Off Kilter, Mo'Rockin and Fife & Drum leaving Epcot?

[Steve Soares]

I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the end of
September.

--

Steve Soares
Webmaster of WDW Live Entertainment
http://wdwent.com

[Steve Russo]

On 8/28/2014 8:51 AM, Steve Soares wrote:
> I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the end of
> September.
>

I'm seeing the same on FB, also including the World Showcase Players,
and I hope it's in error. I know this is the end of Disney's fiscal year
and I'm hoping this just means they're negotiating new contracts.

--
Steve

[John Mc.]

"Steve Soares" <ho...@wdwent.com> wrote:
> I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the end of
> September.

Say it ain't so Joe eeerrrr Steve. Epcot would not be the same without Off
Kilter. Same goes with the others.

John Mc.

[Steve Russo]

I enjoy Off Kilter but they've been playing there for a hundred years.
Hopefully, a new group will be as good or better. I'll probably miss the
World Showcase Players most. They changed those shows just enough to
keep them fresh and I always enjoyed them.

--
Steve

[Sandi Femino]

In article <ltn8kj$88k$1...@speranza.aioe.org>,

"Steve Soares" <ho...@wdwent.com> wrote:

> I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the end of
> September.

I always have mixed feelings when Dis lets an act go, or closes one
attraction for another. I hate to see the old beloved stuff go, but it
is always fun to see the new.
That said, I will seriously miss Mo' Rockin, just as I still miss
Chirikli (I think that was the spelling...those large bird puppets that
roamed World Showcase)

--


Sandi
http://capecodcards.blogspot.com/

[Paul]

"Steve Soares" <ho...@wdwent.com> wrote in
news:ltn8kj$88k$1...@speranza.aioe.org:

> I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the
> end of September.

Another bit of luck in our timing -- this trip we should be able to see
these acts, and also dine at Kouzzina, all of which will be missed.

--
Paul in NH -- Latest plans, Sept. 7-14, 2014, BCV

pssawyer at comcast dot net

[judy.f...@gmail.com]

As much as I enjoy listening to and watching Off Kilter, on my last two visits I only watched them sing one song and then I left. It seems like they always do the same set.
Maybe a change will be good.

Judy

[Gloria Konsler]

On 8/29/2014 3:45 PM, Sandi Femino wrote:

> I always have mixed feelings when Dis lets an act go, or closes one
> attraction for another. I hate to see the old beloved stuff go, but it
> is always fun to see the new.

Interesting perspective, Sandy! I posted a link to the information on
another Disney planning group (on Facebook-- a friend started as a
private site to help her friends plan trips --so don't go looking of it,
you won't find it LOL)

Anyway, there are now about 100 members who post regularly, mainly
asking the usual questions that people who only visit once or
occasionally ask.

So, I posted the information about the entertainment changes at Epcot
and no one had anything negative to say. Everyone who commented just
said something like, "Oh, great! I like the entertainment at Epcot. It
will be nice to see something different this trip." I was sort of
shocked. I expected, "Oh, that's too bad, I always loved XYZABC."

I think those of us who visit more often get attached to certain people,
groups, acts and we hate to see them go. It's like losing an old friend
or a member of the family.

...but to the average park-goer, it's just entertainment. They don't
care whether it's new or old, it's just something to see or do.

Gloria

[Steve Russo]

I guess I was surprised by the passionate and negative comments - mostly
on Facebook. Everyone screams for new stuff but, when it comes, no one
wants to give up what's already there. It seems people have already
decided these moves are being made for cost cutting reasons (always a
possibility) and the new entertainment is sub-par compared to the
existing stuff - without ever seeing the new acts.

I will miss the Word Showcase Players but, to be honest, it's been years
since I've listened to more than a song or two from Off Kilter. They're
good but not good enough for me to kill 20-30 minutes and they've been
there for what... 15 years?

I'd like to at least see this new entertainment before passing judgment.

--
Steve

[Lisa Cubbon]

I am with you and I said something similar on FB. I was not shouted down
for it. Wait and see. I remember a few years back, the Mariachi
Colibre had it hours cut and there was high dungeon about that. I lot of
ailing and gnashing of teeth stuff. Now, no one mentions it and they
still get to enjoy the mariachi.


I still miss the Tapestry of Nations Parade and those huge drums and
puppets. I wish Phoenix was able to see it but WS NOW? HA! Lawsuit....

Remember the trams that used to go out to WS and drop people off (or the
trams by the international gateway that went out to Swan and Dolphin and
all stops in between, past the enticing Boardwalk Resort....) but
nowadays, no way that can be done. I am amazing that Disney ran the
buses and the parade as long as they did. And that they still run the
old time firetruck and horse cart (mornings only!) at the MK.

I am hoping that the new Blueland at DAK will enthrall me better than
the new Fantasy Land does.

Wait and see if my motto in my old age (no cracks ok?)


Lisa

(enjoy the typos...)

[John Mc.]

I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
thing not necessarily change.

My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
way to save money? The only one that comes to my mind is the new 3
o'clock parade. An example from the other side-when Fantasmic started
the pre-show was the two bellhops (Delman and Moe). They were hilarious.
And now? A lame sing along show.

New doesn't always mean better. I hadn't noticed a decrease in the
audience size for either group so I don't see this as a popularity
thing. From the Disney Park blog:

<http://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2014/08/new-entertainment-experiences-coming-to-world-showcase-at-epcot/>


or

<http://tinyurl.com/os2wqus>

I see: "Berber music and dance troupe in Morocco, a corps of dynamic
flag-waving performers in Italy, a thrilling lumberjack-inspired show in
Canada, a Celtic folk music ensemble at the United Kingdom" as the
"improvements" they'll be making. SWMBO might enjoy the Celtic show but
I'm not sure this is an "improvement." But I can always vote with my
feet. I did the same at a local deli restaurant. I'd usually have lunch
there on Saturday. They have decent selection of food at a good price.
As music they had a mix from the 50's,60's and 70"s. Suddenly the music
went from the mix I enjoyed to contemporary pop hits. Wouldn't change it
back so I stopped eating there. Did I put them out of business? No but
I've gone elsewhere with my money. I'll give the new shows a try but as
Epcot is my least favorite park I can easily eat elsewhere, use the FP+
to schedule the few rides I like in the evening and then catch
Illuminations and leave.

