Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
Sparkling or Non-Sparkling Columbia Logo for Lawrence?
5 views
Skip to first unread message
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 7, 2012, 9:16:23 PM2/7/12
to peterm...@hotmail.com
When I saw first saw Lawrence at the Barclay Cinema In Sydney,
Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
for its original release in Sydney.
Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
Regards,
Peter Mason
Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
for its original release in Sydney.
Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
Regards,
Peter Mason
grand...@hotmail.com
Feb 8, 2012, 1:12:24 AM2/8/12
to
would have been a bit old fashioned.. So many dvds today have several
logos before the film. Most annoying for these co-productions.I had
to suffer 4 logos before a dvd I watched last week. . I think it is
about time the dvds/blurays have ONLY and I mean ONLY the original
film's logo from the studio that released the film.It gets to be
really ridiculous and a big wank seeing the Warner Bros or Turner
logo before a film that they originally had nothing to do with.We all
know that MGM released HTWWW so why do we have to endure the Warner
logo? ...and few people overseas would know what the Turner logo
would mean? The recent Bluray release of the classic film WINGS had
the Paramount logo shown a ridiculous 8 times. before the films
title. I can forsee the day when we have to endure the Turner logo
before as Disney film.
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 8, 2012, 3:25:04 AM2/8/12
to
On Feb 8, 5:12 pm, "grandeu...@HOTMAIL.COM" <grandeu...@HOTMAIL.COM>
wrote:
prologue.
I always believed that the prologue was on a separate 35mm film, but
about 12 years ago Noel Roberts who was
an assistant projectionist at the Barclay at the time told me that it
was actually on the beginning of the 70mm print
where the overture was. It was printed at about 1.66:1 on the 70mm
film.
I am talking about the lady with the Torch immediately after the
Overture finished.
Regards
Peter Mason
The sparkling logo
> would have been a bit old fashioned.. So many dvds today have several
> logos before the film. Most annoying for these co-productions.I had
> to suffer 4 logos before a dvd I watched last week. . I think it is
> about time the dvds/blurays have ONLY and I mean ONLY the original
> film's logo from the studio that released the film.It gets to be
> really ridiculous and a big wank seeing the Warner Bros or Turner
> logo before a film that they originally had nothing to do with.We all
> know that MGM released HTWWW so why do we have to endure the Warner
> logo? ...and few people overseas would know what the Turner logo
> would mean? The recent Bluray release of the classic film WINGS had
> the Paramount logo shown a ridiculous 8 times. before the films
> title. I can forsee the day when we have to endure the Turner logo
> before as Disney film.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
wrote:
> On Feb 8, 1:16 pm, cine...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > When I saw first saw Lawrence at the Barclay Cinema In Sydney,
> > Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
> > and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
> > For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
> > 1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
> > for its original release in Sydney.
>
> > Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
>
> > Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
> > of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
> > the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
> > after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
> > thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
>
> > Regards,
> > Peter Mason
>
> Was that before the prologue or the main film?.
Australia was among the very few countries that showed the b/w
>
>
>
>
>
> > When I saw first saw Lawrence at the Barclay Cinema In Sydney,
> > Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
> > and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
> > For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
> > 1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
> > for its original release in Sydney.
>
> > Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
>
> > Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
> > of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
> > the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
> > after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
> > thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
>
> > Regards,
> > Peter Mason
>
> Was that before the prologue or the main film?.
prologue.
I always believed that the prologue was on a separate 35mm film, but
about 12 years ago Noel Roberts who was
an assistant projectionist at the Barclay at the time told me that it
was actually on the beginning of the 70mm print
where the overture was. It was printed at about 1.66:1 on the 70mm
film.
I am talking about the lady with the Torch immediately after the
Overture finished.
