Did Jenny die of AIDS in Forrest GumP?!
Patrick McNally
doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
Did anyone read the book? Is this what really I am supposed to think?
______________________________________
ã Patrick McNally, BOB #2503
lm...@telerama.lm.com
> In Forrest Gump, Forrest's girlfriend eventually dies of a "virus that the
> doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
> since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
I think that was the implication of her illness and death in the movie.
> Did anyone read the book? Is this what really I am supposed to think?
"Supposed?" Well, I think the director/writer of the movie left her death
open to interpretation. Also, they wanted Forrest to get the kid at the
end of the movie.
In the book, Jenny marries someone else, but she does tell Forrest that
the boy was his. She doesn't die in the book.
--
****Laurie Mann * * lm...@telerama.lm.com * * Laurie.Mann (GEnie)****
***I would like to believe in God, but I just believe in Billy Wilder***
*Director of Belle Epoque, 1993 Best Foreign-language Film Oscar winner*
* Geek: GAT d@ -p+ c++@ l- u+ e+ m*@ s+/++ n+l-- h- f+ g+ w+ t+ r x+ *
David Sternshein
>From: pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu (Patrick McNally)
>Subject: Did Jenny die of AIDS in Forrest GumP?!
>Date: 20 Aug 1994 21:48:12 GMT
>In Forrest Gump, Forrest's girlfriend eventually dies of a "virus that the
>doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
>since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
>Did anyone read the book? Is this what really I am supposed to think?
I cannot beleive you just did that. I for one haven't seen Forrest Gump and
wished you wouldn't have blurted out how a major charactor dies. You suck.
Larry Sternshein
gary cooper
Gee. I don't know.
BECAUSE I HAVEN'T SEEN THE FUCKING MOVIE YET!
thanks - now I know how Jenny turns out.
dipshit.
--
gary cooper (not the dead one) coo...@digex.com
EMAIL ME ABOUT THE 1994 AirWarrior CONVENTION
666th Fighter Squadron; #1225 - "Moggy"
Internet Daemons !2!
Josh Caruthers
>
>Gee. I don't know.
>
>
>
>BECAUSE I HAVEN'T SEEN THE FUCKING MOVIE YET!
>
>
>
>thanks - now I know how Jenny turns out.
Only by reading the following posts do you find out if she died or not!
Yeah, I can understand with a signoff of Dipshit.
Chooi Siew H.
Gee, thanks for sharing the fun with me.
Patrick McNally (pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu)
wrote:
> ______________________________________
> ‹ Patrick McNally, BOB #2503
--
Shaun Chooi
Viboon Chaojirapant
Either you are very careless or inconsiderate, how can _anyone_
post something with a subject title that _give away_ the very element of
surprise, not to mention the ending, of the movie? Please, please, be more
careful (and include a <spoiler> warning). Hey, and I did what I preach,
I asked the exact same question in my past post with the title 'Forrest Gump:
Question on Jenny (spoiler)' and I still received lots of replies.
So, be more thoughtful for the people who have not seen the movie
(notice posts about Schinler's List (sp?) and The Piano, even now?) and are
waiting for videos. Thanks for reading.
--
Viboon (chao...@sfu.ca)
Orange Road, a road that is both sweet and sour.
lm...@telerama.lm.com
> Hello People (Especially to the original poster)
> Either you are very careless or inconsiderate, how can _anyone_
> post something with a subject title that _give away_ the very element of
> surprise, not to mention the ending, of the movie? Please, please, be more
> careful (and include a <spoiler> warning). Hey, and I did what I preach,
> I asked the exact same question in my past post with the title 'Forrest Gump:
> Question on Jenny (spoiler)' and I still received lots of replies.
OK, you're right, I should have reminded the original poster of
that rather than simply answering his question.
HOWEVER
o the movie has been out for, what, two months now? What happens
in the movie has been hashed over here and in other places.
o I read people's debates about Jenny before seeing the movie,
and it didn't "ruin the movie" for me. Heck, I even knew
what the "big surprise" was in The Crying Game before
seeing it for myself and found it a GREAT movie.
o Any movie that lives or dies by a gimick isn't
a particularly good movie.
o Rosebud was his sled....<ooops, that was another movie...>
In short, if you're REALLY that worried about reading about "what happens"
in a movie before you see it, you either need to see the movie when it first
comes out or you need to not read this newsgroup. (However, I do agree
the original poster and those of us who responded to him should have put
SPOILER in the message title.)
gary cooper
>Ya'know, the post title, asks the question, DID jenny die in forest gump.
Re-read it, dumbass - it asks if she died of AIDS, not if she died or
not.
gary cooper
> o the movie has been out for, what, two months now? What happens
> in the movie has been hashed over here and in other places.
And it's still pulling in a LOT of people - excuse me for prefering
to see it after the crowd has thinned.
> o I read people's debates about Jenny before seeing the movie,
> and it didn't "ruin the movie" for me. Heck, I even knew
> what the "big surprise" was in The Crying Game before
> seeing it for myself and found it a GREAT movie.
I have read NOTHING regarding the movie, for the simple reason
I didn't want to know what happened - but when an idiot posts
a major plot point in a subject, it's sort of hard to miss.
> o Any movie that lives or dies by a gimick isn't
> a particularly good movie.
It would have been nice if WE who haven't seen it yet could have
decided for ourselves whether or not it was a gimmick.
adam shah
>
>In short, if you're REALLY that worried about reading about "what happens"
>in a movie before you see it, you either need to see the movie when it first
>comes out or you need to not read this newsgroup. (However, I do agree
>the original poster and those of us who responded to him should have put
>SPOILER in the message title.)
threads about movies I think I might want to see before I've seen them. The
only thing that was ever spoiled for me was the Rosebud thing, and that's
just because I was dumb enough to try to read the grand spoiler list.
The original poster was the only person I've ever seen dumb enough to
actually put the spoiler (Jenny's death) in the actual subject so that
there is no way to avoid it. The part about her dying of AIDS is not
the real spoiler, especially since it's unclear. The fact that she dies
at all is the real spoiler, and the subject does not leave that in
question.
I am not sure when exactly people should stop being very cautious about
spoilers, but if a movie is still playing in theaters, it's because there
are people who still haven't seen the movie but still wish to do so. At
least wait 'til it's finished it's theatrical run.
Finally, just because a movie is not ruined because of a spoiler is no
reason for people to become careless about spoilers. Even if you
enjoyed the Crying Game despite knowing the secret, how do you know you
wouldn't have enjoyed it more without knowing it.
--
adam (as...@midway.uchicago.edu)
aka mercutio...back in beautiful(?) new york...
175 Lafayette Ave/Brooklyn, NY 11238/(718) 855-9149
obligatory go yankees, hey what happened to the baseball season???
Josh Caruthers
It can be read either way, asking if she died, or what she died of. What
does it matter, it's not the only thing that happens in the movie. And you
really don't have to call people things like dmbass or dipshit. Lighten up
a little, turn off that rush limbaugh.
David Gregory Platt
Big deal. The movie's almost two months old. Also, if one spoiler ruins a
movie for you, it wasn't a good enough movie to begin with.
BTW:
-Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father
-Norman Bates' "mother" is in fact Norman himself
-The black woman in The Crying Game is a man
-Rosebud is...
Dave
Chairorganism
>> In Forrest Gump, Forrest's girlfriend eventually dies of a "virus that the
>> doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
>> since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
wouldn't the kid have had HIV? They didn't say anything about that, so
I doubt it was AIDS, IMHO.
Daniel Jude Bredy
>Viboon Chaojirapant (chao...@kits.sfu.ca) wrote:
>> Hello People (Especially to the original poster)
>> Either you are very careless or inconsiderate, how can _anyone_
>> post something with a subject title that _give away_ the very element of
>> surprise, not to mention the ending, of the movie? Please, please, be more
>> careful (and include a <spoiler> warning). Hey, and I did what I preach,
>> I asked the exact same question in my past post with the title 'Forrest Gump:
>> Question on Jenny (spoiler)' and I still received lots of replies.