John Mc.

[Rudeney]

On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>
> I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
> thing not necessarily change.
>
> My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
> entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
> way to save money?

We can still hope that the changes will be new and exciting acts, but we have
been trained to expect the opposite: cutbacks. We can still hope, though!


--

- RODNEY

Next WDW Vacation?
Who knows!

Need to know more about RADP (rec.arts.disney.parks)?

http://www.radp.org
http://allears.net/btp/radp_bk.htm
http://allears.net/tp/abrev.htm

Are you still accessing RADP via Google? Why?
Get instructions on how to access to the "real"
RADP Usenet Group here:

http://meets.radp.org/usenet.htm

[Steve Russo]

On 9/2/2014 12:09 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>
>> I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
>> thing not necessarily change.
>>
>> My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
>> entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
>> way to save money?
>
>
> We can still hope that the changes will be new and exciting acts, but we have
> been trained to expect the opposite: cutbacks. We can still hope, though!
>
>

I think we have to at least give the benefit of the doubt. Too many
folks are condemning these new acts without having seen them.

--
Steve

[slawter]

On 9/1/2014 7:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
> On 8/28/2014 1:54 PM, Steve Russo wrote:
>> On 8/28/2014 11:04 AM, John Mc. wrote:
>>> "Steve Soares" <ho...@wdwent.com> wrote:
>>>> I'm reading on Twitter that these three groups will be gone by the
>>>> end of
>>>> September.
>>>
>>>
>>> Say it ain't so Joe eeerrrr Steve. Epcot would not be the same
>>> without Off
>>> Kilter. Same goes with the others.
>>>
>>> John Mc.
>>>
>> I enjoy Off Kilter but they've been playing there for a hundred years.
>> Hopefully, a new group will be as good or better. I'll probably miss the
>> World Showcase Players most. They changed those shows just enough to
>> keep them fresh and I always enjoyed them.
>>
> I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
> thing not necessarily change.
>
> My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
> entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
> way to save money? The only one that comes to my mind is the new 3
> o'clock parade. An example from the other side-when Fantasmic started
> the pre-show was the two bellhops (Delman and Moe). They were hilarious.
> And now? A lame sing along show.

Who performed there before Off Kilter ? Certainly making the change from
*them* to Off Kilter was an improvement. OK, most of the time we lose a
very good show and I do wish they'd open a fifth gate and stock it with
all the attractions, parades, and shows that we have lost that were
worth coming back again and again to see.

-Sid

[Rudeney]

I will withhold judgment until I see what they offer. I have to admit,
though, that my first-blush reaction is that it's a function of cutbacks. And
I'm not saying that because I'm a cynic, but it makes sense. Overall park
profitability is measures by subtracting costs from revenues. Even though the
operation of a given attraction is really on the "cost" side of the balance
sheet, they measure the turnstile ticks to see how many guests each one draws.
I assume that the more guests the attraction serves, the more it is
considered a "draw" and thus contributes to profitability.

There aren't any turnstile clicks to measure for the entertainment. I guess
they could use CMs or cameras to count attendees and objectively judge
popularity, but there' really no hard ties to the revenue side of the balance
sheet. Entertainment is like the foliage - it really serves no purpose, and
is strictly a cost, but if it were missing, it would be noticed and profits
would suffer. The best financial strategy is to lower the cost of this as
much as possible, without affecting overall revenue. I suspect that these
long running acts probably demand much higher pay than new up and coming acts
would. That doesn't mean the new acts will necessarily be worse, just less
expensive to hire.

So, we should just wait and see. Who knows, maybe some of the new
entertainment will be wonderful and we will come to enjoy it more than what is
leaving. If not, we can always post our bitching and whining on The Internet. :-)

[John Mc.]

I'm willing to give the new shows a chance but I'm not sanguine about
the whole thing.

John Mc.

[John Mc.]

On 9/2/2014 2:17 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/2/2014 12:28 PM, Steve Russo wrote:
>> On 9/2/2014 12:09 PM, Rudeney wrote:
>>> On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
>>>> thing not necessarily change.
>>>>
>>>> My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
>>>> entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
>>>> way to save money?
>>>
>>>
>>> We can still hope that the changes will be new and exciting acts, but we have
>>> been trained to expect the opposite: cutbacks. We can still hope, though!
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I think we have to at least give the benefit of the doubt. Too many
>> folks are condemning these new acts without having seen them.
>

As I said else-thread the Celtic ensemble might be okay but I really
can't see the Lumberjack themed show as anything to write home about. As
for the others, I'll reserve judgement for now.

>
> I will withhold judgment until I see what they offer. I have to admit,
> though, that my first-blush reaction is that it's a function of cutbacks. And
> I'm not saying that because I'm a cynic, but it makes sense. Overall park
> profitability is measures by subtracting costs from revenues. Even though the
> operation of a given attraction is really on the "cost" side of the balance
> sheet, they measure the turnstile ticks to see how many guests each one draws.
> I assume that the more guests the attraction serves, the more it is
> considered a "draw" and thus contributes to profitability.
>
> There aren't any turnstile clicks to measure for the entertainment. I guess
> they could use CMs or cameras to count attendees and objectively judge
> popularity, but there' really no hard ties to the revenue side of the balance
> sheet. Entertainment is like the foliage - it really serves no purpose, and
> is strictly a cost, but if it were missing, it would be noticed and profits
> would suffer. The best financial strategy is to lower the cost of this as
> much as possible, without affecting overall revenue. I suspect that these
> long running acts probably demand much higher pay than new up and coming acts
> would. That doesn't mean the new acts will necessarily be worse, just less
> expensive to hire.

