Super Villains: Where's The Prison Rape?
badth...@yahoo.com
It just used to be Red Sonja with the occasional Carol Danvers or Big
Barda (though I hope that story of her being raped by Sleeze and
turned into a porn star was retconned out of existence and John Byrne
beaten for ever doing it), but now we have Sue Dibny by Dr. Light who
confesses to being a serial rapist, Kevin Smith deciding Black Cat
wasn't a fun loving thief but a rape victim looking for power; The
Purple Man didn't rape Jessica Jones but obviously dozens of others,
Ra's Al Ghul planning to rape Wonder Woman in Matt Wagner's Trinity
and threats of rape every time I turn around now.
On one hand I can understand opening up this area of crime when you're
dealing with bad guys in a more mature sense. After all, it does make
a sick odd sense that when a dirtbag gets the power to do whatever he
wants, it's not just money and power he's going to take. But while
comic book writers obviously have no problem showing women as victims,
what about men? And no I don't mean Nightwing and Green Arrow. I mean
what happens in a prison filled with men with superpowers? We've all
seen Oz. Now imagine that on a super scale. It's not so much about
power, but dominance and given this guy just tried to take over the
world, where's the super-powered rape going on in the prisons of the
DCU and MU? What convict made the mistake of laughing at The
Armadillo then wound up in the showers with him? Who's tossing the
salad of The Kingpin? Where's encounter of a criminal mastermind with
all the henchmen he left behind when Batman came after him? He's
without his gadgets or been placed in a power dampener. He only
wishes they were going to kill him.
I'm only half-kidding about this, but given how these creators have
decided to employ rape to make things more "realistic" it's kinda hard
to avoid this side of it.
Magnus, Robot Fighter
You never read the Tattoo Man mini-series? And for some reason The
Purple Man always struck me as being Gay.
elf_with_a...@yahoo.com
badthin...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
> On one hand I can understand opening up this area of crime when you're
> dealing with bad guys in a more mature sense. After all, it does make
> a sick odd sense that when a dirtbag gets the power to do whatever he
> wants, it's not just money and power he's going to take. But while
> comic book writers obviously have no problem showing women as victims,
> what about men? And no I don't mean Nightwing and Green Arrow. I mean
> what happens in a prison filled with men with superpowers? We've all
> seen Oz. Now imagine that on a super scale. It's not so much about
> power, but dominance and given this guy just tried to take over the
> world, where's the super-powered rape going on in the prisons of the
> DCU and MU? What convict made the mistake of laughing at The
> Armadillo then wound up in the showers with him? Who's tossing the
> salad of The Kingpin? Where's encounter of a criminal mastermind with
> all the henchmen he left behind when Batman came after him? He's
> without his gadgets or been placed in a power dampener. He only
> wishes they were going to kill him.
>
> I'm only half-kidding about this, but given how these creators have
> decided to employ rape to make things more "realistic" it's kinda hard
> to avoid this side of it.
>
I've never seen Oz, but I've heard about it. May have to track down
some more info on it before looking for the DVD's of it, but it does
sound interesting.
The only comic I can think of that dealt somewhat with this (and from
what I've heard, may have been the first mainstream superhero comic to
do so) was a Wolverine arc from the Tieri(sp?) era of the book, where
Wolvie and Beast are depowered and sent to an underground prison for
super-villians for some reason (can't remember why at the moment).
Among the gangs at this prison were White Supremists (can't have a
prison story without 'em :) ), Black Supremists (they exist, they just
don't get as much air time as their white bretheren :) ), and a bunch
called the Cruisers, who, well, cruise the prison searching for
"vunerable" guys they can overpower and, well, have their way with.
They're introduced in a panel where they've got Wolvie trapped in a
shower. (And before you ask, even a depowered and, for pratical
purposes, declawed Wolvie can still get the idea across to these guys
that 'No' means 'NO!' when he says it to them.)
Chris
Tony
--you know, your post has some merit, but I couldn't stop laughing
after you gave me the visual of the Kingpin...
Tony
Tony
>
> - Show quoted text -
--well I'd hope so. Even though Wolverine is often shown as a rough
and tumble brawler, he's highly skilled in various martial arts.
