Mavel's increasing quality (NOT)
Jason Graff
So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
Mitri Van
>So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
>Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
I'd haveta say the Punisher War Journals...
They were slightly lame when Jim Lee left....
and they were incredibly lame when Carl Potts left.
Potts had several interesting dangling plot lines, and when he left,
I'd hoped that the suceeding writers would follow up on at least one or
two... but alas, I've been proven wrong. I would say the most interesting
characters/plots that they had going on would have to be the stories with
Sniper or that Japanese Assassins guild...
Mitri Van
mv4...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Jim Jagielski
>ha...@buhub.bradley.edu (Jason Graff) writes:
>>So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
>>Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
>I'd haveta say the Punisher War Journals...
Thor... without a doubt.
--
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#include <std/disclaimer.h>
Jim Jagielski NASA/GSFC, Code 711.4
j...@jagubox.gsfc.nasa.gov Greenbelt, MD 20771
"If we took the bones out, it wouldn't be crunchy now would it?"
Charles Anthony Leone
********************
So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
********************
Not a chance. Tom DeFalco has destroyed the Fantastic Four beyond hope
of repair UNLESS someone kills DeFalco and then writes a retcon using
Walter Simonson's bureaucracy that handled alternate timelines (or maybe
the Gem of Infinite Realities). Of course DeFalco has not listened to
all the gripe mail I collected from CMU and all those net people I thank
for writing to me with gripes.
The ever-reliable Ron Frenz has informed me that now that he's got it
DeFalco plans to write FF for the rest of his career. I hope he dies a
horrible, violent death in a drug shootout or something. Or maybe
someone could ram a napalm truck into him. The stupid fucker KNOWS that
he's the cause of a lot of Marvel problems, and he wants 200 titles a
month starting this summer? Fuck him, I hope he gets found in an adult
movie house watching the trashiest stuff around because teenagers won't
bail him out like they did Pee Wee.
Amazing Spidey died the day that DeFalco promoted Jim Salicrup,
ex-arachnerd, to Executive Editor. This led to Danny Fingeroth (what the
hell David and Erik, there aren't enough guest stars!!!!!) taking over
and driving Erik Larsen (whose art I LIKE, dammit) off the book. The
first thing he did was grab Mark Bagley, whose work has suffered because
of his 2-issues-a month-minimum, and buy that ***IDIOT FUCK**** Secret
Empire story from Allen ("I write just a little better than my buddy Tom
DeFalco") Milgrom because he felt that Amazing Spidey had just too much
Spider-Man in it.
So naturally, when McFarlane bowed out of Spiderman Fingeroth had to beg
Larsen to follow Todd again. I've been told that he gort a lot of money
to do it- but naturally Fingeroth stepped in and made him insert Hulk,
Sleepwalker, and all the others that plagued Amazing for the last 3
months. So Larsen is pissed AGAIN and on top of that, his house burned
down.
I agree that Amazing has suffered, but the FF ( a team I loved until
issue 355) is the most harmed book. Thor has been dead since walt left
that, too.
Tony
8^\)
Mitri Van
>vani...@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Mitri Van) writes:
>>ha...@buhub.bradley.edu (Jason Graff) writes:
>>>So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
>>>Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
>>I'd haveta say the Punisher War Journals...
>Thor... without a doubt.
Ooh, I furgot about that one... yeah, I'd haveta say Thor's the one mag that's
declined in quality the _MOST_
Mitri Van
mv4...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Tom Galloway
>...UNLESS someone kills DeFalco...I hope he dies a horrible, violent death
>in a drug shootout or something. Or maybe someone could ram a napalm truck
>the trashiest stuff around because teenagers won't bail him out like they
>did Pee Wee.
Um, Tony, I think you're going a bit overboard here. Perhaps this was meant
to be satire, but as someone who's not particularly humor impaired it sure
didn't come off much like it. I mean, I'm not a fan of DeFalco's FF or
Thor either, but the man's not done anything warrenting hoping he suffers
a violent painful death. Save that for the real monsters out there at least.
After all, if there was a death penalty for bad writing, Usenet would be
*much* *much* smaller...:-) (seriously, you might try to find a copy of
Harlan Ellison's essay Xenogenesis, published a while back in Isaac Asimov's
SF Magazine and more recently in CBG which addresses the extreme treatment
some people do to creators or prominent people. It's helpful in getting
a sense of perspective in this sort of thing I think, unless you're so
around the bend that you think tossing a cup of warm vomit on Alan Dean
Foster is somehow justified by what you think of his writing abilities
to use one example from the essay).
"Mind you, if I were the fellow she made fun of, I'd be thinking thoughts of
stretch-wrap, and butane torches, or perhaps cheese graters. Not, of course,
that one should *act* on such impulses, but the desire to see a taunter
socially humilated, their friendships destroyed, their families impoverished,
their cultures undermined, their continent dispoiled and their homeworld baked
clean of all life, is only natural." ----James Nicoll
UD13...@ndsuvm1.bitnet
Ditto on the "Xenogenesis" commentary, folks. Ellison pulled fewer punches
than usual in his indictment of the rabid fans of the "industry." Should be
required reading for cons, IMO.
