Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

Ghost Light... "What?!"

61 views
Skip to first unread message

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 14, 2024, 3:18:22 PMFeb 14
to
Hi.

Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again I'm
going... "What?!"

What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)

All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd burned
down the house when younger, in the future, due to a lingering sense of
evil or something. _That_ I understand. The rest... not so much.

(Of course I could ask google or wiki or something, but hey, we're here,
let's talk about the series! :) )

--

Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 14, 2024, 8:04:25 PMFeb 14
to
8/10 for GL!
--
Member - Liberal International This is doc...@nk.ca Ici doc...@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism ; unsubscribe from Google Groups to be seen
The ignorant won't rest until everyone is as dumb as they are. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

The Last Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:04:22 AMFeb 15
to
Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI entities? -
of a vessel from another reality. One in which things didn’t evolve. Sent
to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled through time, they
experienced the reality of evolution and went a bit mad in different ways.
And then …

Oh who am I kidding? Cartmel and Pratt were too inexperienced to carve a
coherent story out of their script in the allotted time and JN-T was as
useful as a chocolate teapot in this department as usual, being too busy
making sure the music was shit, turning up the colour palette to play
school level and generally trying to lower the tone back to season 24
levels.

Result - a colourful, incoherent, confused mess. One of three stories in
this season that fell short of their promise, the exception being
“Survival” and that’s because there wasn’t much promise in that concept to
begin with.

--
“The timelines and … canon … are rupturing” - the Doctor

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:14:39 AMFeb 15
to
Mickmane wrote:

> Hi.
>
> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
> I'm going... "What?!"

I'm not sure I'd call "Ghost Light" a 'classic' episode but it is
from the classic era! ;-)

"Ghost Light" was one of the better Seventh Doctor stories, but
that's not really saying much. For me, it wouldn't be in the same
league as the Tom Baker 'classic' episodes. "Ghost Light" was also
the last Doctor Who story to be made before the show was cancelled.
So maybe the BBC were also saying "what?!" after seeing the tapes!
As "Ghost Light" doesn’t quite make sense or fit together as well as
it should.

> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
> lingering sense of evil or something. That I understand. The
> rest... not so much.

That pretty much sums up most of the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
Who! Poor writing, bad editing and budget cuts left Doctor Who of
that era with ideas that looked good on paper and stories with
potential badly realised on-screen when broadcast.

Also I think the S26 stories were scripted as four-episode stories
and whittled down to three episodes for broadcast, so that might
explain some of the confusion in the stories.

> (Of course I could ask google or wiki or something, but hey, we're
> here, let's talk about the series! :) )

A novel idea for RADW. Worth trying though...

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:38:33 AMFeb 15
to
In article <uqkuk3$3a0l6$1...@dont-email.me>,
I rate it 8/10 !

>--
>“The timelines and … canon … are rupturing” - the Doctor


The Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:39:51 AMFeb 15
to
In article <xn0oi3ru5...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>Mickmane wrote:
>
>> Hi.
>>
>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>> I'm going... "What?!"
>
>I'm not sure I'd call "Ghost Light" a 'classic' episode but it is
>from the classic era! ;-)
>
>"Ghost Light" was one of the better Seventh Doctor stories, but
>that's not really saying much. For me, it wouldn't be in the same
>league as the Tom Baker 'classic' episodes. "Ghost Light" was also
>the last Doctor Who story to be made before the show was cancelled.
>So maybe the BBC were also saying "what?!" after seeing the tapes!
>As "Ghost Light" doesn’t quite make sense or fit together as well as
>it should.

It is suppose to be the Creation vs Evolution debate plot.

>
>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>> lingering sense of evil or something. That I understand. The
>> rest... not so much.
>
>That pretty much sums up most of the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
>Who! Poor writing, bad editing and budget cuts left Doctor Who of
>that era with ideas that looked good on paper and stories with
>potential badly realised on-screen when broadcast.
>
>Also I think the S26 stories were scripted as four-episode stories
>and whittled down to three episodes for broadcast, so that might
>explain some of the confusion in the stories.

Thanks to J Powell!

>
>> (Of course I could ask google or wiki or something, but hey, we're
>> here, let's talk about the series! :) )
>
>A novel idea for RADW. Worth trying though...
>

Better to interact with humans!

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:42:36 AMFeb 15
to
The Doctor wrote:

> In article <uqkuk3$3a0l6$1...@dont-email.me>,
> The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
> >
> > Oh who am I kidding? Cartmel and Pratt were too inexperienced to
> > carve a coherent story out of their script in the allotted time
> > and JN-T was as useful as a chocolate teapot in this department
> > as usual, being too busy making sure the music was shit, turning
> > up the colour palette to play school level and generally trying
> > to lower the tone back to season 24 levels.
> >
> > Result - a colourful, incoherent, confused mess. One of three
> > stories in this season that fell short of their promise, the
> > exception being “Survival” and that’s because there wasn’t much
> > promise in that concept to
> > begin with.
>
> I rate it 8/10 !

