Asking for your opinion on locking up a Riv

[Anthony Davila]

Hi! I posted a while back asking for advice on what Riv model would fit me and where I could try them. A month after visiting Riv HQ, I bought a used homer, which is arriving tomorrow!

Anyway the point of this post was to ask your opinion on this particular situation. I commute to my university classes and intend on using the homer for that. There's an indoor bike locker that is accessible to the public (do not need student or faculty IDs to get in) and I was planning on locking it up there. I will be using a chain lock for the front tire and the frame and a u-lock for the rear wheel and frame (possibly a cable loop for the seat as well). This room has a security camera but no active security personnel.

At most I would leave the bike there for 2 hours or so, would you risk this? I know that ultimately this risk is up to me to live with, but I wanted to hear some of your thoughts. I have attached a picture of the bike locker! Thanks in advance!

[Ryan]

I'd feel a lot better for you and the security of your new Homer if this locker was only accessible to students and faculty and you had to badge in. It's good that it's inside and you are only there for 2 hours and have 2 locks for frame and wheels...but not clear from this photo to me what the immoveable attachment point is. Are those pulldown bike racks of some kind? I guess if there's enough traffic in and out of this locker, a potential thief with whatever tools are used to break the locks would be noticeable, but it seems a little sketchy. Especially if you have night classes and there are not too many people around and someone has free rein at hacking your locks, out of the elements, with no one else in the room, while the cameras record the event with nobody monitoring them until after the fact.

For me...I would be stressing over that Homer and that is my argument for an understated but mechanically sound, fun ,  not horrible to ride beater that wouldn't blow up my world if it got stolen, but ...I realize this goes against one of the purposes of getting said Homer. A risk I might be leery of but you might be OK with.

Good luck with whatever you decide

[Anthony Davila]

Yeah I would feel a lot better as well, but unfortunately the room was built that way and the two entrances into it are just big halls. There are always students studying right outside though and I'm sure you would need a power tool to get through both locks I would use. Here's a better picture of the actual locking mechanism with my current Raleigh bike. I guess it also shows the entrance as well to the right there!

[Ryan]

Can't see that...unfortunately.All I see is the circle with the bar and opening as an image didn't help. Sorry. At least if people are around and they could deter a would-be thief, that's better. I might not be so quick to get rid of the Raleigh though

[Joe Bernard]

I probably wouldn't do this with my Riv Custom but I certainly would with my Clem. It's meant to be commuted on and locked up, sometimes we gotta take a bit of theft risk and enjoy the bike.  

Joe Bernard 

Clearlake CA 

[Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!]

Hi Anthony,

I have a similar situation and I’ll give you my perspective. 

My son inherited a Clem from my dad in 2020. That Rivendell sat in its box for 4 years until that son grew into the tall man he’d be and headed off to college. I had the bike assembled and added fenders and a rack so he could ride anywhere he needed to go. A lot of people told me I was nuts to send such a nice bike with my kid. But I could not bear the bike languishing in a box for another 4 years.

So! I went to the Hexlox site and purchased locking wheel skewers, nuts to lock the saddle, seat post and stem. I bought the best u-lock. I told him never to leave it unlocked and that was it. The bike lives outside, is probably getting rained on as I type this, and has been so far, unmolested. He rides it EVERYWHERE. He loves that bike because it gets him anywhere he wants to go and counts as a little bit of exercise. 

I say, take the necessary precautions. You, too, can get the Hexlox and buy some peace of mind. 

Grant once told me, if someone really wants your bike, they’ll get it. I accept that, and now I don’t worry about it much. 

Rivendells are meant to be ridden. I say, It’s a risk to use them…but a tragedy if you don’t. 

Leah

[Franco Rinaldi]

My biggest fear of my riv being stolen is how hard they’ll be to replace once china takes Taiwan. But I do plan on commuting with my Clem and locking it outside if my main entrance at work, downtown Manhattan where a security guard is posted.

