Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?

[Lynn McGuire]

Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29

No.

Lynn

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <sqiamj$qfs$1...@dont-email.me>,

Well, diabetes....

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/

[Joy Beeson]

On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 02:59:14 GMT, djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J
Heydt) wrote:

> In article <sqiamj$qfs$1...@dont-email.me>,
> Lynn McGuire <lynnmc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
> > https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
> >
> >No.
> >
> Well, diabetes....

And there's fitting through doorways.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at centurylink dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

[Your Name]

Greatly depends on what's in the pie.

For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
the end of a toothpick is far too much.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <t8kqsgd8ktuuusif8...@4ax.com>,

Joy Beeson <jbe...@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:
>On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 02:59:14 GMT, djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J
>Heydt) wrote:
>
>> In article <sqiamj$qfs$1...@dont-email.me>,
>> Lynn McGuire <lynnmc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>> > https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>> >
>> >No.
>> >
>> Well, diabetes....
>
>And there's fitting through doorways.
>

Ernestine Schuman-Heink (1861-1936) was an operatic contralto of
not inconsiderable mass (although judging by many photographs on
Wikipedia, she wasn't all *that* huge. One of her common roles
was the Witch in _Haensel und Gretel_. The tale is told that she
was scheduled to perform with a large symphony orchestra; the
size of the orchestra is relevant, because the many players and
their music stands packed the available space.

So she was trying to get from the wings to the front of the
stage, and there just wasn't room. The conductor whispered to
her, "Go sideways, Madame!"

She answered, in her magnificent contralto that filled the entire
hall, "Mein Gott, es gibt kein Sideways!"

[Paul S Person]

On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
wrote:

De gustibus non est disputandum.

Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
gooseberries and rhubarb.

I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.

But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
taste a whole lot better to me.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hodg5It3usE
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable. I have
never encountered gooseberries.

[Robert Woodward]

In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
> wrote:
>
> >On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
> >>
> >> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
> >> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
> >>
> >> No.
> >>
> >> Lynn
> >
> >Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
> >
> >For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
> >the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>
> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>
> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>

Rhubarb is not a fruit.

> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>
> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
> taste a whole lot better to me.

The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
pies each summer.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
-------------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

[Lynn McGuire]

I love the pumpkin pie that my wife makes with her own custom spice mix.
She made three for Christmas and I bought a pecan pie at HEB.

Lynn

[Your Name]

Technically "pumpkin pie" isn't even a pie at all. The version you
mostly see which has a pastry case filled with organge goo is really a
"tart". Similarly with "lemon meriingue pie", "key lime pie", etc. also
being tarts

A tart is *usually* open-topped, while a real "pie" has a lid,
*usually* pastry, on the top (can be with or without the lower case).

[Your Name]

Usually a rhubarb pie or crumble has some other fruit (e.g. Apple)
mixed in as well to cut done on the amount of sugar needed.

The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
redefining American), but can be used in pies too.

The "kiwifruit" (incorrectly called just "kiwi" in many other
countries, which is really a flightless bird) is more correctly called
the "Chinese gooseberry" because it's a native plant of China later
stolen and renamed by New Zealand growers for copyright purposes ...
and they now selfishly complain that China is stealing their market for
the fruit! :-\

[John W Kennedy]

The use of “jelly” to designate a clarified fruit-based production, with
no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition of Mrs.
Acton’s “Modern Cookery”, published by Longman.

> The "kiwifruit" (incorrectly called just "kiwi" in many other countries,
> which is really a flightless bird) is more correctly called the "Chinese
> gooseberry" because it's a native plant of China later stolen and
> renamed by New Zealand growers for copyright purposes ... and they now
> selfishly complain that China is stealing their market for the fruit!   :-\
>

--
John W. Kennedy
Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

[John W Kennedy]

I really must insert here that, though she was no doubt zaftig, my
teacher would lose ten pounds in a single performance. And “Hänsel und
Gretel”, despite being popular at children’s matinees, is musically
rather heavy. (Richard Strauss conducted at the première.)

[Your Name]

> of Mrs. Acton’s "�œModern Cookery", published by Longman.

"Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).

"Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
with roast lamb.

Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.

[Scott Lurndal]

Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> writes:
>On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:

>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
>>> berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>>> redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>
>> The use of "jelly"€ to designate a clarified fruit-based production,
>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition

>> of Mrs. Acton’s "€œModern Cookery", published by Longman.

>
>"Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>
>"Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>with roast lamb.

Jelly is made from juice only. Jam includes the fruit. Both are put on
toast, bread, muffins or between layers of sponge cake.

"Jelly is a clear fruit spread made from cooked fruit juice and
sugar, and possibly pectin, which helps it gel and thicken. ...

Jam is a thick spread made from fruit juice, chopped, crushed,
or puréed fruit, and sugar. Pectin may also be added to help it
gel, but jams are usually looser than jellies."

www.finecooking.com

[Your Name]

Those are the silly American re-definitions. The actual *English*
definitions are what I gave ... which is the entire point I started
with. :-\

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <sql4tr$fs1$1...@gioia.aioe.org>,

Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote:
>On 2021-12-30 17:39:24 +0000, Dorothy J Heydt said:
>> In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,
>> Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>>>>>
>>>>> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>>>> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>>>>
>>>>> No.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lynn
>>>>
>>>> Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>>>>
>>>> For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>>>> the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>>
>>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>>
>>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>>
>>> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>>
>>> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>>> taste a whole lot better to me.
>>
>> Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable. I have
>> never encountered gooseberries.
>
>Usually a rhubarb pie or crumble has some other fruit (e.g. Apple)

Strawberry, in my experience.

>mixed in as well to cut done on the amount of sugar needed.

But unmixed (except with sugar) rhubarb, IMO, tastes better.

>
>The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
>berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>redefining American), but can be used in pies too.

>The "kiwifruit" (incorrectly called just "kiwi" in many other
>countries, which is really a flightless bird) is more correctly called
>the "Chinese gooseberry" because it's a native plant of China later
>stolen and renamed by New Zealand growers for copyright purposes ...
>and they now selfishly complain that China is stealing their market for
>the fruit! :-\

Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
it.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <robertaw-7B1E65...@news.individual.net>,

Robert Woodward <robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:
>In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,
> Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>> >>
>> >> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>> >> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>> >>
>> >> No.
>> >>
>> >> Lynn
>> >
>> >Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>> >
>> >For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>> >the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>
>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>
>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>
>
>Rhubarb is not a fruit.

