Nagging Ranma Questions
Jeff Yang
about these technical matters, but I'VE never actually had the pleasure of
reading them...so: anybody know or care to hypothesize...
...if Ranma-chan has a regular woman's menstrual cycle? and is it
regulated by the amount of time Ranma spends as -chan, or is it
monthly--regardless of whether Ranma has actually spend a "subjective"
month as a girl?
...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
...how long does the transformation take? And is there a volume of water
that is necessary? It seems anything from a sprinkle to a near-drowning
will do. Does the transformation affect Ranma in any way, i.e. does it
take any effort or does it tire him/her? What would happen if Ranma were
to transform back and forth hundreds of times in a day?
...what would happen if Ranma stood with one foot in a bucket of hot water
and one in a bucket of cold?
...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
where does it come from when she changes back? the relativity equations
are even worse for Ryouga, Shampoo, and Mousse--if the mass were released
as energy, the greater part of the galaxy would likely be obliterated with
each "downward" transformation?
...Ranma could theoretically impregnate herself, via artificial
insemination, right? would this be, effectively, a kind of cloning? we
assume that the genetic material doesn't appreciably vary, besides the
actual gender shift, between chan and kun.
...what would happen if Ranma WERE to jump in another Jusenkyo pool? is he
correct in thinking that the drowned-man-pool will cure his condition?
...Jusenkyo water can obviously be ported--Mousse did it somehow--so what
would happen if you MIXED it? a different question from the above, note.
...there must be literally trillions of bacteria, insects, and the like
which exist in or find their ways into the Jusenkyo pools. Why don't they
transform and result in an out of control horde of creatures emanating
from the Jusenkyo region?
...does the curse end with life? If Ranma were killed as a girl, would he
have to be buried as a girl, or would hot water turn his corpse into a
male one?
...it's intimated that the curse is hereditary. (There's an episode where
Ryouga and Akane's "kids" in a fantasy future turn into little pigs when
wet.) It may even be dominant rather than recessive. If so: what happens
if Ranma and Shampoo actually do mate? Do their children become ambisexual
cat people?
...BIG PROBLEM: if Ranma turns male when soaked with hot water...but he
doesn't change his clothes (he usually doesn't)...the water will turn cold
long before it evaporates. Which means he should turn back into a girl,
right? In one episode, Ryouga turns into a pig solely because of his wet
clothes...
...is water the only thing that effects the change? what about tea, or
milk, or urine, or any number of other liquids? if it's just water, what
purity of water? if rainwater and pondwater and so forth effect the
change, so should coffee or Coke.
Hope these questions are answerable, even in the realm of the
theoretical...I'm interested in knowing what you guys think.
JOHN MARTIN KARAKASH
[ OPINIONS OPINIONS OPINIONS OPINIONS OPINIONS etc. etc. etc. etc.]
[ EXCEPT FOR THE SCIENCE ANSWERS! TRUST ME ON THOSE! ]
|>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
|>where does it come from when she changes back? the relativity equations
|>are even worse for Ryouga, Shampoo, and Mousse--if the mass were released
|>as energy, the greater part of the galaxy would likely be obliterated with
|>each "downward" transformation?
|>
Magic! (come on now... cursed mystic pools)
And you assume that the amounts of mass we are talking about are significant
on the cosmic scale. They're not. The sun converts mass to energy at the
rate of billions of tons PER SECOND! It hasn't blown up the galaxy as far
as I know. Also, while Ryouga & company might lose about 150 lbs, the far
greater change is Ranma's pop who goes from a 500-600 lb panda to about 200
lbs of human. The 'relative' quantity doesn't matter, just the total
amount of mass.
|>...Ranma could theoretically impregnate herself, via artificial
|>insemination, right? would this be, effectively, a kind of cloning? we
|>assume that the genetic material doesn't appreciably vary, besides the
|>actual gender shift, between chan and kun.
|>
No it would not be cloning, because the genes get
distributed randomly. The resultant baby would likely be defective or
stillborn, because the chances of reinforcing bad genes is truly
horrendous. This is the reason that they frown on closely related
people from producing progeny.
|>...there must be literally trillions of bacteria, insects, and the like
|>which exist in or find their ways into the Jusenkyo pools. Why don't they
|>transform and result in an out of control horde of creatures emanating
|>from the Jusenkyo region?
|>
Magic! (boy, these questions are getting easy!) But seriously,
the pools (to my knowledge) only seem to transform intelligent creatures.
Otherwise that region would have a surplus of all sorts of farm animals.
(Excuse me, I've got this earthworm, but I could really use a cow!)
|>...does the curse end with life? If Ranma were killed as a girl, would he
|>have to be buried as a girl, or would hot water turn his corpse into a
|>male one?
|>
IMO, (based on the various werewolf movies I have seen :)
He would be a he, upon death.
-john 'I haven't viewed all the episodes, but I know science' karakash-
Leslie Mills
>Now, I know that there have been hundreds of back-and-forth arguments
>about these technical matters, but I'VE never actually had the pleasure of
>reading them...so: anybody know or care to hypothesize...
>
>...if Ranma-chan has a regular woman's menstrual cycle? and is it
>regulated by the amount of time Ranma spends as -chan, or is it
>monthly--regardless of whether Ranma has actually spend a "subjective"
>month as a girl?
>
>...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
A question like this was answered in the FAQ list. A conclusion
drawn from the resulting flame war was that the author, Rumiko Takahashi
(apologies if I got her name wrong) would not write "that kind of story".
Another conclusion drawn was that Ranma-chan wouldn't get pregnant to
begin with. Irregardless of physical form, Ranma still thinks like a man
and would not get pregnant voluntarily, and his martial arts prowess would
teach any potential rapist the error of his ways.
This probably applies to the menstual cycle question as well.
>
>...how long does the transformation take?
For Ranma, it usually occurs instantly. Other characters who transform
can take varying amounts of time, depending on the authors mood (remember,
this *is* fiction, and comedy fiction at that). If Takahashi-sensei feels
that an instantaneous transformation is funnier for a given transformation,
it's instantaneous, otherwise it will be as many slow or in differing stages
as the author wants. Call it poetic license.