Franco Rinaldi 

c:  646.403.0661 

-Pardon any typos, Siri typed this message-

On Sep 24, 2024, at 7:03 PM, Joe Bernard <joer...@gmail.com> wrote:

I probably wouldn't do this with my Riv Custom but I certainly would with my Clem. It's meant to be commuted on and locked up, sometimes we gotta take a bit of theft risk and enjoy the bike.  

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[Anthony Davila]

Thanks for all the responses! I'll look more into Hexlox, it looks great for locking down components and I've never heard of them before. Here's a link to the picture I uploaded earlier that wasn't displaying for some reason: https://imgur.com/a/oe7fjLZ.

[Stephen Merelman]

This seems fine. I wouldn't worry about a bike in that room for a couple of hours as long as it's properly locked up, particularly with people and cameras all around. 

I leave my Clem at the train station all day. It seems happy. No separation anxiety. 

smm

[Patrick Moore]

I'm curious how many Rivendell riders/listers simply park their bikes in their offices?

I was lucky in always having employers who happily let me park my commuter next to my desk -- one of them even gave me an extra office for bike and kit and arranged to have a wee closet with hanger pole and shelving installed. Perhaps this is one big advantage of always working for small organizations.

Now I am even luckier and work at home, but I still wheel my bikes into stores, and our priest, fed up with me wheeling my bikes into the library or men's bathroom (he really took exception to the Ken Rogers racing tricycle; but I have rights of seniority) gave me a key to the external utility closet at church.

[Curtis McKenzie]

Always parked the bicycle in my classroom.  Often there were six or seven student bicycles as well.

Curtis

El Cajon CA

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[mgst...@gmail.com]

My son has 2 bikes now at university; not Rivs, but equally good targets (a Jones and and a rando bike).  In addition to lockable skewers / seat bolt, we added a Knog AirTag/alarm to each of them, but more importantly: wrapped them both with duct tape, in several colors / wore it through / spray painted a little bit in various areas, etc. I don't recall the brand of duct tape, but many of them now come off residue free; we tried it, both when we put it on, and after 2 years; it came off, and the paint underneath was fine.  In addition, he locks it up with a Ulock designed to blunt angle grinders.  And filthy water bottles in the cages, and a beat up looking seat.    And goes without saying, never leave it locked up outside overnight.   

Whole frame seat post and bars are taped / the rack has a rusty basket zip tied to it. 

 

If someone wants your bike, they'lll get it; but around universities, esp the one he's at where there's a lot of bike thievery, they go for the easiest ones to steal. 

Ron in Western Ma

[Patrick Moore]

An enlightened school!

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[Michael Baquerizo]

fmri...@gmail.com<fmri...@gmail.com>

unread,

7:22 PM (3 hours ago) 

to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com

My biggest fear of my riv being stolen is how hard they’ll be to replace once china takes Taiwan.

lol, what?

[Kim H.]

In my days of going to college back in the 70's, the best ant-theft device I had was my own two eyes for my beloved road bike. I would never let my bicycle out of my sight, except on the days I rode my old 1966 Raleigh three-speed bike, of which I did lock up outside with other bicycles.  I took it to the bathroom, all my classes and to my bank without incident nor questions from other people around me.

@Anthony,

If you can keep your Homer in your classroom or office for a couple hours with your two eyes as your bike lock, I would do it.

Now that I own a Clem, my first Rivendell bicycle, I treasure it a lot in many ways. Once again, I do not leave it out of my sight. Upon my car, if I am transporting my bike from my home to another location to ride, I have a modified elongated Yakima Raptor bike tray with a knob locking keyed mechanism to secure the bike. Additionally, I have a thick cable lock that I run through the frame and up through the support arm and down under the tray. 

Kim Hetzel, who is susceptible to high anxiety of not wanting to have my bike stolen.

[Joe in the Pay Area]

First off, congrats and good luck with the newly-acquired frame!

I routinely lock up my All Rounder using 2 U-locks: one through the front wheel and around the down tube, and then the second to a significant sign post and then through the rear wheel and the seat tube. And, And, And I lock it up where people can see it! This room of yours seems to me to be too much out of the public's eye. No lock can stop a thief (who belong in their own separate ring of Dante's hell) but hiding the bike away out of sight is just, to me, asking for trouble.

