Why do some people hate FY's Miaka Yuuki?
Sarah Davis
micha...@hotmail.com wrote in message <822coi$nhu$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
>some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
Because she's idealized and stereotyped. Miaka's world is a fantasy world.
All the men become fixated with her, either romantically (too many to list),
as friends (yet more), or as enemies (lots of 'em). She consistently does
stupid things to "help" others, thus setting up bad subplots about Tamahome
having to save her, sometimes several times in a single episode. She also
received the absolute minimum character development possible, never
outgrowing her role as the clumsy-but-sweet lead character. She's a
fairytale princess without the depth of a kiddie pool. Miaka is not real
enough to be likable, as far as I'm concerned. She's friendly, giving, and
loving, but do those qualities make up for an utter lack of uniqueness and
intensity? The few times there was room for her to develop, the story
resorted to slapstick quality. Yui's plight was more moving because she was
flawed as a person, and thus more complete as a character. Yui didn't always
do the right thing, whereas Miaka never did the wrong thing. That gets
tiresome. Who can relate to a character whose only flaw is that she's too
nice?
Personally, I just got tired of seeing her all the time. The series left
some potentially fascinating characters woefully underdeveloped
(*cough*Tomo*cough*), choosing to focus on Miaka and Tamahome getting
together and breaking up time and time again. By the end, I really didn't
care about either of them and found the preoccupation the rest of the
characters had with their happiness to be nothing short of nauseating. Miaka
almost ruined the series for me.
I don't *hate* Miaka, mind you. I just think she's the least interesting
major character from the story. I'd take Miboshi over Miaka.
Sarah
micha...@hotmail.com
some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
Mike Rhea
http://rei.animenetwork.com/ranchan/
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Animeg3282
>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
>some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
>
She is stupid, but she doesn't grow a brain as she goes along, like Usagi, and
therefore doesn't get to be as endearing. She also goes along with the stupid
'only morons get boys' sterotype. That's very irresponsible, with so many young
girls wacthing.
Hana no Kaitou
Pledged to the Way of the Wimp
Cause of the month: Pastel Yumi
http://members.aol.com/Animeg3282/index.html ,
http://members.aol.com/animeg3282/page5/index.htm<--Please visit both my main
home page, and Fancy Lala fanclub.
Michael Borgwardt
micha...@hotmail.com writes:
> I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
> some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
Um... how can anyone *not* hate that whiny, annoying excuse for a
character?
You should have heard me cheering when she almost managed to
commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
--
Michael "Brazil" Borgwardt --- Member of #WASHU# and Her would-be guinea-pig.
Untiring defender of Washu-chan, Asuka-chan and Elektra-chan.
A Homepage for Elektra: http://www.informatik.tu-muenchen.de/~borgward/
ANT - Animeclub fuer Deutschland: http://www.anime.no.tomodachi.de/
--------------- Let`s shake the dew off this lily, shall we ? ---------------
Alistair Chiu
This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life. Everything that's been said so
far has confirmed everything I hate about Miaka - I could just tell
how things were going to pan out with her. And what I hate about
contrived plots.
Now Yurika, though only slightly less annoying, at least appears to be
getting what she deserves. A harsh way to put it perhaps; what I mean
is this: she hasn't so far been magically protected by the
contrivances of the plotline from suffering the consequences of her
own personality. So I'll stick with Nadesico, for the moment.
It's extremely annoying when major themes or character flaws aren't
drawn out to their logical conclusion *coughEscaflownecough*, doubly
so when it's the annoying parts of a show that are allowed to pass so
unrealistically.
For the record, I've watched episodes 1-4? and 11-13 or something like
that of FY, and 1-5 of Nadesico.
--
Alistair.
vanfanel
borg...@informatik.tu-muenchen.de (Michael Borgwardt) wrote:
> Um... how can anyone *not* hate that whiny, annoying excuse for a
> character?
I liked Miaka from the first time she slapped Nuriko back in episode 4.
I think she's stronger than most people give her credit for, and I just
like her personality. As for not ever doing the wrong thing (as
somebody else mentioned), I think that's debatable, though I'm really
more bored by "flawed protagonists" lately than I am idealistic heroes.
I'm tired of just relating; I want to be inspired. That being said...
> You should have heard me cheering when she almost managed to
> commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
herself, drowned herself, tried to let a "doctor" knife her, etc.,
etc., etc. This does seem a little irresponsible in a show aimed at
early teens. Passions run very high at that age, and I'd hate to be
guilty of doing anything that makes suicide look like an attractive way
out of something.
--Daniel Huddleston
whose opinions are his own, and who isn't speaking for any of the
organizations he may write for
Fish Eye No Miko
>*grin*
>
>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
>episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life.
Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in the show.
Catherine Johnson.
--
Remove "3AT" to reply
"Angel Investigations; we hope you're helpless."
-Doyle, _Angel_
Derek Janssen
> >some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
>
> All the men become fixated with her, either romantically (too many to list),
> as friends (yet more), or as enemies (lots of 'em).
> Yui didn't always
> do the right thing, whereas Miaka never did the wrong thing. That gets
> tiresome. Who can relate to a character whose only flaw is that she's too
> nice?
>
> major character from the story. I'd take Miboshi over Miaka.
Speaking for only the casual watchers, I don't mind Miaka--
In fact, given that--although the background and trappings are pretty to
look at--most of the story and scripting isn't what you'd call,
well...*original*, if Miaka WAS the flawlesss ideal of kawaii-dom that
most shoujou heroines (ahemcoughCCScough) are, or that a 100% period
show would require, the series would deflate pretty quickly.
As it is, I LIKE Miaka's SD bursts of Usagi-cloned klutziness and their
jarring ability to drag all the other characters momentarily into the SD
realm with her:
It reminds me not to take the show as seriously, and puts me in the
right "cute" frame of mind to accept all the other more by-the-numbers
serious/romantic elements of the storyline.
Derek Janssen
dja...@ultranet.com
Fish Eye No Miko
>In article <8235ok$17c$1...@sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de>,
> borg...@informatik.tu-muenchen.de (Michael Borgwardt) wrote:
>
>> You should have heard me cheering when she almost managed to
>> commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
>
>My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
>to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
>herself,
That was self-sacrifice, not suicide.
>drowned herself, tried to let a "doctor" knife her, etc., etc., etc.
The doctor thing is a bit iffy, too... She was already ill, wasn't she?
And, supposedly, that was the only cure.
Having said that, though, I think your point is valid; Miaka does seem to be
the poster girl for offing yourself as a way out of your problems.
Catherine Johnson. o/~ "Come on baby, don't fear the reaper..." o/~
Sarah Davis
Derek Janssen wrote in message <384580C7...@ultranet.com>...
>Speaking for only the casual watchers, I don't mind Miaka--
Some people love her. To each his own...
>In fact, given that--although the background and trappings are pretty to
>look at--most of the story and scripting isn't what you'd call,
>well...*original*,
The story isn't bad. Not terribly original, as you mention, but not bad.
It's the characters that make a series like this more than "pretty to look
at." (So to speak.) I'm a devout fan of the villains because some of them
are *very* original. I can even find room to like Ashitare and Miboshi, the
two most despised characters from the series, because they interest me. If I
were to rely on the heroes and story to keep me watching FY, I'd probably
never have finished it.
>As it is, I LIKE Miaka's SD bursts of Usagi-cloned klutziness and their
>jarring ability to drag all the other characters momentarily into the SD
>realm with her:
It can be very amusing when done at the right time. But as people who have
seen the whole series will recall, there was at least one time when Miaka
went SD at a very BAD time and cheapened a major subplot. FY walked the thin
line between comedy and drama, but it did so too unevenly, jumping around in
erratic frenzy. Whereas you liked to be reminded not to take it too
seriously, I found that same aspect of the show very vexing.
Sarah
Galen Musbach
> >My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
> >to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
> >herself,
>
> to be the poster girl for offing yourself as a way out of your problems.
>
> Catherine Johnson. o/~ "Come on baby, don't fear the reaper..." o/~
> --
what does she have to live *for*? If life is a burden of duty
without hope of joy, can death be worse?
-Galen
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Sarah Davis
Animeg3282 wrote in message
<19991201220150...@ng-fv1.aol.com>...
>Galen said:
>
>>It's understandable really; consider Miaka,
>>what does she have to live *for*? If life is a burden of duty
>>without hope of joy, can death be worse?
>
about
>how to make her own joy? ^_-
But if she had a brain, what ever would become of Tamahome? He'd be useless
to her!
Sarah
Fish Eye No Miko
>> >My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem
>> >seems to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's
>> >stabbed herself,
>>
>> Having said that, though, I think your point is valid; Miaka does seem
>> to be the poster girl for offing yourself as a way out of your problems.
>>
>> Catherine Johnson. o/~ "Come on baby, don't fear the reaper..." o/~
>>
>It's understandable really; consider Miaka,
>what does she have to live *for*? If life is a burden of duty
>without hope of joy, can death be worse?
Yes. Some people realize that duty is important. And, yes, I know she's
only 15, but that's all the more reason not to kill herself... How does she
know they'll be no "hope of joy"? She has friends who care for her, and a
world she can try to get home to (where she also has people who love her).
To say he life is going to be nothing but duty without joy seems really
short sighted. I mean, even if, say, Tamahome died, she *15*... She's
never gonna meet another guy who loves her?? *coughHotohoricough*
Catherine Johnson.
Fish Eye No Miko
>Derek Janssen wrote in message <384580C7...@ultranet.com>...
>
>>As it is, I LIKE Miaka's SD bursts of Usagi-cloned klutziness
>>and their jarring ability to drag all the other characters momentarily
>>into the SD realm with her:
>
>It can be very amusing when done at the right time. But as people who
>have seen the whole series will recall, there was at least one time when
>Miaka went SD at a very BAD time and cheapened a major subplot. FY
>walked the thin line between comedy and drama, but it did so too unevenly,
> jumping around in erratic frenzy. Whereas you liked to be reminded not to
>take it too seriously, I found that same aspect of the show very vexing.
I agree. I think the show DID try to be serious at times, and the SD really
gets in the way. there's a time and a place for SD in almost every show,
but FY had a habit of putting it in places I thought were fairly
inappropriately.
Edwin Koshimoto
>
>Yes. Some people realize that duty is important. And, yes, I know she's
>only 15, but that's all the more reason not to kill herself... How does
>she
>know they'll be no "hope of joy"? She has friends who care for her, and a
>world she can try to get home to (where she also has people who love her).
>To say he life is going to be nothing but duty without joy seems really
>short sighted. I mean, even if, say, Tamahome died, she *15*... She's
>never gonna meet another guy who loves her?? *coughHotohoricough*
>
>Catherine Johnson.
>
Well, the only thing I have to say about this is that the author implies
that Miaka and Tamahome are destined to be with each other and only
to each other... (all the astrology references) This transcends through
both the alternative universe and reality, or at least that's what Miaka
feels is true.
I believe that Miaka 'ran away' into the book because she hated her
'normal life' with the entrance exams and the family problems (mom is
divorced). Not to say that she is really helping herself by running
away but stay with the rest of the anime...
I think the ending (the ending of the manga is the ending of the OVA
series) is worth waiting for. Yup, only 26 TV episodes and then an
entire OVA series away! ^_^ To be fair the released stuff is around
manga vol 9 out of a total of 18. A lot gets revealed along the way.
Also, I believe the target audience of this were teenage girls? I
believe the author herself was barely 20 when she wrote the entire
series? I'm kinda impressed with the depth and breadth of the series
taken from that particular viewpoint ^_-
ed
Sarah Davis
Edwin Koshimoto wrote in message ...
