Action visual cliche
Alex Crouvier
I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones, and
I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2, BLUE
STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
Also, another cliche John Woo popularized with his BETTER TOMORROW
series, the 'romantic' trench coat image. The oldest origin I could
think of is CASABLANCA, Bogie immortalized in that image. Also Alain
Delon later in LE SAMOURAI.
Alex Crouvier
Franknseus
>I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones, and
>I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
>bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2, BLUE
>STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
>cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
I don't know where it was done first, but From Dusk Till Dawn definitely does
it as a reference to and/or rip off of Near Dark, in which it is also used as a
way of hurting vampires. FDTD adds the extra twist of the beams hitting a disco
ball, though.
Bryan Frankenseuss Theiss
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Alex Crouvier (trojan50...@geocities.com) writes:
> I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones, and
> I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2, BLUE
> STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
I remember seeing an interview with Joel Silver in which he raved about
the "shafts of light through bullet holes" shot in Blood Simple, and marvelled
that no one had ever thought of doing it before. I doubt he's right
about this, but I can't think of an earlier example myself.
--
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"I'm serious, you smoke too much of that shit. That shit robs you of your
ambition."
"Not if your ambition is to get high and watch TV."
Jill Cozzi
The two action visual cliches I can't stand are: a) the obligatory
car-chase-into-the-fruit-stand; and b) the obligatory
slow-motion-leap-out-of-the-burning-building.
In fact, the ONLY thing I didn't like about TITANIC was the damned
slow-motion-run-ahead-of-the-rushing-water!
J.
Alex Crouvier wrote:
> I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones,
> and
> I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
> BLUE
> STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
>
randy stiefer
>> > > I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> > > bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
> > > BLUE
> > > STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> > > cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
The oldest and most effective time this was used, that I recall,
was in Black Sunday. Not bullet holes though. It was when the terrorists
tested the dart bomb in the airport hanger and shredded the security
guard posing for that odd camera.
Homage
Jill Cozzi wrote:
>
> The two action visual cliches I can't stand are: a) the obligatory
> car-chase-into-the-fruit-stand; and b) the obligatory
> slow-motion-leap-out-of-the-burning-building.
>
> In fact, the ONLY thing I didn't like about TITANIC was the damned
> slow-motion-run-ahead-of-the-rushing-water!
>
> J.
The 90's variant upon this (earlier versions being Fly Through Air
Propelled By Big Explosion, see Predator 1 *and* 2; and Jump Out Of
Burning Building, don't see Long Kiss Goodnight, Renny Harlin directed
it) being Walk Staunchly Away From Explosion (see Desperado and Con Air,
or hell, just the trailers, as I'm sure these shots are filmed with
trailer and tv spot appearances in mind).
> Alex Crouvier wrote:
>
> > I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones,
> > and
> > I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> > bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
> > BLUE
> > STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> > cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
Dunno, but check Near Dark, also by Kathryn (Blue Steel) Bigelow.
Actually quite a cool scene, the shafts of light being more than just a
visual device. I wonder if Robert Rodriguez has seen Near Dark.
John Woo really has a lot to answer for in terms of action movie
cliches. Think two guns, slomo shots of people firing said dual
firearms, trenchcoats (although a, as Alex pointed out he hardly
invented this, and b, I don't care how overused it is, that establishing
shot of Nicolas Cage in Face/Off was gorgeous) etc.
Not that I have a problem with Woo retaining his stylistic cliches -
anything that contributes to an end result such as Face/Off or The
Killer, I ain't arguing with. But when you add to Woo's own use of these
trademarks, the fact that every two-bit action director in Hollywood
wants to be him (Bay, West, Tarantino - sorry - etc), it gets a little
tiresome.
But my essential argument here would have to be, if people rip other
people off, it's bad for everyone involved. And, well, duh.
My favourite cliche is the all-time Cliche Of Cliches. Check The Lost
World, Terminator 2, Aliens and, shit, I don't know, loads of others,
for variants upon the "wheel rolling away from the crash" motif.
- Tom, who uses two hands on the keyboard, sometimes in slow motion.
Woo homage or just unoriginal? You be the judge.
Gary Pollard
Yes, "Blood Simple" is the first one that comes to mind for me. I remember
the Coens sayig they didn't give a damn about whether it was naturalistic or
not as long as it looked good.
Gary
Skander Halim wrote in message <68edm6$3...@freenet-news.carleton.ca>...