On Tuesday, September 24, 2024 at 2:51:32 PM UTC-7 anthony...@gmail.com wrote:

[John Dsvidson]

I wouldn’t do it. Even with all the locks. I would feel to bad loosing my Homer. 

I would find/ or keep an old Schwin, Trek or other good riding, but clunky frame. Then I would spray paint it flat black and ugly. Then lock it up as you describe. I’m not losing any Riv to bike thieves 

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[Ryan]

Or just keep that Raleigh you're currently riding. 

[Josh C]

I posted a similar thread about a year ago, asking about commuting on a Riv, as I also had reservations. The thing for me is that my commuter ends up being the bike I ride the most often. I may ride more miles on my road-ish bikes but the daily gets the most use. I'll take it to run errands, go to work, go out for dinner/drinks, etc. To me, the purest form of cycling is the commuter/townie rides, where the bike is replacing other forms of transportation. I've since started taking my Rivs everywhere. I'll lock up my Atlantis outside of a restaurant, Hunq outside of a bar, and so on. I own several bikes but to justify buying a Clem recently, I've decided that it'll be my daily driver and just ordered new wheels for it. I'll fender, dynamo, front/rear light the thing and lock it everywhere. That bike will be locked up in public parking garages, in downtown Indianapolis for 13 hours at a time, several days per week. I lock them well with U-locks and a cable through the front wheel. I don't want to lose any of them, but I'm trying not to let the fear of getting one stolen keep me from using them. What's a garage full of cool bikes if you only take a junk bike every time you leave? That's my mindset. Folks in other areas may have different crime rates related to bikes but I'd guess most people think your homer is some type of old-fashioned retro bike anyway. Go steal an e-bike and leave me alone!

[Julian Westerhout]

I park my Clem in my office (photo attached).  When the weather gets snowy and salt my ancient Schwinn MTB comes out of the shed and it gets locked outside my building...   My Clem?  Inside! 

Julian Westerhout

Bloomington, IL 

[Ryan]

       Think I agree with Joe and Josh about Clems....which you can replace. Not so much for customs. So riding a custom to work is/was a non-starter for me. Before I retired I used my X0-1 with fenders and my PX10 (unfenderable with 700 X 35 tires) and locked with U-lock and cable thru the front wheel. In the last couple of years I parked in a parking garage that was keyed....though bikes did go missing from time to time. 

     

       I respect and even intellectually subscribe to Leah and others' viewpoints, but in a less-than ideal world I would leave the hard-to-replace/hate to lose bikes at home. Moot point , I guess, since I'm no longer working.

[Bernard Duhon]

Years ago I was at a bicycling event. I  was riding with a fellow who had an outrageously expensive Colnago. I was riding a second hand bike that cost me a few $100.

He asked me what I was gonna do to keep my bike from being stolen.

 

I told him I was gonna park it next to his.

 

 

rom: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Patrick Moore
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2024 8:03 PM
To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Asking for your opinion on locking up a Riv

 

I'm curious how many Rivendell riders/listers simply park their bikes in their offices?

 

I was lucky in always having employers who happily let me park my commuter next to my desk -- one of them even gave me an extra office for bike and kit and arranged to have a wee closet with hanger pole and shelving installed. Perhaps this is one big advantage of always working for small organizations.

 

Now I am even luckier and work at home, but I still wheel my bikes into stores, and our priest, fed up with me wheeling my bikes into the library or men's bathroom (he really took exception to the Ken Rogers racing tricycle; but I have rights of seniority) gave me a key to the external utility closet at church.

 

 

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[Patrick Moore]

Josh makes a very good point. What's the point of using a less satisfactory bike for most of your riding?

Still, the dangers of locking up do argue for a second, more disposable, if not completely throw-away bike. Others describe buying Clems for this purpose, and I've been toying with the idea of doing that myself; the price for a full Clem is pretty darn reasonable.

