Location sound in Swaziland
all...@verizon.net
Last year you helped me equip my wife to do a doc shoot in Swaziland in
southern Africa. She's going back again, and this time bringing me to
help with sound (there were lots of problems last time). I'm a studio
engineer (and musician), not a location sound guy. So please forgive
my ignorance on the subject. I could use some recommendations on
wireless systems and lav mics. We're planning to buy 2 channels of
wireless and two lavs, to use along with a boom mic (which we already
have).
One problem last time was that the cinematographer (who was taking the
sound directly into her Panasonic 24p camera ) did lots of long shots,
and the wireless system she brought (from South Africa) couldn't handle
the distance. Which wireless systems have better range, and what range
should I expect. Fortunately, there's very little interference in this
area of Swaziland (there's not much of anything, particularly anything
electric).
It looks like I'm going to buy a Sound Devices 302 so that I'll have
control of the gain and can work with three mics.
Most of the shooting will be outdoors, and will be interviews.
Do you recommend a stereo receiver system or two mono ones?
Is there a particular belt pack/case that you recommend that will hold
the mixer and receivers?
What do you recommend as a power source for the receivers and mixer (is
there one battery system that will power everything).
Needless to say, out in the bush of Africa, durability is a big issue
(but not humidity - it hasn't rained here in 10 years!).
Budget is a consideration, but I know we need to go with excellent
equipment. We'll spend what we need to.
Thanks,
Ken Winokur
Noah Timan
> Hi Guys,
> Which wireless systems have better range, and what range
> should I expect.
Hi Ken,
Audio Limited, Lectrosonics, and Zaxcom are generally the best wireless
to use in terms of range and fidelity. Lectrosonics are the most
affordable of that bunch, generally speaking. All offer a pretty
similar RF range performance (some might argue) and should get you
between 150 and 350 feet as a standard, provided an uncrowded RF
environment. You can increase your performance significantly by using
appropriate antennaes to your situation -- look into dipole
omnidirectional antennae, log periodic ("shark fins") directional
antennae, and YAGI highly directional antennae. Used properly and with
proper cable, you will do better. Sennheiser also makes popular
wireless systems but I have always found them to compare unfavorably to
the others in regards to range.
> Do you recommend a stereo receiver system or two mono ones?
Stereo receivers are generally only needed for creating a wireless link
to the camera or for having a boom operator collect stereo tracks with
a wireless link to the mixer. If neither of these is your scenario,
I'd recommend two mono systems.
> Is there a particular belt pack/case that you recommend that will hold
> the mixer and receivers?
Try Porta-Brace, Kata, or Petrol.
> What do you recommend as a power source for the receivers and mixer (is
> there one battery system that will power everything).
Try IDX lithium NP1 batteries. You get a lot of power for the weight
and don't have to worry about memory cycles. Remote Audio makes a
popular distribution system for the bag called "BDS". Alternately,
Hawk-Woods in the UK makes a good NP1 cup with multiple hirose outputs
-- build your own cables (or have someone build them for you) and
you're off.
> Needless to say, out in the bush of Africa, durability is a big issue
> (but not humidity - it hasn't rained here in 10 years!).
In that regard I'd suggest the Lectrosonics. In my opinion, they take
abuse better than either of the other two recommended systems.
Good luck! And get some surround sound while you're there <vbg>
Regards,
Noah Timan
Travis Groves
Hi Ken,
In addition to everything Noah recommended, I'd add a 250 watt Tx if
range is an issue. I'm not sure if the other manufacturers offer high
output Tx's, but I see used Lectro 250's from time to time on
consignment boards. With regards to lavalier mics, I have found the
COS-11 from Sanken to be very robust and more importantly, they sound
great. If you are suspecting high winds, look into the fuzzy high wind
covers from Remote Audio (micro cat) or Koala.
Travis Groves
Courtney Goodin
"Travis Groves" <travis...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1161198466.6...@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> Hi Ken,
>
> In addition to everything Noah recommended, I'd add a 250 watt Tx if
> range is an issue. I'm not sure if the other manufacturers offer high
> output Tx's, but I see used Lectro 250's from time to time on
> consignment boards.
Ken,
Don't be confused by Travis's typo. He means 250 Milliwatt Transmitter.
or 1/4 Watt. If you were to have a 250 Watt Transmitter the range would be
incredible, but you would need a truck battery to run the thing and that
would be difficult to stick on the actor.:-)
---Courtney
Martin Harrington
Even my cheapie Sony UC series will do well over 200 feet, and it seems that
the camera is only a HD/DV type, so the lens range isn't going to be huge.
sync at that range will be a non issue I would think.
One thing to remember..go as light and stealth as possible.
--
Martin Harrington
www.lendanear-sound.com
"Travis Groves" <travis...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1161198466.6...@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
all...@verizon.net
> Ken,
> Don't be confused by Travis's typo. He means 250 Milliwatt Transmitter.
> or 1/4 Watt. If you were to have a 250 Watt Transmitter the range would be
> incredible, but you would need a truck battery to run the thing and that
> would be difficult to stick on the actor.:-)
> ---Courtney
Got it! Although, the truck battery might slow down the subjects and
make them easier to film. Squirmy little devils.
