a copy in a
bookshop for the last couple of years. I've read it twice from the
library. I think this is the sort of book Lucy and Patrick would
both enjoy. There was a British B-Format edition, which I have seen
and held in my hand, but which not even Blackwells seem to stock.

:The Shattered Horse: is also good, but deeply weird -- it's the story
of Astynax's life after a slave was hurled from the wall of Troy in
his place. I think I liked it, and it was certainly well written, but
it was extremely odd. Emmet loves this book and buys copies to give
people whenever he sees it.

The rest of what Somtow's written that I've seen has all been horror.
I liked :Jasmine Nights: so much that I actually tried to read :Riverrun:,
even though I don't like horror, and Emmet assured me it wasn't too
distressing. I had to stop because I was too distressed. This is _not_
a book for people who don't like horror, or who have lost a sibling.

Oh, and there's a terrific short story called "Dragon's Fin Soup" which
was on the web and may still be, which is why I started looking for the
novels in the first place.

--
Jo - - I kissed a kif at Kefk - - J...@bluejo.demon.co.uk
http://www.bluejo.demon.co.uk - UPDATED Interstichia; Poetry; RASFW FAQ;
THE KING'S PEACE, Tor Books, Out now!!!
sample chapters on http://www.tor.com/sampleKingsPeace.html


Loren MacGregor

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Sep 28, 2000, 10:31:13 PM9/28/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
> In article <8FBD96C59...@192.9.201.127>,
> j...@anglemark.pp.se (Johan Anglemark) wrote:
> > som...@primenet.com wrote in <8qvc1c$rkq$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:
> >
> > >Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but
> > >at the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all,
> > >at the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because
> > >they didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul,
> > >loser of two Hugos.
> >
> > You are not kidding? Honestly not kidding? I have unfortunately not read
> > anything by you (yet), but hey, even I knew that.

> It's absolutely true. Well, then I covered up the S.P. on my name badge,


> went back, and the person at the door went ... "Ooooooooooh YOU!" and
> let me in.

I cannot imagine anyone having met you once mistaking you for anyone
else.

Oh, maybe for an action film star from Hong Kong, but otherwise....

-- LJM

Ray Radlein

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Sep 29, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/29/00
to
Loren MacGregor wrote:

>
> som...@primenet.com wrote:
> >
> > It's absolutely true. Well, then I covered up the S.P. on my
> > name badge, went back, and the person at the door went ...
> > "Ooooooooooh YOU!" and let me in.
>
> I cannot imagine anyone having met you once mistaking you for
> anyone else.
>
> Oh, maybe for an action film star from Hong Kong, but otherwise....

He doesn't look a thing like Anita Mui to me.

- Ray R.


--

**********************************************************************
"LOS ANGELES: A city of millions; thousands more are born each day.
Some in maternity wards, some in creche incubators. The Artificial
ones don't have civil rights, but they still need the law. That's
why they turn to me. My name is Friday. I carry a badge."
-- Robert A. Heinlein's "Dragnet"

Ray Radlein - r...@learnlink.emory.edu
homepage coming soon! wooo, wooo.

**********************************************************************

Lyrker

unread,
Sep 29, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/29/00
to

> >Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but
> >at the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all,
> >at the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because
> >they didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul,
> >loser of two Hugos.
>
> You are not kidding? Honestly not kidding? I have unfortunately not read
> anything by you (yet), but hey, even I knew that.
>
> Jeez.
>
> -j

I read 'Mallworld' as my first around... oh, geez. 1991? I think. It's a
great book; I love the whole idea behind it. Anyway, I went looking for
other Sucharitkul novels after finishing that one (mildly hoping there would
be Mallworld sequels) but couldn't find anything Sucharitkul. Saw some S.P.
Somtow and thought the name coincidence was interesting but kept going.
Silly me. :)

I recently saw on Amazon.com that they have The Ultimate Mallworld. With a
review of 5 stars no less! Must... have...

John Kensmark

unread,
Sep 29, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/29/00
to
Lyrker wrote:

> I read 'Mallworld' as my first around... oh, geez. 1991? I think.
> It's a great book; I love the whole idea behind it. Anyway, I
> went looking for other Sucharitkul novels after finishing that
> one (mildly hoping there would be Mallworld sequels) but couldn't
> find anything Sucharitkul. Saw some S.P. Somtow and thought the
> name coincidence was interesting but kept going. Silly me. :)

I happen to have, sitting on a shelf at my computer desk, the July
and September 1980 IASFM issues, both of which have Somtow's name on
the cover. One for "Dear Caressa" and the other for "Sing a Song of
Mallworld". How about that. Both edited by George Scithers.

