IBS Convention
MARIA CHIARA PADRINI
Most of the Italian instructors will exibit – between them, Liporace, Andolfo, Cappellaro, Cetorelli, Cipollini, Genotti, Padrini and Schenone (suiseki).
Bonsai demonstration of the honor guest Master Cheng Kung Cheng, for the second time in Europe after the great exhibition to the Munich World Convention .
Stage of specialization for instructors on the working of the wood.
Honor guest for the Suiseki the ESA President Mr. Willi Benz, with a course of specilitation on suiseki of the oriental countries excluded Japan (i.e, Corea, Malasya, Taiwan, …)
Demo of:
Cappellaro - Cetorelli - Cipollini - Genotti - Settembrini - Schenone (suiseki).
If you are interested to participate I can give you my assistence and book for you the Hotel
e-mails:
St...@collegioibs.it or sui...@padrini.it
nostro 6° Congresso nazionale che si terrà a Carmagnola . vicino a Torino, dal 21 al 23 settembre
Liporace, Andolfo, Cappellaro, Cetorelli, Cipollini, Genotti, Padrini and Schenone (suiseki).
Corso di specializzazione per istruttori di suiseki dell’Opsite d’onore il Maestro W. Benz Presidente dell’ESA , sul suiseki dei paesi Orientale escluso il Giappone.
Dimostrazioni di:
Cappellaro - Cetorelli - Cipollini - Genotti - Settembrini - Schenone (suiseki).
Se siete interessati a partecipare mettetevi in contatto anche per le prenotazioni dell’albergo
e-mails:
St...@collegioibs.it sui...@padrini.it
Jim Lewis
> congress of the National College of Italian Bonsai and suiseki
> Instructors
Suiseki "instructors?" What, pray, do/can they teach?
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - He who sets
an apple tree will live to see it end. He who sets a pear tree,
sets it for a friend. - Anon.
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Alan Walker
be taught about suiseki. There is the matter of geology, collecting, ethics of
collecting, standards and art of display, how to make a daiza, care and maintenance
of suiseki, etc.
Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
> > As President of IBS I'm plesed to invite you to participate to
> the 2001 congress of the National College of Italian Bonsai and suiseki
> > Instructors
>
> Suiseki "instructors?" What, pray, do/can they teach?
> Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL
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Jim Lewis
of several things to
> be taught about suiseki. There is the matter of geology,
collecting, ethics of
> collecting, standards and art of display, how to make a daiza,
care and maintenance
> of suiseki, etc.
> Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
Hmm . . . I'm a one-time geologist and tend to key in on any
"what-kind-of-rock-is-that?" discussions, and I haven't noted
much of that among suiseki-ests. And teaching mineralogy is more
something a rockhound might do than a suiseki seeker, who is less
concerned with the *kind* of rock than he is of its shape.
As for collecting, all collectors (of most anything) I know are
quite leery of telling others where they go to collect whatever
it is they collect. So teachers would tell us to look in stream
beds, old lava flows, drumlins, and ancient beaches and
waterways? End of lesson.
Ethics of collecting . . . well, I consider myself an ethicist,
especially an environmental ethicist, having taken several
graduate level courses, attended as many ethics conferences as I
can get to, and then writing about it every now and then, but I
don't see much of an ethical problem here. We/They don't pick up
EVERY rock we/they see -- unlike some gem collectors or some
generic rockhounds I've met -- and especially because the world's
total supply of suiseki-ests probably would not fill up a large
auditorium.
Display? I see VERY little to teach in display. In fact,
suiseki-ests seem to cling stubbornly to what everyone else
before them has done (polished wooden tray carved to fit the
stone, or sand-or-water-filled suiban). TRADITION reigns! And
Japanese tradition, at that.
Care and maintenance: Don't drop them on a cement floor. Dust
them occasionally. Rub stone on forehead now and then to add
some oil and gloss (or cheat, and brush on a little olive oil),
then rub them down -- the same thing you'd do to most any shiny
display object.
etc? I can't think of many. Stone shapes? Here again, someone
ELSE's imagination is the rule here as collectors slavishly go
for the same two dozen styles described in the Japanese
literature (See Bonsai Today, issue 9 for a fairly thorough list
of the accepted shapes).
All this said, I do enjoy collecting and displaying viewing
stones, especially small (under 8 inches) ones. But I don't
think there's a heckuva lot for an "instructor" to do here.
And, while I'm being a gadfly, I can't imagine how anyone can
call suiseki an "art," either (despite the insistence on the
Viewing Stone list that it is). All dictionary definitions of
art include an element of the conscious use of some skill
obtained by "experience, study, or observation." Suiseki are
objects that you collect and display in as attractive a manner as
you can devise (within the previously mentioned limit that others
must have done it that way before you). That ain't "Art." You
need a fairly good eye (and sometimes imagination), but that's
not "art." We don't "DO" anything to the stones to "improve"
them, other than maybe add some gloss to stones that naturally
lean toward that.