I know that with series television the main actors receive a salary bump
at 3 years, 5 years and at 7 with the one at 7 years being substantial.
That's the reason so few shows pass 5 years let alone 7 and those that
do start killing off supporting actors to keep the costs down. I'd
assume that the contracts for the axed acts have salary bumps at certain
years and these have hit a level Disney doesn't like. Also I'd point out
that the suits at WDW are also the ones who decided that closing the
Adventurer's Club and Comedy Warehouse and replacing them with more
dining/shopping and a "Hot Air Balloon" ride were an improvement for
guests. (I've still got that swampland in Sioux City if you want to buy it.)

>
> So, we should just wait and see. Who knows, maybe some of the new
> entertainment will be wonderful and we will come to enjoy it more than what is
> leaving. If not, we can always post our bitching and whining on The Internet. :-)
>
>

At least we've got a hobby.

John Mc.

[Lisa Cubbon]

Agreed. Change happens even at Disney! But I remember when Mr Toad's
Wild Ride was closed... WOW that was a wild time. I don't remember
quite the commotion when Horizons was taken down..

Lisa

[Rudeney]

Remember when they cancelled Surprise Mornings and replaced it with Character
Caravan? That was probably the most lame "guest experience improvement" there
ever was. I know that this was a cutback right on the heels of 9/11, but it
was just a horrible idea. Thankfully, it lasted less than a year, and then
they came back with EMH, which added extra evening hours. I suppose someone
at DIS must listen to the guests.

>> So, we should just wait and see. Who knows, maybe some of the new
>> entertainment will be wonderful and we will come to enjoy it more than what is
>> leaving. If not, we can always post our bitching and whining on The Internet. :-)
>>
>>
>
> At least we've got a hobby.

LOL!

[John Mc.]

Please. I was trying to block that out. We actually took a 2 year hiatus
following 9/11. Travel was a b.... and the cutbacks just didn't make it
appealing.


>
John Mc.

[John Mc.]

On 9/2/2014 12:09 PM, Rudeney wrote:

> On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>
>> I have an animus for the mantra: "Change is good." Improvement is a good
>> thing not necessarily change.
>>
>> My take on it is this- How often has Disney made a change to "live
>> entertainment" (Not attractions) that WAS an improvement rather than a
>> way to save money?
>
>
> We can still hope that the changes will be new and exciting acts, but we have
> been trained to expect the opposite: cutbacks. We can still hope, though!
>
>

The problem is the great unwashed masses don't realize that there's been
a change for the worse. The small cadre of regular guests don't have
enough numbers to really influence the suits. The Character
Caravan being the exception and then it was probasbly tied more to the
reduced number of guests at that time so the complaints mattered.

But I'm willing to check out the new entertainment. I'm not optimistic
but all I can do is see what they offer.

John Mc.

[Rudeney]

How ironic. I think we went to WDW more - 2 or 3 times year - in the few
years right after 9/11. Crowds were down and discounts were high. I had to
do a lot of flying for work anyhow, so I quickly became accustomed to the "new
normal" when traveling. But we also did a lot of driving, it's about 550
miles for us.

[John Mc.]

The closing of Mr. Toad was made all the worse by the fact Disney
replaced it with a less than stellar ride. I think it came down to "How
do we sell more Plush?" Admit it a plush Pooh Bear is way more appealing
than a Mr. Toad.

John Mc.

[John Mc.]

Double for me and SWMBO has trouble with long car rides now so we fly. I
think our first post 9/11 trip was in October of 2004. Then 2005 but in
2006 we did our first trip to Italy. After that we've alternated with
overseas trips then Disney.... though the last two years we've taken
advantage of SWMBO's work conferences.

John Mc.

[Steve Denham]

On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 5:59:18 PM UTC-4, John Mc. wrote:

>
> > Agreed. Change happens even at Disney! But I remember when Mr Toad's
>
> > Wild Ride was closed... WOW that was a wild time. I don't remember
>
> > quite the commotion when Horizons was taken down..
>
> >
>
> > Lisa
>
>
>
> The closing of Mr. Toad was made all the worse by the fact Disney
>
> replaced it with a less than stellar ride. I think it came down to "How
>
> do we sell more Plush?" Admit it a plush Pooh Bear is way more appealing
>
> than a Mr. Toad.
>
>
>
> John Mc.

I WILL NEVER ADMIT IT.

They never even test marketed plush Toad, or plush Demons, or plush weasels, or plush Toad Hall, or even plush Hell.

Steve Denham
TDC Barbie Headhunter

[Rudeney]

Jan also hates to sit for a long time. In fact, she won't travel overseas due
to the flight time. I've been trying to get her to go with me to one of my
Vegas conferences, but she doesn't even want to make that 4-hour flight. It's
four solid hours of driving to Destin, but we always make several stops -
lunch or dinner, plus several rests. Plus we make the drive so often, she
knows the landmarks and that makes it seem shorter. Honestly, I have no
problem with the drive to WDW. I've made the drive by myself in less than 8
hours, but that's with minimal stops (maybe one). With Jan along, it's 9 or
more due to a stop every 2 hours.

[Lisa Cubbon]

On 9/3/14, 4:24 PM, John Mc. wrote:
> On 9/3/2014 10:44 AM, Rudeney wrote:
>> On 9/2/2014 5:52 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>> On 9/2/2014 2:17 PM, Rudeney wrote:
>>>>
>
>>
>> Remember when they cancelled Surprise Mornings and replaced it with
>> Character
>> Caravan?

Just when I had erased that memory from my brain... We were at
Boardwalk Inn with a room that faced the portico; one very early
morning, I heard all this NOISE... And there it was the Character
Caravan... LOUD and no kids were anywhere around. Ugh....

[Lisa Cubbon]

Agreed that was doing the REIGN of that hated man who's name escapes me.
Got it. Paul Pressler!! He was the great believer in pushing plush.

