About CLAMP Studios (for Rich)
OhSojourner
are huge corporations like Disney (in fact, most of them aren't).
http://www.manga.com/x_x/x_production.html
Clamp Studios
The artists behind X and the manga book of the same title, Clamp
Studios is famous for its work and unusual staff configuration. Clamp
is made up of four talented women: Nanase Ohkawa, Mokona Apapa, Mikku
"Mick" Nekoi and Satsuki Igarashi. These four women, three of whom
went to high school together, have distinguished themselves as one the
most consistent top-selling manga artists.
Nanase Ohkawa, who is primarily responsible for Clamp's writing,
credits Japanese animation masters Go Nagai and Osamu Tezuka and
Hitchcock as well as Twelve Monkeys, Jacob's Ladder, Silence of the
Lambs, and The Dead Zone as her major influences. Remarkably, she
conceived of the basic story of X in elementary school when "the
'Gaia' theory was starting to circulate-- The idea that the Earth
itself was one living organism." Once they had formed Clamp, the team
brought the story of X directly to a publisher because it was a story
that felt compelled to create.
After seven years of working together as a team, Clamp's manga books,
Tokyo Babylon, Magic Knight, Rayearth, X/1999 and RG Vega, and their
animated television show, "Primera's Magic Knight Rayearth," have
propelled them to national and international stardom.
Lan
> http://www.manga.com/x_x/x_production.html
> Clamp Studios
Good for them. I like women actually doing something I CAN approve of.
Why are you crossposting to libertarian?
--
Kill all feminists, make them feel the pain they are responsible for creating
so that it destroys them. Stop at nothing to make every single fucking evil
sexist female feel every thing they did do, plus everything they could have
done, and added to that everything they even ever wanted to do. DESTROY THEM
ICQ: 26027485
Rich
I have the movie "X" somewhere, but I've not seen it.
But I have seen (some) Magic Knights Rayearth.
Funny thing about Anime, most of it at any rate, it has
female heroes and most characters with special powers are
female (there are exceptions, but this seems to be the
rule). They also have something almost unknown here,
female villains, and this pisses off some feminists to
no end.
But while women tend to do only women's stuff, men do
both men and women's stuff. I just started watching Noir.
It's very well done, and of course, all the main characters
are female. Men drop like flies (dead flies) by the drove
every episode. I also have a Noir special, where it's
creators talk about what they intend and why. Funny thing,
it ain't a female production (except for the voice
actresses). Seems the women in Japan only interested in
women same as the ones over here.
As for male only or female only companies, I don't expect
you to admit you are wrong, but you are. By this of course
I mean companies where men or women are excluded, not small
companies or circles (not unless they exclude by sex anyway).
As for the Affirmative Racism, I oppose this abomination in
the strongest terms, as well as those who support it.
But as long as we have it I think we also need to consider
things in terms of what is (presumably) acceptable. And I
note that you seem to have issues with employment in Japan,
with a decidedly unlibertarian advocacy if I read you right.
You also use nonsense words like "underrepresented," which
don't help things from where I stand. How can you both oppose
AA and use the basic ideas of it is beyond me, but I read
this as fundamental support for AA or tenants of AA. And you
know where I stand on those who support it.
Rich
Max Burke
>It's comprised of all of FOUR women, Rich. Not all animation studios
>are huge corporations like Disney (in fact, most of them aren't).
>http://www.manga.com/x_x/x_production.html
>Clamp Studios
>The artists behind X and the manga book of the same title, Clamp
>Studios is famous for its work and unusual staff configuration.
So this animation studio is famous for:
a. The creative work of the artists that create the work...
Nothing wrong with that is there....
b. That the studio staff are all women.....
Why??????
Studio's staffed by men aren't famous for that fact, so why do women need to
be 'famous' for being women doing something that men do?????
Men achieve fame because of what they do; Women just get to be famous because
they're females doing something that men do..... ROTFLOL
BTW New Zealand teams First and forth in the Trans Atlantic rowing race.....
The forth placed team were two kiwi women (the only women in the race).....
Should they be famous for being women or for being forth out of a feild of 35?