I just looked at prices and see that they're pretty expensive. I
suspect that 100 ft is the maximum range we'll need (and even that's
pushing it). Would one of the 100 milliwatt versions work for that?
What are the best moderately priced units? We were thinking about
something between $1000 and $1500 per unit.
Ken
Martin Harrington
--
Martin Harrington
www.lendanear-sound.com
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161214329.2...@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
all...@verizon.net
Martin Harrington wrote:
> One thing to remember..go as light and stealth as possible.
> --
> Martin Harrington
> www.lendanear-sound.com
Last time Jane (my wife went there) she decided to go as stealth as
possible, and not use a soundman (I offered to work for free). This
proved to be too light and stealth. She did interviews with her South
African (pregnant) camera woman, her producer (also a woman), and a
blind Swazi guide (a man).
The radio mics failed regularly. There was intermitant digital
breakup. It seemed almost always to be when they were 50 or more feet
away (shooting a group of people from a distance with a telephoto
lens). Unfortunately, the shooting included lots of distance shots.
Of course, since the cinematographer was watching levels and listening
to the mix, she was too busy to notice problems. My wife was doing the
interviews and holding the boom (she had cans on, but only listened to
one side). In addition to the digital breakup, there were frequent
problems with levels (too loud or too quiet). It didn't seem like the
Panasonic 24p camera's limiter worked too well either.
Still, the material they got was amazing. It's a story about how the
oldest generation of grandmothers (called Gogos in Swazi) are now
having to take care of all the AIDs orphans. Often 80 year old women
are taking care of 15 kids, with no income or support. Unfortunately
Jane is having to cut around the audio problems.
So this year, the idea is that I will go along for much of the job and
do sound (instead of the producer). I'll have a portable field mixer
(Sound Devices I think), two radio mics, one AT 4053 hypercardiod, one
Sennheiser ME66, Sony MDR 7506 phones, boom, shock, Rycotes etc. I'm
tempted to go out and buy a Sennheiser MKH 60 - but I'll have to see
about finances. Hopefully I can improve the percentage of shots with
usable audio.
Since much of the interviews are in Swazi, there will be subtitles for
almost all the interviews (even the English is so unusual, that
Americans will need subtitles). So, there's a level of forgiveness to
poor sound (but not distortion).
Thanks for all the help.
Ken
Charles Tomaras
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161194838.0...@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Which wireless systems have better range, and what range
> should I expect. Fortunately, there's very little interference in this
> area of Swaziland (there's not much of anything, particularly anything
> electric).
One of the drawbacks of being in the middle of nowhere is that you don't
have any reflective surfaces to help you out like buildings, roads, and all
the other stuff that our rational minds tells us should cause us problems.
The middle of nowhere is actually one of the most difficult enviornments to
get range and drop out free audio out of. The things that will help you when
working with good modern wireless systems are antenna height and raw power.
If you can find 250mW transmitters that will help (Lectrosonics makes them).
Even someone's body mass can cause problems at distance. If you can plant
the wireless transmitter on the side of thier body that is facing you, you
will get better results at long range. I think many of us have listened to
the wireless sound perfect as the subject walks away from us to get ready
for the long shot, then have them turn and face the camera (with the
transmitter on thier back) only to find that your wireless begins to take
hits and cause problems as they walk toward camera.
Martin Harrington
185 as a camera link, and my Audio RMS 14's as the 2 radios....not one
dropout in over 6 weeks of shooting in 6 countries circumnavigating the
continent, a lot of it at long range, although most were interviews and
PTC's, (shooting on Beta SP, BTW)
--
Martin Harrington
www.lendanear-sound.com
"Charles Tomaras" <tom...@tomaras.com> wrote in message
news:8sWdnRxijrbqbKvY...@comcast.com...
Charles Tomaras
"Martin Harrington" <len...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:yECZg.49629$rP1....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> The last time I recorded in Africa was in 1993/4, and I was using a lectro
> 185 as a camera link, and my Audio RMS 14's as the 2 radios....not one
> dropout in over 6 weeks of shooting in 6 countries circumnavigating the
> continent, a lot of it at long range, although most were interviews and
> PTC's, (shooting on Beta SP, BTW)
> --
> Martin Harrington
> www.lendanear-sound.com
I guess your mileage may vary! My worst nightmares have been shooting across
large fields; trying to get audio boat to boat on a body of water; in desert
like sand dune conditions; and in the middle of thick evergreen forests. But
put me in the middle of an asphalt and glass jungle and my RF seems to go on
for much further distances.
Kurt Albershardt
>
> The middle of nowhere is actually one of the most difficult enviornments to
> get range and drop out free audio out of. The things that will help you when
> working with good modern wireless systems are antenna height and raw power.
And antenna gain. If you can put a shark fin or other yagi on the RX
you can make major improvements to the overall performance.
Oleg Kaizerman
>
> The radio mics failed regularly. There was intermitant digital
> breakup. It seemed almost always to be when they were 50 or more feet
> away (shooting a group of people from a distance with a telephoto
> lens). Unfortunately, the shooting included lots of distance shots.
get more , but that depends on the what you have between reciever and
transmitter
>
> Of course, since the cinematographer was watching levels and listening
> to the mix, she was too busy to notice problems.
that's your first problem - if she was really listen then maybe she was
changing the lens and going to suitable working range
>In addition to the digital breakup, there were frequent
> problems with levels (too loud or too quiet). It didn't seem like the
> Panasonic 24p camera's limiter worked too well either.
