2014 Side Pull Sam Questions

[Ben Mihovk]

Good morning!

I have purchased (and am picking up after work today) a 62cm Sage Green Sam and I am really excited about it! I used the Wayback Machine to double check what Riv would have sized me in (seller bought at the end of 2013) and I've read Grant's "Reintroduction of Sam Hillborne" a thousand times. I've done a BOAT LOAD of web searches and dug through this group and there are two things I can't seem to find out...

1. Why might the head tubes not be painted cream on some of the sage green bikes? The pictures I keep seeing seem to only picture the 62cm Sage without a cream head tube. The bike I purchased is the same (which made me think the bike was older than stated until I found those pictures). 

2. Does the geometry I'm seeing for the 2017 Sams line up with where they were in late 2013-14? I'm 100% positive that I got the right size, just curious to poke around on Bike Insights. 

If you know more about either question, I'd appreciate anything you have to add!

Thanks!

Ben in Omaha 

[David Person]

Hi Ben, I have a 62cm sidepull Sam frame/fork form Riv in the spring of 2015.  Here are the specs I've measured directly from my bike, which line up pretty well with the current canti version.

Head Angle = 72
Seat Angle = 71.5
Seat Tube = 62cm
Eff TT = 627mm
BB Drop = 73mm
HT Length = 260mm
WB= 1106mm
CS = 463mm
FC = 653mm
Stack = 684mm
Reach = 390mm

David

[RichS]

Hello Ben,

I have a 2014 Sage Green Sam, green on the head tube. For that run some of the Sams had cream on the ht and some didn't. If you were making a purchase early enough then you had a choice. I didn't but I've never been disappointed.

Congratulations on acquiring a Sam!

Best,

Rich in ATL

[Johnny Alien]

Didn't it have something to do with the factory? Something like some of the SH frames were done at Waterford and didn't have the cream accents.

[Bill Lindsay]

I'd say ALL the 'early' Sam's have a single color, with no cream head tube.  Mine, bought in December '09 is all orange.  I'm sure some people might have gotten D&D repaint with a cream headtube.  I associate the transition to cream headtube with 'later' Sam's, and there were a couple ways that occurred.  Some got built at Waterford, and some of it may have been introduced alongside price increases.  You asked "why", which i take to mean "what was Rivendell's motivation to ever spec any bike without a cream headtube?"  I think it was to keep the price down.  When I bought mine in 2009, it was a $995 frameset.  There are several cost-saving details on mine.  No cream headtube, socketed dropouts, etc.  I don't recall what MSRP was in 2013.  Early Betty Foys were one color.  Romulus and Redwood were one color.  Quickbeam and Simpleones were one color, etc.  

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

On Thursday, October 28, 2021 at 6:13:13 AM UTC-7 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

[Ben Mihovk]

Good stuff, everyone! 

The one thing that makes me wonder, though, is that this BLUG post below makes it seem like the Sams that were coming out in early 2014 were produced with the 62cm Sage not having a cream head tube, but other double top tubes pictured have cream tubes.

https://rivbike.tumblr.com/post/68923093887/new-green-sams-came-in-today-available-for/amp

There's no mention in the Blug about the difference, though. Maybe it is where they were produced, though. I know I saw with the Wayback Machine a web special for sage green Sams that should have had cream head tubes but the painter messed up...they were being sold discounted...but I can't remember what year/month/day I checked and saw it.

It's pretty unimportant and I only ask because I thought it might be a well-known piece of Riv trivia (Rivia?).

Thanks again!

Ben

[Joe Bernard]

There was a darker green run - kind of a vintage Porsche color - around 2010 that had this "mistake", too. Some came without a cream headtube and I thought looked better that way. 

Joe Bernard

[Ben Mihovk]

Oooh...I think the darker green ones were the mistake ones I saw on the Wayback Machine. Now I NEED to find it!

[EricP]

My sage has a painted headtube. The earlier green one I had did not. Also, the earlier one did not have the two raised portions of the fork crown painted when I bought it. Took care of that with some white paint and a hobby brush.

While I have seen photos of the sage with no contrasting headtube, have never seen one like that in person. 

Besides the double top tubes, not sure there were any other significant changes. 

Eric Platt

St. Paul, MN

[Joe Bernard]

Here's the solid Porsche Green, I wish I'd bought one, I never see them now. Sorry about the clutter on the screenshot, I don't know how to get rid of it. 

[lconley]

My first Rivendell was an all-blue sidepull 56 Sam. It was discounted because of the blue headtube - $950 in December 2012. I later had an orange metal flake sidepull 56 Sam, which had the cream heatube, it was $1,150 in November 2015.

Laing

[James Warren]

Ben,

I'd have to do some research to answer all of your questions, but first I'd like to point out that my Sam is a 62 cm from 2014, and it just might be bicycle perfection. I hope you enjoy yours, and I really think you will.

I do recall that circa 2013-14, some Sams were painted single-color, some of which were greyish blue and then later sage. I thought they looked pretty good. I seem to recall your single-color sage looked great.

Enjoy!

-Jimmy

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[Ian A]

Didn't the very first Sams have a longer top tube as they were intended for upright bars? Then later runs had a shorter top tube?

I really liked the single paint blue and.green color schemes, except for the Tuxedo Sam which looks fantastic with the white accents on gloss black.

IanA Alberta Canada

[Ben Mihovk]

OKAY! So I have the Sam in question in my possession. I snapped a pick as it lay in my cargo area to prove to my wife that I was on my way home victorious, and it's my only pic that accurately shows the color (the few I took in my garage are affected by the yellowish garage light and I think distort the color). 

When I look at this picture from the Blug, they look to be two different colors...in person, mine is a bit lighter in color, but it's the lighting. 

The Serial No. starts M13...so it was made in 2013 (if I'm doing that right). After digging around on the Blug, I found a 2015 post (near the mid 30s in page count) talking about the sage Sams being cleared out and how they weren't as popular as the sam blue-cream version (though Grant insists they should have been). So there's that...apparently none of the Sage (which reads more light blue with a tinge of green) had cream head tubes. 

When I got home, I pumped up the tires, adjusted the SH, threw on a headlight and rode around a school parking lot a couple blocks away. Very fun to ride! Definitely zippier and livelier than the Atlantis...this bike will be a blast on long road/rails-to-trails/light gravel rides. Drop bars are going to take some getting used to, but I love the position it puts me in. After my quick test ride, I switched the RD shifter to friction mode. That CLICK is awful on index mode and sounds like bones snapping. 

All-in-all, I'm as pleased as punch! Can't wait to slap some new tires on this bad boy and fly! 

Ben (and his new Sam in Omaha, where there are actually hills, believe it or not)

[David Person]

I kept the announcement on the Blug from Jan 2014 when they introduced the updated version with sidepull brakes.