Crooked Auctioneers
sam
Hi Folks,
Lets open a new can of worms and see where they crawl.
Ron Mckinley [dealer] and David Ayers [auctioneer], were talking about
how dealers pool at an action and how this was illegal on both sides of the
big muddy pond. This is true, however the real problem that we have are all
the crooks who call themselves "auctioneers".
Dealers, listen to me and take notice if this is happening at any of the
sales that you attend.
1. Do they say: Okay folks, we have a small bid left by another
dealer on this piece. Who's going to start the bidding. [ The guy who
left the bid should start. Ask them how much the bid is. They won't tell
ya. If there trying to make as much money as possible for the owner, then
they should start there and go up.]
2. Who owns the items at this sale? The way things are here,
nine times out of ten, they belong to the house or auctioneer. I think that
they should make this fact known before the sale starts. Why is this
important? How often have you seen a item knocked off to a number that
isn't there and the auctioneer says " put that in the office for # 7 or #
1". If he owns it, he telling you that he wants more money then you bid and
where does it go from there?
3. The next auction. I've seen the same piece travel clear across
the state of Pa., and it was always listed as out of the estate of Betty
so-so, or Mildred Hum-Hum, or Harry Bin-Dead- For -Awhile. So I started
watching who bought this item. Everytime it was sold, it went to the guy in
the front row who also happened to be the owner of the next auction house
and if it didn't go for what the first guy wanted, it was on to the next.
This went on through nine sales and at all times, the first auctioneer was
there running it up.
4. Watch the back door. Watch the guy who always pays over what
you know it's worth, and see where he's from. Then listen to the auctioneer
say " out the back door, first truck on the left ".
5. This group in pennsy has grown in the last two years. They are
from Maryland, Delaware, Virginia, New York, Jersey, and Pa.. Sometime four
and five of the auctioneers are at the same sale, in a group in the back.
Watch for them.
6. This is why people are saying that things at auctions are going
so high. These crooks have us bidding against ourselves or atleast till
they get what they want. And believe me what they want has nothing to do
with what an item would bring at an honest auction. It would be the same as
haveing a auction at your shop and not letting anything go that was below
your shelf price. I don't know for sure, but I think what there doing is
against the law, meaning that you can't run up a bid on your own item.
Well, if it's not against the law then it should be. Now think
about what I've just said and watch the next sale that you go to, or better
yet ask the auctioneer if he owns any of the items and watch his face.
Let's hear from some of you folks,
sam
Ronnie McKinley
On 7 Jul 1997 18:03:08 GMT, "sam" wrote all about those lovely people
the auctioneer:
.......the Seller shall not bid for his property nor employ any person
to bid for him and ********'s alone shall have the right to bid on
behalf of the Seller up to the amount of the reserve.
In other words the auctioneer can run the saleroom up to the reserve,
which of course he has set and tuff if you don't like it.
I wonder how many people really read the crap on the inside of the
auction catalouge. Here's another one
....once a reserve has been agreed, it may be changed only with the
consent of ********'s
And here's a major UK auction house. playing the double, auctioneer
and dealer.
..... in the event of any reserve price not being reached at auction
******** are empowered to sell after the auction, by private treaty,
at not less than the reserve price, as long as the goods remain on
******** premises . in the event of such a sale by private tready the
Conditions of Sale applicable to a buyer governing the auction will
apply.
Utter cobblers, so I'll sell it to you by auction, but if noboby wants
it. I'll sell it to you after the sale. just as long as you pay me
want I want, and to hell with the fact it didn't reach reserve at
auction. NOT MY FAULT I SET THE RESERVE TOO HIGH.
I could go on for ever, total rip off merchants the lot of them. Get a
auction catalouge and read these peoples Conditions, in short I'll
play just as long as I win and you lose.
No wonder they are ringed.
Ronnie
_____
sam
Hi Ron,
These low lifes that I'm talkin about list their sales as " NO
RESERVES ", everything must go regardless of price. Ought to drown them
all in the big muddy pond.
sam
filmclip
I often find myself bidding aginst the walls and light fixtures.
The auctioneer is going so fast and waving his hands around,yet from the
back row I do not see anyone bidding against me.