Panasonic limiters are working well- on the digital side( after a2d) but
they don't prevent from high level clip before a2 d .
so you need external limiter or work with suitable level for camera input .
the me 66-k-6 is quite hot microphone , which need to be pad down about
10-15db if you like to stay without clipping on your input stage (
decreasing levels with camera potentiometer doesn't do anything on analog
side , so you increase or decrease already clipped signal)
if you looking for new wire less , check the lectrosonics ucr401 with lm
transmitters , - it will give you much solid signal -about 1700 us for tx/rx
incl lavalier or look for used 210/211-um 200 combo ( 1300-1700 ebay)
or cheaper 195/195 d ( run 700-800 on ebay) , single fq but excellent range
.
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
>
>
all...@verizon.net
> that's your first problem - if she was really listen then maybe she was
> changing the lens and going to suitable working range
>
> >In addition to the digital breakup, there were frequent
> > problems with levels (too loud or too quiet). It didn't seem like the
> > Panasonic 24p camera's limiter worked too well either.
>
> Panasonic limiters are working well- on the digital side( after a2d) but
> they don't prevent from high level clip before a2 d .
> so you need external limiter or work with suitable level for camera input .
> the me 66-k-6 is quite hot microphone , which need to be pad down about
> 10-15db if you like to stay without clipping on your input stage (
> decreasing levels with camera potentiometer doesn't do anything on analog
> side , so you increase or decrease already clipped signal)
>
> if you looking for new wire less , check the lectrosonics ucr401 with lm
> transmitters , - it will give you much solid signal -about 1700 us for tx/rx
> incl lavalier or look for used 210/211-um 200 combo ( 1300-1700 ebay)
> or cheaper 195/195 d ( run 700-800 on ebay) , single fq but excellent range
> Oleg
I did a little forensic work on Jane's tapes today - trying to see what
the problems really are. The big problem seems to the the automatic
level on the Panasonic 24p. It seems obvious from all the pumping and
ducking on the tapes (which often led to added crackling noise) that
this was engaged through most or all of the shooting. The audio was
highly variable - people stomping around wearing wireless lavs, dogs
barking, handling noise on the boom. All of these things made the auto
level issue a big problem.
The Panasonic manual doesn't show hardly any info about the auto level
mode. It seems that the threshold isn't adjustable, and both channels
are linked (so a problem with one mic becomes a problem with both). It
seems clear that limiting and levels need to be done at a mixer, not in
the camera. Of course, this means that a 3rd crew member is really
needed (and I may not be able to stay for the entire period of
shooting).
Also there is definately poor performance from the wireless lavs. At
reasonably short distances they cut out or crackle. It often happens
when the subject turns the belt pack away from the camera or is too far
away.
Also I don't think she was using a Sennheiser ME66. I think it's an
older model, with the small lithium battery (which we found replacement
lead acid batteries for). There's no model number on the mic (it's
black, lightweight aluminim and looks a lot like the newer ME66). It's
definately not too hot (output is far below the ATM 4043). Gain on the
camera needed to be almost pinned to get sufficient level with normal
conversation.
Last year's discussion invariable came to the conclusion that having
the camera person doing sound wasn't a good idea. The tapes prove
this. I'm sure that there cinematograhers who can handle everything at
once, but not in this case, and my wife sho is directing and doing the
interviewing is reluctant to take on the job.
Oleg Kaizerman
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161358267.9...@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
sorry - the dvx100 ( if it is the camera you was shooting with) doesn't
have automatic gain control- that is fact , the alc is a hard limiter on the
digital side , so it also can limit already distorted signal
>
> The Panasonic manual doesn't show hardly any info about the auto level
> mode. It seems that the threshold isn't adjustable,
it is not , it byte at-6dbfs and end at -4dbfs
>and both channels
> are linked (so a problem with one mic becomes a problem with both).
they are , the limiter operates as ganged ones .
> seems clear that limiting and levels need to be done at a mixer, not in
> the camera. Of course, this means that a 3rd crew member is really
> needed (and I may not be able to stay for the entire period of
> shooting).
so - you back to your first problem :-)
>
> Also there is definately poor performance from the wireless lavs. At
> reasonably short distances they cut out or crackle. It often happens
> when the subject turns the belt pack away from the camera or is too far
> away.
body blocks the signal - better wireless - grater range ,less problems
>
> Also I don't think she was using a Sennheiser ME66. I think it's an
> older model, with the small lithium battery (which we found replacement
> lead acid batteries for). There's no model number on the mic (it's
> black, lightweight aluminim and looks a lot like the newer ME66). It's
> definately not too hot (output is far below the ATM 4043). Gain on the
> camera needed to be almost pinned to get sufficient level with normal
> conversation.
looks like k-3 u +me 80, you can adjust the camera input preamp gain in the
manual ( -50,-60db , usually 50 for condensers , 60 for dynamics)
you don't need internal battery , it can work on 48ph power from your camera
or mixer
>
> Last year's discussion invariable came to the conclusion that having
> the camera person doing sound wasn't a good idea. The tapes prove
> this. I'm sure that there cinematograhers who can handle everything at
> once, but not in this case, and my wife sho is directing and doing the
> interviewing is reluctant to take on the job.
