Gershwin or Porter?
darr...@aol.com
Date : 3/10/02 8:08 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <a6h032$pi3$1...@peabody.colorado.edu>
<<I love Gershwin(s). And I love the movies that really use his music
such as American In Paris>>
Howie, perhaps with the exception of Lennon & McCartney, George & Ira
Gershwin (sweet Jews) are two of the most prolific composers of the
20th century. Do you think it's just a coincidence that they both
happen to be Jewish!?eheeee Once again, wherever you turn, so shall be
the Jew! Howie, for a KVETCHING yokel from Colorado, you still have
splendid taste!eheheh LOL! -D, NYC "This legendary Jewish composer
penned the most popular selling Christmas song, "White Christmas" -
Irving Berlin"
David
>Howie, perhaps with the exception of Lennon & McCartney, George & Ira
>Gershwin (sweet Jews) are two of the most prolific composers of the
>20th century. Do you think it's just a coincidence that they both
>happen to be Jewish!?eheeee Once again, wherever you turn, so shall be
>the Jew! Howie, for a KVETCHING yokel from Colorado, you still have
>splendid taste!eheheh LOL! -D, NYC "This legendary Jewish composer
>penned the most popular selling Christmas song, "White Christmas" -
>Irving Berlin"
You haven't yet mentioned such towering talents as Neil Simon, Steve
Guttenberg, Tom Bosley or Menahem Golan in your litany of Jewish
artistic giants. And what of Jerry Bruckheimer, who bestowed upon the
world "Flashdance" & "Con Air" & "Top Gun" & "Armageddon"? Oh, &
"Pearl Harbor."
--
Pas de lieu Rhône que nous.
Liam Devlin
>
> <<From how...@brazee.net
> Date : 3/10/02 8:08 PM Eastern Standard Time
> Message-id: <a6h032$pi3$1...@peabody.colorado.edu>
>
> <<I love Gershwin(s). And I love the movies that really use his music
> such as American In Paris>>
>
> Howie, perhaps with the exception of Lennon & McCartney, George & Ira
> Gershwin (sweet Jews) are two of the most prolific composers of the
> 20th century. Do you think it's just a coincidence that they both
> happen to be Jewish!?
Of course not, Lumpy, thay were brothers.
Bob
David wrote:
> darr...@aol.com (darr...@aol.com) wrote:
>
> >Howie, perhaps with the exception of Lennon & McCartney, George & Ira
> >Gershwin (sweet Jews) are two of the most prolific composers of the
> >20th century. Do you think it's just a coincidence that they both
> >happen to be Jewish!?
Dummy - brothers usually tend to both be of the same religion. What would
be remarkable would be George being Jewish and Ira being Baptist.
Darrin - are you not sure that you're Palestinian? All the Jews I know are
much more decent people than you are, at least, the impression that you
present on the net.
Bob
Anthony Dale
prolificy.
IF Gershwin had written nothing but PORGY AND BESS' "Summertime;" the choice
would be obvious.
IF Porter had written nothing but KISS ME KATE'S "So In Love," the choice
would be obvious.
As far as film music goes, not theater, I'd venture closer to Porter, who
really understood the musical film form, and let his songs be
character-driven.
There really isn't an original Gershwin film musical which stands up against
either THE PIRATE or HIGH SOCIETY's song scores.
But, when all is said and done, I'll take Jerome Kern's "The Folks Who Live
on the Hill" from HIGH, WIDE AND HANDSOME - or Harold Arlen's "With the Sun
Warm Upon Me" from THE FARMER TAKES A WIFE.
td
--
I have seen the starlight fading
into echos on the floor
And I dreamed the stars parading
like tin soldiers on the shore
The city casts no shadow now
At midnight, all the whores
come out and dance with darkness
and the night rains pour...
@1979, Janis Ian.
Anthony Dale
--
I have seen the starlight fading
into echos on the floor
And I dreamed the stars parading
like tin soldiers on the shore
The city casts no shadow now
At midnight, all the whores
come out and dance with darkness
and the night rains pour...
@1979, Janis Ian.
"Anthony Dale" <hil...@nauticom.net> wrote in message
news:3c8c...@news.nauticom.net...
Matthew Murray
> Wow, tough choices. Really. Porter's sophistication versus the Gerswhin
> prolificy.
Why should we HAVE to choose? I think it's amazing we got Porter
AND Gershwin, and I'm thankful for both of their contributions!
----------------------------
Matthew A. Murray
matthe...@mindspring.com
http://www.matthewmurray.net
----------------------------
Mason Barge
>> prolificy.
Is "prolificy" really a word?
Anyway, I am reasonably sure Gershwin was not more prolific than Cole Porter.
If there is a distinction outside the sound of their music, it would have to be
Gershwin's successful ventures into more serious idioms, i.e. symphonic jazz,
opera and "serious" piano pieces. Also, Cole Porter wrote his own lyrics while
Ira wrote most of George's better lyrics.
It would actually be hard to compare their output in terms of gross quantity.
I'm sure Porter wrote more songs and he sure published a lot more. But then,
it certainly takes a hell of a lot longer to write a symphonic work like
Rhapsody in Blue than a song. But then, on the other hand, Porter was doing
most of his own lyrics and so every song is double output.
Gershwin was a hard worker but he died young.
"If this is coffee, please bring me some tea. If this is tea, please bring me
some coffee."
- Abraham Lincoln
Robert Keser
> On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, Anthony Dale wrote:
>
> > Wow, tough choices. Really. Porter's sophistication versus the Gerswhin
> > prolificy.
>
> Why should we HAVE to choose? I think it's amazing we got Porter
> AND Gershwin, and I'm thankful for both of their contributions!
Of course, we're lucky that we them both, not to mention Harold Arlen
and Irving Berlin and Jerome Kern and Harry Warren and Johnny
Mercer and lots more. But it's interesting to look at how these two
quite different styles worked in music for films.
--Bob Keser.
darr...@aol.com
No sh*t, SHMENDRICK!eheh Since you couldn't wait to twist my words,
allow me to explain it to you in layman's terms: How does George & Ira
Gershwin (whose religion comprises a mere 1/4 of 1% of the world's
population) overshadow the 99% of Gentiles (non Jews) in ultimately
becoming synonymous with their chosen craft? Once again, do you think
it's just a coincidence that two of the world's most renowned
composers happen to be Jewish!?eheheh -D, NYC "This legendary Jewish
DJ was known as "The 5th Beatle" - Murray The K (Kaufman)"
Robert Keser
> <snip> Once again, do you think
> it's just a coincidence that two of the world's most renowned
> composers happen to be Jewish!?
George Gershwin was a composer. Ira Gershwin was a lyricist:
a great talent, but a very different talent.
Still, it's fair enough to view George Gershwin and Cole Porter as
the contrast between a poor immigrant jew and a patrician silver-spoon
gentile. The question is how their music differed, and how their output
in Hollywood fared, and how Hollywood treated them.
(With Gershwin and Harold Arlen and Irving Berlin and Arthur
Schwartz and Sammy Cahn for starters, nobody can credibly deny the
achievement of Jewish composers in American film music).
--Bob Keser
Robert Keser
> <snip> As far as film music goes, not theater, I'd venture closer to Porter,
> who
> really understood the musical film form, and let his songs be
> character-driven.
That's a great point, it's true.
> There really isn't an original Gershwin film musical which stands up against
> either THE PIRATE or HIGH SOCIETY's song scores.
The songs in The Pirate just don't speak to me, for some reason,
while the songs in High Society seem better performed by later
musicians, at least to me. Yet the Gershwin scores have nary a
clinker in them and get definitive performances in the films.
> But, when all is said and done, I'll take Jerome Kern's "The Folks Who Live
> on the Hill" from HIGH, WIDE AND HANDSOME - or Harold Arlen's "With the Sun
> Warm Upon Me" from THE FARMER TAKES A WIFE.
Good, 'cause then I can have Kern's "I'm Old Fashioned" from You
Were Never Lovelier, and Irving Berlin's "Isn't It a Lovely Day?" from
Top Hat. Oh yes, and "Embraceable You"...
--Bob Keser
Liam Devlin
If being circumcised is so much better than not, and being uncut leads
to such a host of maladies in your imagination, why are there so many
Goys and so few Jews? The uncut should have disappeared by now, right,
Mr. Darwin?
Your pal,
Goyyishe LiamD
Liam Devlin
>
> "darr...@aol.com" wrote:
>
> > <snip> Once again, do you think
> > it's just a coincidence that two of the world's most renowned
> > composers happen to be Jewish!?
>
> George Gershwin was a composer. Ira Gershwin was a lyricist:
> a great talent, but a very different talent.
>
> Still, it's fair enough to view George Gershwin and Cole Porter
Footnote: Cole Porter wrote a couple of Yale fight songs. Not many
colleges have someone like him writing songs for football games:-)
keith edgerley
Footnote2footnote: Bet they're not as good as Tom Lehrer's Harvard song.
--
Keith
This is what they call classical music, isn't it?... I can tell because
there's no vocal.
darr...@aol.com
Boy, what a difference a "Bob" makes!heehehehh LOL! Bob Keser, I
simply wish the other Bob (chil...@ix.netcom.com, still hasn't taken
his own alias advice!eheh) was as self-assured, honest and cordial as
you! -D, NYC "This legendary Jewish actor voiced nearly all of Warner
Brothers' cartoon characters - Mel Blanc"
darr...@aol.com
<<If being circumcised is so much better than not, and being uncut
leads to such a host of maladies in your imagination, why are there so
many Goys and so few Jews? The uncut should have disappeared by now,
right, Mr. Darwin?
Your pal, Goyyishe LiamD>>
Liam, you truly are FARBLONDJET!ehehh What good is number, if it
cannot be applied!? Case in point: Where were your 99% of Gentiles
when the 1% of Jews were busy creating Hollywood!? Where were your 99%
of Gentiles when Einstein, Freud & Karl Marx were busy dominating the
intellectual landscape of the 20th century? Where were your 99% of
Gentiles when Dr. Jonas Salk & Dr. Albert Sabin were both busy working
on their polio vaccine discoveries!? One of the most important medical
discoveries of the 20th century. If I sat here and listed every
medical & scientific discovery that Jews have made, we would be here
for an eternity! And it doesn't end there! Choose any field, and you
will find that Jews have excelled in it. Remember, Jews are so few in
number (populous), yet so great in ability (success is
disproportionate to their small number). e.g. Of the 660 Nobel prizes
from 1901-1990, 160 have been won by Jews. That number translates into
winning 40x more than should be expected of them, simply based upon
their small population numbers. In the end, Jews win more Nobel prizes
than any other race or ethnicity. Liam, if we were to judge
circumcision by intellect, I think Jews have more than proven that
circumcision can enrich the mind. Afterall, was Einstein not the
greatest mind to have ever lived? Remember, circumcision is the
defining ritual for a Jew on the eighth day of his life. -D, NYC
"Jews: the few, the proud, the chosen. NYC is the proud home to 1.9
million Jews. Almost two-thirds of the entire American-Jewish
population. Jews are so few in number, yet so great in ability"
Bob
keith edgerley wrote:
>
>
> Footnote2footnote: Bet they're not as good as Tom Lehrer's Harvard song.
True, but then, what IS, except for another Lehrer song?
Bob
R. Cohen
Steve Guttenberg is indeed a cinematic giant.
Wasn't Menahem Golan the "master" of action oriented T&A? Another giant.
Liam Devlin
>
> Liam Devlin wrote:
>
> > Robert Keser wrote:
> > >
> > > "darr...@aol.com" wrote:
> > >
> > > > <snip> Once again, do you think
> > > > it's just a coincidence that two of the world's most renowned
> > > > composers happen to be Jewish!?
> > >
> > > George Gershwin was a composer. Ira Gershwin was a lyricist:
> > > a great talent, but a very different talent.
> > >
> > > Still, it's fair enough to view George Gershwin and Cole Porter
> >
> > Footnote: Cole Porter wrote a couple of Yale fight songs. Not many
> > colleges have someone like him writing songs for football games:-)
>
> Footnote2footnote: Bet they're not as good as Tom Lehrer's Harvard song.
You'd have to be the judge of that, beauty in the eye, etc.
It's hard for me to imagine college kids singing something about "Bingo
that's the lingo..." at a football game, but maybe they did back in the
teens (Porter as class of 1913).