I have tried to ask the auctioneer who I am bidding against and all I
get is a point in a general direction, last time this happened, after a
pile of merchandise kept going to #1 which happened to be right next to
the pile of stuff not sold, I walked out of the auction. I have called
the Maryland office that handles auction licences and they are
investigating. If more people did that I think we could get something
done.
Awopbopalu
Dear Sam,
How about crooked dealers? How about the crooked customers
(and there are some, let me tell you if you didn't already know)?
How about the bully on the schoolyard? How about liars cheat and
thieves in all walks of life.
Now, car repair people. I have always thought there is a special
reserved section, and a rather large one at that, for car repair guys.
Who is crookeder, auctioneers or car repairmen?
bopawopbamboom
Ronnie McKinley
Hi Ralph, a NO RESERVE auction. yea I go to those auctions as well.
LOL
Usually indicates the suff all belongs to the auctioneer, which he has
pick-up in a job lot for buttons ....... who needs reserves.
Last thing I had with ********'s oil painting, estimate by phone
probably by some graduate with a Geography degree, 2500-3500, sent it
over. some other ''expert'' no doubt an MA this time in Social
Studies, re-estimated 1800-2000. went to sale, and was unsold at 1000
means it made a grand, but they didn't sell it. So I get a letter
''Dear Mr McKinley we are sorry to inform you ....blab blab .... but
we would be delighted to re-offer for sale with 10% discretion on a
revised estimate of 800-1200 ..... blab blab .....'' They are
chancers, they put the big estimates on, only to get the goods in, and
make it up as they go along. The greed of these people is killing the
trade. Van Gogh's at 25 mil and 10 years down the line it's disclosed
now that some of these were Forgeries and nobody say boo!! If the big
boys don't give a fiddlers and set the bad examples the rest of the
minors just follow suit. At last the UK media (BBCTV AND C4) are
trying their damnest to expose the carry-ons of the big houses, and
power to them, it's about time these auctioneers were put in toe. It's
time the general public knew the real score.
Ronnie
_____
OXSHUNEER
< Okay folks, we have a small bid left by another
dealer on this piece. Who's going to start the bidding. [ The guy who
left the bid should start. Ask them how much the bid is. They won't tell
ya. If there trying to make as much money as possible for the owner, then
they should start there and go up.]>
"At my auction house the left or absentee bid is a service I offer my
customers who ordinarily wouldn't be able to attend the sale for what ever
the reason. In most auction houses the auction staff will try to by the
piece as cheaply as possible while competitivly bidding against the crowd.
If I were to start the bidding at the top of my left bid I would never get
another left bid from most customers again. Sometimes it's those left
bidders that keep me from going out of business. We walk a fine line
between servicing both our consignors & our buyers. You wouldn't tell me
before an auction how much your going to bid on an item, why should I tell
you what someone elses bid is ! As far as mystery buyers & house #'s go
yes I do agree with you that does happen in a lot of places. At my house
the under bidder has the privelage to ask & receive the name of their
competitor. If I pass an item you'll know it, no Games ! As far as
ownership goes many auctioneers do buy a lot of the merchandise in their
auction and aren't ashamed to tell you so, otherwise they would never have
an auction. Most consignors that approach me now a days the first word out
of their mouths is RESERVE. There isn't a major auction company anywhere
that doesn't excercise a reserve in some fashion & the only time it's
illegal to excersise a reserve bid ( for example an auctioneer bidding on
items he owns or bidding on behalf of a consignor ) is if you advertise an
absolute or unreserved sale. So as you see your definition of an auction
has a lot to do with what is considered legal or illegal. My best advice
to any one who is not comfortable with an auctioneers practices is don't
go to that auction. There are plenty of auctions every day to go to. In
Massachusetts alone there are over 2500 licensed auctioneers. They don't
all sell antiques but a majority of them would if the opportunity
presented itself. The pond is staying the same size but there are a lot
more fish in it & their all fighting to stay afloat.. Well that's my 2
cents worth for now.. Luck & Success to All !