>
before you do another mistake , check the www.dvxuser.com audio section ,
it dealing allot with setup and situations you are going to work
better find local soundman , who can replace you in the days you want be
able to mix
Noah Timan
Charles Tomaras wrote:
> I guess your mileage may vary! My worst nightmares have been shooting across
> large fields; trying to get audio boat to boat on a body of water; in desert
> like sand dune conditions; and in the middle of thick evergreen forests. But
> put me in the middle of an asphalt and glass jungle and my RF seems to go on
> for much further distances.
I have a very opposite experience; of course, I believe it has more to
do with the presence of other RF sources in the asphalt and glass
jungle than the elements themselves. I did a film up in the country
this summer and I was amazed to remember/re-discover how wonderful my
wireless can be when there isn't something competing for bandwidth
every other block. I had actors in cars seemingly half a mile away and
flawless reception the whole time.
That seldom happens to me in NYC -- I just did a film here where I got
about fifty feet's worth of range (and that's being generous), with the
exact same setup, on a midtown block. (Granted, it was near Times
Square, where our theatre mixer brothers and sisters employ about
thirty 1/4 watt to full watt transmitters per show, and there's a
different theatre doing that every three buildings). Nothing like that
"uh oh" look you get from the rest of the crew when they see you with a
bag setup because you have to walk the recievers for the walk and talk
in "olde tyme" fashion.
nvt
Noah Timan
> I'm sure that there cinematograhers who can handle everything at
> once,
No, there's not.
Ken:
Sadly, while making a quality production can be done for relatively
cheap considering what it cost say, twenty years ago, it's still a far
cry from free. If you want "okay" sound, get a solid microphone and a
couple of solid wireless and a sound mixer who knows what he or she is
doing (maybe that's you) and do the best you can. If you want good or
great sound, do this with a SELECTION of good microphones and
accessories for wind and so forth, a few solid wireless with some
frequency agility, and someone who not only knows what he or she is
doing but has the courage to stop the flow of things if it's all going
to hell in a handbasket.
But all this talk of "an old ME66 that runs on lead acid batteries" and
wireless that crap out as soon as the subject moves -- in what is
assumably an uncrowded RF environment in Africa -- is not the way.
Your dailies from your last adventure have proved this to you. If
there's not enough money now to do things properly, maybe you wait a
bit until you raise more, if that's possible?
And yes, get rid of AGC and separate your channels. It can be done. I
assume you are using a DVX100 -- google it in this newsgroup for upteen
discussions about calibrating to this camera.
.02 nvt
all...@verizon.net
I couldn't agree more. That's why I'm going along on the shoot this
time (I'm the best that no money can buy), and shopping for some decent
equipment. There will definitely be a good radio lav or two, a decent
mixer and all the peripherals. I don't think our older Sennheiser
shotgun was the problem. In any case I sent them off last time with my
nice ATM 4053 with Rycote. They chose to go with the (slightly) more
directional Sennheiser. I will go and check out the DVX100 discussions
in previous posts. Thanks for all the help.
Ken
all...@verizon.net
Are the mid range and power Lectrosonics (UCR 100 and UM 400
transmitter) generally going to be good enough (instead of the UCR 401
and UM 250c)?
Can you recommend a cheap but good boom pole.
What shock mounts do you recommend. I have several versions by Audio
Technica, but I don't think it holds the mic securely enough. And the
one with the spring loaded clip makes noise when moved around.
If I buy a new shotgun, how do you feel about the Sanken CS-1? I do
have a hypercardiod ATM 4043a, is the Sanken substantially more
directional? The shortness of the mic would seem to be an advantage in
future shoots when the mic will get attached to the camera. How does
it compare in directivity to the Sennheiser MHK 60 or the Rode NTK 2?
Thanks again for all the info, I'm getting ready to make the plunge.
The perfect package is a bit of a budget buster, but it does look like
there are some compromises that will yield good equipment at reasonable
prices. I'm going to avoid buying used (at least for the mixer and
mics). I think that's asking for trouble at this (fairly last minute)
point.
Ken Winokur
Oleg Kaizerman
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161609208.6...@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>A few last questions:
>
> Are the mid range and power Lectrosonics (UCR 100 and UM 400
> transmitter) generally going to be good enough (instead of the UCR 401
> and UM 250c)?
around 70mw only)
>
> Can you recommend a cheap but good boom pole.
k-tek have aluminum poles in good price
>
> What shock mounts do you recommend. I have several versions by Audio
> Technica, but I don't think it holds the mic securely enough. And the
> one with the spring loaded clip makes noise when moved around.
http://www.trewaudio.com/store/product.php?productid=758&cat=39&page=1
http://www.mklemme.com/pole/ksm.html
check k-teck they have wide range of zeppelins and shock mounts , also have
slip on fur
>
> If I buy a new shotgun, how do you feel about the Sanken CS-1? I do
> have a hypercardiod ATM 4043a, is the Sanken substantially more
> directional?
not much more
> The shortness of the mic would seem to be an advantage in
> future shoots when the mic will get attached to the camera. How does
> it compare in directivity to the Sennheiser MHK 60 or the Rode NTK 2?
go with audio technica 4073 , exellent sound around 500 us ,not exactly
mkh -60 but much better then the rode ( and you dont need ntg 2 if you
will deside on that one, the ntg 1 is very short mic , exactly the same as
2 but without battery compartment which you dont need at all)
4073 very light , no problem to place on the camera
more sharp pattern then the sanken
check www.coffeysound .com
boom kits , they have what are you looking for in a package deal
to place the same mic on the camera take valuble time not to metion is
good to have substitut mic on location you are going
, better buy 2 one good as the 4073 and one rode which can be palced all
the time as the camera mic .