>I think the ending (the ending of the manga is the ending of the OVA
>series) is worth waiting for. Yup, only 26 TV episodes and then an
>entire OVA series away! ^_^ To be fair the released stuff is around
>manga vol 9 out of a total of 18. A lot gets revealed along the way.
But there are some of us who have seen the whole anime, read the whole
manga, grabbed all those novels, and visited tons of websites trying to
justify Miaka, and still manage to think she's an ineffectual character. She
is like a shadow puppet, flat and utterly without depth. She has form, but
it is superficial. She has action, but it is not her own. An idle mockery of
reality.
Sarah
Joey and his Akane hammer
>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),
I can't.
>but why do
>some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
Well, she's ditzy, runs away, cries alot, and never makes any sense^^;; There's
more reason not to like her then to like her. But I like her anyway.
>
>
>Mike Rhea
>http://rei.animenetwork.com/ranchan/
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
>
>
-Joey, who's now got 3 new manga to be obsessed with. Family Compo(even if it's
written mostly in furigana-less kanji~_~), One Piece(OMG.. it's so cool..), and
most of all, Meitantei Conan! OMG OMG, Great Detective Conan is just..
wonderful.. DAISUKI!!
Animeg3282
>It's understandable really; consider Miaka,
>what does she have to live *for*? If life is a burden of duty
>without hope of joy, can death be worse?
The hope that she might someday grow a brain, therefore giving her ideas about
how to make her own joy? ^_-
Hana no Kaitou
Kevin Pezzano
wrote:
*potential spoilers for Escaflowne, if you're really picky*
>It's extremely annoying when major themes or character flaws aren't
>drawn out to their logical conclusion *coughEscaflownecough*, doubly
>so when it's the annoying parts of a show that are allowed to pass so
>unrealistically.
>
I always thought that Escaflowne's ending left a little to be desired,
but what major themes and/or character flaws in that series did you
think weren't drawn out to their logical conclusion?
I'm kinda curious.
Alistair Chiu
<fisheye3...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>Alistair Chiu wrote in message <38452431...@news.zipworld.com.au>...
>
>>*grin*
>>
>>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
>>episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life.
>
>Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in the show.
Granted, and I know there are a lot of people that adore this show.
But, if I'm going to be screaming at the writer for doing awful things
to the characterisation just to move the plot along, and having to
endure the various characters as well as other inconsistencies, will
it be worth it? Will I be able to take the serious parts seriously?
(same problem I had with the original Slayers)
On top of that, it's a long series. 26 hours is a heavy investment.
Maybe some day, when I have some hours to throw away...
--
Alistair.
Alistair Chiu
Um, I'll have to go to work and dig out that old email about it. Just
briefly, it's basically the serious nature of developments in the show
- mainly of war. Given what it started, I don't think it finished it
consistently. Instead, it wimps out. I'll find that email and post it
- I was a lot more eloquent in that. ^_^
--
Alistair.
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <822coi$nhu$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, micha...@hotmail.com wrote:
>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
That I really can't, if you've read the entire breadth of the manga series.
She's easily the most consistently selfless character there.
Arnold Kim
Michael Borgwardt
"Fish Eye No Miko" <fisheye3...@mindspring.com> writes:
>>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
>>episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life.
>
> Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in the show.
Still, you'll have to admit that hating the main character who gets the
most screen time by far *would* be a serious deterrent.
But you're right, it's not on a level where I wouldn't watch it; it's
entertaining enough if one ignores Miaka.
Michael Borgwardt
vanfanel <alse...@my-deja.com> writes:
>> You should have heard me cheering when she almost managed to
>> commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
>
> My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
> to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
[]
> etc., etc. This does seem a little irresponsible in a show aimed at
> early teens.
What I find *really* bad is the basic message her character sends out:
"It's OK to be lazy, irresponsible and stupid, no harm will come from it
and everything will turn out OK if only your intentions are good."
It's also one reason why I dislike Sailor Moon.
What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
friends killed).
Galen Musbach
Michael Borgwardt wrote:
>
> What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
> Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
> friends killed).
>
Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
Animeg3282
>But if she had a brain, what ever would become of Tamahome? He'd be useless
>to her!
>
Well, she'd still have her hormones, so maybe they could get have sex or
something! ^_^;; What else is Tamahome good for? :P
Carl Benson
>
> vanfanel wrote in message <8243ii$vmd$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
> >In article <8235ok$17c$1...@sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de>,
> > borg...@informatik.tu-muenchen.de (Michael Borgwardt) wrote:
> >
> >> commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
> >
> >My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
> >to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
>
> That was self-sacrifice, not suicide.
>
> >drowned herself, tried to let a "doctor" knife her, etc., etc., etc.
>
> The doctor thing is a bit iffy, too... She was already ill, wasn't she?
> And, supposedly, that was the only cure.
> the poster girl for offing yourself as a way out of your problems.
>
> Catherine Johnson. o/~ "Come on baby, don't fear the reaper..." o/~
Oooh, BOC! I love 'em. Seriously, suicide is not news to
Japanese teens. I watch the news from Japan sometimes, and
teen suicide is an ongoing problem there. The news does
tend to sensationalize it, though.
--CarlB
Matt Martin
micha...@hotmail.com <micha...@hotmail.com> imparted the
following wisdom unto us:
> I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
> some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
Because she can be rather annoying, and has virtually no character
development. She stays practically clueless until the end, and she
still hasn't grown up much even then.
And she sounds like the pink spawn of evil, Chibi-Usa...
(Yes I know it's Araki Kae in both roles.)
It's really easy to get sick of "Miaka!" "Tamahome!" "Miaka!"
"Tamahome!" all the time too.
Even with this, though, I still like FY. Guess it's the Tasuki,
Chichiri, and Nuriko factor...
--
Matt Martin / buf...@yggdrasil.dhs.org
Visit the University of Richmond Japanese Anime Club home page:
http://www.student.richmond.edu/~anime
------------------------------------------------------------------------
$100 invested at 7% interest for 100 years will become $100,000, at
which time it will be worth absolutely nothing.
-- Lazarus Long, "Time Enough for Love"
Alistair Chiu
(Michael Borgwardt) wrote:
>In article <8243ii$vmd$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> vanfanel <alse...@my-deja.com> writes:
>
>>> You should have heard me cheering when she almost managed to
>>> commit suicide... but she's too incompetent even for that.
>>
>> My big problem with Miaka is that her solution to every problem seems
>> to involve exactly that: committing suicide. So far, she's stabbed
>[]
>> etc., etc. This does seem a little irresponsible in a show aimed at
>> early teens.
>
>What I find *really* bad is the basic message her character sends out:
>"It's OK to be lazy, irresponsible and stupid, no harm will come from it
> and everything will turn out OK if only your intentions are good."
>It's also one reason why I dislike Sailor Moon.
>
>What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
>friends killed).
Couldn't agree more. Actually, books tend to be better at this sort of
logical consistency than TV. Read any Robert Jordan lately?
--
Alistair.
Animeg3282
>*grin*
>
>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
>episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life. Everything that's been said so
>far has confirmed everything I hate about Miaka - I could just tell
>how things were going to pan out with her. And what I hate about
>contrived plots.
>
>Now Yurika, though only slightly less annoying, at least appears to be
>getting what she deserves. A harsh way to put it perhaps; what I mean
>is this: she hasn't so far been magically protected by the
>contrivances of the plotline from suffering the consequences of her
>own personality. So I'll stick with Nadesico, for the moment.
>
>It's extremely annoying when major themes or character flaws aren't
>drawn out to their logical conclusion *coughEscaflownecough*, doubly
>so when it's the annoying parts of a show that are allowed to pass so
>unrealistically.
>
>For the record, I've watched episodes 1-4? and 11-13 or something like
>that of FY, and 1-5 of Nadesico
I wacthed all of FY, but I couldn't wacth it more than once because of Miaka.
Animeg3282
>What I find *really* bad is the basic message her character sends out:
>"It's OK to be lazy, irresponsible and stupid, no harm will come from it
> and everything will turn out OK if only your intentions are good."
>It's also one reason why I dislike Sailor Moon.
Hey, at least Usagi grows a brain! That's more than Miaka can say for herself.
Also, Usagi's missteps seem more a case of too nice, than too stupid.
Jerico Mele
show.>
Just about all the other characters are good. They more than make up for
Miaka, who by the time I was halfway done, had grown on me. Much like a
fungus or possibly virus. She's the girl I love to hate, though she does
fine by the end of the series.
Jerico
Fish Eye No Miko
<825cmq$ofv$3...@sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de>...
>What I find *really* bad is the basic message her character sends
>out: "It's OK to be lazy, irresponsible and stupid, no harm will come
>from it and everything will turn out OK if only your intentions are
>good." It's also one reason why I dislike Sailor Moon.
>
>What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of
>her friends killed).
Wow, you haven't seen much of the show, huh...?
Catherine Johnson. Saying any more would be a spoiler.
Fish Eye No Miko
><Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in the
>show.>
>
>Just about all the other characters are good. They more than make up
>for Miaka, who by the time I was halfway done, had grown on me. Much
>like a fungus or possibly virus.
Or cancer!
Catherine Johnson.
Jerico Mele
Yeah, cancer works.
*blinks*
Nevermind.
Jerico
Fish Eye No Miko
>On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:12:13 -0700, "Fish Eye No Miko"
><fisheye3...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>Alistair Chiu wrote in message <38452431...@news.zipworld.com.au>...
>>
>>>*grin*
>>>
>>>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch
>>>another episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life.
>>
>>Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in
>>the show.
>
>Granted, and I know there are a lot of people that adore this show.
>But, if I'm going to be screaming at the writer for doing awful things
>to the characterisation just to move the plot along, and having to
>endure the various characters as well as other inconsistencies, will
>it be worth it? Will I be able to take the serious parts seriously?
>(same problem I had with the original Slayers)
I don't know...
>On top of that, it's a long series. 26 hours is a heavy investment.
It is?
>Maybe some day, when I have some hours to throw away...
I've bot nothing but time right now... d-:
Fish Eye No Miko
>>Yes. Some people realize that duty is important. And, yes, I
>>know she's only 15, but that's all the more reason not to kill herself...
>>How does she know they'll be no "hope of joy"? She has friends
>>who care for her, and a world she can try to get home to (where she
>>also has people who love her). To say he life is going to be nothing
>>but duty without joy seems really short sighted. I mean, even if, say,
>>Tamahome died, she *15*... She's never gonna meet another guy who
>>loves her?? *coughHotohoricough*
>
>Well, the only thing I have to say about this is that the author implies
>that Miaka and Tamahome are destined to be with each other and only
>to each other... (all the astrology references) This transcends through
>both the alternative universe and reality, or at least that's what Miaka
>feels is true.
Ok, so she won't have a boyfriend. So?
>I believe that Miaka 'ran away' into the book because she hated her
>'normal life' with the entrance exams and the family problems (mom is
>divorced).
Ummm.. She ended up in tehre by accident the first time. Later, she wnet
in to get Yui.
>Not to say that she is really helping herself by running
>away but stay with the rest of the anime...
I plan to.
>I think the ending (the ending of the manga is the ending of the OVA
>series) is worth waiting for. Yup, only 26 TV episodes and then an
>entire OVA series away! ^_^ To be fair the released stuff is around
>manga vol 9 out of a total of 18. A lot gets revealed along the way.
I know, I'ver ead plot synopses.
Fish Eye No Miko
>In article <823u8e$emq$1...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net>,
> "Fish Eye No Miko" <fisheye3...@mindspring.com> writes:
>
>>>This has all confirmed me in my decision to never watch another
>>>episode of Fushigi Yuugi in my life.
