Jack Browns vs. Pasela vs. ??

[JL]

Hello All,

I am interested in some reviews or insight about Jack Brown tires. I
have plenty of experience with high volume 650b tires and not as much
first hand knowledge about plumper 700c tires. I ride 700x28 Paselas
(both TG and non) on a regular basis. Are Jack Browns a better ride
and/or long life than the 32 or 35mm Paselas? Are there other tires
that one should consider? Kojacks? GB Cypress?

Thanks
JL

[PATRICK MOORE]

Kojaks. No question.

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Albuquerque, NM
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[Aaron Thomas]

Jack Brown Green label are great. I much prefer them to Paselas (TG and non), whose tread I find squirmy. Jack Brown Blue label are ok -- a little plodding feeling, but still nicer than Paselas. I can't speak to the longevity comparison, because I never kept the Paselas on long enough to find out -- I just didn't care for them.

Kojaks are nice but felt sort of slow rolling to me. Among the tires you mentioned, here's my pecking order: JB greens, Kojak, JB blue, paselas. The GB Cypres are supposedly very nice and fast, but also reportedly fragile.

[PATRICK MOORE]

Wow! I had Greens on the Hilsen and find the Kojaks even better --
and they have a belt. The 559X1.35s on the Green Riv feel as fast as
the undoubtedly fast 23 mm Turbos they replaced -- they are wire bead;
the 622s on the Fargo are Kevlar bead but I don't sense any
difference.

Just for the record.

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 4:25 PM, Aaron Thomas <aaron.a...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Kojaks are nice but felt sort of slow rolling to me. Among the tires you
> mentioned, here's my pecking order: JB greens, Kojak, JB blue, paselas. The
> GB Cypres are supposedly very nice and fast, but also reportedly fragile.
>

--

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I rode 32 paselas for the first time last weekend and they were plush
and felt great. They replaced 32 Conti Sport Contacts which are
heavier and thicker sidewalls and didn't ride as comfy as the Paselas.

If you haven't tried the 32s or 35s, I would just get the Paselas and
ride as an experiment because you can get 4 Paselas at $15 a pop at
N*shb*r for the price of 1 GB Cypress. I think 32s are a huge
improvement over 28s.

Toshi

[William]

" I rode 32 paselas for the first time last weekend and they were plush
and felt great.  "

<Toshi translation services INITIATE>

...and by 'rode', he means 'crushed it for 190 miles all over Marin and Sonoma Counties on a 300k brevet.'

<Toshi translation services TERMINATE>

[Toshi Takeuchi]

Thanks Bill,

We had a great ride on a great day (Bill on his AHH and me on my Ram),
and Aaron on his Hillborne finished around the same time too. Yes, the
Paselas passed on their extended test ride ;).

Best,
Toshi

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 4:07 PM, William <tape...@gmail.com> wrote:
> " I rode 32 paselas for the first time last weekend and they were plush
> and felt great.  "
>

[cyclotourist]

And the 35s are an improvement over the 32s. Nice tires at any price.

Congrats on the 300K!

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Cheers,
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Redlands, CA

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[Steve]

I've ridden Jack Brown Blues about 6 days/week for around a year with only one flat... a one mm wide wire manage bend around the tread and puncture the sidewall. This bike is my work horse so I'd say they're pretty good tires. I don't have experience with the others but these are fun, cushy, durable and fast.

Steven

On Tuesday, March 13, 2012 2:20:35 PM UTC-7, JL wrote:

[Phil Bickford]

A little late here but, I gotta say;

The Green Jack Browns are the ticket. I've ridden Pasela Tour guards
for years, and the Browns felt like a breath of fresh air. IME they
can be run softer than the TGs without the squirmies that Aaron
alludes to.

I bought two pairs when they came out and three of the four are still
rideable. I did add the Panaracer kevlar tire liners when new.
Definitely got my money's worth.

Another one to consider are the Grand Bois 700x30 Cypres, though that
might be too skinny for this bunch.

Phil B

[Mojo]

I haven't tried Kojaks. Must resist the urge to add another tire to my pile.

I have been riding the JB Greens and love them. If they are slow they don't seem to bother ex-world class racers

http://www.bikeradar.com/gallery/article/pro-bike-andy-hampstens-cycles-strada-bianca-ti-16577?img=1&pn=pro-bike-andy-hampstens-cycles-strada-bianca-ti&mlc=news%2Farticle

 

I took my JB Green shod Legolas out for a flattish 40 miler to sunset this evening. It was a great ride and the tires were pure pleasure on chip seal and bumps.