>
> Thanks again for all the info, I'm getting ready to make the plunge.
> The perfect package is a bit of a budget buster, but it does look like
> there are some compromises that will yield good equipment at reasonable
> prices. I'm going to avoid buying used (at least for the mixer and
> mics). I think that's asking for trouble at this (fairly last minute)
> point.\
quit wrong thinking - if you know who you buy from you can get much more
usifful gear for the same money
http://groups.google.com/group/sellbuyexchange-film-videoaudiogear?lnk=oa
check here , you have few nice mics for your job
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
>
> Ken Winokur
>
Noah Timan
all...@verizon.net wrote:
> A few last questions:
>
> Are the mid range and power Lectrosonics (UCR 100 and UM 400
> transmitter) generally going to be good enough (instead of the UCR 401
> and UM 250c)?
The short answer is, "depends".
> What shock mounts do you recommend. I have several versions by Audio
> Technica, but I don't think it holds the mic securely enough. And the
> one with the spring loaded clip makes noise when moved around.
AT makes a pretty standard and simple one with four crisscrossed rubber
bands and a 3/8" screw mount. That one is pretty tried and true. PSC
universal mounts have also been around forever and ain't broke.
> If I buy a new shotgun, how do you feel about the Sanken CS-1?
That's not a shotgun -- more of a hypercardioid. Generally a nice mic
though. Sanken's shotgun is the CS-3e -- much more expensive but much
more useful.
> How does
> it compare in directivity to the Sennheiser MHK 60 or the Rode NTK 2?
Its corresponding Sennheiser would be the MKH-50, not the 60. If you
have a dealer near you, you can listen to both and see what you like.
One advantage of the Sennheisers are that they are very robust -- they
have good RF shielding and generally take abuse and unpleasant weather
well. For a trip to Africa, that's a worthwhile consideration, I would
think.
> prices. I'm going to avoid buying used (at least for the mixer and
> mics). I think that's asking for trouble at this (fairly last minute)
> point.
Depends what you buy and whom you buy it from. A used mic that was
$1700 and is now half that and is in good shape is going to sound a lot
better than a brand new $500-600 budget-level entry, in my opinion.
Good luck!
all...@verizon.net
And yes, it does take Phantom 48V.
Since we're shooting lots of stuff to provide continuity with the last
shoot (same people in same locations), I think we'll stick with this
mic, even if it's not the best sounding. Same thing for the lav (they
used a Sony last time). Previous problems weren't with the mics, they
were with bad levels, brutal limiting, and radio failure.
Ken
Oleg Kaizerman
> And yes, it does take Phantom 48V.
>
> Since we're shooting lots of stuff to provide continuity with the last
> shoot (same people in same locations), I think we'll stick with this
> mic,
this is a very nice mic , I like it more then the one that replaced it ,
indeed not so hot out as other shotguns , with good mixer you will be able
get good results
the only drug is it to long for camera mounting - buy rode for that
>even if it's not the best sounding. Same thing for the lav (they
> used a Sony last time). Previous problems weren't with the mics, they
> were with bad levels, brutal limiting, and radio failure.
you can change the lavaliers for better ones , its not a problem if part of
the suff would sounds better :-)
all...@verizon.net
Ken
all...@verizon.net
Ken
all...@verizon.net
Ken
Jeff C
PSC, LECTRO, most radio mfgs... Wolf Seeburg does offer a less
expensive model... Parts to make your own avalilable on ebay...
j
G. John Garrett, C.A.S
Lots of people. Sennheiser, Lectro, Wolf Seeburg. You can get a bare antenna on
Ebay [search LPDA] and solder on the coax, build a mount, etc yourself if you like.
John
all...@verizon.net
of antennas for Lectrosonics. Several are a single wire, and one is a
diapole.
Also I was unable to find Wolf Seeberg by a Google search. Anybody
know where to find his shark fins?
Ken
Oleg Kaizerman
you intend to use more then 1 receiver -
usually external antennas wouldn't work for you if you do run and gun
documentary ( one hand on the boom , the second on the mixer ) and have no
helping hands to hold it .
better to invest in more powerful tx and good rx
http://www.wolfvid.com/
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161697744.5...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
G. John Garrett, C.A.S
> OK, I'll bite. What exactly are shark fins and yagi? I find a variety
> of antennas for Lectrosonics. Several are a single wire, and one is a
> diapole.
A shark fin is somebody's slang for a type of antenna, specifically the Log
Periodic Directional Array, or LPDA. Its a moderate-gain, broadband antenna that
can work over a very large span of frequencies, depending on how many elements
are in the antenna. A Yagi is a narrow-band multielement array consisiting of a
driven dipole element, a parasitic reflector and one or more parasitic
directors. Developed by two chaps, its actually called a Yagi-Uda, after the
inventors. I'm sure Google will tell you more.
