If you were novelizing City of Death...

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Shane "Remo D" Dallmann

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Mar 21, 2002, 8:02:23 PM3/21/02
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...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe the
scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that point?

--
_____________________________________________

"What a day!"
The Baron--"Flesh For Frankenstein"
_____________________________________________

_____________________________________________

______________________________________________


Corey Klemow

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Mar 21, 2002, 8:16:23 PM3/21/02
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Shane \"Remo D\" Dallmann wrote:

> ...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe the
> scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
> that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that point?

I would handle it just like novelization-ist Vic Crume:

"The critic was a tall, gregarious man who looked exactly like John Cleese."

coreY
CKl...@compuserve.com

In my ideal world, that posting could have ended right there. (In your ideal
world, it was probably never posted at all.) However, as most of you probably
have no clue what I'm talking about, I'll have to Explain the Joke:

Vic Crume was a hack writer of my childhood, who made a living writing
novelizations of various "family" films of the 1970s, many of which were
published by Scholastic Books. In his novelization of "Herbie, the Love Bug,"
he describes the character played by Buddy Hackett to his young readers - and
I'm not kidding about this - as somebody who "looked and talked exactly like
Buddy Hackett." Not only was this lazy writing, it assumed that a generation
of very young children would know exactly who Buddy Hackett was... and Hackett,
in the 1970s, was mostly known for his raunchy, expletive-and-innuendo-laden
Vegas act...

For more works by Vic Crume, check here:

http://home.123india.com/booksby/C/Books_by_Vic_Crume.html

Truly a menage of classics.

coreY
CKl...@compuserve.com


David Brunt

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Mar 21, 2002, 8:39:35 PM3/21/02
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Corey Klemow wrote in message

>Vic Crume was a hack writer of my childhood, who made a living writing
>novelizations of various "family" films of the 1970s, many of which were
>published by Scholastic Books. In his novelization of "Herbie, the Love
Bug,"
>he describes the character
<snip>

Not that it matters much but as I understand it *he* was a *she* by the
name of Victoria who wrote those books under an implied male name because
female tie-in writers were something of a rarity.

The exception was Marilyn Ross, who did the Dark Shadows books. Who was a
married man named Dan who preferred to write about soap operas and gothic
dramas under a female name. It takes all sorts.

David


Cardinal Zorak

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Mar 21, 2002, 8:56:04 PM3/21/02
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"David Brunt" <Dvb..@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:a7e20m$5cq$1...@paris.btinternet.com...

Marilyn's not *so* far from Marion which is a man's name - according to John
Wayne ;-)

CZ


remove hormel to reply

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Mar 21, 2002, 10:10:12 PM3/21/02
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I wouldn't suggest it were John Cleese at all, I'd just write it as it
happened. It was a museum patron, not John Cleese.

o--c
___
/ __ __ __ \ / _ __ __
/ |_ |_ |_ \ /\ / | | |_/ |_/|_
(_/ |_ | | \/ \/ |_| | \ | \ _|
---c
Building the foundations for a spookier tomorrow...

Brax

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Mar 21, 2002, 11:05:10 PM3/21/02
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"remove hormel to reply" <jeff...@aol.com.hormel> wrote in message
news:20020321221012...@mb-cc.aol.com...

> I wouldn't suggest it were John Cleese at all, I'd just write it as it
> happened. It was a museum patron, not John Cleese.

But that would lose the whole point of the scene, which was /only/ included
in the story when Cleese and Bron were available.

I'd write it as John Cleese himself visiting the art gallery...

Brax

David Brider

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Mar 22, 2002, 1:00:12 AM3/22/02
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Shane "Remo D" Dallmann wrote in message ...

>...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe the
>scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
>that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that point?

Well, leaving aside the point that if I were novelising "City of Death" it would
mean that something seriously unusual had happened to the entire fabric of the
space time continuum and the publishers were approaching total hacks to do the
job... :o)

I've a suspicious feeling that I wouldn't even include the scene. Not sure, but
as it was an on-the-day ad lib cameo, and I'd wager doesn't even appear in
rehearsal/camera scripts, and doesn't really advance the plot... I might sort
of mention it in passing - "the TARDIS vanished with a wheezing, groaning noise,
much to the bemusement of two of the art gallery's visitors who had assumed that
it was one of the many works of art on display." But I'd certainly not bother
with the dialogue or physical descriptions of Cleese or Bron.

