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eating with fork tines up or down
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fabzorba
May 26, 2013, 3:50:28 AM5/26/13
to
WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
eating alone, but never in company.
I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
as devices to point and make gestures with.
But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
eating alone, but never in company.
I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
as devices to point and make gestures with.
But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
Ian Jackson
May 26, 2013, 7:11:37 AM5/26/13
to
In message
<a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1...@hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
fabzorba <myles....@gmail.com> writes
Being brung up proper, I was taught that unless it was a last resort,
when eating with a knife and fork, you should to keep the tines down.
However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
them. I can't say I disagree with him.
--
Ian
<a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1...@hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
fabzorba <myles....@gmail.com> writes
when eating with a knife and fork, you should to keep the tines down.
However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
them. I can't say I disagree with him.
--
Ian
Leslie Danks
May 26, 2013, 7:29:21 AM5/26/13
to
tines facing downwards - unless the nature of the food requires that the
fork be transferred to the other hand and used without the knife. I'm not
sure what the TDN (pronunciation copyright protected) (Tines Down Nazis)
have to say about spaghetti.
--
Les (BrE)
"... be skeptical of government guidelines. The Indians learned not to trust
our government and neither should you." (Fallon & Enig)
BDK
May 26, 2013, 10:06:24 AM5/26/13
to
In article <a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1-a423-87b163716bb3
@hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, myles....@gmail.com says...
I have to admit, I've never heard of, or wondered about the tines
pointing up or down meaning anything. Even my friend whose mother ran a
charm school didn't say anything about it, and she obsessed over all
kinds of nonsense. One time, I got fed up with her nitpicking about her
son's and my "manners", and I just tossed the fork and knife on the
table and picked up my sreak with my hands and ate my entire meal that
way, staring at her the whole time. It was a huge hit with her family,
especially her husband, but she didn't like it too much. She called my
mom up and told her what I did, and my mother's response, "And?", didn't
go over too well either.
--
BDK- Head FUD-Master Blaster. Friend to all kOOkbashers.
@hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, myles....@gmail.com says...
pointing up or down meaning anything. Even my friend whose mother ran a
charm school didn't say anything about it, and she obsessed over all
kinds of nonsense. One time, I got fed up with her nitpicking about her
son's and my "manners", and I just tossed the fork and knife on the
table and picked up my sreak with my hands and ate my entire meal that
way, staring at her the whole time. It was a huge hit with her family,
especially her husband, but she didn't like it too much. She called my
mom up and told her what I did, and my mother's response, "And?", didn't
go over too well either.
--
BDK- Head FUD-Master Blaster. Friend to all kOOkbashers.
Curlytop
May 26, 2013, 2:33:54 PM5/26/13
to
Ian Jackson set the following eddies spiralling through the space-time
continuum:
> However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
> attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
> I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
> he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
> I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
> the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
> them. I can't say I disagree with him.
I too were brung up proper, so I set the fork whichever way up is
appropriate - tines up or down as required. Using a spoon to scoop up the
peas is a definite no-no though.
There was one occasion where I had to reverse the usual layout - after I had
broken my left arm. For a while I could not raise my left hand far enough
to reach my mouth, so I had to have the fork in my right hand and the knife
in my left. Very difficult to get used to the reverse movements at first
but I managed it. (Finger movements were unaffected by the injury, and full
use of my left arm was gradually restored.)
--
ξ: ) Proud to be curly
Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply
continuum:
> However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
> attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
> I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
> he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
> I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
> the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
> them. I can't say I disagree with him.
appropriate - tines up or down as required. Using a spoon to scoop up the
peas is a definite no-no though.
There was one occasion where I had to reverse the usual layout - after I had
broken my left arm. For a while I could not raise my left hand far enough
to reach my mouth, so I had to have the fork in my right hand and the knife
in my left. Very difficult to get used to the reverse movements at first
but I managed it. (Finger movements were unaffected by the injury, and full
use of my left arm was gradually restored.)