>
>Alex Crouvier (trojan50...@geocities.com) writes:
>
>> I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones, and
>> I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
>> bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2, BLUE
>> STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
>> cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
>
Gary Pollard
Well spotted Randy
I remembered that sequence, but couldn't remember where the hell it was
from, so I couldn't remember if it pre-dated or post dated "Blood Simple".
The other similar cliché shot , most often seen in action and S-F movies and
rock videos is the big fan, with a light on the other side. Who the hell
points a big light at a fan outside of US movies?
Gary
randy stiefer wrote in message <34AB26...@onr.com>...
>>> > > I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
>> > > bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
>> > > BLUE
>> > > STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
>> > > cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
>
Alex Crouvier
There is worse cliches in TITANIC, the robotic henchman and the bad guy
with guns. When I saw part of the trailer that shows Zane firing away:"I
hope you have a great time together..", why, oh, why?
>
> John Woo really has a lot to answer for in terms of action movie
> cliches. Think two guns, slomo shots of people firing said dual
> firearms, trenchcoats (although a, as Alex pointed out he hardly
> invented this, and b, I don't care how overused it is, that establishing
> shot of Nicolas Cage in Face/Off was gorgeous) etc.
Yea, I got a weakness for that Nicolas Cage's entrance to FACE/OFF. Art
snobs don't know what they are missing (they're like people who says
candy is bad for your health). The one Woo's overused trademark, besides
the Mexican standoff, is the lounging-sideways-while-firing. I
remembered seeing it on that 'scene for scene' remake of THE GETAWAY
which is full of Peckinpah's slo mo images. As for Bay - an arrogant
clueless young jerk that he is- borrowing from Woo, his use of
unintentionally hilarious slo mo images of asexual Will Smith and Martin
Lawrence running in one chase scene in BAD BOYS is as far as it gets. On
his commentary for Criterion laserdisc for THE ROCK, he marvels at his
own more realistic action scenes and makes a point that his style is
very far from Woo's lounging-action motif. At least, Rodriguez admits
where his borrowing comes from in his commentary for DESPERADO.
Alex Crouvier
Franknseus
> The 90's variant upon this (earlier versions being Fly Through Air
>Propelled By Big Explosion, see Predator 1 *and* 2; and Jump Out Of
>Burning Building, don't see Long Kiss Goodnight, Renny Harlin directed
>it) being Walk Staunchly Away From Explosion (see Desperado and Con Air,
>or hell, just the trailers, as I'm sure these shots are filmed with
>trailer and tv spot appearances in mind).
Yeah, but when it was done in Desperado it was great because it was such a
well shot play on the cliche - you think, "Well, this guy *is* a badass because
instead of running away from the explosion, he looks like he's on his way home
from work." He probably wasn't the first one to do it but I sure did enjoy it.
Rodriguez actually seems to be the master of shooting people standing in
front of fiery explosions - he also had the hilarious
argument-in-front-of-an-exploding-liquor-store in From Dusk Till Dawn and the
bellboy-caught-holding-the-leg-of-a-dead-hooker-while-the-kids-drink-booze
-inside-a-burning-hotel-room scene in Four Rooms.
Rat & Swan
Franknseus wrote:
>
> > The 90's variant upon this (earlier versions being Fly Through Air
> >Propelled By Big Explosion, see Predator 1 *and* 2; and Jump Out Of
> >Burning Building, don't see Long Kiss Goodnight, Renny Harlin directed
> >it) being Walk Staunchly Away From Explosion (see Desperado and Con Air,
> >or hell, just the trailers, as I'm sure these shots are filmed with
> >trailer and tv spot appearances in mind).
>
> Yeah, but when it was done in Desperado it was great because it was such a
> well shot play on the cliche - you think, "Well, this guy *is* a badass because
> instead of running away from the explosion, he looks like he's on his way home
> from work."
And of course in Escape From LA, the protagonist walks away from one
explosion (the crashed helicopter) and, in a strange twist, walks asaw
at the end from the OPPOSITE, an EMP damping field that destroys
electricity and power sources! so , having created the greatest
NONexplosion in the world (it took out the entire Earth technology) Kurt
russell's character calmly lights a cigarette and walks off smiling.
Cute reversal, that!
Swan
"Hph!...Welcome to the human race." Snake Plissken
John Robinson
On 31 Dec 1997 21:54:36 GMT, frank...@aol.com (Franknseus) wrote:
> >I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones, and
> >I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> >bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2, BLUE
> >STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> >cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
>
> I don't know where it was done first, but From Dusk Till Dawn definitely does
> it as a reference to and/or rip off of Near Dark, in which it is also used as a
> way of hurting vampires. FDTD adds the extra twist of the beams hitting a disco
> ball, though.