>
>that rather than simply answering his question.
>
>HOWEVER
>
> in the movie has been hashed over here and in other places.
>
Some people, not interested in paying full price for a movie, wait
for it to appear at local dollar theatres, so these people likely
won't see the movie for a while yet, even though they might want
to. It is likely that these people also have avoided all the
threads on this movie. However, a header that gives away some
essential part of the movie sometimes is pretty hard to avoid.
> o I read people's debates about Jenny before seeing the movie,
> and it didn't "ruin the movie" for me. Heck, I even knew
> what the "big surprise" was in The Crying Game before
> seeing it for myself and found it a GREAT movie.
>
Everyone isn't you, now, are they?
> o Any movie that lives or dies by a gimick isn't
> a particularly good movie.
>
I don't think that Deathtrap lives or dies by a gimmick necessarily,
but think of the appropriateness of a header which says something like
"What if ______ killed _____ instead of the other way around?"
> o Rosebud was his sled....<ooops, that was another movie...>
>
>In short, if you're REALLY that worried about reading about "what happens"
>in a movie before you see it, you either need to see the movie when it first
>comes out or you need to not read this newsgroup.
What if we're interested in reading about other movies?
(However, I do agree
>the original poster and those of us who responded to him should have put
>SPOILER in the message title.)
>
This statement seems to render the rest of post moot.
>--
>****Laurie Mann * * lm...@telerama.lm.com * * Laurie.Mann (GEnie)****
>***I would like to believe in God, but I just believe in Billy Wilder***
>*Director of Belle Epoque, 1993 Best Foreign-language Film Oscar winner*
>* Geek: GAT d@ -p+ c++@ l- u+ e+ m*@ s+/++ n+l-- h- f+ g+ w+ t+ r x+ *
Dan
--
Daniel Jude Bredy
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt3655a
Internet: gt3...@prism.gatech.edu
Pudman
Quite often, the kid will not be infected. I think it was intended to be AIDS
and I think that's why they showed the shooting-up scene, which otherwise
seemed out of place to me.
____________________________________________________________
"Hey kids, don't die now/Someday we'll be dignified and old"
-The Modern Lovers
-montalvo m.a.
>>Patrick McNally (pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu) wrote:
>>> In Forrest Gump, Forrest's girlfriend eventually dies of a "virus that the
>>> doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
>>> since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
>
>wouldn't the kid have had HIV? They didn't say anything about that, so
>I doubt it was AIDS, IMHO.
>
Evidently HIV doesn't pass that often from mother to child, and when
it does, it's most often from blood exchange at birth, or through
nursing. Some kids born to HIV-positive mothers have HIV antibodies,
and so test positive, but aren't actually infected.
Of course, this is all picked up from magazines (but nothing as
official as JAMA; I'm talkin' Reader's Digest, etc.), so I could be wrong.
Maria
gt3...@prism.gatech.edu
>In <davids.17...@interaccess.com> dav...@interaccess.com (David Sternshein) writes:
>
Irrelevant, it's still playing in theatres, and a number of people
might prefer not to pay full price for a movie, and instead wait
for the movie to show up at a less expensive venue like a dollar theatre
(i.e. college students).
Also, if one spoiler ruins a
>movie for you, it wasn't a good enough movie to begin with.
Not necessarily ruin the movie, but it definitely affects the viewing
experience.
>BTW:
>-Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father
>-Norman Bates' "mother" is in fact Norman himself
>-The black woman in The Crying Game is a man
>-Rosebud is...
>Dave
Soylent Green is people! -- oops, sorry, got carried away...
Jeff Wilson
(Patrick McNally) writes: A HUGE Spoiler :-(
She died of incredulity, that someone would reveal a major plot point of a
movie that's only been out a few weeks .... ASSWIPE .
--
jwi...@ncratl.atlantaga.ncr.com (Jeff Wilson)
"Mmmmmm, forbidden doughnut." - Homer
Andy Spooner
>it does, it's most often from blood exchange at birth, or through
>nursing. Some kids born to HIV-positive mothers have HIV antibodies,
>and so test positive, but aren't actually infected.
The risk of maternal-fetal transmission is about 1/6. While it is
doubtful that HIV can be passed very easily through nursing,
HIV-positive mothers are usually counseled not to breastfeed.
gary cooper
You really need to pull you head out of whatever orifice it happens to
be filling at the moment and realize this is an INTERNATIONAL forum,
and that movie release dates around the world for a movie vary.
sometimes MORE than two months.
David Gregory Platt
> Also, if one spoiler ruins a
>>movie for you, it wasn't a good enough movie to begin with.
>Not necessarily ruin the movie, but it definitely affects the viewing
>experience.
I guess I thought it was such a crappy movie that it didn't make much
difference to me. I'm still wary of movies with "big secrets." Some movies
still hold up, but some (The Crying Game...) don't.
>>BTW:
>>-Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father
>>-Norman Bates' "mother" is in fact Norman himself
>>-The black woman in The Crying Game is a man
>>-Rosebud is...
>>Dave
>Soylent Green is people! -- oops, sorry, got carried away...
The Planet Of The Apes is really EARTH!!!
Dave
Dan O'Day
1. She could have developed AIDS symptoms after delivering the baby, and the
baby could have avoided AIDS.
2. Regardless of the timing...YES: She did die of AIDS. That was the reason
for the not-so-subtle hint "some kind of a virus." Running through the entire
movie were major traumatic human events on a large scale - violent protests
of integration, Vietnam, Watergate.
Argue about anything else: Tom Hanks' haircut or accent or how many
different ways they came up with to prepare shrimp. But not about what
diseases inflicted Jenny.
Robert Anisko
I don't know much about AIDS (other than what the news/newspaper
relays) but perhaps it, unlike say Chicken Pox, does not just
all of the sudden attack the victim as soon as it's been
entered into the system? It's a virus, and virii sometimes
have the tendency to lie dormant until some time that it
then wreaks its havoc.
Or there's always the possibility that the kid could be
a carrier? I'd suspect there are more folx HIV positive out there
than have full blown Aids. Who knows, I'm not a doctor,
nor do I play one on TV :-)
--
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<| "Some say the glass is half full,
Robert J. Anisko --- R.ANISKO (GEnie) | some say it is half empty,
ani...@usdtsg.daytonoh.ncr.com (internet) | but I say you have a glass
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<| twice as big as it should be..."
Patricia Daukantas
spoiler about "Forrest Gump" right in the subject line, the post has gone
out with that SAME spoiler out on the subject line, thus INCREASING the
chances that someone who hasn't seen the movie yet is going to notice the
posts and then feel as if the moviegoing experience was ruined.
So, if we're going to keep on training "dumbass" and "dipshit" remarks, at
LEAST let's change the subject line so we don't keep doing the same thing
that made people ripsnorting angry in the first place!!
P.S. Don't bother flaming me... over the next 48 hours I have to take
my department's Ph.D. qualifying exam and no one has passed it in the
last 24 months... that's STRESS ENOUGH.
Gabrielle Hodson
>In <davids.17...@interaccess.com> dav...@interaccess.com (David Sternshein) writes:
>>In article <pmcnally-200...@elvex91.acns.nwu.edu> pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu (Patrick McNally) writes:
>>>From: pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu (Patrick McNally)
>>>Subject: Did Jenny die of AIDS in Forrest GumP?!
>>>Date: 20 Aug 1994 21:48:12 GMT
>> I cannot beleive you just did that. I for one haven't seen Forrest Gump and
>>wished you wouldn't have blurted out how a major charactor dies. You suck.