What did you like about "Ghost Light" so Dave? Did you find it
confusing?

I bet you thought Ace was "hot" didn't you?

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 7:43:35 AMFeb 15
to
In article <xn0oi3sjw...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
No! Ace has to face her action!

Evolution vs creation.

Snakedance is more confusing!

Midnight is even more confusing!

>
>I bet you thought Ace was "hot" didn't you?

Yes!

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 6:18:23 PMFeb 15
to
On 15.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <xn0oi3ru5...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>> Mickmane wrote:

Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?

>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>>
>> I'm not sure I'd call "Ghost Light" a 'classic' episode but it is
>> from the classic era! ;-)

Yeah, that's what I mean. :)

>> "Ghost Light" was one of the better Seventh Doctor stories, but
>> that's not really saying much. For me, it wouldn't be in the same
>> league as the Tom Baker 'classic' episodes. "Ghost Light" was also
>> the last Doctor Who story to be made before the show was cancelled.
>> So maybe the BBC were also saying "what?!" after seeing the tapes!
>> As "Ghost Light" doesn���t quite make sense or fit together as
>> well as it should.

There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
Survival.

Or do you mean it was cancelled, and then they filmed a little more
before the end?

To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be comprehensible.
:)

> It is suppose to be the Creation vs Evolution debate plot.

No one was creating anything in it, and that one character was just
complaining about evolution happening.

>>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>>> lingering sense of evil or something. That I understand. The
>>> rest... not so much.
>>
>> That pretty much sums up most of the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
>> Who! Poor writing, bad editing and budget cuts left Doctor Who of
>> that era with ideas that looked good on paper and stories with
>> potential badly realised on-screen when broadcast.

Aww.

>> Also I think the S26 stories were scripted as four-episode stories
>> and whittled down to three episodes for broadcast, so that might
>> explain some of the confusion in the stories.

I did notice some of them being only three episodes.

>>> (Of course I could ask google or wiki or something, but hey, we're
>>> here, let's talk about the series! :) )
>>
>> A novel idea for RADW. Worth trying though...

Haha. :)

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 6:18:23 PMFeb 15
to
On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:

>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>> I'm going... "What?!"
>>
>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>>
>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>> lingering sense of evil or something. _That_ I understand. The
>> rest... not so much.

> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
> bit mad in different ways. And then ?

Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.

> Oh who am I kidding? Cartmel and Pratt were too inexperienced to
> carve a coherent story out of their script in the allotted time and
> JN-T was as useful as a chocolate teapot in this department as usual,
> being too busy making sure the music was shit, turning up the colour
> palette to play school level and generally trying to lower the tone
> back to season 24 levels.

Lol. Ghost-lighting the viewers!

Don't know those names though, and Google didn't really help.

> Result - a colourful, incoherent, confused mess. One of three stories
> in this season that fell short of their promise, the exception being
> ?Survival? and that?s because there wasn?t much promise in that
> concept to begin with.

The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
that was season 25.

I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)

--

Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 8:43:26 PMFeb 15
to
In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 15.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <xn0oi3ru5...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
>> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>>> Mickmane wrote:
>
>Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?
>

Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!

>>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>>>
>>> I'm not sure I'd call "Ghost Light" a 'classic' episode but it is
>>> from the classic era! ;-)
>
>Yeah, that's what I mean. :)
>

Ha! Ha!!

>>> "Ghost Light" was one of the better Seventh Doctor stories, but
>>> that's not really saying much. For me, it wouldn't be in the same
>>> league as the Tom Baker 'classic' episodes. "Ghost Light" was also
>>> the last Doctor Who story to be made before the show was cancelled.
>>> So maybe the BBC were also saying "what?!" after seeing the tapes!
>>> As "Ghost Light" doesn���t quite make sense or fit together as
>>> well as it should.
>
>There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>Survival.

both are grand IMHO.


>
>Or do you mean it was cancelled, and then they filmed a little more
>before the end?
>
>To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be comprehensible.
>:)
>


What happened was that Season 27 was ready to go
and then idoit BBC1 controller Jonathan Powell canned DW
for El Dorado!

>> It is suppose to be the Creation vs Evolution debate plot.
>
>No one was creating anything in it, and that one character was just
>complaining about evolution happening.
>

Priest versus one man person

>>>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>>>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>>>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>>>> lingering sense of evil or something. That I understand. The
>>>> rest... not so much.
>>>
>>> That pretty much sums up most of the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
>>> Who! Poor writing, bad editing and budget cuts left Doctor Who of
>>> that era with ideas that looked good on paper and stories with
>>> potential badly realised on-screen when broadcast.
>
>Aww.

Please ignore the troll.