>And is there a volume of water
>that is necessary? It seems anything from a sprinkle to a near-drowning
>will do. Does the transformation affect Ranma in any way, i.e. does it
>take any effort or does it tire him/her? What would happen if Ranma were
>to transform back and forth hundreds of times in a day?
>
Ranma doesn't seem to suffer any ill effects from the transformations.
The worst that repeated back-and-forth transformations would do is risk
putting Ranma in shock.
>...what would happen if Ranma stood with one foot in a bucket of hot water
>and one in a bucket of cold?
Something wierd. The first thing that occurs in my mind is that he would
truly become half-man, half-girl. Again, the transformations may also cancel
each other out, and make him gender-neutral. My bet would be that he gets
both physical properties of a male and female.
>
>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
>where does it come from when she changes back? the relativity equations
>are even worse for Ryouga, Shampoo, and Mousse--if the mass were released
>as energy, the greater part of the galaxy would likely be obliterated with
>each "downward" transformation?
This isn't scientific; it's a magical, tragic ("VERRRY Tragic") curse.
>
>...Ranma could theoretically impregnate herself, via artificial
>insemination, right? would this be, effectively, a kind of cloning? we
>assume that the genetic material doesn't appreciably vary, besides the
>actual gender shift, between chan and kun.
>
>...what would happen if Ranma WERE to jump in another Jusenkyo pool? is he
>correct in thinking that the drowned-man-pool will cure his condition?
>
Ranma was splashed with a cheap imitation of the drowned-man pool, and it
effectively cured his condition -- once.
>...Jusenkyo water can obviously be ported--Mousse did it somehow--so what
>would happen if you MIXED it? a different question from the above, note.
>
You would probably become a mix of creatures.
>...there must be literally trillions of bacteria, insects, and the like
>which exist in or find their ways into the Jusenkyo pools. Why don't they
>transform and result in an out of control horde of creatures emanating
>from the Jusenkyo region?
Poetic licence again? Or perhaps the curse only affects large,
biologically-complex animals.
>
>...does the curse end with life? If Ranma were killed as a girl, would he
>have to be buried as a girl, or would hot water turn his corpse into a
>male one?
Hmmm, Vampire Transvestite Ranma...
I think the issue here is a dead one.
>
>...it's intimated that the curse is hereditary. (There's an episode where
>Ryouga and Akane's "kids" in a fantasy future turn into little pigs when
>wet.) It may even be dominant rather than recessive. If so: what happens
>if Ranma and Shampoo actually do mate? Do their children become ambisexual
>cat people?
If the curse mixes, their children would probably become female cats.
>
>...BIG PROBLEM: if Ranma turns male when soaked with hot water...but he
>doesn't change his clothes (he usually doesn't)...the water will turn cold
>long before it evaporates. Which means he should turn back into a girl,
>right? In one episode, Ryouga turns into a pig solely because of his wet
>clothes...
Again, this is poetic licence. Takahashi-sensei has never shown very much
regard for boring details like physics.
>
>...is water the only thing that effects the change? what about tea, or
>milk, or urine, or any number of other liquids? if it's just water, what
>purity of water? if rainwater and pondwater and so forth effect the
>change, so should coffee or Coke.
>
>Hope these questions are answerable, even in the realm of the
>theoretical...I'm interested in knowing what you guys think.
Most people are interested in knowing IF I think...:-)
--
Leslie Mills
If you love something, set it free. If it doesn't come back to you,
Hunt it down and kill it -- Thus sayeth a T-shirt
Sergey Shimkevich
Although I feel that such questions are best left unanswered...
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KAL Rim
And chop up the scientifics up to the four winds.
As for the part where Ranma is standing in one pail with hot water and the
other with cold, I believe that Ranma must be SPLASHED with water
for the change to come into effect.
For example, simple washing his hands, brushing his teeth or drinking
water won't initiate a change (I think...)
However if just his head or face (maybe even torso) gets splashed with
water that is sufficient to initiate a change. Even just one cup of water
or a steady spray from a water pistol is enough to do it if it hits him
in the right spot.
When he is immersed within water that counts as well since water will
be covering his entire body.
Now another question would be, what is the temperature of the water to
be considered warm or cold?
I can image Ryouga and Ranma arguing over it:
The water is cool!
It's warm!
Cool!
Warm!
Cool!
Warm!
Great taste!
Less filling!
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"Mr. Evil Dream Demon? Pleased to meet you!"
KAL Rim
we should start it off right with discussions on the stories.
My major gripe is that Kasuga is still being an indecisive wimp.
I don't understand this guy, why would he risk his sure-thing relationship
with Madoka for a possible fling with that other girl (K something...)
With Hikaru I can understand since he was still very ambiguous with
Madoka.
When she practically asks him for a date, he's saved by Madoka's
phone call. And then he lies to her by saying it's a guy friend.
He could have just said it was his girlfriend and ended it there.
No one would have gotten too hurt. But oh no! Instead he makes two dates
with two girls (on seperate days - he's learning).
Can anyone explain why Kasuga is acting this way
or will Part II tell us why?
Ryan Alexander Noguchi
>In article <C1pqz...@panix.com> jy...@panix.com (Jeff Yang) writes:
>Irregardless of physical form, Ranma still thinks like a man
>and would not get pregnant voluntarily, and his martial arts prowess would
>teach any potential rapist the error of his ways.
But, Ranma is always getting knocked unconscious (even without the
benefit of his okonomiyaki sauce or Akane's cooking :)
Also, Ranma hasn't always had that requisite male personality. In
Nettouhen 31 he actually believed he was a girl, and in...er...the
manga Vol. 23, Parts 8-10 (the koi fishing rod eps) who knows what
Ranma was thinking like?
>>What would happen if Ranma were
>>to transform back and forth hundreds of times in a day?