I just finished reading Marty Sklar's memoir. It was a fun book to
read. Not many people left who really were under Walt's direct
influence.

Lisa
> John Mc.

[Lisa Cubbon]

LOL~~~~ So true.. LOL..


Lisa

[Rudeney]

On 9/4/2014 11:36 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
> On 9/3/14, 5:59 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>> On 9/3/2014 9:51 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>> On 9/2/14, 1:28 PM, Steve Russo wrote:
>>>> On 9/2/2014 12:09 PM, Rudeney wrote:
>>>>> On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>>>>>
>
>>> Agreed. Change happens even at Disney! But I remember when Mr
>>> Toad's Wild Ride was closed... WOW that was a wild time. I don't
>>> remember quite the commotion when Horizons was taken down..
>>>
>>> Lisa
>>
>> The closing of Mr. Toad was made all the worse by the fact Disney
>> replaced it with a less than stellar ride. I think it came down to "How
>> do we sell more Plush?" Admit it a plush Pooh Bear is way more appealing
>> than a Mr. Toad.
>>
>
> Agreed that was doing the REIGN of that hated man who's name escapes me.
> Got it. Paul Pressler!! He was the great believer in pushing plush.

"Paul Pressler Pushes Plush" (say that 10 times fast!)

>
> I just finished reading Marty Sklar's memoir. It was a fun book to read.
> Not many people left who really were under Walt's direct influence.

Yes, that exclusive club is shrinking every day. Based on what Michael Eisner
"said" I was very hopeful that we would continue the great traditions Walt had
instituted. Based on what he "did", I was disappointed.

[John Mc.]

On 9/4/2014 1:50 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/4/2014 11:36 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>> On 9/3/14, 5:59 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>> On 9/3/2014 9:51 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>>> On 9/2/14, 1:28 PM, Steve Russo wrote:
>>>>> On 9/2/2014 12:09 PM, Rudeney wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/1/2014 6:26 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>
>>>> Agreed. Change happens even at Disney! But I remember when Mr
>>>> Toad's Wild Ride was closed... WOW that was a wild time. I don't
>>>> remember quite the commotion when Horizons was taken down..
>>>>
>>>> Lisa
>>>
>>> The closing of Mr. Toad was made all the worse by the fact Disney
>>> replaced it with a less than stellar ride. I think it came down to "How
>>> do we sell more Plush?" Admit it a plush Pooh Bear is way more appealing
>>> than a Mr. Toad.
>>>
>>
>> Agreed that was doing the REIGN of that hated man who's name escapes me.
>> Got it. Paul Pressler!! He was the great believer in pushing plush.
>
>
> "Paul Pressler Pushes Plush" (say that 10 times fast!)
>
>
>>
>> I just finished reading Marty Sklar's memoir. It was a fun book to read.
>> Not many people left who really were under Walt's direct influence.
>
>
> Yes, that exclusive club is shrinking every day. Based on what Michael Eisner
> "said" I was very hopeful that we would continue the great traditions Walt had
> instituted. Based on what he "did", I was disappointed.
>
>

Weren't we all. At the start I thought highly of him but that soon
evaporated.

John Mc.

John Mc.

[John Mc.]

Judy has more problems with automobile travel than planes. The only
problem there is on long overseas flights she insists on a cup of coffee
when were about 30 mins or so out. That's fine except that by the time
we deplane she's GOTTA GO MAN. Which sticks me with corralling all the
luggage. Not fun.

John Mc.

[John Mc.]

Plush Toad or weasel dolls might have worked but we'll never know.

John Mc.

[Lisa Cubbon]

I think Eisner did a lot of good at Disney. The company was in dire
straits before he was recruited into the company. He expanded the
business, reinvigorated the cast members and expanded the footprint of
the parks. Turned them into resorts actually.

Reading Marty's book you can see evidence of the good he did.

Then things and egos got out of hand, badly. He outstayed his welcome
and good will at Disney.


Read what Sklar has to say about Dick Nunis and it's really???? Things
you don't know until you read the books. Granted it's one person's view
but interesting. I was sad when I finished reading the book too.


Lisa

>
> John Mc.
>
> John Mc.

[Lisa Cubbon]

I gotta try that one! I am usually helping Andy get the bags etc. But
that going to the toilet might work.... Thanks John!

Lisa

[Rudeney]

My whole view of Eisner changed after reading "Disney War". It really showed
his ego and incompetence. And then, there was this underlying weird idea that
he was "Walt incarnate".

[Tom Moeller]

"Lisa Cubbon" <cub...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:lucdm3$kmp$2...@dont-email.me...

If you fly into an inefficient airport like ALB, there's plenty of time for
a bathroom break before luggage hits the carousel... even when they don't
hook up the second jetway from the back of the plane.

tom

[Steve Russo]

Hang on. Are you saying ALB is inefficient? ;-)

Here's what ALWAYS happens... I deplane, we both take bathroom breaks,
head down the escalator to baggage claim and wait 10-15 minutes for the
carousel to start moving. Then it's another 10-15 minutes until I see my
luggage. I always plan on 30-45 minutes before we leave the airport.


--
Steve

[John Mc.]

Let me add that on our last overseas trip for a cruise I had A carry-on
and a small suitcase weighing 42 lbs all together. She had -a carry on,
a small personal (ha!) item and two suitcases. In one of her suitcases
was a second suitcase which she palmed off on me for the return trip
after filling it with who knows what. And on the way back? "I" was
almost over the weight limit on both bags. Thanks Dear.

John Mc.

[Mark L Fendrick]

Actually, Character Caravan did have its origin in the aftermath of 9/11.

Many families where stranded at the resorts (if you had an airline ticket to go home, while the flights were grounded Disney allowed you to stay at your resort at no charge. Character Caravan was instituted for those families who were not going to a park (once they re-opened). Most of the families who were stranded had already spend their vacation money and another park ticket (even at special prices) was not an option.