>>
>> Which is sad, cuz there are a lot of OTHER good characters in the show.
>
>Still, you'll have to admit that hating the main character who gets the
>most screen time by far *would* be a serious deterrent.
You're right... This is why I don't watch much of the original _Star Trek_
series...
Sarah Davis
Fish Eye No Miko wrote in message <827o9e$2ui$1...@nntp5.atl.mindspring.net>...
>Edwin Koshimoto wrote in message ...
>
>>'normal life' with the entrance exams and the family problems (mom is
>>divorced).
>
>Ummm.. She ended up in tehre by accident the first time. Later, she wnet
>in to get Yui.
In the manga, she goes in the second time because her mother slaps her
across the face and yells at her when Miaka is angered by seeing her
(divorced) mother with a new boyfriend. She enters the book three separate
times in the manga, whereas in the anime she does this only twice (excluding
OVAs/second series in both cases).
Sarah
Fish Eye No Miko
>Fish Eye No Miko wrote in message
<827o9e$2ui$1...@nntp5.atl.mindspring.net>...
>>Edwin Koshimoto wrote in message ...
>>
>>>I believe that Miaka 'ran away' into the book because she hated her
>>>'normal life' with the entrance exams and the family problems (mom is
>>>divorced).
>>
>>Ummm.. She ended up in tehre by accident the first time. Later, she wnet
>>in to get Yui.
>
>In the manga, she goes in the second time because her mother slaps
>her across the face and yells at her when Miaka is angered by seeing
>her (divorced) mother with a new boyfriend.
Ooohh.. Ok. Thanks for the info.
Michael Borgwardt
Galen Musbach <musb...@xtn.net> writes:
>> What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>> Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
>> friends killed).
>>
> Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
Uh... really???
Is that a game? Because the two OAV episodes were just about the most
stupid anime I'd ever seen, *much* worse than anything Miaka does...
Michael Borgwardt
geda...@remove.spam.filter.arigatou.zipworld.com.au (Alistair Chiu) writes:
>>What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>>Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
>>friends killed).
>
> Couldn't agree more. Actually, books tend to be better at this sort of
> logical consistency than TV. Read any Robert Jordan lately?
:) Now that you mention it... I'm currently in the process of completing
my WoT collection. Volumes 4 and 7 arrived yesterday :)
Though I don't seehow the above would apply, at least to WoT. The females
in there all seem rather scarily un-Miaka-like. Of course, there could
easily be something I don't remember right away in that
most-impressive-of-all-fantay-cycles...
Galen Musbach
Michael Borgwardt wrote:
> Galen Musbach <musb...@xtn.net> writes:
>
> >> What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
> >> Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results
> >>(like getting one of her
> >> friends killed).
> >>
> > Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
>
> Uh... really???
>
> Is that a game? Because the two OAV episodes were just about the most
> stupid anime I'd ever seen, *much* worse than anything Miaka does...
> --
> Michael "Brazil" Borgwardt ---
The first two OAVs have been combined on one tape, and the next three
released as one set on a different tape-
the Villains attack Yuna's followers, and she tries to make peace
with them, even in the face of sustained murderous aggression;
it's neat to watch cute little girls get battered, bloody, and impaled,
isn't it? The game isn't fun anymore, time to grow up ....
Definitely not for everybody.
Knight of the Black Rose
> In article <38464F2C...@xtn.net>,
> Galen Musbach <musb...@xtn.net> writes:
>
>>> What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>>> Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
>>> friends killed).
>>>
>> Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
>
> Uh... really???
>
> Is that a game? Because the two OAV episodes were just about the most
> stupid anime I'd ever seen, *much* worse than anything Miaka does...
It's great fun.
The 2nd series, the 3-parter actually has a serious storyline. I didn't like it
as much as the first one.
~Shocked that someone who likes Tenchi doesn't like Yuna.
I I don't have anything against Miaka either. Although, FY holds appel to me.
Damn emulator, wonder where my cursor went.
--
Knight of the Black Rose
tony_f...@juno.com
Alistair Chiu
(Michael Borgwardt) wrote:
>In article <3846854c...@news.zipworld.com.au>,
> geda...@remove.spam.filter.arigatou.zipworld.com.au (Alistair Chiu) writes:
>
>>>What I'd like to see is a story where the incompetence of a
>>>Miaka/Usagi-like lead has *really* bad results (like getting one of her
>>>friends killed).
>>
>> Couldn't agree more. Actually, books tend to be better at this sort of
>> logical consistency than TV. Read any Robert Jordan lately?
>
>:) Now that you mention it... I'm currently in the process of completing
>my WoT collection. Volumes 4 and 7 arrived yesterday :)
Heh. Got all 8. :) Only got one of them in hardcover, though.
>Though I don't seehow the above would apply, at least to WoT. The females
>in there all seem rather scarily un-Miaka-like. Of course, there could
>easily be something I don't remember right away in that
>most-impressive-of-all-fantay-cycles...
Not directly apply. However, in terms of the general principle that
the natural consequences of what is laid down earlier on ought to
played out, I think this series does it as well as the others. You
noticed the tone of the series getting markedly darker past book 4?
We've got another young protaganist who doesn't handle being the
pressure of being Saviour of the world all that well.
And the various machinations of all the political factions, which all
only see a thin slice of the game, can be pretty stupid. The sheer
amount of misinformation running around in Jordan's world is
mind-boggling. Stupid, or blind characters (Elaida, etc) definitely
aren't protected from the consequences of their actions...and neither
is the rest of the world. Stupid actions by people in power tend to
have wide reaching and multiplying adverse effects, rather like in the
real world...
--
Alistair.
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>She's easily the most consistently selfless character there.
>
>Arnold Kim
>
>
Tendou Akane lovers of the world unite^.~ She's wonderful, ne? The anime
doesn't do her justice.
-Joey, who's now got 3 new manga to be obsessed with. Family Compo(even if it's
written mostly in furigana-less kanji~_~), One Piece(OMG.. it's so cool..), and
most of all, Meitantei Conan! OMG OMG, Great Detective Conan is just..
wonderful.. DAISUKI!!
Joey and his Akane hammer
>Micheal said:
>
>>What I find *really* bad is the basic message her character sends out:
>>"It's OK to be lazy, irresponsible and stupid, no harm will come from it
>> and everything will turn out OK if only your intentions are good."
>>It's also one reason why I dislike Sailor Moon.
>
>herself.
>Also, Usagi's missteps seem more a case of too nice, than too stupid.
>
>
And this is different from Miaka how?
Feh..
>
>
>
>
>Hana no Kaitou
>Pledged to the Way of the Wimp
>Cause of the month: Pastel Yumi
>http://members.aol.com/Animeg3282/index.html ,
>http://members.aol.com/animeg3282/page5/index.htm<--Please visit both my main
>home page, and Fancy Lala fanclub.
-Joey, who's now got 3 new manga to be obsessed with. Family Compo(even if it's
Animeg3282
>And this is different from Miaka how?
>
>Feh..
Miaka NEVER grows a brain, and does things like run off alone(she doesn't have
powers like SM) for no apperent reason, without thinking of the consequences at
all.
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <19991204003642...@ng-bh1.aol.com>,
frod...@aol.comnoplush (Joey and his Akane hammer) wrote:
>>
>>
>>----------
>>In article <822coi$nhu$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, micha...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
>>
>>That I really can't, if you've read the entire breadth of the manga series.
>>She's easily the most consistently selfless character there.
>>
>>Arnold Kim
>>
>>
>
>Tendou Akane lovers of the world unite^.~ She's wonderful, ne? The anime
>doesn't do her justice.
Yeah. Actually I might say the anime does few of the characters justice.
Akane's the only one who actually goes out of her way to help others without
any of her own self interests involved. I mean jesus, she helped Tarou, the
guy who _kidnapped_ her. She's even nice to Kuno when he's not being a
pompous jerk.
She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)Ranma
can be a real jerk at times.
Arnold Kim
Ross TenEyck
[Tendo Akane]
>She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)Ranma
>can be a real jerk at times.
There's that, and I agree that she's extremely nice to pretty much
everyone *except* Ranma.
But I think what gets a lot of people about her relationship with Ranma
is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in fact
completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
situation -- and the other half, he does no worse than hurt her feelings
-- and almost invariably, her response is to administer a beating that
would cripple or kill anyone who didn't have Ranma's resilience and
quick-healing ability.
Now, I'm aware that these sequences are meant as gags, to be taken no
more seriously than Wile E. Coyote getting driven into the ground like
a tent stake by a falling anvil... but still, the cumulative effect
of it all leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
be much better off marrying other people.
--
================== http://www.alumni.caltech.edu/~teneyck ==================
Ross TenEyck Seattle, WA \ Light, kindled in the furnace of hydrogen;
ten...@alumni.caltech.edu \ like smoke, sunlight carries the hot-metal
Are wa yume? Soretomo maboroshi? \ tang of Creation's forge.
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>
>----------
>In article <19991204003642...@ng-bh1.aol.com>,
>frod...@aol.comnoplush (Joey and his Akane hammer) wrote:
>
>
>>>
>>>
>>>----------
>>>In article <822coi$nhu$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, micha...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
>>>
>>>That I really can't, if you've read the entire breadth of the manga series.
>
>>>She's easily the most consistently selfless character there.
>>>
>>>Arnold Kim
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Tendou Akane lovers of the world unite^.~ She's wonderful, ne? The anime
>>doesn't do her justice.
>
>Yeah. Actually I might say the anime does few of the characters justice.
>Akane's the only one who actually goes out of her way to help others without
>any of her own self interests involved. I mean jesus, she helped Tarou, the
>guy who _kidnapped_ her. She's even nice to Kuno when he's not being a
>pompous jerk.
>
>can be a real jerk at times.
>
And one thing to note here(this is for the other guy too), is that it looks
like Akane and Ranma get along half of the time. We do get to see "peaceful
scenes", and Ranma nearly always provokes her. Of course, the things with the
fiancees..^^;;
Joey and his Akane hammer
>Frodoj said:
>
>>And this is different from Miaka how?
>>
>>Feh..
>
>Miaka NEVER grows a brain, and does things like run off alone(she doesn't
>have
>powers like SM)
I've seen some of the anime and read some of the manga, I realize thisO.o
for no apperent reason, without thinking of the consequences
>at
>all.
And the major problem here is, Usagi is guilty of her idiocies as well^^;;
Miaka runs off spurred by her guilty concience, usually. Sure, it's stupid.
Sure, it's tedious. But it's also tedious to watch Usagi whine, cry, and get
tricked by every single little trick the monster of the day pulls in Sailor
Moon^^;;
-prefers strong, Himechan No Ribon magical girls^.~
>
>
>Hana no Kaitou
>Pledged to the Way of the Wimp
>Cause of the month: Pastel Yumi
>http://members.aol.com/Animeg3282/index.html ,
>http://members.aol.com/animeg3282/page5/index.htm<--Please visit both my main
>home page, and Fancy Lala fanclub.
-Joey, who's now got 3 new manga to be obsessed with. Family Compo(even if it's
Animeg3282
>I've seen some of the anime and read some of the manga, I realize thisO.o
Yea, but when I talk, I sometimes give all of the reasons for my reasoning
anyway.
>
>And the major problem here is, Usagi is guilty of her idiocies as well^^;;
>Miaka runs off spurred by her guilty concience, usually. Sure, it's stupid.
>Sure, it's tedious. But it's also tedious to watch Usagi whine, cry, and get
>tricked by every single little trick the monster of the day pulls in Sailor
>Moon^^;;
Yea, but a good amount of the time, it is less annoying than Miaka's troubles.