----------
# Feminism is, above all, a crutch to lean on for those that believe in it;
Only by their professed belief in feminism can they believe in themselves.
--
mlvburke@#%&*.net.nz
Replace the obvious with paradise to email me.
See Found Images at :
http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/~mlvburke
Marie Kelly
"Max Burke" <mlvburke@$&^5.co.nz> wrote in message
news:RFFM7.1920$kM3.2...@news02.tsnz.net...
> So this animation studio is famous for:
Actually, animation studio does seem to be a misnomer. CLAMP is a group of
female manga artists. They're solely responsible for manga, or comic books.
If one of their works is turned into an animation, then they'd go to an
actual animation studio, with both men and women.
> b. That the studio staff are all women.....
>
> Why??????
Because it's the group that they are. After all, nobody complained that
Charles Schultz was the only one to draw Peanuts. It's the same thing. CLAMP
is a group of artists. *Not* an animation studio.
Marie
Arbane the Terrible
> Why are you crossposting to libertarian?
>
> --
> Kill all feminists, make them feel the pain they are responsible for
> creating so that it destroys them. Stop at nothing to make every single
> fucking evil sexist female feel every thing they did do, plus everything
> they could have done, and added to that everything they even ever wanted
> to do. DESTROY THEM
Nice sig. Why are you NOT cross-posting to 'alt.he-mens.womena-hater.club'?
I just got finished explaining to one dingbat on rec.arts.anime that
'Feminism is the radical notion that women are human', and now here's
another...you go away for five minutes around here...
--
"Remember,the plural of 'moron' is 'focus group'."
-- James A. Wolf
Max Burke
>>"Max Burke" <mlvburke@$&^5.co.nz> wrote in message
>>news:RFFM7.1920$kM3.2...@news02.tsnz.net...
First thing.....
My apologies to the participants of the following newsgroups, I failed to
check that my response wasn't being croosposted (like I usually do...)
rec.arts.animation,rec.arts.disney.animation,rec.arts.anime.misc
Followup set to these groups.
Second thing......
My response is to an on going debate in alt.feminism that is discussng
affirmative action and how women benefit from these laws, while men get
discriminated against by these laws; Laws that are based on the sex of the one
who benefits or gets discriminated against.....
>> So this animation studio is famous for:
>Actually, animation studio does seem to be a misnomer. CLAMP is a group of
>female manga artists.
But they have a studio right? As in a physical location and/or company?
>They're solely responsible for manga, or comic books.
OK..... (note to myself: check them out.....)
>If one of their works is turned into an animation, then they'd go to an
>actual animation studio, with both men and women.
>> b. That the studio staff are all women.....
>> Why??????
>Because it's the group that they are. After all, nobody complained that
>Charles Schultz was the only one to draw Peanuts. It's the same thing. CLAMP
>is a group of artists. *Not* an animation studio.
Here in alt.feminism the debate is about the fact that a. they're famous for
the work they produce in their owner/operator studio; and b. they're famous
because they're *women* doing what men do......
The first is because of their talent and abilities which is as it should
be.... The second is purely because they're *female* (as opposed to being
male....)
I wouldn't mind being famous just because I'm a man, but I'd much prefer to be
famous for something I do or achieve....
It's as I said, men gain fame for what they do; women gain fame for being
women. (sometimes doing what men do).......
Skeleton Man
>
> Why??????
>
Because they're a bunch of friends who decided to start a studio together.
> Studio's staffed by men aren't famous for that fact, so why do women need
to
> be 'famous' for being women doing something that men do?????
I always thought they were famous because they were responsible for four of
the top selling manga/anime in all of Japan. Not many studios have such a
track record.
--
Skeleton Man
http://users.lvcm.com/artfx
ORIGINAL ANIMATION ON DVD!!!
Arbane the Terrible
> I wouldn't mind being famous just because I'm a man, but I'd much prefer
> to be famous for something I do or achieve....
So give birth.
Nargun
Fails reality check; lots of women draw and write comics in japan; it's
nothing special. CLAMP's structure *is* unusual, considered independantly
of the member's genders.