"Bingo, that's the Lingo"
words and music by Cole Porter, '13
sung by Yale Glee Club
Bingo, Bingo,
Bingo, Bingo, Bingo,
That's the lingo,
Eli is bound to win.
There's to be a victory,
So watch the team begin!
B-B-B-Bingo, Bingo, Harvard's [Princeton's] team cannot prevail,
Fight! Fight! Fight with all your might for Bingo,
Bingo,
Eli Yale!
"Bulldog"
music and words by Cole Porter, '13
sung by Yale Glee Club
Bull-dog! Bull-dog! Bow, wow, wow,
Eli Yale!
Bull-dog! Bull-dog! Bow, wow, wow,
Our team can never fail.
When the sons of Eli break through the line,
That is the sign we hail,
From http://www.yale.edu/athletic/songs/son.html, the official Yale
Athletic Dept.
Liam Devlin
(snipped)
That's completely unresponsive.
LiamD
PSmith9626
But, Musically and technically Gershwin was in a higher class than Porter. For
example: Gershwin has classical pieces which are still popular on the concert
stage
( Concerto in F Minor, Rhapsody in Blue, American in Paris), and Porter has
nothing like that.
Structurally Gershwin's pop tunes are more sophisticated than anything
Porter ever wrote.
And I do like Cole Porter.
best
penny
>Message-id: <Pine.LNX.4.43.020311...@zork.plover.net>
PSmith9626
Not to mention Aaron Copland, who among other things was a film composer. Or
Jerome Kern
But there were, of course, many equally talented non jews: Stravinsky
and
N. Roza come to mind.
best
penny
" I will take Rogers and Hart over Rogers and Hammerstein, anytime"--penny
>ou haven't yet mentioned such towering talents as Neil Simon, Steve
>Guttenberg, Tom Bosley or Menahem Golan in your litany of Jewish
>artistic giants. An
These are towering talents. Oh, how our culture has fallen.
Gershwin was in a class with Mozart.
PSmith9626
Because they don't. For every Copland there are ten gentiles like
shostakovich or
Debussy, for every Paul Simon there are ten gentiles like James Taylor, or Duke
Ellington.
The jews are a brilliant people, but in music they do not dominate beyond
their
proportional population.
In physics Nobel Prizes--it is a different story.
best
penny
>hose religion comprises a mere 1/4 of 1% of the world's
>population) overshadow the 99% of Gentiles (non Jews) in ultimately
>becoming synonymous with their chosen craft?
Were Mozart, Beethoven and Bach
jews?
PSmith9626
In fact, hollywood was a haven for jewish composers who were severely
discriminated against by the gentile classical music establishment.
Jews had already established themselves in Tin Pan Alley and on Broadway
by the time of Gershwin. Again, these were viewed as backwaters by the
establishment.
best
penny
PSmith9626
Many of the songs in "Mad Magazine" from the fifties and sixties are.
best
penny
>True, but then, what IS, except for another Lehrer song?
>Bob
How about some of the alan sherman songs?
Bob
PSmith9626 wrote:
Penny, I was just joking. You want a serious discussion of parodies?
Yes, MAD had some hilarious lyrics in the Mag. For that matter, you
mentioned Alan Sherman, one of my favorites. But, for all of that, there
was a certain "touch" in Tom Lehrer that the others, for some reason or
other, did not have. Perhaps Sherman was not "highbrow" enough in his
subject matter. We could not HEAR the MAD lyrics. IMHO, Lehrer is/was
the best parody musician/song writer I have ever heard. ( This is not to
deny the genius of Shermans "Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah")
Bob
PSmith9626
Stravinsky? Was he jewish? I am not sure.
best
penny
He might have been.
Mason Barge
>For every Copland there are ten gentiles like
>shostakovich or
>Debussy, for every Paul Simon there are ten gentiles like James Taylor, or
>Duke
>Ellington.
Exactly. I don't know the figures, but there's no way Jews make up 10% of the
population. Plus, I think it would be better to keep the comparison pool in
the US -- however prevalent anti-semitism may have been here, it was worse in
most places in Europe.
> The jews are a brilliant people, but in music they do not dominate beyond
>their
>proportional population.
I suspect that this is incorrect -- certainly in some narrower classifications,
such as solo violin performers. Whereas, in opera and "classical" vocal
performance, I don't think I have ever heard a Jewish performer other than
(gag) Jan Peerce. They are predominanantly Italian and German.
Gershwin would pretty much singlehandedly skew the proportion for popular
songwriters AND symphonic composers due to his prodigious output and talent.
Go ahead, name an American opera other than Porgy and Bess that people actually
like. Hell, name an American orchestral composition that people actually like.
Well, your alternative to Gershwin is Aaron Copland!
I do think Jews have distorted the motion picture industry -- I can count the
movies where church attendance is shown sympathetically on my fingers and toes.
My favorite was Doc Hollywood, where Michael J. lands in a small South
Carolina town without a church in it.
Whether this distortion is compensated by brilliant contributions to the medium
of cinema, I will leave to greater minds to figure out. In music, though, IMHO
the contribution of Jews clearly outpaces their numbers.
darr...@aol.com
> dear darrin,
> Because they don't. For every Copland there are ten gentiles like
> shostakovich or > Debussy, for every Paul Simon there are ten gentiles like James Taylor, or Duke > Ellington.> The jews are a brilliant people, but in music they do not dominate beyond> their> proportional population.
> In physics Nobel Prizes--it is a different story.
> best
> penny>
Penny, firstly, thank you for such a civilized response. In a cyber
world full of Bob's, your input comes as a breath of fresh air!eheh
Penny, Jews disproportionately inhabit every echelon of the music
industry as well. Not only inhabiting it, but Jews are also
responsible for the very creation of its being!! How so? Emile
Berliner (German-Jew) is the man who developed the modern-day
phonograph. While Thomas Edison was working out a type of phonograph
that used a cylinder as a record, Berliner invented a machine that
would play a disc. The machine he patented was called the gramophone,
and the famous RCA trademark is a picture of a dog listening to "his
master's voice" on Berliner's device. The gramophone was superior to
Edison's machine. In short, Emile Berliner made possible the modern
record industry. His company was eventually absorbed by the Victor
Talking Machine Company, now known as RCA. Penny, is this yet another
coincidence!? LOL! As for your Aaron Copeland analogy!? I can
guarantee you that more music enthusiasts have heard of Copeland than
Debussy. As for Paul Simon!? You say Paul Simon, I say Bob Dylan (b.
Zimmerman). ehe No offense to James Taylor, but I hardly consider
Taylor in the same esteemed class as Dylan!ehe How many Bob Dylans are
there!? How many Leonard Bernsteins are there!? How many Gershwins!?
How many Arthur Fiedlers ("Boston Pops")?
The key to Jewish success has always lied in their distinguished
synonymity. The biggest names in the music industry have always been
Jewish: Barbara Streisand, Dylan, Simon & Garfunkel, Barry Manilow,
Neil Diamond, Neil Sedaka, Gershwin, Irving Berlin, Leonard Bernstein,
Leonard Cohen, Carol King, Carly Simon, Burt Bacharach, Bette Midler,
Billy Joel, etc.). The biggest names behind the music industry have
also been Jewish: Phil Spector (producer, songwriter, label owner,
responsible for creating "The Wall Of Sound" w/ such groups as "The
Ronettes," etc.), Don Kirschner (producer, former host of "Don
Kirschner's Rock Concert, "brill building" founder in NYC, which is
responsible for having produced & written some of the biggest songs in
early rock 'n' roll), Herp Alpert (founder of A&M records,
trumpeter/songwriter - tijuana brass), Clive Davis (founder of Arista
records, considered the grandaddy of 'em all), Leiber & Stoller
(composers, penning such rock classics as Stand By Me, Hound Dog,
Jailhouse Rock), Bill Graham (legendary rock promoter/producer,
founder of The Fillmore East/West), DJ Alan Freed, who coined the term
"rock 'n' roll," etc, etc. Once again, if I sat here and listed every
Jewish pop/rock star, producer, composer, and record company founder,
the list would be endless. All in spite of a religion that comprises a
mere 1/4 of 1% of the world's population. Remember, that small
population number must always be factored into the Jewish success
equation. 99% of the world is non Jewish, remember? continued...
> >hose religion comprises a mere 1/4 of 1% of the world's
> >population) overshadow the 99% of Gentiles (non Jews) in ultimately
> >becoming synonymous with their chosen craft? >
> Were Mozart, Beethoven and Bach
> jews?
No, but Felix Mendelssohn was. Universally ranked as one of the
greatest composers of the 19th century. His grandfather was the famous
Jewish philosopher Moses Mendelssohn. Secondly, your point of
comparison is futile! e.g. There have been thousands upon thousands of
Gentile physicists in the world, and not one will ever achieve the
same universal recognition or impact as Albert Einstein. What good is
number if it cannot be applied!? Remember, it doesn't take an
"Einstein" to excel in this world when you comprise 99% of the world's
population. Jews are so few in number, yet so great in ability! -D,
NYC "This legendary Jewish composer wrote one of the most famous
anthems in American history, "God Bless America" - Irving Berlin"
David
>> Were Mozart, Beethoven and Bach jews?
>
>No, but Felix Mendelssohn was. Universally ranked as one of the
>greatest composers of the 19th century.
If you discount James Taylor because he isn't the artist that Dylan is
(or was), then you have to discount Mendelssohn, who was not a Mozart,
a Beethoven or a Bach -- as Mendelssohn himself would have been the
first to tell you.
In fact, you cannot find a Jewish composer in the Western tradition
who is at the absolute first rank of composers (Bach, Beethoven,
Mozart).
--
Pas de lieu Rhône que nous.
darr...@aol.com
> Because they don't. For every Copland there are ten gentiles like
> shostakovich or> Debussy, for every Paul Simon there are ten gentiles like James Taylor, or Duke> Ellington.> The jews are a brilliant people, but in music they do not dominate beyond> their> proportional population.> In physics Nobel Prizes--it is a different story.best>penny>
Penny, allow me to give you a simpler example: If you were to compile
a listing of the most influential composers (film or otherwise) of the
20th century, half that list would be comprised of Jews. Amazing
numbers, considering that Jews only comprise 1/4 of 1% of the world's
population! This is what you seem to be forgetting! And which Jewish
composers would make such a list? Here's just a taste: George
Gershwin, Leonard Bernstein, Irving Berlin (if these 3 names had been
the only Jewish composers to exist, it would still be enough to last a
lifetime!ehe), Oscar Hammerstein II, Jacob Ludwig Felix Mendelsshon,
Aaron Copland, Stephen Sondheim, Sammy Cahn, Gustav Mahler, Arnold
Schoenberg, Giacomo Meyerbeer, Harold Arlen, Elmer Bernstein, Kander &
Ebb, Adolph Green, Marvin Hamlisch, Burt Bacharach, Rodgers & Hart,
Jerome Kern, Bernard Herrmann, Oscar Levant, Alfred Newman, Andre
Previn, Lalo Shifrin, Dimitri Tiomkin, etc, etc. -D, NYC "This Jewish
scientist is credited with the development of the birth control pill -
Gregory Pincus"
David
>composers would make such a list? Here's just a taste: George
>Gershwin, Leonard Bernstein, Irving Berlin (if these 3 names had been
>the only Jewish composers to exist, it would still be enough to last a
>lifetime!ehe), Oscar Hammerstein II, Jacob Ludwig Felix Mendelsshon,
>Aaron Copland, Stephen Sondheim, Sammy Cahn, Gustav Mahler, Arnold
>Schoenberg, Giacomo Meyerbeer, Harold Arlen, Elmer Bernstein, Kander &
>Ebb, Adolph Green, Marvin Hamlisch, Burt Bacharach, Rodgers & Hart,
>Jerome Kern, Bernard Herrmann, Oscar Levant, Alfred Newman, Andre
>Previn, Lalo Shifrin, Dimitri Tiomkin, etc, etc.
You've got the wrong century on some of these folks.
Pan
[snip]
>In fact, you cannot find a Jewish composer in the Western tradition
>who is at the absolute first rank of composers (Bach, Beethoven,
>Mozart).
How many non-Jewish composers do you put on that list?
Mahler is IMO a very great composer, as is Schoenberg at his best.
Salamone Rossi (called "l'Ebreo") is also pretty wonderful. Not to
mention Mendelssohn, himself.
Michael
To reply by email, please take out the TRASH (so to speak). Personal messages only, please!