David R. Ayers / New England Auctions of Brookfield
vist our web site at http://members.aol.com/oxshuneer/index.html
also at http://members.aol.com/Bidcaller1/Ruggles.html
OXSHUNEER
Careful now I wouldn't be making blanket statements about a group of
people. We all conduct our busnisses differently.
sam
Hi David,
I just don't understand your left bid idea. Now if I leave a bid on an
item, that means thats what I am willing to pay for it, right? Then start
it there!!!!! If it is a low bid, then I know that I have no chance of
getting the item, however if I want the item then I will bid as high as I
can and still make a profit. Lets start there and if it is a good bid then
maybe no one will make a second bid. Makes for a much faster auction.
I think the real reason is the item is yours and you don't want to set a
price for it. You want us to run it up against a phantom
bidder----------you------.
sam
OXSHUNEER
Well Sam it seems no matter what I say you have your mind made up about
how all auctioneers conduct their business. But until you witness my
operation first hand I would appreciate it if you would aim your pot shots
in a different direction. Like changing your terminology to some
auctioneers instead of auctioneers in general. Just because there are a
few rotten apples it doesn't mean the whole barell is spoiled. You really
don't want to start a flame war with me ! State your opinion & be polite &
be careful who you call a crook !
DR. NORMAN DEAN
In article <01bc8b27$b9c03c60$692c...@whispers.ptd.net>, "sam" <whis...@ptd.net> writes:
> Hi David,
> I just don't understand your left bid idea. Now if I leave a bid on an
> item, that means thats what I am willing to pay for it, right? Then start
> it there!!!!! If it is a low bid, then I know that I have no chance of
> getting the item, however if I want the item then I will bid as high as I
> can and still make a profit. Lets start there and if it is a good bid then
> maybe no one will make a second bid. Makes for a much faster auction.
>
Sam-
I wouldn't want to leave a bid using the system you described. When you get
an item at an auction for a hundred dollars that you would have paid 200.00 for
do you pay the house the two hundred anyway- that is the maximum you were
willing to pay. I don't think so, and why should the bidder leaving a bid loose
any shot at picking up a bargain?? If a house is going to accept left bids then
I think davids method is the fair way to do it.
no...@nowhere.com
On 7 Jul 1997 18:03:08 GMT, "sam" <whis...@ptd.net> wrote:
>Hi Folks,
> Lets open a new can of worms and see where they crawl.
<big snip>
for me, when i go to an auction, i don't care who owns the items, who
buys them, or where they go from there. i am only interested in
acquiring those items i want at the price i am prepared to pay. if i
don't get them, i go home. then i go to another auction another day.
as for starting the bid at the left bid price... if i knew that were
happening on my left bids, i wouldn't ever leave another one.
--
http://www.every-era.com Every Era Antiques ro...@every-era.com
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.
Ronnie McKinley
On 7 Jul 1997 22:46:16 GMT, oxsh...@aol.com (OXSHUNEER) wrote:
>Well Sam it seems no matter what I say you have your mind made up about
>how all auctioneers conduct their business. But until you witness my
>operation first hand I would appreciate it if you would aim your pot shots
>in a different direction. Like changing your terminology to some
>auctioneers instead of auctioneers in general. Just because there are a
>few rotten apples it doesn't mean the whole barell is spoiled. You really
>don't want to start a flame war with me ! State your opinion & be polite &
>be careful who you call a crook !
>Luck & Success to All !
>
>
Now Cool David, why is it (not just you) when folk are speaking
straight and with a bit of passion, it's termed a flame war, and some
folk start the whinging, in discussion sometimes folk DO RAISE their
voice :-)
Now auctioneers (in general :-) like to get left bids, in a catalouged
sale with pre-sale estimates with a bottom and top figure, and
estimates I may add the auctioneer arrived at, there isn't much point
leaving below bottom estimate, so by the start of the auction with the
auctioneer holding lots of bids, it is kind of in his advantage, don't
you think?
I have stood in pre-sale auctionrooms and heard someone ask the porter
to take a bid, they then give the bid to the porter and the porter
says ''Oh! we are already holding a bid higher'' and then discloses
the bid. You guys make it up as you go along. :-)
>In
>Massachusetts alone there are over 2500 licensed auctioneers. They don't
>all sell antiques but a majority of them would if the opportunity
>presented itself.
