Thank you very much.
Bruce, languishing in Indiana while the Crime Doctor lives it up in Florida.
Ain't no justice, I tells ya. 8^)
Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
Does anyone besides me think that this is the only way Ace can possibly
leave? Her warrior spirit and her whole attitude make this the only in
character way for her to leave.
Is anyone besides me afraid she'll be written out through a love-interest
type of story (something a la the way Susan left)?
Steve
--
University of Florida, Department of Computer Science and Information
email: s...@cis.ufl.edu, s...@math.ufl.edu, Bitnet:Prisoner@ufcc
smail: Stephen P Potter, E309A CSE, UF Campus
Click here to find out about the <a href=http://www.cis.ufl.edu/perl>Perl World Wide Web Page</a>
Kate may be able to extend this, but here's what I know, which goes as far
as August 1994.
The current one Kate's "The Left-Handed Hummingbird." However, in my area,
the most recent book is "Bloodheat," so I'm still waiting for "The Dimension
Riders" and TLHH.
Coming after TLHH:
Conundrum
No Future
Tragedy Day
Legacy (formerly `The Terror of Peladon')
Theatre of War
All-Consuming Fire
Harvest of Blood
Strange England
Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
By the way, how many places in the U.S. haven't received The Dimension Riders
yet? I'm wondering if it'll ever arrive. Perhaps the local shop has decided
to stop carrying the series.
--
Ron O'Dell `Keeper' kee...@armory.com kee...@cats.ucsc.edu kee...@ucscb.ucsc.edu
My physical mail address will change. Those who have had or are having dealings
with me through physical mail should email me requesting to know my new address.
Okay, see, the deal is that Ace is going to leave with the Valeyard, who
she's fallen madly in love with, and they're going to go off and do a
bunch of evil scheming against the Doctor, so Ace can get back at the
Doctor for all he's done to her and the Valeyard can steal all those
regenerations. Of course, Virgin won't let Kate use the Valeyard, so
she'll call him "Muldwych" or John Peel or something of the sort, and
then...
("Shoot me now! Shoot me now!" -- Daffy Duck)
Actually, I'm not going to post ideas on what I'd like to see happen, so
that Kate can create her own version untainted by me.
--
The Admiral -- mwz...@ouray.denver.colorado.edu, ze...@durum.cgd.ucar.edu
"The Doctor. Wonderful chap...all of them."
-- Brigadier Alastair Gordon Lethbridge-Stewart, Dr. Who "The Five Doctors"
***** 11/23/1993 -- HAPPY 30th ANNIVERSARY, DOCTOR! *****
No sign of "The Dimension Riders" or "The Left-Handed Hummingbird" in
the Denver area yet. I've been checking B. Dalton, Waldenbooks, Barnes &
Noble and even a comic book store that managed to get Iceberg two days
after it was released in the UK.
I wish! :)
No, to find out what will happen to Ace when she leaves, read
the last two pages of Nigel Robinson's NA _Birthright_ ... the meeting
between the Doctor and Muldwych in the final appendix or whatever. They
give it away here, although Kate says there'll be "a twist" :)
>Steve
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
|Jason A. Miller | in%"doc...@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu"|
|"some doctor guy" |Pointless behavior, and plenty of it!|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
|"The naked hulk alongside came, | "I don't drink - wine" |
| The twain were casting dice. | |
| 'The game is done, | -Count Dracula |
| I've won! I've won!' |-------------------------------------|
| Quoth she, and whistles thrice" - Samuel Taylor "Bake" Coleridge |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
If there is a Waldenbooks out there, I would give that a try. I'm in
Champaign Illinois, and I got the book a week and a half ago from them.
Quite good, by the way.
>By the way, how many places in the U.S. haven't received The Dimension Riders
>yet? I'm wondering if it'll ever arrive. Perhaps the local shop has decided
>to stop carrying the series.
No they haven't (as a whole, anyway) decided to stop carrying the series.
In North Carolina, I can find the books anywhere from 2 weeks after the UK
release to 2 and a half months after the UK release date. There is no
reliable pattern to predict when the books will arrive here. According to
the computers at "Bookstar" in Cary, NC and "B.Dalton's", the Dimension
Riders will come out in December (no specific date given) and TLHH to
follow in Jan.(again, no date given).
>
>--
>Ron O'Dell `Keeper' kee...@armory.com kee...@cats.ucsc.edu kee...@ucscb.ucsc.edu
>
>My physical mail address will change. Those who have had or are having dealings
>with me through physical mail should email me requesting to know my new address.
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------
| Eric Johnson <epjo...@eos.ncsu.edu> | "Me, not allowed? |
| No, I don't play guitar!! :) | I'm allowed everywhere!" |
| aka *Mr. Wizard* | - The second Doctor |
| | |
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
> in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
>
>Does anyone besides me think that this is the only way Ace can possibly
>leave? Her warrior spirit and her whole attitude make this the only in
>character way for her to leave.