[Whoops, I forgot: "Wheezing, groaning noise" is Š Terrance Dicks, 1970s, and
used without permission.]

--
David Brider; a full-length adventure, too broad and too deep for the small
screen.
This week I have been mostly re-reading: "Intervention" by Julian May.
"...God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners,
Christ died for us."
(Romans 5:8)
"I'm always the kooky girl. I don't think I have ever played someone my age,
straight, together, who wears normal clothes and doesn't turn out to be a
murderer."
(Charlotte Coleman. 3rd April 1968 - 14th November 2001. Irreplaceable.)
http://www.geocities.com/davidbrider/index.html


Corey Klemow

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Mar 22, 2002, 4:57:52 AM3/22/02
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David Brunt wrote:

> Corey Klemow wrote in message
> >Vic Crume was a hack writer of my childhood, who made a living writing
> >novelizations of various "family" films of the 1970s, many of which were
> >published by Scholastic Books. In his novelization of "Herbie, the Love
> Bug,"
> >he describes the character
> <snip>
>
> Not that it matters much but as I understand it *he* was a *she* by the
> name of Victoria who wrote those books under an implied male name because
> female tie-in writers were something of a rarity.

Thank you for that bit of Vic Crume trivia... I didn't even know that there
*was* such a thing as Vic Crume trivia! :)

coreY
CKl...@compuserve.com


David Brunt

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Mar 22, 2002, 5:37:33 AM3/22/02
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Brax wrote in message ...

>"remove hormel to reply" <jeff...@aol.com.hormel> wrote in message
>> I wouldn't suggest it were John Cleese at all, I'd just write it as it
>> happened. It was a museum patron, not John Cleese.
>
>But that would lose the whole point of the scene, which was /only/
included
>in the story when Cleese and Bron were available.

No it wasn't....

It's included in the emergency first draft script written by Adams and
Williams. I've got part of that here, covered in alcohol and tea stains.
That predated the studio recording by at least a month or two.

So it was not an on-set addition, even if the casting may have been. In
which case, who was cast in those roles before Cleese and Bron, because
somebody must have been? This all smacks of fan-urban legend to me.

David


The Doctor

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Mar 22, 2002, 9:15:11 AM3/22/02
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In article <20020321221012...@mb-cc.aol.com>,

remove hormel to reply <jeff...@aol.com.hormel> wrote:
>I wouldn't suggest it were John Cleese at all, I'd just write it as it
>happened. It was a museum patron, not John Cleese.
>

Novelising John Cleese as having a rolein City of Death?

You might as well forget the count and call him Julian Glover.
--
Member - Liberal International On 11 Sept 2001 the WORLD was violated.
This is doc...@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doc...@nl2k.ab.ca
Society MUST be saved! Extremists must dissolve.
Beware of defining as intelligent only those who share your opinions

Bokman7757

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Mar 22, 2002, 12:34:43 PM3/22/02
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>From: "Shane \"Remo D\" Dallmann" Shane.D...@gte.net

>...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe
>the
>scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
>that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that point?

"The art critic nodded admiringly, noting to himself that he'd have to tell
Sybil about this when he got back..."

David Brider

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Mar 22, 2002, 12:36:09 PM3/22/02
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David Brunt wrote in message ...

>Brax wrote in message ...

>>But that would lose the whole point of the scene, which was /only/ included


>>in the story when Cleese and Bron were available.

>No it wasn't....
>
>It's included in the emergency first draft script written by Adams and
>Williams. I've got part of that here, covered in alcohol and tea stains.

You really should take more care of your copies of "Doctor Who" scripts.

;oÞ

Misha Lauenstein

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Mar 22, 2002, 1:32:01 PM3/22/02
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"David Brider" <david@NO_SPAMdwjbrider.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message news:<a7ehes$ino$1...@news7.svr.pol.co.uk>...

> Shane "Remo D" Dallmann wrote in message ...
> >...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo?

> I might sort


> of mention it in passing - "the TARDIS vanished with a wheezing, groaning noise,
> much to the bemusement of two of the art gallery's visitors who had assumed that
> it was one of the many works of art on display."

Oh, if you're taking out all the jokes, don't forget the "You're a
beautiful woman, probably." bit.

Misha

David Brunt

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Mar 22, 2002, 2:01:03 PM3/22/02
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David Brider wrote in message ...

>>It's included in the emergency first draft script written by Adams and
>>Williams. I've got part of that here, covered in alcohol and tea stains.
>
>You really should take more care of your copies of "Doctor Who" scripts.