That's amazing. not the number of auctioneers, but the fact that any
''old auctioneer'' can sell antiques. We have the same problem over
here, every Tom, Dick and Ben wants to be an antique auctioneer, even
some of the traditional cattle market auctioneers over here have a
weekly or monthly antique auction, so how do these guys all of a
sudden get antique knowledge? all of a sudden know the antique trade
and marketplace? Seem like they all just work on some kind of
auctioneer formula. Think of a number, double it, but don't drop below
10% of it, and tell everyone the lot should make somewhere between
500-1000, get a few mugs to leave you middle estimate bids, seems to
me you guys can't go wrong, unless it doesn't sell, but Aha sure
there's always next week :-)
And btw why should you be so different, unique I think is a better
word :-) No flame, a discussion (this is rec.antiques) with people of
a different viewpoints, but supposedly all part of the same trade.
Ronnie
_____
Dan Erickson
I would like to agree with Sam on how there are a few dishonest
auctioneers out there. I have attended many auctions over the years and
have seen pieces that show up in auction after auction until it sells at
the "right price". I attend a lot of auctions in western Wisconsin and
have also noted a few auctioneers that put reproduction pieces in their
sales. Now they do not say they are originals, but they do not say they
are reproductions that the auctioneer has put in the sale to make
money. I guess the buyer has to beware. I have noticed that if the
auctioneer owns certain items in a sale the clerk will keep a separate
sheet with those items on it, so watch for the clerk to pull out a sheet
from the back of his book as a tip off to an auctioneer's item in a
sale.
-Dan
Chris Kocsis
Sam, I disagree -- I'm a bidder, not an auctioneer, and when I leave an
absentee bid I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT WANT the auctioneer to begin at my high
bid.
The item may well sell below my top bid, and I am blessed to have a
regular ringer for me at a particular auction house who will keep on
bidding on my behalf until my limit is reached. I have bought many fine
things at good prices, and my top bid is my *desperation* price, not my
desired price. This is the ideal absentee bid, a stand-in for me during
the regular process of an auction. It puts me on equal footing with
everybody else there, and I'm grateful for that.
I don't know if my winning prices have ever gotten a leg up from
auction-house chicanery. But I've done very well at many auctions and I
will continue to try to buy this way.
Chris
On 7 Jul 1997, sam wrote:
> I just don't understand your left bid idea. Now if I leave a bid on an
> item, that means thats what I am willing to pay for it, right? Then start
> it there!!!!! If it is a low bid, then I know that I have no chance of
> getting the item, however if I want the item then I will bid as high as I
> can and still make a profit. Lets start there and if it is a good bid then
> maybe no one will make a second bid. Makes for a much faster auction.
OXSHUNEER
Being called a crook is a flame remark & the writer doesn't even know me
or has never attended any of my auctions. I've been attending auctions &
been involved in the antiques business since I was 8 years old. I got my
first auction experience under the Late Great Gordon Reid ( Founder of
Auction Acres & the famous Brimfield Flea Market ). You don't stay around
as long as I have if you rip people off & cheat them ! I'm sorry many of
you have had bad experiences at some auctions, but don't take it out on me
just because I'm an auctioneer.
One more thing I don't hide behind a computer & take pot shots at people,
all my info is readily available on my web site including My phone #, Home
& business addresses, my photo & bio.. Regards.
Ronnie McKinley
In rec.antiques David Ayers wrote:
>Being called a crook is a flame remark & the writer doesn't even know me
>or has never attended any of my auctions. I've been attending auctions &
>been involved in the antiques business since I was 8 years old. I got my
>first auction experience under the Late Great Gordon Reid ( Founder of
>Auction Acres & the famous Brimfield Flea Market ). You don't stay around
>as long as I have if you rip people off & cheat them ! I'm sorry many of
>you have had bad experiences at some auctions, but don't take it out on me
>just because I'm an auctioneer.
>One more thing I don't hide behind a computer & take pot shots at people,
>all my info is readily available on my web site including My phone #, Home
>& business addresses, my photo & bio.. Regards.