>Ranma doesn't seem to suffer any ill effects from the transformations.
>The worst that repeated back-and-forth transformations would do is risk
>putting Ranma in shock.
Weren't the Jusenkyou Guardians (in Nettouhen 30) trying to get rid
of the transformation power in Genma, Ranma, etc. by repeatedly dunking
them in cold and hot (but otherwise normal) water?
>>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
>>where does it come from when she changes back?
Maybe the mass is released to/from the water used to initiate the
transformation? After all, the human body is mostly water... :)
- Ryan rnog...@ernie.princeton.edu
Ryan Alexander Noguchi
>As for the part where Ranma is standing in one pail with hot water and the
>other with cold, I believe that Ranma must be SPLASHED with water
>for the change to come into effect.
>For example, simple washing his hands, brushing his teeth or drinking
>water won't initiate a change (I think...)
In the manga Vol.19 (Part 7)/Nettouhen 111 (Ukyou's okonomiyaki sauce),
Ranma drinks a whole pail of cold water and doesn't change. He drinks
it pretty fast too, so he probably did get at least some water spilled
on his face or dribbled down his shirt (I drank from a pail before so I
know it's pretty tough to do without getting wet... :)
- Ryan rnog...@ernie.princeton.edu
Ken Primer
*a bunch of very intelligent questions deleted*
Um nNobdy cares about silly little details in the works of Rumiko Takahashi.
:-)
--
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"Um...you had to eat some chuck?"| Eat a vegetarian| (217) 356-0627
-Bad Taste |*****************| I be da one dey be
<fnord> calin da mammynun
E. Kontei
>
> ...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
AAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!
[If I had one dime for every time I hear that question...]
Jeff, go read the rec.arts.anime FAQ. NOW. (Steve, you're on.)
> Hope these questions are answerable, even in the realm of the
> theoretical...I'm interested in knowing what you guys think.
Repeat after me: "It's only a TV comedy. It doesn't have to make sense.
It's only a TV comedy. It doesn't have to make sense..." ^_^
--
E n r i q u e C o n t y
Master of Science!
jes...@ihlpm.att.com
Disclaimer: You're not dealing with AT&T
ITO Takayuki
para...@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Leslie Mills) writes:
>>...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
>Another conclusion drawn was that Ranma-chan wouldn't get pregnant to
>begin with. Irregardless of physical form, Ranma still thinks like a man
>and would not get pregnant voluntarily, and his martial arts prowess would
>teach any potential rapist the error of his ways.
That's right. But, if Ranma 1/2 were an H-manga, it'd be very likely
that Ranma's friends (especially those who have no girlfriends) would
ask Ranma-chan to [CENSORED] with him. :-)
>>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
In those big breasts. :-)
BTW, I have a certain Ranma goods, that's a set of four kinds of
hot-spring mix (just like the one Shampoo had in Doujou-yaburi
episodes). They are named respectively
the hotwater of Nyan-ni-chuan (Girl drowned pool)
the hotwater of Mao-ni-chuan (Cat drowned pool)
the hotwater of Shonmao-ni-chuan (Panda drowned pool)
the hotwater of Heitouen-ni-chuan (Black pig drowned pool)
and they're illustrated with respective characters. None of them have
I ever tried since it is too scared for me.(^^;) Jeff, how about
trying them? B-)
--
ITO Takayuki <yu...@is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp>
Senior, Department of Infomation Science,
Faculty of Science, University of Tokyo, JAPAN.
Robert DeLoura
Take careful note of who brought this subject up again, so you'll know
who to blame in a couple of weeks.
That's all I'll say for now, but watch this space for further
developments.... ;-)
---
Robert DeLoura
del...@noaapmel.gov
Robert Carragher
>...Jusenkyo water can obviously be ported--Mousse did it somehow--so what
>would happen if you MIXED it? a different question from the above, note.
You would get a mixed curse. This was answered in one of the
later manga (22 or 23, I think), with a truly bizarre creature
as a result.
Bob Carragher
Michael Studte
In article <1993Feb1.0...@cc.u-tokyo.ac.jp> yu...@is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp writes:
> BTW, I have a certain Ranma goods, that's a set of four kinds of
> hot-spring mix (just like the one Shampoo had in Doujou-yaburi
> episodes). They are named respectively
>
> the hotwater of Nyan-ni-chuan (Girl drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Mao-ni-chuan (Cat drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Shonmao-ni-chuan (Panda drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Heitouen-ni-chuan (Black pig drowned pool)
>
> and they're illustrated with respective characters. None of them have
> I ever tried since it is too scared for me.(^^;) Jeff, how about
> trying them? B-)
It's actually a set of five. There's also a hot-spring mix for Moose,
although it seems that one is very hard to get hold of.
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Starbuck
> Now, I know that there have been hundreds of back-and-forth arguments
> about these technical matters, but I'VE never actually had the pleasure of
> reading them...so: anybody know or care to hypothesize...
Jeff Yang wonders alot about Ranma 1/2 and the Takahashi curses.
For you Jeff, I am reposting the Ranma What-Ifs from the FAQ.
These and other FAQ files are available on remus.rutgers.edu
(128.6.13.3) in pub/anime/faq/{anime, manga}.
Q: Can Ranma's curse be cured?
A: Yes. In one episode, Ranma obtained a mix that turned ordinary water into
"man-drown-spring" water. The water effectively cancelled the original
curse, so Ranma didn't change when wet (unfortunately, the mix was
a cheap imitation that only worked once). It is assumed that if Ranma
were able to get to Jusenkyo, and find the real "man-drown-spring",
he could remove his curse.
Q: What if Ranma fell into another pool? Would both curses be activated
at the same time?
A: No. Only one curse can be active at a time. BTW, a character was
introduced who, when splashed, transformed into a combination of
various animals, because he fell into a cursed pool where various animals
drowned together.
Q: What would happen if Ranma-chan (the female Ranma, in Japanese) got
pregnant? Would she lose her baby if she changed back to Ranma-kun
(the male Ranma)?