Regards
Peter Mason
The sparkling logo
> would have been a bit old fashioned.. So many dvds today have several
> logos before the film. Most annoying for these co-productions.I had
> to suffer 4 logos before a dvd I watched last week. . I think it is
> about time the dvds/blurays have ONLY and I mean ONLY the original
> film's logo from the studio that released the film.It gets to be
> really ridiculous and a big wank seeing the Warner Bros or Turner
> logo before a film that they originally had nothing to do with.We all
> know that MGM released HTWWW so why do we have to endure the Warner
> logo? ...and few people overseas would know what the Turner logo
> would mean? The recent Bluray release of the classic film WINGS had
> the Paramount logo shown a ridiculous 8 times. before the films
> title. I can forsee the day when we have to endure the Turner logo
>
> - Show quoted text -
Martin Hart
Feb 8, 2012, 12:29:05 PM2/8/12
to
In article <9b7b1881-9aa8-4d7e-bfd2-685f1b9ff480
@pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
My memory tells me that I saw the sparkling logo in the original
roadshow run of "Lawrence", not the static painting seen in the
restoration. Bob Harris tells us that the logo was a new painting done
especially for the film in 1962. I believe that it was used with the
addition of the animated "sparkles". I was surprised to see the static
looking logo when I first saw Bob's beautiful restoration.
The black & white prologue wasn't on any of the prints that I've
personally seen, 70mm or 35mm.
Regarding the beginning of the Blu-ray of HTWWW, it is as originally
created. I hadn't noticed the long gap between overture and main title
but it might have been done so that the curtains could get a head start
before the MGM lion appears. If curtains in a typical Cinerama
installation began to open when the lion first appears they would not
have had a chance to fully display the logo before the titles start.
That's just a swag.
The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
Marty
--
The American WideScreen Museum
www.widescreenmuseum.com
@pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
roadshow run of "Lawrence", not the static painting seen in the
restoration. Bob Harris tells us that the logo was a new painting done
especially for the film in 1962. I believe that it was used with the
addition of the animated "sparkles". I was surprised to see the static
looking logo when I first saw Bob's beautiful restoration.
The black & white prologue wasn't on any of the prints that I've
personally seen, 70mm or 35mm.
Regarding the beginning of the Blu-ray of HTWWW, it is as originally
created. I hadn't noticed the long gap between overture and main title
but it might have been done so that the curtains could get a head start
before the MGM lion appears. If curtains in a typical Cinerama
installation began to open when the lion first appears they would not
have had a chance to fully display the logo before the titles start.
That's just a swag.
The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
Marty
--
The American WideScreen Museum
www.widescreenmuseum.com
grand...@hotmail.com
Feb 8, 2012, 9:48:47 PM2/8/12
to
On Feb 9, 4:29 am, Martin Hart
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
> The American WideScreen Museumwww.widescreenmuseum.com- Hide quoted text -
on the small screen (like the early cinerama prologues). It was
actually on the 70mm prints (not a seperate 35mm film) shown in
Australia and New Zealand according to the projectionist at one
Sydney cinema where it was shown..I can recall seeing it also in
Christchurch . .It was a pity that it was removed for later
audiences. Why do they stuff around with prologues? The prologue for
the 70mm release of THE AGONY AND THE ECSTACY was deleted in New
Zealand which also meant that the end credits had to go as the final
scene followed on from the prologue.It made watching the film a mess.
Why did they bother at all?? Then there was the prologue for MUTINY ON
THE BOUNTY which never even made it to the finished film but made it
to the dvd release.. More horrors: The finale to How The West Was Won
was deleted from non cinerama prints and the opening pre credit
sequence for Wonderful World Of The Brothers Grimm disappeared from
TV prints. Even THIS IS CINERAMA had 2 different prologues- one for
Europe and the other for America.I can also recall seeing a prologue
for THE TEN COMMANDMENTS when it was first released. That too
disappeared from later reissues.Thankfully the prologue to AROUND THE
WORLD 80 DAYS was left on the 70mm prints.It would have been a crime
if they had deleted it.Can anyone recall other prologue
problems?.More 70mm horrors: The tv version of SCENT OF MYSTERY (aka:
Holiday In Spain) lost over an hour of footage.The tv print of
WINDJAMMER only contained the centre panel of the 3 panel film.
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
>
> - Show quoted text -
The short black and white prologue for LAWRENCE OF ARABIA was shown
> - Show quoted text -
on the small screen (like the early cinerama prologues). It was
actually on the 70mm prints (not a seperate 35mm film) shown in
Australia and New Zealand according to the projectionist at one
Sydney cinema where it was shown..I can recall seeing it also in
Christchurch . .It was a pity that it was removed for later
audiences. Why do they stuff around with prologues? The prologue for
the 70mm release of THE AGONY AND THE ECSTACY was deleted in New
Zealand which also meant that the end credits had to go as the final
scene followed on from the prologue.It made watching the film a mess.