>
>Is anyone besides me afraid she'll be written out through a love-interest
>type of story (something a la the way Susan left)?
She won't be killed off. The editors want the NA's to keep continuity with
the TV novelisations. Therefore, she must wind up in 18th century France
(I believe that's where the "Curse of Fenric" novel had her end up).
this info comes straight from Kate.
>Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
>in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Votes, please, ladies and gentlemen. :-)
--
Kate Orman, BSc, KOTEP, SFLAaE/BS (Assoc.), BDFT #25
"Everyone remotely interesting is mad - in one way or another."
YES! please :)
What better way to celebrate Christmas next year then with the
merry posters of rec.arts.drwho all popping in for Chapter 23: O Happy Day!
of _Set Piece_, each dancing over Ace's corpse, singing an
ode to the end of poorly-written teen angst ;)
>Kate Orman, BSc, KOTEP, SFLAaE/BS (Assoc.), BDFT #25
>"Everyone remotely interesting is mad - in one way or another."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Kate may be able to extend this, but here's what I know, which goes as far
> as August 1994.
>
> The current one Kate's "The Left-Handed Hummingbird." However, in my area,
> the most recent book is "Bloodheat," so I'm still waiting for "The Dimension
> Riders" and TLHH.
Funny, at visions 1993, these books were available.
>
--
God save the Queen! God bless and save us all!!
Remeber, Jesus saves all souls from eternal damnation!
Save the world! Purge Republicanism and Dictatorship!
Happy Christmas and Merry New Year to one and all
>: >Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
>: >in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
>: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>: Votes, please, ladies and gentlemen. :-)
>I agree with the original poster, I would hate to see Ace married off.
>I would much rather have her die (acutally I would rather not have had
>her come back at all after _Love and War_, that was such a good exit).
I second not wanting Ace married off (thank God the rumors that they were
going to leave her with that prat Robin Yeadon never came true)... but
killing her is such a cliche.
Look at it this way. Ace has always had a bit of a death-wish -- especially
since coming back in "Deceit". What do you do with a character with a
death-wish? Let 'em die? BORING. Force 'em to live, and you've got an
interesting situation.
Besides, the whole point of Ace's character, in the series and at least
the early New Adventures, is that she's growing up. She's getting past
all the teenage angst... and this desire of hers to die young is part of
that adolescent mind-set.
The whole "live fast, die young, and leave a good-looking corpse" mentality
turns out to be bogus in the end. After all, remember the folks that used
to sing "Hope I die before I get old"? Well... they've gotten old.
I'd rather see Ace realize that she has a reason to live... one that doesn't
necessarily involve the Doctor. Not just fighting, but fighting FOR
something. And then she can tell the Doctor "look, thanks for the ride,
all right, but I really don't need you playing funky buggers with my head
anymore. Catch you round the palace in twenty years." She shouldn't have
to need him anymore.
One other thing, Kate -- whatever you do to get her away from the Doctor,
_PLEASE_ don't let it be a member of the opposite sex (or same sex even).
That would just be substituting another person-to-live-for in place of the
Doctor. Let her live her own life for once.
Regards,
Jon Blum
(who would, just once, like to see the old Ace's optimism and sense of
right and wrong back before she leaves...)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"All this time you two thought you were playing some twisted game of
chess... when it was just me playing solitaire!"
D O C T O R W H O : T I M E R I F T
: >Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
: >in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yes, please!
: Votes, please, ladies and gentlemen. :-)
I agree with the original poster, I would hate to see Ace married off.
I would much rather have her die (acutally I would rather not have had
her come back at all after _Love and War_, that was such a good exit).
Sonja
--some...@nmsu.edu
Well, if you do kill her, please make it for reasons that have nothing to
do with any decision the Doctor made, because we've already heard quite
enough about how guilty he feels about everyone else who has died as an
effect of his decisions. Kill her while she's trying to help somebody else
if you're going to do it.
I'm not certain that killing her is the best way for her to go. Ideally
what you'd want is a place where she can somehow peacefully apply her
love of demolitions, i.e. it's part of a normal job. Perhaps she could
join a group of terraformers, and it's her job to blow up cliff faces or
carve roadways or some such thing.
I would dearly love to see Ace live and find something in the universe
she can really enjoy doing and want to do it for the rest of her life.
The occupation must be exciting, of course, or she wouldn't like it, and
perhaps it's even a little dangerous, although after having served in an
army for three years she may perhaps be sick of that type of thing.
Steven.K.Manfred
Rob
>>>Then a few more until, in January 1995, "Set Piece," according to Kate,
>>>in which Ace finally will be gone for pretty well good. (Y'gonna kill'er?)