A: No idea. At any rate, it's very unlikely that such a thing will happen,
for a number of reasons, some of which are:
- Mentally, Ranma is still a man, whatever his physical form may be.
- Rumiko Takahashi, the author of RANMA 1/2, doesn't write that kind
of story. :-)
> Hope these questions are answerable, even in the realm of the
> theoretical...I'm interested in knowing what you guys think.
Repeat to yourself: "It's just a show, I should really just relax!"
Steve
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QUOTES: "What is Starbuck-ing?" -Adultress 19
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Miss Animerica
> Q: What if Ranma fell into another pool? Would both curses be activated
> at the same time?
> A: No. Only one curse can be active at a time. BTW, a character was
> introduced who, when splashed, transformed into a combination of
> various animals, because he fell into a cursed pool where various animals
> drowned together.
And when he doused himself with water from another spring, his curse
combined with that one. Tarou's example has answered lots of
questions about Jusenkyou...
Happousai christened the newborn Pansuto Tarou and baptized him in
Niuhoomanmaorenniichuan, where a yeti riding a bull carrying a crane
and an eel drowned 2500 years ago, turning Tarou into a baby monster
like a winged minotaur with an eel-headed tail. So, if more than one
creature drowns in the spring, you turn into a combination of them.
Also, cursed forms age.
When Tarou went back to Jusenkyou and doused himself with water from
Chanyuiniichuan, his cursed form gained tentacles and the ability to
shoot ink. So curses that don't cancel each other, combine.
He brought back water from Shannenniichuan, where a virtous man
drowned, to make Happousai virtuous. So some curses can affect the
mind.
However, the water was really from Chuanshontsuniichuan, where twins
drowned. The Chuanshontsuniichuan water doubles what it splashes.
Fortunately, when it finally hit Happousai, it only hit a bump on his
head, which turned to two bumps. So, curses do whatever the auther
wants them to do. ^_)
Chung-Mau Cheng
In article <C1pqz...@panix.com> jy...@panix.com (Jeff Yang) writes:
>>...what would happen if Ranma stood with one foot in a bucket of hot water
>>and one in a bucket of cold?
>Something wierd. The first thing that occurs in my mind is that he would
>truly become half-man, half-girl. Again, the transformations may also cancel
>each other out, and make him gender-neutral. My bet would be that he gets
>both physical properties of a male and female.
Sorry, but I don't think so. Remeber that they have to be almost
drenched in water before any transformation takes place. Putting a foot
into a bucket of water won't change anything.
>>...Jusenkyo water can obviously be ported--Mousse did it somehow--so what
>>.would happen if you MIXED it? a different question from the above, note.
>>
>You would probably become a mix of creatures.
Check out the character Pansuto Taro. He ended up in a pool where an
eel, a bull, a goose, and a gorilla drowned, and when he gets wet, he
becomes a mix of all these animals. Also, when he showed up again in
volume 23 of the manga, he had since landed into another pool, this time
with an octpus (how can an octopus drown? Beats me. :) ), and now
whenever he gets wet, he ends up as the mix plus tentacles. :D
Later,
The Chunger :)
KAL Rim
>Starbuck writes:
>> Q: What if Ranma fell into another pool? Would both curses be activated
>> at the same time?
>> A: No. Only one curse can be active at a time. BTW, a character was
>> introduced who, when splashed, transformed into a combination of
>> various animals, because he fell into a cursed pool where various animals
>> drowned together.
>
>And when he doused himself with water from another spring, his curse
>combined with that one. Tarou's example has answered lots of
>questions about Jusenkyou...
>
>Happousai christened the newborn Pansuto Tarou and baptized him in
>Niuhoomanmaorenniichuan, where a yeti riding a bull carrying a crane
>and an eel drowned 2500 years ago, turning Tarou into a baby monster
>like a winged minotaur with an eel-headed tail. So, if more than one
>creature drowns in the spring, you turn into a combination of them.
>Also, cursed forms age.
>
>When Tarou went back to Jusenkyou and doused himself with water from
>Chanyuiniichuan, his cursed form gained tentacles and the ability to
>shoot ink. So curses that don't cancel each other, combine.
Not exactly. Being splashed with one cursed water, makes your
transformation into that form. For example the time when Mousse was
trying to spash Ranma with the water that would change him into a duck,
if Ranma was hit, I am guessing it would make Ranma change into a duck
when spashed with water versus a female duck.
In the case of Pansuto Tarou, I believe Pansuto Tarou he said
that he SPRAYED himself lightly with the Octopus cursed water.
(correct me if I am wrong)
So his new cursed form gained tentacles and sprayed ink like an
Octopus or squid.
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Jeff Yang
>As far as chromosomes go: is Ranma-chan XX(female) or XY(male)?
>Although I feel that such questions are best left unanswered...
Nope. Ask every question, get every crappy answer...My guess is (and this
would solve a lot of the dumb questions I asked) s/he remains XY. That
way, while PHENOTYPICALLY female, she would not be a "breeder" (loaded
term), would not have a menstrual cycle, and would retain
testosterone-driven male aggression/bullheadedness.
But then--she'd probably grow facial hair, wouldn't she? Hell, I'll follow
the advice of others. IT'S ONLY A TV SHOW....
Jeff Yang
>In article <C1pqz...@panix.com> jy...@panix.com (Jeff Yang) writes:
>> ...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
>Take careful note of who brought this subject up again, so you'll know
>who to blame in a couple of weeks.
>That's all I'll say for now, but watch this space for further
>developments.... ;-)
Um...Did I do something...wrong? Heh heh.
See you when Internet crashes due to systems overload. :)
Honestly, tho, I'm NOT satisfied with the FAQ answers for this question.
We're reasonable, if not RATIONAL, people. Imaginative answers--I crave
them...
Jeff Yang
>In article <1993Jan31....@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca> para...@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Leslie Mills) writes:
>>In article <C1pqz...@panix.com> jy...@panix.com (Jeff Yang) writes:
>>>...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven <forbid>, got pregnant?