>
>>> Also I think the S26 stories were scripted as four-episode stories
>>> and whittled down to three episodes for broadcast, so that might
>>> explain some of the confusion in the stories.
>
>I did notice some of them being only three episodes.
>

4 -3 -4 -3

>>>> (Of course I could ask google or wiki or something, but hey, we're
>>>> here, let's talk about the series! :) )
>>>
>>> A novel idea for RADW. Worth trying though...
>
>Haha. :)
>

We are better company.

>--
>
>Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 15, 2024, 8:45:29 PMFeb 15
to
In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
>> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>>>
>>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>>>
>>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>>> lingering sense of evil or something. _That_ I understand. The
>>> rest... not so much.
>
>> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
>> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
>> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
>> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
>> bit mad in different ways. And then ?
>
>Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>

MM for you!

>> Oh who am I kidding? Cartmel and Pratt were too inexperienced to
>> carve a coherent story out of their script in the allotted time and
>> JN-T was as useful as a chocolate teapot in this department as usual,
>> being too busy making sure the music was shit, turning up the colour
>> palette to play school level and generally trying to lower the tone
>> back to season 24 levels.
>
>Lol. Ghost-lighting the viewers!
>
>Don't know those names though, and Google didn't really help.
>

quotefile!

>> Result - a colourful, incoherent, confused mess. One of three stories
>> in this season that fell short of their promise, the exception being
>> ?Survival? and that?s because there wasn?t much promise in that
>> concept to begin with.
>
>The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
>coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
>that was season 25.
>
>I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)
>

If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 4:18:23 AMFeb 16
to
On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
>>> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:

>>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>>> I'm going... "What?!"

>>> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
>>> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
>>> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
>>> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
>>> bit mad in different ways. And then ?
>>
>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.

> MM for you!

I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?

>> The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
>> coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
>> that was season 25.
>>
>> I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)

> If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
> or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.

Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much later
episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently being hidden in
Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that bothered me.)

Midnight, Ten(nant) episode, with Donna relaxing somewhere while he goes
on some shuttle sight-eeing tour to planet Midnight, and that talky non-
visible thing takes over some woman? Where they want to expell him into
no-air planet outside?

I didn't like that episode, but didn't think it so very incoherent. Now
the Ten(nant) episode I liked least was the one with Absorbalof. Hardly
any Doctor, boring stupid people not paying attention, and ghastly
ending.

That other episode you mention simply doesn't make sense, so it's just
the Master messing with the Doctor's mind. And even Toymaker confirmed
that our first Doctor was the actual first Doctor. (He'd know! And likes
jabs at the Doctor.)

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 4:18:23 AMFeb 16
to
On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> On 15.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>> wrote:
>>> In article <xn0oi3ru5...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
>>> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>>>> Mickmane wrote:

>> Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?

> Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!

Hah, doubtful. He's a real person who supplies Usenet and Fidonet as a
hobby. (And also a gateway between the two. Until I moved in 2009 and
got broadband for the new flat, I used my 28.8 modem to call his
directly computer via landline.)

>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>> Survival.

> both are grand IMHO.

Survival is the one with the cat people? I remember watching that
before, but now it's the last story remaining on the list of Classic to
(re-)watch.

--

Mickmane

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 7:10:07 AMFeb 16
to
Mickmane wrote:
>
> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
> Survival.

S26 was broadcast out of order. "Ghost Light" was the last Doctor
Who story made before the show was cancelled. Two stories produced
earlier were broadcast after "Ghost Light".

"Survival" was the last episode of Doctor Who broadcast obviously,
but it was made before "Ghost Light".

> Or do you mean it was cancelled, and then they filmed a little
> more before the end?

No, it was broadcast but episodes produced before it were shown
after it!

> To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be
> comprehensible. :)

Better as in relatively when compared to other Seventh Doctor
stories. As the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor Who was so bad they
cancelled the show. Ghost Light wasn't one of JNT's 'pantomime'
episodes, it had an okay story for that era, it just needed
concentration to follow it!

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 7:15:10 AMFeb 16
to
The Doctor wrote:

> In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
> >
> > Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here
> > anywhere!?
>
> Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!

Filters I'd say... <shrugs>

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 10:21:31 AMFeb 16
to
In article <GYyKWDb5czB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 15.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>>> In article <xn0oi3ru5...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
>>>> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>>>>> Mickmane wrote:
>
>>> Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?
>
>> Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!
>
>Hah, doubtful. He's a real person who supplies Usenet and Fidonet as a
>hobby. (And also a gateway between the two. Until I moved in 2009 and
>got broadband for the new flat, I used my 28.8 modem to call his
>directly computer via landline.)
>

ti is NNTP vs NNTP providers!