PSmith9626
The phonograph was based on the mathematical ideas of Fourier, who was not
jewish. Edison's phonograph was the first and the gramophone a minor
improvement.
We also needed the electronic amplifier and this was invented by Armstrong/
Fleming. Neither of which was jewish.
>While Thomas Edison was working out a type of phonograph
>that used a cylinder as a record, Berliner invented a machine that
>would play a disc. The machine
> I can
>guarantee you that more music enthusiasts have heard of Copeland than
>Debussy.
This is not a good bet. We can add Ravel,
Rimsy-K, Borodin, shostakovich, Vaughn Williams, Phillip Glass, N. Roza,
Wolfgang Eric Korngold, Count Bassy
, John Williams, Bela Bartok and a hundred other non-jews.
Or Steven Foster, Elvis Priestley and a hundred other popular music composers.
> Barbara Streisand
Judy Garland, Lisa Minnelli, Melanie,
Lilly Pons, Maro pinza, and a hundred others.
> The biggest names behind the music industry have
>also been Jewish:
You need to get out more.
>Herp Alpert (founder of A&M records,
Guy Lombardo, Dean martin, Frank Sinatra
>Remember, that small
>population number must always be factored into the Jewish success
>equation. 99% of the world is non Jewish, remember? continued...
99% of the world is not italian christian. I can name a hundred famous
christian italians in musical history, with no effort at all.
>There have been thousands upon thousands of
>Gentile physicists in the world, and not one will ever achieve the
>same universal recognition or impact as Albert Einstein.
Issac Newton did ok.
So did James Clerk Maxwell
Or Galileo
or Heisenberg
best
penny
I did say the jews did very well in physics last century.
PSmith9626
Max Planck
best
penny
darr...@aol.com
> dear bob,> Many of the songs in "Mad Magazine" from the fifties and sixties are.>best>penny>
Penny, and who created MAD MAGAZINE!? You bet - sweet Jews!eheh They
being, William M. Gaines & Harvey Kurtzmann. Penny, is this yet
another coincidence!? ehe Since we're on the subject of comic books,
three of the greatest comic book super heroes of all-time were created
by Jews: SUPERMAN (Joe Shuster & Jerry Siegel), BATMAN (Bob Kane) and
SPIDERMAN (Stan Lee (b. Lieber) & Jack Kirby). Choose any field, and
you will find that Jews have excelled in it. Jews have been given a
special gift - the gift of talent in every field of human endeavor.
All done in spite of the overwhelming odds against them: thousands of
years of persecution, losing 6 million of their people in the
Holocaust, and comprising a mere 1/4 of 1% of the world's population.
-D, NYC "The first American scientist ever awarded the Nobel Prize was
Jewish - Albert Abraham Michaelson"
Speedbyrd@fizban.com Dr. Speedbyrd
you would have been spared, however. You would have been the perfect
instrument in Hitler's quest. A deranged little kike who turned the world
against his own people. What a perfect arrangement!
--
Dr. Speedbyrd
<darr...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:ea3caee5.02031...@posting.google.com...
______________________________________________________________________
Posted Via Uncensored-News.Com - Still Only $9.95 - http://www.uncensored-news.com
With NINE Servers In California And Texas - The Worlds Uncensored News Source
darr...@aol.com
> darr...@aol.com (darr...@aol.com) wrote:
> >Howie, perhaps with the exception of Lennon & McCartney, George & Ira
> >Gershwin (sweet Jews) are two of the most prolific composers of the
> >20th century. Do you think it's just a coincidence that they both
> >happen to be Jewish!?eheeee Once again, wherever you turn, so shall be
> >the Jew! Howie, for a KVETCHING yokel from Colorado, you still have
> >splendid taste!eheheh LOL! -D, NYC "This legendary Jewish composer
> >penned the most popular selling Christmas song, "White Christmas" -
> >Irving Berlin">
> You haven't yet mentioned such towering talents as Neil Simon, Steve
> Guttenberg, Tom Bosley or Menahem Golan in your litany of Jewish
> artistic giants. And what of Jerry Bruckheimer, who bestowed upon the
> world "Flashdance" & "Con Air" & "Top Gun" & "Armageddon"? Oh, &
> "Pearl Harbor.">
David, my favorite master propagandist, so nice to see you again! LOL!
Ah, but there's a Jew for every desired taste!ehe e.g. You say Neil
Simon, I say Arthur Miller!eh You say Steve "OY GUTTENYU" Guttenberg,
I say Dustin Hoffman. You say Menahem Golan, I say David O. Selznick.
You say Tom Bosley, I say Woody Allen (b. Konigsberg). Even amongst
Jews in Hollywood, there has to be some distinction, no!?ehee But
alas, it's very silly for you to even try to pit Jews against each
other, since you're always going to be in a no-win situation. ehe The
simple fact remains: Jews created Hollywood and continue to dominate
every facet of its being. -D, NYC "This Jewish producer was also
responsible for the Todd-AO new method of cinematography - Mike Todd"
darr...@aol.com
From: psmit...@aol.com (PSmith9626)>>
<<dear darrin, The phonograph was based on the mathematical ideas of
Fourier, who was not jewish. Edison's phonograph was the first and the
gramophone a minor improvement. We also needed the electronic
was jewish.>>
Penny, the above is nice filler (ehe), but it still doesn't change the
following fact: Emile Berliner (German-Jew) is the man who invented
the gramophone. An invention that was far superior (contrary to your
"minor" remark) to Edison's machine. An invention that gave way to the
modern record industry. Before Berliner came onto the scene, Thomas &
Fourier were struggling! ehe In essence, Berliner improved on what
Edison was unable to do - replacing a cylinder with a flat disc made
of zinc. Berliner is also credited with improving the clarity of the
telephone. In case you've forgotten: The famous RCA trademark of a
picture of a dog listening to his master's voice is on Berliner's
device!! His company was eventually absorbed by the Victor Talking
Machine Company, now known as RCA. continued...
>> I can guarantee you that more music enthusiasts have heard of
Copeland than Debussy>>
<<This is not a good bet. We can add Ravel, Rimsy-K, Borodin,
Shostakovich, Vaughn Williams, Phillip Glass, N. Roza,Wolfgang Eric
Korngold, Count Bassy, John Williams, Bela Bartok and a hundred other
non-Jews>>
Penny, not a good bet for you, because you are about to remove Phillip
Glass & Erich Wolfgang Korngold from the above list!eheh Both of whom
are Jewish! DOH!eheh Once again, no matter how hard you try to not
name a Jewish composer, it simply cannot be done!eheheh Furthermore,
the discussion centered around Copland (sorry for the "Copeland" typo)
vs. Debussy.
<Barbara Streisand>
<<Judy Garland, Lisa Minnelli, Melanie Lilly Pons, Maro Pinza, and a
hundred others>>
As if to say that I cannot name hundred pop/rock artists who are
Jewish!? LOL!
BABS alone has accomplished what very few have been able to do
successfully: direct, produce, act & sing. She's in a class all to
herself!! What does your list prove!?eheh
<The biggest names behind the music industry have also been Jewish:>>
<You need to get out more.>
<Herp Alpert (founder of A&M records,>
<<Guy Lombardo, Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra>>
Penny, what part of "behind the music industry" did you not
understand!?eheh In this instance, I was specifically referring to the
producers, creators & innovators of the music industry. How then did
you manage to derive at Guy Lombardo and Dean Martin!?eheh LOL!
<,Remember, that small population number must always be factored into
the Jewish success equation! 99% of the world is non-Jewish,
remember?>>
<<99% of the world is not italian christian. I can name a hundred
famous Christian italians in musical history, with no effort at all>>
Penny, what part of "99% of the world is non Jewish" did you not
understand the first time around?heh Dear, the majority of the world
is Christian! LOL! How did you jump from religion to
nationality?!hehehee Even if you were to name 100 Italian-Christians
in music, they would still pale in comparison to the achievement of
the Jews. And I would still be able to match that number
tenfold!ehehehe Penny, can you name me one Italian-Christian (LOL!eh)
who has been able to come close in stature to an Irving Berlin,
Leonard Bernstein, or a George & Ira Gershwin!? Waiting...still
waiting...ehehe ZZzzz eheh
darr...@aol.com
<<Darrin, I completely agree with everything you've stated so far in
this thread, but I have to ask you something: What, in the name of
God, does "!ehe" mean?>>
Tom, it's a dyslexic "ehe!" eheheheheh LOL! -D, NYC "This glazed
yeast-raised doughnut-shaped roll with hard crust is a Jewish creation
- BAGEL"
Mason Barge
>who is at the absolute first rank of composers (Bach, Beethoven,
>Mozart).
Yeah I would have to agree, although Mahler's best work would come mighty
close. Still, there was not enough of it and there was not enough variety to
put him up there with the three you mention.
On the other hand, I have to say (and I am hardly a whining liberal type) that
being Jewish and making a living as a "classical" European composer were pretty
much an impossible combination before the 20th Century. Composers needed
patronage from the church or the aristocracy.
Jews sort of had to do their own thing a lot of the time. Considering the
numbers involved, I would have to say Jewish liturgical music is comparable in
beauty and volume to Christian liturgical music. (Well maybe not in volume,
but again you have to consider the importance and richness of the Church when
looking at the sheer volume of beautiful Christian liturgical music.) If
you've never heard it, it will make your hair stand on end and your heart
bleed.
PSmith9626
Puccini.
best
penny
Off the thread. You are hopeless.
PSmith9626
Actually, it was joint with his american co-worker-- the christian, Morely.
That is why it is Michaelson-Morely.
best
penny
PSmith9626
In the spirit of the Harvard Lampoon. Not created by jews. And, of course,
satire was done in the same vein by Alexander pope, Johnathan Swift, and
Voltaire.
Comics in newpapers way predated the jews, by the way. They go back to the
19th century.
The graphic novel goes back as far as William Blake--who was not a jew.
Oh, and for satirical songs--I could have mentioned Gilbert and Sullivan
(non-jews) instead of Mad Magazine.
best
penny
>Penny, and who created MAD MAGAZINE!? You bet - sweet Jews!eheh They
>being, William M. Gaines & Harve
I know.
>hoose any field, and
>you will find that Jews have excelled in it.
That was never in doubt. It is true for italians or brits or moslems or chinese
buddhists too.
Mason Barge
ROFL.
Mason Barge
>>you will find that Jews have excelled in it.
>
Well as a defender of Jewish contribution to music, I have to say, in the
graphic arts, I have never seen much from Jews. Jewish art is generally
hideous.
darr...@aol.com
<<iri...@aol.com (IrisR1) wrote in message news:<20020314100119...@mb-mg.aol.com>...
> >, you cannot find a Jewish composer in the Western tradition
> >>who is at the absolute first rank of composers>
> Bizet
> Offenbach
> Schoenberg
> Mahler
> Remember, also, that in classical music, being Jewish kept you OUT of the front> rank. Many Jews hid their religion, or changed it. Both Mendelssohn and
> Mahler converted to be more accepted.>> If proportion of population
is the question, there is no doubt that in this> light, Jews have made
a momentously out-of-proportion contribution to music.> And in our
business: Richard Rodgers (Hammerstein half Jewish, I think),> Lorenz
Hart, Lerner and Loewe, Romberg, Kern, Berlin, Arlen and Harburg and>
Rome and Weill and Bernstein and Styne and Loesser and Kander and Ebb
and> Sondheim.> > Is this an argument about who's better, Jews or
non-Jews? Then it's not a very> bright argument.> > Is it about how
many Jews have risen to the top in a field that allows them (or>
doesn't) to contribute?> Best,> Larry Raiken
Larry, after reading your eloquent response, the following words
immediately came to mind: Bravo, Encore, Author!, Author!eheheh David,
now do you see the importance of crossposting!?eheh Since Larry only
posted his response to "rec.arts.theatre.musicals," you would have
been deprived the dishonor of ever having to respond with more
propaganda!hehehe LOL! -D, NYC "This Jewish scientist was the first to
produce electromagnetic waves artificially, which ultimately gave way
to t.v., x-rays, radio & radar. This unit of frequency bears his name
- Heinrich Hertz"
Robert Keser
Darrin, you're not giving us anything to respond to here. When
you insist that Jews are the most important this or that, it seems
like just the flip side of saying Jews are the *least* important this
or that. If you deny that some Jewish artists--Neil Simon, for example,
but there are others--have failings, then you are dehumanizing them
the same as a nazi might. When you move through the history of music
playing who's-a-jew?, that's the exact same game that anti-semites
play, only for different reasons. Most people suspect that extremist
assertions on either side are rarely valid.