My father had a complete collection of IASFM from the late 70's to
the late 80's, maybe the early 90's, but my brother stole a bunch of
issues, and some of them wound up in my room. It's interesting to
look and see who was being published there ten to twenty years ago.

> I recently saw on Amazon.com that they have The Ultimate
> Mallworld. With a review of 5 stars no less! Must... have...

Hmm. That would make a find birthday present for my brother.
Thanks for the tip.

--
John Kensmark kensmark#hotmail.com

NB: I will be away from home for roughly the first three weeks
of October. During this time, it's likely I won't be able to
read news, although I will almost certainly be able to read and
respond to email.

som...@primenet.com

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
PLEASE, PLEASE do buy the book!!!! You see, I have told Stephe Pagel,
the owner of Meisha Merlin Press, that I want to write a MALLWORLD novel,
i.e. a full-length Mallworld extravaganza, and I think he's waiting to
see how this reissue does before committing himself....

Somtow

And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat

> > -j

>
> I recently saw on Amazon.com that they have The Ultimate Mallworld. With a
> review of 5 stars no less! Must... have...
>
>

Ray Radlein

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
> And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
> rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
> Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat

Aha! Ready to slip over the border into Canada [1]! You can't fool us!

[1] Or at least Oregon.

Avedon Carol

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
On Thu, 28 Sep 2000 12:02:55 GMT, som...@primenet.com wrote:

>Let me just say this about that:
>

>Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but at
>the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all, at
>the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because they
>didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul, loser of
>two Hugos.

!!! (Does this mean George isn't running them anymore?)

>Papinian was a Roman, but actually a lawgiver of some kind. He lived in
>the reign of Caracalla, who built the baths, and was executed by him.

You can't weasel out of it that easily, you are still my Siamese twin.


Kip Williams

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
> PLEASE, PLEASE do buy the book!!!! You see, I have told Stephe Pagel,
> the owner of Meisha Merlin Press, that I want to write a MALLWORLD novel,
> i.e. a full-length Mallworld extravaganza, and I think he's waiting to
> see how this reissue does before committing himself....
>
> Somtow
>
> And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
> rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
> Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat

I'm on the wrong coast, but if you ever come back to the Newport
News area, let me know. (I met you at the late Mega-City Comics in
the Norfolk-Virginia Beach area, where we had a lovely evening
giving the MST treatment -- which we hadn't yet heard of -- to _THE
LAUGHING DEAD_. I had a great time.)

--
--Kip (Williams)
amusing the world at http://members.home.net/kipw/

Loren MacGregor

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
Ray Radlein wrote:

>
> som...@primenet.com wrote:
> >
> > And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
> > rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
> > Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat
>
> Aha! Ready to slip over the border into Canada [1]! You can't fool us!
>
> [1] Or at least Oregon.

If he slips over the border into Oregon, we can hide him out until
Orycon.

-- LJM

Mitch Wagner

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote in <8r425t$b03$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:

>PLEASE, PLEASE do buy the book!!!! You see, I have told Stephe Pagel,
>the owner of Meisha Merlin Press, that I want to write a MALLWORLD
>novel, i.e. a full-length Mallworld extravaganza, and I think he's
>waiting to see how this reissue does before committing himself....

Hey, I'm Doing My Part - I just bought the Mallworld book on Amazon.com.

This is an odd purchase for me. I read some of the stories when they came
out and found them disappointing. I think, perhaps, that the problem lay in
me rather than the stories themselves, that I was, in a strange way, too
young to appreciate them. I was a college kid and took things too
seriously.

I really did enjoy two of your stories that were actually set in Thailand;
I'd like to see more of those. And I thought the alternate Rome stuff was
neat.