Long ago my latest custom Riv Road was hanging on the wall gathering dust while most of my riding was a long commute to and from work on various beaters (*). After a couple of years of this I had a local builder turn it into a fixed gear and enjoyed it immensely and much more often over 14 more years of errand and commuting riding until I replaced it in 2020.

(*) Tho' I have to say that 2 of those beaters were bikes I wish I'd kept: ~ top-end 1990 Diamond Back Axis/Access/Axes Team with ENO fixed hub and 60 mm Big Apples and a 64" fixed gear, and a late '80s (I think; at any rate, an early model) Raleigh Technium flexy flyer alum-tubes-glued-into-plumbing-pipe-steel-lugs + steel fork sports tourer, also set up as a fixed gear. The DB exhibited perfectly neutral handling -- IMO the high point of NORBA geometry, the Noodle was high enough thanks to a 10 cm Dirt Drop stem with rise to spare, and the high bb let me pedal merrily around corners. The Raleigh with then (circa 2002-2005) fat Vittoria 32s and the long stays and flexy frame made it ride like an old Cadillac; not fast but certainly plush. So sometimes there are good beater options. Still, the matter is one of inherent tension: between riding a much-loved bike as much as possible and putting it at risk of theft.

[Ryan]

Well Patrick, in reality, my X0-1 and SS PX10 made fine daily riders...so I think that mine was a Solomon-like solution.Daily commuting should be pleasurable and I also didn't have the cognitive burden of worrying about a custom and the X0-1 and PX10 are still here....now if I'd been occupying the corner office, I wouldn't think twice about trotting out the Rivs. In your earlier post you did mention secure office space, so totally makes sense to ride one of your lovely customs. 

Again, in my case a totally moot point. 

[Michael Baquerizo]

https://hiplok.com/product/hiplok-d1000/?utm_source=Google+Shopping&utm_campaign=US+Google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=40860&currency=USD&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw6c63BhAiEiwAF0EH1KK-KrJnR8sg3CoUqpz82OAPWGMmpQ1wgwSm31zqBFSmh-lbEfd5ExoCHt8QAvD_BwE

and 

https://www.pitlock.de/en/

and 

https://www.urbanbiketech.com/installation-guides/pitlock-hex-bolt-security/

a rivendell is well deserving of a hiplok. if i wasn't so cheap i'd have one by now. (i lock my riv up all the time, albeit not for prolonged periods of time in a scheduled way like work or a class)

pitlocks also allow for needling less things like extra locks and cables.

pitstoppers help with the smaller bits on your bike. 

[Eric Karnes]

I can relate. My current living situation required me to make the following decision:

(A) Lock up my current Riv outside in South Philadelphia (albeit under a rain cover and behind a locked gate in the back yard of a row house); or

(B) Sell it and not have a nice bike to ride.

Needless to say, I chose option A. Obviously, I’ll be absolutely gutted if my Riv is stolen. But if it means being able to regularly ride and enjoy the bike, I’m willing to take the chance. I agree wholeheartedly with Leah. I’ve owned two Homers over the years. They are wonderful bikes and we all pay good money for our Rivendells because of their beauty and ride quality. But if–worst case scenario–yours got stolen, with a little bit of patience (and reaching out to the RBW group), you could likely eventually find another. I know this is easier said than done and it would be a financial (and emotional) hit. But I say, ride it as much as you can. Even if that entails some risk in locking it up during commuting. 

Just my two cents. That said, multiple quality U locks (and cables) never hurt…especially if you can leave one of them in the bike locker at your university. And I’m going to look into these Hexlox…

[Anthony Davila]

Thanks everyone, I've been reading all the responses and decided to use it as a commuter even though I can see using a beater as a very safe option. It's hard to describe the room, but there are big openings and people right outside of them studying at all hours of the day. I think it would be really hard to run one of those battery-powered angle grinders without someone peeking in and realizing what's happening, so I'm thinking that it'll be okay. I'm looking around at different component lock mechanisms since it seems like a good thing to have.

Also, I wanted to say the Raleigh is going to my dad so it's not really an option for me to use after I give it to him!

Thanks for the large amount of responses and advice I got!