>>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>>> Survival.
>
>> both are grand IMHO.
>
>Survival is the one with the cat people? I remember watching that
>before, but now it's the last story remaining on the list of Classic to
>(re-)watch.
>

That one! THe Master was in it!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 10:22:48 AMFeb 16
to
In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
>>>> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>
>>>> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
>>>> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
>>>> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
>>>> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
>>>> bit mad in different ways. And then ?
>>>
>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>
>> MM for you!
>
>I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>

MM is Mike McKeown.

>>> The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
>>> coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
>>> that was season 25.
>>>
>>> I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)
>
>> If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
>> or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.
>
>Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much later
>episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently being hidden in
>Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that bothered me.)
>

The Mara

>Midnight, Ten(nant) episode, with Donna relaxing somewhere while he goes
>on some shuttle sight-eeing tour to planet Midnight, and that talky non-
>visible thing takes over some woman? Where they want to expell him into
>no-air planet outside?
>
>I didn't like that episode, but didn't think it so very incoherent. Now
>the Ten(nant) episode I liked least was the one with Absorbalof. Hardly
>any Doctor, boring stupid people not paying attention, and ghastly
>ending.
>

Yes that one!

>That other episode you mention simply doesn't make sense, so it's just
>the Master messing with the Doctor's mind. And even Toymaker confirmed
>that our first Doctor was the actual first Doctor. (He'd know! And likes
>jabs at the Doctor.)
>

And there goes Chibnall out the door!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 10:24:03 AMFeb 16
to
In article <xn0oi55r1...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
False! Grade/Powell wants to cancel as in there view, BBC was no place for scifi!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 10:24:39 AMFeb 16
to
In article <xn0oi56g0...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
Possible!

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 1:39:52 PMFeb 16
to
The Doctor wrote:

> In article <xn0oi55r1...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
> > Mickmane wrote:
> >> To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be
> >> comprehensible. :)
> >
> > Better as in relatively when compared to other Seventh Doctor
> > stories. As the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor Who was so bad they
> > cancelled the show. Ghost Light wasn't one of JNT's 'pantomime'
> > episodes, it had an okay story for that era, it just needed
> > concentration to follow it!
>
> False!

IYIO!

> Grade/Powell wants to cancel as in there view, BBC
> was no place for scifi!

They certainly played their part, and maybe they also had ideas for
shows that would attract more viewers to BBC1 than any sci-fi shows
could? At the time that was their job.

That doesn't change the fact that the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
Who was crap! McCoy himself was not the man for the job, the scripts
were [generally] poor and the rock-bottom ratings reflected the
apathy among the general public for Doctor Who.

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 2:18:23 PMFeb 16
to
On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>> wrote:
>>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:

[Ghost Light.... WHAT!?]
>>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>>
>>> MM for you!
>>
>> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?

> MM is Mike McKeown.

Names and I don't get on well, I'd be hard pressed listing all actors
who played the Doctor, never mind companions or even anyone not seen on
the show. I barely remember the in-show names of the companions.

Or take crime series like Criminal Intent or Criminal Minds. Takes a
while (weeks, months) until I even know the detectives' names. Suspects
and victim have no chance at all, so I rarely know who they're talking
about. :)

>>> If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
>>> or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.
>>
>> Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much
>> later episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently being
>> hidden in Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that bothered
>> me.)

> The Mara

Yup, that thing. Which episode that it turns up were you refering to?

>> Midnight, Ten(nant) episode, with Donna relaxing somewhere while he
>> goes on some shuttle sight-eeing tour to planet Midnight, and that
>> talky non- visible thing takes over some woman? Where they want to
>> expell him into no-air planet outside?

> Yes that one!

Hah, for once my memory worked! :)

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 2:18:23 PMFeb 16
to
> In article <xn0oi55r1...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>> Mickmane wrote:

(For once, doctor replying to everything without snipping is useful!)

>>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>>> Survival.
>>
>> S26 was broadcast out of order. "Ghost Light" was the last Doctor
>> Who story made before the show was cancelled. Two stories produced
>> earlier were broadcast after "Ghost Light".
>>
>> "Survival" was the last episode of Doctor Who broadcast obviously,
>> but it was made before "Ghost Light".

Oh, didn't know that.

>>> To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be
>>> comprehensible. :)
>>
>> Better as in relatively when compared to other Seventh Doctor
>> stories. As the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor Who was so bad they
>> cancelled the show. Ghost Light wasn't one of JNT's 'pantomime'
>> episodes, it had an okay story for that era, it just needed
>> concentration to follow it!

Pantomime episodes?

> False! Grade/Powell wants to cancel as in there view, BBC was no
> place for scifi!

Boo!

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 2:18:24 PMFeb 16
to
On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYyKWDb5czB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>>> In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:

>>>> Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?
>>
>>> Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!
>>
>> Hah, doubtful. He's a real person who supplies Usenet and Fidonet as
>> a hobby. (And also a gateway between the two. Until I moved in 2009
>> and got broadband for the new flat, I used my 28.8 modem to call his
>> directly computer via landline.)