--
ξ: ) Proud to be curly
Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply
Evan Kirshenbaum
May 26, 2013, 2:51:41 PM5/26/13
to
According to Petroski (_The Evolution of Useful Things_) the way that
Europeans and Americans treat forks has to do with what they did
before forks were introduced. In much of Europe, including the UK,
the practice was to eat with two knives, using one to hold the food
down while the other cut, and then using the first to bring the food
to the mouth. So when forks were introduced as a better second knife
(since the multiple tines meant that the food was less likely to twist
while cutting and the lack of a blade meant you were less likely to
cut your lips), it was held tines-down (to better stabilize) and it
remained in the non-cutting hand when bringing the food to the mouth
(as the second knife had).
In America, by contrast, the practice was to eat with a knife and
spoon, using the spoon to stabilize food (poorly) while cutting and
switching hands to scoop the cut food (or, apparently more commonly
there than in Europe, stew) and bring it to the mouth, because most
people have trouble either cutting or using a spoon with their off
hand. The fork was taken as a better spoon (since it could better
hold food when cutting, and you didn't need to push food onto it with
your knife), but the practice of changing hands and holding it convex
side up, as had been done with the spoon, remained.
Do Brits these days think of forks as more like spoons or more like
knives?
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |ActiveX is pretty harmless anyway.
SF Bay Area (1982-) |It can't affect you unless you
Chicago (1964-1982) |install Windows, and who would be
|foolish enough to do that?
evan.kir...@gmail.com | Peter Moylan
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/
Skitt
May 26, 2013, 3:21:16 PM5/26/13
to
Evan Kirshenbaum wrote:
In some (Asian, I think) cultures, eating is done using forks and
spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
instrument, when required.
--
Skitt (SF Bay Area)
http://home.comcast.net/~skitt99/main.html
spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
instrument, when required.
--
Skitt (SF Bay Area)
http://home.comcast.net/~skitt99/main.html
alien8er
May 26, 2013, 3:25:07 PM5/26/13
to
On May 26, 7:06 am, BDK <Cont...@Worldcontrol.com> wrote:
> In article <a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1-a423-87b163716bb3
> @hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, myles.abzo...@gmail.com says...
> In article <a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1-a423-87b163716bb3
Interlaken, Switzerland (in the late 1960's) where she caught all
sorts of hell for being an American barbarian. She will recount at the
drop of a hat the Headmistress asking if she needed her roasted
chicken deboned so as not to have to eat it with her fingers, though
Female Friend successfully managed to use knife and fork on it all by
herself.
She did not mention the tines up/down distinction though and I don't
recall seeing her eat either way preferentially.
A little research shows that table forks were generally flat until
some 18th century German got the idea of curving them, before which
point they were called "split spoons". Farming forks (pitchforks etc.)
generally had curved tines since antiquity though so I'm wondering if
tines-up indicated one was a hayseed.
My family line has a high proportion of hayseeds, and I was taught
"fingers came before forks". Even my somewhat prissy Jehovah's Witness
aunt saw me, as a child, eating her (outstanding) fried chicken with
my fingers as a sign of great appreciation.
Anybody else remember sporks? Great idea efficiency-wise but they
never really caught on. Maybe it's because they're impossible to use
tines-down.
Dr. HotSalt
alien8er
May 26, 2013, 3:30:25 PM5/26/13
to
> > <a9a2c1c8-24e8-4bf1-a423-87b163716...@hc4g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> > fabzorba <myles.abzo...@gmail.com> writes
Anyone else read Mad magazine back in the 1960's? I remember a
satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
things...
Dr. HotSalt
> > fabzorba <myles.abzo...@gmail.com> writes
satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
things...
Dr. HotSalt
R H Draney
May 26, 2013, 4:33:16 PM5/26/13
to
Ian Jackson filted:
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.
>
>However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
>attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
>I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
>he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
>I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
>the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
>them. I can't say I disagree with him.
Barbarians!...anyone with half a brain would know to use chopsticks....r
>However, some 50 years ago, I was at a semi-formal dinner where the
>attendees were university engineering staff and their students. The guy
>I was seated next to was one of the lecturers, and I was surprised when
>he specifically asked the waiter if he could have an extra desert spoon.
>I tactfully asked him why, and he replied that, as there were peas on
>the menu, any engineer with any common sense would use a spoon to eat
>them. I can't say I disagree with him.
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.