[Ryan]

Understood....great the Raleigh is going to your Dad...and yeah...get those component locks. It's good that your bike locker is not as out-of-the-way as I first thought.

Also show us some pictures of your new Homer! 

[Corwin Zechar]

I second most of what has been said by others. Nice bikes are meant to be ridden. Investing in a good solution for locking up your bike is wise - but not fool proof. I have lost saddles and other stuff from bikes that were locked up. I have invested in Kryptonite Faghettaboudit locks, Hiploks, and square link boron chains with heavy Mul-t-lock padlocks. But if someone really wants your bike, they're going to get it. They will bring angle grinders, pry bars, etc. to defeat your security solution.

I have used group parking facilities in the past. My first Rivendell Custom lived in one for about ten years. The downside of group parking facilities is that people can piggy-back on others entering the facility, linger after others leave and steal bikes.

The best option I have found, by far, is individual bike lockers. They are not widely available (probably should be), but they greatly simplify the problem. In the San Francisco Bay Area, you can rent a bike locker from https://www.bikelink.org/ for $0.03 - 0.05/hour. No need to carry a heavy lock or chain when you have access to bike lockers.

I realize most people outside the Bay Area do not have the option of bike lockers. But if enough of a ruckus were made, bike lockers could become widely available.

Regards,

Corwin

[Jason Fuller]

I use the Hexlox inserts on the allen bolts for both seatpost collar and in the seatpost clamp, as well as on both wheels (with allen head skewers). I do recommend these, though they can sometimes be fiddly to remove.  For locking the bike in place, as you say the risk level is largely personal, but two good locks would make me feel pretty comfortable in this situation - provided I had the financial means to replace it with a similar bike if I had to.  One U-lock and one chain lock is a good combo, since they require different approaches for a would-be thief. 

Also it might be worth considering using an Air-tag to track the bike if anything were to happen. I don't, but they are gaining popularity 

[Anthony Davila]

Hey Jason, thanks for the suggestion, I actually bought an airtag recently and 3D printed a case that can mount it under the saddle! Here's a picture:

[Feldspar Palimpsest]

I’ll add a couple of observations: If a bike is worth locking, it’s worth locking properly. Campuses are right up there with New York City as one of the highest risks places to lock a bike, and I wouldn’t use anything less than a Kryptonite lock with a hardened chain and a disc detainer type locking mechanism. 

Most tumbler locks (and all Master locks) can be defeated in seconds. Most combination locks can be defeated faster than you can dial in the combination. Cables can be snipped in an instant. There are a lot of fancy new bike locks that claim to be high security but are about as secure as a zip-tie. 

A $100-120 lock is cheap insurance for a $2,000 bike.

[rlti...@gmail.com]

And even the highest security lock is worthless if you lock up to something that’s easily defeated. Thieves will just cut the rack or pole you are locked to and take the bike somewhere where they can work on the lock. I always use a lock through the frame and at least one through a wheel so at least the bike can’t be ridden away if the thief cuts the bike rack or pole I locked to.

I just try and make my bike more work to steal and hopefully the thieves will think that it is not worth the time.

Robert Tilley

San Diego, CA

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 29, 2024, at 8:32 AM, Feldspar Palimpsest <michaelj...@gmail.com> wrote:

I’ll add a couple of observations: If a bike is worth locking, it’s worth locking properly. Campuses are right up there with New York City as one of the highest risks places to lock a bike, and I wouldn’t use anything less than a Kryptonite lock with a hardened chain and a disc detainer type locking mechanism. 

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[Tom Wyland]

I lock my Platypus at my office in the parking garage. My office is in a suburban area and I use one heavy u-lock and no QR locks (although I like this idea a lot). I also ride my Riv in the rain. My office is moving to a more theft-prone area next year, but they do have lockers there I can hopefully squeeze my bike into. My high-security setup would be one u-lock and one heavy chain lock.

One thing to consider is how others lock their bikes in the same area. In Montreal all the bikes have mid-range or better u-locks.  Where my son goes to school everyone uses cable locks or no lock. 