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> Votes, please, ladies and gentlemen. :-)
>> --
>> Kate Orman, BSc, KOTEP, SFLAaE/BS (Assoc.), BDFT #25
>> "Everyone remotely interesting is mad - in one way or another."
>
No Kate, don't kill Ace off. Although the 'original' Ace that we were
introduced to seems to have been killed off about 10 books ago, the character
deserves better than to die after overcoming so much since she started
traveling with the Doctor. I think that it would be good for her to stand
back and look at what she has become and realise that her life has taken a
bad turn. Her faith in mankind and her love of life has not been completely
shut down yet and it is not too late for her to settle down and re-experience
the good parts of life.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Eric Johnson <epjo...@eos.ncsu.edu> | "And I thought I was good for | |
| No, I don't play guitar!! :) | a few more regenerations yet."|
| aka *Mr. Wizard* | - The Sixth Doctor |
| | "Revelation of the Daleks" |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
> One other thing, Kate -- whatever you do to get her away from the Doctor,
> _PLEASE_ don't let it be a member of the opposite sex (or same sex even).
Since it also is a cliche:
- because she has already left the Doctor because of a member of the
opposite sex (and didn't stay away, so they could bring her back again
grrrrr!)
- because too many other companions have previously left the Doctor
for that reason.
The only problem is, here we are saying what *not* to do, but none of
us are thinking of any brilliant ideas of what to do instead (me included).
Let's see, if you rule out death, love, and hate, what interesting
reasons for Ace leaving do you have left? She's not the type to suddenly
decide to stop and smell the daisies...
> That would just be substituting another person-to-live-for in place of the
> Doctor. Let her live her own life for once.
Yeah, but what does that *mean*? At the moment she seems to have defined
her purpose in life as looking after the Doctor (when she's not totally
cheesed off at him). I should hope that "living her own life"
doesn't mean redefining (narrowing) her purpose in life to that of
looking after herself - sounds pretty awful and selfish (and immature).
I don't think that's what you meant, really.
She sees herself as a warrior, and therefore her purpose is to fight,
and if you fight, you fight against something or you fight for something.
When she was with IMC she was fighting against Daleks. Now she fights
to protect the Doctor, yes?
But seeing herself as *just* a warrior is too self-limiting. And if
she is not to die, then she needs to break free of that mold, I think.
No, she wouldn't be any less herself - she'd be more herself.
(My purpose in life is to be the best me I can be, and that process
don't stop until I'm dead and probably not even then... 8-)
This is a hard question, and we're getting into philosophy here,
so I'd better stop...
Kathryn Andersen
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
"This is not a moral issue, it is a business issue."
-- f...@turing.duq.edu (Fred Cohen) on Tapping Phones, in comp.risks
--
_--_|\ Kathryn Andersen <k...@shirka.apana.org.au>
/ \ #include <std/disclaimer.h>
\_.--.*/ Hawthorn -> Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia
v -> Southern Hemisphere -> Earth -> Sol -> Milky Way Galaxy
And even though I don't expect a single word any of us have said to change
the twisted fate you no doubt have planned for Ace... I'm glad you're at
least willing to listen. There's a whole paranoid crisis going on over
at the Babylon 5 news groups -- because the executive producer reads the
group regularly, it's gotten everyone freaked about posting story
speculations / suggestions. JMS is worried that someone might post an idea
the production team has already thought of, see an episode using that idea,
and sue them. Glad to see we Whovians are more trusting than that...
Hmm. Johnny Byrne's been known to drop in on this group too... if he's
still working on the movie script, wonder if _he'd_ be willing to let us
throw ideas out? :-)
Regards,
Jon Blum
------------------------------------------------------------------------
just in case anyone's wondering -- it looks like we'll have a rough
cut of Episode 1 together by the end of January!
{lots and lots deleted}
>> That would just be substituting another person-to-live-for in place of the
>> Doctor. Let her live her own life for once.
>Yeah, but what does that *mean*? At the moment she seems to have defined
>her purpose in life as looking after the Doctor (when she's not totally
>cheesed off at him). I should hope that "living her own life"
>doesn't mean redefining (narrowing) her purpose in life to that of
>looking after herself - sounds pretty awful and selfish (and immature).
>I don't think that's what you meant, really.
>She sees herself as a warrior, and therefore her purpose is to fight,
>and if you fight, you fight against something or you fight for something.
>When she was with IMC she was fighting against Daleks. Now she fights
>to protect the Doctor, yes?
>But seeing herself as *just* a warrior is too self-limiting. And if
>she is not to die, then she needs to break free of that mold, I think.
>No, she wouldn't be any less herself - she'd be more herself.