Anyone who has read history knows that every Hollywood studio
was started by Jews, and anyone who knows anything about film
music pays tribute to all the great Jewish composers, as indeed many
people have in these posts. Okay, we take our hats off to them, but
now what? What do you want us to do? We'd like to discuss and
compare the movies...
--Bob Keser
Bob
Robert Keser wrote:
There is a strong theory among several people on the newsgroup that Darrin is not really Jewish, but rather a person who wants to engender hate for the Jews. He certainly engenders a lot of dislike for himself.
Bob
Bob
PSmith9626 wrote:
Penny, you are trying to use facts with a propagandist. You
will, I think, find it an exercise in frustration.
Intelligent replies simply do not work with Darrin.
Bob
Bob
PSmith9626 wrote:
Darrin is a frustrating little idiot, isn't he. I tried being civil in my
responses to him at one time. I was soon smacked down by him for my efforts.
Bob
Robert Keser
> >
> > Darrin, you're not giving us anything to respond to here. When
> > you insist that Jews are the most important this or that, it seems
> > like just the flip side of saying Jews are the *least* important this
> > or that. If you deny that some Jewish artists--Neil Simon, for example,
> > but there are others--have failings, then you are dehumanizing them
> > the same as a nazi might. When you move through the history of music
> > playing who's-a-jew?, that's the exact same game that anti-semites
> > play, only for different reasons. Most people suspect that extremist
> > assertions on either side are rarely valid.
> >
> > Anyone who has read history knows that every Hollywood studio
> > was started by Jews, and anyone who knows anything about film
> > music pays tribute to all the great Jewish composers, as indeed many
> > people have in these posts. Okay, we take our hats off to them, but
> > now what? What do you want us to do? We'd like to discuss and
> > compare the movies...
> >
> > --Bob Keser
>
> There is a strong theory among several people on the newsgroup that Darrin is not really Jewish, but rather a person who wants to engender hate for the Jews. He certainly engenders a lot of dislike for himself.
> Bob
Hmmm, I'd like to think that people are not so oblique, but his arguing
for a Master Race does strike a familiar chord...
--Bob Keser
PSmith9626
Actually, I was posting to defend you. He is quite a fool.
best
penny
>Darrin is a frustrating little idiot, isn't he. I tried being civil in my
>responses to him at one time. I was soon smacked down by him for my efforts.
Yes.
darr...@aol.com
> "darr...@aol.com" wrote:
Bob, would you rather have me not debunk her claims that Jews do not
disproportionately excel in the music industry!? LOL! Peggy still has
yet to grasp the simple concept that Jews only comprise a mere 1/4 of
1% (13 million) of the world's population (6 billion). Peggy also
conveniently forgets that only a handful of composers (Jew or Gentile)
truly get to leave their mark on music history. In spite of both these
facts, Jews are still right up there with the non Jews. That was the
crux of my above response!! Bob, your war & peace SCHPIEL would have
been better suited for Peggy!eheh Pose the following question to her:
What part of "99% of the world is non Jewish" does your MESHUGGENEH
brain not understand!?ehehehe -D, NYC "This German-Jew invented the
telephone - and exhibited it publicly 15 years before Alexander Graham
Bell patented the invention - Johann Philipp Reis"
darr...@aol.com
penny
> >Penny, and who created MAD MAGAZINE!? You bet - sweet Jews!eheh They
> >being, William M. Gaines & Harvey Kurtzmann>> Another coincidence!? LOL!>>
> I know.>
> >Choose any field, and
> >you will find that Jews have excelled in it.>
> That was never in doubt. It is true for italians or brits or moslems or chinese> buddhists too.
OY VAY IZ MIR!ehh Here we go again!hehe Penny, but never to the
disproportionate degree of the Jewish people. Italians & Muslims are
non Jews, thus falling into the 99% of the world's non Jewish
population! FARSHTAIST!?eheh Peggy, were you aware that Harvard's
student body & teacher faculty is comprised of 40% Jews!? Over 50% of
former President Bill Clinton's cabinet & staff had been comprised of
Jews. Do the math: How can a religion that comprises 1% of the world's
populous, consistently comprise 40% of Harvard's student body &
teacher faculty? Choose any field, and you will most definitely find a
disproportionate amount of Jews in comparison to the smallness of
their population number. e.g. Prior to Nazi Germany, Jews comprised 1%
of Germany's population. In spite of this, Jews still managed to
constitute 16 percent of its practicing lawyers, 10 percent of its
doctors and dentists, 17 percent of its bankers. In the commercial
community, Jews accounted for 11 percent of the personnel in
real-estate brokerage, 25 percent in retailing, 30 percent in the
clothing trade, and 70 percent in department stores. Peggy, is
deductive reasoning not your forte!?ehehehe -D, NYC "As long as you
SHLEP foreskin around, you're definitely no EINSTEIN!"
Marcello Penso
darr...@aol.com says...
prototype dates back to 1849, then 1854 and presented in 1860. Innocenzo
Manzetti also had a telephone, officially presented in 1865, but first
prototyped in 1850. Reis was probably not far behind, but not the first.
http://www.esanet.it/chez_basilio/meucci_more_info.htm
http://space.tin.it/scienza/macanigg/english.htm
Marcello
Adam
Mason Barge <mason...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
news:20020313085228...@mb-mq.aol.com...
>
>
> I suspect that this is incorrect -- certainly in some narrower
classifications,
> such as solo violin performers. Whereas, in opera and "classical" vocal
> performance, I don't think I have ever heard a Jewish performer other than
> (gag) Jan Peerce. They are predominanantly Italian and German.
>
I'm pretty sure Beverly Sills is Jewish.
But when you talk about Jewish performers, you really find disproportionate
numbers in pop music. And a pretty wide range, as well. You can go from the
sugary pop of Barry Manilow (gag), Carole King and Bette Midler to the hard
core pre-punk of Lou Reed and Iggy Pop. And a ton o' talent in between.
>
> I do think Jews have distorted the motion picture industry -- I can count
the
> movies where church attendance is shown sympathetically on my fingers and
toes.
> My favorite was Doc Hollywood, where Michael J. lands in a small South
> Carolina town without a church in it.
>
I'm not sure that that's a Jewish influence. That film was done in the
1980's, right?
By that time, Hollywood was no longer run by Jews. It was run by
corporations.
The ironic thing is that during the heyday of Jewish control of Hollywood,
you
couldn't *find* a Jew in a Hollywood film! All the heroes were W.A.S.P.s
Such is the desire for assimilation.
Adam "I saw a 900 foot Darwin" Haaretz
Adam
news:<20020313075446...@mb-cb.aol.com>...
>
> > dear bob,> Many of the songs in "Mad Magazine" from the fifties and
sixties are.>best>penny>
>
> Penny, and who created MAD MAGAZINE!? You bet - sweet Jews!eheh They
> being, William M. Gaines & Harvey Kurtzmann. Penny, is this yet
> another coincidence!? ehe Since we're on the subject of comic books
Fans of Mad Magazine know that they did not consider themselves a "comic
book"
They purposely positioned themselves as a "magazine" to avoid content
limitations
laid down by the comic book code.
Darrin, please stop your NARRISHKEIT.
My bubbe always reminded me never to make
a fool of myself in front of the Gentiles.
What you're doing is a SHONDA.
Adam
Mason Barge <mason...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
> >>Choose any field, and
> >>you will find that Jews have excelled in it.
> >
>
> Well as a defender of Jewish contribution to music, I have to say, in the
> graphic arts, I have never seen much from Jews. Jewish art is generally
> hideous.
>
Well, I wouldn't go that far. I have a fondness for Chagall.
But I agree that there's not much in the graphic arts field from Jews.
Much of this goes to a strict interpretation of the 2nd Commandment
which speaks against the creation of graven images.
My personal interpretation is that it forbids one to create graven images
*for the purpose of worshiping them*, but in the past the line was drawn
at the beginning of the sentence.
But enough of this
Let's talk about movies.
That's what this group's about, innit?
Thomas Andrews
but perhaps that stems from a coincidence of time and place - New York City
in the 20s to 50s. In fact, the big names mentioned so far - Copland,
Berlin, Gershwin - are not just Jews but New York Jews. WASP and Catholic
whites were more staid and unadventurous, while the Jewish musicians,
particularly in New York, were open to all sorts of influences, from
classical to jazz to folk melodies. This openness that was certainly a
major factor in these composers' abilities. Their music, rather than being
tied to their traditional music, instead reflected the melting pot, and thus
was truly great American music, with influences wide and deep. [Bernstein
was not a New Yorker by birth... ]
Another aspect of this might be the Russian connection: Copland, Gershwin,
and Berlin were children of Russian Jewish immigrants.
So these three greats share a remarkable set of cultural similarities - all
children of Russian Jewish immigrants to New York City at about the same
time.
=thomas
Liam Devlin
Speaking of Italians, there's a reason all the musical terms are from
the Italian & not Yiddish or Hebrew (or French or german, for that
matter). The Italians are certainly in the front row of any gathering
honoring those who've influenced the arts, e.g., Monteverdi, Verdi, da
Vinci, ..... We all know the names. This is not to say that the Jewish
artists mentioned weren't also outstanding talents, my point is that
they're not alone on Mt. Olympus.
BTW, where did "volts" get their name? <g>
darr...@aol.com
> >For every Copland there are ten gentiles like
> >shostakovich or
> >Debussy, for every Paul Simon there are ten gentiles like James Taylor, or
> >Duke> >Ellington.>
> Exactly. I don't know the figures, but there's no way Jews make up 10% of the
> population. Plus, I think it would be better to keep the comparison pool in
> the US -- however prevalent anti-semitism may have been here, it was worse in
> most places in Europe.
SHNOOKY, no one ever claimed that Jews comprised 10% of the world's
population! They comprise 1/4 of 1%! DOH! Even more amazing, eh!? LOL!
How do you like them apples, ya SHMEGGEGE!?ehhe I label you as such,
because every single one of your responses has an anti-Semitic
overtone to them. In your mad dash to try and refute anything that
praises the Jews, you not only place yourself in a jealous GENTILE
light, but you also lose sight of the facts!! And the simple fact
remains that Jews continue to disproportionately saturate every part
of the music industry. Accept it and move on!! -D, NYC "This legendary
Jewish record producer was the founder of DUNHILL/ABC records - Lou
Adler"
<snipped Mason's anti-Semitic rambling on how Jews are destroying
Hollywood>
Pan
wrote:
>Speaking of Italians, there's a reason all the musical terms are from
>the Italian & not Yiddish or Hebrew (or French or german, for that
>matter). The Italians are certainly in the front row of any gathering
>honoring those who've influenced the arts, e.g., Monteverdi, Verdi, da
>Vinci, ..... We all know the names.
Yes, of course.
> This is not to say that the Jewish
>artists mentioned weren't also outstanding talents, my point is that
>they're not alone on Mt. Olympus.
[snip]
Of course they're not. This is all quite fatuous.
But there was at least one great Italian composer who was Jewish:
Salamone Rossi. There's no contradiction between being Italian and
Jewish, after all. :-)
Michael
To reply by email, please take out the TRASH (so to speak). Personal messages only, please!
darr...@aol.com
> >>Choose any field, and
> >>you will find that Jews have excelled in it.
> Well as a defender of Jewish contribution to music, I have to say, in the
> graphic arts, I have never seen much from Jews. Jewish art is generally
> hideous.>
Boy, for someone who claims to defend the Jewish contribution to
music, why are you so clueless to the actually population number of
Jews, as well as insisting that Jews do not disproportionately excel
in the field of music? As for your latest jealous tirade on trying to
refute Jewish success!? Shall we begin with one of the biggest artists
of the 20th century!? Does MARC CHAGALL (b. Segal) ring a bell!? DOH!
How 'bout ROY LICHTENSTEIN!? On to MAN RAY (b. Emmanuel Radnitsky). We
can also throw in AL HIRSCHFELD, RALPH BAKSHI, PETER MAX, JULIAN
SCHNABEL, MAX LIEBERMANN, JULES PASCIN (b. Pincus), MARK ROTHKO, I.J.