Well, they match the tea and alcohol stains that were already on there...
It's like noughts and crosses.

David

p.s.Noughts won.


Daniel Frankham

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Mar 22, 2002, 2:14:57 PM3/22/02
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On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 01:02:23 GMT, "Shane \"Remo D\" Dallmann"
<Shane.D...@gte.net> wrote:

>...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe the
>scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
>that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that point?

Johann Clues liked art.

He had discovered this some time in the 1960s, around the time the art
world was moving on from the mild but dull oddness of cubism and
futurism and surrealism, to the less mild but much duller oddness of
guys in suits standing around all day - but in an art gallery. But it
was all tremendously *intellectually* exciting, of course.

After several years of struggling through a degree in fine arts and
trying awfully hard to understand and appreciate it all, he had been
standing in a gallery in Soho one day in 1967, watching a still life
called "Nude in Chair" which, however hard he tried to analyse it,
just seemed to be a naked woman sitting in a chair, when a revelation
came upon him. Hardly knowing what he was doing, he found himself
turning to the attractive young flower child beside him, and
explaining, with great eloquence and persuasiveness, what it all
meant.

Afterwards he wasn't even sure quite what he'd said, and the little
that he remembered didn't make a great deal of sense to him. It was as
though his higher brain functions had gone to sleep, and some kind of
hitherto unsuspected art sense had taken over his mouth for a few
minutes. And it worked a charm. Because the chicks, as they used to
say in 1967, really dug it.

So here he was twelve years later, in Paris with Lenore Braun, art
critic for that French art magazine which fortunately he didn't have
to pretend to read, since nobody expected the English to learn the
Frog language just to read art magazines, not even leading art
academics. He'd had his eye on her for years now, after catching the
odd fleeting glimpse, trying but never quite succeeding in initiating
contact with an occasional awkward English nod and mouthed greeting at
various conferences and exhibitions, and now through a stroke of sheer
luck he'd found her entirely by chance in some obscure little gallery
and introduced himself as the great English art critic (not that he
said it of course, but in the art world in which she moved his name
was synonymous with the expression) and soon his tongue would be
working its magic upon her.

But there was nothing there. He stared long and hard, but... nothing.
He started to say something about a painting of coloured geometric
shapes, hoping he could kickstart it by getting his mouth moving, but
it went nowhere and he had to pretend it had only been a coughing fit.
Coloured geometric shapes. Seen it, talked it up, finished with it. It
was a problem he'd faced only a few times before. He had come up with
a theory: that whatever part of his brain was responsible for the
Gift, actually needed some kind of artistic stimulation to get it
going, needed to be fed. He had come to think of it as almost a living
thing, a thing that ate art and shat first-class criticism out of his
mouth. And it was getting nothing here.

He began to sweat. It had never been this bad before. Lenore was
starting to look at him askance, clearly asking herself if this tall,
dark, devilishly handsome Englishman's reputation was all it was
cracked up to be. If something didn't happen soon, he'd lose her, and
then would he ever have the confidence to bring a woman into an art
gallery again?

He turned away from the wall in despair, and there it was. A simple,
tall, blue wooden box. An old Police Box, in fact, like he used to see
a lot in the 60s, back when the Gift had come so effortlessly. And as
he looked at it his mouth began to move, and his higher brain centers
nestled warmly into their familiar cocoon, and it was good.

--
Daniel Frankham

Brax

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Mar 22, 2002, 3:18:47 PM3/22/02
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"Daniel Frankham" <dan...@bigblue.net.au> wrote in message
news:idum9u023egoq96el...@4ax.com...

> On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 01:02:23 GMT, "Shane \"Remo D\" Dallmann"
> <Shane.D...@gte.net> wrote:
>
> >...how would you handle the John Cleese cameo? Would you just describe
the
> >scene as it appears, or would you try to drop a hint or a bit of wordplay
> >that would tip the reader off that he was to picture Cleese at that
point?
>
> Johann Clues liked art.
<snip>

nice!

Brax

Auntie Krizu

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Mar 22, 2002, 5:48:22 PM3/22/02
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"Daniel Frankham" <dan...@bigblue.net.au> kirjoitti viestissä
news:idum9u023egoq96el...@4ax.com...

*snip*

You *ARE* Douglas Adams and I claim my five pounds!!!! QUOTEFILE!

