Full Metal Jacket (Reprise) 1987

[Mack A. Damia]

R. Lee Ermey was a former Marine drill instructor who was hired as a
consultant by Kubrick for the section on basic training. Ermey
persuaded Kubrick to let him play the role himself, and he ad libbed
most of the dialogue.

Takes me back to the days of my basic training and Sgt. Hartman even
resembled my drill instructor, Sgt. Geyer, in basic.

I recall when we were marching in formation that he'd say, "Yer
bouncing".

Question:

Happens at the 13:25 point into the film. Right after the barracks
scene where they are marching with their rifles and singing, "This is
my rifle, this is my gun. This is for fighting, this is for fun!"

Scene shifts to parade ground where they are marching in formation.
Hartman almost sings his commands (maybe about eight to ten words)
then says "yer bouncing" - and then seems to repeat himself in a kind
of lyrical way.

Scene shifts to troops climbing ropes on the obstacle course.

Does anybody know what he is saying?

[tomcervo]

Don't know--subtitles help?
BTW, someone noted that Ermey's dialogue is largely taken from
Hasford's novel. Ermey was hired at first to provide a model for the
actor playing Hartman, but got the part after Kubrick saw him read the
lines on tape. His main adlib came in the middle of a very long take;
he got lost and used something of his own. Kubrick, usually wary about
improv, was grateful that the take was saved, then asked him what "a
reacharound" was. Ermey told him and they kept it in.

[Mack A. Damia]

Funny! I first saw FMJ when I was teaching in Nassau, Bahamas in the
1980s. There was a video rental store, and I had to ask my housemate
what a "reacharound" was.

I can understand all of his commands except this one brief scene where
Sgt. Hartman almost sings this command and then sys, "Yer bouncing".

[Michael OConnor]

From how I understood it, Ermey was hired to be a Technical Advisor on
the film, as they had already hired a different actor to play the
Drill Instructor role and Ermey was going to work with him to make him
like a DI. But Kurbrick asked Ermey to demonstrate a Drill Instructor
screaming and yelling and cussing (just to get an idea what it is
like) and Ermey went onto a 30 minute rant without stopping once, or
repeating himself at all, and Kubrick decided to give him the Drill
Instructor role and the actor he had already hired he gave him a
different part.

[Mack A. Damia]

That's exactly what Robert Osborne said after the film.

I knerw he was a former USMC drill instructor, but I didn't know the
details of his hiring for the part.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Wed, 07 Dec 2011 19:48:25 -0800, Mack A. Damia
<mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:


>Takes me back to the days of my basic training and Sgt. Hartman even
>resembled my drill instructor, Sgt. Geyer, in basic.

> "yer bouncing"

>Does anybody know what he is saying?

I'm not the only one who wonders, but it's more than cadence - or
whatever he says is said in cadence.

Q. "What do you call it when Hartman is singing but he's not really
singing words? One example is when they are marching and he goes
"You're bouncing."

A. It's commonly known in the service as "cadence." Hartmann was
calling cadence.

http://www.0x61.com/forum/post1970219.html

But what is he saying? It's quite lyrical. Nobody have the film?
Happens about the 13:25 mark.
--

[Halmyre]

I think, in the context of Emery's rant, it's surely not too difficult
to work out what "reacharound" means! Perhaps Kubrick led too much of
a sheltered life?

--
Halmyre

[Mack A. Damia]

Some of us don't live in the gutter.

[Pjk]

> Some of us don't live in the gutter.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I have a copy and if I remember I'll try to find the part and listen
to it...this weekend.

Pjk

[Mack A. Damia]

As I said, it occurs about 13:25, and Sgt. Hartman almost sings the
command in a lyrical way. Just wonder what the command is.

His words are very difficult to discern but pleasant to listen to. The
background music picks up on the way he lyrically gives the command or
cadence.

[Halmyre]

I'd never heard the expression myself, but luckily I'm fairly
intelligent and could work it out for myself.

--
Halmyre

[tomcervo]

On Dec 9, 1:29 am, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Dec 2011 20:22:18 -0800 (PST), Michael OConnor
>

He'd been a technical adviser for "Apocalypse Now". He's also clearly
visible as one of the helo pilots in the air cav attack for about two
seconds.