"Friz" FRELENG, MAX FLEISCHER, SOLOMON & PEGGY GUGGENHEIM (not
artists, but patrons of the arts, whose name has become synonymous
with modern art, ala "THE GUGGENHEIM MUSEUM" in NYC - hub of the
world), PAUL RAND (b. Peretz Rosenbaum, one of the most influential
graphic artists/art directors of the 20th century - he designed the
logos for IBM and ABC). Mason, say when and I will list hundreds of
Jewish artists for you! -D, NYC "This Jewish physicist was awarded the
Nobel Prize in 1922 for his series in the investigation of the
structure of atoms & of the radiation emanating from them - Niels
Bohr"
buck
says...
> There is a strong theory among several people on the newsgroup that Darrin is not really Jewish, but rather a person who wants to engender hate for the Jews. He certainly engenders a lot of dislike for himself.
> Bob
>
>
I want to know what makes him think anyone who enjoys music would give a
RATS ASS what the religion of the songwriter is/was.???
(Note the double punctuation, as Im not sure if that was a question or a
statement)
--
Larry Lynch
Mystic, Ct
buck
says...
>
>
> PSmith9626 wrote:
>
> > dear bob,
> > Many of the songs in "Mad Magazine" from the fifties and sixties are.
> > best
> > penny
> >
> > >Bob
> >
> > How about some of the alan sherman songs?
>
> Penny, I was just joking. You want a serious discussion of parodies?
> Yes, MAD had some hilarious lyrics in the Mag. For that matter, you
> mentioned Alan Sherman, one of my favorites. But, for all of that, there
> was a certain "touch" in Tom Lehrer that the others, for some reason or
> other, did not have. Perhaps Sherman was not "highbrow" enough in his
> subject matter. We could not HEAR the MAD lyrics. IMHO, Lehrer is/was
> the best parody musician/song writer I have ever heard. ( This is not to
> deny the genius of Shermans "Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah")
> Bob
>
>
Lets not forget "My Zelda" which kept me in "stitches" for years (pardon
the pun).
Robert Keser
> why are you so clueless to the actually population number of
> Jews, as well as insisting that Jews do not disproportionately excel
> in the field of music? As for your latest jealous tirade on trying to
> refute Jewish success!? Shall we begin with one of the biggest artists
> of the 20th century!? Does MARC CHAGALL (b. Segal) ring a bell!? DOH!
> How 'bout ROY LICHTENSTEIN!? On to MAN RAY (b. Emmanuel Radnitsky). We
> can also throw in AL HIRSCHFELD, RALPH BAKSHI, PETER MAX, JULIAN
> SCHNABEL, MAX LIEBERMANN, JULES PASCIN (b. Pincus), MARK ROTHKO, I.J.
> "Friz" FRELENG, MAX FLEISCHER, SOLOMON & PEGGY GUGGENHEIM (not
> artists, but patrons of the arts, whose name has become synonymous
> with modern art, ala "THE GUGGENHEIM MUSEUM" in NYC - hub of the
> world), PAUL RAND (b. Peretz Rosenbaum, one of the most influential
> graphic artists/art directors of the 20th century - he designed the
> logos for IBM and ABC). Mason, say when and I will list hundreds of
> Jewish artists for you! -D, NYC "This Jewish physicist was awarded the
> Nobel Prize in 1922 for his series in the investigation of the
> structure of atoms & of the radiation emanating from them - Niels
> Bohr
Somehow I picture Darrin laboring in a huge Victorian room
stuffed to the ceiling with papers--like the bureaucratic offices in Brazil
--and dust-covered volumes listing every Jew who ever lived, with
yellowing newspaper clippings about their achievements spilling onto
the floor. Darrin! Open the window!
--Bob Keser
Bob
Pan wrote:
> But there was at least one great Italian composer who was Jewish:
> Salamone Rossi. There's no contradiction between being Italian and
> Jewish, after all. :-)
>
> Michael
There was at one time, some centuries ago, but Italy outgrew the inquisition much faster than
Spain did.
Bob
PSmith9626
Part Jewish and practicing christian--Niels Bohr.
best
penny
PSmith9626
Another connection: Copland, Bernstein, and Gershwin ( along with quite a few
famous composers) learned their composition skills at the feet of Nadia
Boulanger in Paris.
best
penny
>In fact, the big names mentioned so far - Copland,
>Berlin, Gershwin - are not just Jews but New York Jews.
The deal was: She was allowed as a woman into the academy francois if and only
if she never let her own music be published under her own name.
( The reader may draw her own conclusions).
However, Rhapsody in Blue predates Gershwin't time with her. I was however
orchestrated ( set for an orchestra) by Ferde Grofe--who was a Nadia graduate.
Marcello Penso
says...
But then again the Romans were not all Italians either...
Marcello
PSmith9626
Yes. Sometimes, being kept out of the establishment has its advantages.
For example, Film composers like Wolfgang Korngold had lots of prewritten
symphonic music that nobody would perform in europe because they were jewish.
In america, they could write wonderful film music at speed. ( God, I love
Korngold's stuff).
best
penny
>while the Jewish musicians,
>particularly in New York, were open to all sorts of influences, from
>classical to jazz to folk melodies.
Or in paris which made new york look lame at the time.
Asking american born composers to use american folk music and jazz was a
personal kick of Nadia Boulanger.
Bob
PSmith9626 wrote:
> dear bob,
> Actually, I was posting to defend you. He is quite a fool.
> best
> penny
Yes, Penny, I know, and your efforts are appreciated. The best thing to do with
Darrin is, I think, continue to let him yell into empty space. Certainly, nobody
of any intelligence listens to him.
>
>
> >Darrin is a frustrating little idiot, isn't he. I tried being civil in my
> >responses to him at one time. I was soon smacked down by him for my efforts.
>
> Yes.
I did receive an e-mail from another sometimes poster, who did not want to go to
the net with his theory, ( for I too, think it is far-fetched), that Darrin is
really of Arab extraction, and trying to engender anti Jewish anti Israeli
sentiment with his abrasive and obnoxious behavior.. I don't think so, for
several reasons.
Bob
Bob
Marcello Penso wrote:
Going back 2000 years ago. All Italians were Romans. Not all Romans were Italians.
Would that be a fair comment?
Bob
PSmith9626
Actually, there were no italians.
best
penny
Larry Rekow
<rfk...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>Somehow I picture Darrin laboring in a huge Victorian room
>stuffed to the ceiling with papers--like the bureaucratic offices in Brazil
>--and dust-covered volumes listing every Jew who ever lived, with
>yellowing newspaper clippings about their achievements spilling onto
>the floor. Darrin! Open the window!
>
>--Bob Keser
Too right. I actually imagine him as being a cross between the
"Nowhere Man" from the Beatle's YELLOW SUBMARINE and "Nathan" (the
Kevin Kline role) from SOPHIE'S CHOICE.
Too bad he's wasting what might have been a good mind on such minutia.
Is it just sad to watch his slide down the slippery slope towards
bigotry, or fascinating? Or both?
I hadn't thought of THROUGH A GLASS DARKLY in a long time, but.....
Larry Rekow
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown."
Marcello Penso
says...
have been entirely undertaken by people from the Italic peninsula, and
could also have even some Jewish-to-Roman citizen/soldier converts.
Marcello
Frank R.A.J. Maloney
news:3C9368E6...@ix.netcom.com...
Actually, the correct answer is rather complicated and at minimum depends on
the exact moment in the history of ancient Rome you're referring to.
Before the so-called Social (from socii, allies) War of BCE 90, Rome had
conquered all of "Italy", as the term was understood then and the non-slave
subjects of Rome were divided into four classes: Roman citizens, the Latins
(citizen of the old Latin towns that surrounded Rome per se), the Allies or
Socii (free inhabitants of Italy who were neither Romans nor Latins), and
Provincials (free subjects of Rome outside of Italy).
After the Social War, a law called the lex Julia extended Roman citizenship
to all Italians and to the Gauls of northern Italy. A person could be born a
citizen, acquire it through emancipation from slavery, or be given it as a
reward at the government's pleasure. (Remember how important Roman
citizenship was to St. Paul and to Judah Ben-Hur, to use an obligatory movie
reference.)
As the power of the later emperors grew and the political rights of
citizenship declined, citizenship was extended until by the time Antoninus
Caracalla it was granted to the entire Roman world. The process of
eliminating classes of citizenship ended in the time of Justinian.
I promise this is just crudest outline of the main points and leaves out all
the interesting details. Ain't you glad you asked?
--
Frank in Seattle
___________
Frank Richard Aloysius Jude Maloney
Aden
industrious and have survived and excelled in many fields (for the
good and the bad). But I have one question for you, what have you
done? What can you boast of? Who is going to place you on a list of
famous Jews? No one. Why? Because you are a low life who wastes his
time on the net posting about the accomplishments of others in order
to make himself feel better by basking in their praise. You know what
I think, I think you are insecure about your own shortcomings and feel
a pseudo sense of accomplishment by attributing others success to your
own (though they have nothing to do with you). If you are building a
case to determine a rule about the capability of Jews, than I would
say you are definitely an exception to that rule. And there is
nothing you can say which can rebut that. Get a life.
Aidan
darr...@aol.com (darr...@aol.com) wrote in message news:<ea3caee5.02031...@posting.google.com>...
> <<Subject: Re: Gershwin or Porter?
> From: Akir...@aol.complacency (Tom Sutpen)>>
>
> <<Darrin, I completely agree with everything you've stated so far in
> this thread, but I have to ask you something: What, in the name of
> God, does "!ehe" mean?>>
>
> Tom, it's a dyslexic "ehe!" eheheheheh LOL! -D, NYC "This glazed
> yeast-raised doughnut-shaped roll with hard crust is a Jewish creation
> - BAGEL"
Peter T. Daniels
>
> In article <3C9368E6...@ix.netcom.com>, chil...@ix.netcom.com
> says...
> > Going back 2000 years ago. All Italians were Romans. Not all Romans were Italians.
> > Would that be a fair comment?
> > Bob
> >
> >
> Yes, that's what I meant. The occupation of Palestine by Romans would not
> have been entirely undertaken by people from the Italic peninsula, and
> could also have even some Jewish-to-Roman citizen/soldier converts.
Flavius Josephus probably being the best-known.
--
Peter T. Daniels gram...@att.net
David
>> Yes, that's what I meant. The occupation of Palestine by Romans would not
>> have been entirely undertaken by people from the Italic peninsula, and
>> could also have even some Jewish-to-Roman citizen/soldier converts.
>
>Flavius Josephus probably being the best-known.
And even Ol' Flav's stock has fallen in recent months.
--
Pas de lieu Rhône que nous.
Bob
Aden wrote:
> I think we all can agree that generally Jewish people are very
> industrious and have survived and excelled in many fields (for the
> good and the bad). But I have one question for you, what have you
> done? What can you boast of? Who is going to place you on a list of
> famous Jews? No one. Why? Because you are a low life who wastes his
> time on the net posting about the accomplishments of others in order
> to make himself feel better by basking in their praise. You know what
> I think, I think you are insecure about your own shortcomings and feel
> a pseudo sense of accomplishment by attributing others success to your
> own (though they have nothing to do with you). If you are building a
> case to determine a rule about the capability of Jews, than I would
> say you are definitely an exception to that rule. And there is
> nothing you can say which can rebut that. Get a life.
>
> Aidan
I have said essentially the same thing to him several times. Granted, you were much more erudite than I was. He
doesn't get it, or refuses to acknowledge it. Instead, he says I have Alzheimer's, and must be fixating on him.
Yes, I'm an old fart, but no Alzheimer's ( at least, yet. Yes, it could happen, Deity forbid.).
Bob
David wrote:
Why? Did he have Arthur Anderson for accountants?
Bob
Bob
PSmith9626 wrote:
Italian. Someone born on the Italian peninsula.
Yes, it is simplistic, but then, I am a simple person.
Bob
Marcello Penso
fr...@blarg.net says...
Marcello
PSmith9626
WIll and Adrian Durant's "History of the World" will work.
Also try Gibbon:" Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire"
or the online encylopedia Britannica.
best
penny
Mason Barge
Actually I think Bob is closer to the truth, although the term "Latins" might
be more appropriate I think, describing a group of tribes outside Rome proper
(with a variety of political relationships to Rome), and south of Italian Gaul,
many of which gradually became citizens.
"If this is coffee, please bring me some tea. If this is tea, please bring me
some coffee."
- Abraham Lincoln
darr...@aol.com
> dear bob,
> Actually, I was posting to defend you. He is quite a fool.