Why did they bother at all?? Then there was the prologue for MUTINY ON
THE BOUNTY which never even made it to the finished film but made it
to the dvd release.. More horrors: The finale to How The West Was Won
was deleted from non cinerama prints and the opening pre credit
sequence for Wonderful World Of The Brothers Grimm disappeared from
TV prints. Even THIS IS CINERAMA had 2 different prologues- one for
Europe and the other for America.I can also recall seeing a prologue
for THE TEN COMMANDMENTS when it was first released. That too
disappeared from later reissues.Thankfully the prologue to AROUND THE
WORLD 80 DAYS was left on the 70mm prints.It would have been a crime
if they had deleted it.Can anyone recall other prologue
problems?.More 70mm horrors: The tv version of SCENT OF MYSTERY (aka:
Holiday In Spain) lost over an hour of footage.The tv print of
WINDJAMMER only contained the centre panel of the 3 panel film.
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 8, 2012, 11:09:45 PM2/8/12
to
> In article <9b7b1881-9aa8-4d7e-bfd2-685f1b9ff480
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
When you say "original roadshow run" do you mean the 222
minutes version
which was the premiere version? If so, in the scene in Part 2 where
Allenby(Jack Hawkins)
tries to persuade Lawrence to go back to the desert, was there
dialogue where Allenby refers to himself as
"a gardening sort of general" and comparing himself to a famous
military leader such as Nelson or somebody
of that ilk.(see the "alternative versions" of Lawrence of Arabia on
us.imdb.com and this is mentioned.
Also in the original 222 mins version after Auda(Anthony Quinn)
states: "Dine with me. It is my pleasure that you all
dine with me in Wadi Rhumm." the cut to the moving camera over the
rocks and the dramatic music was not in the
original 222 mins version. David Lean insisted in putting it in
because the direct cut to the interior of the tent seemed "hammy" to
him..
If you speak to Robert Harris at any time would you ask him to please
restore the "Spakling Logo".in the event of any further restoration
where
the scenes with the additional dialogue between Lawrence and
Allenby.are re-instated.
Regards,
Peter mason
Bob Harris tells us that the logo was a new painting done
> especially for the film in 1962. I believe that it was used with the
> addition of the animated "sparkles". I was surprised to see the static
> looking logo when I first saw Bob's beautiful restoration.
>
> The black & white prologue wasn't on any of the prints that I've
> personally seen, 70mm or 35mm.
>
> Regarding the beginning of the Blu-ray of HTWWW, it is as originally
> created. I hadn't noticed the long gap between overture and main title
> but it might have been done so that the curtains could get a head start
> before the MGM lion appears. If curtains in a typical Cinerama
> installation began to open when the lion first appears they would not
> have had a chance to fully display the logo before the titles start.
> That's just a swag.
>
> The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
> the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
> version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
> overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
> transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
>
> Marty
> --
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
>
>
>
>
>
> > When I saw first saw Lawrence at the Barclay Cinema In Sydney,
> > Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
> > and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
> > For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
> > 1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
> > for its original release in Sydney.
>
> > Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
>
> > Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
> > of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
> > the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
> > after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
> > thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
>
> > Regards,
> > Peter Mason
>
> My memory tells me that I saw the sparkling logo in the original
> roadshow run of "Lawrence", not the static painting seen in the
> restoration.
Martin,
>
>
>
>
> > When I saw first saw Lawrence at the Barclay Cinema In Sydney,
> > Australia at the age of about 14 the film was the 202 minutes version
> > and had the "sparkling" Columbia Title.
> > For the 1988-89 restoration they went back to the new Painting circa
> > 1962 but I much preferred the "sparkling" Columbia logo. as was used
> > for its original release in Sydney.
>
> > Does anybody else have strong feelings in relation to this?
>
> > Also Martin Hart mentioned recently in relatiion to HTWWW that in one
> > of the dvds the Turner Logo was shown after the Overture but before
> > the MGM Logo. In the current Blu-ray there seems to be a long gap
> > after the end of the overture and the start of the MGM logo.Perhaps
> > thjs is the space where the Turner Logo used to be?
>
> > Regards,
> > Peter Mason
>
> My memory tells me that I saw the sparkling logo in the original
> roadshow run of "Lawrence", not the static painting seen in the
> restoration.