Depends on your definition. Botanically, rhubarb is not a fruit
(it's a stem), and a tomato is.

But if you define "fruit" as "something you put in a pie, with
enough sweetening to make it palatable," then rhubarb fits that
definition.

>The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
>attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
>pies each summer.

Ah. Now all I need is a time machine and an introduction to your
Mom.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <sql46t$4kr$1...@gioia.aioe.org>,

Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote:
>
>Technically "pumpkin pie" isn't even a pie at all. The version you
>mostly see which has a pastry case filled with organge goo is really a
>"tart". Similarly with "lemon meriingue pie", "key lime pie", etc. also
>being tarts
>
>A tart is *usually* open-topped, while a real "pie" has a lid,
>*usually* pastry, on the top (can be with or without the lower case).
>

Does a lemon or Key Lime confection continue to be a tart when
it's covered with meringue?

[Titus G]

IIRC there was more than just selfish complaint; it may have gone to
some court or arbitration. I wouldn't say stolen from China. Back in the
day when Chinese gooseberries arrived in New Zealand, no one would
regard it as theft. But New Zealand growers developed a new copyrighted
strain of the Chinese gooseberry which was technically stolen by Chinese
growers. ( Good on them. Imagine the stupidity of someone owning the
copyright for the potato! Another example of Capitalism's desire for
control rather competition.)

I never see nor hear of gooseberries any more though they were once a
common and popular home garden bush, perhaps because they were hardy and
prolific producers. I remember eating them raw after removing the
prickles and tail. Delicious. Kiwifruit production requires much more
attention and is a commercial operation in contrast.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <r4yL9...@kithrup.com>,

Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>In article <sql46t$4kr$1...@gioia.aioe.org>,
>Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote:
>>
>>Technically "pumpkin pie" isn't even a pie at all. The version you
>>mostly see which has a pastry case filled with organge goo is really a
>>"tart". Similarly with "lemon meriingue pie", "key lime pie", etc. also
>>being tarts
>>
>>A tart is *usually* open-topped, while a real "pie" has a lid,
>>*usually* pastry, on the top (can be with or without the lower case).
>>
>Does a lemon or Key Lime confection continue to be a tart when
>it's covered with meringue?
>

Moving slightly sideways:

_Slate_ online mag is reprinting some of its best articles from
the last 25 years. This one is about pies.

https://slate.com/human-interest/2015/11/20-guests-19-pies-my-mothers-demented-glorious-thanksgiving-baking-extravaganza.html

[Titus G]

On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:

>
> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
> it.
>

Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
bits with a spoon.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.

[Titus G]

On 31/12/21 4:48 pm, Ted Nolan <tednolan> wrote:
> In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>> On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>> it.
>>>
>>
>> Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>> bits with a spoon.
>
> And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.
>

Yes. I have never eaten the Golden variety and seldom have the green. My
preference is usually for an apple for texture, taste and to keep the
doctor away.

[Your Name]

Yep, that's the usual method when eating it 'whole', but if you're
using it for something else (e.g. cake decoration) then you do have to
peel it and slice it for best results.

[Your Name]

On 2021-12-31 03:48:55 +0000, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan said:
> In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>> On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>
>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>> it.
>>
>> Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>> bits with a spoon.
>
> And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.

You can actually eat the peel (wash it first!) of any kiwifruit, but
the "furry" texture is off-putting to most people.

[Your Name]

On 2021-12-31 02:51:07 +0000, Dorothy J Heydt said:
> In article <sql46t$4kr$1...@gioia.aioe.org>,
> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote:
>>
>> Technically "pumpkin pie" isn't even a pie at all. The version you
>> mostly see which has a pastry case filled with organge goo is really a
>> "tart". Similarly with "lemon meriingue pie", "key lime pie", etc. also
>> being tarts
>>
>> A tart is *usually* open-topped, while a real "pie" has a lid,
>> *usually* pastry, on the top (can be with or without the lower case).
>
> Does a lemon or Key Lime confection continue to be a tart when
> it's covered with meringue?

It gets a bit tricky, but they're probably tarts, same as with ones
with pastry lattices on top.

Another less obvious visual difference is the pastry itself - pies tend
to be flaky pastry while tarts are more crumbly pastry.
<https://greatist.com/eat/what-is-the-difference-between-a-pie-and-a-tart#recipes>


There are exceptions, as always. Here in New Zealand you can get a
"Potato Top Pie" which is a pastry case filled with a mince meat mix
and mashed potato covering on top ... no pastry lid.
<https://kiddscakes.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Kidds-Famous-Pies-Potato-Top-Pie.jpg>

[Scott Lurndal]

The sun set decades ago. Get over it.

[Scott Lurndal]

Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> writes:
> But New Zealand growers developed a new copyrighted
>strain of the Chinese gooseberry which was technically stolen by Chinese
>growers. ( Good on them. Imagine the stupidity of someone owning the
>copyright for the potato! Another example of Capitalism's desire for
>control rather competition.)

Yeah, imagine that:

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20050081269A1/en
https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/india-revokes-patent-pepsicos-lays-potatoes-2021-12-03/

[Quinn C]

* Your Name:

And you're fine with jelly by the above definition not having any name?
because you haven't suggested one.

--
Do not they speak false English ... that doth not speak thou to one,
and what ever he be, Father, Mother, King, or Judge, is he not a
Novice, and Unmannerly, and an Ideot, and a Fool, that speaks Your
to one, which is not to be spoken to a singular, but to many?
-- George Fox (1660)

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <j37ct7...@mid.individual.net>,

Ted Nolan <tednolan> <tednolan> wrote:
>In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>> it.
>>>
>>
>>Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>>bits with a spoon.
>
>And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.

Hmm. I don't think I've ever seen one of those.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <r4zM...@kithrup.com>,

Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:

>In article <j37ct7...@mid.individual.net>,
>Ted Nolan <tednolan> <tednolan> wrote:
>>In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>>> it.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>>>bits with a spoon.
>>
>>And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.
>
>Hmm. I don't think I've ever seen one of those.
>

They seem to be less common than the fuzzy ones, but I do see them
at the local "Fresh Market" (which is a little upscale, but not
Whole Foods by any means) from time to time. They are less fuzzy
and have kind of a "beak" on one end. Pretty tasty as well.

[Paul S Person]

On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 17:39:24 GMT, djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J
Heydt) wrote:

>In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,
>Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>>>>
>>>> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>>> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>>>
>>>> No.
>>>>
>>>> Lynn
>>>
>>>Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>>>
>>>For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>>>the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>
>>De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>
>>Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>>to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>>gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>
>>I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>
>>But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>>taste a whole lot better to me.
>
>Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable. I have
>never encountered gooseberries.