> best>penny
Penny, I would really be a fool, if I sat back and allowed you to
incorrectly list Jewish composers (Philip Glass, Erich Wolfgang
Korngold) as GOYIM, and insist that Jews do not saturate every facet
of the music industry!eheheh LOL!
-D, NYC "This Jewish record producer is the co-founder of Atlantic
records and is credited with coining the musical term/genre, "R&B" -
Jerry Wexler"
darr...@aol.com
A lot of the great American composers of the twentieth century were
Jewish,
but perhaps that stems from a coincidence of time and place - New York
City
in the 20s to 50s. In fact, the big names mentioned so far - Copland,
Berlin, Gershwin - are not just Jews but New York Jews. WASP and
Catholic
whites were more staid and unadventurous, while the Jewish musicians,
particularly in New York, were open to all sorts of influences, from
a
major factor in these composers' abilities. Their music, rather than
being
tied to their traditional music, instead reflected the melting pot,
and thus
was truly great American music, with influences wide and deep.
[Bernstein
was not a New Yorker by birth... ]Another aspect of this might be the
Russian connection: Copland, Gershwin,and Berlin were children of
Russian Jewish immigrants. So these three greats share a remarkable
set of cultural similarities - all children of Russian Jewish
immigrants to New York City at about the same time.=thomas>>
Thomas, when you consider that NYC (hub of the world) has produced &
inspired more notables, celebrities and intellectuals than any other
city in the world, the above should come as no surprise. From
1892-1924, the largest influx of European & East European Jews came
through Ellis Island & the port of New York. Remember, cultural
diversity and greatness breeds cultural diversity and greatness.
Secondly, NYC is home to the largest Jewish population in the USA -
1.9 + million Jews. Almost two-thirds of the entire American-Jewish
population. That number alone should tell you just how few Jews there
are in the world. -D, NYC "The cultural, financial, media and fashion
capital of the world"
darr...@aol.com
> darrin,
> Part Jewish and practicing christian--Niels Bohr.
> best> penny>>
Ah, I see you finally omitted the word "dear" from your greeting! eheh
FYI: Bohr was born to a Jewish mother, thus making him a full-blooded
Jew under Talmud law. The matriarchal lineage is what determines
Judaism. Next... eheheeh eh -D, NYC "This Jewish doctor developed a
maneuver which has saved countless people from choking. The maneuver
is named after him - "Henry Heimlich"
darr...@aol.com
> Robert Keser <rfk...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> >Somehow I picture Darrin laboring in a huge Victorian room
> >stuffed to the ceiling with papers--like the bureaucratic offices in Brazil
> >--and dust-covered volumes listing every Jew who ever lived, with
> >yellowing newspaper clippings about their achievements spilling onto
> >the floor.>
> crossposting troll -- quite a different kettle of lobster from the
> genuine scholar of Jewish thought & achievement.>>
"David" must still be soaking wet from my last tongue lashing! LOL!
eheh David, has "troll" become the new definition for not wanting to
put up with your insanely jealous propaganda against the Jews!? Hint:
If you don't want a larger audience (eheh), try and curb your maniacal
behavior!! Furthermore, you don't have to be Dr. Sigmund "sweet Jew"
Freud to know what you are suffering from!eheh Once again, when the
argument is lost, or when sensitivity prevails over truth, everyone
immediately becomes a troll or a Nazi. David, playing the "Godwin's
Law" card is the poor man's game!! -D, NYC "This Jewish founder of
Mercury Records was also an important talent agent whose clients
included Jack Benny, Doris Day, and others - Berle Adams"
darr...@aol.com
> dear darrin,
> Puccini.> best> penny
> Off the thread. You are hopeless.>
Penny, a Christian whose religion comprises 99% of the world's
population. A Christian whose name primarily remains in the past
tense, while Gershwin's legacy can still be felt to this day. Once
again, it all comes back to influence, legacy, accessibility and
endurance. Penny, how many contemporary artists have covered Puccini?
LOL! Here are just a few of the many who have covered Gershwin: Ella
Fitzgerald, Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Janis Joplin, David Bowie,
Willie Nelson, Cher, Peter Gabriel, Sting, Meat Loaf, Elton John,
Sinead O' Connor, Barbara Streisand, Carly Simon, John Williams,
Billie Holiday, Count Basie, Louis Armstrong, etc. Penny, are you
going to sit there and have us believe that Puccini has exerted the
same influence on contemporary music as Gershwin!? LOL! Penny, at the
rate you're going, there won't be any more corners left for you to
back into!ehheeheh -D, NYC "The development of anthropology or the
study of man as a modern science was begun, largely in the United
States, by German-Jew FRANZ BOAS"
> >Penny, can you name me one Italian-Christian (LOL!eh)
> >who has been able to come close in stature to an Irving Berlin,
> >Leonard Bernstein, or a George & Ira Gershwin!? Waiting...still
PSmith9626
Obviously you don't go to the opera.
> Penny, how many contemporary artists have covered Puccini?
>Penny, a Christian whose religion comprises 99% of the world's
>population.
You asked for one italian christian. I gave you one. I could give you a
hundred. But, I was amused at your ignorance.
>A Christian whose name primarily remains in the past
>tense, while Gershwin's legacy can
In your dreams. More people listen to Puccini. And I like Gershwin. His scores
are interesting--especially the bridges in
Rhapsody in Blue.
>Penny, are you
>going to sit there and have us believe that Puccini has exerted the
>same influence on contemporary music as Gershwin!?
More. Including on Gershwin, by the way. He was no musical illiterate. Porgy
and Bess was inspired by Pucinni.
>NYC "The development of anthropology or the
>study of man as a modern science was begun, largely in the United
>States, by German-Jew FRANZ BOAS"
Nope. It was developed in germany in the 19th century.
>> >Penny, can you name me one Italian-Christian (LOL!eh)
I did. Everyone else was amused.
PSmith9626
Perhaps full blooded by jewish law by not by the laws of GENETICS.
best
penny
>FYI: Bohr was born to a Jewish mother, thus making him a full-blooded
>Jew under Talmud law
>Ah, I see you finally omitted the word "dear" from your greeting!
I got more familar. WHy do you call me Peggy?
PSmith9626
I learned the so-called Heimlich maneuver
in Judo school as a child. It is the traditional japanese judo method of
helping a choked person to recover. In fact, you don't need a blockage--it
stimulates nerves to help breathing as well as pushing out obstructions.
You may check the book on Judo of Bruce Tegner ( from decades before
Heimlich) to see the maneuver described.
best
penny
>"This Jewish doctor developed a
>maneuver which has saved countless people from choking. The maneuver
>is named after him - "Henry Heimlich"
Ok gee, he took a judo course.
PSmith9626
Nor do you have to be Charcot--the french christian genius who trained Freud
and got it right before Freud screwed it all up.
best
penny
" Freud, the man who confused Charcot's theory of dissociation and did for the
unconscious what NYC has done for the beaches of New Jersey, thus holding back
clinical psychology for a century."--Kluft,
HEad of the Institute of Philedelphia Dissociative disorders Unit.
Freud --as it has been documented by the former head of the Freud History
Project---
lied about the child abuse of his colleagues
daughter and recanted his early child abuse theory ( which was correct) to save
his friendship and his professional standing.
He was responsible for thousands of female patients in psychoanalysis being
told their real memories were "fantasy dreams' according to Freud's revised
theory.
He also convinced one of his wealthy and highly suggestible clients to donate
a fortune to his institute.
]
Freud was also the man who championed the use of Heroin as a safe
non-addictive opium substitute causing thousands of addictions.
>Furthermore, you don't have to be Dr. Sigmund "sweet Jew"
>Freud to know what you are suffering from!eheh O
Freud was a true jerk, thief, scoundrel
and liar.
PSmith9626
>Philip Glass, Erich Wolfgang
>Korngold)
But there are so many I listed who were not jewish. Want dozens more.
best
penny
I am really tired of this nonsense.
Mason Barge
>incorrectly list Jewish composers (Philip Glass, Erich Wolfgang
>Korngold) as GOYIM
I haven't been following this too much, but if you are down to arguing about
Erich Korngold and Philip Glass, you are -- well not scraping the barrel, but
well below the "cream" layer.
Liam Devlin
>
> psmit...@aol.com (PSmith9626) wrote in message news:<20020314091331...@mb-fm.aol.com>...
>
> > dear darrin,
> > Puccini.> best> penny
> > Off the thread. You are hopeless.>
>
> Penny, a Christian whose religion comprises 99% of the world's
> population. A Christian whose name primarily remains in the past
> tense, while Gershwin's legacy can still be felt to this day. Once
> again, it all comes back to influence, legacy, accessibility and
> endurance. Penny, how many contemporary artists have covered Puccini?
> LOL! Here are just a few of the many who have covered Gershwin: Ella
> Fitzgerald, Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Janis Joplin, David Bowie,
> Willie Nelson, Cher, Peter Gabriel, Sting, Meat Loaf, Elton John,
> Sinead O' Connor, Barbara Streisand, Carly Simon, John Williams,
> Billie Holiday, Count Basie, Louis Armstrong, etc.
Here's a list of covers of Joni Mitchell tunes. It includes artists as
diverse as Sinatra, Judy Collins, Prince, etc. "Both Sides Now", on its
own, has been covered more than 300 times, by artists such as: Neil
Diamond, Chet Atkins, Glen Campbell, Clannad, Pete Seeger & the United
States Army Chamber Orchestra.
ALL I WANT
Tim Curry (1978)
Read My Lips
Nick DeCaro (1974) Italian Graffiti (MCA Records)
ECM Artists (1974) from Swedish LP
Jon Jang (1999) Self-Portrait
Keith Jarrett (1971) The Mourning of a Star (Atlantic-SD 1596)
Lydia Van Dam Group (1999) Both Sides Now
Andrea Marcovicci (2000) Here, There and Everywhere
Natalie Merchant (Live) (1995)
Judy Niemack (198 )
Ann Sally (2001) Voyage
The Supremes (1972) Stoned Love
Traut / Rodby (1989) The Great Lawn (Columbia-CK 44472)
AMELIA
Greg Brown Mary Chapin-Carpenter and Shawn Colvin (2000) (Live at An All
Star Tribute
to Joni Mitchell)
Marianne Faithfull (Live) (1983)
Stevie Salas (1995) Back From the Living
Dave Stewart & Barbara Gaskin (1992) Spin
A STRANGE BOY
Sisterboy (1996)
A Wish To You
BANQUET
Lani Hall (1975)
Hello It's Me
Manfred Mann Band (1986) Criminal Tango
BARANGRILL
Mark Murphy (1999) Sings Nat King Cole and More
Karen Oberlin (2000) My Standards
BE COOL
Dawn Aitken (2000) Aitken
Jacqui Fizgerald (1985)
The Masquerade is Over
Lydia Van Dam Group (1999) Both Sides Now
Claire Martin (1997) Waiting Game
Christine Sullivan Here and Now
BIG YELLOW TAXI
Monty Alexander (1988) Ivory & Steel
Julie de Azevedo Pray for Rain Concert Tour
Del Beazley World's Got To Choose
Big Country (1996) Eclectic
Maire Brennan (1994) Misty Eyed Adventures
Mary Chapin-Carpenter, Shawn Colvin, and James Taylor (2000)(Live at An
All Star Tribute
to Joni Mitchell)
Big Country (1996) Eclectic
Blue System Twilight
Denjean, Claude & Synthesizer (1973) Open Circuit
Dogtrax
Bob Dylan (1973), Dylan
Eddie from Ohio (2000) Live at Ziggy's 6/1/00
Elmerhassel Do You Want A Japanese To Do?