R H Draney
May 26, 2013, 4:37:34 PM5/26/13
to
alien8er filted:
Circa 1980, a man named Howard Morris released a movie called "Gizmo!"
consisting of film clips of inventors from the 1920s through the early
1970s...when promoting the film, he was asked if he had noticed any ideas that
kept surfacing again and again while he scoured the archives...yes, he answered,
for some reason people keep trying to invent an automatic spaghetti fork....
The second most common idea was for an alarm clock that would force you out of
bed, whether by stripping away the bedclothes, tilting the bed to make you fall
out, or pouring water on your face....r
>
> Anyone else read Mad magazine back in the 1960's? I remember a
>satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
>with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
>things...
Oh, that hasn't been a mere parody for quite some time now....
> Anyone else read Mad magazine back in the 1960's? I remember a
>satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
>with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
>things...
Circa 1980, a man named Howard Morris released a movie called "Gizmo!"
consisting of film clips of inventors from the 1920s through the early
1970s...when promoting the film, he was asked if he had noticed any ideas that
kept surfacing again and again while he scoured the archives...yes, he answered,
for some reason people keep trying to invent an automatic spaghetti fork....
The second most common idea was for an alarm clock that would force you out of
bed, whether by stripping away the bedclothes, tilting the bed to make you fall
out, or pouring water on your face....r
Leslie Danks
May 26, 2013, 4:51:56 PM5/26/13
to
Dechucka
May 26, 2013, 5:48:08 PM5/26/13
to
"Skitt" <ski...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:kntnb7$fhv$1...@news.albasani.net...
to eat. The Chinese felt that getting guest to butcher their meat at the
table was not proper so it is cut into edible size pieces in the kitchen
hence chopsticks can be used
Robert Bannister
May 26, 2013, 9:51:42 PM5/26/13
to
--
Robert Bannister
cw...@gmx.net
May 27, 2013, 3:36:50 AM5/27/13
to
On Sun, 26 May 2013 00:50:28 -0700 (PDT), fabzorba
<myles....@gmail.com> wrote:
>WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
>pierce, like peas. [---]
<myles....@gmail.com> wrote:
>WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
We French look upom the habit of eating peas with a tines-down fork as
a typically nonsensensical piece of British folklore.
Walter P. Zähl
May 27, 2013, 6:30:10 AM5/27/13
to
Leslie Danks <leslie...@aon.at> wrote:
> R H Draney wrote:
>
>> alien8er filted:
>>>
>>> Anyone else read Mad magazine back in the 1960's? I remember a
>>> satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
>>> with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
>>> things...
>>
>> Oh, that hasn't been a mere parody for quite some time now....
>>
>> Circa 1980, a man named Howard Morris released a movie called "Gizmo!"
>> consisting of film clips of inventors from the 1920s through the early
>> 1970s...when promoting the film, he was asked if he had noticed any ideas
>> that kept surfacing again and again while he scoured the archives...yes,
>> he answered, for some reason people keep trying to invent an automatic
>> spaghetti fork....
>>
>> The second most common idea was for an alarm clock that would force you
>> out of bed, whether by stripping away the bedclothes, tilting the bed to
>> make you fall out, or pouring water on your face....r
>>
> Or you could just get married.
Well, *my* wife knows how to get up in the morning without waking me up.
> R H Draney wrote:
>
>> alien8er filted:
>>>
>>> Anyone else read Mad magazine back in the 1960's? I remember a
>>> satire article describing the invention of a battery-operated fork
>>> with spinning tines for use with spaghetti. Now you can buy the damn
>>> things...
>>
>> Oh, that hasn't been a mere parody for quite some time now....
>>
>> Circa 1980, a man named Howard Morris released a movie called "Gizmo!"
>> consisting of film clips of inventors from the 1920s through the early
>> 1970s...when promoting the film, he was asked if he had noticed any ideas
>> that kept surfacing again and again while he scoured the archives...yes,
>> he answered, for some reason people keep trying to invent an automatic
>> spaghetti fork....
>>
>> The second most common idea was for an alarm clock that would force you
>> out of bed, whether by stripping away the bedclothes, tilting the bed to
>> make you fall out, or pouring water on your face....r
>>
> Or you could just get married.