>>Irregardless of physical form, Ranma still thinks like a man
>>and would not get pregnant voluntarily, and his martial arts prowess would
>>teach any potential rapist the error of his ways.
>But, Ranma is always getting knocked unconscious (even without the
>benefit of his okonomiyaki sauce or Akane's cooking :)
>Also, Ranma hasn't always had that requisite male personality. In
>Nettouhen 31 he actually believed he was a girl, and in...er...the
>manga Vol. 23, Parts 8-10 (the koi fishing rod eps) who knows what
>Ranma was thinking like?
This is why I wasn't satisfied with the FAQ answer... and meanwhile, for
all of those "this is just a story" naysayers, I remember a thread that
went on FOREVER about Gundam control systems some time back when I first
jumped on this newsgroup...
>>>What would happen if Ranma were
>>>to transform back and forth hundreds of times in a day?
>>Ranma doesn't seem to suffer any ill effects from the transformations.
>>The worst that repeated back-and-forth transformations would do is risk
>>putting Ranma in shock.
>Weren't the Jusenkyou Guardians (in Nettouhen 30) trying to get rid
>of the transformation power in Genma, Ranma, etc. by repeatedly dunking
>them in cold and hot (but otherwise normal) water?
A good point, right? Meanwhile, regardless of magic, the biological
changes HAVE to have some effect--if only because one's mind is responsive
to FEEDBACK from one's body--how could Ranma-chan, with her vastly
different physiotype, be as agile and coordinated as Ranma-kun (at the
least, certain things would be gettin in the way...
Note that recently handicapped people have to retrain to attain equivalent
skills. I'd guess that losing a couple dozen pounds, having shorter arms
and legs, and, er. Breasts. Would give any martial artist pause.
>>>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
>>>where does it come from when she changes back?
>Maybe the mass is released to/from the water used to initiate the
>transformation? After all, the human body is mostly water... :)
Not possible. If the mass is released to the water, it would
evaporate--or, if conditions were right, FUSE (hi-tritium/deuterium
water?). Watch for Ranma the Human H-Bomb, coming soon...
And as for the mass being absorbed from the water, that would suggest
that, at a minimum, the mass of the water would have to be equivalent to
the mass gained in the transformation. Obviously not the case.
IT'S JUST A STORY. repeat after me...I'm trying, I'm trying...
Jeff Yang
> *a bunch of very intelligent questions deleted*
>Um nNobdy cares about silly little details in the works of Rumiko Takahashi.
>:-)
Ah--but it is the details, the details, that make her work divine...
Jeff Yang
>In article <1993Jan31....@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca>
> para...@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Leslie Mills) writes:
> >>...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
> >Another conclusion drawn was that Ranma-chan wouldn't get pregnant to
> >begin with. Irregardless of physical form, Ranma still thinks like a man
> >and would not get pregnant voluntarily, and his martial arts prowess would
> >teach any potential rapist the error of his ways.
> That's right. But, if Ranma 1/2 were an H-manga, it'd be very likely
>that Ranma's friends (especially those who have no girlfriends) would
>ask Ranma-chan to [CENSORED] with him. :-)
Well--luckily, that's not the case. (Cream Ranma?)
> >>...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl?
> In those big breasts. :-)
That's a VERY scary concept. I won't elaborate.
> BTW, I have a certain Ranma goods, that's a set of four kinds of
>hot-spring mix (just like the one Shampoo had in Doujou-yaburi
>episodes). They are named respectively
> the hotwater of Nyan-ni-chuan (Girl drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Mao-ni-chuan (Cat drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Shonmao-ni-chuan (Panda drowned pool)
> the hotwater of Heitouen-ni-chuan (Black pig drowned pool)
Umm...I got that stuff in my Takahashi Fan Starter Kit. You wouldn't
believe what I look like now...
Jeff Yang
copouts...especially the Ranma-gets-pregnant one.
Of course, that's where this silly thought-experiment is going to end up
anyway--back in copout land. But let's see where it goes along the way
there, hey?
Jeff Yang
>And when he doused himself with water from another spring, his curse
>combined with that one. Tarou's example has answered lots of
>questions about Jusenkyou...
Oops. If this is the case, then Ranma's in for a BAAAAD surprise...when
he's doused in cold water post-nannyichuan, he'll turn into...a
hermaphrodite.
As for the "water does what the author wants it to" thing, that's a
variation of "it's just a story..." but: if the water only doubles what it
hits (i.e., the bumps on Happosai's head) then Ranma should be a kind of
patchwork girlyman whenever he isn't fully immersed.
Matt Pyson
> Now, I know that there have been hundreds of back-and-forth arguments about
> these technical matters, but I'VE never actually had the pleasure of reading
> them...so: anybody know or care to hypothesize...
Gomen nasai, net.kamis, for my premeditated transgression against the holy
injunctions of netiquette never to speak of those things which are mentioned in
the FAQ!! I am only human, and cannot resist! (especially not about my favorite
show :-)
> ...if Ranma-chan has a regular woman's menstrual cycle? and is it regulated
> by the amount of time Ranma spends as -chan, or is it monthly--regardless of
> whether Ranma has actually spend a "subjective" month as a girl?
>
> ...what WOULD happen if Ranma-chan, heaven forfend, got pregnant?
Interesting thought... I'd speculate that it most likely depends on subjective
time that Ranma spends as a girl, or that it resets to the starting point every
time he changes into a girl, OR (just to be fun) that it runs along normally,
and Ranma only has a period at the proper time of the month IF he's female at
that time. Maybe Ranma's female form hasn't reached menarche yet, Ranma-chan
seems younger than Ranma-kun (at least to me). Maybe Ranma-chan is going to get
a very bad scare when she does "get it." After all, Ranma (given his wandering
childhood and total devotion to Kempo) could easily have missed Sex Ed in
school or ignored the "How Girls Are" part of it.
Of course, this subject is never mentioned in the show. None of the female
characters give any indication of dealing with their monthly period.