When you say "original roadshow run" do you mean the 222
minutes version
which was the premiere version? If so, in the scene in Part 2 where
Allenby(Jack Hawkins)
tries to persuade Lawrence to go back to the desert, was there
dialogue where Allenby refers to himself as
"a gardening sort of general" and comparing himself to a famous
military leader such as Nelson or somebody
of that ilk.(see the "alternative versions" of Lawrence of Arabia on
us.imdb.com and this is mentioned.
Also in the original 222 mins version after Auda(Anthony Quinn)
states: "Dine with me. It is my pleasure that you all
dine with me in Wadi Rhumm." the cut to the moving camera over the
rocks and the dramatic music was not in the
original 222 mins version. David Lean insisted in putting it in
because the direct cut to the interior of the tent seemed "hammy" to
him..
If you speak to Robert Harris at any time would you ask him to please
restore the "Spakling Logo".in the event of any further restoration
where
the scenes with the additional dialogue between Lawrence and
Allenby.are re-instated.
Regards,
Peter mason
Bob Harris tells us that the logo was a new painting done
> especially for the film in 1962. I believe that it was used with the
> addition of the animated "sparkles". I was surprised to see the static
> looking logo when I first saw Bob's beautiful restoration.
>
> The black & white prologue wasn't on any of the prints that I've
> personally seen, 70mm or 35mm.
>
> Regarding the beginning of the Blu-ray of HTWWW, it is as originally
> created. I hadn't noticed the long gap between overture and main title
> but it might have been done so that the curtains could get a head start
> before the MGM lion appears. If curtains in a typical Cinerama
> installation began to open when the lion first appears they would not
> have had a chance to fully display the logo before the titles start.
> That's just a swag.
>
> The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
> the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
> version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
> overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
> transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
>
> Marty
> --
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 8, 2012, 11:26:53 PM2/8/12
to
> In article <9b7b1881-9aa8-4d7e-bfd2-685f1b9ff480
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
I first saw HTWWW with my mother when I was 12 years old. I
subsequently saw it at least another five times alone.
The last time I saw HTWWW was just before its Sydney season finished
in March 1964. I was 13 and a half years old.
I remember clearly that just as the Overture finishes the MGM Lion
appears almost immediately and there certainly wasn't
the Long Delay that is in the Blu-ray.. I have seen the version with
the Turner Logo and I actually sent an email to Ned Price at Warners
and he told me it wouldn'
be on the Blu-ray, which it isn't BUT the gap left by its emission is.
Regards,
Peter Mason
> @pk8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
subsequently saw it at least another five times alone.
The last time I saw HTWWW was just before its Sydney season finished
in March 1964. I was 13 and a half years old.
I remember clearly that just as the Overture finishes the MGM Lion
appears almost immediately and there certainly wasn't
the Long Delay that is in the Blu-ray.. I have seen the version with
the Turner Logo and I actually sent an email to Ned Price at Warners
and he told me it wouldn'
be on the Blu-ray, which it isn't BUT the gap left by its emission is.
Regards,
Peter Mason
> That's just a swag.
>
> The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
> the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
> version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
> overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
> transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
>
> Marty
> --
>
> The Blu-ray and DVD were from a completely new 8K digital scan made from
> the three separate negatives, not the composite (shitty) 35mm anamorphic
> version seen in previous releases. The Turner logo was inserted between
> overture and main title of a previously made NTSC letterbox video
> transfer. Boy does that transfer suck bigtime.
>
> Marty
> --
Martin Hart
Feb 12, 2012, 5:14:41 PM2/12/12
to
In article <8c908b27-9e3e-4cef-a5c4-
492da9...@lr19g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, grand...@HOTMAIL.COM
says...
<SNIP>
> The short black and white prologue for LAWRENCE OF ARABIA was shown
> on the small screen (like the early cinerama prologues). It was
> actually on the 70mm prints (not a seperate 35mm film) shown in
> Australia and New Zealand according to the projectionist at one
> Sydney cinema where it was shown..I can recall seeing it also in
> Christchurch . .It was a pity that it was removed for later
> audiences. Why do they stuff around with prologues? The prologue for
> the 70mm release of THE AGONY AND THE ECSTACY was deleted in New
> Zealand which also meant that the end credits had to go as the final
> scene followed on from the prologue.It made watching the film a mess.