A)In time, SM gains more sense, and is stronger. Like in the Nehelenia arc, she
barely did any whining at all. B)SM actually has some powers to deal with
things. Miaka doesn't even have a good knife. C)When Miaka does something
stupid, you often end up subjected to 'TAAAAAMAAAHOOOOOMEEE!!!!!'
"MIIIIIAAAAAAKAAAAAAA!!!!!' ad naseuam.
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <19991204165149...@ng-bd1.aol.com>,
frod...@aol.comnoplush (Joey and his Akane hammer) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
>>>>
>>>>That I really can't, if you've read the entire breadth of the manga series.
>>
>>>>She's easily the most consistently selfless character there.
>>>>
>>>>Arnold Kim
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>Tendou Akane lovers of the world unite^.~ She's wonderful, ne? The anime
>>>doesn't do her justice.
>>
>>Yeah. Actually I might say the anime does few of the characters justice.
>>Akane's the only one who actually goes out of her way to help others without
>>any of her own self interests involved. I mean jesus, she helped Tarou, the
>>guy who _kidnapped_ her. She's even nice to Kuno when he's not being a
>>pompous jerk.
>>
>>She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)Ranma
>>can be a real jerk at times.
>>
>>Arnold Kim
>
>And one thing to note here(this is for the other guy too), is that it looks
>like Akane and Ranma get along half of the time. We do get to see "peaceful
Actually, I'd say even more than that- at least 90% of the time on a given
day, and I could probably list whole manga stories where the arguing is
minimal or nonexistent.
Personally, one of my favorite little "peaceful scenes" is the last panel in
the "Nabiki as the fiancee" storyline.^_^
>scenes", and Ranma nearly always provokes her. Of course, the things with the
>fiancees..^^;;
That too.
Arnold Kim
Scott Schimmel
: -prefers strong, Himechan No Ribon magical girls^.~
Well, Hime-chan does her share of stupid things, too. It's just that
they're -reasonable- stupid things (at least from the point of view of
an impulsive adolescent girl with five times too much energy). ^_^
--
Scott Schimmel http://www.seas.upenn.edu/~schimmel/
Ex ignorantia ad sapientium; "You really aren't normal, are you?"
ex luce ad tenebras. -- Miki Koishikawa
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <82bsg5$s...@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, ten...@alumnae.caltech.edu
(Ross TenEyck) wrote:
>"Arnold Kim" <ki...@erols.com> writes:
>
>[Tendo Akane]
>>She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)Ranma
>>can be a real jerk at times.
>
>There's that, and I agree that she's extremely nice to pretty much
>everyone *except* Ranma.
Even sometimes people she shouldn't be too nice to...
>But I think what gets a lot of people about her relationship with Ranma
>is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in fact
>completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
A reaction spurred on by her own insecurity and inability to confront her
feelings. I'd say it's less a drawback of hers and more a character flaw
that gives her depth, but that's clearly just my opinion. I'm a sucker for
characters like that- surely why Asuka's my favorite in Evangelion...
>situation -- and the other half, he does no worse than hurt her feelings
You'll notice, though, that when her feelings are _genuinely_ hurt, she
usually doesn't react very violently at all.
>-- and almost invariably, her response is to administer a beating that
>would cripple or kill anyone who didn't have Ranma's resilience and
>quick-healing ability.
She's given the same kind of beating to other people, or other characters
have given similar beatings to people less durable than Ranma. People like
Gosunkugi, for example.
>Now, I'm aware that these sequences are meant as gags, to be taken no
>more seriously than Wile E. Coyote getting driven into the ground like
>a tent stake by a falling anvil... but still, the cumulative effect
>of it all leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
Well, I guess I can't really argue with that, then. Unlike you, I don't
take it that seriously, and like I said, when she's _genuinely_ hurt, she's
usually no more violent than a slap on the face. But I guess it really
boils down to a difference of opinion, and if that's all there is, I respect
that.
>All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
>strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
>fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
>him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
>but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
>be much better off marrying other people.
I think quite the opposite, actually- it seems that not only do they feel
more comfortable with each other as the series progresses, but also if they
get married, one of the major obstacles that causes the friction between
them- inability to deal with their feelings- will be gone.
Besides, I don't think they have much of a choice...
Arnold Kim
Puma Twins
>There's that, and I agree that she's extremely nice to pretty much
>everyone *except* Ranma.
>
>is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in fact
>completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
>would cripple or kill anyone who didn't have Ranma's resilience and
>quick-healing ability.
>
>more seriously than Wile E. Coyote getting driven into the ground like
>a tent stake by a falling anvil... but still, the cumulative effect
>of it all leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
>
>strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
>fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
>him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
>but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
>be much better off marrying other people.
>
Actually, in the manga, most of the time Akane will just leave Ranma and whom
ever else is with him in a fury. Ranma will go chasing after her to explain
his case. Ranma will say something stupid or insult her. Then she will either
give him ONE boot to da head or she will yell at him and leave. Very rarely
does she beat him into a bloody pulp . . . But that's just the manga. The
anime is quite different in that reguard. :)
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Puma Twins
>
>Well, Hime-chan does her share of stupid things, too. It's just that
>they're -reasonable- stupid things (at least from the point of view of
>an impulsive adolescent girl with five times too much energy). ^_^
>
For example, lets go after the older guy I like as my older much more feminine
sister. No big spoiler since it's within the first 4 eps anyway. ^_^
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Galen Musbach
Animeg3282 wrote:
> (snip)
> Miaka doesn't even have a good knife.
?
A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
Sarah Davis
Galen Musbach wrote in message <384A5FF7...@xtn.net>...
>
>
>Animeg3282 wrote:
>> (snip)
>> Miaka doesn't even have a good knife.
>?
>A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
>How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
Most of them in the vein of FY (fantasy shoujo, that is) don't need
traditional weapons because they have a special skill. The Sailor Senshi
have their attacks, Chacha has her (botched-up) magic, Hime-chan has her
power. Nagisa from "I'll Make a Habit of It" uses martial arts (that same
stupid attack over and over, actually) to thwart her opponents. Heroines
from less fantasy-driven anime/manga such as "Hana Yori Dango" and "Kodomo
No Omocha" have strong attitudes that allow them to persevere. Watase Yuu's
latest heroine, Aya Mikage of "Ayashi No Ceres," isn't as helpless as Miaka,
either. What Miaka is, is not a heroine, but an airheaded little girl in the
lead role, with no knife.
Sarah
S.t.A.n.L.e.E
>
> >All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
> >strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
> >fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
> >him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
> >but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
> >be much better off marrying other people.
>
> I think quite the opposite, actually- it seems that not only do they feel
> more comfortable with each other as the series progresses, but also if they
> get married, one of the major obstacles that causes the friction between
> them- inability to deal with their feelings- will be gone.
Are you sure?
A lot of married couples out there still have that problem.
Heck, at extreme, ever heard of celibate marriage? ^_^
Laters. =)
Stan
----------
_______ ________ _______ ____ ___ ___ ______ ______
| __|__ __| _ | \ | | | | _____| _____|
|__ | | | | _ | |\ | |___| ____|| ____|
|_______| |__| |__| |__|___| \ ___|_______|______|______|
__| | ( )
/ _ | |/ Stanlee Dometita Lost...@optonline.net
| ( _| | U of Rochester sta...@www.cif.rochester.edu
\ ______| _______ ____ ___
/ \ / \ | _ | \ | | www.cif.rochester.edu/~stanlee
/ \/ \| _ | |\ | uhura.cc.rochester.edu/~sd005e
/___/\/\___ __| |__|___| \ ___|
Frank Wustner
> ten...@alumnae.caltech.edu (Ross TenEyck) wrote:
> >All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
> >strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
> >fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
> >him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
> >but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
> >be much better off marrying other people.
> I think quite the opposite, actually- it seems that not only do they feel
> more comfortable with each other as the series progresses, but also if they
> get married, one of the major obstacles that causes the friction between
> them- inability to deal with their feelings- will be gone.
*blinkblink* Hardly. Marriage *never* solves problems like
that no matter how much people think it will. The bride and
groom will be the same people after going to the alter as they
were before. Unless Akane and Ranma solve their problems
before it gets that far, then married life will be exactly the
same for them as unmarried life is now, if not worse. As it
stands at the end of the manga, them getting married would be
a huge mistake. Whether it gets better afterward is the topic
of lots of fanfics.
> Besides, I don't think they have much of a choice...
Of course they do. The manga makes quite clear, repeatedly,
that nobody can get either of them to the alter if they do not
want to go. Their families may blather about honor and such
things, but the ultimate choice will be theirs. And if they
do decide not to go through with it, then their families will
have more chance of moving Mount Fuji than they will have of
getting them married.
--
The Deadly Nightshade
http://deadly_nightshade.tripod.com/
http://members.tripod.com/~deadly_nightshade/
|-----------------------------------|
| "Never say 'bite me' to Shishio |
| Makoto." |
|-----------------------------------|
| Want to email me? Go to the URL |
| above and email me from there. |
|-----------------------------------|
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <see-sig-0512...@user-33qtk0e.dialup.mindspring.com>,
see...@for.email.org (Frank Wustner) wrote:
>"Arnold Kim" <ki...@erols.com> wrote:
>> ten...@alumnae.caltech.edu (Ross TenEyck) wrote:
>
>> >All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
>> >strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
>> >fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
>> >him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
>> >but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
>> >be much better off marrying other people.
>
>> I think quite the opposite, actually- it seems that not only do they feel
>> more comfortable with each other as the series progresses, but also if they
>> get married, one of the major obstacles that causes the friction between
>> them- inability to deal with their feelings- will be gone.
>
>*blinkblink* Hardly. Marriage *never* solves problems like
>that no matter how much people think it will. The bride and
>groom will be the same people after going to the alter as they
>were before. Unless Akane and Ranma solve their problems
>before it gets that far, then married life will be exactly the
>same for them as unmarried life is now, if not worse. As it
>stands at the end of the manga, them getting married would be
>a huge mistake. Whether it gets better afterward is the topic
>of lots of fanfics.
You misunderstand me. I'm not saying that marriage will force them to make
these changes, but if they themselves on their own eventually come to the
conclusion that marriage is what they want (which, I think, is implied in
the manga) I think that would be a sign that one of the personal barriers
between them will have been eroded. I don't think marriage is realistically
going to happen _until_ they solve their problems, but I also don't doubt
that one of the major issues that causes these problems- once again,
inability to react properly and be comfortable with their feelings- will
have been dealt with by that point. After all, they've started to get along
progressively better for the most part after the Ryugenzawa story.
I'm not saying marriage solves problems. I'm saying that in this case,
marriage is a sign showing that problems have been solved.
Arnold Kim
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>frodo said:
>
>>I've seen some of the anime and read some of the manga, I realize thisO.o
>
>Yea, but when I talk, I sometimes give all of the reasons for my reasoning
>anyway.
>
Well, if I'm engaging in the conversation, I must have some experience with the
series.
>
>>
>>And the major problem here is, Usagi is guilty of her idiocies as well^^;;
>>Miaka runs off spurred by her guilty concience, usually. Sure, it's stupid.
>>Sure, it's tedious. But it's also tedious to watch Usagi whine, cry, and get
>>tricked by every single little trick the monster of the day pulls in Sailor
>>Moon^^;;
>
>Yea, but a good amount of the time, it is less annoying than Miaka's
>troubles.
>A)In time, SM gains more sense, and is stronger. Like in the Nehelenia arc,
>she
>barely did any whining at all. B)SM actually has some powers to deal with
>things. Miaka doesn't even have a good knife. C)When Miaka does something
>stupid, you often end up subjected to 'TAAAAAMAAAHOOOOOMEEE!!!!!'
>"MIIIIIAAAAAAKAAAAAAA!!!!!' ad naseuam.