I knew gooseberry pie from a George Pal cartoon, "Jasper and the
Haunted House". Which isn't nearly as bad as might be expected from
its age, at least until you reach the end.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

[Paul S Person]

On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 11:20:25 -0500, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Your Name:
>
>> On 2021-12-31 01:54:22 +0000, Scott Lurndal said:
>>
>>> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> writes:
>>>> On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
>>>
>>>>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
>>>>>> berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>>>>>> redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>>>>

>>>>> The use of "jelly"€? to designate a clarified fruit-based production,

>>>>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition
>>>>> of Mrs. Acton’s "€œModern Cookery", published by Longman.
>>>>
>>>> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>>>> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>>>> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>>>>
>>>> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>>>> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>>>> with roast lamb.
>>>
>>> Jelly is made from juice only. Jam includes the fruit. Both are put on
>>> toast, bread, muffins or between layers of sponge cake.
>>>
>>> "Jelly is a clear fruit spread made from cooked fruit juice and
>>> sugar, and possibly pectin, which helps it gel and thicken. ...
>>>
>>> Jam is a thick spread made from fruit juice, chopped, crushed,
>>> or puréed fruit, and sugar. Pectin may also be added to help it
>>> gel, but jams are usually looser than jellies."
>>>
>>> www.finecooking.com
>>
>> Those are the silly American re-definitions. The actual *English*
>> definitions are what I gave ... which is the entire point I started
>> with. :-\
>
>And you're fine with jelly by the above definition not having any name?
>because you haven't suggested one.

It occurs to me, reviewing the above, that the "English" definitions
are about /how it is used/ while the "American" definitions are about
/how it is made/.

They can both be valid.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <eseusg9v4kbv1bao0...@4ax.com>,

The Jasper shorts were "Puppetoons" not cartoons. You couldn't
show them today probably. I like the non-Jasper Puppetoon "Tulips
Shall Grow":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1QUUmShhMM

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <mffusglud2e5gq2bq...@4ax.com>,

Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

And remember the test: It must be jelly because..

[Paul S Person]

On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 19:27:33 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
wrote:

When I was growing up, my mother engaged in "home canning".

For those unaware of this, it was a major enterprise, involving things
to can, glass jars with vacuum-seal tops, lots of boiling water, and
lots of of sugar. She did this in the fall; we ate the results into
the next spring if not summer.

One of things she canned was called "Queen-of-All Preserves". I loved
it. Well, given the amount of sugar, why not? This was a compendium of
small bits and pieces of various fruits. I was appalled to learn that
one of my favorite pieces was, in fact -- orange peel.

So I am well able to imagine that a gooseberry pie, if it had enough
sugar in it when it was cooked, would be something I might like.

[Paul S Person]

On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 10:19:58 -0800, Robert Woodward
<robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:

>In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,

> Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>

>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>> >>
>> >> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>> >> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>> >>
>> >> No.
>> >>
>> >> Lynn
>> >
>> >Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>> >
>> >For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>> >the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>
>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>
>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>
>

>Rhubarb is not a fruit.

I wondered about that while I was eating it.

It had a taste reminiscent of okra, definitely a vegetable, which I
bought once by mistake (I was one-box-off from the lima beans).

Both made me gag a bit. But, again, anyone who grew up eating these
would very likely have a completely different opinon.

>> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>
>> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>> taste a whole lot better to me.
>

>The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
>attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
>pies each summer.

[J. Clarke]

On 31 Dec 2021 17:31:25 GMT, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan

I can see why they'd be offensive, but funny nonetheless, although
creatures of their time. I wonder how many kids today would get the
haunted house not being haunted anymore because the haunts had all
been drafted?

<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPNbjJFrOx8>

>I like the non-Jasper Puppetoon "Tulips
>Shall Grow":
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1QUUmShhMM

That was a good one. Seems antiwar now instead of anti Nazi. I'll
never hear the word "screwball" without seeing that image. The
goose-stepping goose was a nice touch.

[Scott Lurndal]

Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> writes:
>On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 19:27:33 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On 2021-12-31 03:48:55 +0000, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan said:
>>> In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>> On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>>>> it.
>>>>
>>>> Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>>>> bits with a spoon.
>>>
>>> And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.
>>
>>You can actually eat the peel (wash it first!) of any kiwifruit, but
>>the "furry" texture is off-putting to most people.
>
>When I was growing up, my mother engaged in "home canning".
>
>For those unaware of this, it was a major enterprise, involving things
>to can, glass jars with vacuum-seal tops, lots of boiling water, and
>lots of of sugar. She did this in the fall; we ate the results into
>the next spring if not summer.

It's not like home canning is extinct - I'm currently enjoying
a nice cherry-plum (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prunus_cerasifera)
jam on my morning english muffin.

Over a 100 jars of cherry-plum jam and grape jelly, all from the
back yard.

>
>One of things she canned was called "Queen-of-All Preserves". I loved
>it. Well, given the amount of sugar, why not? This was a compendium of
>small bits and pieces of various fruits. I was appalled to learn that
>one of my favorite pieces was, in fact -- orange peel.

Candied orange peel is delicious.

>
>So I am well able to imagine that a gooseberry pie, if it had enough
>sugar in it when it was cooked, would be something I might like.

I certainly enjoyed them growing up. Not a common fruit where
I live now.

My grandmother made an excellent rhubarb crumble.

[Your Name]

A 'Chineses gooseberry' (kiwifruit) a day keeps the accupunturist away. ;-)

[Your Name]

Especially with custard. :-)

There's a UK kids' animated series called "Roobarb and Custard" ...
another in the massively long line of bad choices that "help" kids
learn to spell, but "Rhubarb and Custard" is probably not
copyrightable. :-\
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071043/>

[Your Name]

They're the same thing, so that would still be "jam" ... simply jam
with and without "bits" in it. :-p

[Your Name]

There are at four main types of Kiwifruit - green, golden, red, and
purple. Within that there are at least 50 sub-varities.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <9kfusg1oaiu2qib4f...@4ax.com>,

Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

>On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 19:27:33 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On 2021-12-31 03:48:55 +0000, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan said:
>>> In article <sqltt2$nqh$1...@dont-email.me>, Titus G <no...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>> On 31/12/21 3:43 pm, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, I like kiwifruit, except for the hassle involved in peeling
>>>>> it.
>>>>
>>>> Bifurcate it through its equatorial circumference and dig out the good
>>>> bits with a spoon.
>>>
>>> And the Golden Kiwi apparently can be eaten peel & all.
>>
>>You can actually eat the peel (wash it first!) of any kiwifruit, but
>>the "furry" texture is off-putting to most people.
>
>When I was growing up, my mother engaged in "home canning".
>
>For those unaware of this, it was a major enterprise, involving things
>to can, glass jars with vacuum-seal tops, lots of boiling water, and
>lots of of sugar. She did this in the fall; we ate the results into
>the next spring if not summer.
>
>One of things she canned was called "Queen-of-All Preserves". I loved
>it. Well, given the amount of sugar, why not? This was a compendium of
>small bits and pieces of various fruits. I was appalled to learn that
>one of my favorite pieces was, in fact -- orange peel.