> Why did they bother at all?? Then there was the prologue for MUTINY ON
> THE BOUNTY which never even made it to the finished film but made it
> to the dvd release.. More horrors: The finale to How The West Was Won
> was deleted from non cinerama prints and the opening pre credit
> sequence for Wonderful World Of The Brothers Grimm disappeared from
> TV prints. Even THIS IS CINERAMA had 2 different prologues- one for
> Europe and the other for America.I can also recall seeing a prologue
> for THE TEN COMMANDMENTS when it was first released. That too
> disappeared from later reissues.Thankfully the prologue to AROUND THE
> WORLD 80 DAYS was left on the 70mm prints.It would have been a crime
> if they had deleted it.Can anyone recall other prologue
> problems?.More 70mm horrors: The tv version of SCENT OF MYSTERY (aka:
> Holiday In Spain) lost over an hour of footage.The tv print of
> WINDJAMMER only contained the centre panel of the 3 panel film.
>
The prologue to "The Ten Commandments", spoken by Cecil B. DeMille, has
been on every theatrical print that I've ever seen and also on all video
releases. It may have been omitted on commercial TV broadcasts, I've
never watched it with enough commercials to spread it out over 5 hours.
The epilogue that was cut from the 35mm anamorphic version of HTWWW was
restored in later years when the film was still being shown on TV in its
wonderful pan and scan version, ugh! All letterbox versions have been
the full film with no cuts.
I've never seen GRIMM theatrically but I've seen a couple of different
versions of it in letterbox and there are differences in the beginning
of some of them. When, and if, the film ever gets rescanned for state of
the art video I'm sure it will be as complete as possible.
The only showing of "Around the World in 80 Days" that I've seen sans
the Edward R. Murrow prologue was when it was run in the U.S. on CBS.
It's on all other versions that I've ever seen. And it doesn't do
anything to improve the film, IMO.
The unused prologue to "Mutiny on the Bounty" first appeared at the
beginning of the first ABC showing of the film back around 1965. In
those days ABC adopted the policy of cutting off the main credits and
playing them at the end of the movie so they could hawk other shows in
voice overs. The prologue was designed to appear after the main credits
in "Mutiny" and I think MGM did themselves a disservice by eliminating
it.
Not only did the TV print of "Windjammer" consist of just the center
panel, it was made from the reissue print that was also just the center
panel. I know it played at the Cinerama Dome because I have one of their
posters but I don't have any idea how much play that castrated version
received.
Let's talk about something that's not so depressing.
492da9...@lr19g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, grand...@HOTMAIL.COM
says...
<SNIP>
> The short black and white prologue for LAWRENCE OF ARABIA was shown
> on the small screen (like the early cinerama prologues). It was
> actually on the 70mm prints (not a seperate 35mm film) shown in
> Australia and New Zealand according to the projectionist at one
> Sydney cinema where it was shown..I can recall seeing it also in
> Christchurch . .It was a pity that it was removed for later
> audiences. Why do they stuff around with prologues? The prologue for
> the 70mm release of THE AGONY AND THE ECSTACY was deleted in New
> Zealand which also meant that the end credits had to go as the final
> scene followed on from the prologue.It made watching the film a mess.
> Why did they bother at all?? Then there was the prologue for MUTINY ON
> THE BOUNTY which never even made it to the finished film but made it
> to the dvd release.. More horrors: The finale to How The West Was Won
> was deleted from non cinerama prints and the opening pre credit
> sequence for Wonderful World Of The Brothers Grimm disappeared from
> TV prints. Even THIS IS CINERAMA had 2 different prologues- one for
> Europe and the other for America.I can also recall seeing a prologue
> for THE TEN COMMANDMENTS when it was first released. That too
> disappeared from later reissues.Thankfully the prologue to AROUND THE
> WORLD 80 DAYS was left on the 70mm prints.It would have been a crime
> if they had deleted it.Can anyone recall other prologue
> problems?.More 70mm horrors: The tv version of SCENT OF MYSTERY (aka:
> Holiday In Spain) lost over an hour of footage.The tv print of
> WINDJAMMER only contained the centre panel of the 3 panel film.
>
been on every theatrical print that I've ever seen and also on all video
releases. It may have been omitted on commercial TV broadcasts, I've
never watched it with enough commercials to spread it out over 5 hours.