;-)
/Walter
Swedish Cook
May 27, 2013, 11:36:21 AM5/27/13
to
you as an American caveman.
No wonder you're having problems with peas and other stuff, besides
looking like five-year-olds who have just been given this strange
contraption and have no idea which way to grab it.
The Swedish cook
Tony Cooper
May 27, 2013, 3:32:48 PM5/27/13
to
On Mon, 27 May 2013 17:36:21 +0200, Swedish Cook <sc...@swe.cook.swe>
wrote:
>fabzorba wrote:
>> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
>> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
>> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
>> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
>> eating alone, but never in company.
>>
>> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
>> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
>> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
>> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
>> still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
>> series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
>> Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
>> line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
>> European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
>> Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
>> as devices to point and make gestures with.
>>
>> But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
>> smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
>
>To anyone in Europe, using the fork tines down will immediately identify
>you as an American caveman.
An American caveman, eh? The only American cavemen I know about are
spelunkers. I wasn't aware that they take silverware into the
caverns.
>No wonder you're having problems with peas and other stuff, besides
>looking like five-year-olds who have just been given this strange
>contraption and have no idea which way to grab it.
>
>The Swedish cook
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
wrote:
>fabzorba wrote:
>> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
>> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
>> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
>> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
>> eating alone, but never in company.
>>
>> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
>> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
>> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
>> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
>> still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
>> series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
>> Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
>> line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
>> European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
>> Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
>> as devices to point and make gestures with.
>>
>> But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
>> smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
>
>To anyone in Europe, using the fork tines down will immediately identify
>you as an American caveman.
spelunkers. I wasn't aware that they take silverware into the
caverns.
>No wonder you're having problems with peas and other stuff, besides
>looking like five-year-olds who have just been given this strange
>contraption and have no idea which way to grab it.
>
>The Swedish cook
Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
Evan Kirshenbaum
May 27, 2013, 7:54:56 PM5/27/13
to
most Europeans) tend to use it tines down, this doesn't say much for
Europeans.
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |If only some crazy scientist
SF Bay Area (1982-) |somewhere would develop a device
Chicago (1964-1982) |that would allow us to change the
|channel on our televisions......
evan.kir...@gmail.com | --"lazarus"
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/
Adam Funk
May 28, 2013, 6:18:40 AM5/28/13
to
On 2013-05-26, fabzorba wrote:
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
> eating alone, but never in company.
>
> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
Is it a breach of etiquette to serve peas without some adhesive food
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
> eating alone, but never in company.
>
> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
at the same time?
--
I look back with the greatest pleasure to the kindness and hospitality
I met with in Yorkshire, where I spent some of the happiest years of
my life. --- Sabine Baring-Gould
Adam Funk
May 28, 2013, 6:19:53 AM5/28/13
to
On 2013-05-26, BDK wrote:
> I have to admit, I've never heard of, or wondered about the tines
> pointing up or down meaning anything. Even my friend whose mother ran a
> charm school didn't say anything about it, and she obsessed over all
> kinds of nonsense. One time, I got fed up with her nitpicking about her
> son's and my "manners", and I just tossed the fork and knife on the
> table and picked up my sreak with my hands and ate my entire meal that
> way, staring at her the whole time. It was a huge hit with her family,
If it was good enough for mediaeval kings...
> I have to admit, I've never heard of, or wondered about the tines
> pointing up or down meaning anything. Even my friend whose mother ran a
> charm school didn't say anything about it, and she obsessed over all
> kinds of nonsense. One time, I got fed up with her nitpicking about her
> son's and my "manners", and I just tossed the fork and knife on the
> table and picked up my sreak with my hands and ate my entire meal that
> way, staring at her the whole time. It was a huge hit with her family,
--
Nam Sibbyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla
pendere, et cum illi pueri dicerent: beable beable beable; respondebat
illa: doidy doidy doidy. [plorkwort]
Adam Funk
May 28, 2013, 6:21:26 AM5/28/13
to
On 2013-05-26, alien8er wrote:
> A little research shows that table forks were generally flat until
> some 18th century German got the idea of curving them, before which
> point they were called "split spoons". Farming forks (pitchforks etc.)