>
David I for one think it's marvellous that we have an auctioneer in
the group and one that plays his part fully and contributes.
Unfortunately, you may find yourself in the minority, as most are
usually dealers and collectors, so it may seem like we are are taking
''pot shots'' but I don't think anyone, was picking on you personally,
and I for one would apologize, if you have felt bad vibes from me.
My posts refer to, IMHO antique auctions in ''gerneral'' from the
backstreet set up to the demigods in London. I think this is a good
subject needing input from both sides, and afterall the auctions are
part and parcel of the trade, both dealer and auctioneer can give it a
bad name.
My experience ''over the years'' has been the ever increasing power of
the auction houses, to directly or indirectly influence and sometimes
control the market. This I think became pretty obvious from the '80
and was strengthened by the boom of the late '80. And sure the
auctioneers have suffered hard times, but IMHO it's the same
situration today, the buying market is pretty well controlled by the
auction house. ...............Now don't give me it's the bidders that
make the prices :-) it's you guys, that set the reserves/estimates or
decide when to drop the hammer or when to pass it.
I find today it's almost impossibe to buy at auctions, I can buy
better from the trade or a collector. Now I would be please to see
your input to this, I assume you'll disagree with me :-).... but why?
It would be nice to hear the other point of view, the otherside of the
coin ......... so do you, think the auction house controls the price
we have to pay? or do the prices find their own levels? do you think
the prices we pay ''in gerenal'' at auction reflects the true merit of
the object, and whilst, the auction goer see a big selection of
goods, is he/she ''really'' getting a good deal?
Ronnie
_____
Elaine Gaul
In article <33C20A6D...@uwec.edu>,
Dan Erickson <eric...@uwec.edu> wrote:
>I have noticed that if the
>auctioneer owns certain items in a sale the clerk will keep a separate
>sheet with those items on it, so watch for the clerk to pull out a sheet
>from the back of his book as a tip off to an auctioneer's item in a
>sale.
But this can also mean that items from several different estates or
consignors are being sold at the same auction. The clerk will keep a
separate sheet for each one. Usually the auctioneers will try to run
through all of one group before starting on another, but sometimes bidders
who want to leave early will request particular items and the auctioneer
will wind up switching between/among the different estates.
Elaine
Roger L. Hackler
"sam" <whis...@ptd.net> wrote:
I, as an auctioneer can only speak for myself. If I have an absentee
bid on an item, I will tell you that. After the sale is over, if you
want the name, and number for that matter, af the bidder, I will
release it to you.
We run a clean, fair, and honest sale. If you were consigning your
items to us for sale, it would be your expectation and right for us to
achieve maximum money for you.
In Georgia, the laws are very specific. It would be insane for us to
do something illegal at the risk of the commission shutting us down
for a few measly dollars.
The bottom line....Treat all people, bidders and consigners fairly!
Creek Chub Nut
On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Roger L. Hackler wrote:
> "sam" <whis...@ptd.net> wrote:
>
> I, as an auctioneer can only speak for myself. If I have an absentee
> bid on an item, I will tell you that. After the sale is over, if you
> want the name, and number for that matter, af the bidder, I will
> release it to you.
I find that many buyers who beat me to an item on the internet or
elsewhere do not want their identities revealed. Do you inform absentee
bidders of this practice? Do you allow them the option of remaining
anonymous (as I would prefer)?
<snip rest>
*****************************************************************
* J. T. Vogt >>Insert Disclaimer<< jv...@acesag.auburn.edu *
* *
* ENTOMOLOGIST ANTIQUE TACKLE COLLECTOR ALL-AROUND NUT *
*_______________________________________________________________*
* Paying big money for pre-1950 fishing tackle, including but *
* not limited to lures, reels, and accessories. Will pay $200 *
* and up for reels and line spools marked "CCBCo." *
*****************************************************************
sam
Hi David,
I didn't accuse you of being a crook. What I did say is that as a rule
most auctioneers are crooked.
Would you say what these following people did crooked?