Here is a picture of the Legolas from last spring http://www.flickr.com/photos/79695460@N00/5598979996/in/set-72157607471577085/

I decided on this ride this would be the bike for the Ride the Rockies in early June, subject change of course. :) 

I thought I would add some cream Longboards for the showers that occur nearly every year.

[Michael Hechmer]

I would second this.  I commuted for many years on Pasella's and found them a decent and durable tire.  Now that I'm retired I have recently purchased a pair of JBs, green & blue.  They definitely offer a better ride, and so far have proven pretty durable while riding a lot of dirt roads.

michael

[robert zeidler]

I use Paselas where durability is needed, i.e., winter bike, some touring, but they ride like a log wagon!  I like the JB's a little less than max psi. They hit a nice sweet spot.

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[Steve Palincsar]

On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 08:34 -0500, robert zeidler wrote:
> I use Paselas where durability is needed, i.e., winter bike, some
> touring, but they ride like a log wagon! I like the JB's a little
> less than max psi. They hit a nice sweet spot.
>

How much weight are you carrying, and how much pressure in the tires?

Either this is hyperbole to the max, your tire pressure is far too high,
or your Paselas are somehow radically different than the 32mm Paselas
I've been using on my Velo Orange during the winters since 2008. (I
presume these are non-TG, as are mine, since you didn't say.)

I have noticed if I run my tire pressure up over 85 both Paselas and
Grand Bois Cypres really start to hammer on rough roads, so I suspect
your "log wagon" ride may be related to using too much tire pressure.

[robert zeidler]

Yes I do run high pressure.

That said, the GB C's are very supple, just not as durable. I can live with that.

On a lot of bikes I run Open Corsa's at max to avoid pinch flats and, at 25c even, have yet to find a better tire. 1800-2000 miles about does it though. I can live with less if that should happen. I'm 6'6" and 230.

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[Steve Palincsar]

On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 08:50 -0500, robert zeidler wrote:
> Yes I do run high pressure.

I'd suggest before giving up on Paselas because of a harsh ride, you try
them at lower pressure, especially if we're talking about 32mm Paselas
(since JBs are 33 mm, it wouldn't be a good comparison to match them
against 28mm or narrower tires).

> That said, the GB C's are very supple, just not as durable. I can live
> with that.

Agreed, the Grand Bois Cypres are very nice tires and using Sheldon's
replacement tire to the front, front tire to the back replacement scheme
I find their service life to be quite reasonable. Not nearly as long as
a Pasela, of course, since there's probably twice as thick a tread on
the Pasela; but that's why I use those in the winter and switch back to
the Grand Bois "in season."

> On a lot of bikes I run Open Corsa's at max to avoid pinch flats and,
> at 25c even, have yet to find a better tire. 1800-2000 miles about
> does it though. I can live with less if that should happen. I'm 6'6"
> and 230.

How true to marked size are the Open Corsa? Are they marked 25 and in
reality measure closer to 23-24?

[robert zeidler]

Not giving up at all just using different rubber on different bikes.

On Friday, March 16, 2012, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> wrote:

[cyclot...@gmail.com]

Have you been using the Philip's on-line calculator? It works very well for me.

I did find that Jack Browns inflated to the recommended pressure are squishy in corners and didn't inspire confidence. I bumped them up 5 psi or so and haven't looked back!

[Bruce Herbitter]

I run paselas at 65 rear and 60 front and like them a lot

Sent from my Kindle Fire

---

From: Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com>
Sent: Fri Mar 16 09:02:25 CDT 2012
To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Jack Browns vs. Pasela vs. ??

[JL]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

It think I should give the Jack Browns a shot.

It is interesting to hear how everyone's riding style and use effects
tire choice so much.

I tend to notice the acceleration and climbing effects more than I
notice the impact on overall handling.

Most of my riding is short trips ( 30miles or under ) and commuting
(10 miles round trip).

Right now I have Pasela 28's and 35's to sort of switch between. If I
decide I need something in between (best of both worlds?) then Jack
Brown Greens are my next purchase.

JL

[William]

These threads remind me just how many really delicious looking fat 700c tires there are these days.  My new road bike came with some Clement model that I'd never heard of before.  Strada LLG.  They are a true 27 on Open Pros and they are rocket fast and really supple feeling.  The 120tpi casing presumably has something to do with it.  I'm scared that I'll get lots of flats with them.  They really feel like a racing tire.  