Auntie Krizu(:>)


Corey Klemow

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Mar 22, 2002, 6:06:16 PM3/22/02
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Daniel Frankham wrote:

> Johann Clues liked art.

[snip]

Exquisite. Simply exquisite.

QUOTEFILE!

coreY
CKl...@compuserve.com


Jonathan Blum

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Mar 22, 2002, 7:29:49 PM3/22/02
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In article <idum9u023egoq96el...@4ax.com>,

Daniel Frankham <dan...@bigblue.net.au> wrote:
>Johann Clues liked art.

[snip]

A thing of beauty is a joy forever. QUOTEFILE!

Regards,
Jon Blum

Shane "Remo D" Dallmann

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Mar 22, 2002, 7:59:13 PM3/22/02
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Bravo, Daniel! Best bit I've read today!
--
_____________________________________________

"What a day!"
The Baron--"Flesh For Frankenstein"
_____________________________________________

_____________________________________________

______________________________________________
.com...

Corey Klemow

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Mar 22, 2002, 9:04:51 PM3/22/02
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Just caught this:

> and now through a stroke of sheer
> luck he'd found her entirely by chance in some obscure little gallery

The Louvre is an "obscure little gallery"? :)

coreY
CKl...@compuserve.com


Brax

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Mar 22, 2002, 10:56:23 PM3/22/02
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"Corey Klemow" <CKl...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:3C9BE2C2...@compuserve.com...

> Just caught this:
>
> > and now through a stroke of sheer
> > luck he'd found her entirely by chance in some obscure little gallery
>
> The Louvre is an "obscure little gallery"? :)

it aint a patch og the Braxiatel Collection!

Brax
(not Irving, the other one)

Shane "Remo D" Dallmann

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Mar 22, 2002, 11:04:35 PM3/22/02
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"Corey Klemow" <CKl...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:3C9BE2C2...@compuserve.com...
> Just caught this:
>
> > and now through a stroke of sheer
> > luck he'd found her entirely by chance in some obscure little gallery
>
> The Louvre is an "obscure little gallery"? :)
>
> coreY
> CKlemow@compuserve

Plenty of the story is set in the Louvre, but that's not where the Doctor
parked the TARDIS.

--
_____________________________________________

"What a day!"
The Baron--"Flesh For Frankenstein"
_____________________________________________

_____________________________________________

______________________________________________
.com
>
>


Daniel Frankham

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Mar 22, 2002, 11:52:47 PM3/22/02
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On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 18:04:51 -0800, Corey Klemow
<CKl...@compuserve.com> wrote:

>Just caught this:
>
>> and now through a stroke of sheer
>> luck he'd found her entirely by chance in some obscure little gallery
>
>The Louvre is an "obscure little gallery"? :)

I was under the imp that the TARDIS wasn't in the Louvre -- but in
another more modern gallery elsewhere in Paris (necessitting some
delightful running through the streets to get from one to the other).

OTOH if I recall incorrectly... just put it down to the character
really not (consciously) knowing or caring anything about art :)

--
Daniel Frankham

Miche Doherty

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Mar 23, 2002, 6:04:59 AM3/23/02
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Corey Klemow <CKl...@compuserve.com> wrote:

> Vic Crume was a hack writer of my childhood, who made a living writing
> novelizations of various "family" films of the 1970s, many of which were
> published by Scholastic Books. In his novelization of "Herbie, the Love
> Bug," he describes the character played by Buddy Hackett to his young
> readers - and I'm not kidding about this - as somebody who "looked and
> talked exactly like Buddy Hackett."

"Had Adric ever seen television, and had Tegan come to Britain a few
years earlier, it might have occurred to them that Todd looked
remarkably like a slightly fatter Sandra from The Liver Birds. But they
hadn't, so it didn't."

Miche.
--
"I try not to speak more clearly than I think." (Niels Bohr)

The Stainless Steel Cat

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Mar 23, 2002, 1:39:26 PM3/23/02
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In article <1f9hjni.1ammdi413dvb1oN%mdoh...@mac.com>,
mdoh...@mac.com (Miche Doherty) wrote:

(Ere! You ere that Sandra? Tha bloke just called you fat! You want me to
get ar kid to beat up him for you? Aw wait I can't, I've got to put on a
snooty accent an go an teach in a little sinister village.)

Doctor: You know Sanders, you look somehow familiar... you've never flown
bomber aircraft have you? <Stroll away humming the Dambusters March>

Cat.
--
La Rustimuna ^Stalkato
stee...@mac.comtrousers
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