> ti is NNTP vs NNTP providers!

Going back and looking at headers, it seems that for about 2 weeks now
posts from "Organisat. : xs news" no longer arrive, while those from
"Organisat. : Indigo News" still get through.

I'll ask the kruemel.org owner if he can make anything of it.

>>>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>>>> Survival.
>>
>>> both are grand IMHO.
>>
>> Survival is the one with the cat people? I remember watching that
>> before, but now it's the last story remaining on the list of Classic
>> to (re-)watch.

> That one! THe Master was in it!

Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or fish,
just plain boring.

--

Mickmane

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 3:08:12 PMFeb 16
to
Dave won't like that... Anthony Ainley and himself were best buds.

Where's that famous photo again Dave, I haven't seen it for a few
years?

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 5:45:54 PMFeb 16
to
In article <xn0oi5ggy...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
The whole quality of the BBC suffered under those 2!

Thank goodness Alan Yentob got BBC1 back up!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 5:48:41 PMFeb 16
to
In article <GYyKql4aczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <xn0oi55r1...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
>> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>>> Mickmane wrote:
>
>(For once, doctor replying to everything without snipping is useful!)
>

Exactly!

>>>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>>>> Survival.
>>>
>>> S26 was broadcast out of order. "Ghost Light" was the last Doctor
>>> Who story made before the show was cancelled. Two stories produced
>>> earlier were broadcast after "Ghost Light".
>>>
>>> "Survival" was the last episode of Doctor Who broadcast obviously,
>>> but it was made before "Ghost Light".
>
>Oh, didn't know that.
>

BS is correct!

>>>> To be 'one of the better' stories, I'd expect it to be
>>>> comprehensible. :)
>>>
>>> Better as in relatively when compared to other Seventh Doctor
>>> stories. As the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor Who was so bad they
>>> cancelled the show. Ghost Light wasn't one of JNT's 'pantomime'
>>> episodes, it had an okay story for that era, it just needed
>>> concentration to follow it!
>
>Pantomime episodes?
>

His opinion

>> False! Grade/Powell wants to cancel as in there view, BBC was no
>> place for scifi!
>
>Boo!
>

Exactly!!!

>--
>
>Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 5:50:01 PMFeb 16
to
In article <GYyKr0vaczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>[Ghost Light.... WHAT!?]
>>>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>>>
>>>> MM for you!
>>>
>>> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>
>> MM is Mike McKeown.
>
>Names and I don't get on well, I'd be hard pressed listing all actors
>who played the Doctor, never mind companions or even anyone not seen on
>the show. I barely remember the in-show names of the companions.
>
>Or take crime series like Criminal Intent or Criminal Minds. Takes a
>while (weeks, months) until I even know the detectives' names. Suspects
>and victim have no chance at all, so I rarely know who they're talking
>about. :)
>

You are MM too!

>>>> If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
>>>> or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.
>>>
>>> Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much
>>> later episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently being
>>> hidden in Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that bothered
>>> me.)
>
>> The Mara
>
>Yup, that thing. Which episode that it turns up were you refering to?
>

Snakedance.

>>> Midnight, Ten(nant) episode, with Donna relaxing somewhere while he
>>> goes on some shuttle sight-eeing tour to planet Midnight, and that
>>> talky non- visible thing takes over some woman? Where they want to
>>> expell him into no-air planet outside?
>
>> Yes that one!
>
>Hah, for once my memory worked! :)
>

There you go!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 5:53:53 PMFeb 16
to
In article <GYyKsAH5czB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYyKWDb5czB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>>>> In article <GYuKC2YqczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>>>> Why do most of Blueshirt's posts no longer turn up here anywhere!?
>>>
>>>> Maybe your nntp provider is mad at his provider!
>>>
>>> Hah, doubtful. He's a real person who supplies Usenet and Fidonet as
>>> a hobby. (And also a gateway between the two. Until I moved in 2009
>>> and got broadband for the new flat, I used my 28.8 modem to call his
>>> directly computer via landline.)
>
>> ti is NNTP vs NNTP providers!
>
>Going back and looking at headers, it seems that for about 2 weeks now
>posts from "Organisat. : xs news" no longer arrive, while those from
>"Organisat. : Indigo News" still get through.
>
>I'll ask the kruemel.org owner if he can make anything of it.
>
Best practice.

>>>>> There's still two stories after it; the Curse of the Fenric, and
>>>>> Survival.
>>>
>>>> both are grand IMHO.
>>>
>>> Survival is the one with the cat people? I remember watching that
>>> before, but now it's the last story remaining on the list of Classic
>>> to (re-)watch.
>
>> That one! THe Master was in it!
>
>Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or fish,
>just plain boring.
>

He was really evil!