[Aaron Thomas]

I've been riding the Clement Strada in both 25 and 28. And I like 'em in both sizes. No flats yet in either. But the rubber on the sidewalls does seem a bit fragile; mine have a couple of nicks, though nothing that's cut through the casing (yet). 

As you mention, the 28s measure more like 27 on my Velocity Aeroheads. Kind of like a poor man's Challenge Parigi Roubaix, though in my experience they don't feel quite as fast as the Challenge. 

They're a nice option for winter riding, given their all black sidewalls/tread. Grime and muck don't show up.

[LF]

On Tuesday, March 13, 2012 5:20:35 PM UTC-4, JL wrote:

Hello All,

I am interested in some reviews... <snip>

 
If you believe Jan Heine's bicycle tire studies, rider experience is a poor measure of rolling resistance and tire efficiency. I'm a believer. Nonetheless, there's plenty to be said for what it feels like to ride a bike, for the rider's perception.  Unless you are racing, the experience is probably more important than the actual tire efficiency. I like the feel of Paselas (non TG) and of Jack Browns (green). 

My mind likes to wander on good rides, and so at various times I feel like I'm riding with bike eFriends -- Sheldon, Kent, Grant, Jan, Tyler, Andrew, Jobst, Patrick, Fast Eddy, Smokin' Phil, Fred, Disco Stu, and you -- and I am usually just in a dream world, not with them in reality.

When I ride Paselas, I smile with Jan, knowing I'm getting the most for my money, a good ride that's hard to beat. When I ride JBs, I wink over at Grant, enjoying a great ride, and thanking my friend for all his hard work and good advice. But then again, sometimes I just like slogging along with Kent on a heavy kevlar tire, getting there in just about the same amount of time, and with not one flat all winter long. The stock pile of Avocet Roads is sadly gone.

Best,
Larry
 

[Addison Wilhite]

I just bought some JB Greens to put on my Gunnar Cross bike so I've been following this thread with interest.  I'm hoping to use it while I ride support on a bike tour I'm planning for the local bike coop this summer.  I have to say, that Legolas makes me even more jealous that I didn't jump on those when Riv offered them.  What ever happened to the Legolas model?  Such a beauty!

--
Addison
http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com

[Andrew]

I have Paselas on the Long Low, and Jack Brown Blues on the QuickBeam. I am really preferring the Jack Browns - they are less squirmy on straights and in turns, and at the same time ride better over bad pavement, which seems only too abundant in Berkeley these days. I keep both at about 80 psi..

- Andrew, Berkeley

[charlie]

I have ridden the Paselas in several configs......and like them fine.
My current tire is the 700x40 Marathon Supreme and 35mm Panaracer T
serves on the SimpleOne. They are fast enough for me at 257 pounds.
Honestly I don't notice a huge diff in tire brands to a point but the
weight and general construction seems to make some difference. Most of
my perceptions about how one is better than another are based on
unscientific observation. IMHO there are too many variables to say if
one is better than another performance wise. A major concern of mine
is reliability.... without that the 1/2 mph difference in speed
becomes pretty moot. As to the tire pressure thing someone mentioned,
I think that really depends on load weight. A ten psi difference is
noticeable to me on pavement and under inflation for ones weight is
not the way to get comfy, fast or reliable. The longer I've been
riding the more I appreciate a reliable wide tire. The Jack Brown
seems like a fine tire being durable and speedy enough. I thought I
might buy some after the T Serves wear out.

[qwerty]

[PATRICK MOORE]

FWIW, I used Paselas, mostly non-Tourguard, for many years and
compared them to many different kinds of tire; my own judgment is that
they are decent but (1) very sensitive to pressure and (2) prone to
flats with rather fragile sidewalls. They don't roll or corner as well
as JB greens or Kojaks. I used the JBGs only for a few months and they
are nice but seemed to catch more flats than the Kojaks (also used for
several months -- currently on two bikes). The Ks seem to have the
best combination of rolling resistance and flat resistance. 175 lb,
goathead country.

On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 8:47 PM, charlie <cl_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> IMHO there are too many variables to say if
> one is better than another performance wise. A major concern of mine
> is reliability.... without that the 1/2 mph difference in speed
> becomes pretty moot.