I have a fruitcake recipe (that I haven't made in years) that
contains both candied orange peel and ditto lemon peel. Also
candied red cherries, green cherries, pineapple chunks, a pound
of each. And two pounds of pecans.

[John W Kennedy]

On 12/30/21 6:26 PM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:

>> On 12/30/21 3:30 PM, Your Name wrote:

>>> On 2021-12-30 17:39:24 +0000, Dorothy J Heydt said:
>>>> In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,

>>>> Paul S Person  <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

>>>>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>>>>>> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lynn
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>>>>>> the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>>>>
>>>>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>>>>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>>>>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>>>>
>>>>> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>>>>
>>>>> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>>>>> taste a whole lot better to me.
>>>>

>>>> Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable.  I have
>>>> never encountered gooseberries.
>>>
>>> Usually a rhubarb pie or crumble has some other fruit (e.g. Apple)
>>> mixed in as well to cut done on the amount of sugar needed.

>>>
>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and
>>> "ground berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a
>>> word redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>
>> The use of "jelly"€ to designate a clarified fruit-based production,
>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition
>> of Mrs. Acton’s "€œModern Cookery", published by Longman.
>
> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>
> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
> with roast lamb.
>

> Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.

”You’re just contradicting everything I say! That's not an argument!”

>>> The "kiwifruit" (incorrectly called just "kiwi" in many other
>>> countries, which is really a flightless bird) is more correctly
>>> called the "Chinese gooseberry" because it's a native plant of China
>>> later stolen and renamed by New Zealand growers for copyright
>>> purposes ... and they now selfishly complain that China is stealing
>>> their market for the fruit!  :-\
>
>


--
John W. Kennedy
Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

[John W Kennedy]

On 12/30/21 9:25 PM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2021-12-31 01:54:22 +0000, Scott Lurndal said:
>
>> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> writes:

>>> On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
>>
>>>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and
>>>>> "ground
>>>>> berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>>>>> redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>>>
>>>> The use of "jelly"€ to designate a clarified fruit-based production,
>>>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition
>>>> of Mrs. Acton’s "€œModern Cookery", published by Longman.
>>>
>>> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>>> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>>> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>>>
>>> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>>> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>>> with roast lamb.
>>

>> Jelly is made from juice only.  Jam includes the fruit.   Both are put on
>> toast, bread, muffins or between layers of sponge cake.
>>
>>   "Jelly is a clear fruit spread made from cooked fruit juice and
>>    sugar, and possibly pectin, which helps it gel and thicken. ...
>>
>>    Jam is a thick spread made from fruit juice, chopped, crushed,
>>    or puréed fruit, and sugar. Pectin may also be added to help it
>>    gel, but jams are usually looser than jellies."
>>
>>   www.finecooking.com
>
> Those are the silly American re-definitions. The actual *English*
> definitions are what I gave ... which is the entire point I started
> with.   :-\

Eliza Acton wasn’t an American.

[John W Kennedy]

“It is not, in fact, very different from the conviction she would have
felt at the age of ten that the kind of fish-knives used in her father’s
house were the proper or normal or ‘real’ kind, while those of
neighboring families were ‘not real fish-knives’ at all.”
—Screwtape

[Your Name]

On 2022-01-01 00:40:13 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
> On 12/30/21 6:26 PM, Your Name wrote:
>> On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
>>> On 12/30/21 3:30 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>> On 2021-12-30 17:39:24 +0000, Dorothy J Heydt said:
>>>>> In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,

>>>>> Paul S Person  <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>>>>>>> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynn
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny bit on
>>>>>>> the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have exposed me
>>>>>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>>>>>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>>>>>> taste a whole lot better to me.
>>>>>

>>>>> Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable.  I have

>>>>> never encountered gooseberries.
>>>>
>>>> Usually a rhubarb pie or crumble has some other fruit (e.g. Apple)
>>>> mixed in as well to cut done on the amount of sugar needed.
>>>>
>>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
>>>> berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>>>> redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>>
>>> The use of "jelly" to designate a clarified fruit-based production,
>>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition

>>> of Mrs. Acton's "Modern Cookery", published by Longman.

>>
>> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>>
>> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>> with roast lamb.
>>
>> Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.
>
> "You're just contradicting everything I say! That's not an argument!"

I'm simply telling you the *facts* of the *English* language and the
Americanisations that are incorrect in the *English* language.

[Your Name]

Not really relevant. Americans are the ones who continue to try to
enforce those now-incorrect definitions on the rest of the
*English*-speaking world ... they're "American English" (an oxy-moron,
it's either English or America, can't be both, just like
"African-American" nonsense).

[Titus G]

Good grief. Why didn't they just start with water or oxygen?

[Quinn C]

All right, and a peach is just a plum with fuzz. People make up too many
unnecessary words.

Happy 2022!

--
Ihre E-Mail-ID Haben Sie gewann £ 500.000,00 GBP in der
SAMSUNG UK Promotion Lotterie ziehen.
-- SPAMPOESIE

[J. Clarke]

On Sat, 1 Jan 2022 11:34:02 -0500, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Your Name:
>
>> On 2021-12-31 16:20:25 +0000, Quinn C said:
>>> * Your Name:
>>>> On 2021-12-31 01:54:22 +0000, Scott Lurndal said:
>
>>>>> Jelly is made from juice only. Jam includes the fruit. Both are put on
>>>>> toast, bread, muffins or between layers of sponge cake.
>>>>>
>>>>> "Jelly is a clear fruit spread made from cooked fruit juice and
>>>>> sugar, and possibly pectin, which helps it gel and thicken. ...
>>>>>
>>>>> Jam is a thick spread made from fruit juice, chopped, crushed,
>>>>> or puréed fruit, and sugar. Pectin may also be added to help it
>>>>> gel, but jams are usually looser than jellies."
>>>>>
>>>>> www.finecooking.com
>>>>
>>>> Those are the silly American re-definitions. The actual *English*
>>>> definitions are what I gave ... which is the entire point I started
>>>> with. :-\
>>>
>>> And you're fine with jelly by the above definition not having any name?
>>> because you haven't suggested one.
>>
>> They're the same thing, so that would still be "jam" ... simply jam
>> with and without "bits" in it. :-p
>
>All right, and a peach is just a plum with fuzz. People make up too many
>unnecessary words.