Louis
--
Louis Patterson l.patt...@ugrad.unimelb.edu.au
"A kind of ghostly never-never land where the might-have-beens
play with the ifs" - Isaac Asimov, _The End of Eternity_
Matthew Cline
unto us these blasphemous ravings:
> So this animation studio is famous for:
>
> a. The creative work of the artists that create the work...
>
> Nothing wrong with that is there....
>
> b. That the studio staff are all women.....
>
> Why??????
Well, in Japan, very little, if any, of the fame is for being women; it's
just for the quality of their work. It's just in the Western world, where
any woman who's the first to do XYZ is famous for it.
Matthew Cline
us these blasphemous ravings:
> I have the movie "X" somewhere, but I've not seen it.
> But I have seen (some) Magic Knights Rayearth.
> Funny thing about Anime, most of it at any rate, it has female
> heroes...
There are many shoujo (girl's) series where most of the heros are
girls: Sailor Moon, Magic Knight Rayearth, Revolutionary Girl Utena.
There are also many shonen (boy's) series where there's one guy
surrounded by lots of girls (who often have extraordinary powers): Tenchi
Muyo, Saber Marionette J, El Hazard, Gate Keepers, Geobreeders, and
so on. In these series the women are there to attract a male
viewer ship. Then there's a few series made by men that consist
entirely of women: Gunsmith Cats, Silent Moebius, and Noir. However,
this last type is rather rare compared to the first two types.
> and most characters with special powers are female
Instead of having special powers, male characters have
near-supernatural fighting skills or they pilot mecha (giant robots).
See Dragonball Z and Gundam Wing for examples.
> They also have something almost unknown here, female villains, and
> this pisses off some feminists to no end.
While I don't doubt this, I'd appreciate it if you could provide some
links on this.
> But while women tend to do only women's stuff, men do both men and
> women's stuff.
As for "men's/women's stuff" in the context of anime and manga... You
seem to be basing this on the gender of the characters. However, from
the point of view of the Japanese, it's based on who the target
audience is. For instance, in the series "Silent Moebius", all of the
main characters are women, but it's targeted at men/boys (it was
originally published as boys (shonen) manga); no one would consider it
to be "women's stuff" just because it stars women.
As for "while women tend to do only women's stuff", I haven't seen any
evidence for this among current manga/anime artists. Rumiko Takahashi
(creator of "Ranma 1/2" and "Urusei Yatsura") only does boys/men
series (with the exception of a few short stories). Kei Kusunoki
writes boys manga, including "Ogre Slayer". And CLAMP did
"Miyuki-chan in Wonderland", and is currently doing "Angelic Layer",
both of which are boys/men series. Since we in the West only see a
fraction of the all the stuff made in Japan, I can't give any absolute
numbers on men doing girls series versus women doing boys series, but
I don't think it's at the level you suggest.
However, back in the 50s and 60s, almost all the manga artists were
men, so the great majority of girls comics were created by men in
those days.
> I just started watching Noir. It's very well done, and of course,
> all the main characters are female.
Noir, being about assassins, was probably targeted at men (though it's
impossible to tell for sure, since it didn't start out as a manga).
They probably made the main characters women because a pair of female
assassins would be more appealing to the male audience than a pair of
male assassins; it also allows for lesbian subtext.
> Men drop like flies (dead flies) by the drove every episode.
Of course; how else are they supposed to show what bad-ass assassins
Mireille and Kirika are? The men who drop like flies are
assassins/soldiers who were sent to kill the main characters, and
female assassins are rather rare.
Nojo Jojo
> >Marie Kelly wrote in message ...
of
> >female manga artists.
> But they have a studio right? As in a physical location and/or company?
Yes, they have a working studio---probably several. But "studio," when
referring to art and animation, has multiple meanings in Japan (same as
here, frankly; c.f. the difference between an artist's studio and a movie
studio). CLAMP are comic book artists. They work in a drawing studio.
When the time came for their work to be animated, however, an animation
company purchased the rights to their character designs, plot, etc., and
produced it in animated form. In Japan, that animation company is called a
"studio". So while the animation studio can take credit for producing the
animated form of the series---backgrounds, frames, direction, etc.---the
original idea, story, and "look" came from CLAMP.