The epilogue that was cut from the 35mm anamorphic version of HTWWW was
restored in later years when the film was still being shown on TV in its
wonderful pan and scan version, ugh! All letterbox versions have been
the full film with no cuts.
I've never seen GRIMM theatrically but I've seen a couple of different
versions of it in letterbox and there are differences in the beginning
of some of them. When, and if, the film ever gets rescanned for state of
the art video I'm sure it will be as complete as possible.
The only showing of "Around the World in 80 Days" that I've seen sans
the Edward R. Murrow prologue was when it was run in the U.S. on CBS.
It's on all other versions that I've ever seen. And it doesn't do
anything to improve the film, IMO.
The unused prologue to "Mutiny on the Bounty" first appeared at the
beginning of the first ABC showing of the film back around 1965. In
those days ABC adopted the policy of cutting off the main credits and
playing them at the end of the movie so they could hawk other shows in
voice overs. The prologue was designed to appear after the main credits
in "Mutiny" and I think MGM did themselves a disservice by eliminating
it.
Not only did the TV print of "Windjammer" consist of just the center
panel, it was made from the reissue print that was also just the center
panel. I know it played at the Cinerama Dome because I have one of their
posters but I don't have any idea how much play that castrated version
received.
Let's talk about something that's not so depressing.
Martin Hart
Feb 12, 2012, 5:24:34 PM2/12/12
to
I have no idea of the length of the version that I saw in roadshow, and
no memory of the chunk of dialog between Hawkins and O'Toole in part 2.
I'm pretty sure that the dramatic shot over the Bedouin camp and strong
music accompaniment was there. That music is on the original soundtrack
album so it would seem that that shot had been present from the
beginning.
I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
have been in the film at that time.
Marty
In article <ebf6ecd3-69b8-4cb8-8e5f-051ba1c45f79
@g4g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
no memory of the chunk of dialog between Hawkins and O'Toole in part 2.
I'm pretty sure that the dramatic shot over the Bedouin camp and strong
music accompaniment was there. That music is on the original soundtrack
album so it would seem that that shot had been present from the
beginning.
I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
have been in the film at that time.
Marty
In article <ebf6ecd3-69b8-4cb8-8e5f-051ba1c45f79
@g4g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 15, 2012, 3:25:00 AM2/15/12
to
On Feb 13, 9:24 am, Martin Hart
According to Bob Morris' 30th Anniversary Book on Lawrence
of Arabia the music
and that tracking scene over the rocks was added at the time the 202
minutes version was
created. It states in the book that David Lean thought it looked hammy
the way Auda(very dramatically says:
"Come dine with me in Wadi Rhumm" and then cuts to the young girl
inside the tent.
>
> I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
> after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
> have been in the film at that time.
The 1963 Oscars were held on 8th April 1863, which was amost 4 months
after the London premiere and 3 3/4 months after the New York
premiere,
and yes the film had been cut by that time.
It would appear that you saw the 202 minutes version not the original
222 mins version.
This is the same cut of the Film I saw at the Barclay Cinema in
Sydney.
Of course over here we had the added attraction of "God Save the
Queen: being played before
the Overture began.
Regards
Peter Mason
>
> Marty
>
> In article <ebf6ecd3-69b8-4cb8-8e5f-051ba1c45f79
> @g4g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
> > > The American WideScreen Museumwww.widescreenmuseum.com-Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
<martinh...@spamfreewidescreenmuseum.com> wrote:
> I have no idea of the length of the version that I saw in roadshow, and
> no memory of the chunk of dialog between Hawkins and O'Toole in part 2.
> I'm pretty sure that the dramatic shot over the Bedouin camp and strong
> music accompaniment was there. That music is on the original soundtrack
> album so it would seem that that shot had been present from the
> beginning.
Martin,
> I have no idea of the length of the version that I saw in roadshow, and
> no memory of the chunk of dialog between Hawkins and O'Toole in part 2.
> I'm pretty sure that the dramatic shot over the Bedouin camp and strong
> music accompaniment was there. That music is on the original soundtrack
> album so it would seem that that shot had been present from the
> beginning.
According to Bob Morris' 30th Anniversary Book on Lawrence
of Arabia the music
and that tracking scene over the rocks was added at the time the 202
minutes version was
created. It states in the book that David Lean thought it looked hammy
the way Auda(very dramatically says:
"Come dine with me in Wadi Rhumm" and then cuts to the young girl
inside the tent.