Tom

[Rory Woods]

Ron,

Can you share the name of the u-lock which is designed to dull an angle grinder cutoff wheel?

Thanks!

Rory in Walnut Creek, CA

[mgst...@gmail.com]

Hi - it's from Hiplock. They're expensive. My calculation though...if a bike is $3,500.00, plus all the time spent, dialing it in....another 8% as insurance...is worth it. Kinda? Also, the marketing from Hiplock says they're light.  Maybe on a planet with different gravity. They're quite heavy. But still worth the tariff. 

Check out the youtube videos / video reviews where people attempt cut them with angle grinders.  What happens is that the blade immediately gets dulled down / the teeth get worn right off by whatever stringy / strandy material the locks are made from (graphene?). So to cut one up would take probably around 20 cutting wheels, a massive amount of time, and a powered angle grinder, or several, because to run them way over load would degrade the motor.  Plus very noticable. 

And of course, really important what you lock up to.

THere's also an AirTag water bottle cage holder from knog which also has an alarm which rings loudly when / if the bike is moved.  This too is worth the $$. (we were able to get some $$ off with REI points).  We also hide ANOTHER AirTag way deep in the bar tape/brakehood, so when they take off the knog, there's ANOTHER one. That said, this hasn't been tested, we've yet to lose a bike (and in 50 years of urban riding, i've never had a bike stolen (and i was a bike messenger in NYC in the 70s). That said...i just got lucky.  And hopefully that will hold for my son in college, though no guarantees. 

I hope you enjoy your bike, and +1 with everyone who says ride the one you like the most (and i really suggest the duct tape too; that's a little harder to navigate, but it does make the bike look awful. I kinda like it).

Ron

[mgst...@gmail.com]

you can get an idea of the intentional hamfistedness of the tape covering. and again, it came off residue free. The tires are still blingy looking because of logo emphasis. But on the whole, the bike looks like a real beater, unless you're looking closely (it's a Jones LWB)

[Feldspar Palimpsest]

Even junkers get stolen. A friend who was a bike messenger in NYC in the 1980s to

D me that he and his friends were constantly on the lookout for old frames and parts, as the thrown-together bikes they rode in their jobs were regularly stolen.

There’s a bike shop not far from me with a reputation for buying any and all bikes that get brought in. They get stripped for parts for repairs and resale, and frames get a rattle can paint job.. 

[Bob Walicki]

I had (have?) a knog and an AirTag (hidden under the saddle) on a Surly Disc Trucker that was stolen.

I could see where it was and called only an hour or two after it was stolen. Cops were willing to drive by the property (on all sides) to try to get a visual, but unwilling to pull a search warrant. Bike wasn't visible from outside and It's in a fairly high-crime area of Chicago, so I do understand. 

But, still more than a little frustrating to know where it is (was), but not be able to recover it.

At this point, I'm assuming the tags have been removed, but who knows?

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[Patrick Moore]

Tangent, but not irrelevant: what, pray, is that cog pliers tool, and does it work better to immobilize cassettes against torque than the standard chain whip?

I expect it's this one: https://www.parktool.com/en-us/product/cassette-pliers-cp-1-2

Second, and most importat: does it work well to remove hard-screwed-on fixed cogs, or is it effective only to hold cassettes still?

Thanks.

[Armand Kizirian]

The most effective theft deterrent I've ever come across is this gadget right here. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0C27TVWHV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Louder than most car alarms. No one will want to deal with getting past your u-lock with 110 decibels in their ears. I keep one attached to my bike rack on my van as well.

If you hide an airtag, remove the speaker from it. Lots of tutorials online for how-to. Anyone can sound an airtag and find it. The best thing is to hide a decoy with the speaker detached, and one more typically placed unmodified. When they find the unmodified one, they will think they found the "one" while the other is tracking the whole time.

[mgst...@gmail.com]

I don't love that tool, it feels awkward; but also. many years using the normal chain whips.  I thought i'd give it a try.  Much more leverage possible w chain whips

[Chris Halasz]

Informational website for bike lock reviews (I have no shared interest): 

https://thebestbikelock.com