[tomcervo]

On Dec 9, 1:29 am, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Dec 2011 20:22:18 -0800 (PST), Michael OConnor
>

The way Alexander Walker--a close friend of Kubrick--explains it in
one of his books, he saw Ermey's tape and recognized him as a
"natural" actor. Within his range, he nails it.

[tomcervo]

Kubrick was the last man to "work out" or guess an answer when he had
an expert to hand. Look up the "Napoleon" book which compiles his
research for that project.

[Mack A. Damia]

It's a gay term, eh?

Wouldn't know a thing about their sexual practices and don't care to.

True story: one of my best friends is gay. I knew him in Vietnam,
but, of course, he was "in the closet" in the military.

We get together for brunch occasionally, and I do all the driving.
When I have an encounter with a bad diver I will growl, "co*ksucker!"

I wasn't thinking, and I said it once whilke he was a passenger. He
said to me, "You know, all gays are good cocksu*kers."

I wasn't certain if he was suggesting something or not, but I didn't
pursue the subject.

[Halmyre]

On Dec 9, 7:56 pm, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Dec 2011 11:03:18 -0800 (PST), Halmyre
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Can't imagine that all gays are good cocksuckers any more than all
women are good cocksuckers.

Maybe he was pulling your chain? (That's not a euphemism, by the
way...)

--
Halmyre

[Mack A. Damia]

You have to know him. He was being very serious with me. I really
couldn't tell you if he is accurate - like you, I tend to think not,
but my friend has some strange ideas about things. I don't argue with
him because I enjoy his friendship. I've known him since 1968.

[Etal]

This is pretty much how Lee Ermey himself and others describes it
in the interesting 30 minute 2007 feature, "Full Metal Jacket:
Between Good and Evil", present on my DVD-release of the movie.

He was initially hired as a tech advisor for the actor hired as
the DI but also for the soldier-actors in general.


--
"Got a phonecall from Stanley Kubrick out of the clear blue one
evening. And we talked about Full Metal Jacket."

[Etal]

poisoned rose wrote:

> That guy has built quite a second-phase career for himself. He
> just *owns* that role. I wonder if any other drill instructors
> are trying to follow his lead -- I'm not aware of any.
>

I bought it on DVD just the other week, and watching got thinking
about Drill Instructors in movies. Good and_or bad.

Lou Gossett in an officer and a Gentlemen..
Clint preparing a bunch of slackers to invade Granada ..
G.I. Jane .. was there a particular DI for her or was she just
bullied by all and everybody during her training?
I remember liking Belouxi Blues or something but i don't remember
the specifics, so i guess the trainees DI in that one didn't make
much of an impression.

What about DI's in older movies, about older wars?

All's quiet on the .. yeah, i think he got what he deserves.

But, I guess Ermey's DI Hartman wins hands down as the meanest
baddest movie DI, right? And being a former 'the real thing' no less.


--
"Because i am hard, you will not like me.
But the more you hate me, the more you will learn."

[Etal]

Subtitles: English

first nothing show (during the first chant)
You're bouncing.
then nothing show again (during the second chant)


Subtitles: English for the hearing impaired

[HARTMAN CHANTING]
You're bouncing.
[HARTMAN CHANTING]


So "You're bouncing." is subtitled, but there is no help from the
subtitles for the rest of what he /says/ during the marching.


--
"There ain't one swinging-dick private
in this platoon's gonna graduate..."

[notbob]

On 2011-12-10, Etal <lo...@sig.bcause.this.is.invalid> wrote:

> What about DI's in older movies, about older wars?

The DI, starring Jack Webb.

Lotta ppl posting, here, have no idea of what a drill instructor is
all about. Their job is to break you. Break you down, break yer
will, break yer spirit, individuality, break you of any resistance.
After yer broke, they recreate you.

Our DI was an asshole. After about 6 wks we discovered it was him they
were talking about on the radio.