Supermarkets sell "grape jelly" and "grape jam". I have never been
able to identify any difference between them other than the word on
the label.

[Paul S Person]

On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 12:26:53 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
wrote:

>On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:

>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and "ground
>>> berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're a word
>>> redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>

>> The use of "jelly"€? to designate a clarified fruit-based production,

>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855 edition

>> of Mrs. Acton’s "�œModern Cookery", published by Longman.

>
>"Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>
>"Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>with roast lamb.

Ah. Jell-O. Wobbly desert indeed!

And I suppose "preserves" is used for canned fruit.

>Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.
>
>
>

>>> The "kiwifruit" (incorrectly called just "kiwi" in many other
>>> countries, which is really a flightless bird) is more correctly called
>>> the "Chinese gooseberry" because it's a native plant of China later
>>> stolen and renamed by New Zealand growers for copyright purposes ...
>>> and they now selfishly complain that China is stealing their market for
>>> the fruit!  :-\
>
--

[Quinn C]

* Your Name:

OK, you're getting exceedingly silly, but I guess that shouldn't have
been a surprise given your silly handle.

Maybe "sensible Usenet contributor" is also an oxymoron.

--
Jib the boom! Poop the deck!
Rattle the hatch! Main the sail! Pepper the mints!
Anchors aweigh in the morn!
-- Muppet Show sea shanty (Ep.220)

[Quinn C]

* Your Name:

Sadly, Roobarb is a dog, not a kangaroo, which would've justified the
spelling.

--
Veronica: You named your puppy "The Missus"?
Cliff: Says the owner of a dog named "Pony".
-- Veronica Mars, S04E05

[Paul S Person]

On 31 Dec 2021 17:31:25 GMT, t...@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan
<tednolan>) wrote:

True, true -- "Puppetoons". Which are stop-motion, just like /Chicken
Run/.

There is a DVD /The Puppetoon Movie/ which includes 24 of them (12 in
the movie, twelve additional ones). How many you could show today I'm
not sure. Many of them were commercials. Jasper himself may be too
stereotypical, and that is a pity, for the end of "Jasper and the
Haunted House" is an outlier. "Jasper in a Jam" and "Jasper at the
Derby" are quite entertaining.

These older cartoons can be quite frustrating. They can go merrily
along, very enjoyable and then -- for no reason -- turn a bit nasty,
if only for a moment.

But that is what audiences wanted, back when they were made.

[Your Name]

I'm guessing they both come in a jar, which would make them both just "jam".

Real "jelly" comes in a box, either in a powdered or cube form. You
then put that into a bowl, add boiling water, and allow to set in the
fridge as a desert (it's never spreadable, so can't be used on toast,
cakes, etc.).

[Your Name]

On 2022-01-01 16:34:02 +0000, Quinn C said:
> * Your Name:
>> On 2021-12-31 16:20:25 +0000, Quinn C said:
>>> * Your Name:
>>>> On 2021-12-31 01:54:22 +0000, Scott Lurndal said:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jelly is made from juice only. Jam includes the fruit. Both are put
>>>>> on toast, bread, muffins or between layers of sponge cake.
>>>>>
>>>>> "Jelly is a clear fruit spread made from cooked fruit juice and
>>>>> sugar, and possibly pectin, which helps it gel and thicken. ...
>>>>>
>>>>> Jam is a thick spread made from fruit juice, chopped, crushed,
>>>>> or puréed fruit, and sugar. Pectin may also be added to help it
>>>>> gel, but jams are usually looser than jellies."
>>>>>
>>>>> www.finecooking.com
>>>>
>>>> Those are the silly American re-definitions. The actual *English*
>>>> definitions are what I gave ... which is the entire point I started
>>>> with. :-\
>>>
>>> And you're fine with jelly by the above definition not having any name?
>>> because you haven't suggested one.
>>
>> They're the same thing, so that would still be "jam" ... simply jam
>> with and without "bits" in it. :-p
>
> All right, and a peach is just a plum with fuzz.

A peach-plum is called a "Nectarine".

There's also a peach-plum-apricot which is called a "Peacotum".

> People make up too many unnecessary words.

I'm not making up any words. It's silly Americans who have two words
for the same jam product, plus an unnecessary third made-up word for an
existing jelly product.

They already have "chunky" and "smooth" versions of the disgusting
peanut butter, so they could easily simply have "chunky" (bits in) and
"smooth" (no bits) versions of jam to, but no, they obstinately insist
on making things more complicated for the *English* speaking world
simply because they want to. :-\

[Quinn C]

* Your Name:

I was taking your lead regarding unnecessary distinctions and criticized
the person who invented the word for "peach" (thousands of years ago,
probably).

People make distinctions where they consider them important. Your
personal opinion doesn't matter.

That said, I don't remember seeing "grape jam" and will see, if I find
it in store, if it is indeed jelly or not. The one in this picture (of a
supposedly homemade product) clearly isn't.
<https://fccmansfield.org/img/47bce10c95f1bb4fd7a102fac2600e00.jpg>

> They already have "chunky" and "smooth" versions of the disgusting
> peanut butter, so they could easily simply have "chunky" (bits in) and
> "smooth" (no bits) versions of jam to, but no, they obstinately insist
> on making things more complicated for the *English* speaking world
> simply because they want to. :-\

That's not sufficient; non-jelly jam already can be smooth and chunky
(made from fine puree or chunky puree). Jelly would have to be called
extra-smooth or something, but even that seems misleading. "Clear" might
work.