One auctioneer went to a ladies house to bid on the contents as did
several of us dealers. I bid 3800 on the pieces and figured to sell them at
around 5800. This auctioneer came in and told the lady that her things were
worth at least 7500, and if she would put them in his auction house thats
what she would make, less his cut. This made me and the other dealers look
like the crooks, because the items were not worth that figure. Well the
lady agreed but said that she wanted to be there when her items were sold.
The auctioneer said no problem but that it would be at least six weeks
before her items would be sold. Aweek later, the lady got a check in the
mail for 800 dollars for her items. She called the guy and he told her they
needed pieces for last weeks auction and put her's in. He was very sorry
but the furniture buyers just weren't there that week, so her stuff didn't
bring much. I talked to some people who were there and her peices never
made it to the block, they went to another auction where the auctioneer
kept all the money and payed only 800 out. Now David, is this guy a crook?
And don't tell me that he wont be in business long, because he been doing
this for about 15 years.
sam
WCG
"sam" <whis...@ptd.net> wrote:
This a excellent topic Sam. OXSHUNEER and Mr McKinley, you both have
valuable knowledge and I for one am glad you share your opinions and
insights about the business. Enough of that. Now, I can't help but
throw my two cents in here.
> Okay folks, we have a small bid left by another
>dealer on this piece. Who's going to start the bidding.
IMHO, and this won't be popular, I think left bids shouldn't be
allowed at all!! If you can't ATTEND the auction, tough luck.
Now, I know the person wanting to leave the bid could still get around
this by striking a deal with one of the auction personnell to still do
the bidding for him. My solution to this is that all auction
personnell should be identified and NOT allowed to bid on anything or
for anybody.
>Who owns the items at this sale?
>
Here I have to side with the auctioneer. They are business people.
They have gained market knowledge and expertise in the field and if
they buy items for the only purpose of reselling them at their own
auction, well, it's the same as any other goods-at-market. The
business owner buys items to resell to you at a profit. If you don't
like the price, you don't buy it! Now I base this on the items not
being misrepresented, such as your scenario that "this item is from so
and so's estate". I don't know if this is true for everybody, but at
the auctions I attend items are clearly marked with lot numbers. if
the auction has been advertised as "an auction for whomever's estate"
then I will ask the auction personnell during my preview which block
of lot numbers go with which estate. If they're straight up, they'll
tell you. From there you can pretty well figure out who is selling
what. I think the bottom line here is knowledge is power. Know the
condition and approximate worth of anything you bid on.
> 6. This is why people are saying that things at auctions are going
>so high. These crooks have us bidding against ourselves or at least till
>they get what they want. And believe me what they want has nothing to do
>with what an item would bring at an honest auction. It would be the same as
>haveing a auction at your shop and not letting anything go that was below
>your shelf price. I don't know for sure, but I think what there doing is
>against the law, meaning that you can't run up a bid on your own item.
>
I do believe this is partly true. I think prices on many items have
been artificially inflated by the auction houses that practice what is
described above. In an ideal world, the casual buyers, the collectors
and the dealers would set what-the-market-will-bear prices on antiques
and collectibles, the auctions would simply provide a service for
liquidating items and get their fair cut and everyone would go home
with a smile on their face. I can dream can't I?
Happy hunting, collecting and bidding out there! This game has few
rules, so learn all you can from people you trust.
Ronnie McKinley
On Sat, 12 Jul 1997 00:46:43 GMT, grtnwjg@-mindspring.com (WCG) wrote:
>"sam" <whis...@ptd.net> wrote:
>>Who owns the items at this sale?
> Here I have to side with the auctioneer. They are business people.
>They have gained market knowledge and expertise in the field and if
>they buy items for the only purpose of reselling them at their own
>auction, well, it's the same as any other goods-at-market.
No it's not. :-) They are supposed to be auctioneers not dealers,
can't play both games at the same time. I wish I could get a 100+
people in my shop at the one time and ask them to bid on my stock.
Tell them to disregard the ticket price, as it's only a price guide,
but at the same time a reserved price. I own a shop where people don't
''even'' pay me the ticket price, the auctioneer is there to auction
goods on the *behalf of a third party*, he's an *agent* and gets two
cuts already, two cuts are enough.