>
> Also I was unable to find Wolf Seeberg by a Google search. Anybody
> know where to find his shark fins?
Wolf SeebUrg can be found at www.wolfvid.com.
Best,
John
all...@verizon.net
spring for the Lithium batteries (and all the peripheral equipment it
requires: charger, distribution box, cables, cup, extra battery). Or
should I just go with AA's.
It's clearly not cost effective in the short run. It's going to cost
about $800 to go with the lithium batteries for both the Sound Devices
302 and the Lectrosonic wireless (I'm only going to have one wireless).
Does anybody have any experience about how long the Lithium batteries
will last running the 302 and one wireless? How long does a set (3) of
AA's last. My experience is that a wireless needs to be changed every
day, or even more often if used for a long period (Is that true of the
Lectrosonic 400 series?).
I understand this all varies - depending on headphone volume, number of
wirless receivers etc. But I could use a ball park.
Is it a royal pain trying to keep AA's in operation?
I'm also reluctant to use disposable batteries. I am not eager to
litter the African wilderness with toxic trash.
Thanks again.
Ken
Oleg Kaizerman
which give you 12 v
usually they are about 60 w , it would last at least for 12 hours
continues work . they already comes with charger
there are rechargeable lithium's 9v which can hold for 4 hours for
transmitter - powerus - brand )
+ at least regular for 2 days work if you have some problem with
electricity around
by the way what transmitter and receiver you have ?,
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1161963382.3...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
all...@verizon.net
UCR 401 Receiver, UM400 Transmitter, 152 mic (as you all recommended).
Here's the kit I'm putting together:
Sound Devices 302
(1) Lectrosonics series 400 receiver/transmitter Lav mic
(1) Sennheiser ME88 short shotgun mic
(2) ATM 4051a cardiod mics
(1) ATM 4053a hyper cardiod capsule
Sony MDR 7506 headphones
K-Tek boom, shock & Zeppelin
Rechargable batteries for all (I guess?)
cables
Ken
Oleg Kaizerman
2 like that
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1162
1 like that
http://www.trewaudio.com/store/product.php?productid=780&cat=2&page=1
1 like that
+disposable batteries for 2-3 days work
you will need make distribution cable fro m the battery to mixer and
lectro , make the cable worth right angle connectors and on/ off switch , so
you will be able shot down both devices
so it looks like
less then 400 us for whale stuff
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1162006912.8...@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Oleg Kaizerman(gebe)
for 2 reasons , it water proof and it powered by aa batteries . or
smd
transmitter so you can run about 6-7 hours on 2 batteries ( probably
400 us
more)
so you can completely eliminate the 9v ones and buy only 1.2 ni mh
rechargeable which good for 401/302 and tx
so it would be around 250us for 3 fast charges and about 30 2500 ma
batteries ( you need about 10 -12 to run 10 hours all your stuff )+ 60
disposible AA
sdfaudio
the power (220-50) plug configurations at each "hotel" was different.
We ended up "borrowing" lamp plugs to make adaptors to power our
rechargers.
all...@verizon.net
The plan (still a little uncertain) is for us to stay at a Catholic
Mission in Swaziland. My wife stayed here the last time she was in the
country. There is power - usually only at night. She was able to
recharge her batteries then.
It is all a little uncertain. I'm sure you're right, that a supply of
alkaline's would be a good back-up.
I also think that a charging system that comes from the car battery
will be useful as a backup.
Ken
Larry Fisher
and it will run from a 12 Volt car battery. The iPower 9 Volt lithium
poly chargers will also run from 12 Volts. Pretty universal setups.
Larry F
Lectro
all...@verizon.net
me. Please forgive me if I continue to plumb you collective
intelligence.
I have been considering spending a little more to get the high power
Lectrosonics UM250c, instead of the UMC400.
But, I am hardly finding the UM250c anywhere on the web (other than
Lectrosonics web site), and nowhere as a package with the UM400
receiver. Is this a valid combination, and is this a good idea? Other
than B & H, Trew, and the Broadcast Shop where would you look for it?
Ken
Larry Fisher
250 mW units entering production, the UM450 and the SMQ. Then the
paperwork hassle with the FCC started and we are still waiting on the
final approvals. We recently have seen some forward motion and have
got the correct circularity for the dotting the i's and the proper
straightness for crossing the t's.
LarryF
Lectro
all...@verizon.net
Would you (or anyone) care to speculate on what the best block number
on the Lectro UCR 401 Receiver, UM400 Transmitter - would be for our
Swaziland shoot?
What about here in my home town of Boston (where I'm sure I'll be using
it for years to come)?
Ken Winokur
Kurt Albershardt
> As I get ready to order equipment, I'm trying to decide if I should
> spring for the Lithium batteries (and all the peripheral equipment it
> requires: charger, distribution box, cables, cup, extra battery). Or
> should I just go with AA's.
More info needed on your wireless inventory before an intelligent
decision can be made.
> Does anybody have any experience about how long the Lithium batteries
> will last running the 302 and one wireless? How long does a set (3) of
> AA's last.
My 302 will run 8-12 hours powering 1-2 AKG C460B mic bodies on a set of
2200 mAH NiMH cells. Haven't found a practical limit to running it on
Sony 7.2V lithium packs.