Tony
YKW '06
communicate as follows:
> I'm only half-kidding about this, but given how these creators have
> decided to employ rape to make things more "realistic" it's kinda hard
> to avoid this side of it.
For the most part, though, powered convicts are shown being kept isolated
not only from GP but from =everyone=. The Raft, TBird Mountain, Iron
Heights and the like generally keep their accomodations one felon to a
cell, with contact generally possible only via shouting into a common area.
If there's any porcine squealin' goin' on, it's strictly among the common-
thug population. And, really, who =cares= if Jigsaw bangs Turk? If it
happens, I'd just as soon not be informed...
--
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Tom
They're never locked up long enough to establish a "relationship."
Tom
race...@lycos.com
homosexual acts and feelings in comics. Everybody just Looovvveees
coming up with the new - out - lipstick lesbian of the week. Women are
shown kissing, seducing and openly talking about sex with each other.
Thunder and Grace in the OUTsiders and the New Batwoman are just
recent examples. You'd NEVER see two men in bed talking about sex as
regularly as you see with women. I'm not clamoring for that, but it
just smacks of the fanboy fantasy lesbian nonsense than really writing
characters.
Along the same lines, are you kidding me. OF COURSE Male superheroes
would be raped in a realistic comic world. You'd also have some gay,
or bisexual supervillians. You're trying to tell me that the Riddler,
is a pretty obvious twink? Or that the Joker wouldn't kidnap and rape
Robin just because he's a maniac and knows it would hurt batman? And
that's just crazy supervillians. Consider aliens like Darkseid, who
would care little for the sexual standards or mores of humans and
consequently raping or abusing heroes that he's captured would be
pretty standard if you ask me. But of course we'll never see that
because a male hero who gets raped by another guy wouldn't be a 'hero'
anymore. He'd be a punk in most people's minds. Ridiculous.
> Tom- Hide quoted text -
MarkRRose
sex that they get desperate for sex.
In The superhero world, the villians are out of jail so frequently that
this is not a problem.
Mark
badth...@yahoo.com
> Prison rape comes because the convicts go so long without the opposite
> sex that they get desperate for sex.
>
and humiliation which is right up the ally of some of your more
sadistic and psychotic villains. As in the HBO prison documentary the
inmate explains you don't make a man lick your ass (tossing your
salad) for pleasure; you do it to humiliate him.
> In The superhero world, the villians are out of jail so frequently that
> this is not a problem.
>
Sadly this true. But anything under a over a week should result in
some sort of an attempt.
badth...@yahoo.com
Trust me, I had the same problem trying to type it up.
JLB
figures they'll be getting out and once out the victim may just turn
around and kill you.
f**k communism
POTENTIAL SPOILERS (if you are WAY behind in your reading):
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Mr Hyde rapes Invisible Man to death in League of Extraordinary
Gentleman.
And I believe Hulk threatens to skull-rape Giantman in an early issue
of The Ultimates.
MarkRRose
badth...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Sep 5, 4:47 pm, MarkRRose <MRosend...@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>
>>Prison rape comes because the convicts go so long without the opposite
>>sex that they get desperate for sex.
>>
>
> Rape is an act of violence, not sex. It's also an act of domination
> and humiliation which is right up the ally of some of your more
> sadistic and psychotic villains. As in the HBO prison documentary the
> inmate explains you don't make a man lick your ass (tossing your
> salad) for pleasure; you do it to humiliate him.
>
There's other ways to enforce humiliation...if there were people of the
opposite sex in the prision with them, and they could get their ass
licked by someone they'd want it from, they'd still use violence for
humiliation, but it wouldn't need to be sexual as well.
>
>>In The superhero world, the villians are out of jail so frequently that
>>this is not a problem.
>>
>
> Sadly this true. But anything under a over a week should result in
> some sort of an attempt.
>
Why? Usually when a villian hits the one week mark, it means they're
only a day or two away from their next escape.
Mark
Hand-of-Omega
> So recently we've seen an apparent spike in the rape quota in comics.
> It just used to be Red Sonja with the occasional Carol Danvers or Big
> Barda (though I hope that story of her being raped by Sleeze and
> turned into a porn star was retconned out of existence and John Byrne
> beaten for ever doing it), but now we have Sue Dibny by Dr. Light who
> confesses to being a serial rapist, Kevin Smith deciding Black Cat
> wasn't a fun loving thief but a rape victim looking for power; The
> Purple Man didn't rape Jessica Jones but obviously dozens of others,
> Ra's Al Ghul planning to rape Wonder Woman in Matt Wagner's Trinity
> and threats of rape every time I turn around now.