"This Sunday!.... Big Daddy Rabbit in his supercharded Ford Falcon"

Yep. Turned out our DI was a local hero at the local San Antonio drag
racing circuit. But, by time we learned this, we were already broke
and well on our way to being good lil' soldiers. ;)

nb

[Mack A. Damia]

Thanks for your help. I would not have thought that the subtitles
would have what he is saying other then, "You're bouncing!". Did you
watch and listen? Could you make anything out? I think it's almost
impossible.

[tomcervo]

On Dec 10, 1:15 am, notbob <not...@nothome.com> wrote:

George MacDonald Fraser writing about FMJ said that if the training
sequences were accurate depictions, the intended end-product must have
been homicidal lunatics.

[tomcervo]

Somewhere the story of how his taped rant was punctuated by off-screen
tennis balls being thrown at him--to demonstrate his concentration--
comes in.

[Mack A. Damia]

"Lemme see your killer face!"

[Captain Infinity]

Once Upon A Time,

tomcervo wrote:

>George MacDonald Fraser writing about FMJ said that if the training
>sequences were accurate depictions, the intended end-product must have
>been homicidal lunatics.

Well the drill instructor does say he hopes to turn them into that guy who
killed Kennedy from that book suppository building.


**
Captain Infinity

[Mack A. Damia]

You got that wrong.

He asks them who Charles Whitmas was; then, he asks them who Lee
Harvey Oswald was.

After the answers, he says they were both marines and trained to shoot
straight. You're twisting his words.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 10 Dec 2011 11:23:43 -0800, Mack A. Damia
<mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:


>He asks them who Charles Whitmas

Typo:

Charles Joseph Whitman (June 24, 1941 – August 1, 1966) was a student
at the University of Texas at Austin and a former Marine who killed 16
people and wounded 32 others during a shooting rampage on and around
the university's campus on August 1, 1966.

[Heynonny]

On 2011-12-09 14:29:22 -0500, tomcervo <paradi...@gmail.com> said:

> he saw Ermey's tape and recognized him as a
> "natural" actor. Within his range, he nails it.

Doesn't that describe many popular, well-thought-of "movie stars"?

A director's sole guidance is frequently "Just speak your lines, and
know that I have cast you correctly."

[Captain Infinity]

Once Upon A Time,

Oh, was I? How odd. That's the sort of thing I would *never* want to do.


**
Captain Infinity
..."Quis trolliet ipsos trollerizum?"

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 10 Dec 2011 06:56:17 -0800 (PST), tomcervo
<paradi...@gmail.com> wrote:

Have you been through basic training? I can appreciate the marines'
experiences even though went through air foces basic in San Antonio.
It was six weeks rather than the marines' eight.

It was very strict. Your time was accounted for minute-by-minute. I
can't identify with Sgt. Hartman's physical abuse of Private Pyle; I
thnk he would have just washed out (military terminology). Also, I
can't identify with Hartman's abuse of his troop especially the
language he used. Our DI was straightforward - you did this, and you
did it this way. No obscenities.

Closet I came to abuse was when I forgot to button up my fly. He saw
me and said, "button your fly, baby!"

Other than that, it was pretty close. Marching in formation, obstacle
course, PT, inspections, rifle range. Our drill instuctor had his own
room in our barracks. I seem to remember that we had the second floor
of a two story building.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 10 Dec 2011 14:45:45 -0500, Captain Infinity

<Infi...@captaininfinity.us> wrote:

>Once Upon A Time,
>Mack A. Damia wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 10 Dec 2011 14:14:46 -0500, Captain Infinity
>><Infi...@captaininfinity.us> wrote:
>>
>>>Once Upon A Time,
>>>tomcervo wrote:
>>>
>>>>George MacDonald Fraser writing about FMJ said that if the training
>>>>sequences were accurate depictions, the intended end-product must have
>>>>been homicidal lunatics.
>>>
>>>Well the drill instructor does say he hopes to turn them into that guy who
>>>killed Kennedy from that book suppository building.
>>
>>You got that wrong.
>>
>>He asks them who Charles Whitmas was; then, he asks them who Lee
>>Harvey Oswald was.
>>
>>After the answers, he says they were both marines and trained to shoot
>>straight. You're twisting his words.
>
>Oh, was I? How odd. That's the sort of thing I would *never* want to do.

He doesn't say, "I want to turn you into that guy who killed Kennedy."