>(My purpose in life is to be the best me I can be, and that process
>don't stop until I'm dead and probably not even then... 8-)
>This is a hard question, and we're getting into philosophy here,
>so I'd better stop...
I just had an interesting thought (Though I'm preparing for the flames :)...
perhaps she could meet Abslom Daak and team up with him! I'm sure she'd
love that.. perhaps she could change her name to Taiyin.... just a thought.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Miller
Email : and...@scorch.hna.com.au
"You can always judge a man by the quality of his enemies." - The Doctor
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Read "Deceit" by Peter Darvill-Evans...
They make the point quite explicitly in that book that Ace is now just as
deranged as Daak. Those who think the new Ace has gotten kind of stuck in
her character might want to glance back at "Deceit". She's softened
tremendously by "Blood Heat"...
Regards,
Jon Blum
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"All this time you two thought you were playing some twisted game of
chess... when it was just me playing solitaire!"
Well, assuming that Ace will still be the kind of person who believes in
fighting for causes (which I think they're working back towards in the NA's --
look at her objecting on principle to the Doctor's actions in the end of
Blood Heat), it should be easy enough to let her find her own group of
downtrodden-and-oppressed for her to liberate. The best fate for her would
be for her to start doing the kind of things the Doctor does, without needing
him to "educate" her anymore.
I think he'd even like that.
("Just go forward in all your beliefs... and prove to me that I am not mistaken
in mine.")
Regards,
Jon Blum
(who now bids farewell and wishes happy holidays on all my fellow netlings out
there... I'm off to Atlanta for a week, with brand-new copies of "Dimension
Riders", "Left-Handed Hummingbird", and "The Tale of the Body Thief"... and a
large silly grin...)
YOU ARE IN THE TARDIS!!!
Definite rush for all TARDIS lovers...
Oh, you can't really do anything once you're logged in, but it doesn't
really matter.
Matt
--
This post in no way reflects the views of Matt Gross, the
poster, the posting software, the hardware used, or anyone
else who might have seen dirtboy type this. Please ignore it.
>Does anyone want to log in to the TARDIS?
>If so, just telnet to isn.hcf.jhu.edu, type DECNET at the 'DIAL:' prompt,
>then type 'c tardis' and log in as guest with passwd: guest.
>YOU ARE IN THE TARDIS!!!
>Definite rush for all TARDIS lovers...
>Oh, you can't really do anything once you're logged in, but it doesn't
>really matter.
so, i guess you mean that the Tardis isn't functioning properly? has it ever?
Damn, well I just checked and they've closed it off to all visitors. Guess
we missed the Doctor this time. Maybe he'll come bakc and let us in some
time.
IG>so, i guess you mean that the Tardis isn't functioning properly? has it ever
Well yes it has, you just have to whack it in the right place, like
Peter Davidson always used to. 8)
___
Merry Yaksmas from smeg...@castlebbs.com
>In article <2fhnhc$m...@panix.com> gme...@panix.com (Gary Merinstein) writes:
>->In <2fgkkn...@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> dir...@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Matthew B Gross) writes:
>->>Does anyone want to log in to the TARDIS?
>->>If so, just telnet to isn.hcf.jhu.edu, type DECNET at the 'DIAL:' prompt,
>->>then type 'c tardis' and log in as guest with passwd: guest.
>->>Oh, you can't really do anything once you're logged in, but it doesn't
>->>really matter.
>->
>->so, i guess you mean that the Tardis isn't functioning properly? has it ever?
>Damn, well I just checked and they've closed it off to all visitors. Guess
>we missed the Doctor this time. Maybe he'll come bakc and let us in some
>time.
maybe he already did...
>In article <1993Dec23.1...@scorch.hna.com.au> and...@scorch.hna.com.au (Andrew Miller) writes:
>>I just had an interesting thought (Though I'm preparing for the flames :)...
>>perhaps she could meet Abslom Daak and team up with him! I'm sure she'd
>>love that.. perhaps she could change her name to Taiyin.... just a thought.
>Read "Deceit" by Peter Darvill-Evans...
>They make the point quite explicitly in that book that Ace is now just as
>deranged as Daak. Those who think the new Ace has gotten kind of stuck in
>her character might want to glance back at "Deceit". She's softened
>tremendously by "Blood Heat"...
Hmmm... I have absolutely no idea about these NA's. I've read Exodus, and
that was it. I personally saw the whole lot of them as a backwards exercise,
Ace being the prime example. I thought the whole point of S26 was to show
Ace growing up... and what happens in the NA's? Ace is a bloody kid again...
Giving that, I'm going to read Hummer... but other than that I'm not really
interested in the series as a whole.
>Regards,
>Jon Blum
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>"All this time you two thought you were playing some twisted game of
>chess... when it was just me playing solitaire!"
> D O C T O R W H O : T I M E R I F T