BTW, my brother-in-law lived in Bangkok for 20 years or so, and married a
Thai woman there and they both came back to live where my wife's family is,
in Columbus, Ohio, about 10 years ago. My b-i-l is an sf reader, I
mentioned you to him and they sounded very interested.
--
Mitch Wagner

Lydia Nickerson

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 3:00:00 AM9/30/00
to
In article <8r37oe$g...@news.or.intel.com>, "Lyrker"
<lil...@whoever.com> wrote:


>
> I read 'Mallworld' as my first around... oh, geez. 1991? I think. It's a
> great book; I love the whole idea behind it. Anyway, I went looking for
> other Sucharitkul novels after finishing that one (mildly hoping there
> would
> be Mallworld sequels) but couldn't find anything Sucharitkul. Saw some
> S.P.
> Somtow and thought the name coincidence was interesting but kept going.
> Silly me. :)
>

> I recently saw on Amazon.com that they have The Ultimate Mallworld. With
> a
> review of 5 stars no less! Must... have...
>
>

I happened to be subscribing to IAsfm back when they were publishing
some of the Mallworld stories. About every issue, there was a response
in the letters column explaining how to pronounce "Sucharitchul," and
they began including the explanation as part of the lead in blurb to all
of his stories.

I was really annoyed when you changed your publishing name, Somtow.
Here I'd spent the better part of my adolescence learning an Anglicized
pronunciation of your name, said knowledge being rare and flauntable,
and then you went and made your name easy to pronounce. I cannot
describe my disappointment.

--
Lydia Nickerson
Dulciculi Aliquorum

mike weber

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 8:53:34 PM9/30/00
to
On Sat, 30 Sep 2000 06:45:17 GMT, som...@primenet.com typed

>PLEASE, PLEASE do buy the book!!!! You see, I have told Stephe Pagel,
>the owner of Meisha Merlin Press, that I want to write a MALLWORLD novel,
>i.e. a full-length Mallworld extravaganza, and I think he's waiting to
>see how this reissue does before committing himself....
>

Isn't Meisha Merlin great?
--
"A cat who sits on a hot stove will never sit on a hot stove
again. She will also never sit on a cold one." Mark Twain
<mike weber> <kras...@mindspring.com>
Ambitious Incomplete web site: http://weberworld.virtualave.net

Mary Kay Kare

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 9:28:12 PM9/30/00
to
In article <39D59D59...@learnlink.emory.edu>,
rayra...@earthlink.net wrote:

> som...@primenet.com wrote:
> >
> > And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
> > rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
> > Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat
>
> Aha! Ready to slip over the border into Canada [1]! You can't fool us!
>
>
>
> [1] Or at least Oregon.
>

Umm. Even the Oregon border is a good 5-6 hour drive. (And parts of it
rise to Very Good)

MKK

--
Stamp out tin toys!

Mary Kay Kare

unread,
Sep 30, 2000, 10:28:50 PM9/30/00
to
In article <39d68afb...@news.mindspring.com>,
kras...@mindspring.com wrote:

> On Sat, 30 Sep 2000 06:45:17 GMT, som...@primenet.com typed
>
> >PLEASE, PLEASE do buy the book!!!! You see, I have told Stephe Pagel,
> >the owner of Meisha Merlin Press, that I want to write a MALLWORLD novel,
> >i.e. a full-length Mallworld extravaganza, and I think he's waiting to
> >see how this reissue does before committing himself....
> >
> Isn't Meisha Merlin great?

I just wish to god they'd get a proofreader. I have become reluctant to
buy anything from them because the ones I've read so far have so many and
such egregious typos I get annoyed.

mike weber

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 1:02:58 AM10/1/00
to
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 02:28:50 GMT, ka...@sirius.com (Mary Kay Kare)
typed

*Blink*

So far i have only three Meisha Merlin books -- the Miller/Lee
"Liaden" books ("Partners in Necessity" and "Plan B") and the
collected edition of Lee Killough's "Brill & Maxwell" future police
procedurals ("To Bridle Chaos", i *think* is the volume title), and i
don't recall particularly noticing any typos...

Which volumes did you find so off-putting?

som...@primenet.com

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 1:05:41 AM10/1/00
to

When is Orycon? I should appear there just to prove I'm not the next Wen
Ho Lee.