> generally had curved tines since antiquity though so I'm wondering if
> tines-up indicated one was a hayseed.
...
> A little research shows that table forks were generally flat until
> some 18th century German got the idea of curving them, before which
> point they were called "split spoons". Farming forks (pitchforks etc.)
> generally had curved tines since antiquity though so I'm wondering if
> tines-up indicated one was a hayseed.
> Anybody else remember sporks? Great idea efficiency-wise but they
> never really caught on. Maybe it's because they're impossible to use
> tines-down.
I have several sporks for travel & picnics. I wonder what we'd call
> never really caught on. Maybe it's because they're impossible to use
> tines-down.
them if the "split spoons" name had persisted for forks ---
"semi-split spoons"?
--
The history of the world is the history of a privileged few.
--- Henry Miller
fabzorba
May 30, 2013, 2:39:00 AM5/30/13
to
than tine-down use of the fork. A chopstick is the handle of a fork
with tines removed, and a spoon with no ladle at the end. But it does
work. People even eat rice with it. Try doing that with a tine-down
fork!
Adam Funk
May 30, 2013, 6:00:59 AM5/30/13
to
suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
well in clumps).
--
Disagreeing with Donald Rumsfeld about bombing anybody who gets in our
way is not a crime in this country. It is a wise and honorable idea
that George Washington and Benjamin Franklin risked their lives for.
--- Hunter S Thompson
Ian Jackson
May 30, 2013, 8:10:48 AM5/30/13
to
In message <rjkj7ax...@news.ducksburg.com>, Adam Funk
<a24...@ducksburg.com> writes
raised to the lips, and the food is shovelled into the mouth.
--
Ian
<a24...@ducksburg.com> writes
>On 2013-05-30, fabzorba wrote:
>
>> On 27 May, 05:21, Skitt <skit...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>> In some (Asian, I think) cultures, eating is done using forks and
>>> spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
>>> instrument, when required.
>>>
>> I thought they used chopsticks, which might seem even less sensible
>> than tine-down use of the fork. A chopstick is the handle of a fork
>> with tines removed, and a spoon with no ladle at the end. But it does
>> work. People even eat rice with it. Try doing that with a tine-down
>> fork!
>
>
>AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
>suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
>well in clumps).
>
And if the food cannot be picked up by the chopsticks, the bowl is
>
>> On 27 May, 05:21, Skitt <skit...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>> In some (Asian, I think) cultures, eating is done using forks and
>>> spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
>>> instrument, when required.
>>>
>> I thought they used chopsticks, which might seem even less sensible
>> than tine-down use of the fork. A chopstick is the handle of a fork
>> with tines removed, and a spoon with no ladle at the end. But it does
>> work. People even eat rice with it. Try doing that with a tine-down
>> fork!
>
>
>AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
>suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
>well in clumps).
>
raised to the lips, and the food is shovelled into the mouth.
--
Ian
Adam Funk
May 30, 2013, 9:00:18 AM5/30/13
to
--
In the 1970s, people began receiving utility bills for
-£999,999,996.32 and it became harder to sustain the
myth of the infallible electronic brain. (Verity Stob)
Peter Brooks
May 30, 2013, 9:53:22 AM5/30/13
to
On May 30, 2:10 pm, Ian Jackson
<ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <rjkj7axr4b....@news.ducksburg.com>, Adam Funk
'Chop-sticked', 'chopped' or 'conveyed', rather than 'shovelled', I'd
have thought - shovelling would involve a spoon of shovel-like design
or proportions.
<ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <rjkj7axr4b....@news.ducksburg.com>, Adam Funk
have thought - shovelling would involve a spoon of shovel-like design
or proportions.
Robert Bannister
May 30, 2013, 9:21:55 PM5/30/13
to
On 30/05/13 6:00 PM, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2013-05-30, fabzorba wrote:
>
>> On 27 May, 05:21, Skitt <skit...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>> In some (Asian, I think) cultures, eating is done using forks and
>>> spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
>>> instrument, when required.
>>>
>> I thought they used chopsticks, which might seem even less sensible
>> than tine-down use of the fork. A chopstick is the handle of a fork
>> with tines removed, and a spoon with no ladle at the end. But it does
>> work. People even eat rice with it. Try doing that with a tine-down
>> fork!