If we fight like animal, we die like animals!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 16, 2024, 5:55:06 PMFeb 16
to

Daniel65

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 3:49:06 AMFeb 17
to
The Doctor wrote on 17/2/24 9:55 am:
> In article <xn0oi5iwx...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
>> Mickmane wrote:
>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> That one! THe Master was in it!
>>>
>>> Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or
>>> fish, just plain boring.
>>
>> Dave won't like that... Anthony Ainley and himself were best buds.
>>
>> Where's that famous photo again Dave, I haven't seen it for a few
>> years?
>
> https://www.nk.ca/~doctor/
>
"costume contast"?? What's a 'contast', "Yellow Beard Yadallee"??

"This Page is based on the personality of Dave Yadallee" .... So that
would be a *ZERO* then, "Yellow Beard Yadallee"!!

"Dave believes in completeness, so never say a Domain is a Web Page URL!!"!!

"World wide Web PAge"?? The same old "Yellow Beard Yadallee"!! "PAge"!!

"For a Web Page, develop for a 486 with 8 MB of RAM and you got
it,otherwise chug, chug, and go to sleep while waiting." ?? "Yellow
Beard Yadallee" must be sooooo busy with his Toastmaster friends that he
can't even update *HIS* webpage .... even if he has the knowledge to do it!!

"BBC announces ninth doctor"!! WOW!! Up-to-date!!
--
Daniel

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 4:48:23 AMFeb 17
to
On 17.02.24, Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
> Mickmane wrote:
>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>> wrote:

>>> That one! THe Master was in it!
>>
>> Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or
>> fish, just plain boring.

> Dave won't like that... Anthony Ainley and himself were best buds.

More names. Google helped. Dave is doctor? Did they actually know each
other, or is doctor just a fan?

> Where's that famous photo again Dave, I haven't seen it for a few
> years?

Oh, photo indicates real life meeting.

But what the actors do could at best not ruin my enjoyment of a TV
series or film. I prefer not to know anything about them.

For me, what counts are the characters. Not the actor's fault if they
are written lame.

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 4:48:23 AMFeb 17
to
On 17.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYyKsAH5czB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>> wrote:

>>> That one! THe Master was in it!
>>
>> Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or
>> fish, just plain boring.

> He was really evil!

He is completely nuts, with ridiculous ideas and obsessions.

That has me wonder, when someone is completely nuts, can you call them
evil, or are they not responsible for their actions?

Can someone who's not responsible for their actions (because their
head's screwed on weirdly and just doesn't work properly) be called
evil?

And does scale play a role? If someone's nuts and 'just' affects his
neighbours, and can be locked up, is it different to someone who's
mighty and has tech or magic to prevent being locked up?

(I've written some stories for myself - don't like what's published
anymore - including some evil overlords and ladies. Most of them are
completely nuts. They can't just be locked up though, too powerful. Same
question applies there: Are they actually evil or just crazy, or both?)

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 4:48:23 AMFeb 17
to
> In article <xn0oi5ggy...@reader.xsnews.nl>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:

>> That doesn't change the fact that the Sylvester McCoy era of Doctor
>> Who was crap! McCoy himself was not the man for the job,

Why was he not the man for the job?

--

Mickmane

Mickmane

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 4:48:25 AMFeb 17
to
On 17.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
> In article <GYyKr0vaczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>> wrote:
>>> In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:

>> [Ghost Light.... WHAT!?]
>>>>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.

>>>>> MM for you!
>>>>
>>>> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>>
>>> MM is Mike McKeown.
>>
>> Names and I don't get on well, I'd be hard pressed listing all
>> actors who played the Doctor, never mind companions or even anyone
>> not seen on the show. I barely remember the in-show names of the
>> companions.

> You are MM too!

Oh, right!

Though most just shorten it to Mick. :) (Or if they have some reading
problem, or I don't know what, sometimes it ends up Mike. It's
interesting how some Twitch streamers can't get my name right.)

>>>> Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much
>>>> later episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently
>>>> being hidden in Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that
>>>> bothered me.)
>>
>>> The Mara
>>
>> Yup, that thing. Which episode that it turns up were you refering
>> to?

> Snakedance.

Yes, which of the two episodes I described was called that?

I guess I'd have to check an episode list or something. :P

--

Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 10:03:32 AMFeb 17
to
In article <uqprtv$b4gi$1...@dont-email.me>,
Well then you can click on the blog link Red-bearded Dannyboy!

>--
>Daniel

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 10:04:02 AMFeb 17
to
I like the Evil Master!!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 10:04:28 AMFeb 17
to
There you go!

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 10:09:41 AMFeb 17
to
No justification from Captain Bluebeard Blueshirt!