>Big deal. The movie's almost two months old. Also, if one spoiler ruins a
>movie for you, it wasn't a good enough movie to begin with.
>BTW:
>-Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father
>-Norman Bates' "mother" is in fact Norman himself
>-The black woman in The Crying Game is a man
>-Rosebud is...
Dont be such an arsehole! Just because someone is waiting for the video
to come out or because they live in a part of the world where the movie
is yet to be released doesnt mean they should have the plot thrust in their
faces. I mean when the spoiler is actually in the subject line you dont
have much chance.
--
Gabrielle g...@muffin.apana.org.au
*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Robt_Martin
: --
: Gabrielle g...@muffin.apana.org.au
: *_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Doesn't the anti-spoiler contingent realize that, by continuing to post
to this (stupid and irrelevant to films) thread, they are perpetuating
the spoiler in the header?
Let it die, people!
--
"Men Wanted for Dangerous Expedition: Low Wages for Long Hours of Arduous
Labour under Brutal Conditions; Months of Continual Darkness and Extreme
Cold; Great Risk to Life and Limb from Disease, Accidents and Other Hazards;
Small Chance of Fame in Case of Success." - Sir Ernest Shackleton, explorer
Jennifer Cohn
g...@muffin.apana.org.au (Gabrielle Hodson) wrote:
--
Do any of you ever watch TV? Talk about spoilers!! Do you guys write to
the networks and request that they not air commercials/trailers about the
movies you haven't seen yet? I thought not. I think you guys suck, and
you need to get a life and see the movies before they hit the 'dollar'
shows so that we don't have to worry about hurting your feelings. Enough
said!
--Jennifer
Janet D. Tilander
wake my daughter at 6:00, get her ready, get to work by 6:30. I work 9 hour
days, so let's see...I get off at 4:00, pick up my daughter, go home,
fix dinner (or stop at the store first to pick up things), my husband comes
home at 6:00. We eat, have time together, and my daughter's bath/bedtime
is about 8:30.
This is just an example of an ordinary day...not counting things such as
doctor/dental appointments, dance classes, and the list goes on and on.
My point is that I most certainly DO have a life. Too much life to often
be able to see movies. Current movies I have seen: The Lion King. Current
movies I would like to see: True Lies, Clear and Present Danger, Forrest
Gump, and again, the list goes on and on.
It's not that I don't want to go..I do! I don't often have the time or
energy to. And please don't say that I shouldn't read this group...I enjoy
the reviews and discussions.
Maybe you have more time than other people...I don't think I'm unusual at
all. But not everyone can see movies within the first two weeks, or even
two months they are out.
Just my $.02.
janet
--
Janet Tilander
Chevron Overseas Petroleum
San Ramon, CA
Hei Mak
the other hand, there is always a possibility that Forrest would be
infected as well. Guess we'll just have to wait for the sequel...
Angela Querey
wholeheartedly, but I think you mean "afflicted" not "inflicted."
Sorry, can't help mysel
wl-san...@society.com
IA>
IA>In article <1701A71B4...@VM.TEMPLE.EDU> Chairorganism writes:
IA>>>Patrick McNally (pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu) wrote:
IA>>>> In Forrest Gump, Forrest's girlfriend eventually dies of a "virus that t
IA>>>> doctors don't know how to fix". I took this to mean that she has AIDS,
IA>>>> since they showed her with a guy that was shooting up.
IA>>
IA>>If Jenny had AIDS since she slept with the druggy before getting pregnant,
IA>>wouldn't the kid have had HIV? They didn't say anything about that, so
IA>>I doubt it was AIDS, IMHO.
I believe it was AIDS that they were referring to... first of all the
year of her death was 1981, right before they had a name for HIV...
secondly, she partook in many activities that put her at risk for
contracting the disease. As far as the child goes... some children born
HIV positive zero-convert before they reach their 18 month. These are
the lucky kids. Zero-convert means that their immune system builds up
against HIV and they become negative. I believe (or like to believe)
that this is what happened to Forrest Jr. :)
Sandi
---
Sent via WorldLink on 08/30/94 at 00:13:34.
From: Info Power Network
Port St. Lucie, FL
Live Chat, Multi-User Games
quadro...@delphi.com
>: >BTW:
>: >-Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father
>: >-Norman Bates' "mother" is in fact Norman himself
>: >-The black woman in The Crying Game is a man
>: >-Rosebud is...
none
It would certainly make sense if it were AIDS from a thematic POV as it
would fit into the movies blending of major historical/cultural events of
the past 30 or 40 years. As well, it being a new virus that doesn't
really have a name yet would make sense for 1981
BTW, whoever titled this string must realise they've revealed a major
plot point in the title:)
kei...@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu
> year of her death was 1981, right before they had a name for HIV...
> secondly, she partook in many activities that put her at risk for
OK so far ...
> contracting the disease. As far as the child goes... some children born
> HIV positive zero-convert before they reach their 18 month. These are
> the lucky kids. Zero-convert means that their immune system builds up
> against HIV and they become negative. I believe (or like to believe)
> that this is what happened to Forrest Jr. :)
Oooohhh!!! Serious problems.
"Sero-conversion" refers to the presence of antibodies to HIV (the
virus) in a person's blood. (The liquid portion of blood with all its
proteins but without blood cells or corpuscles is "serum" - serum is
tested for antibodies, hence "sero-conversion".) There is no such
thing as "zero-conversion". A person who is infected with HIV will
begin to respond to the virus by producing antibodies to attack it.
These antibodies can be detected in the bloodstream (it is easier to
detecte the antibodies than the virus itself, and thus this test is
used to determine whether they have been infected.) It takes a while
(up to 6 months) for a person who has been infected to actually
produce detectable amounts of antibodies; when they do so they are
said to have "sero-converted" - gone from a state of having no
detectable antibodies to a state of having detectable antibodies to
HIV. Thus, a person who has seroconverted is presumed to be infected
with HIV (and are called "HIV-positive"), and one who has no detectable
antibodies either has not been infected or has been infected less than
6 months ago and has not seroconverted (and are said to be
"HIV-negative"). Sero-converting is bad, since it indicates you are
infected.
It is true that some infants are born HIV-positive and then revert to
an HIV-negative state. The reason is that the test, remember, tests
only for antibodies to the virus, and not the virus itself. Infants
born to an infected mother can pick up her antibodies from her blood,
(through the placenta) and be born with her antibodies in their blood
stream, even though they may not have gotten the virus itself. If
this happens, their blood will show the presence of the (mother's)
antibodies on the test, and they will be HIV-positive at birth; their
own body is not making antibodies, however, since there is not really
any virus present, and so the mother's antibodies will gradually fade
out and not be replaced, leaving the infant HIV-negative some months
later. But this process is not called sero-converting, or
zero-converting, or anything like that.
Not all infants born to a mother infected with HIV will get HIV
themselves. The virus is not automatically passed across the placenta
(though the *antibodies* to the virus, produced by the mother's body,
which are much smaller than the virus itself, are passed across).
Infants commonly get infected during birth, when small tears in the
placenta allow blood from mother and infant to be mixed directly; this
does not always happen, however. So a child born to an HIV-positive
mother need not get HIV-infected themselves. *This* is what we are
led to believe happened to the kid in FG - it just didn't get infected
(though in fact we don't know this from the film).
Finally, it is worth making the standard point that HIV infection or
HIV-positivity is not the same as having AIDS - AIDS is a set of
diseases or symptoms which arise as the result of HIV infection, but
it can be years after one is actually infected that the symptoms start
to show.
Sorry to go on about this in the movie forum, but I think the
information is worth having.
Kevin T. Keith
kei...@guvax.georgetown.edu
none
: > ["Jenny" in Forrest Gump_: her disease]
: > year of her death was 1981, right before they had a name for HIV...
: > secondly, she partook in many activities that put her at risk for
: OK so far ...