BTW, while CBG recently reprinted it, it was sanitized just a tad for a
general media audience. The full transcript of the speech (with addendum)
appeared in two issues (?) of Isaac Asimov's Magazine. Interested parties who
really HAVE to know can email me for the issues (you'll HAVE to know because
I'm gonna HAVE to go digging to find them).
DRH/Orb
JM2N...@miamiu.bitnet
In article <1992Jan28....@zip.eecs.umich.edu>,t...@z.eecs.umich.edu (To m
Galloway) says:
>
>In article <kdVCXgK00...@andrew.cmu.edu> cl...@andrew.cmu.edu (Charles
>Anthony Leone) writes:
>>...UNLESS someone kills DeFalco...I hope he dies a horrible, violent death
>>in a drug shootout or something. Or maybe someone could ram a napalm truck
>>into him...Fuck him, I hope he gets found in an adult movie house watching
>>the trashiest stuff around because teenagers won't bail him out like they
>>did Pee Wee.
>
>Um, Tony, I think you're going a bit overboard here. Perhaps this was meant
>to be satire, but as someone who's not particularly humor impaired it sure
>didn't come off much like it. I mean, I'm not a fan of DeFalco's FF or
>Thor either, but the man's not done anything warrenting hoping he suffers
>a violent painful death. Save that for the real monsters out there at least.
>After all, if there was a death penalty for bad writing, Usenet would be
>*much* *much* smaller...:-)
To Hell with restraint, it takes all the fun out of voicing our little,
meaningless opinions here on Usenet. If everyone acted this way, the
Net would become a "mutual admiration society" in no time. I think
DeFalco, Frenz, Milgrom, and the rest of their cronies produce Shit:
Shit artwork, Shit writing! There, I've gotten that off my chest.
Death (or retirement) to Defalco!
Be Seeing You,
John McMillan
**********************************************************************
* "...It's fun to take a trip, * JOHN McMILLAN *
* to put acid in your veins." * jm2n...@miamiu.bitnet * jm
* - 1000 Homo DJs "Supernaut" * jm2n...@miamiu.acs.muohio.edu *
**********************************************************************
Thomas P. Johnston
>To Hell with restraint, it takes all the fun out of voicing our little,
>meaningless opinions here on Usenet. If everyone acted this way, the
>Net would become a "mutual admiration society" in no time. I think
>DeFalco, Frenz, Milgrom, and the rest of their cronies produce Shit:
>Shit artwork, Shit writing! There, I've gotten that off my chest.
>Death (or retirement) to Defalco!
>
You know what really pisses me off? There are three dealers in town, and
the one with the best back issue selection insists on charging OverPriced
Street Guide prices for everything. I tried to pick up a copy of Flash
#53 there one month after it came out, and the guy wanted $4 for it. $4?!!
For a one-month old main-stream DC (read: high-print run) comic which
cost $1 when it came out? Unbelievable. Of course, I didn't buy the
thing, nor have I bought anything else from him. Still, the fact that
many comic book dealers routinely overcharge collectors (mostly naive
children who think they're going to make money by INVESTING in comic books)
really irritates me. More than a lack of quality, it is this highway
robbery (which I associate with comic books, although I'm sure it exists
in many hobbies) which makes me wonder occasionally whether I should just
quit buying the damned things.
Hmm, I've shown too much restraint, I think. Well, thems the breaks.
Tom
Aaron Leitch
making a fool of myself, but I think the subject title means enough to me
for me to make an inteligent comment here. Everyone seems to be worried
about a decline in comic book's quaility. Now, I have to ask a question.
Is this refering to a book by book basis? In that case, then the
discusion being held here is entirely too vague. For instance, the team
at Ghost Rider are producing some of the best quality I've ever seen (and
no decline on sight). DarkHawk started off really sloppy, but is slowly
gaining ground. And a book such as Sleepwalker is having real trouble.
Now, on the other hand, you could be talking about the COMIC BOOK
INDUSTRY. In other words saying that the books from the (lets say) 70's
were generaly better than the 80's-90's.
So, are we going to keep droning on about the quality of (here's the
vague statement:) COMICS, or are we going to get down and start reviwing
some specific titles? We could start with the 3 afore mentioned, which
happen to be three of my favorites to date (the other is Punisher, we can
even disuss him in all of this...
\ /
/\/\ /\/\
\/ ampire
Andy Young
>So which book in your opinion has gone down the tube the most?
>Amazing Spider-Man gets my vote...
Geez, _SO_ many to choose from. Hmmmmmm, I'll just pick 'em all...
.Andy.
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Andy Young Hewlett-Packard "Gee, Rocky, maybe you can't
an...@hpsmo100.rose.hp.com 8050 Foothills Blvd get there from here..."
(916)785-7173 Roseville, CA 95677 -Bullwinkle J. Moose
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