That's my point. He uses Whitman and Oswald as examples of expert
sharpshooters.

[notbob]

On 2011-12-10, Mack A Damia <mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> It was six weeks rather than the marines' eight.

When I was at Lackland, in '66, the war was really gearing up and we
were there for 24 days. We did the obstacle course only once and it
was the only fun we had. We actually asked to do it again. After
basic, I went straight to tech school at Chanute AFB in IL. We had
more personal freedom, but it was waaaay stricter than basic. We
couldn't even send our fatigues to the laundry. We had to
wash/starch/iron them ourselves and they had to be board stiff and
PERFECT. Made basic seem like a vacation.

nb

--
eschew obfuscation

[Mack A. Damia]

When were you there? I was there in July, 1966. We had a lot of red
flag days, so we stayed in the barracks. Flight 1634, 3703 Squadron.
It was definietely six weeks as I have a diary. I enlisted with a buddy
from high school.

I went to Chanute, too - must have been in late August, 1966. Yes, it
was far stricter because of the "ropes" - fucking little Hitlers that
they were. I had my run ins with them. We had to get up even earlier
than basic - 4 am, as I recall - get in formation - inspection - march
to breakfast - back to the barracks - clean up - march to classes.

Remember Rantoul? And they used to call a cereal "Chanutees" or
something like that, because they sucked (the milk). Can't remember
properly. I didn't hang around too long. Decided I didn't like it and
told them as much. They sent me to Charleston AFB where I eventually
crosstrained at Shepherd AFB, Texas, but I had two stripes by then, so I
didn't have to put up with the BS the one stripers had to. Shared a
room with two guys, drove to school - no curfew - pretty much on our
own.

[Etal]

Mack A. Damia wrote:

> Etal wrote:
>
>> Mack A. Damia wrote:
>>

>>>
>>> But what is he saying? It's quite lyrical. Nobody have
>>> the film? Happens about the 13:25 mark.
>>
>> Subtitles: English
>>

>> Subtitles: English for the hearing impaired
>>
>> [HARTMAN CHANTING] You're bouncing. [HARTMAN CHANTING]
>>
>>
>> So "You're bouncing." is subtitled, but there is no help
>> from the subtitles for the rest of what he /says/ during the
>> marching.
>
> Thanks for your help. I would not have thought that the
> subtitles would have what he is saying other then, "You're
> bouncing!". Did you watch and listen? Could you make
> anything out? I think it's almost impossible.
>

Most of the actual worlds of what Hartman and the recruits shouts
and sings during training, including during the exercise
sequences, are spelled out in the subtitles with the above as an
exception.

No, i can't make out what if anything he actually sings in this
sequence. Can it be just word-like nonsense, like talking in
tongues, something to keep the rhythm for their marching?


--
Nah-ah. I'm staying out of this. ... Now, here's my opinion.

[Mack A. Damia]

Even if it's sounds nonsensical, it usually means something.

Take the command, "Attention" - which is turned into, "Ten-Huh".

Also sounds as though he's used to saying whatever he's singing.

Can't find the script, either - probably wouldn't help.

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

On Wednesday, December 7, 2011 8:48:25 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> R. Lee Ermey was a former Marine drill instructor who was hired as a
> consultant by Kubrick for the section on basic training. Ermey
> persuaded Kubrick to let him play the role himself, and he ad libbed
> most of the dialogue.
>

> Takes me back to the days of my basic training and Sgt. Hartman even
> resembled my drill instructor, Sgt. Geyer, in basic.
>

> I recall when we were marching in formation that he'd say, "Yer
> bouncing".
>
> Question:
>
> Happens at the 13:25 point into the film. Right after the barracks
> scene where they are marching with their rifles and singing, "This is
> my rifle, this is my gun. This is for fighting, this is for fun!"
>
> Scene shifts to parade ground where they are marching in formation.
> Hartman almost sings his commands (maybe about eight to ten words)
> then says "yer bouncing" - and then seems to repeat himself in a kind
> of lyrical way.
>
> Scene shifts to troops climbing ropes on the obstacle course.
>

> Does anybody know what he is saying?

I'm presuming you checked the quotes on imdb? They have several of the "marching songs" as they call them. I didn't see "you're bouncing", but the "rifle/gun" one is in there.