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - Not brave
enough to bring this up on the stones list :-) and hoping to
discuss some of this in October in Washington (or to be proven
wrong?)
MARIA CHIARA PADRINI
Might be my suiseki teaching could be very poor, but I've learned many meny
wanderful things from Mr. Matsuura, Mr. Benz. Mrs Hideko Metaxas, Mr. Felix
Rivera, and all friends from over the world who love suiseki. I , and all
Italian suiseki teachers (only Instructors not Masters) we try to spread
this knowledge in our country.
I'll be very pleased (if you will come in Italy) to show you how many
marvellous things you can meet doing suiseki and learning it.
bye
Chiara Padrini
Jim Lewis <jkl...@NETTALLY.COM> wrote in message
003801c128b9$d4477c40$97102cc7@pavilion...
Anton Nijhuis
clean up, place in conventional pot, tradition reigns...not art?
Anton
Alan Walker
to go to the symposium in Washington, if you really believe all you are saying.
colin lewis
would say this, but... ;)
Take a look at the Scholar Stones section on Dave Sampsons website and check
out the history of one of these stones: "DAIKOKU TEN ISHI" - goes back
several hundred years. Even I can see the fascination in that.
http://www.djsampson.com/historic.htm
Colin
___________
Colin Lewis
http://www.go.to/bonsai
colin lewis
>> From: Alan Walker
>> Well, Jim, I don't know what to say. I'm a bit curious as to why you're
bothering
>> to go to the symposium in Washington, if you really believe all you are
saying.
Er, don't they have some bonsai there as well?
Jim Lewis
why you're bothering
> to go to the symposium in Washington, if you really believe all
you are saying.
> Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
Why, Alan . . . to learn something, of course. I don't have to
"believe" it to learn about it. Besides, reading the agenda, a
lot of it's about the _history_ of viewing stones -- in Japan and
China (which HAS to be interesting), and then there's a critique.
Those are always fun -- if only to see if one can agree, or how
vehemently one can disagree with the one doing the critique.
Besides, as I said, I LIKE suiseki. I just have to keep my jaws
clenched to keep from laughing at all the silliness that's said
about them -- and I refuse to worship stones.
And, as Colin says, there'll be trees there, too. And, of
course, the people. And the Arboretum itself -- I can spend
hours getting lost there. LOTS of reasons to go.
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - He who sets
an apple tree will live to see it end. He who sets a pear tree,
sets it for a friend. - Anon.
********************************************************************************
Jim Lewis
learned many meny
> wanderful things from Mr. Matsuura, Mr. Benz. Mrs Hideko
Metaxas, Mr. Felix
> Rivera, and all friends from over the world who love suiseki.
I , and all
> Italian suiseki teachers (only Instructors not Masters) we try
to spread
> this knowledge in our country.
> I'll be very pleased (if you will come in Italy) to show you
how many
> marvellous things you can meet doing suiseki and learning it.
> bye
> Chiara Padrini
>
We'll be in Spain next September. Maybe I can take you up on
that. I'm always willing to hear something new.
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - Who likes
Suiseki, but just doesn't think they should be venerated.
********************************************************************************
Jim Lewis
find tree,
> clean up, place in conventional pot, tradition reigns...not
art?
>
> Anton
Ah, no . . . you DO things to a tree. You wire, trim, tilt,
twist, and torture them. You make them "better" (at least in
YOUR eyes). YOUR vision and skill -- perhaps, even, your vision
and skill as an artist, has something to do with the final tree
that people see.
Stones are supposed to be taken as Ma Nature made them. If you
DO anything to a stone -- buff it, slice it, dice it, paint it,
carve it -- people throw (inferior) stones at you.
q-( Or at least say unkind things. ;-() Or look down their
noses. :--) Or something. :-/
Hey, guys, I'm just having a little fun -- don't take me (or
stones) so seriously. They can be lovely or strange, or both, so
enjoy them for what they are.
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - He who sets
an apple tree will live to see it end. He who sets a pear tree,
sets it for a friend. - Anon.
********************************************************************************
marco favero
> > The same argument you have can also apply to collected bonsai,
>find tree,
> > clean up, place in conventional pot, tradition reigns...not
>art?
> >
> > Anton
>
>twist, and torture them. You make them "better" (at least in
>YOUR eyes). YOUR vision and skill -- perhaps, even, your vision
>and skill as an artist, has something to do with the final tree
>that people see.