Mark

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Thursday, September 4, 2014 7:05:56 PM UTC-4, John Mc. wrote:

>
> Weren't we all. At the start I thought highly of him but that soon
>
> evaporated.

When Frank Wells was alive (remember, he was offered the position first and said that Eisner would be the better choice), he kept Eisner in check and along the path that did keep the spirit of Walt alive. When Wells was killed, with nobody to keep a reign on him and his huge ego - the Eisner beast was released and we all saw the results of that.


Mark

[Lisa Cubbon]

That's why we ALWAYS get one of those over-priced luggage carts at
baggage. I understand completely. I have not done the stash a bag
inside in a long time. We came back from a cruise in February with stuff
in our bags, not too much, and were not over the limit and we didn't
have too much carry-on. Of course it was from Sydney and we just
didn't want to tote that much from plane to plane. We went to So Africa
years ago and had severe weight restrictions on some flights so that was
tough but we proved we could do with less. Didn't like it but can do it. LOL

OTOH, when we go to WDW, we DRIVE. We live in suburban Atlanta and it's
a straight shot 7.5-8h drive. We are old and poke along. And we take
whatever we damn well want, seriously. We sometimes like nuts on the
way home with the backseat covered in Disney bags.


L

[Lisa Cubbon]

Mark, I didn't know that. Thanks! That's another plus for Disney.

Lisa

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Sunday, September 7, 2014 9:40:17 AM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:

>
> Mark, I didn't know that. Thanks! That's another plus for Disney.
>
>
>
> Lisa

First of all ... WOW ... I really need to look my posts over for spelling/grammar mistakes before I hit POST!

My daughter was working at CBR when this all happened. Was chaos!

Ironically, we had originally planned on being there then but circumstances prevented us at the last minute.



Mark

[John Mc.]

We blame those type of things on our sloppy luck elves.

<http://variety-sf.blogspot.com/2008/02/henry-kuttner-housing-problem-short.html>

Something goes wrong to upset our plans but now we are not at Disney
when the hurricane grounds flights for two days. Or I'm a few minutes
late leaving work and now get caught up in a traffic jam only to find
the reason for the jam is a 6 car pileup at the intersection I always go
through earlier. Coulda been me except for the sloppy elves.

John Mc.

[Lisa Cubbon]

HA. I didn't even notice the typos! What I remember was the NOISE
the caravan made.

Lisa

[Paul]

"John Mc." <jo...@tdcogre.com> wrote in
news:luarhp$b4o$2...@dont-email.me:

> Plush Toad or weasel dolls might have worked but we'll never know.
>
> John Mc.

We don' have to show you no Badger...

--
Paul in NH -- Here now, Sept. 7-14, 2014, BCV

pssawyer at comcast dot net

[John Mc.]

I've no problem with a luggage cart if they're available. But it seems
as though everyone has bags just like ours. Same color, same size, same
dings. We've even tried tying scarves and such to the handles. So does
everyone else. I WANT to paint some sort of design on the sides but Judy
thinks that's tacky. Anyway, so the scenario usually goes like this:

We're in some foreign airport waiting on the bags. The carousel just
starts moving AND: "Just get the bags, John. I need to use the restroom."

Now John spends 15 minutes in Hell trying to spot our bags and being
cussed at by people who think he's trying to steal theirs when he picks
it up, realizes it not ours and sets it back. Is everyone's bag some
permutation of these?

<http://slimages.macys.com/is/image/MCY/products/3/optimized/1740093_fpx.tif?$filterlrg$&wid=370>


we have them in black and red

or These

<http://coolmaterial.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Tumi-Vapor-Luggage.jpg>

Two sets of those

Because coming off the plane and jumbled all together they sure seem to be.

> OTOH, when we go to WDW, we DRIVE. We live in suburban Atlanta and it's
> a straight shot 7.5-8h drive. We are old and poke along. And we take
> whatever we damn well want, seriously. We sometimes like nuts on the
> way home with the backseat covered in Disney bags.
>
>
> L
>
>
>

It's just over 1000 miles from our house to Bonnet Creek resort. My best
time including time for gas and pit stops is 15 1/2 hours. I may not be
in Rodney's class but I can boogie when I want to. After a while we
began stopping in Atlanta overnight. But SWMBO doesn't do long car
trips now so it's around 3+ with a nonstop flight INDY to ORL.


John Mc.
(And she has to have coffee)

[Lisa Cubbon]

I know!! I got some really colorful christmas ribbon and tied it on the
handles of our checked and unchecked bags; it did help. No one else had
that ribbon!

>
>
>
>> OTOH, when we go to WDW, we DRIVE. We live in suburban Atlanta and it's
>> a straight shot 7.5-8h drive. We are old and poke along. And we take
>> whatever we damn well want, seriously. We sometimes like nuts on the
>> way home with the backseat covered in Disney bags.
>>
>>
>> L
>>
>>
>>
>
> It's just over 1000 miles from our house to Bonnet Creek resort. My best
> time including time for gas and pit stops is 15 1/2 hours. I may not be
> in Rodney's class but I can boogie when I want to. After a while we
> began stopping in Atlanta overnight. But SWMBO doesn't do long car
> trips now so it's around 3+ with a nonstop flight INDY to ORL.

So you drive from Indy? My brother lives in Sheridan. I know some of
Indy. Stopping in Atlanta is odd. Stay north and you get to enjoy
Atlanta's world famous traffic in the morning. Stay south and you
still get to experience the traffic on the southern end all the way
thru. Either way you lose. Books on CD...

Lisa

[Tom Moeller]

"Lisa Cubbon" <cub...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message

news:luiqsn$qvd$1...@dont-email.me...