[Mack A. Damia]

Thanks, but I don't think it appears in the "Quotes". "Bouncing" is
an incorrect way to march; it's kind of contagious, and you start
bouncing off the ground rather than "Heel - toe"

Sgt. Hartman was correcting them as he was lyrically givng this
command or saying some kind of cadence rhyme. He interrupts himself
to tell them that they are bouncing. I'd like to know what the
command or cadence is.

[tomcervo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liGN6wXyoHM&feature=fvwrel

Scary thing? it sounds more natural this way.

[Etal]

notbob wrote:

> Etal wrote:
>
>> What about DI's in older movies, about older wars?
>
> The DI, starring Jack Webb.
>
> Lotta ppl posting, here, have no idea of what a drill
> instructor is all about. Their job is to break you. Break
> you down, break yer will, break yer spirit, individuality,
> break you of any resistance. After yer broke, they recreate
> you.
>
> Our DI was an asshole.

I'm not watching or interested in many reality shows
(I do like _Survivor_ ) but i think my favorite is

*SAS Selection: are you tough enough?*

Impressed by many of the participants, and while remembering that
they are there voluntarily and that they can quit at any time - I
like to, from the comfort of my chair, sit and strongly dislike
Sgt. Eddie Stone during each episode. Also i like the premise for
what the reward is for the winner, in that the journey of
participating/enduring really is the reward.


--
I'm only in it for the money.

[Mack A. Damia]

This doesn't show the scene where he says, "You're bouncing", German
or English.

[Halmyre]

Considering he's giving them a reprimand, he's very laid back about
it!

--
Halmyre

[Mack A. Damia]

What would you expect him to do? Stop the formation and scream at
them? They don't realize that they're doing it; it's an unconscious
tendency that is contagious among marching formations. They only
needed to be reminded.

I don't think you served five minutes in the military, but you know
ALL about military life don't you?

[Halmyre]

Hartmann doesn't seem to have any qualms abouscreaming at them at any
other time, why stop now?

>
> I don't think you served five minutes in the military, but you know
> ALL about military life don't you?

Don't start playing the "you weren't in the military" card with me,
chum. I was making a jokey comment about Hartmann, a fictional
character in a fictionalised account of army life. I comment on
westerns, spy thrillers, police movies and science fiction films, but
I've never been a cowboy or a secret agent or a policeman or an
astronaut from the future.

--
Halmyre

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

On Sunday, December 11, 2011 7:23:21 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Sun, 11 Dec 2011 17:47:21 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"
> <Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >On Wednesday, December 7, 2011 8:48:25 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:

> >> Happens at the 13:25 point into the film. Right after the barracks

> >I'm presuming you checked the quotes on imdb? They have several of the "marching songs" as they call them. I didn't see "you're bouncing", but the "rifle/gun" one is in there.
>
> Thanks, but I don't think it appears in the "Quotes". "Bouncing" is
> an incorrect way to march;

Yeah, I know. I was in basic at Lackland (early 80s). I was the only one in my squad that *didn't* bounce (hey, the entire family is military - all branches).

it's kind of contagious, and you start
> bouncing off the ground rather than "Heel - toe"

I used to watch others starting, but I didn't (fortunately, Caramante and Burdett did not like the tall ones, and I was one of them).

> Sgt. Hartman was correcting them as he was lyrically givng this
> command or saying some kind of cadence rhyme. He interrupts himself
> to tell them that they are bouncing. I'd like to know what the
> command or cadence is.

I can vaguely recall the scene you mean. I'll have to see if I can find our copy, and check the time you gave. Odds are, if you don't know it, I probably don't either.

[Mack A. Damia]

Well then why don't you re-write the fucking script, sweetheart?

>Don't start playing the "you weren't in the military" card with me,
>chum. I was making a jokey comment about Hartmann, a fictional
>character in a fictionalised account of army life. I comment on
>westerns, spy thrillers, police movies and science fiction films, but
>I've never been a cowboy or a secret agent or a policeman or an
>astronaut from the future.