: > contracting the disease. As far as the child goes... some children born
: > HIV positive zero-convert before they reach their 18 month. These are
: > the lucky kids. Zero-convert means that their immune system builds up
: > against HIV and they become negative. I believe (or like to believe)
: > that this is what happened to Forrest Jr. :)
It's also quite possible she contracted AIDS after Forrest Jr.'s birth.
gigl...@shrsys.hslc.org
It is not necessarily assumed that jenny died of an AIDS related disease. Since
Jenny was a drug user and very sexually active, she could have gotten a
number of sexually transmitted diseases or even a form of cancer. Why does
everyone want to put this movie into todays context? People have been dying
of other diseases you know...
Frank
Phil Kim
[stuff deleted]
|> It's also quite possible she contracted AIDS after Forrest Jr.'s birth.
I feel stupid to ask this, but if Jenny died of AIDS, is it possible for her
skin to appear clean?
--
Phil Kim (ki...@rpi.edu)
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
http://www.rpi.edu/~kimp/laser.html for laserdisc HTML pages
Yet Another Steve
> I feel stupid to ask this, but if Jenny died of AIDS, is it possible for her
> skin to appear clean?
Of course. Some people with AIDS have Kaposi's Sarcoma, which produces
skin lesions, but the rest have skin as "clean" as anyone's.
Alexander E. Christensen
: That's what I thought too. Has anyone read the book? Is the virus named?
In the book, Jenny does not die at all. She marries another man who is
helping her raise Forrest, Jr. Yes, she did die of AIDS in the movie,
however. I liked the movie better than the book, or to qualify that
statement, the book and the movie make completely different points.
Reginald Martin u
:
: Uh, no. It is never stated just what virus she has, and seems to have been
: purposely left open. There's a great many things out there that will kill you
: just as surely as AIDS but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
: loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally. What she died of doesn't
: matter.
Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
blah... I think that the implications were pretty clear that it was
AIDS, and like somebody else said it fits in with the rest of the
flick since AIDS was such a major event.
Reg Martin
Tisha King
was AIDS, why wouldn't Forrest have gotten it? It just seems to me that Jenny
straightened out once she left Forrest and got pregnant. Logistically, I
really don't think it could have been AIDS. --Tisha
Patman
You don't always contract HIV in a sexual encounter. Also remember that
Forrest Gump seemed to be a very lucky person.
--
Patman - All opinions are mine, not Ma Tech's.
"I checked over the ComicFest Debate rules, and I can't find anywhere
that it says, 'Loser gets to debate John Byrne." -- John Byrne's
response when asked by Dragon Con to consider debating McFarlane this year.
David Mears
> aech...@liberty.uc.wlu.edu (Alexander E. Christensen) writes:
> > In the book, Jenny does not die at all. She marries another man who is
> > helping her raise Forrest, Jr. Yes, she did die of AIDS in the movie,
> . . . but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
> loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally.
Too bad she didn't love him. I got the very distinct impression that
the only reason Jenny came back to Forrest at all was because she knew
she was dying and she wanted to get Forrest to take over responsibility
for raising her child.
David B. Mears
Hewlett-Packard
Cupertino CA
me...@cup.hp.com
an6...@anon.penet.fi
-> From: tis...@merle.acns.nwu.edu (Tisha King)
-> Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies
-> Date: 22 Sep 94 19:53:10 GMT
-> Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, IL USA
-> Lines: 5
-> Distribution: usa
-> References: <1994Sep21...@eagle.wesleyan.edu> <CwJDE...@info.uucp>
-> NNTP-Posting-Host: unseen3.acns.nwu.edu
->
-> Oh. I got the impression that it was some sort of cancer or something. If it
-> was AIDS, why wouldn't Forrest have gotten it? It just seems to me that Jenny
-> straightened out once she left Forrest and got pregnant. Logistically, I
-> really don't think it could have been AIDS. --Tisha
->
She said it was some kind of virus that no one really knew much
about, so I don't think it could be cancer. Sexual AIDS transmission
from female to male is rare. The statistics that were released a
couple of months ago show almost all the cases were gay men, IV drug
users, and women who have sex with an infected man. I don't remember
the chance of the baby getting it, but it was much lower than I
thought. Maybe 25%.
-Jason
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in itself.... PLEASE be more careful!
--
Eugene Shapiro
e-mail: esha...@ocf.berkeley.edu
"In woman sex corrects banality, in men it aggravates it." - de Assis
James Dirmeyer
the police about the break-in.
Tisha King
>day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>> . . . but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
>> loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally.
>Too bad she didn't love him. I got the very distinct impression that
>the only reason Jenny came back to Forrest at all was because she knew
>she was dying and she wanted to get Forrest to take over responsibility
>for raising her child.
No, she loved him. It's not clear what type of love it was. I don't think
she figured out, herself, wether it was romantic love or the love of a true
and close friendship. Remember, he was there all through her life to help
cheer her through hard times when noone else would have anything to do with
her that didn't involve using her for her body. But that love is all that is
really needed.
Okay, so I'm a hopeless romantic. But it's true, anyway.
--Tisha
Tisha King
>>Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
>>virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
>
>
>>deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
>>blah... I think that the implications were pretty clear that it was
>>AIDS, and like somebody else said it fits in with the rest of the
>>flick since AIDS was such a major event.
>
>The movie never even hinted that Forest was Deep Throat, only that he alerted
>the police about the break-in.
Thanks. I'm glad someone else agrees with me. I think the point of the
Watergate hotel thing was just placing Gump into the event somehow, like they
did with the shots of him at the university protests.
--Tisha
Alexander E. Christensen
: > In the book, Jenny does not die at all. She marries another man who is
: Uh, no. It is never stated just what virus she has, and seems to have been
: purposely left open. There's a great many things out there that will kill you
: just as surely as AIDS but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
: loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally. What she died of doesn't
: matter.
Uh, yes. Unless Ebola River Virus has broken out in Mississippi, it
definitely _was_ AIDS from everything said and shown in the movie.
Medically, it could not have been anything else. What she died of may
not matter, but it _was_ AIDS.
Alex Christensen
"Wanna buy a monkey?"
Chip Armstrong
: Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
: virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
: deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
: blah...
Deepthroat is supposively someone who was either in the Nixon
administration or someone just on the fringe of it who continued to feed
information to Woodward and Burnstein. All FG did was call security when
he witnessed people with flashlights in a neighboring room. FG was
definately NOT Deepthroat.
Chip
John E. Harrington
>day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>:
>: Uh, no. It is never stated just what virus she has, and seems to have been
>: purposely left open. There's a great many things out there that will kill you
>: just as surely as AIDS but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
>: loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally. What she died of doesn't
>: matter.
>
>Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
>virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
Where in forrest gump is it suggested that "FG was deepthroat"? I must've missed
that part. Certainly he phones in a complaint about the burglars, and, thereby,
calls the attention of the police to them, but this was not deepthroat's role.
So...where?
[by the way: she died of AIDS; it was obvious from her description of the disease].
--
*******************************************************************************
* DISCLAIMER: Unless indicated otherwise, everything in this note is *
* personal opinion, not an official statement of Biosym Technologies, Inc. *
*******************************************************************************
day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Perhaps I missed something in the film. I recall her saying that she had "A
virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
Erik A. Speckman
day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>> Uh, yes. Unless Ebola River Virus has broken out in Mississippi, it
>> definitely _was_ AIDS from everything said and shown in the movie.
>> Medically, it could not have been anything else. What she died of may
>> not matter, but it _was_ AIDS.
>
>Perhaps I missed something in the film. I recall her saying that she had "A
>virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
>organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
I don't think it was ever explicitly stated that she died of AIDS but it
doesn't really matter.