> On 9/7/14, 4:48 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>> On 9/7/2014 9:39 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>> On 9/6/14, 10:55 PM, John Mc. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We're in some foreign airport waiting on the bags. The carousel
>>>>>>>> just
>> starts moving AND: "Just get the bags, John. I need to use the restroom."
>>
>> Now John spends 15 minutes in Hell trying to spot our bags and being
>> cussed at by people who think he's trying to steal theirs when he picks
>> it up, realizes it not ours and sets it back.
>

> I know!! I got some really colorful christmas ribbon and tied it on the
> handles of our checked and unchecked bags; it did help. No one else had
> that ribbon!
>

Same here, but we used leftover multi-color yarn. It's been pretty durable,
and also nobody else has the same coloring on their handles. Fortunately the
truck unloader grabs the bag by the handle, so the handle is facing you as
the bags come around on the carousel...

tom

[Steve Denham]

On Sunday, September 7, 2014 3:50:01 PM UTC-4, Paul wrote:
> "John Mc." wrote in

>
> news:luarhp$b4o$2...@dont-email.me:
>
>
>
> > Plush Toad or weasel dolls might have worked but we'll never know.
>
> >
>
> > John Mc.
>
>
>
> We don' have to show you no Badger...
>
>
>

Too sweet.

[Lisa Cubbon]

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. So I have started putting the fancy stuff
on both the top handle and the side. LOL

L

[Rudeney]

That sounds just like BHM. I think part of it is the fact that our gates are
so close to the baggage claim area the walk takes only a minute or two, but it
takes them 15-20 minutes to unload all the bags from the cargo hold. It
really makes the wait for bags seem to take a long time. In larger airports,
where you have a long walk and maybe even a tram ride between the gate and
baggage claim, you are giving the handlers time to unload the plane, and once
loaded, they can drive their trams much faster and more directly than you can
walk.

[Rudeney]

Actually, *I* invented Character Caravan, unwittingly of course! You see, it
was August of 2001 and we were saying at the "nearly empty" GF. We were
walking to The Monorail one morning and talking about maybe getting up early
the next day for EE at the MK. I was being sarcastic as I told Jan, "You
know, I'd rather be run over by a busload of Disney characters than have to
get up at the crack of dawn while on vacation!" At that very moment, there
were a group of DIS "suits" walking along with us. It was just weeks later
when they announced the end of EE and the introduction of Character Caravan. :-)

[Rudeney]

I tend to travel heavy. Most of my flights are on SWA, so I don't worry about
checking a bag or two. Just for the sake of convenience, I try to pack
everything into one medium-sized bag, but I have a hard time with the weight.
I just always over pack! I always take both business clothes and casual
clothes. And being a big guy, my clothes are big, too. On top of that, I
like to take my own personal fan (I need the noise and air movement to sleep).
I am always bumping just under the 50lb limit.

[Rudeney]

On 9/7/2014 8:39 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>
> OTOH, when we go to WDW, we DRIVE. We live in suburban Atlanta and it's
> a straight shot 7.5-8h drive. We are old and poke along.

I am glad you said it... ;-)

[Rudeney]

I used to have "Hollywood Tower Hotel" luggage tags on my bags, but over the
years, they have all been broken and lost. I now use some that I got as
schwag at a conference. They are very flexible and rubbery so they aren't
easily broken. I have yellow ones I use. And then even though my bag is a
black Delsey and looks like most other black bags, it has these fancy chrome
wheels that no one else seems to have, so between that and the yellow tag,
mine is easily spotted.

[Mark L Fendrick]

I have two large plastic tags that I bought at Brookstones years ago ... one says, ARE WE THERE YET? and the other says, STOP THIS THING, I WANT TO GET OFF!

I have yet to see another piece of luggage with these tags and they make it easy to spot ours.


Mark

[slawter]

On 9/8/2014 11:54 AM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/7/2014 8:28 AM, Mark L Fendrick wrote:
>> Actually, Character Caravan did have its origin in the aftermath of 9/11.
>>
>> Many families where stranded at the resorts (if you had an airline ticket
>> to go home, while the flights were grounded Disney allowed you to stay at
>> your resort at no charge. Character Caravan was instituted for those
>> families who were not going to a park (once they re-opened). Most of the
>> families who were stranded had already spend their vacation money and
>> another park ticket (even at special prices) was not an option.
>
>
> Actually, *I* invented Character Caravan, unwittingly of course! You see, it
> was August of 2001 and we were saying at the "nearly empty" GF. We were
> walking to The Monorail one morning and talking about maybe getting up early
> the next day for EE at the MK. I was being sarcastic as I told Jan, "You
> know, I'd rather be run over by a busload of Disney characters than have to
> get up at the crack of dawn while on vacation!" At that very moment, there
> were a group of DIS "suits" walking along with us. It was just weeks later
> when they announced the end of EE and the introduction of Character Caravan. :-)
>
>
>

Wizard ?? Is that you ??

[Lisa Cubbon]

On 9/8/14, 12:01 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/7/2014 8:39 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>
>> OTOH, when we go to WDW, we DRIVE. We live in suburban Atlanta and it's
>> a straight shot 7.5-8h drive. We are old and poke along.
>
>
> I am glad you said it... ;-)
>
>

I beat you to it is all. lol

Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

Those would be great to have.

Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

Now, Rodney, you KNOW that DISNEY would never ever use an idea that a
guest opined, EVER, right? Why, just because at that very same moment
a suit came up with the idea is mere coincidence in this great big
wonderful world (of color. I could not help myself to that one.)

Really....


Lisa (lol)

[Steve Russo]

I guess I've been spoiled by Magical Express. I check my bags at the
Albany airport and they appear in my hotel rooma couple of hours after
landing. I've not had an issue... so far.

--
Steve

[Lisa Cubbon]

Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..


Lisa

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 9:39:10 AM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:
>
> Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..
>

As much as I love flying and getting there in a little over 2 hours actual travel time, all of the preboarding routines have put me off flying when I can help it.

Since both my wife and I are retired and have all the time in the world, not to mention that I enjoy the drive, we generally do just that - drive down.