"W.I.R.G.P.?" Have a baby, I suppose. :-) I base this on the supposition that
the transformed bodies granted by the magic of the pools are healthy and
fully-functional in all respects. Genma-panda can eat bamboo logs, Mousse-duck
can fly, Ranma-chan could bear a child.
If you mean "What would happen if Ranma got pregnant as a girl, and then tried
to change back to a boy?" Depends on how you deal with the menstruation
idea....
0) Ranma-chan isn't a real girl, doesn't menstruate, hence can't get pregnant.
Phooey.
1) Ranma could only be pregnant while as girl, and after spending a total
period of nine months being female completes the pregnancy normally. Could
take years of story (actual) time, depending on how much Ranma manages to
stay in his male state.
2) Ranma will stay pregnant while a boy. This makes for some amusing images in
the third trimester. :-) The pregnancy continues and the magic fudges it by
making up an ectopic (non-uterine) pregnancy while Ranma is male. Delivery
while male would have to be through cesarian section, which leaves a
distinctive scar (especially distinctive for males). Either way, Ranma-kun
winds up with stretch marks from carrying the baby.
3) Ranma can (and does) get pregnant somehow while female, and immediately has
a nasty miscarriage while transforming back into a male. Not pleasant.
Alternately, fetus just "goes away" and everybody gets the willies
wondering where it went TO. :-(
> ...how long does the transformation take?
Nearly instantaneously, unless the animators want to do a sight-gag with it.
> And is there a volume of water that
> is necessary? It seems anything from a sprinkle to a near-drowning will do.
It seems to require enough water to wet the head or torso...
> Does the transformation affect Ranma in any way, i.e. does it take any effort
> or does it tire him/her? What would happen if Ranma were to transform back
> and forth hundreds of times in a day?
It doesn't seem to tire Ranma, the magic causes the transformation. Several
times, he's missed the fact that he's changed until someone else told him.
> ...what would happen if Ranma stood with one foot in a bucket of hot water
> and one in a bucket of cold?
Hmmm... Probably nothing new would happen... unless Ranma stayed female because
that would be more embarrassing to him. :-)
> ...where does all of the extra mass go when Ranma changes into a girl? where
> does it come from when she changes back? the relativity equations are even
> worse for Ryouga, Shampoo, and Mousse--if the mass were released as energy,
> the greater part of the galaxy would likely be obliterated with each
> "downward" transformation?
Nope, the magic transcends the normal limitations of physics, metaphysics too.
The mass just "goes away" during the process of transformation.
> ...Ranma could theoretically impregnate herself, via artificial insemination,
> right? would this be, effectively, a kind of cloning? we assume that the
> genetic material doesn't appreciably vary, besides the actual gender shift,
> between chan and kun.
I've always viewed Ranma in his transformed state as a version of the poor girl
who drowned in the pool in the first place, instead of a version of "Ranma-as-
a-girl" because I get the feeling that "Ranma, had he been born female" would
be much taller, leaner, and less busty than the female body he wound up with.
In the TV show, the dramatic change of hair color (from black to red) supports
this.
> ...what would happen if Ranma WERE to jump in another Jusenkyo pool? is he
> correct in thinking that the drowned-man-pool will cure his condition?
Tough one... with contradictory canon for each argument.
The feeling that I get from the show is that the new curse would displace the
previous one, with the special case being that cursing you back to your
original species would cancel out the previous curses.
This doesn't quite wash with me, because (IMHO) the simplest thing would be for
Ranma to get splashed with man-drown-spring water and then still transform --
not into a girl -- but into a different male form. But, that's the way all the
characters treat it in the show, so it's Canon... or a massive red herring.
> ...Jusenkyo water can obviously be ported--Mousse did it somehow--so what
> would happen if you MIXED it? a different question from the above, note.
>
> ...there must be literally trillions of bacteria, insects, and the like which
> exist in or find their ways into the Jusenkyo pools. Why don't they transform
> and result in an out of control horde of creatures emanating from the
> Jusenkyo region?
[Beats me. They just don't.]
> ...does the curse end with life? If Ranma were killed as a girl, would he
> have to be buried as a girl, or would hot water turn his corpse into a male
> one?
Like in old werewolf movies? Maybe if it was a Western/Christian type of
curse, but it's an Eastern/Naturalistic (Shinto? Buddist?) type of curse.
Unless that type of thing is common in Japanese folklore or Chinese legend, I'd
guess they'd just die and stay in whatever form they happened to be in,
regardless of what might happen to the body afterwards.
> ...it's intimated that the curse is hereditary. (There's an episode where
> Ryouga and Akane's "kids" in a fantasy future turn into little pigs when
> wet.) It may even be dominant rather than recessive. If so: what happens if
> Ranma and Shampoo actually do mate? Do their children become ambisexual cat
> people?
Maybe, maybe not... it was only a dream. Dreams reflect characters' emotional
states, not "reality." If Ranma (or Ryouga, or Genma) has transformation
nightmares, it says more about Ranma's fears than anything else.
Children should be totally unaffected: after all THEY never fell in one of the
springs. Or perhaps children would transform only if the mother transformed
during pregnancy. Maybe they'd get both possible curses, with a side order of
self-image phobias to round them out as characters for "Ranma 1/2: The Next
Generation."
> ...BIG PROBLEM: if Ranma turns male when soaked with hot water...but he
> doesn't change his clothes (he usually doesn't)...the water will turn cold
> long before it evaporates. Which means he should turn back into a girl,
> right? In one episode, Ryouga turns into a pig solely because of his wet
> clothes...
The thing is that the transformation is triggered by a splash of a volume of
cold water. Otherwise, Ranma-kun would change into a girl every time he put a
cold washcloth on his forehead. How about sweat in a headband? It'll have to
get cold sometime. Mere presence of moisture is not enough. It's got to be
water; not ice, not steam, not excessively humid weather; only liquid water,
and only in sufficient quantity.