Percy Faith (1971)
Black Magic Woman
Feddy, Jason Fish On the Moon
BB Gabor
Amy Grant (1994)
Amy Grant (The Remixes) (1995)
Loran Grant BBC Music: Star for a Night
Lorin Grean
Green Day
Vera Haime (2000) Came Upon A Child of God
Hodge Podge Imaginary Numbers
Hollywood Session Singers T.V. Superhits
Dick Hyman The Sensuous Piano of Dick Hyman
Janet Jackson (1997) (sampling Joni) Velvet Rope
J.R. & Sharon Too Many Parades
Lilac Time (1992)
Vickie-Maree Loach All Play
Loaded Boxers
Mia Martini (1983) I Miei Compagni di Viaggio
Sarah McLachlan (Live @ Lilith Fair)
MFQ (Modern Folk Quartet) Highway 70 (1995)
Negative Space (1970) Debut
The Neighborhood (1970)
Pinhead Gunpowder (1994) Jump Salty
Lorraine Scott (1992) Back to the Garden
Sir Douglas Quintet
Sugar Beats (1993) Really Cool Songs
Tar Heel Voices (2000) Deuces Wild
Taxi Gang (1998) La Trenggae
The Albion Band (1999) Songs from the Shows
The Take Take One
Toxic Audio Toxic Audio
Voce So Many Ways
Jaymes Warnock Both Hands in the Fyre
When the Cat's Away (1989) (45 single)
BLACK CROW
Molly Johnson (1992) Back to the Garden
David Lahm (2001) More Jazz Takes on Joni Mitchell
Lydia Van Dam Group (1999) Both Sides Now
Will Taylor (2001) Will Taylor w/Strings Attached
Richard Thompson (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Cassandra Wilson (1994) Blue Light 'Til Dawn
BLONDE IN THE BLEACHERS
Lou Barlow (1995) on solo CD-single and on Lou Barlow and Friends (1994)
David Lahm (1999) Jazz Takes on Joni Mitchell
Squiddly (1992) Back to the Garden
BLUE
Trish Colter & Paul Reed (1997) The Dance Never Ends
Marc Copland (1998) Softly
Frente (1993)
No Time
EP
Joe Locke Quintet (1977) Slander (and other Love Songs)
Paul Horn (1974) Visions (with Joni on vocal doo's)
Bill Lazwell (1998) Jazzonia
Sarah McLachlan (1996) Rarities, B-Sides, and Other Stuff
BLUE MOTEL ROOM
David Lahm (1999)
Jazz Takes on Joni Mitchell
BORN TO TAKE THE HIGHWAY
Foggy Dew-O (1994) Acoustic Nuisance
BOTH SIDES NOW (apparently this "child" has been recorded more than 300
times!)
Acoustic Nuisance (1994)
Acoustic Nuisance
Aerial Landscapes
Ronnie Aldrich
Robert Allen The Naked Piano
Julie Anthony You and I
Chet Atkins (1969)
This Is Chet Atkins
Baillie & the Boys (1996) Lovin' Every Minute
Cilla Black (1970)
Sweet Inspiration
Bola Sete (1968) Haciendo Algo Especial
Boomtang Boys
Denny Books Denny Brooks
Brother Love Canal (1998) Brother Love Canal EP
Brothers Four (1997) Greenfields & Other Gold
Ray Brown Just Ray Brown
Ed Bruce (1969) Shades of Ed Bruce
Max Bygraves
Glen Campbell (1970) Try A Little Kindness
Carteret High School Choir
Cartoon Reunion
Michael Chapdelaine (1997) Romantic Guitar - Killing Me Softly
Charles Curtis Trio Volcanoes
Clannad & Paul Young (1991) Switch (Soundtrack)
Tom Clay (1971) What The World Needs Now Is Love
Natalie Cole (1996) For Our Children Too!
Judy Collins (1967) Wildflowers
Judy Collins (1999) (Live)
Floyd Cramer
Bing Crosby (1969) Hey Jude/Hey Bing
Gerard Crosson
Sharon Cuneta
Marcel Dadi (1992) La Guitare A Dadi V.2
John Davidson (1969)
Doris Day (1999) Que Sera Sera
Blossom Dearie (1997) Whisper For You
Dee Felice Trio In Heat
Valerie DeLaCruz (1998) My Girlfriend's Quilt
Neil Diamond (1969) Love Songs
Neil Diamond (Live) (197 )
Louis van Dijk and Rogies van Otterloo Collage
Dion (1968) Dion
Dust & Ashes (1970) Dust & Ashes
Enoch Light & The Brass Menagerie
European Jazz Trio Europa
Evson The Best of Evson
Fairport Convention (1996) Ashley Hutchings, The Guv'nor Vol. 4
Percy Faith (1969) Those Were The Days
Jason Falkner (1997) Follow Me
Michael Feinstein (1990) The Very Best of Michael Feinstein
Julie Felix (1969) This World Goes Round and Round
Foggy Dew-O (1968) Born to Take the Highway
Pete Fountain Both Sides Now
Hal Frazier (1968) Hal Frazier
Jill Galt Memories
David Gerrard With All My Love
Stan Getz (1969) Marrakesh Express
Dizzy Gillespie (1969) Cornucopia
Kathie Lee Gifford (2000) Born for You
Go-Betweens (1988)
16 Lovers' Lane
Benny Goodman (1970) Happiness Is... Up, Up and Away with the Happy Hits
of Today
Robert Goulet (1969)
Davey Graham (1968)
Large As Life and Twice As Natural
Joel Grey Black Sheep Boy
George Hamilton IV (1969) Canadian Pacific
Claire Hammill/Andrew Warren (1998) Summer (Bonus LP)
Bev Hanson Sentimentally Yours
Jane Henderson (1994) It Might Be Spring
Harper's Bizarre (45 single)
Al Hirt Al Hirt Now
Hole (1991) Pretty On The Inside
Hot Biscuit Disco
Hudson Dusters
Dick Hyman Trio (1969) The Age of Electronicus
The Innocence Mission (Live) (1995)
The Johnstons (1968) Give A Damn
Kamahl Kamahl
Howard Keel Howard Keel
Ken Watters Group (2001) Southern Exposure
Asao Kikuchi Childisc, Voume 1
Kiri Te Kanawa
Floyd Kramer (1970)
Marie LaForet (French)
Cleo Laine (1973) Woman to Woman
Enoch Light & The Brass Menagerie (1969)
Lincoln Mayorga (1972) The Missing Linc, Vol. 2
Jeanette Lindstrom (2000) Feathers
Claudine Longet (1969) Colours
Lydia Van Dam Group (1999) Both Sides Now
Mantovani (1969) The Mantovani Scene
Eva Maria (1969) Zingara
Pat Martino (1974) Consciousness
Pat Martino w/Cassandra Wilson (1997) All Sides Now
Hugh Masekela (1994) Reconstruction
Jeanne McDonald
Catherine Mckinnon Both Sides Now
Rod McKuen
Me, live in various rooms around the house
Ian McShane (1992) From Both Sides Now
Mabel Mercer (1969) Mabel Mercer & Bobby Short祐econd Town
Jane Michel (1997) The World of American Folk
Eric Miller and His Orchestra (1992) Sweetheart Tree
Glen Miller Band Do You Wanna Dance
Chad Mitchell Chad
Tony Mottola Tony Mottola & The Guitar Underground
Nana Mouskouri (French Version) (1969)
Nana Mouskouri (1991) Essential
Movin' Dream Orchestra Yesterday's Dream柚ovie Theme Classics
Anne Murray (1997) Both Sides Now
Mystic Moods Orchestra (1969)
Jim Nabors (1973) The Golden Voice of Jim Nabors
Willie Nelson (1970)
Sweet Memories
Phyllis Newman (1968) Those Were The Days
Leonard Nimoy Highly Illogical
Nitty Gritty Dirt Band (1972)
Mark O'Connor (1988) Elysian Forest
Mary O'Hara (2000) Always
Ohio Singers (1994) Greenfields (the Great American Folksongs)
Oliver (1969) Good Morning Starshine
Orlando (1970) Harp, Voice, Tears
Parasite (1994) Pair
Barry Phillips (2000) Gentleman Sings
Nat Raider Nat Raider Does His Thing
Boots Randolph (1970) Boots Randolph Hit Boots
Dianne Reeves (1995) Quiet After the Storm
Dianne Reeves (1995) Morning Becomes Eclectic 6-16-95
Jimmie Rodgers (1969) Windmills Of Your Mind
Nina Rousso
Roger Saint-Denis & Dan Gibson (1998) Heart of Summer
Ann Sally (2001) Voyage
Earl Scruggs (1972) Live at Kansas State 1972
Randy Scruggs (1998) Crown of Jewels
Pete Seeger (1969) Young vs. Old
Bola Sete (1968) Haciendo Algo Especial
Bud Shank Let It Be (w/The Bob Alcivar Singers)
Fred Simon (2000) Songs of My Youth, Vol. 1
Frank Sinatra (1968) Cycles
Singers Unlimited (1971) A Capella
David Snell
Almeta Speaks Blues & Spirituals
Harry Stoneham (1971) Solid Gold Hammond
Brad Swanson Brad Swanson And His Whispering Organ
David Syme (1994) Keys to Your Heart
Gabor Szabo (1969) 1969
The Ballroom Band (1995) Samba
The Collection
The Don Costa Concept The Don Costa Concept
The Electric Concept Orchestra (1968) The First Album of Electronic Rock
The Tokens (1971) Both Sides Now
Emilliana Torrini
Treasure (2000) Came Upon A Child of God
Txarango Todo Tiene su Sitio Bojo El Sol
United States Army Chamber Orchestra (1973) The United States Army Band
Presents the
United States Army Chamber Orchestra
Katerina Valente
Dave Van Ronk (1968) Chrrestomathy
Sharon Veer (1979) Yesterday's Dreams
Lonie Walker All That I've Got I Gave To Music
Patti Weaver No Ones' Ever Seen This Side of Me
Viola Wells (198 )
Welyn Garden City Band Best of Brass
Kim Weston (45 single)
Roger Whittaker (1975) Fire and Rain
Roger Whittaker Roger Whittaker有ive
Hank & Lewie Wickham Hank & Lewie Wickham with Johnny Dagucon
Paul Winter The Winter Consort
Andy Williams (1970) The Impossible Dream
Williams & Valentine Romantic Flute & Guitar, 40 All-Time Romantic
Favorites
Kate Wolf Carry It On
Paul Young & Clannad (1991) Switch (Soundtrack)
CACTUS TREE
Julie Adams (1997) Julie Adams & The Mountain Stage Band - Live
Marina Belica & Friends Live at the Gallery, NYC 6/22/99
CAREY
Trish Colter & Paul Reed (1997) The Dance Never Ends
Dianne Davidson (1972) Mountain Mama
Kiki Dee (1995)
Kiki Dee Live - Almost Naked
Goldie Hawn (1972)
Goldie
Marian Hoiting Kwartet (1999) Celebrate The Heart
Cyndi Lauper (2000) (Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Random Maxx (1999) Senseless Beauty
Universal Honey (1997) Back to the Garden
A CASE OF YOU
Tori Amos (1994)
Spew U (Atlantic's CMJ Survival Kit)
A Bird That Whistles (1996) A Bird That Whistles
Betty Buckley (1994) With One Look
Trish Colter & Paul Reed (1997) The Dance Never Ends
Marjan Cornille, Won't You Try
Michael Holland (1999) Darkness Falls
Brian Kennedy Won't You Take Me Home
Diana Krall (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Caroline LaVelle (1995) Spirit
Graham Nash (1992) Graham Nash: Medium Rare
Angie Palmer (1994), A Certain Kind of Distance
Prince (1983) Live at First Avenue (video)
Sloan (1992) Back to the Garden
Joe Slomp (2000) Introducing Joe Slomp
Phoebe Snow (1998) I Can't Complain
Susan Webb (1975) Bye Bye Pretty Baby
Keller Williams
Nancy Wilson (of Heart) (1999) Live at McCabe's Guitar Shop
A CHAIR IN THE SKY
Mingus Dynasty (1979) Chair in the Sky.
CHELSEA MORNING
A Bird That Whistles (1996) A Bird That Whistles
Walter Barr (1980) Walter Barr
Peggy Chew (1999) Real Days
Judy Collins (Live) (1971) from the album Living.
Judy Collins (1997) Re-recording for double album anthology Forever
Mary Chapin-Carpenter and Shawn Colvin (2000)(Live at An All Star
Tribute to Joni
Mitchell)
Neil Diamond (1971)
Stones
Fairport Convention (1968)
Fariport Convention
Green Lyte Sunday (1970) Green Lyte Sunday
Paul Horn (1974)
Visions
Anki Lindqvist (1972) Anki ennen aurinkoa
Gloria Loring
Mainstreet Mainstreet
Sylvia McNeill
Sergio Mendes & Brasil '66 (196 )
Stillness
Sergio Mendes & Brasil '86 (1986)
Marion Montogmery and Richard Rodney Barrett (1977)
Singers Unlimited (1978) Singers Unlimited w/ Rob McConnell & The Boss
Brass
Lisa Tavi (1979) Lisa Tavi
Emilliana Torrini Merman
Dave Van Ronk (1968) Dave Van Ronk and the Hudson Dusters
Dave Van Ronk (1992) Chrestomathy 1
Jennifer Warnes (1968) I Can Remember Everything
Ralph Martin Willey (2000) Came Upon A Child of God
THE CIRCLE GAME
Ian Campbell (196 )
Richard Dworsky (1993) Back to the Garden
Rick Ely
Kathie Lee Gifford (2000) (medley w/Born for You), Born for You
Ian & Sylvia (1967) So Much For Dreaming
Tom Rush (1968) The Circle Game
Buffy Saint Marie (196 )
Sweet Honey In The Rock (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni
Mitchell)
COLD BLUE STEEL & SWEET FIRE
Tim Curry (1979)
CONVERSATION
Shawn Colvin (1975) (Live)
Klaudio & Rico At the Same Place Twice In Life
McAlmont (1994) from the U.K.