Somtow


In article <39D5FCC1...@home.com>,
Loren MacGregor <churn...@home.com> wrote:


> Ray Radlein wrote:
> >
> > som...@primenet.com wrote:
> > >
> > > And by the way, I am back in the States, so presumably, contrary to
> > > rumor, no longer on the lam ... I will be in Other Change of Hobbit
> > > Sunday ... if anyone's in the Bay Area, love to chat
> >
> > Aha! Ready to slip over the border into Canada [1]! You can't fool us!
> >
> > [1] Or at least Oregon.
>

> If he slips over the border into Oregon, we can hide him out until
> Orycon.
>
> -- LJM
>

Paul W. Cashman

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 02:28:50 GMT, ka...@sirius.com (Mary Kay Kare)
wrote:

Hmm, I'm local; maybe I should give Stephe a ring.... I've done some
proofing before. Even some occasional editing, in egregious, "this
story is twice as long as the anthology can accomodate" situations.


OTOH, I'm kinda hoping Stephe can help Storm Constantine slip across
the Pond next summer for Worldcon and Dragoncon, so I'd feel guilty
about getting any money from him. :)

Loren MacGregor

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
> When is Orycon? I should appear there just to prove I'm not the next Wen
> Ho Lee.

November 17-19, 2000, at the Doubletree Inn. Which reminds me that
I should fill out the participant's questionnaire, buried somewhere
in my email.

Do come up; after 22 years, Orycon is still one of the most pleasant
regionals around.

-- LJM

Kip Williams

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
> When is Orycon? I should appear there just to prove I'm not the next Wen
> Ho Lee.

I'm sorry, do you mean the 'Guilty Bastard Fry 'im Now,' or the
'Poor Railroaded Martyr to the Failed Clinton Administration?' (Or
perhaps yet another WHL that the Gee Oh Pee hasn't told us about
yet.)

Mary Kay Kare

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
In article <39d6c4ef...@news.mindspring.com>,
kras...@mindspring.com wrote:

> On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 02:28:50 GMT, ka...@sirius.com (Mary Kay Kare)
> typed
>
> >In article <39d68afb...@news.mindspring.com>,
> >kras...@mindspring.com wrote:
> >
> >> Isn't Meisha Merlin great?
> >
> >I just wish to god they'd get a proofreader. I have become reluctant to
> >buy anything from them because the ones I've read so far have so many and
> >such egregious typos I get annoyed.
> >
> *Blink*
>
> So far i have only three Meisha Merlin books -- the Miller/Lee
> "Liaden" books ("Partners in Necessity" and "Plan B") and the
> collected edition of Lee Killough's "Brill & Maxwell" future police
> procedurals ("To Bridle Chaos", i *think* is the volume title), and i
> don't recall particularly noticing any typos...
>
> Which volumes did you find so off-putting?

The Tanya Huff collection; the sf mystery whose author I keep forgetting,
and Selina Rosen's book. I don't have the ones you describe. I have all
Lee's books in their original incarnation and the Liaden books haven't
caught my interest yet.

mike weber

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 16:15:56 GMT, ka...@sirius.com (Mary Kay Kare)
typed

>In article <39d6c4ef...@news.mindspring.com>,
>kras...@mindspring.com wrote:
>

>> So far i have only three Meisha Merlin books -- the Miller/Lee
>> "Liaden" books ("Partners in Necessity" and "Plan B") and the
>> collected edition of Lee Killough's "Brill & Maxwell" future police
>> procedurals ("To Bridle Chaos", i *think* is the volume title), and i
>> don't recall particularly noticing any typos...
>>
>> Which volumes did you find so off-putting?
>

>The Tanya Huff collection; the sf mystery whose author I keep forgetting,
>and Selina Rosen's book. I don't have the ones you describe. I have all
>Lee's books in their original incarnation and the Liaden books haven't
>caught my interest yet.

Oh, you *must* get "Partners in Necessity" if only to read what i
*still* think is about the best Heyer/Space Opera combo i've ever read
-- "A Conflict of Honors".

After Captain Shan yos Galen discovers what quiet means of
arm-twisting his man of business is using in a particularly fraught
situation, he collapses with restrained mirth and chokes out something
like "=Our honor is stained forever, Ken Rik -- we have brought a
professional to an amateur's game.="
--
=============================================================
"They put manure in his well and they made him talk to lawyers!"
-- Cat Ballou
mike weber -- kras...@mindspring.com


P Nielsen Hayden

unread,
Oct 1, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/1/00
to
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 15:18:32 GMT,
Loren MacGregor <churn...@home.com> wrote:

>Do come up; after 22 years, Orycon is still one of the most pleasant
>regionals around.