Mark

[Rudeney]

And when you drive, you don't have to worry about finding your bag on the
carousel either! :-)

[Rudeney]

The funny thing is, that is a true story! We really were walking along with
some DIS suits at the GF and I really did make a comment to Jan about getting
up early for EE. I thought the suits were just hotel management, but later I
heard that there was a large group of corporate officers in town that week.
Now, my comment was not exactly what I said. What really happened was we had
stayed out late the night before for E-ride, then we had woken up early that
morning for EE, and my comment was something like, "I can't believe we woke up
so early for EE - I feel like I've been run over by a bus." I can only assume
that those "suits" heard that and translated it into "guests don't like
getting up early, and they see buses as a bad things, so let's can EE and make
the buses more friendly by filling them full of characters." :-)

[Rudeney]

On 9/9/2014 9:07 AM, Mark L Fendrick wrote:
> On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 9:39:10 AM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:
>>
>> Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..
>>
>
>
> As much as I love flying and getting there in a little over 2 hours actual
> travel time, all of the preboarding routines have put me off flying when I
> can help it.

I fly enough that it really doesn't bother me. I am really good at
"cleansing" my carry-on and pockets and making it through with minimal
hassles. I thought about signing-up for TSA-Pre, but I've been randomly
selected for it a few times, and found it only saved me 5-10 minutes of
waiting and the minor hassle of removing my shoes. Plus, I usually travel
with a one or more employees, so I'd just end up waiting on them if they
didn't join, too.

My bigger complaint about flying is the continual money-grubbing by the
airline industry. I generally fly SWA as they have the lowest fares and best
schedules out of BHM, but they still find ways like Early Bird check-in to
tack on an extra $20 per flight. It's still better than paying to check a bag
and paying hundreds more to get a non-center seat, but it's really getting
tiring to play all these games.

In my case, if I can drive in 8 hours or less, I do that instead of flying.
Pretty much any flight I take is a minimum 5-hour investment of my time: I
budget two hours before flight time to drive to the airport, park, and get
through security. Even the shortest trips worth flying will take at least 2
hours gate to gate, and then I'll likely have another hour to get off the
plane, claim bags, and get transportation to my destination. By driving, I
can carry what I want, leave on my own schedule, and even enjoy having my own
car instead of dealing with cabs, buses or rentals. And often times, I can
get there faster that way.

> Since both my wife and I are retired and have all the time in the world,
> not to mention that I enjoy the drive, we generally do just that - drive
> down.

I enjoy driving, too, but as long as it's not in rush hour traffic. There are
certain routes I absolutely hate. For example, I-65 south of BHM on a summer
weekend is a nightmare. The first 50 miles out is literally stop-and-go
traffic heading to and from the beach. Consequently, we never go to the condo
on the weekends or we choose a few back roads to avoid the snarls. And BHM to
ATL is a nightmare, too. It's 150 miles of hills, trucks, cops and
construction. And then you get there and have to deal with ATL traffic! But
give me a nice boring drive where I can set the cruise control and relax and
I'll do that all day long!

[Steve Russo]

True. We'll be flying later this month and driving in January. I'm like
Rodney in that I tend to overpack. I can't imagine how much we'll bring
when the only limiter is the size of the car ;-)


--
Steve

[Steve Russo]

We're retired also but haven't quite reached that "All the time in the
world" mode yet. A lot has to do with how long we'll spend there to make
driving worthwhile.

--
Steve

[Rudeney]

So you must not have a tow hitch...

[Steve Russo]

I remember you relating that story a few years ago (somewhere between 3
and 15 years - my memory's shot).

--
Steve

[Rudeney]

It was in August 2001, so you are correct - between 3 and 15 years!

[Steve Russo]

On 9/9/2014 11:59 AM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/9/2014 9:07 AM, Mark L Fendrick wrote:
>> On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 9:39:10 AM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:
>>>
>>> Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..
>>>
>>
>>
>> As much as I love flying and getting there in a little over 2 hours actual
>> travel time, all of the preboarding routines have put me off flying when I
>> can help it.
>
>
> I fly enough that it really doesn't bother me. I am really good at
> "cleansing" my carry-on and pockets and making it through with minimal
> hassles. I thought about signing-up for TSA-Pre, but I've been randomly
> selected for it a few times, and found it only saved me 5-10 minutes of
> waiting and the minor hassle of removing my shoes. Plus, I usually travel
> with a one or more employees, so I'd just end up waiting on them if they
> didn't join, too.
>
> My bigger complaint about flying is the continual money-grubbing by the
> airline industry. I generally fly SWA as they have the lowest fares and best
> schedules out of BHM, but they still find ways like Early Bird check-in to
> tack on an extra $20 per flight. It's still better than paying to check a bag
> and paying hundreds more to get a non-center seat, but it's really getting
> tiring to play all these games.

Agreed. SWA is *only* $12.50 per flight for EBCI but still...

>
> In my case, if I can drive in 8 hours or less, I do that instead of flying.
> Pretty much any flight I take is a minimum 5-hour investment of my time: I
> budget two hours before flight time to drive to the airport, park, and get
> through security. Even the shortest trips worth flying will take at least 2
> hours gate to gate, and then I'll likely have another hour to get off the
> plane, claim bags, and get transportation to my destination. By driving, I
> can carry what I want, leave on my own schedule, and even enjoy having my own
> car instead of dealing with cabs, buses or rentals. And often times, I can
> get there faster that way.

In the days I was traveling a lot for business, that was exactly my mode
of operation. I would fly often to Boston which meant driving West to
the airport, flying East to Boston, then driving West to our office. It
was much easier, and about the same elapsed time to just drive.