>
> I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
> after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
> have been in the film at that time.
after the London premiere and 3 3/4 months after the New York
premiere,
and yes the film had been cut by that time.
It would appear that you saw the 202 minutes version not the original
222 mins version.
This is the same cut of the Film I saw at the Barclay Cinema in
Sydney.
Of course over here we had the added attraction of "God Save the
Queen: being played before
the Overture began.
Regards
Peter Mason
>
> Marty
>
> In article <ebf6ecd3-69b8-4cb8-8e5f-051ba1c45f79
> @g4g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
Martin Hart
Feb 15, 2012, 6:50:28 PM2/15/12
to
In article <ce75edda-8e7f-49e5-9906-
5b6b2b...@n8g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
<SNIP>
Peter,
I'd never contradict anything in Bob Morris' book. He and Lawrie
exhaustively researched the book and I think it's the best book
dedicated to the documenting the production of any film. Wonderful work.
I have to assume that it was the 202 minute version that I saw. There
was certainly no black & white prologue. The thing that confuses me is
the original soundtrack album issued by Colpix Records. The first track
on side 2 is "Arrival at Auda's Camp". That LP had to have been created
before the film was cut to the 202 minute length.
My sympathies on having to endure "God Save The Queen" at the start of
all those movies years ago. Do you recall when it no longer became a
standard practice to play it?
Marty
5b6b2b...@n8g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>, cin...@hotmail.com says...
<SNIP>
Peter,
I'd never contradict anything in Bob Morris' book. He and Lawrie
exhaustively researched the book and I think it's the best book
dedicated to the documenting the production of any film. Wonderful work.
I have to assume that it was the 202 minute version that I saw. There
was certainly no black & white prologue. The thing that confuses me is
the original soundtrack album issued by Colpix Records. The first track
on side 2 is "Arrival at Auda's Camp". That LP had to have been created
before the film was cut to the 202 minute length.
My sympathies on having to endure "God Save The Queen" at the start of
all those movies years ago. Do you recall when it no longer became a
standard practice to play it?
Marty
cin...@hotmail.com
Feb 16, 2012, 12:52:14 AM2/16/12
to
On Feb 16, 10:50 am, Martin Hart
<martinh...@spamfreewidescreenmuseum.com> wrote:
> In article <ce75edda-8e7f-49e5-9906-
> 5b6b2bedb...@n8g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
Greater Union or Hoyts Theatre.
If my memory is correct I think Greater Union got rid of it first and
then a year or two later Hoyts. stopped playing it.
I am by no means a Royalist but at the Barclay the House Lights dimmed
slightly and the drum roll of GSTQ could be heard and then after the
end of GSTQ there was about a 5-6 seconds delay before the Drum Rolls
of the Lawrence Overture could be heard and the House Lights dimmed a
bit more.
The whole experience of the Overture and the dimming Lights and the
50ft Gold Curtain opening during the start of
the Prologue was a Real Work of Art.. Then the curtains closed again
and the last minute or so of the Overture played out and
the stage lights dimmed gradually to black. and then the curtains
opened again and the experience of the gradually ascending music
behind the "sparkling"
Columbia Logo still gives me goose-bumps.
I've been looking around for a 45 of God Save the Queen because to me
that was all part of the "performance" of Lawrence of Arabia.I first
saw
when I was almost 14 years old.
Anyway I hope the Blu-Ray lives up to expectations because I'm hoping
to install a gold curtain and a 10ft screen and perhaps also a 45Rpm
of God Save the Queen for a special 50th Anniversary presentation here
in Sydney, Australia.
Regards,
Peter Mason
>
> Marty
>
>
>
> > Martin,
> > According to Bob Morris' 30th Anniversary Book on Lawrence
> > of Arabia the music
> > and that tracking scene over the rocks was added at the time the 202
> > minutes version was
> > created. It states in the book that David Lean thought it looked hammy
> > the way Auda(very dramatically says:
>
> > "Come dine with me in Wadi Rhumm" and then cuts to the young girl
> > inside the tent.
>
> > > I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
> > > after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
> > > have been in the film at that time.
>
> > The 1963 Oscars were held on 8th April 1963, which was amost 4 months
> > > > > The American WideScreen Museumwww.widescreenmuseum.com-Hidequoted text -
<martinh...@spamfreewidescreenmuseum.com> wrote:
> In article <ce75edda-8e7f-49e5-9906-
> 5b6b2bedb...@n8g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>, cine...@hotmail.com says...