> I'm also reluctant to use disposable batteries. I am not eager to
> litter the African wilderness with toxic trash.
Keep a small collection on hand for backup, and/or a suitable holder for
D-cells and appropriate adapters. Also a set of 12V wiring with
clamp/clip leads to utilize a car or truck battery in an emergency.
This includes adapters/converters for your cellphone, laptop, digicam,
PDA, GPS or any other gadget you deem critical.
Nic
Contact me.I can help you with anything out here in South Africa
Nico Louw
e mail:ni...@iafrica.com
Cell +27(0)837478261
all...@verizon.net
Ken
all...@verizon.net
exactly as recommended and as I specified before. I ordered from B & H
(who had everything in stock and the same prices as everyone else).
One last question: Do you typically monitor the camera's headphone
(via the 302's monitor bus), or do you leave the camera's headphone
jack available for the DP? I'll have to buy the breakout cable with
the extra stereo line if I'm going to monitor the camera.
Here's what I'm going with:
Sound Devices 302 mixer
(1) Lectrosonics UCR 401 (Block 21)
1) Lectrosonics UM 400
(1) Lectrosonics 152 Lav mic
(1) Sennheiser ME80 short shotgun mic
(2) ATM 4051a cardiod mics
(1) ATM 4053a hyper cardiod capsule
Sony MDR 7506 headphones
K-Tek Traveler aluminum boom (6'7")
(2) Rycote Softies - for both mics
(2) AT 4815 shockmounts - with K-Tek replacement mike holding silicone
bands
One hot shoe mounting bracket for AT Shock for Panasonic DVX 100 camera
(2) 12 V computer rechargable lithium batteries (I still have to make a
cable for this)
cables for all
Still to buy - 9v rechargable batteries
By the way, my good friend and pro audio dealer here in Boston (Parsons
Audio), who couldn't get much of this stuff in time, asked where I was
getting all my information. He was impressed that I had discovered the
best of the best (sometimes slightly esoteric) equipment.
I couldn't have done this without all your help.
Best,
Ken Winokur
Oleg Kaizerman
> One last question: Do you typically monitor the camera's headphone
> (via the 302's monitor bus), or do you leave the camera's headphone
almost on every camera , make sure making 2 rca out to mini stereo jack
femail use that one , that also would leave the headphones for your dp .
make sure they use right angle rcas for that matter , the same is for
thejack mini they use .
buy barake out cable and extencion ( the cble is regullary 5 meter ), 10
meter of extention is the most handy size , when you need be furher or make
the camera enouth way to move .
ask that the camera tail would be at least 50 cm so you can secure the
cable tail on the camera handle .
another lavalier microphone would be nice for long trip- shit happence:-) -
countryman emw - shelved - is quit better then what comes with lectrosonics
pakege
dont forget buy good mixer bag - something like petrol eargonizer 1 so you
can throw in , battries ,tapes and all other shit you need for a day work
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
all...@verizon.net
We do have a backup lav (Audio Technica) - not the greatest (cardiod)
but usable in a pinch. I would like to have a backup radio - but we
couldn't afford it. There are available rentals in South Africa (only
a day's drive away), so in an emergency we can go get something.
I ordered the Sound Devices CS-3 bag. It seemed smaller and more
fitted to the package. I have some back problems, so I'm trying to
diminish the weight on my back. I'm planning to use a fanny pack for
extra batteries,mic etc. We'll be traveling by car everywhere, so
another bag in the car can hold gaff tape, extra cables, chargers,
spare mics etc.
In looking at bags I'm surprised that nobody sells a belt system. I
would think that getting the weight off your shoulders, especially
while holding a boom, would be a great advantage. I may try to do this
(or at least find a temporary clip arrangement to put some weight on my
belt). I guess the inability to to shift the bag around when you're
getting in and out of cars, around tight spaces etc. makes the belt
inconvenient.
Ken
Oleg Kaizerman
if you have the dvx 100 , dvx 100 a - you will get delayed audio from the
both outs ( rca and headphones ) while you are shooting in progressive mode.
24 p
if you have 100 b - there is monitor menu which says tape or e to e or
something similar ( camera setup , second page)
the e to e ( or direct) not effect rca outs so you still have the delay
it effects only headphone - so if you are going to monitor 100b with
return (that what i always do) don't use the rcas since you would have
echo because the outside sound penetrate your headphones , then ask the
people who make the tail for your camera make another female parallel out
for the dp headphones .
the tape position is not confidence head of any kind , just the sound comes
after a to d converter (Panasonics mee(a)nless:-))
buy better bag - the dedicated 302 from petrol much nicer product and have
hooks and could cought with harness if you will decide on that ( 30 $more
with harness)
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1162649244.0...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Martin Harrington
I carry my mixer and radios and peripherals solely by using a belt pack.
I can't stand anything over my shoulder or neck, so I've been working tat
way for years.
Any wide (3 inch) belt with a quick release will do, (army surplus??)
--
Martin Harrington
www.lendanear-sound.com
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1162649244.0...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Charles Tomaras
"Martin Harrington" <len...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:IY93h.58837$rP1....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Re the Belt system...
> I carry my mixer and radios and peripherals solely by using a belt pack.