>
depredations were going on long before Alias, that's where the Purple
Girl came from (WEH to her, anyway?).
The only instance I can think of male prison rape in comics was John
Constantine arranging it to happen to one of the inmates when he was
incarcerated. But that doesn't really fit your criteria (no
supervillains, powers, or a fringe book, at that).
I do remember an Alan Davis drawn issue of Batman (Year 2?) where
Batman uses the threat of prison rape to convince someone to give him
info...
But don't worry, I'm sure Bendis and Millar will get around to it,
soon enough...
Dex
Terry McCombs
"I mean what happens in a prison filled with men with superpowers? We've
all seen Oz. Now imagine that on a super scale. It's not so much about
power, but dominance and given this guy just tried to take over the
world, where's the super-powered rape going on in the prisons of the DCU
and MU?"
Well, it's not DC or Marvel but at it was brought up on an episode of
The Venture Brothers when the Monarch was in prison, King Gorilla did
have all those Tarzans.
Terry
Dan McEwen
news:1189030393.8...@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com:
> Was the Black Cat actually raped in that storyline? The Purple Man's
> depredations were going on long before Alias, that's where the Purple
> Girl came from (WEH to her, anyway?).
What's weird is how Purple Girl/Persuasion's mother used his last name.
Pretty sick. Persuasion is listed as one of the 198.
The Black Guardian
> Hand-of-Omega wrote:
>> Was the Black Cat actually raped in that storyline? The Purple
>> Man's depredations were going on long before Alias, that's where
>> the Purple Girl came from (WEH to her, anyway?).
>
> What's weird is how Purple Girl/Persuasion's mother used his last
> name. Pretty sick. Persuasion is listed as one of the 198.
This brings to mind a question: Persuasion's mother--was she Purple
Man's wife... or sister?
Magnus, Robot Fighter
I don't think your average con is afraid of such luminaries as Toy
Man, The Prankster and Solomon Grundy.....wait...something's wrong
here.
-the HoSt-
<badth...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1189011377.4...@19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com...
You forgot the rape of the common reader.
You see, last time I read an issue of the Flash I felt as though I had been
raped...
H.
Dan McEwen
news:1189036585.7...@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com:
Wow, I didn't even go there. Spooky.
STRATEGY
>
> - Show quoted text -
rape in prison usually occurs as a form of retaliation for one of two
things: failure to pay for drugs or snitching.
STRATEGY
Duggy
> I'm only half-kidding about this, but given how these creators have
> decided to employ rape to make things more "realistic" it's kinda hard
> to avoid this side of it.
There are very few comics that focus on the prison life of characters,
hense it doesn't come up much.
===
= DUG.
===
Michael Wood
I understand your question. Well thought out and some good responses.
But honestly, if we want to get "young people" back into reading comics, so
that this art form continues after us, then rape and all the other trappings
of so-called realism have to be deal with in a much more circumspect way or
gotten rid of completely. We need good writing that operates at more than
one level.
I remember a story where Batman threatened one his snitches who was
obviously gay to an older reader about him being "popular in prison". That
was brilliantly written. The older readers would have picked up on the rape
threat. the younger ones viewed it as a "stool pigeon" being very unpopular
in prison. Brilliantly and elegantly done.
Michael Wood
prestorjon
> On 05 Sep 2007, badthin...@yahoo.com re-ordered random electrons to
Quite true. These places are more like Supermax prisons where the
felons are kept in their cells 23+ hours a day.
badth...@yahoo.com
> badthin...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > On Sep 5, 4:47 pm, MarkRRose <MRosend...@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >>Prison rape comes because the convicts go so long without the opposite
> >>sex that they get desperate for sex.
>
> > Rape is an act of violence, not sex. It's also an act of domination
> > and humiliation which is right up the ally of some of your more
> > sadistic and psychotic villains. As in the HBO prison documentary the
> > inmate explains you don't make a man lick your ass (tossing your
> > salad) for pleasure; you do it to humiliate him.