--
Gehören Sie auch zu billigeren Geschenk für Ihre Freunde wollen
-- SPAMPOESIE

[John W Kennedy]

On 12/31/21 9:28 PM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2022-01-01 00:40:13 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
>> On 12/30/21 6:26 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>> On 2021-12-30 22:12:58 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
>>>> On 12/30/21 3:30 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>>> On 2021-12-30 17:39:24 +0000, Dorothy J Heydt said:
>>>>>> In article <u4qrsg1ofs6t53046...@4ax.com>,

>>>>>> Paul S Person  <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 20:32:35 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2021-12-29 18:50:58 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>>>>>>>> https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Lynn
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Greatly depends on what's in the pie.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For example, 'pumpkin pie' is simply digusting so even a tiny
>>>>>>>> bit on
>>>>>>>> the end of a toothpick is far too much.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> De gustibus non est disputandum.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Surprises in Amazon's efforts to provide canned fruit have
>>>>>>> exposed me
>>>>>>> to two fruits I never had when growing up but have heard about:
>>>>>>> gooseberries and rhubarb.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I didn't like them; I suspect they are an acquired taste.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But bake them into a pie with enough sugar and I suspect they would
>>>>>>> taste a whole lot better to me.
>>>>>>

>>>>>> Rhubarb pie (with, yes, sufficient sugar) is delectable.  I have

>>>>>> never encountered gooseberries.
>>>>>
>>>>> Usually a rhubarb pie or crumble has some other fruit (e.g. Apple)
>>>>> mixed in as well to cut done on the amount of sugar needed.
>>>>>
>>>>> The gooseberry has other names too, including "goldenberry" and
>>>>> "ground berry". Mostly they are used for jam (or "jelly" if you're
>>>>> a word redefining  American), but can be used in pies too.
>>>>
>>>> The use of "jelly" to designate a clarified fruit-based production,
>>>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855
>>>> edition of Mrs. Acton's "Modern Cookery", published by Longman.
>>>
>>> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>>> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>>> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>>>
>>> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>>> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>>> with roast lamb.
>>>
>>> Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.
>>
>> "You're just contradicting everything I say! That's not an argument!"
>
> I'm simply telling you the *facts* of the *English* language and the
> Americanisations that are incorrect in the *English* language.
>

Still nothing but evidence-free contradiction, backed by what might,
perhaps, be called a sort of “vocabular creationism”.

[John W Kennedy]

And yet the OED sees fit to tag “jelly” in the sense of fruit juice
gelled with some agent other than gelatine as “later”, not “US”. It’s
almost as though specialist professional scholars disagree with you.

Speaking of the OED (or the NED, as it was then), when the first edition
was finished in book form, presentation copies were formally presented
to the White House as well as to Buckingham Palace.

[John W Kennedy]

In US use, the distinction is well defined. Grape jelly is absolutely
clear, and is gelled with pectin, and is meant to be used like jam
(chiefly, spread on bread). If gelatin is used, and it is served at the
table as a cold dessert, it is “grape gelatin", or by abuse of a trade
name, “grape Jell-O. "Grape jam" has solid bits in it, but is otherwise
much the same as “grape jelly”.

In the 50s, there was also “grapelade”.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <sqqee8$1sjm$1...@gioia.aioe.org>,

"The rose is a rose,
And was always a rose.
But now the theory goes
That the apple's a rose,
And the pear is, and so's
The plum, I suppose.
The dear only knows
What will next prove a rose.
You, of course, are a rose
But were always a rose."

--Robert Frost

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosaceae

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <04adnQjzcu9dl0z8...@giganews.com>,

John W Kennedy <john.w....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>In the 50s, there was also “grapelade”.

In my distant youth, it was Grapette.

Bright purple, sweet as hell, and (I'm sure) totally synthetic.
The only place I could find it was at a stand on a beach along
the Russian River, halfway between Rio Nido and Guerneville.

[J. Clarke]

I defy you to find any solid bits in Welch's Grape Jam.

[J. Clarke]

On Sun, 2 Jan 2022 03:00:29 GMT, djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
wrote:

>In article <04adnQjzcu9dl0z8...@giganews.com>,
>John W Kennedy <john.w....@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>In the 50s, there was also “grapelade”.
>
>In my distant youth, it was Grapette.
>
>Bright purple, sweet as hell, and (I'm sure) totally synthetic.
>The only place I could find it was at a stand on a beach along
>the Russian River, halfway between Rio Nido and Guerneville.

It was commonplace in the South in the late '50s and early '60s. I
rather liked it.

[Your Name]

Whatever Americanised stupidty you want to delude yourself with. The
actual facts of the *English* language remain as I said in the first
place.

Game over

[Paul S Person]

On Sun, 2 Jan 2022 09:37:55 +1300, Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com>
wrote:

Definitely Jell-O, then.

[Paul S Person]

It may have depended on the time of year.

One reason I am using Kroger's Strawberry Preserves instead of
Smucker's is because Kroger's /always/ has bits of Strawberry in it,
sometimes more, sometimes less. The Smucker's went from sometimes less
to sometimes none during the year.

[Paul S Person]

>>>>> The use of "jelly"? to designate a clarified fruit-based production,

>>>>> with no use of animal gelatin, is at least as old as the 1855
>>>>> edition of Mrs. Acton's "Modern Cookery", published by Longman.
>>>>
>>>> "Jam" is a spreadable topping you put on toast or between layers of
>>>> sponge cake. (I would say used on scones, but then that opens up yet
>>>> another rabbit hole of misued American definitions).
>>>>
>>>> "Jelly" is a wobbly desert used in trifles, etc., although there are
>>>> also things like mint "jelly" (as oposed to "mint sauce") which goes
>>>> with roast lamb.
>>>>
>>>> Gooseberries can actually be used for both a jam and a jelly.
>>>
>>> "You're just contradicting everything I say! That's not an argument!"
>>
>> I'm simply telling you the *facts* of the *English* language and the
>> Americanisations that are incorrect in the *English* language.
>>
>
>Still nothing but evidence-free contradiction, backed by what might,
>perhaps, be called a sort of “vocabular creationism”.

Yes, he does seem awful insistent on defining /British English/ as the
One True English, doesn't he.

Still, I suppose this is a useful illustration of the "two great
peoples divided by a common language" saying.

[Mark Jackson]

Likely pro-Brexit as well.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
As for behavior, I have shocking news:
Physicists can be arrogant. - Mike Tamor

[Robert Woodward]

In article <2ro3tgtatsau35heo...@4ax.com>,

Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

I wonder if there is regional variation in England on the meanings of
jam and jelly? We had to pick up our usage somewhere after all.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
‹-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robe...@drizzle.com

[Your Name]

Most silly Americanisations are due to either:

A. Making up words and definitions to suit themselves, and then
trying to enforce that on everyone else,
(same as Microsoft deciding to make up HTML "standards" to
suit themselves and then trying to force everyone else to
use them),

or

B. Continuing to stubbornly use ye olde English definitions
that have long since been out-dated in real *English*.

Either way, the Americanisations are simply incorrect.