I never said Miaka was flawless. Yes, she's stupid character. But really, so is
Usagi^^;; It's their stupid qualities that make them fun characters. Neither
Sailor Moon nor Fushigi Yuugi are plot heavy, thought provoking series with
alot going for them. But both series have nice characters, and an easy plot,
and in FY's case, nice art. I don't mind Miaka. Usagi does grow throughout
Sailor Moon, but not surprisingly, she seems to lose all she's gained at the
beginning of each season, no?
>
>Hana no Kaitou
>Pledged to the Way of the Wimp
>Cause of the month: Pastel Yumi
>http://members.aol.com/Animeg3282/index.html ,
>http://members.aol.com/animeg3282/page5/index.htm<--Please visit both my main
>home page, and Fancy Lala fanclub.
>
>
>
-Joey, who's now got 3 new manga to be obsessed with. Family Compo(even if it's
Joey and his Akane hammer
True, but those are the things that make her lovable^.~ Feh, I'm about to go
upstairs and watch Hime-chan now~_~
Of course..
SPOILER SPACE
The fact that she loses Pokota and gets him back, then proceeds to pick a fight
with him and make him run away in the time period of.. what, two stories? in
the final volume DOES seem kind of stupid^^;;;
>
>-Matt
>General Anime Fan
Joey and his Akane hammer
>>A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
>>How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
>
>Most of them in the vein of FY (fantasy shoujo, that is) don't need
>traditional weapons because they have a special skill. The Sailor Senshi
>have their attacks, Chacha has her (botched-up) magic, Hime-chan has her
>power.
I guess if you call being able to turn into other people for an hour a power,
then it's a power. Then again, she can make copies, travel through time, and do
all sorts of cool things^^ Hime-chan no Ribon is the best..
>Nagisa from "I'll Make a Habit of It" uses martial arts (that same
>stupid attack over and over, actually) to thwart her opponents. Heroines
>from less fantasy-driven anime/manga such as "Hana Yori Dango" and "Kodomo
>No Omocha" have strong attitudes that allow them to persevere. Watase Yuu's
>latest heroine, Aya Mikage of "Ayashi No Ceres," isn't as helpless as Miaka,
>either. What Miaka is, is not a heroine, but an airheaded little girl in the
>lead role, with no knife.
Personally, I like the manga over the anime(that's usually the case with me
anyway~_~), but I like Miaka alot because she's kind of realistic. She
over-reacts, she doesn't have any real special power, etc. As far as Usagi
goes, one of the things that gets on my nerves is oft times, the other girls do
the battling for her, and Tuxedo Kamen usually throws a rose, not surprisingly
dispelling all the mean stuff the MOTD has done to them. Then Usagi kills the
villain. The only time she ever shows "real power" is when she's battling the
"Great Big Meanie Main Monster Of The Story Arc"
>
>Sarah
Joey and his Akane hammer
Well, this is what the final story arc is supposed to take care of. Believing
Akane dead, Ranma admits his feelings(sort of, I'm still not to clear on this
one. The suki is in a thought balloon). The fact that Akane wakes up for him
and reacts happily to this seems to tell us that she's comfortable with
this(though Ranma doesn't seem to be^^ Toshioooo.. Toshiooo..) Then just the
fact that they were willing to go through with the wedding in the end(stupid
fiancees/suitors) shows that they're over the barrier. I think they would've
been happy together in the end. It would be a bumpy ride, but they'd get
through it. Plus, like I mentioned before, they DO seem comfortable with each
other when nobody interferes..
Animeg3282
>A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
>How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
Monster Rancher? If you don't have any kind of magic and are going into
dangerous situations, you should take along a weapon of some sort, so you can
have some means of self defense other than waiting for others to rescue you.
Animeg3282
>Personally, I like the manga over the anime(that's usually the case with me
>anyway~_~), but I like Miaka alot because she's kind of realistic. She
>over-reacts, she doesn't have any real special power, etc. As far as Usagi
>goes, one of the things that gets on my nerves is oft times, the other girls
>do
>the battling for her, and Tuxedo Kamen usually throws a rose, not
>surprisingly
>dispelling all the mean stuff the MOTD has done to them. Then Usagi kills the
>villain. The only time she ever shows "real power" is when she's battling the
>"Great Big Meanie Main Monster Of The Story Arc"
>
I always thought that was kind of a case of saving the best for last. Why use
your special SUPER DUPER powers on the minion? However, Miaka went back to her
own world in the anime. She could have said 'Hey, look. I really want to go
back for Yui. I know there's a lot of dangerous stuff, so I'll just take along
a kicthen knife' I mean, didn't she have a pack of books to study from? She
could have put a knife in there. It's not like she hadn't encoutered those guys
who wanted to sell her. If there were people like that lurking about, I'd
certainly take protection.
Arnold Kim
----------
In article <19991205145730...@ng-fa1.aol.com>,
frod...@aol.comnoplush (Joey and his Akane hammer) wrote:
I think it's spoken as well, as Akane in the next chapter tells him how she
overheard him say that, and Ranma, of course, flat out denies it. ^_^
>and reacts happily to this seems to tell us that she's comfortable with
>this(though Ranma doesn't seem to be^^ Toshioooo.. Toshiooo..) Then just the
>fact that they were willing to go through with the wedding in the end(stupid
>fiancees/suitors) shows that they're over the barrier. I think they would've
I'm not entirely sure they're totally ready for it by the end of the manga,
but certainly sometime down the line... Whenever they're ready to do it on
their own terms- I'd think outside interaction would only hurt their
chances.
>been happy together in the end. It would be a bumpy ride, but they'd get
>through it. Plus, like I mentioned before, they DO seem comfortable with each
>other when nobody interferes..
Yep...
Arnold Kim
Sarah Davis
Joey and his Akane hammer wrote in message
<19991205144536...@ng-fa1.aol.com>...
>Neither
>Sailor Moon nor Fushigi Yuugi are plot heavy, thought provoking series with
>alot going for them.
I'd debate this by pointing out that there is much profundity in FY that
cannot be picked up with that attitude. It may feature a cute character at
the forefront, but once you look beyond Miaka you will find a lot of depth.
This is one of the most notable reasons Miaka grates on some of us: There
were some VERY interesting characters who never got screen time enough to
fulfill their potential. Whole scenes were cut from the manga just so that
Miaka and Tamahome could be shown cooing and cuddling. There is information
from the manga that does not appear in the anime for Miaka's benefit (and to
this viewer's continuing disgust).
The only thing hindering FY from being renowned as a thought-provoking, deep
series is that it focused primarily on the lighter side, skipping over the
darker aspects. Is it possible to *not* find Ashitare interesting once you
know about his past, whether or not you like him as an individual? But was
his past exposed in detail, or was the essential time taken up by Miaka and
Tamahome having relationship problems that they'd already had a thousand
times before? Really, in the end when you're dealing with people who dislike
Miaka, you're dealing with people who were embittered by her very presence.
I never thought I'd be able to rant so much about this... *sigh* Pardon me.
Sarah
Galen Musbach
Animeg3282 wrote:
> She could have said 'Hey, look. I really want to go
> back for Yui. I know there's a lot of dangerous stuff,
> so I'll just take along a kicthen knife' She
> could have put a knife in there. It's not like she hadn't
> encountered those guys who wanted to sell her.
> If there were people like that lurking about, I'd
> certainly take protection.
>
I feel impelled to point out that having a weapon does not
constitute having protection unless you have the training
to use it--one of the few things "Xena: Warrior Princess"
did well was how long it took Gabby to learn how to fight.
Miaka would need at least months of physical conditioning
and self-defense courses before she could use a knife effectively
against men who are accustomed to facing blade-armed opponents.
IMO.
Galen Musbach
Animeg3282 wrote:
>
> Galen said:
>
> >A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
> >How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
>
> Monster Rancher?
Holly of Monster Rancher carries a heavy fighting knife;
it was her father's, I've never seen her use it--
despite lots of attackers.
-Galen
Yes, I know I'm off-thread.
Fish Eye No Miko
>Therefore,I write most of my fics AFTER volume 38.In those fics,it's
>not uncommon for me to pair Konatsu with either Tsubasa
But Tsubasa hates boys...
Catherine Johnson.
--
Remove "3AT" to reply
"Angel Investigations; we hope you're helpless."
-Doyle, _Angel_
Sarah Davis
Puma Twins wrote in message
<19991206014729...@ng-fi1.aol.com>...
>I watched the anime for Amiboshi, Noriko, and Chichiri. That was it. Most
of
>the scenes with everyone else I ignored. If it hadn't been for Chichiri, I
>would have stopped watching the series after the main Noriko arc. :p
I live and breathe Suboshi &Amiboshi. Maybe they're responsible for some of
my aversion to Miaka -- look at what she did to them! Admittedly, I love all
the Seiryuu side and find the Genbu No Shichiseishi to be wonderfully
defined and interesting characters, but, coincidentally, the only two Suzaku
No Shichiseishi that I like are Chichiri and Nuriko. As for the others...
*shrug* Total indifference.
>It is a good heckling anime though. How many other anime can you make
>Thundercats, Dragonball, and Lunar referances all in one episode. ^_^
If there's one thing to be said for Watase's writing, it's that she knows a
good joke. FY had *tons* of references to other series/pop-culture icons.
Sarah
ranma...@my-deja.com
ten...@alumnae.caltech.edu (Ross TenEyck) wrote:
> "Arnold Kim" <ki...@erols.com> writes:
>
> [Tendo Akane]
> >She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)
Ranma
> >can be a real jerk at times.
>
> everyone *except* Ranma.
>
> But I think what gets a lot of people about her relationship with
Ranma
> is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in
fact
> completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
> situation -- and the other half, he does no worse than hurt her
feelings
> -- and almost invariably, her response is to administer a beating that
> would cripple or kill anyone who didn't have Ranma's resilience and
> quick-healing ability.
>
> Now, I'm aware that these sequences are meant as gags, to be taken no
> more seriously than Wile E. Coyote getting driven into the ground like
> a tent stake by a falling anvil... but still, the cumulative effect
> of it all leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
>
> strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
> fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
> him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
> but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
> be much better off marrying other people.
>
> ================== http://www.alumni.caltech.edu/~teneyck
==================
> Ross TenEyck Seattle, WA \ Light, kindled in the furnace of
hydrogen;
> ten...@alumni.caltech.edu \ like smoke, sunlight carries the
hot-metal
> Are wa yume? Soretomo maboroshi? \ tang of Creation's forge.
>
On both my page and in my fanfics,I take the open-ended manga ending
into consideration.Therefore,I write most of my fics AFTER volume 38.In
those fics,it's not uncommon for me to pair Konatsu with either Tsubasa
or,to a lesser extent,Azusa.:)
Mike Rhea,Defender of the Cute Fiancee
http://rei.animenetwork.com/ranchan/
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Animeg3282
Frodo said:
>I never said Miaka was flawless. Yes, she's stupid character. But really, so
>is
>Usagi^^;; It's their stupid qualities that make them fun characters. Neither
>Sailor Moon nor Fushigi Yuugi are plot heavy, thought provoking series with
>alot going for them
>
>alot going for them. But both series have nice characters, and an easy plot,
>and in FY's case, nice art. I don't mind Miaka. Usagi does grow throughout
>Sailor Moon, but not surprisingly, she seems to lose all she's gained at the
>beginning of each season, no?