Dispite the rather vague circumstances surronding her death I think the
fact that the movie is quite deliberate about evoking recent US history to
provide a context for the story makes it painfully obvious that it was
supposed to be AIDS.
Anyone who says otherwise is just itching for a fight (and perhaps a
freshman:).
______________________________________________________________________
Erik A. Speckman Seattle, Washington Good Brain Doesn't Suck
espe...@reed.edu espe...@halcyon.com
chris stefanich
> virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
> organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
i just assumed it was aids, given the time frame, which was when a lot of
the first cases of aids were spread, and also the focus on her heroin and
sex lifestyle, and then a mysterious incurable virus the doctors can't
figure out. se did say at one point " the doctors don't even know what
it is", and also given the media. turn on your tv and see if you don't
see an aids awareness commercial. it could have been something else, but
i think they wanted to hint at aids without coming out and saying it.
Chris <ph...@grfn.org>
Lorraine Yeung Cheryl Wong
---I didn't think this was still being discussed...all the same
though it SEEMS like the hint was AIDS, it also could be anything else
ie Hepatitis B which is also a virus.
I also think that if they had shown symptoms to imply that it was aids
it would have stirred up the controversy of "why didn't forrest or forrest
jr. get it or have it too?" (With Philadelphia being Tom's last pic before
this was released is alsoan issue in my mind...)
I just don't think it's fair for people to flame others for thinking
that virus may NOT have been AIDS, especially when there is no PROOF
that it is. However I realize that some people think it was AIDS
O.k. that's your opinion, but that doesn't make you (or me for that matter)
totally right...
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lorraine Wong | "Movies are like a box of condoms, you never know
umwo...@ccu.umanitoba.ca | if they're gonna fit until you try 'em on."
Steve Wall
u) wrote:
>
> Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
> virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
> deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
> blah... I think that the implications were pretty clear that it was
> AIDS, and like somebody else said it fits in with the rest of the
> flick since AIDS was such a major event.
>
No, she died of "Old Movie Disease", as defined by Mad Magazine back
in 1970 or so when "Love Story" came out. It's a classic illness where
the bitchy (if female) protagonist gets an incurable case of goodie-two-
shoeishness, that gets progressively worse until they turn into a pillar
of saccharine at the "tragic" end.
--
Steve Wall
Who
: Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
: virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
: deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
Forrest was not the Deep Throat of Watergate fame.
Barbara J. Nordin
AIDS; they could't come right out and say it because it
_didn't_ fit with the time frame. AIDS was around in gay men
for awhile before anyone from another group was identified as
having it. At least, that's my memory. Anyone read And the
Band Played On? Maybe that would be the definitive answer.
Erik A. Speckman
I rather doubt there wasn't atleast one woman who contracted AIDS early in
the history of the disease.
Given all the coincidences in Forrest Gump it doesn't seem too unlikely
that Jenny could be that woman.
Chooi Siew H.
chris stefanich (ph...@grfn.org) wrote:
> i just assumed it was aids, given the time frame, which was when a lot of
> the first cases of aids were spread, and also the focus on her heroin and
> sex lifestyle, and then a mysterious incurable virus the doctors can't
> figure out. se did say at one point " the doctors don't even know what
> it is", and also given the media. turn on your tv and see if you don't
> see an aids awareness commercial. it could have been something else, but
> i think they wanted to hint at aids without coming out and saying it.
> Chris <ph...@grfn.org>
--
Shaun Chooi
===========
UNT -- Denton Texas
day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu
> Reginald Martin u (mart...@mach1.wlu.ca) wrote:
> : day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>
> : Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
> : virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
> : deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
The above is incorrectly attributed to me. The cause of Jenny's death seems to
have been purposely left open, and is tangental to the story in any case.
>
> Forrest was not the Deep Throat of Watergate fame.
I knew that. Like so many other things in the film, Gump is show as the
catalyst for events and change, not an active participant.
Brad Templeton
AIDS at the time, they certainly weren't aware that it was a virus.
She had no AIDS symptoms.
Of course, they might have *meant* for it to be AIDS and got it wrong.
For example, to make a good joke, Gump got rich by investing in Apple
Computer, and cashing out -- in 1976.
So they didn't really care about anachronism to make a point.
--
Brad Templeton, publisher, ClariNet Communications Corp. | www.clarinet.com
The net's #1 Electronic newspaper (circulation 70,000) | in...@clarinet.com
brian r. mcdonald
i think that the scriptwriter(s) intended that the audience think of AIDS
when jenny mentioned her illness, so in a sense that automatically means
that it was AIDS. on the other hand, the scene itself provides evidence
that, on a purely technical level her disease could not have been AIDS.
the term acquired immune deficiency syndrome, and its acronym, were first
coined in early 1982. while there was a bit of speculation about the
possibility that it was transmitted by a virus as early as the summer of
1981, the idea didn't gain much ground until 1983, when french researchers
first began to isolate a possible candidate virus. thus there was never
a time when AIDS was defined as a virus without a name.
--
part-time longshoreman and full-time dilettente at the game of go
bibliophile, skeptic, oulipian, liberal, romantic
"if you've got 'em by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"
day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu
> In article <1994Sep26...@eagle.wesleyan.edu>,
> day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>
>>> Uh, yes. Unless Ebola River Virus has broken out in Mississippi, it
>>> definitely _was_ AIDS from everything said and shown in the movie.
>>> Medically, it could not have been anything else. What she died of may
>>> not matter, but it _was_ AIDS.
>>
>>Perhaps I missed something in the film. I recall her saying that she had "A
>>virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
>>organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
>
> I don't think it was ever explicitly stated that she died of AIDS but it
> doesn't really matter.
Here we agree. The point isn't what she died of but that Gump loved Jenny
_unconditionally_. My objection to people insisting that it "was too AIDS" is
that they are obscuring an important point in the movie. If the film makers
wanted her to die of AIDS it would have been explicit.
> Dispite the rather vague circumstances surronding her death I think the
> fact that the movie is quite deliberate about evoking recent US history to
> provide a context for the story makes it painfully obvious that it was
> supposed to be AIDS.
The film is also quite deliberate about invoking ~specific~ historical moments.
If we were meant to understand that it was AIDS, then the name would have been
invoked. Others have contended that "medically it could not have been anything
else", but this is an unsupported claim. From the time line and lack of
details in the film it could have as easily been Hepatitis B.
> Anyone who says otherwise is just itching for a fight (and perhaps a
> freshman:).
Ah. An ad hominem arguement. Actually, I'm neither. At 38 years old, with a
license to practice nursing, a BA in film from Wesleyan and a Masters in
progress, I an simply disagreeing with those that I think are mistaken.
TornCot
could have easily gotten the virus from a bisexual man or a needle.
Although the incubation period can last over ten years there are
individuals who become rapidly infected
Dave Krugman
Alexander E. Christensen
: > : Uh, no. It is never stated just what virus she has, and seems to have been
: > : purposely left open. There's a great many things out there that will kill you
: > : just as surely as AIDS but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
: > : loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally. What she died of doesn't
: > : matter.
: >
: > Uh, yes. Unless Ebola River Virus has broken out in Mississippi, it
: > definitely _was_ AIDS from everything said and shown in the movie.
: > Medically, it could not have been anything else. What she died of may
: > not matter, but it _was_ AIDS.
: Perhaps I missed something in the film. I recall her saying that she had "A
: virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
: organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
The only virus that will kill you at the rate it killed Jenny is AIDS.
Flu either would have killed her more quickly or been treatable. Ebola
River Virus dehydrates you in a matter of days and is still confined to
Africa. Viruses associated with other infections either are not deadly
in themselves (and Jenny said she was dying of the virus) or would have
acted much more quickly. Not everyone who gets AIDS gets KS or
pneumonia, and obviously there was some sort of organ failure--she died.