>--
>
>Mickmane

The Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 10:11:08 AMFeb 17
to
In article <GZ1LEY2LczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>On 17.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYyKr0vaczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>>> In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>> [Ghost Light.... WHAT!?]
>>>>>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>
>>>>>> MM for you!
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>>>
>>>> MM is Mike McKeown.
>>>
>>> Names and I don't get on well, I'd be hard pressed listing all
>>> actors who played the Doctor, never mind companions or even anyone
>>> not seen on the show. I barely remember the in-show names of the
>>> companions.
>
>> You are MM too!
>
>Oh, right!
>
>Though most just shorten it to Mick. :) (Or if they have some reading
>problem, or I don't know what, sometimes it ends up Mike. It's
>interesting how some Twitch streamers can't get my name right.)
>

We will now have to be careful
!

>>>>> Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much
>>>>> later episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently
>>>>> being hidden in Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that
>>>>> bothered me.)
>>>
>>>> The Mara
>>>
>>> Yup, that thing. Which episode that it turns up were you refering
>>> to?
>
>> Snakedance.
>
>Yes, which of the two episodes I described was called that?
>
>I guess I'd have to check an episode list or something. :P

Videos, scripts, reviews ...

The Last Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 12:01:44 PMFeb 17
to
Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
> On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
>> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>>>
>>> What were the aliens, why were they there, what happened!? :)
>>>
>>> All I know is that the Doctor and Ace were there, and that she'd
>>> burned down the house when younger, in the future, due to a
>>> lingering sense of evil or something. _That_ I understand. The
>>> rest... not so much.
>
>> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
>> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
>> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
>> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
>> bit mad in different ways. And then ?
>
> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.

I may have picked that up from the novelisation. Looking back I don’t think
it was made clear in the show (mind you not much was).

>
>> Oh who am I kidding? Cartmel and Pratt were too inexperienced to
>> carve a coherent story out of their script in the allotted time and
>> JN-T was as useful as a chocolate teapot in this department as usual,
>> being too busy making sure the music was shit, turning up the colour
>> palette to play school level and generally trying to lower the tone
>> back to season 24 levels.
>
> Lol. Ghost-lighting the viewers!
>
> Don't know those names though, and Google didn't really help.

Marc Pratt was the writer, this was his first Doctor Who story (and the
only one televised to date though he has become a prolific and excellent
writer for Big Finish - including the very best Cyberman origin story to
date, “Spare Parts”, a Fifth Doctor adventure.

Well worth a listen even if you aren’t usually into radio plays.

John Cartmel was the new script editor. He famously had a “master plan” to
make the Doctor more Machiavellian and mysterious, with origins well before
the Hartnell incarnation - and he was supposedly grooming (in the not
creepy sense of the term) Ace for admission to the Time Lord Academy, hence
the various “tests” of her in this season, in Ghost Light and The Curse of
Fenric.

JN-T is John Nathan-Turner, the man who in my opinion ran Doctor Who slowly
onto the reefs of oblivion as producer since Tom Baker’s final season. He
it was who introduced Tom’s burgundy coat, and wanted Colin Baker’s costume
to be hideously flamboyant and the character to become obnoxious. He was
responsible for the loud electronic background music, the over lit primary
colours of everything, and for choosing a diminutive obscure Vaudeville
comedian with no acting skills as the Seventh Doctor, as well as the masses
of guest appearances from comedians with varying degrees of success - from
the sublime Tony Selby as Sabalom Glitz to the ridiculous Beryl Reid in
Earthshock and the pointless Hale and Pace in Survival.

>
>> Result - a colourful, incoherent, confused mess. One of three stories
>> in this season that fell short of their promise, the exception being
>> ?Survival? and that?s because there wasn?t much promise in that
>> concept to begin with.
>
> The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
> coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
> that was season 25.
>
> I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)

Battlefield. But how did Arthurian knights cross realities to fight here?
And why? Why was the Doctor Merlin (and when?) And why was the sword
fighting so shite?

There is a cinematic re-edit of Fenric that’s a bit more coherent - I think
it’s the version in the Tales of the TARDIS wrapper on iPlayer?

--
“The timelines and … canon … are rupturing” - the Doctor

The Last Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 12:29:14 PMFeb 17
to
Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 15.02.24, The Last Doctor <mi...@xenocyte.com> wrote:
>>>> Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
>>>>> Rewatched Ghost Light (Classic episode from season 26), and again
>>>>> I'm going... "What?!"
>
>>>> Light, Control and Josiah were the - crew? - components? - AI
>>>> entities? - of a vessel from another reality. One in which things
>>>> didn?t evolve. Sent to study Earth and getting accidentally stalled
>>>> through time, they experienced the reality of evolution and went a
>>>> bit mad in different ways. And then ?
>>>
>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>
>> MM for you!
>
> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>
>>> The story after Ghost Light (the Curse of the Fenric) wasn't that
>>> coherent either. The third is the Greatest Show in the Galaxy? Wait,
>>> that was season 25.
>>>
>>> I liked the one where they'd dug out Brigadier Steward again. :)
>
>> If you want incoherent, try snakedane or worse yet Midnight
>> or even worse yet Chibnall's Timeless Child.
>
> Without checking, Snakedance was that with the Kinda? Or the much later
> episode where the evil thing resurfaced from apparently being hidden in
> Teagan? (That last bit was the only thing that bothered me.)