Ah, you are looking at things differently. The plot was the only thing I liked
about FY. SM is a good meduim plot series at times,and I wacth anime because of
the plots and chracters, and if a chracter annoys me, or if they plot is just
stupid(like the end of FY. Hotohori had more sense than that!) I won't like the
series as much. I also liked the themes of SM, especally friendship. I like
likable chracters better than 'fun' ones. :P
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>Frodo said:
>
>>Personally, I like the manga over the anime(that's usually the case with me
>>anyway~_~), but I like Miaka alot because she's kind of realistic. She
>>over-reacts, she doesn't have any real special power, etc. As far as Usagi
>>goes, one of the things that gets on my nerves is oft times, the other girls
>>do
>>the battling for her, and Tuxedo Kamen usually throws a rose, not
>>surprisingly
>>dispelling all the mean stuff the MOTD has done to them. Then Usagi kills
>the
>>villain. The only time she ever shows "real power" is when she's battling
>the
>>"Great Big Meanie Main Monster Of The Story Arc"
>>
>
>I always thought that was kind of a case of saving the best for last. Why use
>your special SUPER DUPER powers on the minion?
If you can use it again, why not? Plot conveniences! Yes, yes, I know about the
"kill after using the crystal" deal, but something to note then is that Usagi
is just as helpless as Miaka is, in a sense
However, Miaka went back to
>her
>own world in the anime. She could have said 'Hey, look. I really want to go
>back for Yui. I know there's a lot of dangerous stuff, so I'll just take
>along
>a kicthen knife' I mean, didn't she have a pack of books to study from? She
>could have put a knife in there. It's not like she hadn't encoutered those
>guys
>who wanted to sell her. If there were people like that lurking about, I'd
>certainly take protection.
Would you think about it, if you had 2 different guys who were in love with you
and willing to save you whenever you were in trouble? Plus, you have the same
types of people in the regular world(ugh, I feel so.. fanny), so should Miaka
walk around with a butcher knife outside the book too?
>
>Hana no Kaitou
>Pledged to the Way of the Wimp
>Cause of the month: Pastel Yumi
>http://members.aol.com/Animeg3282/index.html ,
>http://members.aol.com/animeg3282/page5/index.htm<--Please visit both my main
>home page, and Fancy Lala fanclub.
>
>
-Joey, who has to stop obsessing over Inu Yasha. I need volume 13..
"Ii jiya naino. Ima wa hitori jiya nainda suno."
"Aa souda. Inomaika... Ataru mae mitaini Kagome ga subani iru-- Ore no ibashiyo
da--"-Kagome and Inu Yasha, volume 12.*sob*Suteiki da
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>Galen said:
>
>>A reference to Holly of Monster Rancher?
>>How many shoujo heroines use weapons?
>
>dangerous situations, you should take along a weapon of some sort, so you can
>have some means of self defense other than waiting for others to rescue you.
Then again, since they're always around..
Joey and his Akane hammer
>
>Frodo said:
>
>>I never said Miaka was flawless. Yes, she's stupid character. But really, so
>>is
>>Usagi^^;; It's their stupid qualities that make them fun characters. Neither
>>Sailor Moon nor Fushigi Yuugi are plot heavy, thought provoking series with
>>alot going for them
>
>>
>>alot going for them. But both series have nice characters, and an easy plot,
>>and in FY's case, nice art. I don't mind Miaka. Usagi does grow throughout
>>Sailor Moon, but not surprisingly, she seems to lose all she's gained at the
>>beginning of each season, no?
>
>Ah, you are looking at things differently. The plot was the only thing I
>liked
>about FY. SM is a good meduim plot series at times,and I wacth anime because
>of
>the plots and chracters
Not much elseO.o It's not like you can stop and admire the art, or anything.
Unless yer quick on the pause button.
, and if a chracter annoys me, or if they plot is just
>stupid(like the end of FY. Hotohori had more sense than that!) I won't like
>the
>series as much. I also liked the themes of SM, especally friendship. I like
>likable chracters better than 'fun' ones. :P
Well, obviously, a fun character is a likeable one^^;;
Puma Twins
>Miaka and Tamahome could be shown cooing and cuddling. There is information
>from the manga that does not appear in the anime for Miaka's benefit (and to
>this viewer's continuing disgust).
I watched the anime for Amiboshi, Noriko, and Chichiri. That was it. Most of
the scenes with everyone else I ignored. If it hadn't been for Chichiri, I
would have stopped watching the series after the main Noriko arc. :p
It is a good heckling anime though. How many other anime can you make
Thundercats, Dragonball, and Lunar referances all in one episode. ^_^
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Puma Twins
>of
>>the scenes with everyone else I ignored. If it hadn't been for Chichiri, I
>>would have stopped watching the series after the main Noriko arc. :p
>
>my aversion to Miaka -- look at what she did to them! Admittedly, I love all
>the Seiryuu side and find the
You liked Tomo? I couldn't stand him, but that's just difference of opinion.
I also didn't like Soi much for the same reasons I could do without Tamahome
and Miaka. True Soi was much deaper than either Tama or Miaka, but still . . .
As for Suiboshi, he was over the top in his hate. I don't know the full
background since I have only seen two of the manga, but the things that he did
were not justifiable IMO. Amiboshi was the exact opposite, but you have read
the manga while I have not so you may have reasons that I cannot see to like
Suiboshi.
Genbu No
>Shichiseishi to be wonderfully
The Genbu group was passed over so quickly in the anime. I wish they had
developed them a little better.
>defined and interesting characters, but, coincidentally, the only two Suzaku
>No Shichiseishi that I like are Chichiri and Nuriko. As for the others...
>*shrug* Total indifference.
Tasuki had his fun points, but everyone else was just sort of there for no
reason.
>>It is a good heckling anime though. How many other anime can you make
>>Thundercats, Dragonball, and Lunar referances all in one episode. ^_^
>
>If there's one thing to be said for Watase's writing, it's that she knows a
>good joke. FY had *tons* of references to other series/pop-culture icons.
>
So true. :)
-Matt
General Anime Fan
David Johnston
>
> ranma...@my-deja.com wrote in message <82fkhn$p8g$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
> >not uncommon for me to pair Konatsu with either Tsubasa
>
People rarely consider Tsubasa's preference when pairing him up.
The interesting thing about this kind of Ukyo fan is that they seem to
assume that Konatsu and Tsubasa's crossdressing implies homosexuality,
but Ukyo's crossdressing does not.
Ross TenEyck
>----------
>In article <82bsg5$s...@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, ten...@alumnae.caltech.edu
>(Ross TenEyck) wrote:
>>"Arnold Kim" <ki...@erols.com> writes:
>>[Tendo Akane]
>>>She's the way she is only to Ranma because a) she's insecure, and b)Ranma
>>>can be a real jerk at times.
>>But I think what gets a lot of people about her relationship with Ranma
>>is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in fact
>>completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
>A reaction spurred on by her own insecurity and inability to confront her
>feelings. I'd say it's less a drawback of hers and more a character flaw
>that gives her depth, but that's clearly just my opinion. I'm a sucker for
>characters like that- surely why Asuka's my favorite in Evangelion...
And I'm sure that Hannibal "the Cannibal" had serious personal issues
as well. The point is, whether Akane beats him senseless because she
has deep insecurity, or just because she has a short fuse, it doesn't
matter if you're on the receiving end of the sledgehammer; angst is
not an excuse for uncontrolled violence.
>>Now, I'm aware that these sequences are meant as gags, to be taken no
>>more seriously than Wile E. Coyote getting driven into the ground like
>>a tent stake by a falling anvil... but still, the cumulative effect
>>of it all leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
>Well, I guess I can't really argue with that, then. Unlike you, I don't
>take it that seriously, and like I said, when she's _genuinely_ hurt, she's
>usually no more violent than a slap on the face. But I guess it really
>boils down to a difference of opinion, and if that's all there is, I respect
>that.
Like I said, I know it's a gag; but -- to me -- the gag wears thin
after a while.
For that matter, the gag is hardly limited to Ranma; does everyone here
recognize this? "One of these days, Alice, one of these days... POW!
Right in the kisser!" Playing up domestic violence for a cheap laugh
goes all the way back to Punch and Judy, at least, and I'm sure much
farther than that. And I'm not entirely immune to that kind of black
humor; but I think it requires an *extremely* light touch... and I
think Takahashi overdoes it.
My opinion, of course. Your mileage may vary.
>>All of which leads me to conclude that, while Takahashi's manga ending
>>strongly implies that Ranma and Akane will get married, this would in
>>fact be a huge mistake on their part. I'm not saying that she'd run
>>him and Ukyou through with a katana during a fit of psychotic rage...
>>but whatever happened, it wouldn't be pretty in the end. They'd each
>>be much better off marrying other people.
>I think quite the opposite, actually- it seems that not only do they feel
>more comfortable with each other as the series progresses, but also if they
>get married, one of the major obstacles that causes the friction between
>them- inability to deal with their feelings- will be gone.
I don't think that's their biggest problem, although it's one of them.
The problem is that they bring out the worst in each other. Akane is,
as noted above, a warm and caring person -- to almost anyone *except*
Ranma, to whom she's violent and judgemental. Ranma is a basically
decent guy to most people except Akane, whom he regularly insults
with little or no provocation.
Ranma and Akane make great allies but lousy friends; when the chips
are down and a crisis needs to be dealt with, they each know, without
any doubt whatsoever, that they can count unreservedly on the other;
but when there isn't a crisis or a mutual enemy, they do nothing but
snipe at each other. Unfortunately for them, a marriage -- or any sort
of relationship -- is based more on getting along with each other from
day to day than it is on teaming up to defeat the bad-guy-of-the-day...
and they suck at getting along from day to day.
Yes, they do love each other. By the end of the series, they are even
aware that they love each other. But it is a harsh fact of life that
sometimes -- a century of romantic literature to the contrary -- love
is not enough... and anyone who hasn't learned that is either blind or
extraordinarly fortunate.
If Ranma and Akane marry, they will love each other fervently... and
drive each other crazy. I don't see it ending any other way than with
both of them getting their hearts broken. In the long run, they'd be
happier with other people.
Ross TenEyck
>>But I think what gets a lot of people about her relationship with Ranma
>>is the sheer disproportionate response. Half the time, Ranma is in fact
>>completely innocent -- he gets caught in an apparently compromising
>>situation -- and the other half, he does no worse than hurt her feelings
>>-- and almost invariably, her response is to administer a beating that
>>would cripple or kill anyone who didn't have Ranma's resilience and
>>quick-healing ability.
>Actually, in the manga, most of the time Akane will just leave Ranma and whom
>ever else is with him in a fury. Ranma will go chasing after her to explain
>his case. Ranma will say something stupid or insult her. Then she will either
>give him ONE boot to da head or she will yell at him and leave. Very rarely
>does she beat him into a bloody pulp . . . But that's just the manga. The
>anime is quite different in that reguard. :)
Hmm... let's take a typical example from the manga. Say, the magic
mushroom story, where Shampoo spells Ranma so that he is forced to hug
anyone who sneezes. At one point in the story, Shampoo sneezes while
in cat form, so Ranma hugs her, and of course freaks out. So, he jumps
into the bath to un-cat her, and Shampoo, now naked, glomps him. Akane
realizes that Ranma was telling the truth about the whole sneeze-hug
thing, and admits to him that he was right, and he was completely innocent.
And *at the same time* that she's saying that, she's slamming a sledge
hammer into his skull.
Is this a reasonable response to the provocation? Is this even within
several orders of magnitude of a reasonable response? I don't think so.
Puma Twins
>I don't think that's their biggest problem, although it's one of them.
>The problem is that they bring out the worst in each other. Akane is,
>as noted above, a warm and caring person -- to almost anyone *except*
>Ranma, to whom she's violent and judgemental. Ranma is a basically
>decent guy to most people except Akane, whom he regularly insults
>with little or no provocation.