COURT & SPARK
Leni Stern Like One
COYOTE
David Lahm (1999) Jazz Takes On Joni Mitchell
Spirit of the West (1997) Back to the Garden
DOCTOR JUNK, THE DENTIST MAN
Ian Campbell (1968)
DON JUAN'S RECKLESS DAUGHTER
David Lahm (2001) More Jazz Takes On Joni Mitchell
DOWN TO YOU
Colosseum II Strange New Flesh
Lydia Van Dam Group (1999) Both Sides Now
DREAMLAND
Roger McGuinn (1975) Cardiff Rose
THE DRY CLEANER FROM DES MOINES
Jacqui Fitzgerald
Robert Group Miller Child's Play
Cassandra Wilson (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
EASTERN RAIN
Fairport Convention (1968)
Fairport Convention (Live) (1968)
Richard Thompson (1985) Doom & Gloom From the Tomb
EDITH AND THE KINGPIN
Ellen Johnson (1968)
too good to title
David Lahm (1999) Jazz Takes On Joni Mitchell
Thom McFarlane (1997) Longtime
FOR FREE
Hoyt Axton (1982) Pistol Packin' Mama/Spin of the Wheel
The Byrds (1973)
Byrds
Petula Clark (1971)Warm and Tender
Judy Collins & Richard Stoltzman (1989) Innervoices
CPR (1997) (Live)
Crosby Stills & Nash (1983) Allies
Crosby, Stills & Nash (Live) (197 )
David Crosby & Graham Nash (Live) (1977)
James Durst (1999) Nude/Renewed
Ethel Ennis (1998) If Women Ruled the World
Marie Fredriksson (19?3) on Swedish compilation album Moten
Lonnie Knight (1974) Family In The Wind.
Bette Midler (1971) (video-unreleased)
Morning (1974) Struck Like Silver
Fred Simon (2000) Songs Of My Youth
Buffy Ste-Marie (1973) Quiet Places
Charlie Starr Tough and Tender
James Taylor (Live) (1971)
FREE MAN IN PARIS
Big Faith (1992) Back to the Garden
Neil Diamond (1977) I'm Glad You're Here With Me Tonight
Elton John (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Jonathan King (1975) A Rose in a Fisted Glove
FURRY SINGS THE BLUES
Ian Shaw & Cedar Walton (1999) In A New York Minute
GOD MUST BE A BOOGIE MAN
Jacqui Fitagerald
HARRY'S HOUSE/CENTERPIECE
Anne Haigis (1993)
HELP ME
kd lang (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Wynonna (2000) New Day Dawning
HISSING OF SUMMER LAWNS
Funky Bummer (1992) Back to the Garden
John Handy (1978) Where Go The Boats
HOW DO YOU STOP
James Brown
I HAD A KING
Adrienne Barbeau
Betty Buckley (medley w/If I remember You Right)
Joshua Redman (w/Interlude)
Mathilde Santing (1996) (Holland) Choosy Live!
I DON'T KNOW WHERE I STAND
Fairport Convention (1968)
Fairport Convention (Live) (1968)
Orville Johnson (1999) Slide & Joy
Singers Unlimited (1998) Magic Voices
Barbra Streisand (1971) Stoney End
THE JUNGLE LINE
Thomas Dolby (Live) (1983)
LADIES OF THE CANYON
Annie Lennox (1995)
LITTLE GREEN
Peter King (1989) Crusade
THE LAST TIME I SAW RICHARD
Laura Canoura (1991 Uruguay)
Rachell Bissex (1995) Don't Look Down
MAN FROM MARS
Kristen Vigard (1996) Grace of My Heart soundtrack
MARCIE
Fairport Convention (Live) (1968)
The Johnstons (196 )
MICHAEL FROM MOUNTAINS
Judy Collins (1967)
Trish Colter & Paul Reed (1997) The Dance Never Ends
Repairs (1971) Already a Household Word
Fred Simon (2000) Songs of My Youth, Volume 1
Gabor Szabo
MY OLD MAN
Dave Douglas (1998) Moving Portrait
Fred Hersch (1999) Let Yourself Go - Live at Jordan
NATHAN LA FRANEER
Noel Harrison
NIGHT IN THE CITY
The Athenians (1970)
Fairport Convention (Live) (1968)
Christopher Grener
Phil Matson & the P.M. Singers
The Staton Brothers Band
3 Dog Night (1971)
Jenny Whitely Back to the Garden
NIGHT RIDE HOME
Dave Van Nater
PEOPLES PARTIES
Jeff Buckley Live 12/31/95
Kevyn Lettau (198 ) Simple Life
THE PRIEST
Jesse Hultberg (1994)
RAISED ON ROBBERY
Matthew's Minstrels (1994) Little Bits of Cheese
Wynonna and Bryan Adams (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni
Mitchell)
REFUGE OF THE ROADS
Rocket Science (1992) Back to the Garden
RIVER
Tori Amos (Live) (1999)
Michael Ball (2000) Christmas
Betty Buckley (1994) With One Look
Julian Coryell (1997) Duality
Rosanne Cash (1995)
Fourplay (1999) Snowbound
Holly Cole (1996)(Live)
Holly Cole (1997) Dear, Dark Heart.
Heart On the Road Home
Heart (Live) (1995)
Don Henley (Live) (1991)
The Indigo Girls (Live) (1995) 1200 Curfews
Hugh Marsh & Jonathon Goldsmith (1992) Back to the Garden
Jill O'Hara (1993) Jill O'Hara.
Dianne Reeves I Remember
Reilly & Maloney (1984)
Astrid Seriese (1999) Astrid Seriese Live in Amsterdam
Janis Siegel & Fred Hersch (198 ) Short Stories
Billy Squier
James Taylor (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Travis
Dave Van Ronk (1973)
Peter White (1997) Songs of the Season.
.
ROSES BLUE
Dave Douglas (1998) Moving Portrait
THE SAME SITUATION
Dave Douglas (1998) Moving Portrait
Clive Gregson & Christine Collister (1990) Love Is A Strange Hotel
SHADES OF SCARLET CONQUERING
Christine Collister (Live) (1995)
Martha & the Muffins (1992) Back to the Garden
SONG TO A SEAGULL
Paul Desmond (1972) Best of Paul Desmond
Carla Helmbrecht (1994) One for My Baby
Buffy Saint Marie (1967) Fire & Fleet & Candlelight
Don Sebesky (1973) Giant Box
Dave Van Ronk (1994) To All My Friends In Far-Flung Places
SONGS TO AGING CHILDREN COME
Marti Jones & John Cody (1992) Back to the Garden
Eric Kloss (1969) Eric Kloss & the Rhythm Section
(Also in film Alice's Restuarant: 196 )
SWEET BIRD
Lani Hall (197 )
THAT SONG ABOUT THE MIDWAY
Bonnie Raitt (1974) Streelights
Bonnie Raitt (1988) (Live)
Dave Van Ronk (1976) Sunday Street
THE BEAT OF BLACK WINGS
Andy Stochansky (1992) Back to the Garden
THIS FLIGHT TONIGHT
Sara Craig (1992) Back to the Garden
Sara Craig (1993) (Live)
Diamond Head (1994) Evil Live
Ian Shaw (1997) Famous Rainy Day
Iron Savior (1998) Iron Savior
Nazareth (1973) Razamanaz
Nazareth (Live)
TIN ANGEL
Tom Rush (1968) The Circle Game
URGE FOR GOING
Theo Bikel (1969) A New Day
Mary Black (1991) Babes in the Wood
Crosby & Nash (1971)
Claire Hamill
Courage of Lassie (1994) This Side of Heaven
George Hamilton IV (1967) Folksy
The Johnstons (196 )
Kennedy (1999) Classic Kennedy
Tony Rice (1988) Native American
Tom Rush (1968) The Circle Game
Tom Rush (Live) (1982)
Travis
Dave Van Ronk (1971) Van Ronk
WINTER LADY
Gary Zack (1998) Little Gems
WOMAN OF HEART & MIND
Minnie Riperton (1981)
WOODSTOCK
Big Country (1993) B-side of "Alone" single
The Bird Sisters (1990)
Eva Cassidy
Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young (1970)
C, S, N & Y (1994)(Live)
Richard Dworski (1992) Back to the Garden
Fairport Convention (1986)(Live)
Larry Goldings & Trio (1999) Moonbird
Fareed Haque (1997) Deja Vu
His Name is Alive Fort Lake + Bonus Tracks
Bobby Kimball Rise Up
Matthews Southern Comfort (1970)
Bonnie Raitt (1971)(Live)
Gary & Randy Scruggs (1970) All the Way Home
Sha Na Na (19 )
James Taylor (1997)(Live)
Alan Tew Orchestra
Richard Thompson (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
Tuck & Patti (1995) Learning How To Fly
Venice (2000) 2 Meter Sessies
W.O.W. (1992) Back to the Garden
YOU TURN ME ON, I'M A RADIO
Gail Davies (1982) Givin' Herself Away
Gail Davies (1997) re-recording for album Greatest Hits
Kurt Swinghammer (1992) Back to the Garden
Wynonna (2000)(Live at An All Star Tribute to Joni Mitchell)
YVETTE IN ENGLISH
CPR (1998)(Live)
David Crosby (1993)
BACK TO THE GARDEN: A Tribute to Joni Mitchell (1992)
For reference purposes, I've also listed the songs in this compilation
as a group; It's a
Canadian only release on Intrepid Records (Toronto).
1. FREE MAN IN PARIS唯ig Faith
2. THIS FLIGHT TONIGHT祐ara Craig
3. CAREY誘niversal Honey
4. BIG YELLOW TAXI有orraine Scott
5. BLACK CROW柚olly Johnson
6. THE BEAT OF BLACK WINGS輸ndy Stochansky
7. SHADES OF SCARLET CONQUERING柚artha and the Muffins
8. THE HISSING OF SUMMER LAWNS友unky Bummer featuring Anne Beadle
9. RIVER幽ugh Marsh, Jonathan Goldsmith, Rob Piltch, Martin Tielli
10.YOU TURN ME ON, I'M A RADIO揖urt Swinghammer
11.COYOTE祐pirit of the West
12.WOODSTOCK邑.O.W.
13.NIGHT IN THE CITY憂enny Whitely
14.A CASE OF YOU祐loan
15.BLONDE IN THE BLEACHERS祐quiddly featuring Maria del Mar
16.SONGS TO AGING CHILDREN COME憂ohn Cody & Marti Jones
17.REFUGE OF THE ROADS由ocket Science featuring Laura Hubert and Art
Bergmann
From: http://www.jonimitchell.com/Frames1.html
> Penny, are you
> going to sit there and have us believe that Puccini has exerted the
> same influence on contemporary music as Gershwin!?
Have you ever heard any Puccini? If you include pop music and go by
numbers alone, Ice-T may have had as great an influence on contemporary
music as Gershwin or Bernstein.
? LOL! Penny, at the
> rate you're going, there won't be any more corners left for you to
> back into!ehheeheh -D, NYC "The development of anthropology or the
> study of man as a modern science was begun, largely in the United
> States, by German-Jew FRANZ BOAS"
>
> > >Penny, can you name me one Italian-Christian (LOL!eh)
> > >who has been able to come close in stature to an Irving Berlin,
> > >Leonard Bernstein, or a George & Ira Gershwin!? Waiting...still
There are many Italian composers who are giants when compared to the
artists you mentioned, e.g., Monteverdi, Verdi, Toscanini, Caruso, etc.
The history of music in the West is almost a history of the Italians
(almost). Music didn't begin when Geroge Gershwin was born, you know.