Jim ,
you find,you clean, you age them ; you do a daiza,you search a good
display, you torture your mind
(and not the stone or a tree) searching in what category you must put it if
it is an abstract stone and what pleasure you can have from them.
>Stones are supposed to be taken as Ma Nature made them. If you
>DO anything to a stone -- buff it, slice it, dice it, paint it,
>carve it -- people throw (inferior) stones at you.
>q-( Or at least say unkind things. ;-() Or look down their
>noses. :--) Or something. :-/
yes .but Ma Nature sometimes is cruel ,the stone is covered totally (at
least here) and it is difficult
to discover it .
>Hey, guys, I'm just having a little fun -- don't take me (or
>stones) so seriously. They can be lovely or strange, or both, so
>enjoy them for what they are.
right ,but please don't call art only bonsai ,otherwise Mr Matsuura next
Fall will
give you a lesson ; I will ask him for this question:Is suiseki an artform?
Please listen his answer carefully , thanks.
best regards,
marco
Jim Lewis
> >stones) so seriously. They can be lovely or strange, or both,
so
> >enjoy them for what they are.
>
> right ,but please don't call art only bonsai ,otherwise Mr
Matsuura next
> Fall will
> give you a lesson ; I will ask him for this question:Is suiseki
an artform?
> Please listen his answer carefully , thanks.
I wouldn't say ONLY bonsai are art; of course not. But art is
something YOU make, with YOUR eye and YOUR skill. You can enjoy
the dickens out of suiseki, you can wax philosophical over the
images you see in the stones, or you can see them as I mostly do,
as pretty objects, often with interesting and evocative shapes,
and that also may have a very nice tactile aspect to them as
well. The fact remains that some other hand "made" them. Yours
may have been the discerning eye that saw the shape, but in MY
book at least, that's not Art.
Finding a stone, mounting it on a well-made diaza, and putting it
up for view and calling it art is like calling the frame around
the Mona Lisa and the wallpaper it is hung on the "art" -- it is
part of the presentation of a lovely object.
And I am looking forward to hearing (and listening to -- there's
a BIG difference), seeing -- and perhaps even speaking with --
Mr. Matsura.
Are you going to be there, Marco?
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - He who sets
an apple tree will live to see it end. He who sets a pear tree,
sets it for a friend. - Anon.
********************************************************************************
Bob Polk
> call suiseki an "art," either (despite the insistence on the
> Viewing Stone list that it is).
I once told my SO that Rubber Stamping was not an art and almost got my
head handed to me.
Careful where thy tread.
Old Bob in Oregon who learned his lesson.
marco favero
>I wouldn't say ONLY bonsai are art; of course not. But art is
>something YOU make, with YOUR eye and YOUR skill. You can enjoy
>the dickens out of suiseki, you can wax philosophical over the
>images you see in the stones, or you can see them as I mostly do,
>as pretty objects, often with interesting and evocative shapes,
>and that also may have a very nice tactile aspect to them as
>well. The fact remains that some other hand "made" them. Yours
>may have been the discerning eye that saw the shape, but in MY
>book at least, that's not Art.
Jim ,
you know there is even an universal art ,not created by man but by nature ;
we discuss with Lynn in the past and she reached this conclusion (I quote):
We can find the inspiration for art in the sight of something beautiful,
the urge to create with our hands something expressive to repeat it . . .
so we paint, sculpt, a representation. OR , we can have an IDEA that is a
beautiful representation of a belief or experience (music is like this) -
the idea needs a representation so that it then drives us to find that
expression of it in an object. The object will in some way reflect back to
us the idea so that we repeatedly can enjoy the beauty in just the Idea. A
work of abstract painting has somewhat that pattern to it. A rock can
reflect many ideas so basic to our human natures! It is most natural for
our "idea" arts.
Of course, this was a bit of the Zen part. What Byung Ju (A Korean
friend)said that made me think was about the patina and no-cutting. Enough
to realize this was not putting the aesthetic as the First goal, but the
spirit or essence, idealizing Nature, whereas a cut or handwork turns it
into Art the polar opposite, an aesthetic goal. (It would take pages to
resolve that dialectic, but the drift is there.)
Actually, it is just finding a way to explain that Idealogical arts are
representative of the same inclination to beauty as the hand-made products
are. I look at a painting and the aesthetic reaction is recalled; I look at
a rock and a non-material idea we create is reflected in it. We discuss the
painting as an aesthetic reaction, the rock holds a projection of our own
mind/spirit that it reflects back to us.
The only stickler will be the question of the paradigms that have been
established for rock art, and that explanation is already figured for me in
the study of Idealogical arts where the aesthetic grows in a culture's
uniformity of experience with beauty which lets them establish traditions
for the art to bring their idea art to an Ideal form.