>
>
> AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
> suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
> well in clumps).
Have you watched Chinese people eat? They will pick up whole crabs in
> On 2013-05-30, fabzorba wrote:
>
>> On 27 May, 05:21, Skitt <skit...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>> In some (Asian, I think) cultures, eating is done using forks and
>>> spoons. No knives are present. The spoon doubles as a crude cutting
>>> instrument, when required.
>>>
>> I thought they used chopsticks, which might seem even less sensible
>> than tine-down use of the fork. A chopstick is the handle of a fork
>> with tines removed, and a spoon with no ladle at the end. But it does
>> work. People even eat rice with it. Try doing that with a tine-down
>> fork!
>
>
> AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
> suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
> well in clumps).
their chopsticks and bite bits off. It's fork-only cultures that can be
guaranteed to serve you bite-sized food.
--
Robert Bannister
Robert Bannister
May 30, 2013, 9:22:35 PM5/30/13
to
--
Robert Bannister
Adam Funk
May 31, 2013, 5:08:14 AM5/31/13
to
everything I was served was either spoon-oriented, bite-sized, or
already on a stick.
--
There's a statute of limitations with the law, but not with
your wife. [Ray Magliozzi, Car Talk 2011-36]
Adam Funk
Jun 26, 2013, 4:47:23 AM6/26/13
to
On 2013-05-31, Robert Bannister wrote:
16. This kid eating pizza with chopsticks.
--
Classical Greek lent itself to the promulgation of a rich culture,
indeed, to Western civilization. Computer languages bring us
doorbells that chime with thirty-two tunes, alt.sex.bestiality, and
Tetris clones. (Stoll 1995)
Jenny Telia
Jun 26, 2013, 8:07:11 AM6/26/13
to
On 27/05/2013 17:36, Swedish Cook wrote:
>
> To anyone in Europe, using the fork tines down will immediately identify
> you as an American caveman.
>
> No wonder you're having problems with peas and other stuff, besides
> looking like five-year-olds who have just been given this strange
> contraption and have no idea which way to grab it.
>
> The Swedish cook
>
Hurdy gurdy gurdy ... I think your opinion is right up there with Moose
>
> To anyone in Europe, using the fork tines down will immediately identify
> you as an American caveman.
>
> No wonder you're having problems with peas and other stuff, besides
> looking like five-year-olds who have just been given this strange
> contraption and have no idea which way to grab it.
>
> The Swedish cook
>
droppings
A true European (unraped by Vikings)
Robert Bannister
Jun 26, 2013, 9:32:23 PM6/26/13
to
On 26/06/13 4:47 PM, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2013-05-31, Robert Bannister wrote:
>
>> On 30/05/13 6:00 PM, Adam Funk wrote:
>
>>> AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
>>> suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
>>> well in clumps).
>>
>> Have you watched Chinese people eat? They will pick up whole crabs in
>> their chopsticks and bite bits off. It's fork-only cultures that can be
>> guaranteed to serve you bite-sized food.
>
>
> http://www.buzzfeed.com/mattbellassai/45-people-you-wont-believe-actually-exist-6z51
>
> 16. This kid eating pizza with chopsticks.
>
>
He's doing it because he can.
> On 2013-05-31, Robert Bannister wrote:
>
>> On 30/05/13 6:00 PM, Adam Funk wrote:
>
>>> AFAICT, chopstick-using cultures also prepare food so as to be
>>> suitable for chopsticks (bite-sized pieces; rice varieties that work
>>> well in clumps).
>>
>> Have you watched Chinese people eat? They will pick up whole crabs in
>> their chopsticks and bite bits off. It's fork-only cultures that can be
>> guaranteed to serve you bite-sized food.
>
>
> http://www.buzzfeed.com/mattbellassai/45-people-you-wont-believe-actually-exist-6z51
>
> 16. This kid eating pizza with chopsticks.
>
>
I am much more worried about grandma in the shopping trolley - how are
they going to get her out again?
--
Robert Bannister
Walter P. Zähl
Jun 27, 2013, 1:42:32 AM6/27/13
to
doing homework.