Blood Simple, which someone has already mentioned, comes to mind, as
does Blade Runner, in the scenes with Deckard chasing/being chased by
Roy Batty towards the end.
I can't think of earlier examples, but I can't believe that either was
first.
--
"It's a big if, and remember `if` is Formula One spelt backwards!"
-- Murray Walker
Homage
tom o'brien wrote:
>
> the stupidest action cliche I can think of is the two guys pointing
> guns at each other in a standoff. In real life the solution is easy one
> guy shots, the other guy dies. Like, what, he's going to shoot back
> before the bullet gets there?
I agree it's overdone, but used properly (ie used by John Woo in a
film without the words "Target" or "Arrow" in the title", the image can
be very symbolic. I mean, think what you've just said. "The solution is
easy, one guy shots [sic], the other guy dies". I don't know, it just
strikes me as interesting that action movies have come to a point where
you're not even remotely putting yourself in the shoes of either
character, not wanting to be the guy that dies. The situation can convey
emotion, shared respect and a reluctance to pull the trigger, as well as
to be in front of the gun.
Then again, 90% of the time it sucks.
What the hell, it's stupid list time.
List Of The Day: Standoffs That Don't Suck
- The mirror one in Face/Off
- The Mickey Mouse and Dumbo one in The Killer
- The "No we don't" one in Broken Arrow (oops)
- The one with really cool camerawork in the nightclub in Full Contact
- The really long one with no bullets in Desperado
- The knife/loaded gun/unloaded gun one in Broken Arrow (oops again)
- The final one in Full Contact
- The final one in Trigger Happy
- The Pop Tarts one in Pulp Fiction (well, it sucked, but I have a soft
spot for it)
Other List: Standoffs That Do Suck
- Pretty much every one in Trigger Happy except the final one
- The final one in Reservoir Dogs (who gives a flying fuck who shot
Nice Guy Eddie?)
- Any that happened to occur in Hard Target, I can't bloody remember.
- The Steve Buscemi On The Floor one in Reservoir Dogs
- The Millions of People one in True Romance
- The Millions of People one in Natural Born Killers
- The one in Con Air
- The one in The Rock
- If you find any other ones, just stick them here to be on the safe
side
Ross Mandell
Snipers in the movies always seem to get their intended victoms in
thier sights and then they wait and wait and wait until the person
moves out of the way. They then put down the rifle and gasp in
frustration. They never shoot when they have the chance.
Alex Crouvier
tom o'brien wrote:
>
> Jill Cozzi wrote:
> >
> > The two action visual cliches I can't stand are: a) the obligatory
> > car-chase-into-the-fruit-stand; and b) the obligatory
> > slow-motion-leap-out-of-the-burning-building.
> >
> > In fact, the ONLY thing I didn't like about TITANIC was the damned
> > slow-motion-run-ahead-of-the-rushing-water!
> >
> > J.
> >
> >
> > > I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones,
> > > and
> > > I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> > > bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
> > > BLUE
> > > STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> > > cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
> > >
> > > series, the 'romantic' trench coat image. The oldest origin I could
> > > think of is CASABLANCA, Bogie immortalized in that image. Also Alain
> > > Delon later in LE SAMOURAI.
> > >
> > > Alex Crouvier
>
> guns at each other in a standoff. In real life the solution is easy one
> guy shots, the other guy dies. Like, what, he's going to shoot back
> before the bullet gets there?
The other guy is just as likely to shoot first ;-) Moron.
Alex Crouvier
Pentti J Lajunen
> > > Alex Crouvier wrote:
> > >
> > > > I just recently sampled trons of action movies, good ones, bad ones,
> > > > and
> > > > I notice there is this overused use of 'shafts of light through the
> > > > bullet holes' shots. You see it in FROM DUSK TILL DAWN, ROBOCOP 2,
> > > > BLUE
> > > > STEEL and ton others. I was wondering if anyone knows where does this
> > > > cliche originate? One of the Scott brothers?
The earliest use of this trick that I can remember is from Bigelow's
Near Dark (very effective). Propably invented earlier, though.
Gareth Wilson
is if they appear in crosshairs. If they do, they're safe.
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Zaphy
On Tue, 06 Jan 1998 10:42:52 -0800, Homage <tgo...@chch.ihug.co.nz> regurgitated:
{snipped other stand-offs that suck}
> - The one in The Rock
you mean the bit near the end where all the "bad guys" are pointing guns at each other? i thought
that was way cool....