[Lynn McGuire]

On 1/3/2022 12:45 AM, Your Name wrote:
...

> Most silly Americanisations are due to either:
>
> A.  Making up words and definitions to suit themselves, and then
>    trying to enforce that on everyone else,
>    (same as Microsoft deciding to make up HTML "standards" to
>     suit themselves and then trying to force everyone else to
>     use them),
>
> or
>
> B.  Continuing to stubbornly use ye olde English definitions
>    that have long since been out-dated in real *English*.
>
> Either way, the Americanisations are simply incorrect.

Looks like you need to be acquainted with Jame Nicoll.

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/694108-the-problem-with-defending-the-purity-of-the-english-language

"“The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow
words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways
to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary.”

― James D. Nicoll"

Lynn

[Your Name]

I never said English was "pure" nor that it didn't use words from
*other* languages. It's not. It separate lanuage that uses a mixture of
words from various other languages.

I said Americans misuse the *English* language with their own spellings
and definitions, and try to enforce those incorrect versions on the
entire *English* speaking world. All that achieves is to simply cause a
confused mess and harder for non-speakers to learn (as if the abundance
of "rule" breaking words wasn't already enough). Even apparently simple
things like dates on magazines and newspapers have slowly been switched
over to the ass-backwards American version, rather than proper English.

If Americans wanted their own language, then they should have actually
made their own, but if they want to use *English* they should adhere to
the way the *English* people define it.

That doesn't mean there aren't localised words (e.g. "dunny" being
Australian for toilet), but they aren't usually very different
definitions or spellings for the same word.

[Joy Beeson]

On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 10:19:58 -0800, Robert Woodward
<robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:

> The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
> attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
> pies each summer.

My mom made rhubarb pies, but most of her crop went into "rhubarb
juice", a sort of pink lemonade.

After I grew up, I learned that rhubarb juice is quite tasty and
refreshing without sugar if you make it with raw rhubarb in a blender
instead of boiling it: an inch or two of petiole in a pint of water.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at centurylink dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

[Joy Beeson]

On Fri, 31 Dec 2021 18:37:32 GMT, sc...@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

> It's not like home canning is extinct - I'm currently enjoying
> a nice cherry-plum (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prunus_cerasifera)
> jam on my morning english muffin.
>
> Over a 100 jars of cherry-plum jam and grape jelly, all from the
> back yard.

I gave away my canner, but still open-kettle pickles every summer.

Preserves can also be open kettled, but I can no longer eat that much
sugar. Mom would put a chunk of wax in the bottom of each sterile
half-pint jar, then pour in boiling preserves. The wax would melt and
rise to the top, making an air-tight seal.

She stopped doing that after we got a freezer big enough to put a calf
in. She also kept a multi-gallon container of ice cream in the
freezer. We would put the syrup of strawberry preserves on our ice
cream, and eat the berries on bread. (One house guest pigged out when
she learned that she could have all the ice cream she wanted -- but
after a few days, couldn't be bothered to go to the freezer and get
it.)

------------

"preserves", by the way, are whole berries or bite-size chunks of
fruit preserved in a syrup made by drawing juice out with dry sugar.
Mom used equal parts by volume of strawberries and white sugar. I
think. I'm pretty sure my niece has the orignal copy of the recipe.

Jam is crushed fruit, preserved with sugar. There is no syrup. I
never made jam, so I'm fuzzy on the details.

Jelly is gelled fruit juice. The juice doesn't have to be filtered
off clear, and tastes better if you don't.

Commercial jelly is nearly always clear, because the important part is
looking sparkley when unmolded onto a plate, not taste or ability to
spread it on toast. Also, clear juice looks like food color, syrup,
"natural" flavoring, and lots and lots of pectin.

--
Joy Beeson, U.S.A., mostly central Hoosier,
some Northern Indiana, Upstate New York, Florida, and Hawaii

joy beeson at centurylink dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

The above message is a Usenet post.

[Your Name]

On 2022-01-04 04:33:56 +0000, Joy Beeson said:
> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 10:19:58 -0800, Robert Woodward
> <robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>
>> The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
>> attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
>> pies each summer.
>
> My mom made rhubarb pies, but most of her crop went into "rhubarb
> juice", a sort of pink lemonade.
>
> After I grew up, I learned that rhubarb juice is quite tasty and
> refreshing without sugar if you make it with raw rhubarb in a blender
> instead of boiling it: an inch or two of petiole in a pint of water.

I nearly misread that as "an inch or two of petrol" ... which would
give it an "interesting" flavour. ;-)

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <sr061b$9lo$1...@dont-email.me>,

Yeah.

[Scott Lurndal]

The proper word is Gasoline, not Petrol. If you used the correct
word, your confusion would have been avoided.

:-)

[Quinn C]

* Your Name:

The *English* invented "marmalade", as if it was something different
than jam made from citrus fruits, and in EU times, tried to force that
distinction even upon non-English speaking people.

--
It was frequently the fastest way to find what he was looking
for, provided that he was looking for trouble.
-- L. McMaster Bujold, Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen

[Stephen Harker]

Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> writes:

> On 2022-01-04 00:57:14 +0000, Lynn McGuire said:
>
>> On 1/3/2022 12:45 AM, Your Name wrote:
>> ...

>>> [...]

>>> Either way, the Americanisations are simply incorrect.
>>
>> Looks like you need to be acquainted with Jame Nicoll.
>> https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/694108-the-problem-with-defending-the-purity-of-the-english-language
>>
>>

>> "“The problem with defending the purity of the English language is

>> that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just
>> borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down
>> alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new

>> vocabulary.â€
>>
>> ― James D. Nicoll"

>>
>> Lynn
>
> I never said English was "pure" nor that it didn't use words from
> *other* languages. It's not. It separate lanuage that uses a mixture
> of words from various other languages.
>
> I said Americans misuse the *English* language with their own
> spellings and definitions, and try to enforce those incorrect versions
> on the entire *English* speaking world. All that achieves is to simply
> cause a confused mess and harder for non-speakers to learn (as if the
> abundance of "rule" breaking words wasn't already enough). Even
> apparently simple things like dates on magazines and newspapers have
> slowly been switched over to the ass-backwards American version,
> rather than proper English.
>
> If Americans wanted their own language, then they should have actually
> made their own, but if they want to use *English* they should adhere
> to the way the *English* people define it.
>
> That doesn't mean there aren't localised words (e.g. "dunny" being
> Australian for toilet), but they aren't usually very different
> definitions or spellings for the same word.