If you were in the military you would know that your DI wouldn't
scream at you while you were marching in formation. It just isn't
done.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 12:04:51 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"

I think they were called T-Is in Lackland (Technical Instructors?) Am
I remembering that correctly? I was there in July 1966. Most of the
country was experiencing a nasty heatwave - temps over 100*F. We had
quite a few red flag days where we spent our time in the barracks.

I don't ever recall our TI singling anybody out for "bouncing". He
would just tell us all as we were marching. I really enjoyed marching
in formation; there was something about it - I can't put my finger on
it - but everybody in the flight performing in unison.

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

On Monday, December 12, 2011 1:58:52 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 12:04:51 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"

> >I can vaguely recall the scene you mean. I'll have to see if I can find our copy, and check the time you gave. Odds are, if you don't know it, I probably don't either.
>
> I think they were called T-Is in Lackland (Technical Instructors?) Am
> I remembering that correctly?

Well, they were when I was there, and both of my TIs were supposed to be part of the "Lackland Ladies Club" (which it took me a while to figure out was a lesbian group, sort of an open secret).

I was there in July 1966.

June/July of 81 here.

Most of the
> country was experiencing a nasty heatwave - temps over 100*F. We had
> quite a few red flag days where we spent our time in the barracks.

It was Black Flag by the time I was there, and we had about 10 Black Flag days. Red Flag just meant we were to be cautious and careful, but we still did PT early in the day.

> I don't ever recall our TI singling anybody out for "bouncing".

I don't recall that about "bouncing", but man did they have it in for one of the girls. They called her "little piggy" and made her the runner (to stop traffic on cross streets). She didn't do well. She got sent to the recovery squadron, and went through again, with different TIs and did very well.

He
> would just tell us all as we were marching. I really enjoyed marching
> in formation; there was something about it - I can't put my finger on
> it - but everybody in the flight performing in unison.

Almost gave ya chills, didn't it? I would feel sort of choked up when we were all doing things correctly.

[Captain Infinity]

Once Upon A Time,
Mack A. Damia wrote:

>I really enjoyed marching
>in formation; there was something about it - I can't put my finger on
>it - but everybody in the flight performing in unison.

Did the skill come in handy when engaging the enemy?


**
Captain Infinity

[Mack A. Damia]

In that it instilled discipline in us, the answer is, "yes".

HTH.
--

[Mack A. Damia]

On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 13:50:37 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"
<Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:


>It was Black Flag by the time I was there, and we had about 10 Black Flag days. Red Flag just meant we were to be cautious and careful, but we still did PT early in the day.

You started me wondering if I had that right. I thought it was a
yellow - red flag system. Yellow meant that we could go outside, but
PT and drill were limited. Red meant that we stayed indoors.

I checked online and found this about the USMC:

"In 1956, after nearly 400 heat
casualties and one death (Figure 1-12),25(chap9) MCRD,
Parris Island, initiated use of the “red flag” system to
control heat casualties. Whenever the temperature,
humidity, or both reached dangerous levels, a red flag
was posted at various locations across the base. Drill
instructors ceased all training and moved recruits out
of the sun." (Page 17)

Can't find out anything about the system at Lackland (although there
is an interesting section - begins on page 19. Great photos!). Check
out Figure 1-20 on page 22. Thta's exactly how I remember our
barracks.

http://www.bordeninstitute.army.mil/published_volumes/recruit_medicine/rm-ch01.pdf

I'm fairly certain it was the yellow-red flag system back in the
1960s.

>Almost gave ya chills, didn't it? I would feel sort of choked up when we were all doing things correctly.

Those who have never experienced it missed the boat. It's amazing how
much discipline was instilled in us during those days and weeks.
Certainly helped me through life after I was discharged.

[notbob]

On 2011-12-13, Mack A Damia <mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Can't find out anything about the system at Lackland....

I don't recall any flag system at Lackland in '66. I do remember it
being hotter than I'd ever experience during the end of May and
though June.