Just to clarify, the ones I've been to have been only three or four
days long.


--
Patrick Nielsen Hayden : p...@panix.com : http://www.panix.com/~pnh

som...@primenet.com

unread,
Oct 2, 2000, 12:11:44 AM10/2/00
to
Well, I think they are pretty great in terms of bringing things back to
people's attention, such as yours truly's book. About typoes, well, I
think allowances should be made for a one-man operation like Stephe's --
it's a wonderful thing that they are doing and should be supported by
all. I only noticed one typo
in their MALLWORLD book so far, and that is that "holo" appeared as
"bob". I did get a
proofreading copy, but I am a pretty bad proofreader of my own work. I
think the "bob" error is the sort of thing that only an OCR scanning type
software thingie could make, and I'm really rather amused by it, as it
proves to me that I'm still a little smarter than a machine....

Somtow

Morris M. Keesan

unread,
Oct 2, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/2/00
to
In article <9qfbtsg8khit74216...@4ax.com>,

Avedon Carol <ave...@cix.co.uk> wrote:
>On Thu, 28 Sep 2000 12:02:55 GMT, som...@primenet.com wrote:
>
>>Let me just say this about that:
>>
>>Okay, so maybe this started as me dispelling a preposterous rumor, but at
>>the very least it's gotten people talking about me again. After all, at
>>the last L.A. Con, I was kicked out of the Hugo Losers party because they
>>didn't realize that S.P. Somtow was *also* Somtow Sucharitkul, loser of
>>two Hugos.
>
>!!! (Does this mean George isn't running them anymore?)

For several years (long enough, now, that it's "the way it's
always been done"), it's been the custom for the Hugo Losers'
Party (sometimes officially "Hugo Nominees' Party", because
calling people losers is Incorrect) to be hosted by the
following year's Worldcon committee.


--
Morris M. Keesan -- kee...@world.std.com
http://world.std.com/~keesan/ -- newest baby pictures added 9/13/2000

David Goldfarb

unread,
Oct 3, 2000, 12:38:41 AM10/3/00
to
In article <970165...@bluejo.demon.co.uk>,

Jo Walton <J...@bluejo.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Let me just say -- :Jasmine Nights:.
>
>It's wonderful. It's sort of like a Thai version of :To Kill a Mockingbird:,
>and it's as good as that as well. It's in the small sub-genre of books
>(with Ryman's :Was:) that turn out to be fantasy on the last page.
>
>It's not in print, here anyway, I've been trying to buy a copy in a
>bookshop for the last couple of years.

As it happens, I attended the book signing Somtow did at Other Change
of Hobbit on Sunday. (I've been reading his fiction since he was
publishing in _Asimov's_ under the name Somtow Sucharitkul.) Most
of the talk was about opera in general and his new opera in particular.
Anyway, I neglected to bring any of his books to sign, so it happens
that I bought a copy of that. And it turned out to be signed already,
but I got him to personalize it anyway.

So to my certain knowledge, Other Change has at least two copies in stock.
And they do international mail order. http://www.dnai.com/~ochobbit.

(It's traditional in these sorts of posts to note any association one
has with the product or store being touted, so I'll mention that I
did used to work there part-time many years ago....I still think it's
a good store run by nice folks and worth supporting. *And* I got my
copy of _The King's Peace_ there before Mary Kay's arrived from Amazon,
which only serves her right.)

--
David Goldfarb <*>|"If I haven't killed you yet, I'll take care of
gold...@ocf.berkeley.edu | it right away."
gold...@csua.berkeley.edu |
aste...@slip.net | -- S. P. Somtow

som...@primenet.com

unread,
Oct 3, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/3/00
to
Yes, there are copies at OTHER CHANGE OF HOBBIT, but alas, it is indeed
out of print. I'm looking for another publisher, but Penguin hasn't
actually released the rights back to me as such ... there was recently a
film sale to this guy Ray Cooper, who used to be head of production at
Handmade Films. Hopefully this means someone wants to reissue the book.