> >They're solely responsible for manga, or comic books.
> OK..... (note to myself: check them out.....)
Just an FYI, since this post isn't primarily aimed at anime newsgroups (who
already know this). In Japan, primarily because there was no Comics Code
Authority to curtail their popularity back in the "golden age" of comics
there, comic books aren't limited to the young or young adult male audience.
Fully half are produced by, and aimed at, girls and women. For that matter,
there are subcategories aimed at practically every walk of life---comic
books for businessmen, comic books for pinball fans, comic books for
housewives, comic books for young women who've just had their first baby,
you name it. Very few of these become popular beyond their target
demographic, however, which is why it's so remarkable when a comic book gets
picked up for animation---that means it's perceived to have enough potential
"crossover" appeal that an animation studio is willing to take a chance on
it. Despite the popularity of girls' stuff, the vast majority of comics
picked up for animation are those aimed at boys and men. *That's* why CLAMP
is considered to be so amazing---not because the *artists* are female, but
because their work is aimed at girls and women and is so unbelievably
popular that practically *all* of it has been animated. Some of CLAMP's
works have been animated twice over---as TV shows and as feature-length
films.
Female comic artists in Japan are a dime a dozen; CLAMP's gender has nothing
to do with it. It's the fact that they've been forerunners in popularizing
comics/animation aimed at girls and women, on an international level.
Nora
---
Shoujocon: A Different Kind of Con.
http://www.shoujocon.com
Mirai's World: DB & BH Fanfic, and Yaoi Reviews
http://home.earthlink.net/~njem
Slayer Moon
> So this animation studio is famous for:
>
> a. The creative work of the artists that create the work...
>
> Nothing wrong with that is there....
>
> b. That the studio staff are all women.....
>
> Why??????
Because of our obsession with the reproductive traits and the attachment of absurd
social significations based on them.
By the way, did you know that Judas Priest is an all-male band? Amazing! ;-)
Max Burke
>>Max Burke wrote:
>> So this animation studio is famous for:
>> a. The creative work of the artists that create the work...
>> Nothing wrong with that is there....
>> b. That the studio staff are all women.....
>> Why??????
>Because of our obsession with the reproductive traits and the attachment of
absurd social significations based on them.
If you're a woman......
>By the way, did you know that Judas Priest is an all-male band? Amazing! ;-)
And they're famous for?
Their music........
Michael Lo
cluttered here.
First off, who's CLAMP? Well according Fred Schodt's Dreamland
Japan-CLAMP were 4 friends who started off working the home-made comic
book conventions. They started off as a bunch of amateurs who found
that hey they were able to sell as trade their home-made comics and
other trinkets during these conventions (the home-made shows were
usually based on trade). They thought to themselves, hey maybe we can
make a living doing this.
Basically CLAMP is the comic industry equivalent of a garage band
made good.
As for why they're famous in Japan, it's the following. They already
cut their teeth on amateur market and they made a name for themselves
there by quashing most of the competition in quality in that
particular market (remember there's over 100 000 amateur producers
there, many of whom are not talented artists-if you got the quality
you can readily outshine your peers). The other thing is that they
have consistently put out high-end merchandise, you see the comic book
industry is extremely high pressure and unlike the NA industry the
story and artwork is done by the author and he/she must be able to
provide comics on a weekly basis rather than per month. CLAMP's 4
person arrangement helps to prevent burnout and so they've been
consistent in their quality which payed off on their reputation.
They're happy with the arrangement and won't work with anybody
else-female or male.
CLAMP is NOT UNIQUE for being women comic book authors, there's
hundreds of established and promising women authors out there plus the
thousands who want a
crack at the business. Fame and fortune in that business comes purely
from the merchandise you put out and establishing yourself through
that. Also if you
are not consistent or you're burnt out-you're in danger of being
labelled a has-been and there'll be lots of people gunning for your
place
"Max Burke" <mlvburke@$&^5.co.nz> wrote in message news:<JtnO7.2982$kM3.3...@news02.tsnz.net>...