> I can't stand anything over my shoulder or neck, so I've been working tat
> way for years.
> Any wide (3 inch) belt with a quick release will do, (army surplus??)
> --
> Martin Harrington
> www.lendanear-sound.com
I've yet to find a belt that can handle a 30lb bag with multiple RF in and
out, IFB etc. You must have an awfully streamlined setup.
Martin Harrington
attached to the belt and mixer..works very well.
If I have the mixer on for hours on end I'll switch to a harness, but that's
not very often.
--
Martin Harrington
www.lendanear-sound.com
"Charles Tomaras" <tom...@tomaras.com> wrote in message
news:kLKdnVPCJqzHqNDY...@comcast.com...
all...@verizon.net
shooting with. It does indeed have a delay in the 24p progressive mode
(which we will be shooting with). So, I guess I'll be monitoring the
mixer.
Which of the Petrol harnesses do you recommend. Can you add a simple
belt to the more minimal one?
I've been looking for Portabrace loops (I assume that is the attachment
to the belt that I can hook a Petrol bag to), but don't find them
anywhere on the web. Are they called something else officially? I'm
thinking that if I exchange the CS3 Sound Devices case for the Petrol
302, I can find some way to attach the case to a belt (as well as
either the harness or neck strap).
It's been a pretty interesting to try to arrange a whole audio kit, and
getting ready for an important job by looking at the internet,
equipment catalogs, and newsgroups. I get the equipment in a day or
two and have more than a month to work with it and fine tune.
Thanks again.
Oleg Kaizerman
<all...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1162830041....@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> More invaluable information! I got out the DVX 100a we're going to be
> shooting with. It does indeed have a delay in the 24p progressive mode
> (which we will be shooting with). So, I guess I'll be monitoring the
> mixer.
>
> Which of the Petrol harnesses do you recommend. Can you add a simple
> belt to the more minimal one?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=11402&A=details&Q=&sku=365903&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation
that what iam working with
sorry , never used a belt
by the way when you hook the mixer , attenuate mixer output for 4 db(
internal menu) , then calibrate the came 0 dbu for -20 dbfs ( the e 4th
white line )
put the limiter around +14-16 dbu (internal menu)
for the 411
maximize the ton to +5 dbu
set the mixer for line level
close the input limiter, set the output limiter to +20 dbu
place the fader on 12 o'clock
turn the input to left or right ( that adds 3 db to input signal)
open the preamp gain till you will get full 20 dbu signal ,all the leds
on 302 are on ( the end stop when the limiter led is glowing)
if the distortion led is glowing go back and open the fader more .
adjust the receiver back 3-4 db since accidental picks can go over the
+5dbu ( from 5 to 2)
make your input and output limiter adjustments in the way you like ( I place
my about +16 dbu)
for mic level is the same only you go back from -30 to -33
now you cant distort your mixer input what ever signal comes from your
transmitter
when you calibrate the tx , the normal conversation the second green led
need to glow
best
sdfaudio
about 5 min.s to fiqure out an unfamilar cam and many times the camera
op hasn't a clue about switching mic/ine AGC, ect.
I was in Swaziland about 12yr.s ago. It was paradise.... compared to
Mozambique.
Best regards and keep us undated on your project.
all...@verizon.net
ago). Now I need to make some cables to connect the lithium battery to
Sound Devices 302 and the Lectrosonics UCR400. Two questions:
1) Anybody know the plug size of the DC plug going into the UCR400?
It's the same as the battery output plug
2) Can anybody recommend a good cablemaker (who works reasonably
quickly - I've got 3 weeks still). I don't want to deal with soldering
these fussy little connectors.
Thanks again.
Ken
André Boisvert
Oleg Kaizerman(gebe)
all...@verizon.net כתב:
look for right angle 5.5/ 2.1 6 feet cord
alwais make at least 2
all...@verizon.net
Great, that confirms what I thought (I've been matching plugs from an
adapter pack that came with the battery, but it's hard to tell which
one is which.
Thanks,
Ken
Larry Fisher
site. Sorry about that.
LarryF
Lectro
G. John Garrett, C.A.S
Hi Ken,
I'm guessing your lithium battery is an NP1 style. I'd get a battery cup for it
and the Remote Audio BDS box with the cables already made up. I dorked around
for years building my own DC cables but the BDS really works great.
John
all...@verizon.net
less than a third the price of the NP1 and BDS. I don't have to
transform the voltage of the battery (so don't need the BDS). The only
issue is cables.
Here's the link for the battery:
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1642
Trew audio is going to make the cables for me. I'm not sure what
they'll cost (probably most of what I saved).
It occurred to me (too late) that I should have gone with the batteries
we'll be using for the Panasonic camera. That way there would have
been more as a backup (both for audio and the camera). Oh well...
Ken
all...@verizon.net
carried a variety of electronics on planes over the last few years, but
nothing so suspicious and enigmatic as a radio transmitter and
receiver. Are people getting by with this stuff on planes?
I read in previous posts that the boom pole is potentially a problem.
I'll pack that in the checked luggage (I bought the K-Tek Economy
Traveler - which is only 19" when collapsed, so easily packed).
I hate to risk the loss of all that gear on the way to an important
shoot, not to mention letting the airline gorillas handle my fragile
stuff.
Ken