They did not go into great medical detail about Jenny's disease, just as
they did not go into great political detail about the times Forrest met
the presidents. But it was obviously AIDS.
**************************************************************************
* Alex Christensen | "Give me Christ or | "Wanna buy a *
* aech...@liberty.uc.wlu.edu | give me Hiroshima." | monkey?" *
* You can call me Al. | --Leonard Cohen | --Dave Letterman *
**************************************************************************
--
**************************************************************************
* Alex Christensen | "Give me Christ or | "Wanna buy a *
* aech...@liberty.uc.wlu.edu | give me Hiroshima." | monkey?" *
* You can call me Al. | --Leonard Cohen | --Dave Letterman *
Kim Pugh
=>:
=>: Uh, no. It is never stated just what virus she has, and seems to have been
=>: purposely left open. There's a great many things out there that will kill you
=>: just as surely as AIDS but that wasn't the point: The point was that Gump
=>: loved Jenny simply, purely and unconditionally. What she died of doesn't
=>: matter.
=>Uh, yes. She did die of AIDS. True, it is never stated explicitly what
=>virus she has, but it is also never stated explicitly that FG was
=>deepthroat or that FG is the one who gave Elvis his moves, or blah blah
=>blah... I think that the implications were pretty clear that it was
=>AIDS, and like somebody else said it fits in with the rest of the
=>flick since AIDS was such a major event.
=>Reg Martin
--
Robert "Kim" Pugh | DISCLAIMER: Opinions expressed are *strictly*
<k...@telepath.com> | those of the last person I talked to.
Cerebus The Aardvark
>In article <AAACD77E9...@blv-pm0-ip16.halcyon.com>, espe...@halcyon.com (Erik A. Speckman) writes:
>> Dispite the rather vague circumstances surronding her death I think the
>> fact that the movie is quite deliberate about evoking recent US history to
>> provide a context for the story makes it painfully obvious that it was
>> supposed to be AIDS.
>The film is also quite deliberate about invoking ~specific~ historical moments.
>If we were meant to understand that it was AIDS, then the name would have been
>invoked. Others have contended that "medically it could not have been anything
>else", but this is an unsupported claim. From the time line and lack of
>details in the film it could have as easily been Hepatitis B.
At the time Jenny died "AIDS" didn't yet have a name. It was a mystery
killer and no one really knew what it was or how you got it. THAT is why
the movie doesn't hold up a flashing neon sign saying "JENNY DIED OF AIDS."
It is obvious that they meant AIDS and that the only reason they didn't say
it was because it was 1983. How soon people forget. If thye had said
AIDS people would be complaining about the historic inaccuracy.
Use your brain, take a hint. Not everything has to be spoon-fed you know,
you can make leaps of judgemnt all by yourself with no one holding your
hand. Or not.
--
| kr...@netcom.com \ 1015 South Gaylord, Denver, CO 80209 #100 |
| PGP Fingerprint \ 1D 5E F7 C8 7E C2 F9 87 0F 86 C9 B0 D2 63 9C B2 |
| [303/722-2009] Vox \ Hey, I've got a reputation to keep down here! |
| [303/777-2911] Data \ Shhhh! I've been knocked subconscious. |
Christopher D. Proulx
knowledgeable than I will hopefully correct me, but I recall from the book _And the
Band Played On_ that the HIV was not isolated until 1984 or 85, and a test
was not developed that discovered antigens to the virus for another 6 months or
so. I thought Jenny told Forest she was sick in 1982, and she died in 1983.
However, a doctor could not have examined a healthy looking person in 1982 and
told them they were dying of a virus which, "doctors can do nothing about." A
diagnosis of AIDS (GRIDS in 1982) could only have been made once opportunistic
infections had advanced to a serious state, and then it would have been based on
the fact that many people were affected with the same set of otherwise rare
illnesses.
Christopher
Duane Takamine
Pat Bowman <pbo...@aimla.com> wrote:
>I have come to the conclusion that the _intention_ of the filmaker(s) was
>that Jenny died of AIDS, but that they were too subtle and/or didn't do
>enough research on AIDS in the early '80s to keep it from being
>ambiguous.
[snip]
>From a narrative point of view, it makes sense that Jenny has AIDS: Forrest
>is involved in a lot of what has happened in the U.S. for the last 30 years,
>and so it's reasonable that he be involved in the AIDS epidemic. It makes
I agree. The flow of the movie, which is to take all of the
interesting, powerful, or important events in American history and
show them from a simple point of view would seem to settle the question
that the *intent* was that Jenny had AIDS.
>HOWEVER, AIDS does not make sense from a historical or medical point of view.
>In 1980/81, no one knew that AIDS was caused by a virus; AIDS was just
>Acquired Immune Defeciency Syndrome, and all that was known (as I recall)
>was that some people's immune systems stopped working, for some reason.
>Jenny's symptoms should have been "My immune system is decaying," or "I've
>been getting all these strange diseases," rather than "I have this virus..."
In 1981, no one was sure, but people suspected that AIDS was
caused by a virus. In fact any communicable disease with no found
pathogen should be at least whispering "virus." Remember too that
Jenny was explaining this to Forrest. She would not have said
"my immune system is decaying" because she knew he wouldn't understand.
She would not have said "I'm getting all these strange diseases"
because that would just alarm Forrest. I'm sure that the doctors
told Jenny something like "we don't know what it is, maybe a virus
or something, but we just don't know" and essentially that is what
got out from Jenny to Forrest.
>It is likely (though not certain) that Forrest Jr and possibly Forrest Sr
>should have contracted the virus from Jenny, as well. And finally,
>AIDS just wasn't that common outside of Haitians and
>gay men until the mid-80's. (Doesn't mean it was impossible, but it puts
>the believability factor close to "rare tropical virus" again.)
If my memory serves, Jenny did say that the doctors didn't
know what kind of virus it was, and she seemed to imply they weren't
sure what it was that was killing her at all, but it would take a
significant amount of time. To me, this rules out the rare
tropical virus theory. It isn't proof, but it screams AIDS to me.
Duane
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Duane Takamine du...@shell.portal.com
Island CD Creations [a divison of Madd Hacker Productions]
"We work for pizza and beer."
Pat Bowman
Alexander E. Christensen <aech...@liberty.uc.wlu.edu> wrote:
>day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu wrote:
>: > Medically, it could not have been anything else. What she died of may
>: > not matter, but it _was_ AIDS.
>
>: Perhaps I missed something in the film. I recall her saying that she had "A
>: virus", and nothing more. No symptoms were ever shown, no KS, no pneumonia, no
>: organ failures. Please show me what your conclusion is based upon.
>
>The only virus that will kill you at the rate it killed Jenny is AIDS.
This statement is a little too universal for me -- I think that there are
probably
plenty of viruses that might cause a pretty slow death...Nonetheless,
I have come to the conclusion that the _intention_ of the filmaker(s) was
that Jenny died of AIDS, but that they were too subtle and/or didn't do
enough research on AIDS in the early '80s to keep it from being
ambiguous.
film -- it sidetracks thought and discussion on the movie into this
essentially pointless argument. Does it matter what the girl in Love Story
died of? Or Beaches? The important thing is how the people involved reacted
to it, and if "Forrest Gump" wasn't so ambiguous on the point, we wouldn't
be worried about it...IMHO)
From a narrative point of view, it makes sense that Jenny has AIDS: Forrest
is involved in a lot of what has happened in the U.S. for the last 30 years,
and so it's reasonable that he be involved in the AIDS epidemic. It makes
it is more believable. Jenny was a promiscuous drug user, also, so it is
not unlikely that she would have a chance to contract the virus
HOWEVER, AIDS does not make sense from a historical or medical point of view.
In 1980/81, no one knew that AIDS was caused by a virus; AIDS was just
Acquired Immune Defeciency Syndrome, and all that was known (as I recall)
was that some people's immune systems stopped working, for some reason.