Or happily singing "Yo ho, and a bottle of rum" as in the other picture ;-)
/Walter
RichA
Jun 27, 2013, 3:56:01 PM6/27/13
to
On Sunday, May 26, 2013 3:50:28 AM UTC-4, fabzorba wrote:
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>
> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>
> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
>
> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
>
> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
>
> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
>
> eating alone, but never in company.
>
>
>
> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
>
> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
>
> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
>
> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
>
> still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
>
> series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
>
> Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
>
> line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
>
> European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
>
> Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
>
> as devices to point and make gestures with.
>
>
>
> But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
>
> smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
Americans prefer tines up. You can shovel more food that way.
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife and fork used
>
> together, and with the fork having tines pointing down all the time.
>
> This was quite an art to master, especially with small items hard to
>
> pierce, like peas. When I was a child and could get away with it, I
>
> would often turn the fork tines up so I could use it as a scoop, which
>
> surely makes sense. I must admit that I do this sometimes when I am
>
> eating alone, but never in company.
>
>
>
> I rem seeing a British academic eating a meal with undergraduates many
>
> years ago, and the way he handled those pesky peas was wonderful - he
>
> would glue a few of them on his tines-down fork using some mashed
>
> potato. Now, this etiquette seems to have largely gone. But I was
>
> still surprised when I viewed an episode of Hannibal, the new American
>
> series which has Mads Mikkelsen as the erudite gourmand psychiatrist
>
> Hannibal Lecter, who happens to have being a serial killer as a side
>
> line. In this episode, Hannibal once again prepares a sumptuous
>
> European style feast. I noticed that his guests ate like typical
>
> Americans, shoveling food into open mouths, and using eating utensils
>
> as devices to point and make gestures with.
>
>
>
> But then I saw Hannibal use the fork tines up! I was totally gob-
>
> smacked! Surely this cannot be? Or am I getting something wrong?
Anton Shepelev
Jun 28, 2013, 3:09:55 PM6/28/13
to
fabzorba:
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife
> and fork used together, and with the fork having
> tines pointing down all the time. This was quite
> an art to master, especially with small items hard
> to pierce, like peas.
> [...]
And there is reason to it. If you want to scoop
then the spoon's your best friend, while the fork is
designed for piercing. Now, using tools most suit-
able for the purpose is only meet, and although mas-
tering them may take certain effort, it will always
pay off in the end. The suiting the purpose is mea-
sured by effectiveness, which in case of hand tools
is the economy of motion and effort. Economy of mo-
tion is graceful, and grace is commendable.
Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items are
best pierced in a strict top-down direction, and the
fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to spare the
wielder flexing his wrist uncomfortably to achieve
vertical position.
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
> WIWAL, I was taught to eat my dinner with a knife
> and fork used together, and with the fork having
> tines pointing down all the time. This was quite
> an art to master, especially with small items hard
> to pierce, like peas.
And there is reason to it. If you want to scoop
then the spoon's your best friend, while the fork is
designed for piercing. Now, using tools most suit-
able for the purpose is only meet, and although mas-
tering them may take certain effort, it will always
pay off in the end. The suiting the purpose is mea-
sured by effectiveness, which in case of hand tools
is the economy of motion and effort. Economy of mo-
tion is graceful, and grace is commendable.
Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items are
best pierced in a strict top-down direction, and the
fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to spare the
wielder flexing his wrist uncomfortably to achieve
vertical position.
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
Adam Funk
Jun 28, 2013, 3:23:09 PM6/28/13
to
On 2013-06-28, Anton Shepelev wrote:
> And there is reason to it. If you want to scoop
> then the spoon's your best friend, while the fork is
> designed for piercing. Now, using tools most suit-
> able for the purpose is only meet, and although mas-
> tering them may take certain effort, it will always
> pay off in the end. The suiting the purpose is mea-
> sured by effectiveness, which in case of hand tools
> is the economy of motion and effort. Economy of mo-
> tion is graceful, and grace is commendable.
>
> Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items are
> best pierced in a strict top-down direction, and the
> fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to spare the
> wielder flexing his wrist uncomfortably to achieve
> vertical position.