SP

In article <8rbnsh$it7$1...@agate.berkeley.edu>,

Mary Kay Kare

unread,
Oct 3, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/3/00
to
In article <8rbnsh$it7$1...@agate.berkeley.edu>, gold...@OCF.Berkeley.EDU
(David Goldfarb) wrote:


> (It's traditional in these sorts of posts to note any association one
> has with the product or store being touted, so I'll mention that I
> did used to work there part-time many years ago....I still think it's
> a good store run by nice folks and worth supporting. *And* I got my
> copy of _The King's Peace_ there before Mary Kay's arrived from Amazon,
> which only serves her right.)
>

Yeah, well. OCH is a little closer to you than it is to me. It's a 40
minute drive on a good traffic day, and I don't remember the last time I
encountered one of those.

MKK--yes, I am feeling guilty

Mary Kay Kare

unread,
Oct 3, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/3/00
to
In article <8rc0jd$5if$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, som...@primenet.com wrote:

> Yes, there are copies at OTHER CHANGE OF HOBBIT, but alas, it is indeed
> out of print. I'm looking for another publisher, but Penguin hasn't
> actually released the rights back to me as such ... there was recently a
> film sale to this guy Ray Cooper, who used to be head of production at
> Handmade Films. Hopefully this means someone wants to reissue the book.
>
> SP
>

Okay. I just emailed them and asked them to save me a copy to be picked
up later today. I have to go into SF today anyway so I might as well
swing by Berkeley on my way home. Can I quit feeling guilty now?

MKK

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604

unread,
Oct 3, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/3/00
to
ka...@sirius.com (Mary Kay Kare) writes:

> In article <8rbnsh$it7$1...@agate.berkeley.edu>, gold...@OCF.Berkeley.EDU
> (David Goldfarb) wrote:
>
>

> > (It's traditional in these sorts of posts to note any association one
> > has with the product or store being touted, so I'll mention that I
> > did used to work there part-time many years ago....I still think it's
> > a good store run by nice folks and worth supporting. *And* I got my
> > copy of _The King's Peace_ there before Mary Kay's arrived from Amazon,
> > which only serves her right.)
> >

> Yeah, well. OCH is a little closer to you than it is to me. It's a 40
> minute drive on a good traffic day, and I don't remember the last time I
> encountered one of those.
>
> MKK--yes, I am feeling guilty
>

They'll mail you a copy, and then the PO can do the driving.
Or you could take BART, which takes longer than a "good driving day",
but you can read on the train.

73, doug

who does have a minor financial interest in OCOH, and a major
emotional interest.

Loren Joseph MacGregor

unread,
Oct 6, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/6/00
to
In rec.arts.sf.fandom, P Nielsen Hayden <p...@panix.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 15:18:32 GMT,
> Loren MacGregor <churn...@home.com> wrote:

>>Do come up; after 22 years, Orycon is still one of the most pleasant
>>regionals around.


>Just to clarify, the ones I've been to have been only three or four
>days long.

But there is so much packed into those few days that it -seems- like 22
years.

<Mutter mutter grxsptlz mutter>

-- LJM

Vicki Rosenzweig

unread,
Oct 6, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/6/00
to
Quoth Loren Joseph MacGregor <lmac...@efn.org> on 6 Oct 2000 17:13:17
GMT:

But without the need for 22 years' worth of clean laundry
and cat-sitters.
--
Vicki Rosenzweig | v...@redbird.org
r.a.sf.f faq at http://www.redbird.org/rassef-faq.html

som...@primenet.com

unread,
Oct 7, 2000, 1:32:37 AM10/7/00
to
David,

you're an angel for selling my books for me any way you can, and for all
these long years.

Thank you

SPS


In article <8rbnsh$it7$1...@agate.berkeley.edu>,
gold...@OCF.Berkeley.EDU (David Goldfarb) wrote:

Ray Radlein

unread,
Oct 7, 2000, 3:00:00 AM10/7/00
to
Loren Joseph MacGregor wrote:
>
> <Mutter mutter grxsptlz mutter>

Haha! Our trick worked! That's it, Mr. Zltpsxrg, you have to return to
your own dimension now!


- Ray R.


--

**********************************************************************
"LOS ANGELES: A city of millions; thousands more are born each day.
Some in maternity wards, some in creche incubators. The Artificial
ones don't have civil rights, but they still need the law. That's
why they turn to me. My name is Friday. I carry a badge."
-- Robert A. Heinlein's "Dragnet"

Ray Radlein - r...@learnlink.emory.edu
homepage coming soon! wooo, wooo.

**********************************************************************

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