>
> <SNIP>
>
> Peter,
> I'd never contradict anything in Bob Morris' book. He and Lawrie
> exhaustively researched the book and I think it's the best book
> dedicated to the documenting the production of any film. Wonderful work.
>
> I have to assume that it was the 202 minute version that I saw. There
> was certainly no black & white prologue. The thing that confuses me is
> the original soundtrack album issued by Colpix Records. The first track
> on side 2 is "Arrival at Auda's Camp". That LP had to have been created
> before the film was cut to the 202 minute length.
>
> My sympathies on having to endure "God Save The Queen" at the start of
> all those movies years ago. Do you recall when it no longer became a
> standard practice to play it?
About the late sixties early seventies depending on whether it was a
> <SNIP>
>
> Peter,
> I'd never contradict anything in Bob Morris' book. He and Lawrie
> exhaustively researched the book and I think it's the best book
> dedicated to the documenting the production of any film. Wonderful work.
>
> I have to assume that it was the 202 minute version that I saw. There
> was certainly no black & white prologue. The thing that confuses me is
> the original soundtrack album issued by Colpix Records. The first track
> on side 2 is "Arrival at Auda's Camp". That LP had to have been created
> before the film was cut to the 202 minute length.
>
> My sympathies on having to endure "God Save The Queen" at the start of
> all those movies years ago. Do you recall when it no longer became a
> standard practice to play it?
Greater Union or Hoyts Theatre.
If my memory is correct I think Greater Union got rid of it first and
then a year or two later Hoyts. stopped playing it.
I am by no means a Royalist but at the Barclay the House Lights dimmed
slightly and the drum roll of GSTQ could be heard and then after the
end of GSTQ there was about a 5-6 seconds delay before the Drum Rolls
of the Lawrence Overture could be heard and the House Lights dimmed a
bit more.
The whole experience of the Overture and the dimming Lights and the
50ft Gold Curtain opening during the start of
the Prologue was a Real Work of Art.. Then the curtains closed again
and the last minute or so of the Overture played out and
the stage lights dimmed gradually to black. and then the curtains
opened again and the experience of the gradually ascending music
behind the "sparkling"
Columbia Logo still gives me goose-bumps.
I've been looking around for a 45 of God Save the Queen because to me
that was all part of the "performance" of Lawrence of Arabia.I first
saw
when I was almost 14 years old.
Anyway I hope the Blu-Ray lives up to expectations because I'm hoping
to install a gold curtain and a 10ft screen and perhaps also a 45Rpm
of God Save the Queen for a special 50th Anniversary presentation here
in Sydney, Australia.
Regards,
Peter Mason
>
> Marty
>
>
>
> > Martin,
> > According to Bob Morris' 30th Anniversary Book on Lawrence
> > of Arabia the music
> > and that tracking scene over the rocks was added at the time the 202
> > minutes version was
> > created. It states in the book that David Lean thought it looked hammy
> > the way Auda(very dramatically says:
>
> > "Come dine with me in Wadi Rhumm" and then cuts to the young girl
> > inside the tent.
>
> > > I saw the film a few days after the Oscars, which was about 2 1/2 months
> > > after the premiere. Perhaps you can judge from that just what would
> > > have been in the film at that time.
>
grand...@hotmail.com
Feb 16, 2012, 1:44:02 AM2/16/12
to
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Listening to god save the queen disappeared years before in new
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
zealand.We were the first to abandon this stupid policy.. Although
it was not as stupid as in America where they used to show
commercials before the film started (sometimes with john wayne
talking) and then they would take up a collection for charity.Can you
believe that this used to happen in NYC in the sixties.Nowadays
30%of the monies collected in the streets for charities go to the
collector with the most of the rest going to the shareholders of the
companies who arrange the collections.The poor charities are lucky to
get anything at all.My policy: never give money to charities in the
street. The money is better off going towards the forthcoming
bluray of lawrence of arabia. While we are on the subject of Lawrence
- just how much of this masterpiece was actually based on
fact.Millions of people were given distorted views of the real story
of Lawrence if they believed everything that they saw in the film
to be the true story. Was it a masterpiece of fact or fiction? Also
will the prologue be on the new bluray disc??
0 new messages