--
Steve

[Steve Russo]

On 9/9/2014 12:02 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/9/2014 11:01 AM, Steve Russo wrote:
>> On 9/9/2014 9:39 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>> On 9/9/14, 9:23 AM, Steve Russo wrote:
>>>> On 9/9/2014 9:14 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>>>> On 9/8/14, 12:50 PM, Mark L Fendrick wrote:
>>>>>> I have two large plastic tags that I bought at Brookstones years ago
>>>>>> ... one says, ARE WE THERE YET? and the other says, STOP THIS THING, I
>>>>>> WANT TO GET OFF!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have yet to see another piece of luggage with these tags and they
>>>>>> make it easy to spot ours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>> Those would be great to have.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lisa
>>>>
>>>> I guess I've been spoiled by Magical Express. I check my bags at the
>>>> Albany airport and they appear in my hotel rooma couple of hours after
>>>> landing. I've not had an issue... so far.
>>>>
>>> Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..
>>>
>>>
>>
>> True. We'll be flying later this month and driving in January. I'm like
>> Rodney in that I tend to overpack. I can't imagine how much we'll bring
>> when the only limiter is the size of the car ;-)
>
>
> So you must not have a tow hitch...
>

Oooooohhhhhhhh!


--
Steve

[Sandi Femino]

In article <luigbc$45p$1...@dont-email.me>, "John Mc." <jo...@tdcogre.com>
wrote:

> I've no problem with a luggage cart if they're available. But it seems
> as though everyone has bags just like ours. Same color, same size, same
> dings. We've even tried tying scarves and such to the handles. So does
> everyone else. I WANT to paint some sort of design on the sides but Judy
> thinks that's tacky. Anyway, so the scenario usually goes like this:

find a WIDE ribbon in an unusual print and tie it on more than one place
n the bag..works well and doesn't deface the bag.

--


Sandi
http://capecodcards.blogspot.com/

[Lisa Cubbon]

Trust me, you put EVERYTHING you can in the car. We even had a
"Disney" bag with things we always take.

Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

Andy's been retired for years and me for 1.5years and we don't seem to
have much free time. We wonder how we found time to WORK.


Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

On 9/9/14, 12:02 PM, Rudeney wrote:
> On 9/9/2014 11:01 AM, Steve Russo wrote:
>> On 9/9/2014 9:39 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>> On 9/9/14, 9:23 AM, Steve Russo wrote:
>>>> On 9/9/2014 9:14 AM, Lisa Cubbon wrote:
>>>>> On 9/8/14, 12:50 PM, Mark L Fendrick wrote:
>>>>>> I have two large plastic tags that I bought at Brookstones years ago
>>>>>> ... one says, ARE WE THERE YET? and the other says, STOP THIS THING, I
>>>>>> WANT TO GET OFF!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have yet to see another piece of luggage with these tags and they
>>>>>> make it easy to spot ours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>> Those would be great to have.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lisa
>>>>
>>>> I guess I've been spoiled by Magical Express. I check my bags at the
>>>> Albany airport and they appear in my hotel rooma couple of hours after
>>>> landing. I've not had an issue... so far.
>>>>
>>> Steve, they don't do that when you drive. Just so you know.. LOL..
>>>
>>>
>>
>> True. We'll be flying later this month and driving in January. I'm like
>> Rodney in that I tend to overpack. I can't imagine how much we'll bring
>> when the only limiter is the size of the car ;-)
>
>
> So you must not have a tow hitch...
>
>
>

LOL!!! Hahaha....

Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

I thought about painting a charming WDW scene (like I could do that!)
but then when the bag is toast, I lose my decorations. Nuts to that idea.


Lisa

[Lisa Cubbon]

And you just got a BRAND NEW CAR! And a home in Clearwater too...

Lisa

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 11:59:47 AM UTC-4, Rudeney wrote:

>
> I enjoy driving, too, but as long as it's not in rush hour traffic. There are
>
> certain routes I absolutely hate. For example, I-65 south of BHM on a summer
>
> weekend is a nightmare. The first 50 miles out is literally stop-and-go
>
> traffic heading to and from the beach. Consequently, we never go to the condo
>
> on the weekends or we choose a few back roads to avoid the snarls. And BHM to
>
> ATL is a nightmare, too. It's 150 miles of hills, trucks, cops and
>
> construction. And then you get there and have to deal with ATL traffic! But
>
> give me a nice boring drive where I can set the cruise control and relax and
>
> I'll do that all day long!

Again, being retired allows us to leave at a time where we usually can avoid most - if not all - of the traffic on the way down. I also actually give us one extra day when we drive down. It used to be if we got there a day early we would spend the night with our daughter ... now when we drive down for a week at the park - and we arrive early - we can just spend the extra night at our own house. :-)


Mark

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 12:02:23 PM UTC-4, Steve Russo wrote:


> We're retired also but haven't quite reached that "All the time in the
>
> world" mode yet. A lot has to do with how long we'll spend there to make
>
> driving worthwhile.

Well, starting with this trip things are a bit different. We are staying a week this week at Pop Century, but most of our visits will be during the half of the year when we will be living in Florida - and it will be about an hour drive.

I've scheduled 2 nights out in either direction which gives us the option of stopping early or arriving early.


Mark

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Tuesday, September 9, 2014 1:10:25 PM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:

> And you just got a BRAND NEW CAR! And a home in Clearwater too...

Well, yes to the brand new car, but it's Iris's mother-in-law who lives in Clearwater ... we live in Sun City Center ... about a half hour south of Tampa.



Mark

[Lisa Cubbon]

AH! So your winter home is 1.5hrs away from Mecca... Still gonna
stay at Iris' and Jason's or will you stay on property or it depends?

Lisa

[Mark L Fendrick]

On Wednesday, September 10, 2014 10:16:30 AM UTC-4, Lisa wrote:

>
> AH! So your winter home is 1.5hrs away from Mecca... Still gonna
>
> stay at Iris' and Jason's or will you stay on property or it depends?

It's generally about an hour from WDW - if I-4 is generally clear. We time it so as not to deal with rush hours.

Even when we are down there we have spend a few nights at WDW ... and this trip for Food and WIne will be on property.

It probably will preclude most stays with Iris, but you never know. Maybe we will still stay there if we are all heading to Port Canaveral in the morning. ;-)



Mark

[Rudeney]

Enjoy the new car on the trip down!