We arrived from the West Coast, where I had never experienced any
humidity to speak of. We stepped off an air condidtion Continantal
jet into barely dawn humidity that almost took my breath away. It
wasn't even light and it was like a sauna. Within two days, almost
every recruit had a large triangular blister on their chest where the
open collared fatigues and v-neck t-shirts allow that blazinig orb to
sun burn one and all. I grew up in the CA Central Valley, so know
what 110F heat was, but that humidity liked ta' kill me.

nb


--
eschew obfuscation

[Mack A. Damia]

On 13 Dec 2011 02:41:06 GMT, notbob <not...@nothome.com> wrote:

>On 2011-12-13, Mack A Damia <mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Can't find out anything about the system at Lackland....
>
>I don't recall any flag system at Lackland in '66. I do remember it
>being hotter than I'd ever experience during the end of May and
>though June.

It wasn't something that was widely known as I seem to remember. There
were no actual flags, but it was taken for granted that when the
temperature was over, say, 90 it was "yellow" and over 95, it was
"red". More of a "condition" than a flag system, methinks.

>We arrived from the West Coast, where I had never experienced any
>humidity to speak of. We stepped off an air condidtion Continantal
>jet into barely dawn humidity that almost took my breath away. It
>wasn't even light and it was like a sauna. Within two days, almost
>every recruit had a large triangular blister on their chest where the
>open collared fatigues and v-neck t-shirts allow that blazinig orb to
>sun burn one and all. I grew up in the CA Central Valley, so know
>what 110F heat was, but that humidity liked ta' kill me.

There was a bad heat wave covering much of the nation in June/July,
1966. In addition, there was an airline strike. I enlisted with a
high school buddy, and we reported to Philadelphia for induction, and
then they put us on the train. I think we went from Philadelphia to
St. Louis and then to San Antonio. On the second and longest leg, we
had "sleepers", and we had some kind of vouchers to eat with in the
dining car. Funny enough, I don't remember the heat at Lackland,
although I know it was hot!
--

[notbob]

On 2011-12-13, Mack A Damia <mybaco...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> There was a bad heat wave covering much of the nation in June/July,
> 1966. In addition, there was an airline strike.

Yep. I was at Chanute AFB in IL during july/aug '66. Made Lackland
look like a tropical isle. How can it be 102% humidity!? I almost
drowned on a flightline!!

> then they put us on the train. I think we went from Philadelphia to
> St. Louis and then to San Antonio.

I went from Chanute to Phoenix on a "local" train, also passing thru
St Lou. Couldn't seem to hook up with that express with a club car.
A single coach and two mail cars. Stopped at every station with two
milk cans or a coke machine out front. The cold chicken box lunches
were pretty good, though.


nb

[Mack A. Damia]

When I left Lackland, I flew to Chicago on a jet, and we must have
connected on a flight to Champaign–Urbana, and then a bus to Rantoul.
My memory is hazy on the actual route, but it was the first time I had
flown on a jet. When I was about eight years old in 1955, a neighbor
paid for his daughter, my sister and I to go up in a Piper Cub or
something similar for a fifteen minute flight. I was scared to death.
I think it was $2.00 each. First time flying.

[Captain Infinity]

Once Upon A Time,
Mack A. Damia wrote:

>Yellow meant that we could go outside, but
>PT and drill were limited. Red meant that we stayed indoors.
>
>I checked online and found this about the USMC:
>
>"In 1956, after nearly 400 heat
>casualties and one death (Figure 1-12),25(chap9) MCRD,
>Parris Island, initiated use of the “red flag” system to
>control heat casualties. Whenever the temperature,
>humidity, or both reached dangerous levels, a red flag
>was posted at various locations across the base. Drill
>instructors ceased all training and moved recruits out
>of the sun." (Page 17)

Red Flag meant that it was hot. Like Africa hot. Even Tarzan couldn't
take that kind of hot.


**
Captain Infinity

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

On Monday, December 12, 2011 7:16:13 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 13:50:37 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"
> <Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> >It was Black Flag by the time I was there, and we had about 10 Black Flag days. Red Flag just meant we were to be cautious and careful, but we still did PT early in the day.

> Can't find out anything about the system at Lackland (although there
> is an interesting section - begins on page 19. Great photos!).