> I think prices on many items have
>been artificially inflated by the auction houses that practice what is
>described above. In an ideal world, the casual buyers, the collectors
>and the dealers would set what-the-market-will-bear prices on antiques
>and collectibles, the auctions would simply provide a service for
>liquidating items and get their fair cut and everyone would go home
>with a smile on their face. I can dream can't I?
>Happy hunting, collecting and bidding out there! This game has few
>rules, so learn all you can from people you trust.
Yes good advice. But alas the auction houses have forgotten the role
they should play, most of them want to play all the roles. They would
do well to try and understand this hobby and business a little better,
and stop jumping on every bandwagon that passes by, most of them know
little as to what drives us to collector, or the passions some people
feel, or the dersire to own an object, for the right reasons, all they
see are the $$$$$$$ signs. I meet many auctioneers that are dealers as
well, but I've yet to meet an auctioneer that is a ''true'' collector,
but I live in hope.
Ronnie
mcki...@netcomuk.co.uk
http://www.netcomuk.co.uk/~mckinley/index.htm
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When a Man has Married a Wife he finds out whether
Her Knees & elbows are only glued together
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OXSHUNEER
Not only am I an auctioneer I am an antique dealer also. When I go to
other auctions I don't care where it came from or who is bidding on it. If
I have a customer for an item none of the above matters. If you can buy it
& make a profit what matters where it came from & who is bidding on it.
Does the term free enterprise mean anything to anybody ? There are a lot
of people out there who just have to have something to complain about. I
think this sums up the whole subject !
WCG
oxsh...@aol.com (OXSHUNEER) wrote:
Why should the auction be the exclusive domain of the auctioneers and
the dealers? What about the casual buyers and collectors? They are
not concerned with the all mighty profit!! Free enterprise has to
follow rules just like any other legitimate endeavor. I think the main
point here is not just an invalid bitch session, but that a great many
auctioneers and dealers unfairly misrepresent and manipulate the
market. And it keeps getting worse! Please don't take this as an
attack on you personally Mr. Ayers, that's not my intention at all.
But for every straight up, honest auctioneer I've seen, their's three
that seem to have no integrity whatsoever.
KrenK
If nobody but those "crooked" auctioneers buys anything, wouldn't the
obvious happen. They would put themselves right out of business.
Yeass
I know just what your talking about. I went toa auction and they had a
set of dishes but they didn't bring the whole set with them. They said
that they would have the other half of dishes the following week. So
this guy bids on them and gets the set for around $35, not bad. The next
week this same guy is there waiting for the rest of his dishes to come up
for auction. Well wouldn't you know it some one wants them real bad and
the poor guy ended up paying over a hundred dollars for the rest of his
dishes. We just know the guy was set up for the kill. Why would someone
want an incomplete so bad.
All these great estate goodies that they were bring to selling from PA
kind of turned us off when we saw some of the items that we had sold at a
garage sale up for auction.
The one that we went to the auctioneer has his own shop so at times when
he would put something up for sale and wasn't getting the price that he
wanted the wife would start to bid on them, till she got the price she
wanted or would end up out bidding everone and take the item back home.
Now thast low. After watching that a few weeks and seeing the same show
we stopped going.
I have found a few good ones and got some great buys. The prices didn't
compare to that first joker that kept pushing up the price..
PS I'm not sure what to do, do I use signature? CC: Author? I'm new at
this.
Patricia V. Lehman
Yeass wrote:
>
> PS I'm not sure what to do, do I use signature? CC: Author? I'm new at
> this.
Generally people use a signature -- some use a real name, some an alias
like Bad Dog or Antic Mama. Just something so when somebody wants to
talk to you we don't have to call you "Yeass." Many people, as you'll
have noticed, also include a little drawing or a quotation (4 lines
maximum is considered to be good taste) but I'm a minimalist.
Also, when you reply, it's generally a good idea to quote just enough of
the message you are responding to so that we remember the original
posting. Not everyone sees the postings in the same order, and often we
see several replies before we see the one being replied to.
Welcome to the newsgroup -- people willling to share their experiences
add a lot to the group, and we are always happy to see somebody new who
wants to discuss antiques!
Tish Lehman (p...@umich.edu)