>Finding a stone, mounting it on a well-made diaza, and putting it
>up for view and calling it art is like calling the frame around
>the Mona Lisa and the wallpaper it is hung on the "art" -- it is
>part of the presentation of a lovely object.
yes, it is like you put a frame in a painting , the art man and the nature
art ,
always to improve your emotion and feelings .
>And I am looking forward to hearing (and listening to -- there's
>a BIG difference), seeing -- and perhaps even speaking with --
>Mr. Matsura.
>
>Are you going to be there, Marco?
yes , I will look forward to meet you :-).
Clyde R. Grace
Maybe the effect of superthrive on the rocks? ;->
Smith kids
i need some help here. where i live, bonsai books are impossible to find!
so i was wondering if any of you guys(and gals) had some sources for bonsai
books fairly cheap
any and all help will be much appreciated : )
thanx
Andy
Central LA, zone 8
"never complain, never explain."
Jim Lewis
> i need some help here. where i live, bonsai books are
impossible to find!
> so i was wondering if any of you guys(and gals) had some
sources for bonsai
> books fairly cheap
> any and all help will be much appreciated : )
> thanx
Bibliofind (www.bibliofind.com) -- alas now owned by Amazon.Com
and reformatted in a very user Unfriendly way -- has page after
page of used bonsai books, including many of the classics.
Jim Lewis - jkl...@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - He who sets
an apple tree will live to see it end. He who sets a pear tree,
sets it for a friend. - Anon.
********************************************************************************
Dave Sampson
getting a bit of taste in your old age !!
Next you will be wanting to own a stone or two, or three, or four, or.....
colin lewis <bons...@BTINTERNET.COM> wrote in message
news:E15YXQ1-00052p-00@protactinium...
Alan Walker
You'll find quite an assortment of bonsai books along with photos of the covers and
reviews of the contents there.
I know a couple of folks who are working on starting a bonsai study group
and possibly a bonsai club in the Cen LA area. They will be in touch with you to
see if you are interested. You'll find it's much easier to learn bonsai with other
live people to talk to and show and tell about what's happening. Between that and
this forum, you'll learn a lot of bonsai much faster than you ever could on your
own.
Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
Geoline Havener
>The only stickler will be the question of the paradigms
>that have been established for rock art, and that explanation
>is already figured for me in the study of Idealogical arts
>where the aesthetic grows in a culture's uniformity of experience
>with beauty which lets them establish traditions
>for the art to bring their idea art to an Ideal form.
Dearest Italian Ronin,
It has been awhile since I last wrote to you. I never had the
opportunity to thank you for the beautiful, black ancestor mountain
rock which you had a friend send me last year. Please forgive my
delayed note of gratitude for your much beloved gift.
The gift was indeed special because it reminded me of the beautiful
Koolau mountains from whence I come from. There are no mountains in
the the Memphis, Tennessee area. The Arkansas rice has a strange
flavor that makes me miss the sushi bentos of Hawaii. I cannot make
sushi or good wasabi balls with Arkansas rice. The only thing that I
can use Arkansas rice for is in fried rice which is heavily seasoned
with other ingredients to temper the strange flavor of the rice. Thus,
your gift makes life more bearable because I can caress the mountain
rock with my hands and think of my grandmother and my island home.
Your gift is not just a rock for display, but a rock to be held and
loved and passed down to my son and his children. This is a rock to
be cherished among the other family heirlooms and antiques during
special celebrations like boys and girls day where we celebrate the
past, present and future. This is a rock I would be proud to display
with my ancient Hina Matsuri collection. While the imperial procession
of ningyo is for display only for a few days a year because of the
delicate condition of the ancient silks and brocade, the rock may be
lovingly caressed and appreciated for its natrural beauty as well as
it spiritual bond with all who have caressed it. When all other
ancient family treasures eventually become too fragile to place on
display, only the rock and a few potteries will survive the
generations of handling.
I am not sure how other people get their rocks off, but the rocks I
have grown to love are a part of the multi-Asian and Polynesian
cultures of my island home: from the smooth music pebbles of Hawaiian
hula, to the cavernous floating mountain scholar rocks of China, to
the smooth mountain range ancestor skin rocks commonly seen in
traditional tokonoma displays during special festive occasions like
girls' day, boys' day, new year's, et al. I can see, hear, smell and
taste the memories of these festivals.
Grazie, mahalo, arigato, doje, gamsa hammida...many thanks
for the cherished memories that your gift brings me,
Geoline (in Memphis, with a new bottle of imported Nori Tamago
Furikake to sprinkle over the imported steamed rice! Hmmm, steamed
rice will take another 30 minutes. Oh, heck with the steamed rice! I
am gonna sprinkle some on my tongue right now!)