Kinda was the first appearance of the Mara, the psychic snake monster.
Snakedance was its return and is possibly more famous for a very effete
turn by Martin Clunes than anything to do with its rather tgin plot. And
yes, the Mara was dormant in Tegan’s mind. Apparently.


> Midnight, Ten(nant) episode, with Donna relaxing somewhere while he goes
> on some shuttle sight-eeing tour to planet Midnight, and that talky non-
> visible thing takes over some woman? Where they want to expell him into
> no-air planet outside?
>
> I didn't like that episode, but didn't think it so very incoherent. Now
> the Ten(nant) episode I liked least was the one with Absorbalof. Hardly
> any Doctor, boring stupid people not paying attention, and ghastly
> ending.

The Absorbaloff was a child’s winning creation in an alien contest, so RTD
had to find a story in which it worked. I think the alien was pretty poor
and getting Peter Kay to play it didn’t help at all, picking another winner
would have been a better choice.

I didn’t mind the ending, yes it was a bit adult compared to the rest of
the episode, but I’m sure it would have gone over the heads of young
children so no harm done. “Doctor-Lite” is a way of filming two episodes at
the same time and a budget saving exercise (Midnight was shot alongside
Turn Left, so we get one episode essentially without Donna and another
essentially without the Doctor made in the same time scale. Sometimes it
works, sometimes it doesn’t.

>
> That other episode you mention simply doesn't make sense, so it's just
> the Master messing with the Doctor's mind.

No, it wasn’t. I might wish it was. But it wasn’t.

> And even Toymaker confirmed
> that our first Doctor was the actual first Doctor.

Then who are the Doctors shown in the mind battle in “The Brain of
Morbius”? And what did the Doctor mean by saying that he had been, with
Omega and Rassilon, involved in developing the prototype Hand of Omega in
legendary history of the Time Lords? (Remembrance of the Daleks). And when
was the Doctor Merlin? (Battlefield).

And when was the Doctor the Fugitive Doctor, as it is clearly in the
Doctor’s past in the sequences involving battling the Bad Guys in Flux?

> (He'd know! And likes
> jabs at the Doctor.)

Where do you think that was confirmed? I didn’t see any such thing. Indeed
the Toymaker doubled down on the “truth” of the Timeless Children by
referring to the Flux.

Just as the aliens from beyond space in Wild Blue Yonder also affirmed it,
by telling the Doctor that he didn’t know who he was any more.

The Last Doctor

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 12:35:19 PMFeb 17
to
Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
>> In article <GYyKVYDLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>>> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>>> In article <GYuKCOoLczB@ATH>, Mickmane <A...@kruemel.org> wrote:
>
> [Ghost Light.... WHAT!?]
>>>>> Oh, totally missed that other reality bit.
>>>
>>>> MM for you!
>>>
>>> I guess you don't mean one of a particular sweet?
>
>> MM is Mike McKeown.
>
> Names and I don't get on well, I'd be hard pressed listing all actors
> who played the Doctor, never mind companions or even anyone not seen on
> the show. I barely remember the in-show names of the companions.

Dave “Yads”, “Yellowbeard” Yadallee refuses to stop posting as “the Doctor”
despite being just about the least Doctor-like poster on Usenet.

I am the one he usually refers to as “MM”, posting as “The Last Doctor” in
protest against the absurdity of Yads arrogating a name to himself that is
utterly unfitting.

Others have done a similar thing, amongst them Aggie (whose initials are
AGA and used to post as “Agamemnon”) who now posts as “The True Doctor”
which is ironic as half of what he posts are lies of Trump-like insanity
and the other half reflects views that would be anathema to the Doctor (the
TV character, not Yads). But that’s just my opinion … make your own mind up
on that one!

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 3:31:09 PMFeb 17
to
The Doctor wrote:

> In article <xn0oi5iwx...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Blueshirt <blue...@indigo.news> wrote:
> > Mickmane wrote:
> >
> >> On 16.02.24, doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
> <doc...@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > That one! THe Master was in it!
> >>
> >> Oh, so then it's just lame. That dude isn't even like vistors or
> >> fish, just plain boring.
> >
> > Dave won't like that... Anthony Ainley and himself were best
> > buds.
> >
> > Where's that famous photo again Dave, I haven't seen it for a few
> > years?
>
> https://www.nk.ca/~doctor/

That's the one! You look very dapper David...

I was never a fan of Ainley's Master though, as far as I was
concerned, Roger Delgado was THE Master!

Blueshirt

unread,
Feb 17, 2024, 3:55:24 PMFeb 17