Back in the good old days people would spell words how they felt on the
day. Shakespeare wrote his name with a range of spelling. The idea of
standardised spelling took a long while to be established, codified and
accepted. Even then there are differences between cusomary spelling and
dictionary spelling: for example OED prefers civilize but civilise is
common in much of British/Commonwealth spelling.

--
Stephen Harker sjha...@netspace.net.au
was: http://sjharker.customer.netspace.net.au/
now: http://members.iinet.net.au/~sjha...@netspace.net.au/
or: http://members.iinet.net.au/~sjharker_nbn/

[Your Name]

"Petrol" is the correct *English* word ... "gasoline" is yet another of
those many silly Americanisms.

[Your Name]

That's because "Shakespeare" either didn't really exist OR everything
"written" by him was really written by various other people. ;-)

> The idea of standardised spelling took a long while to be established,
> codified and accepted. Even then there are differences between
> cusomary spelling and dictionary spelling: for example OED prefers
> civilize but civilise is common in much of British/Commonwealth
> spelling.

Technically the "z" words were the originals, but these days are more
silly Americanisations. The proper *English* spellings were changed to
now use "s".

Similarly with leaving the "u" out of words like "colour" and "flavour"
also being due to Americans stubbornly sticking to now out-dated ye
olde English (as sniped from the top quote).

[John W Kennedy]

Actually, “petrol” is French, and “gasoline” is Anglo-Irish (and thirty
years older).

[Your Name]

On 2022-01-04 21:37:56 +0000, John W Kennedy said:
> On 1/4/22 2:57 PM, Your Name wrote:
>> On 2022-01-04 14:59:56 +0000, Scott Lurndal said:
>>> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> writes:
>>>> On 2022-01-04 04:33:56 +0000, Joy Beeson said:
>>>>> On Thu, 30 Dec 2021 10:19:58 -0800, Robert Woodward
>>>>> <robe...@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The house that my parents bought when I was 13 had several acres of land
>>>>>> attached to it which included a rhubarb patch. Mom baked several rhubarb
>>>>>> pies each summer.
>>>>>
>>>>> My mom made rhubarb pies, but most of her crop went into "rhubarb
>>>>> juice", a sort of pink lemonade.
>>>>>
>>>>> After I grew up, I learned that rhubarb juice is quite tasty and
>>>>> refreshing without sugar if you make it with raw rhubarb in a blender
>>>>> instead of boiling it:  an inch or two of petiole in a pint of water.
>>>>
>>>> I nearly misread that as "an inch or two of petrol" ... which would
>>>> give it an "interesting" flavour.  ;-)
>>>
>>> The proper word is Gasoline, not Petrol.  If you used the correct
>>> word, your confusion would have been avoided.
>>>
>>> :-)
>>
>> "Petrol" is the correct *English* word ... "gasoline" is yet another of
>> those many silly Americanisms.
>
> Actually, “petrol” is French, and “gasoline” is Anglo-Irish (and thirty
> years older).

As previously said, it doesn't matetr that a word is older. It's simply
yet another example of Americans stubbornly stick to the old out-dated
word while proper English has moved on.

[Don]

Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> Joy Beeson wrote:
>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:

>>> Lynn McGuire wrote:
>>> >Over The Hedge: Can One Ever Eat Too Much Pie ?
>>> > https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2021/12/29
>>> >
>>> >No.
>>> >

>>> Well, diabetes....
>>
>>And there's fitting through doorways.
>>
> Ernestine Schuman-Heink (1861-1936) was an operatic contralto of
> not inconsiderable mass (although judging by many photographs on
> Wikipedia, she wasn't all *that* huge. One of her common roles
> was the Witch in _Haensel und Gretel_. The tale is told that she
> was scheduled to perform with a large symphony orchestra; the
> size of the orchestra is relevant, because the many players and
> their music stands packed the available space.
>
> So she was trying to get from the wings to the front of the
> stage, and there just wasn't room. The conductor whispered to
> her, "Go sideways, Madame!"
>
> She answered, in her magnificent contralto that filled the entire
> hall, "Mein Gott, es gibt kein Sideways!"

LOL.

Reminds me of _Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep_ (PKD) when bounty
hunter Rick Deckard administers the Voight-Kampff empathy test to opera
singer Luba Luft in order to discern whether she's an android. Deckard
tests Luft in her dressing room where Luft does her level best to stall
and out-think Deckard.

[Deckard] selected his initial question. "You're sitting
watching TV and suddenly you discover a wasp crawling on your
wrist." He checked with his watch, counting the seconds. And
checked, too, with the twin dials.
"What's a wasp?" Luba Luft asked.
"A stinging bug that flies."
"Oh, how strange." Her immense eyes widened with childlike
acceptance, as if he had revealed the cardinal mystery of
creation. "Do they still exist? I've never seen one."
"They died out because of the dust. Don't you really know
what a wasp is? You must have been alive when there were wasps;
that's only been --"
"Tell me the German word."
He tried to think of the German word for wasp but couldn't.
"Your English is perfect," he said angrily.
"My accent," she corrected, "is perfect. It has to be, for
roles, for Purcell and Walton and Vaughn Williams. But my
vocabulary isn't very large." She glanced at him shyly.
"Wespe," he said, remembering the German word.
"Ach yes; eine Wespe." She laughed. "And what was the
question? I forget already."

Eventually Luba Luft holds Deckard at (laser) gunpoint while she phones-
in a sham SF Police Precinct staffed by androids...

... a large harness bull arrived in his archaic blue uniform
with gun and star. ...

Later, when alone with Deckard, the harness bull discloses:

"That girl's quite a looker," Officer Crams said. "Of course,
with that costume you can't tell about her figure. But I'd say
it's damn okay."

###

It recently came to my attention how Perry Rhodan audiobooks only use
abridged versions of Moewig's original stories. It made me curious as to
the commonality of abbreviated audio adaptations. And it turns out
_Electric Sheep_'s audiobook:

https://archive.org/details/DoAndroidsDreamOfElectricSheep

is unabridged.

Danke,

--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``. https://crcomp.net/reviews.php
telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'