>
>Ranma and Akane make great allies but lousy friends; when the chips
>are down and a crisis needs to be dealt with, they each know, without
>any doubt whatsoever, that they can count unreservedly on the other;
>but when there isn't a crisis or a mutual enemy, they do nothing but
>snipe at each other. Unfortunately for them, a marriage -- or any sort
>of relationship -- is based more on getting along with each other from
>day to day than it is on teaming up to defeat the bad-guy-of-the-day...
>and they suck at getting along from day to day.
Actually, they get along fine as long as no one bothers them. I think if they
lived on the moon with no one else around, they would be very happy. Also,
Akane is not always extremely violent to him. She will help him out just like
she will help anyone else out. The only problem is that he refuses that help
and then insults her. That is where the difference is. Also she will ask for
his help and he will refuse it. I'm not saying it's all Ranma's fault since
she needs to learn to trust him more, but it's not like she beats him half to
death for sneezing either.
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Michael Borgwardt
aefig...@miavx1.muohio.edu (Knight of the Black Rose) writes:
>>> Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
>>
>> Uh... really???
>>
>> Is that a game? Because the two OAV episodes were just about the most
>> stupid anime I'd ever seen, *much* worse than anything Miaka does...
> You're kidding, right? You don't like the Galaxy Fraulein anime?
> It's great fun.
> The 2nd series, the 3-parter actually has a serious storyline. I didn't like it
> as much as the first one.
> ~Shocked that someone who likes Tenchi doesn't like Yuna.
And I'm shocked that there is *anyone* who can actually like the first
two Yuna episodes. I mean, it's *exclusively* mind-bogglingly idiotic and
*not* funny except for the very beginning.
It is not like Tenchi Muyo at all, in fact I'm inclined to take offense
to the suggestion.
--
Michael "Brazil" Borgwardt --- Member of #WASHU# and Her would-be guinea-pig.
Untiring defender of Washu-chan, Asuka-chan and Elektra-chan.
A Homepage for Elektra: http://www.informatik.tu-muenchen.de/~borgward/
ANT - Animeclub fuer Deutschland: http://www.anime.no.tomodachi.de/
--------------- Let`s shake the dew off this lily, shall we ? ---------------
Fish Eye No Miko
>Fish Eye No Miko wrote:
>>
>> ranma...@my-deja.com wrote in message <82fkhn$p8g$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>>
>> >Therefore,I write most of my fics AFTER volume 38.In those fics,
>> >it's not uncommon for me to pair Konatsu with either Tsubasa
>>
>> But Tsubasa hates boys...
>
>People rarely consider Tsubasa's preference when pairing him up.
Which is odd, considering how adamant he is about it. He beats up on Ranma
numerous times to make this point; you think someone who's a fan of the
character would know this... I mean, what part of him screaming "I HATE
BOYS!!" do they not get?
>The interesting thing about this kind of Ukyo fan is that they seem
>to assume that Konatsu and Tsubasa's crossdressing implies
>homosexuality, but Ukyo's crossdressing does not.
Yeah, well.... I mean, it IS more acceptable for girls to dress as boys.
And Ukyo is very obviously straight, considering she's so stuck on Ranma.
But, again, Tsubasa is also very obviously straight. As soon as he found
out Koatsu was a guy, he'd drop (kick) him like a bad habit. I'm not
familiar enough with Konatsu to say, but I've heard he prefers girl, too.
Catherine Johnson. OOC is one thing, changing something so basic and
well-established about the character is not.
Michael Borgwardt
geda...@remove.spam.filter.arigatou.zipworld.com.au (Alistair Chiu) writes:
>>Though I don't seehow the above would apply, at least to WoT. The females
>>in there all seem rather scarily un-Miaka-like. Of course, there could
>>easily be something I don't remember right away in that
>>most-impressive-of-all-fantay-cycles...
>
> Not directly apply. However, in terms of the general principle that
> the natural consequences of what is laid down earlier on ought to
> played out, I think this series does it as well as the others. You
> noticed the tone of the series getting markedly darker past book 4?
>
> We've got another young protaganist who doesn't handle being the
> pressure of being Saviour of the world all that well.
True. Though in his case there is hope, because there are people
who recognize the problem and plan to do something about it.
"He confuses being hard with being strong", indeed...
Sarah Davis
Puma Twins wrote in message
>You liked Tomo? I couldn't stand him, but that's just difference of
opinion.
Tomo has a background worth checking out, and he's an interesting character.
Not the most likable guy in the world, but at least he isn't boring. I also
LOVE his character design. Femininity and masculinity have never
intermingled quite so well before. He embodies grace and ferocity while
diminishing neither. Plus, he's got the cackle. It belongs in the Hall of
Fame for villain laughs.
>I also didn't like Soi much for the same reasons I could do without
Tamahome
>and Miaka. True Soi was much deaper than either Tama or Miaka, but still .
. .
Okay, you've got me there. I'm not a big Soi fan. She's better in the manga,
but she still seems to have built her love for Nakago out of too flimsy a
premise. It mirrors Hotohori's infatuation with Miaka in too many ways.
> As for Suiboshi, he was over the top in his hate. I don't know the full
>background since I have only seen two of the manga, but the things that he
did
>were not justifiable IMO. Amiboshi was the exact opposite, but you have
read
>the manga while I have not so you may have reasons that I cannot see to
like
>Suiboshi.
Suboshi has a gentler side that contrasts deeply with his manic, obsessive
compulsion to inflict pain on others. He's fixated with vengeance and
punishment while he has no clear concept of either. He's a self-defeating,
self-contradictory, hypocritical character. This makes him fascinating to
me, although I can understand not liking him as a person. His violence can
be disturbing, but it always elicits a reaction, and audience reactions are
what make characters great. I like Amiboshi for many of the same reasons I
like his brother: Walking the line between sweet-natured and brutal. Talk
about bipolar disorder...
>Genbu No
>>Shichiseishi to be wonderfully
>
>The Genbu group was passed over so quickly in the anime. I wish they had
>developed them a little better.
So do I, but I still love 'em. The Byakko No Shichiseishi weren't quite as
interesting (too idealized), but Suzuno and Tatara were memorable. I hope
Watase will focus on them for one of the novels she and the other woman
(can't think of her name) are writing. I'd like to know more about the Genbu
and, to a lesser extent, the Byakko.
Sarah
PmChivas
micha...@hotmail.com wrote:
> I can understand why people hate Akane Tendou(Ranma 1/2),but why do
> some people hate Miaka Yuuki(Fushigi Yuugi)?
>
I don't mind Akane however, I do Hate Miaka. Why I hate Miaka?
Well in the beginning I can understand her wanting to get back
her friend Yui. I can understand her wanting to get Yui to see
the truth, but when she found out that Yui wasn't f***ing around
with finding her seishi and summoning her God first, Miaka should
have taken the same perpective. But did she, no she endangered all
her friends trying to Yui back, she could have summoned Suzako and
got Yui back that way and helped Hotohori. But instead she got most
of all her friends killed, not taking her duty serious. And she spent
the whole time calling Tamahome, when Hotohori was the better choice.
She's just plain annoying.
> Mike Rhea
>
PmChivas
--
"To prepare to defeat your opponets means you
know that you may be defeated yourself."
--Okina, RK
puma...@aol.communist
<sili...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Puma Twins wrote in message
><19991206023739...@ng-fi1.aol.com>...
>>You liked Tomo? I couldn't stand him, but that's just difference of
>opinion.
>
>Tomo has a background worth checking out, and he's an interesting character.
>Not the most likable guy in the world, but at least he isn't boring. I also
>LOVE his character design. Femininity and masculinity have never
>intermingled quite so well before. He embodies grace and ferocity while
>diminishing neither. Plus, he's got the cackle. It belongs in the Hall of
>Fame for villain laughs.
>
Ah, the laugh. The thing that saves many a villian. :)
>>I also didn't like Soi much for the same reasons I could do without
>Tamahome
>>and Miaka. True Soi was much deaper than either Tama or Miaka, but still .
>. .
>
>Okay, you've got me there. I'm not a big Soi fan. She's better in the manga,
>but she still seems to have built her love for Nakago out of too flimsy a
>premise. It mirrors Hotohori's infatuation with Miaka in too many ways.
>
Well, I liked her better than Hotohori, but she should have gotten a
clue. She was basically a human sheild. That was the only reason why
I could sympathise with her. Other than that, the story would have
gotten along fine without her. Her powers were nice though. Sort of
like "what if Storm (from X-men) decided to get into anime?" :)
>> As for Suiboshi, he was over the top in his hate. I don't know the full
>>background since I have only seen two of the manga, but the things that he
>did
>>were not justifiable IMO. Amiboshi was the exact opposite, but you have
>read
>>the manga while I have not so you may have reasons that I cannot see to
>like
>>Suiboshi.
>
>Suboshi has a gentler side that contrasts deeply with his manic, obsessive
>compulsion to inflict pain on others. He's fixated with vengeance and
>punishment while he has no clear concept of either. He's a self-defeating,
>self-contradictory, hypocritical character. This makes him fascinating to
That is exactly the reason why I can't stand him. He had no redeeming
qualities except for his brother and Yui. Without them, he just would
have been some random killer. I wonder what would have happened if he
had Nakago's power. Everybody would have been dead.
>me, although I can understand not liking him as a person. His violence can
>be disturbing, but it always elicits a reaction, and audience reactions are
>what make characters great. I like Amiboshi for many of the same reasons I
>like his brother: Walking the line between sweet-natured and brutal. Talk
>about bipolar disorder...
>
I think the best measue of Amiboshi was when he lost his memory. He
was a completely normal person. There's not much you can hate about
some one who is selfless and fights for what they believe in. If
Suiboshi lost his memory, I could still see him beating up on small
children for the fun of it.
>>The Genbu group was passed over so quickly in the anime. I wish they had
>>developed them a little better.
>
>So do I, but I still love 'em. The Byakko No Shichiseishi weren't quite as
>interesting (too idealized), but Suzuno and Tatara were memorable. I hope
>Watase will focus on them for one of the novels she and the other woman
>(can't think of her name) are writing. I'd like to know more about the Genbu
>and, to a lesser extent, the Byakko.
>
Maybe if they go back into the history. It would be nice to see.
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Sarah Davis
puma...@aol.communist wrote in message
<384b8d44...@news.erols.com>...
This contains some spoilers, so here's a little space for the wary:
S
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>>Okay, you've got me there. I'm not a big Soi fan. She's better in the
manga,
>>but she still seems to have built her love for Nakago out of too flimsy a
>>premise. It mirrors Hotohori's infatuation with Miaka in too many ways.
>>
>
>Well, I liked her better than Hotohori, but she should have gotten a
>clue. She was basically a human sheild. That was the only reason why
>I could sympathise with her. Other than that, the story would have
>gotten along fine without her.
Soi had additional development and value. Nakago treated her as a lover
while at once shunning her in favor of his agenda, and her background
indicated to her that the emotional extent of a relationship was equal to
the physical extent of a relationship. She was sold into sexual slavery, so
abuse of this nature was nothing new to her. Watch the man who slaps her.
She does not defend herself because she has been conditioned to devalue
herself. When she died for Nakago, she was proving that she her vision of
love had matured. In the manga, Soi beckons to Nakago from Heaven when he is
dying, and he whispers her name. There was love in their relationship. Not
traditional or romantic love, but it was still valid. It just wasn't
developed enough for me to feel much sympathy for Soi.
>>Suboshi has a gentler side that contrasts deeply with his manic, obsessive
>>compulsion to inflict pain on others. He's fixated with vengeance and
>>punishment while he has no clear concept of either. He's a self-defeating,
>>self-contradictory, hypocritical character. This makes him fascinating to
>
>That is exactly the reason why I can't stand him. He had no redeeming
>qualities except for his brother and Yui. Without them, he just would
>have been some random killer. I wonder what would have happened if he
>had Nakago's power. Everybody would have been dead.