Jenny's symptoms should have been "My immune system is decaying," or "I've
been getting all these strange diseases," rather than "I have this virus..."
should have contracted the virus from Jenny, as well. And finally,
AIDS just wasn't that common outside of Haitians and
gay men until the mid-80's. (Doesn't mean it was impossible, but it puts
the believability factor close to "rare tropical virus" again.)
If I'm off on my recollections about AIDS, please correct me, but I think
that "poor background research" is the best answer to this question
of Jenny and AIDS.
David #6
I seem to have a different question than everyone else, though. I
remember the date on her tombstone being _1989_. Am I dreaming?
If I'm not, the question becomes: why _didn't_ the doctors know what it
was, as she said in the film? The illness cannot have lasted more than a
couple of years, since little Forrest doesn't get much older from the
time Forrest first meets him until the final scene by the bus.
--
David
dav...@netcom.com
brian r. mcdonald
the name aids was coined approximately two years before
anyone knew it was caused by a virus. thus there was never a time that
the disease could have been described as an unnamed virus, as it appears
to be in the film. i do think, however, that the scriptwriter intended
the audience to infer that the scene referred to aids - the anachronism
was either intentionally or unintentionally overlooked.
MoviSearch
pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu (Patrick McNally) writes:
In the first draft of Eric Roth's screenplay written Dec. 18, 1992, Jenny
died in Mississippi in 1980. Obviously before AIDS came to this country.
David Shuman
OK, interesting (though not necessarily obvious). But in the movie, Jenny
dies in Alabama in, what, 1983? AIDS was definietly in full swing by then,
and, by sleeping with intravenous drug users in the mid/late '70s, Jenny was
definitely in a high-risk category.
Face it, Jenny died of AIDS. Perfectly believable. I liked how AIDS was
written into the screenplay but not mentioned by name; it was refreshing to
see a film that breaches the subject of AIDS without being a film about AIDS,
if you know what I mean.
--
--Dave--
Chooi Siew H.
Aids arrived in America in 1976--as per "And the Band Played on". Jenny
died of AIDS.
--
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Gorgeous One !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(No Kidding)
bfr...@panix.com
: In article <38r0fe$r...@hermes.unt.edu> Chooi Siew H.,
: ii...@jove.acs.unt.edu writes:
: >Aids arrived in America in 1976--as per "And the Band Played on". Jenny
: >died of AIDS.
: It is BY NO MEANS CLEAR what she died of. Could have been cancer for
: all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
: subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
: dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
But it MAKES NARRATIVE SENSE that she died of AIDS. And sometimes, that's
all we have to go on.
-bf-
--
Bryant Frazer | "I hate music; it's got too many notes."
914/631/7155 | -- Paul Westerberg
David Gregory Platt
> It is BY NO MEANS CLEAR what she died of. Could have been cancer for
>all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
>subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
>dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
Jeez, name another VIRUS that kills slowly. Something from space?
I agree with you, sort of, on one point: the writers WERE trying to impute
'90s politically popular diseases to '70s subject matter. There were no
cases of heterosexual female AIDs in North America that early. However,
there's no doubt that in the movie, it's supposed to be AIDS.
Dave
ege...@sunyboard.org
She probably did.. Now her poor son and Forest are history..
I wonder how AIDS will look through the eyes of GUMP..
EL
New York
Aman Verjee
>died of AIDS.
It is BY NO MEANS CLEAR what she died of. Could have been cancer for
all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
Aman
Catherine Charron
: It is BY NO MEANS CLEAR what she died of. Could have been cancer for
: all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
: subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
: dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
: Aman
I remember Jenny saying, "i have a virus." Cancer is not a "virus", is
it? AIDS, however, is. It was wimpy of them not to come right out and
say she had AIDS, I thought.
The Dominator
Thanks for nothing to whoever started this post, since I haven't seen the
fucking film yet!
Dominator
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IMRAN BIN MOHAMED NOOR
: In article <pmcnally-200...@elvex91.acns.nwu.edu>,
: pmcn...@plato.nwu.edu (Patrick McNally) writes:
: In the first draft of Eric Roth's screenplay written Dec. 18, 1992, Jenny
: died in Mississippi in 1980. Obviously before AIDS came to this country.
In the movie, Jenny tod Forrest that she was carrying a virus and the
was no cure for it. AIDS only got its name around 1982-1984, but has been
around longer than that. Jenny died in 1982 probably months before the virus
got its name.
However it can be speculated that Jenny DID die of AIDS........via
looking at the care-free lifestyle she led before returning back to Forrest.
She was an intra-venous drug user and joined the group of hippies......known
for their sex-free lifestyle. These are characteristics of the high risk
group for AIDS.
So, we can safely conclude that she DID die of AIDS.
mgm...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
>
> In the movie, Jenny tod Forrest that she was carrying a virus and the
> was no cure for it. AIDS only got its name around 1982-1984, but has been
> around longer than that. Jenny died in 1982 probably months before the virus
> got its name.
>
> However it can be speculated that Jenny DID die of AIDS........via
> looking at the care-free lifestyle she led before returning back to Forrest.
> She was an intra-venous drug user and joined the group of hippies......known
> for their sex-free lifestyle. These are characteristics of the high risk
> group for AIDS.
I thought it was strange seeing Tom Hanks follow up THE movie about AIDS with
FG's version of AIDS. I know it wasn't central to the storyline, but Jenny
seemed to have a pretty easy death/illness.
I think they suspected AIDS was an STD around that time, but I think the
chances of Forrest catching HIV, not to mention Forrest Jr, would have been
high. No mention of it though. I read that the original author of the FG book
is considering a sequel about Forrest and his son. Maybe they'll tackle it in
that?
-----------------------------------------------------
Cath Aiken
c.a...@mang.canterbury.ac.nz
University of Canterbury, New Zealand
------------------------------------------------------
David Gregory Platt
>>In the first draft of Eric Roth's screenplay written Dec. 18, 1992, Jenny
>>died in Mississippi in 1980. Obviously before AIDS came to this country.
>Thanks for nothing to whoever started this post, since I haven't seen the
>fucking film yet!
The movie's five months old. Get over it.
Dave
Hazel Simpson
What ever the poor woman died of, it wasn't AIDS because you don't
die of AIDS, you die of an AIDS related illness.
I know I'm pedantic.
Hazel
day...@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Thanks. I've been saying the same thing here for weeks, and have a stack of
self-rightious flame responses to show for it.
Frank M. Carrano
: >all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
: >subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
: >dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
: >Aman
That makes no sense at all. Forrest Gump *is* a '90s movie. Who cares
if the book was written in the '70s? Have you read it? I suggest you do,
and you'll find that the movie is quite a radical departure from the book.
I think the implication from Levinson that Jenny dies of AIDS is fairly
obvious (although not many people die from ARC looking as good as she did
or dying so peacefully--very unrealistic).
-FMCJr
fra...@panix.com
V-X
The only self-righteous responses have been the ones yelling at people for
assuming she had AIDS. Given the information we get from the movie (early
'80s, a virus, the doctors don't know what it is yet, her past sexual
promiscuity and IV drug use), can you suggest something else it could have
been? And given the whole point of the movie--Gump as this ridiculous
innocent who drifts through every important event of the last thirty
years--even if you can suggest another illness, isn't it likely the writer
meant AIDS?
And, no, it couldn't have been cancer "for all we know."
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V-X
>I think they suspected AIDS was an STD around that time, but I think the
>chances of Forrest catching HIV, not to mention Forrest Jr, would have been
>high. No mention of it though. I read that the original author of the FG book
>is considering a sequel about Forrest and his son. Maybe they'll tackle it in
>that?
The chances of the son getting it would have been 100%, or close to it--mother
and child share blood supply, immune systems, etc. during pregnancy.