Clothing and possessions are another area where continuity takes a beating. It
is never explained what happens to Ryouga's clothing and possessions (and
Mouse's clothing while we're at it) when he changes into a small animal. Does
it fall on the ground and get left behind? Does it disappear, reappearing when
human form is regained? Ryouga never seems to be at a loss for his personal
clothing, to say nothing of his backpack and umbrella. The problem is that
sometimes it works one way, sometimes it works another. Whatever is appropriate
in that situation.
> ...is water the only thing that effects the change? what about tea, or milk,
> or urine, or any number of other liquids? if it's just water, what purity of
> water? if rainwater and pondwater and so forth effect the change, so should
> coffee or Coke.
Human beings are largely made up of water, but Ranma doesn't change into a girl
every time he touches another human being. It's just water, and it needs to be
nearly as pure as naturally-occuring water. Seawater triggers the change even
though it is full of salt, minerals, and fish-poo. I'm not sure how to quantify
"hot" versus "cold" water... a rule of thumb: hot means "hotter than body
temperature" (?) and cold means anything "not hot".
Hope this gave you some food for thought. And yes, I have no life, so I spend
all my time thinking about stuff like this. :-)
---
| Matt Pyson | Ranma Nibunnoichi |
| Internet: mrp...@psuvm.psu.edu | Akane: "Who says I don't have any |
| BITNET: MRP105 AT PSUVM | femininity?!" (clobbers Ranma) |
Darin Johnson
> - Mentally, Ranma is still a man, whatever his physical form may be.
Lame excuse. Your mental state has nothing whatever to do with
if you get pregnant or not. Maybe Ranma would never voluntarily
get pregnant, but he/she can always get drunk and pass out, get
hit on the head and pass out, get raped, fall into the pool where
the pregnant lady drowned, switch form just at the critical
moment (because his dad through cold water on him to get him
to stop :-), etc.
> - Rumiko Takahashi, the author of RANMA 1/2, doesn't write that kind
> of story. :-)
This is the more likely reason. (although Kyoko got pregnant...)
--
Darin Johnson
djoh...@ucsd.edu
- I'm not a well adjusted person, but I play one on the net.
Darin Johnson
>drenched in water before any transformation takes place.
But getting a mild splash from that old lady with the ladle
converts Ranma. Not quite getting "drenched" there...
Starbuck
If someone would like to summarize the current thread, I'd be happy to
revise the thread. The Chromosome/Phenotype discussion was
particularly interesting... (Someone check the DNA on that Panda!)
Steve
---
Stephen Pearl (Starbuck) Work: (908)932-3465 Home: (908)566-6842
Internet: pe...@remus.rutgers.edu FidoNet: I need a node!
Ken Arromdee
>If you mean "What would happen if Ranma got pregnant as a girl, and then tried
>to change back to a boy?" Depends on how you deal with the menstruation
>idea....
You forgot:
4) Ranma could get pregnant as a girl. The pregnancy would only exist while
Ranma is female, but the 9 months is measured normally. (What happens if
Ranma doesn't get wet at the end of the 9 month period? I don't know.)
When Genma as a panda eats bamboo and turns back to a human, he doesn't turn
into a human with a stomach filled with a panda-sized quantity of
indigestible bamboo. This tends to support the idea that any "extras", whether
actually part of the person or not, don't hang around after the change.
Similarly, fur (which is not really a body part) on those with cursed forms
that have fur, doesn't stay around in human form.
>This doesn't quite wash with me, because (IMHO) the simplest thing would be for
>Ranma to get splashed with man-drown-spring water and then still transform --
>not into a girl -- but into a different male form. But, that's the way all the
>characters treat it in the show, so it's Canon... or a massive red herring.
Not only is it Canon, it's also explicitly done in the episode with the fake
nannichuan mix that does work, but only once. Ranma and Genma just stay
themselves when splashed. (Once.)
The change in hair color does not occur in the manga, so isn't terribly good
evidence. Similarly, episode 30, with the Jyusenkyou guardians, one of whom
has two male forms with two personalities, is not a manga story.
Other than that, if you are splashed with X water, you turn into someone who
looks somewhat like yourself except for being an X.
>Clothing and possessions are another area where continuity takes a beating. It
>is never explained what happens to Ryouga's clothing and possessions (and
>Mouse's clothing while we're at it) when he changes into a small animal. Does
>it fall on the ground and get left behind? Does it disappear, reappearing when
>human form is regained?
The same applies to Genma's glasses and robe.
It all falls to the ground. You see this very clearly in the manga and in the
first series. They probably goofed a few times in Nettouhen, but then, goofs
are goofs.
--
"On the first day after Christmas my truelove served to me... Leftover Turkey!
On the second day after Christmas my truelove served to me... Turkey Casserole
that she made from Leftover Turkey.
[days 3-4 deleted] ... Flaming Turkey Wings! ...
-- Pizza Hut commercial (and M*tlu/A*gic bait)
Ken Arromdee (arro...@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu, arro...@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu)
nsz4...@vax1.utulsa.edu
[Stuff deleted]
>
>> ...it's intimated that the curse is hereditary. (There's an episode where
>> Ryouga and Akane's "kids" in a fantasy future turn into little pigs when
>> wet.) It may even be dominant rather than recessive. If so: what happens if
>> Ranma and Shampoo actually do mate? Do their children become ambisexual cat
>> people?
>
> Maybe, maybe not... it was only a dream. Dreams reflect characters' emotional
> states, not "reality." If Ranma (or Ryouga, or Genma) has transformation
> nightmares, it says more about Ranma's fears than anything else.
>
> Children should be totally unaffected: after all THEY never fell in one of the
> springs. Or perhaps children would transform only if the mother transformed
> during pregnancy. Maybe they'd get both possible curses, with a side order of
> self-image phobias to round them out as characters for "Ranma 1/2: The Next
> Generation."