Colors, temperature readings, hazard explanations and work-rest requirements are:

White flag
78-81.9 ˚F
Easy work


Green flag
82-84.9 ˚F


Yellow flag
85-87.9 ˚F


Red flag
88-89.9 ˚F


Black flag
>90 ˚F

snipped out the work limitations and work to rest ratios.


from:

http://www.lackland.af.mil/news/story_print.asp?id=123253859

Check
> out Figure 1-20 on page 22. Thta's exactly how I remember our
> barracks.

Our barracks had a few less supporting posts, but otherwise very similar.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 14:51:03 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"

<Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Monday, December 12, 2011 7:16:13 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
>> On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 13:50:37 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"
>> <Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> >It was Black Flag by the time I was there, and we had about 10 Black Flag days. Red Flag just meant we were to be cautious and careful, but we still did PT early in the day.
>
>> Can't find out anything about the system at Lackland (although there
>> is an interesting section - begins on page 19. Great photos!).
>
>Colors, temperature readings, hazard explanations and work-rest requirements are:
>
>White flag

>78-81.9 ?F
>Easy work
>
>
>Green flag
>82-84.9 ?F
>
>
>Yellow flag
>85-87.9 ?F
>
>
>Red flag
>88-89.9 ?F
>
>
>Black flag
>>90 ?F

>
>snipped out the work limitations and work to rest ratios.
>
>
>from:
>
>http://www.lackland.af.mil/news/story_print.asp?id=123253859
>
> Check
>> out Figure 1-20 on page 22. Thta's exactly how I remember our
>> barracks.
>
>Our barracks had a few less supporting posts, but otherwise very similar.

I also remember a small container on the wall just by the door that
contained salt tablets, and we were required (supposed to) take six
tablets per day in multiples of two. They were pink about the size of
an aspirin.

I think that changed, but I really don't know if and when. I think
it became known that too much salt was dangerous, too.

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

Only the number you took. I think it was 4 a day, unless you perspired alot, then you took 5 or 6. They weren't pink either, they were white, but that doesn't mean much <grin>.

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

On Wednesday, December 7, 2011 8:48:25 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> R. Lee Ermey was a former Marine drill instructor who was hired as a
> consultant by Kubrick for the section on basic training. Ermey
> persuaded Kubrick to let him play the role himself, and he ad libbed
> most of the dialogue.
>
> Takes me back to the days of my basic training and Sgt. Hartman even
> resembled my drill instructor, Sgt. Geyer, in basic.
>
> I recall when we were marching in formation that he'd say, "Yer
> bouncing".
>
> Question:
>

> Happens at the 13:25 point into the film. Right after the barracks

> scene where they are marching with their rifles and singing, "This is
> my rifle, this is my gun. This is for fighting, this is for fun!"
>
> Scene shifts to parade ground where they are marching in formation.
> Hartman almost sings his commands (maybe about eight to ten words)
> then says "yer bouncing" - and then seems to repeat himself in a kind
> of lyrical way.
>
> Scene shifts to troops climbing ropes on the obstacle course.
>
> Does anybody know what he is saying?

Okay, having watched the scene twice (and having hubby watch it once)... Basically, he's saying the "yer left, yer left, yer left, right, left" with what I tend to call a modified yodel (because I don't know how else to describe it), so it sounds like he is saying other words. Or so that's how my ears hear it.

[Mack A. Damia]

I watched it again last night and paid particular attention to that
scene. With your comments in mind, I'll listen to it again. You may
be correct. Thanks!

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 14 Jan 2012 15:30:03 -0800 (PST), "Smokie Darling (Annie)"
<Barnab...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Just watched it again.

Seems to be a lyrical command or cadence with a tune.

While there may be a "left" or a "right" in there, I also heat an "O"
sound and a "B".

This isn't it, but something like, "march on yer boots, first left
then right....."

It has a tune, too, that the musical score picks up on for the rest of
the scene and more.
--

[Smokie Darling (Annie)]

That's the "modified yodel" I was referencing.

> While there may be a "left" or a "right" in there, I also heat an "O"
> sound and a "B".
>
> This isn't it, but something like, "march on yer boots, first left
> then right....."

Entirely possible, but when I was marching, all I heard about was "listen to the 'directional', nothing else". So, when we were marching, we listened for the "left, left, left, right, left".

Still, I think it's a basic cadence (with correctionals), to get them into hearing what needs to be heard, and not a lot else.