Forrest's chances of contracting it from a single act of heterosexual
intercourse would be next to nil--the mechanics of the virus' spread make
"pitchers" a lot safer than "catchers"--and even more so when there's no
feces, blood, etc. to deal with.
Duane Takamine
Aman Verjee <bkm...@leland.stanford.edu> wrote:
>In article <38r0fe$r...@hermes.unt.edu> Chooi Siew H.,
>ii...@jove.acs.unt.edu writes:
>>died of AIDS.
>
>all we know. Don't impute '90s politically popular diseases to '70s
>subject matter; red ribbons at the Oscars doesn't mean that everyone who
>dies in a movie of a mysterious ailment dies of AIDS.
>
It is true that they never come out and say what Jenny died of.
From my point of view, it would have broken the general flow of the film
to state explicitly what she died of. What we see is only that part of
the world that Forrest sees - except for the cuts to Jenny's life which
are meant to contrast with what Forrest is "thinking" about what she is
Probably doing at that moment. Since Jenny doesn't tell Forrest, we never
find out; as far as Forrest is concerned, it doesn't matter what she died of.
Heck, we don't exactly know what his mother died of either; it wasn't
important to know.
Also, if you were Jenny, tell me how you would explain AIDS to him?
I don't mean literally - I can come up with a speech about it. I mean
what would you tell Forrest if you were Jenny? A virus the doctors
aren't sure about isn't all that far off from reality in the late 70s.
Now, given that the movie shows without much comment most of
the really important bits of American history over the last 40 years
or so, it makes sense that Jenny died of AIDS. It almost certainly
wasn't cancer or Jenny would have just said "cancer." And AIDS can't
be excluded on the basis of Jenny dying to early in history of AIDS.
People were dying of AIDS in 1981, certainly (though not many confirmed
cases). It is unclear how many people died of it prior to that, although
the numbers must have increased over time until the disease was detected.
And prior to 1981, it would have been very likely misdiagnosed as something
else; perhaps some mysterious unknown virus (the catch all term sometimes
used to mean "I dunno, but it looks bad").
David Gregory Platt
>How very Amurrican of you. The movie is five months old in the United States;
^^^^^^^^^
Check the address. You mean "North Amurrican."
>many other nations represented on the Internet haven't had an opportunity to
>see it yet. And I'm curious: what exactly is the "statute of limitations" as
>far as this subject is concerned? Is there a specific number of days after
>initial release in country of origin after which spoiler alerts are no longer
>necessary?
>Show some consideration.
Maybe you're right, but I still don't think that this is a major spoiler
that ruins the movie.
Dave
Mike D'Angelo
How very Amurrican of you. The movie is five months old in the United States;
many other nations represented on the Internet haven't had an opportunity to
see it yet. And I'm curious: what exactly is the "statute of limitations" as
far as this subject is concerned? Is there a specific number of days after
initial release in country of origin after which spoiler alerts are no longer
necessary?
Show some consideration.
Mike D'Angelo
Tisch School of the Arts, NYU
"No, no...you're not that upset." --Johnny Depp as ED WOOD
V-X
>From: M24...@mwvm.mitre.org
>Subject: Re: Did Jenny die of AIDS in Forrest GumP?!
>Date: Tue, 01 Nov 94 15:35:59 EST
>>I remember Jenny saying, "i have a virus." Cancer is not a "virus", is
>>it? AIDS, however, is. It was wimpy of them not to come right out and
>>say she had AIDS, I thought.
>
>Well historically at the time, did they even have a name for "the virus"
>yet?? I got the impression what with all of the heavy drug using involving
>needles that it was also AIDS. But it doesn't work out. It's been a while
>since I've seen the movie, but didn't she discover that she had the
>"disease" circa 1981?? I thought the first known AIDS patient wasn't
>until a few years later. If they meant for this disease to indeed be
>AIDS, they really messed up.
The first known AIDS case now dates from the 1950's, I think--the virus has
been discovered in the blood of a sailor who died then. (I don't have refs
handy for this, but someone who knows the story has to be reading this.) The
first cases in the epidemic we now face date from the mid-70s, with the first
US cases showing up before 1980. On a personal note, the first references I
remember hearing on the news to "gay cancer" were when I was a freshman in
high school in the Bay Area--I entered high school in 1981.
Where the movie does cheat is in the amount of information Jenny gives so
we'll all know S*H*E*'S*G*O*T*A*I*D*S. HIV *wasn't* discovered until a few
years later. It would have been more true for her to say that the doctor's
just had no idea what she had, but then neither would the audience.
M24...@mwvm.mitre.org
>it? AIDS, however, is. It was wimpy of them not to come right out and
>say she had AIDS, I thought.
yet?? I got the impression what with all of the heavy drug using involving
needles that it was also AIDS. But it doesn't work out. It's been a while
since I've seen the movie, but didn't she discover that she had the
"disease" circa 1981?? I thought the first known AIDS patient wasn't
until a few years later. If they meant for this disease to indeed be
AIDS, they really messed up.
and all of it's paraphernalia came out in the early 70's. In the
scene where Gump "invented" the 'have a nice day' shirt with the
smiley face on it, they were playing Fleetwood Mac's "Go Your Own
Way". That song didn't come out until 1976. (?)
M24...@mwvm.mitre.org
of the Top 100 movies of all time (and their grosses).
Does anyone know where I can obtain that list?
Thanks!!
Michael Day
The movie's age is irrelevant. The fact is that it has not yet opened in
some countries yet, such as Australia. Your sort of message appears here
from time to time from people who continue to believe that the USA is the
centre of the universe.
Michael.
gary cooper
>Maybe you're right, but I still don't think that this is a major spoiler
>that ruins the movie.
Actually - this fucking thread has been around for months. I
saw the movie a month after release AFTER having seen this fucking
thread, and every time I saw Jenny I thouhgt "She's the one who
dies of AIDS"
Ruin? Maybe not, but it did lessen my enjoyment.
--
gary cooper (not the dead one) 666thID "moggy"
"Only a brave heart, borne in the spirit
of attack" blah blah blah... A. Galland !2!
Ulrich Schreglmann
>In article <38phgj$3...@nuscc.nus.sg>, med3...@leonis.nus.sg (IMRAN BIN MOHAMED NOOR) writes:
>> In the movie, Jenny tod Forrest that she was carrying a virus and the
>> was no cure for it. AIDS only got its name around 1982-1984, but has been
>> around longer than that. Jenny died in 1982 probably months before the virus
>> got its name.
>>
>> However it can be speculated that Jenny DID die of AIDS........via
>> looking at the care-free lifestyle she led before returning back to Forrest.
>> She was an intra-venous drug user and joined the group of hippies......known
>> for their sex-free lifestyle. These are characteristics of the high risk
^^^^^^^^
So abstinent, those flower kids, weren't they? :-)
>> group for AIDS.
>I thought it was strange seeing Tom Hanks follow up THE movie about AIDS with
>FG's version of AIDS. I know it wasn't central to the storyline, but Jenny
>seemed to have a pretty easy death/illness.
>I think they suspected AIDS was an STD around that time, but I think the
>chances of Forrest catching HIV, not to mention Forrest Jr, would have been
>high. No mention of it though. I read that the original author of the FG book
^^^^
From only one sexual encounter? In the female -> male direction? High?
I guess not. And as for Junior, I guess his chances of getting it would
have been around a quarter or so. However in that case most probably he
would have shown symptoms even as a baby and wouldn't have survived ear-
ly infanthood, would he? So looking healthy at his age he apparently
hasn't gotten it, either.
I mean, I'm no expert, but that IS after all what you hear about it in
in the news and everywhere, isn't it?
>is considering a sequel about Forrest and his son. Maybe they'll tackle it in
>that?
May the Cool Be with You!
(C)OOL mcmxciv