Suboshi never killed until he was driven to rage upon being convinced that
his brother had been slain by the Suzaku No Shichiseishi. Besides, Suboshi
also showed empathy for Ashitare when no one else would and stood by Yui
until the very end, even uttering her name as he died. He's not a bad person
fundamentally, but he does some hideous things because he believes he must.
Retribution is the key word. Unfortunately for Suboshi, he has an immature
concept of justice, so his version of carrying it out is to enlist the aid
of Hammurabi's Law: An eye for an eye. It's a simple, effective method as
far as he's concerned. He led a life of suffering from the age of nine when
his parents died so to inflict suffering on others seems a natural act.
Suboshi's grief mounted over a period of six years, but he still had his
brother to care for him. When he was robbed of Amiboshi, he slid over the
edge.
His violence aside, Suboshi had many moments in the series (manga more than
anime) where he was a genuinely loving person to those who loved him back.
One of the best manga scenes (which was edited out of the anime) is when he
tells Yui that he cares for her and she gives him the bow to her school
uniform, thanking him both in word and deed for his kindness to her. To a
select few, Suboshi is a wonderful person. To most people, he is
indifferent. To a small group of opposition, he is the bringer of death.
>I think the best measue of Amiboshi was when he lost his memory. He
>was a completely normal person. There's not much you can hate about
>some one who is selfless and fights for what they believe in.
Alternatively, Amiboshi was being selfish in that he wittingly and willingly
left behind his brother, indirectly affecting his brother's actions. He did,
after all, admit that he never forgot his brother, and his brother
*definitely* remember him, to the point of seeking him out at the slightest
hint that he was still alive. Amiboshi also had that AWFUL line about
wishing he'd been born a Suzaku No Shichiseishi. I love him for his role as
literary foil for his brother, but I think "Kaika" was a weaker character
than Amiboshi.
> If
>Suiboshi lost his memory, I could still see him beating up on small
>children for the fun of it.
Now, when exactly did he beat up on small children for the fun of it? He
killed Tamahome's family because he was convinced that it was the only way
to make Tamahome feel the anguish that he felt when he lost his brother.
Suboshi would NEVER attack a random child for personal amusement. Suboshi
isn't a thug. He can be an awful fool, but he's not cruel for the sake of
being cruel. He's cruel because he's motivated. I won't make excuses (ie:
the good, old fashioned, "Nakago made him do it!"), but I don't think
Suboshi is half as terrible as most people think.
Sarah
Animeg3282
>If you can use it again, why not? Plot conveniences! Yes, yes, I know about
>the
>"kill after using the crystal" deal, but something to note then is that Usagi
>is just as helpless as Miaka is, in a sense
*shakes head* She actually uses her powers at times, just not her most powerful
weapon. Remember, SM lasted like 5 episodes entirely on her own. If that was
Miaka, she'd be sushi!
>
>Would you think about it, if you had 2 different guys who were in love with
>you
>and willing to save you whenever you were in trouble? Plus, you have the same
>types of people in the regular world(ugh, I feel so.. fanny), so should Miaka
>walk around with a butcher knife outside the book too?
>
Yes, I don't like to depend on a man! She should be equiped with some mace and
self defense class. The knife is for those hardy Seiyuu ^_^;;
>
>-Joey, who has to stop obsessing over Inu Yasha. I need volume 13.
That's nothing! I need volume 2! ;_;
Animeg3282
>>
>I feel impelled to point out that having a weapon does not
>constitute having protection unless you have the training
>to use it--one of the few things "Xena: Warrior Princess"
>did well was how long it took Gabby to learn how to fight.
>Miaka would need at least months of physical conditioning
>and self-defense courses before she could use a knife effectively
>against men who are accustomed to facing blade-armed opponents.
>IMO.
It's better than nothing. If you are that weak, you should fall back and not
run out into the danger, also. She should have stayed in the real world if she
was going to be such a wimp.
Animeg3282
>Not much elseO.o It's not like you can stop and admire the art, or anything.
>Unless yer quick on the pause button.
*laughs* You know what I mean!
>
>Well, obviously, a fun character is a likeable one^^;;
>
What if it's not a comedy? Then the 'fun' chracter tends not to fit. Having
flat chracters in the lead role is very annoying, too.
Animeg3282
>Then again, since they're always around..
>
But don't you have enough rescept for your friends/lover/whatever not to want
them to worry?
Puma Twins
wrote:
>Galen said:
>
>>>
>>I feel impelled to point out that having a weapon does not
>>constitute having protection unless you have the training
>>to use it--one of the few things "Xena: Warrior Princess"
>>did well was how long it took Gabby to learn how to fight.
>>Miaka would need at least months of physical conditioning
>>and self-defense courses before she could use a knife effectively
>>against men who are accustomed to facing blade-armed opponents.
>>IMO.
>
>It's better than nothing. If you are that weak, you should fall back and not
>run out into the danger, also. She should have stayed in the real world if she
>was going to be such a wimp.
>
Spoken like a true Army general. :)
I'm sorry, but that line reminded me of when I worked around Fort
Meade. There was a Major who used to go to the cafeteria I worked at
from NSA. He always talked about the weak wanting to fight was wrong.
That fighting and defending was the work of the strong and that no
matter what, the weak only get in the way. I can't help but disagree.
I hope you don't truely believe this yourself.
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Puma Twins
<sili...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>puma...@aol.communist wrote in message
><384b8d44...@news.erols.com>...
>This contains some spoilers, so here's a little space for the wary:
Oops, I forgot to put a spoiler warning on my first message. ^^;;
I hope no one was to terribly offended. :p
>
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>>
>>Well, I liked her better than Hotohori, but she should have gotten a
>>clue. She was basically a human sheild. That was the only reason why
>>I could sympathise with her. Other than that, the story would have
>>gotten along fine without her.
>
>Soi had additional development and value. Nakago treated her as a lover
>while at once shunning her in favor of his agenda, and her background
>indicated to her that the emotional extent of a relationship was equal to
>the physical extent of a relationship. She was sold into sexual slavery, so
>abuse of this nature was nothing new to her. Watch the man who slaps her.
>She does not defend herself because she has been conditioned to devalue
>herself. When she died for Nakago, she was proving that she her vision of
>love had matured. In the manga, Soi beckons to Nakago from Heaven when he is
>dying, and he whispers her name. There was love in their relationship. Not
>traditional or romantic love, but it was still valid. It just wasn't
>developed enough for me to feel much sympathy for Soi.
>
I may have to pick up the manga if I have time. I need alternate
views on some of the characters. With most series, I could find good
points for almost all of the characters. I couldn't find good points
for all of the FY characters and that's hurting me.
>>
>>That is exactly the reason why I can't stand him. He had no redeeming
>>qualities except for his brother and Yui. Without them, he just would
>>have been some random killer. I wonder what would have happened if he
>>had Nakago's power. Everybody would have been dead.
>
>Suboshi never killed until he was driven to rage upon being convinced that
>his brother had been slain by the Suzaku No Shichiseishi. Besides, Suboshi
>also showed empathy for Ashitare when no one else would and stood by Yui
>until the very end, even uttering her name as he died. He's not a bad person
>fundamentally, but he does some hideous things because he believes he must.
>Retribution is the key word. Unfortunately for Suboshi, he has an immature
>concept of justice, so his version of carrying it out is to enlist the aid
>of Hammurabi's Law: An eye for an eye. It's a simple, effective method as
>far as he's concerned. He led a life of suffering from the age of nine when
>his parents died so to inflict suffering on others seems a natural act.
>Suboshi's grief mounted over a period of six years, but he still had his
>brother to care for him. When he was robbed of Amiboshi, he slid over the
>edge.
My biggest problem is not that he slid over the edge, it's that he
took out his anger on defensless people. He should have just attacked
his real target. I have been as annoyed if he had attacked Miaka
alone and left everyone else alone since she was the major cause of
his suffering. She nay have been defensless, but she was the cause so
it could have been justified.
>His violence aside, Suboshi had many moments in the series (manga more than
>anime) where he was a genuinely loving person to those who loved him back.
>One of the best manga scenes (which was edited out of the anime) is when he
>tells Yui that he cares for her and she gives him the bow to her school
>uniform, thanking him both in word and deed for his kindness to her. To a
>select few, Suboshi is a wonderful person. To most people, he is
>indifferent. To a small group of opposition, he is the bringer of death.
I agree that he was nice to Yui, Amiboshi and Nakago, but I don't
remeber him giving anyone else the time of day. To me it seemed that
he was questing solely for the power to beat his enemys.
>>I think the best measue of Amiboshi was when he lost his memory. He
>>was a completely normal person. There's not much you can hate about
>>some one who is selfless and fights for what they believe in.
>
>Alternatively, Amiboshi was being selfish in that he wittingly and willingly
>left behind his brother, indirectly affecting his brother's actions. He did,
>after all, admit that he never forgot his brother, and his brother
>*definitely* remember him, to the point of seeking him out at the slightest
>hint that he was still alive. Amiboshi also had that AWFUL line about
>wishing he'd been born a Suzaku No Shichiseishi. I love him for his role as
>literary foil for his brother, but I think "Kaika" was a weaker character
>than Amiboshi.
Oh, I never said he was perfect, but he did try to redeeme hisself to
his brother by offering Suiboshi his body. Also, I did not like Kaika
as much as Amiboshi, but I was using him as a measure not a sum total.
>> If
>>Suiboshi lost his memory, I could still see him beating up on small
>>children for the fun of it.
>
>Now, when exactly did he beat up on small children for the fun of it? He
>killed Tamahome's family because he was convinced that it was the only way
>to make Tamahome feel the anguish that he felt when he lost his brother.
>Suboshi would NEVER attack a random child for personal amusement. Suboshi
>isn't a thug. He can be an awful fool, but he's not cruel for the sake of
>being cruel. He's cruel because he's motivated. I won't make excuses (ie:
>the good, old fashioned, "Nakago made him do it!"), but I don't think
>Suboshi is half as terrible as most people think.
Okay, I know he won't beat up on children or kick a dog for no reason,
but I believe if he had Nakago's power, most of the people in the
series would have been dead. In fact, anyone that he had a gripe with
probably would have been dead. To miss quote a bad movie "He lacked
focus thus he was lead to the dark side." ;)
-Matt
General Anime Fan
Puma Twins
>>>> Galaxy Fraulein Yuna Returns
>> You're kidding, right? You don't like the Galaxy Fraulein anime?
>> It's great fun.
>> The 2nd series, the 3-parter actually has a serious storyline. I didn't
>like it
>> as much as the first one.
>> ~Shocked that someone who likes Tenchi doesn't like Yuna.
>
>And I'm shocked that there is *anyone* who can actually like the first
>two Yuna episodes. I mean, it's *exclusively* mind-bogglingly idiotic and
>*not* funny except for the very beginning.
Well, this is just me, but I thought it was so stupid, that it was funny. It
was a big parody. It had parodies of Tenchi, Oh My Goddess, Iczelion, and a
few other things in there. Besides, I wish more people spoke Japanese like
Shiori. That way I wouldn't have to ask for them to repeat certain words.
^^;;
>It is not like Tenchi Muyo at all, in fact I'm inclined to take offense
>to the suggestion.
>
Wow. I didn't know there was someone so against Yuna. It was meant to be a
fun anime . . . Until GFY Returns it was at least. In Returns, the Sailor Moon
/ Sailor Saturn referances kinda got dark. :p
-Matt
General Anime Fan