May I ask what you're using to produce the hyphenation &
> And there is reason to it. If you want to scoop
> then the spoon's your best friend, while the fork is
> designed for piercing. Now, using tools most suit-
> able for the purpose is only meet, and although mas-
> tering them may take certain effort, it will always
> pay off in the end. The suiting the purpose is mea-
> sured by effectiveness, which in case of hand tools
> is the economy of motion and effort. Economy of mo-
> tion is graceful, and grace is commendable.
>
> Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items are
> best pierced in a strict top-down direction, and the
> fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to spare the
> wielder flexing his wrist uncomfortably to achieve
> vertical position.
justification?
Anton Shepelev
Jun 28, 2013, 3:57:53 PM6/28/13
to
,----[Adam Funk:]
| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | ...
| | ably to achieve vertical position.
| `-----------------------------------
| May I ask what you're using to produce the hyphen-
| ation & justification?
`-----------------------
It's GNU Troff at about 0.1 percent of its power.
| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | ...
| | Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items
| | are best pierced in a strict top-down direction,
| | and the fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to
| | spare the wielder flexing his wrist uncomfort-
| | are best pierced in a strict top-down direction,
| | and the fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to
| | ably to achieve vertical position.
| `-----------------------------------
| May I ask what you're using to produce the hyphen-
| ation & justification?
`-----------------------
It's GNU Troff at about 0.1 percent of its power.
Adam Funk
Jun 28, 2013, 4:02:52 PM6/28/13
to
On 2013-06-28, Anton Shepelev wrote:
> ,----[Adam Funk:]
>| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
>| | ...
>| | Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items
>| | are best pierced in a strict top-down direction,
>| | and the fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to
>| | spare the wielder flexing his wrist uncomfort-
>| | ably to achieve vertical position.
>| `-----------------------------------
>| May I ask what you're using to produce the hyphen-
>| ation & justification?
> `-----------------------
> It's GNU Troff at about 0.1 percent of its power.
Oh, you're running that inside Sylpheed or an external editor? Neat.
>| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
>| | ...
>| | Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small items
>| | are best pierced in a strict top-down direction,
>| | and the fork's tines are bent somewhat so as to
>| | spare the wielder flexing his wrist uncomfort-
>| | ably to achieve vertical position.
>| `-----------------------------------
>| May I ask what you're using to produce the hyphen-
>| ation & justification?
> `-----------------------
> It's GNU Troff at about 0.1 percent of its power.
--
The Nixon I remembered was absolutely humorless; I couldn't imagine
him laughing at anything except maybe a paraplegic who wanted to vote
Democratic but couldn't quite reach the lever on the voting machine.
--- Hunter S Thompson
Anton Shepelev
Jun 28, 2013, 4:42:15 PM6/28/13
to
,----[Adam Funk:]
| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | ,----[Adam Funk:]
| | | ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | | | ...
| | | | Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small
| | | | items are best pierced in a strict top-down
| | | | direction, and the fork's tines are bent
| | | | somewhat so as to spare the wielder flexing
| ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | ,----[Adam Funk:]
| | | ,----[Anton Shepelev:]
| | | | ...
| | | | Accoring to the laws of mechanics, small
| | | | items are best pierced in a strict top-down
| | | | direction, and the fork's tines are bent
| | | | somewhat so as to spare the wielder flexing
| | | | his wrist uncomfortably to achieve vertical
| | | | position.
| | | `----------
| | | | position.
| | | May I ask what you're using to produce the hy-
| | | phenation & justification?
| | `---------------------------
| | It's GNU Troff at about 0.1 percent of its pow-
| | er.
| `----
| Oh, you're running that inside Sylpheed or an ex-
| ternal editor? Neat.
`----------------------
No, not inside Sylpheed. I have written a little
package to format letters and call it from the com-
mand line, which is really quick with the FAR File
and Archive manager which I use on Windows in place
of the Explorer.
On my Macbook (shame on me!) I have set up Tin to
use Vim, and Vim to call Groff by a shortcut.
Adam Funk
Jul 4, 2013, 10:47:45 AM7/4/13
to
On 2013-06-28, Anton Shepelev wrote:
--
The kid's a hot prospect. He's got a good head for merchandising, an
agent who can take you downtown and one of the best urine samples I've
seen in a long time. [Dead Kennedys t-shirt]
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