>
> There's other ways to enforce humiliation...if there were people of the
> opposite sex in the prision with them, and they could get their ass
> licked by someone they'd want it from, they'd still use violence for
> humiliation, but it wouldn't need to be sexual as well.
>
heterosexual man's psyche more than the sexual violation by another
man. And the "salad toss" is the worse because the victim has to
participate or die. At least with a rape you can tell yourself you
fought.
>
>
> >>In The superhero world, the villians are out of jail so frequently that
> >>this is not a problem.
>
> > Sadly this true. But anything under a over a week should result in
> > some sort of an attempt.
>
> Why? Usually when a villian hits the one week mark, it means they're
> only a day or two away from their next escape.
>
Exactly why you gotta get 'em!
badth...@yahoo.com
> On Sep 5, 12:56 pm, badthin...@yahoo.com wrote:> So recently we've seen an apparent spike in the rape quota in comics.
> > It just used to be Red Sonja with the occasional Carol Danvers or Big
> > Barda (though I hope that story of her being raped by Sleeze and
> > turned into a porn star was retconned out of existence and John Byrne
> > beaten for ever doing it), but now we have Sue Dibny by Dr. Light who
> > confesses to being a serial rapist, Kevin Smith deciding Black Cat
> > wasn't a fun loving thief but a rape victim looking for power; The
> > Purple Man didn't rape Jessica Jones but obviously dozens of others,
> > Ra's Al Ghul planning to rape Wonder Woman in Matt Wagner's Trinity
> > and threats of rape every time I turn around now.
>
> Was the Black Cat actually raped in that storyline? The Purple Man's
> depredations were going on long before Alias, that's where the Purple
> Girl came from (WEH to her, anyway?).
>
He was then killed in a car accident before she could get her revenge
so she turned this frustrated energy into...crime? Yeah, you'd think
she'd go vigilante on rapists, but not according to Kevin Smith.
badth...@yahoo.com
> <badthin...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Terry McCombs
"Male on male consensual sex is rare enough in comics. Rape is almost
unheard of, let alone in Prison. The only example I can come up with
from a superhero comic is the Mileston LS Deathwish where an intruder
raped and killed the heroes family and then raped the hero."
There was the well known incident in Wildstorm's The Authority # 14
where Superman pastiche Apollo was beaten by Captain America pastiche
The Commander, after which it was implied that the beating was followed
by a rape which was followed by a scene of revenge in which it is
implied that Batman pastiche The Midnighter in turn raped The Commander
with a jackhammer.
Terry
prestorjon
UGh thanks. Glad I missed that. Pretty typical. I guess gay men are
victims of the Women in Refrigerators syndrome too.
Lilith
Jackhammer or the world's largest vibrator?
>Terry
--
Lilith
Denny Colt
>
> There was the well known incident in Wildstorm's The Authority # 14
> where Superman pastiche Apollo was beaten by Captain America pastiche
> The Commander, after which it was implied that the beating was followed
> by a rape
The Commander raped Apollo? I didn't get that at all, nor did I assume
that Midnighter was raping the Commander with the jackhammer. Visually
it makes sense, so without rereading it I can't say it's unlikely, but
what makes you think Apollo was raped? Am I the only one who didn't
get this?
Terry.Kei...@gmail.com
> The Commander raped Apollo? I didn't get that at all, nor did I assume
> that Midnighter was raping the Commander with the jackhammer. Visually
> it makes sense, so without rereading it I can't say it's unlikely, but
> what makes you think Apollo was raped? Am I the only one who didn't
> get this?
It's not shown in graphic detail, but it's strongly implied, for a
write-up about it go to
http://www.comicvine.com/apollo/2197/
and start reading under the Violated header.
Terry
Shadowland
Yes indeed, let's make sure EVERY bit of society is degenerate.
Ruin every last vestible of decency.
Make sure there is NO WHERE to take cover, retreat.
And this may come as a shock to some, but comics used to be a retreat
for me. It was ABOVE the slime of everyday humanity.
Now a new generation has come in, savages all..and freaking ruined
even THAT for me !
Oh bravo, bravo !!
I rather see it all burn...BURN BURN BURN IT ALL !!
Lilith
wrote:
> Oh bravo, bravo !!
Dr. Wertham, would you please sit down. You're disrupting the
meeting.
--
Lilith