Im not totally aggree with you. Since later Takahashi sensei
introduced 3 new characters (SPOILER). They were some kind of mystic clan from
China. The leader was some kind of dragon-man thing and the rest of them were
tiger-man and wolf(or fox)-man. Their ancestors practiced various kung-fu
style that based on animal. They caught anmial and threw those animal into the
girl-cursed pool. Once the animals turned into woman, those weird people mated
with them. So their sons would have a characteristic of the animal that they
had mated with. Thus it means that children can be affected by their
parents'condition(curses).
"Magic works in a mysterious way"
Paul M. Aoki
>In article <C1pqz...@panix.com>, jy...@panix.com (Jeff Yang) says:
>> Now, I know that there have been hundreds of back-and-forth arguments about
[...]
>Hope this gave you some food for thought. And yes, I have no life, so I spend
>all my time thinking about stuff like this. :-)
Since this instance of the "Ranma-chan gets preggers" bit has dragged on
for quite a while (hint hint ^_^), I'm going to interject the following
bit of r.a.a history to show the extent to which this subject has already
been pondered -- and by Persons Much Weirder Than You ^_^, to boot.
Subject: Re: Shampoo's Sexuality
Date: 27 Sep 90 23:57:19 GMT
To take this one step further: what if Shampoo gets pregnant by Ranma?
Of course now the sexuality becomes a genetic issue. Since a person like
Shampoo can change into a completely different organism, it is very likely
that the mechanism is genetically coded, and equally true that the acquired
trait can be passed down to her offspring. In that case, and if the child's
father is Ranma, we'll have several possibilities.
1) nothing will happen. The child grows up happily with 2 mothers and a cat.
2) Nianni-genes dominates Maoni-genes if the child happens to be a boy, or
Maoni over Nianni if it's a she. (very interesting. The fetus may remain
in cat form during the entire pregnancy).
3) The child turns into a cat of the opposite sex (composite effect.) That
would be very disturbing indeed, but not as much as .......
4) hello kitty.
d.n.a.b.
--
Paul M. Aoki | CS Div., Dept. of EECS, UCB | ao...@postgres.Berkeley.EDU
| Berkeley, CA 94720 | ...!uunet!ucbvax!aoki
Starbuck
> If someone would like to summarize the current thread, I'd be happy to
> revise the thread. The Chromosome/Phenotype discussion was
> particularly interesting... (Someone check the DNA on that Panda!)
That should be revise the FAQ.
christian gadeken
>
>But when you named as your subhead Shampoo's Sexuality, I thought you were
>going to be discussing sexuality as in sexual orientation--which made me
>wonder: Shampoo is perhaps the only Ranma character that no longer seems
>to give a damn whether Ranma is male or female when she leaps bodily upon
>him/her...
Actually, there is is one other:Ukyou. In fact, Ukyou had the most
understated reaction of anyone to the truth:She just asked "You're
Ranma?" in a normal tone of voice; THEN, next scene, she was switching
Ranma back and forth and saying "This is fun no matter how many times
I do it!"
--
C h r i s t i a n G a d e k e n
Yakumo: "But I really did destroy a monster in Hong Kong!
Saru : "Ahem, ahem"
Yakumo: "Saru, do you believe me?"
Saru : "Where's my Hong Kong souvenir?"
Jeff Yang
> 4) hello kitty.
This made me laugh my little ass off.
But when you named as your subhead Shampoo's Sexuality, I thought you were
going to be discussing sexuality as in sexual orientation--which made me
wonder: Shampoo is perhaps the only Ranma character that no longer seems
to give a damn whether Ranma is male or female when she leaps bodily upon
him/her...most of her efforts to obtain the Jusenkyo water are dedicated
toward the curing of her own curse, not the resolving of his. So
conceivably, Shampoo and Ranma--if they ever got together--would be party
to a VERY progressive relationship indeed. Or what?
Ken Arromdee
> Im not totally aggree with you. Since later Takahashi sensei
>introduced 3 new characters (SPOILER). They were some kind of mystic clan from
>China. The leader was some kind of dragon-man thing and the rest of them were
>tiger-man and wolf(or fox)-man. Their ancestors practiced various kung-fu
>style that based on animal. They caught anmial and threw those animal into the
>girl-cursed pool. Once the animals turned into woman, those weird people mated
>with them. So their sons would have a characteristic of the animal that they
>had mated with. Thus it means that children can be affected by their
>parents'condition(curses).
WRONG, at least if the story (which I haven't read) is as you describe.
Their animal forms, in the story you describe, are their _un_cursed condition,
with human as their cursed condition. If the children are half animal and
half human, that means the children are _not_ affected by the curses, not that
they _are_.
ChaOs
(Why do I have the feeling i'm going to regret gtting involved in this?)
Ranma was fully immersed in the spring, so he turns fully into a girl...
Happosai only got a little water on the bump on his head, so only the
bump doubled.
Presumably, therefore, if someone were only to get splashed with the
original springwater, only part of him/her/it would change. ("Uh, Bob? Why do
you have a duck's foot?" "Shut up, Pete.")
Then again...maybe I shouldn't have introduced logic into this
discussion...
--
Jeff (ChaOs) Johnston Je...@yang.earlham.edu
Michael Edwards
> [Stuff deleted]
> Im not totally aggree with you. Since later Takahashi sensei
> introduced 3 new characters (SPOILER). They were some kind of mystic clan from
> China. The leader was some kind of dragon-man thing and the rest of them were
> tiger-man and wolf(or fox)-man. Their ancestors practiced various kung-fu
> style that based on animal. They caught anmial and threw those animal into the
> girl-cursed pool. Once the animals turned into woman, those weird people mated
> with them. So their sons would have a characteristic of the animal that they
> had mated with. Thus it means that children can be affected by their
> parents'condition(curses).
Hang on I didn't think this was quite how this went... I missed most of the
episodes except for the last two in SSunday but I'm sure Iain's description
of what happened was different... Can someone confirm this? [Someone who
can read Japanese?]
Michael
[Damn now I want Vol 24 to be published...]
--
Michael Edwards "...and if you win, everyone dies." mich...@nsg.com.au
Sydney, Australia
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