Roadeo or RB1?

[PATRICK MOORE]

Hardly have sold the Herse and I am salivating at the thought of something new. What I need, I say, *need*, is a gofast multispeed bike (with coasting capability); no gd fenders, racks -- I've got plenty of bikes that will take fenders, racks and loads. This would be for fair weather, no-load, cycling-kit-wearing (but wool kit), lightweight rides. No tire fatter than 28 and 26 acceptable.

Now I am sure that the Roadeo is a better bike and I know that fender and 32 mm clearance won't take from its speed; but the R would run upward of $4K minimum built with used parts, and I would hope to find a RB1 or similar classic for less.

I want something that is fast to accelerate, climbs well, corners "intuitively" and that will well fit a long torso and short limbs. 

Perhaps I ought to convert my 1999 650C Joe Starck fixie custom to a gearie (having converted my '03 Curt gearie to a fixed commuter). Actually, now that I think of that, this might make sense -- unless I convert the '99 to a trike.

Seriously, Rodeo or RB1 or clone?

--
Patrick Moore
Albuquerque, NM
For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW
http://resumespecialties.com/index.html

[robert zeidler]

It's a nice problem to have.
When I went that route, I went Calfee (gasp!)

RGZ

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[PATRICK MOORE]

Several listers have mentioned Calfee. Maybe this would be a place where a CF bike would be appropriate. I'd love to hear comparos of Calfees with other, more Rivendellian models.

Tho' I fear to hear what a Calfee costs ...

[robert zeidler]

Without options it's pushing $3K for a frame.

[PATRICK MOORE]

Cheaper than a custom Riv!! I'll keep Calfee in mind.

$500 less than a custom Riv!!

So, how does it ride?

On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 2:34 PM, robert zeidler <zeidler...@gmail.com> wrote:

Without options it's pushing $3K for a frame.

[robert zeidler]

Responsive, light, comfy, light. Did I mention light?  Light enough to notice.

On Sunday, January 1, 2012, PATRICK MOORE <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

[dougP]

Patrick:

Note that Calfee has a model that takes fenders, on the off chance you
change your mind (never happesn, right?). The So Cal Riv group did a
mostly off road ride a few months back & Joe Bartoe did it on his
carbon Calfee, no worries.

dougP

On Jan 1, 1:39 pm, robert zeidler <zeidler.rob...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Responsive, light, comfy, light. Did I mention light?  Light enough to
> notice.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, January 1, 2012, PATRICK MOORE <bertin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Cheaper than a custom Riv!! I'll keep Calfee in mind.
> > $500 less than a custom Riv!!
> > So, how does it ride?

> > On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 2:34 PM, robert zeidler <zeidler.rob...@gmail.com>

> wrote:
>
> >> Without options it's pushing $3K for a frame.
>
> > --
> > Patrick Moore
> > Albuquerque, NM
> > For professional resumes, contact
> > Patrick Moore, ACRW
> >http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>
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> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>
> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.> For more options, visit this group at
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
>
>
>

> - Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Will]

Why not have Riv build up a go-fast San Marcos? Geometry's right.

[Kelly Sleeper]

Well my wife sold her extralite Merlin and then went to the Roadeo.. hasn't looked back.. the Merlin just sat there .. she finally sold it. The Roadeo is light and quick and fun to ride fast.
If you just want cf then Calfee is a great choice ... Roadeo is the fast and comfortable choice with options for changing attitudes.

[robert zeidler]

Kelly, as usual, makes sense.
The next bike, if there is a next bike, I get will be another Riv Custom, set up to accept multiple wheel-sets for knobbies, smooth road light and skinny, rough road fat and comfy, 700 and 650 if possible. A Swiss Army knife kind of thing.

On Sunday, January 1, 2012, Kelly Sleeper <tksl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Well my wife sold her extralite Merlin and then went to the Roadeo.. hasn't looked back.. the Merlin just sat there .. she finally sold it.  The Roadeo is light and quick and fun to ride fast.
> If you just want cf then Calfee is a great choice ... Roadeo is the fast and comfortable choice with options for changing attitudes.
>

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[Mike]

The Calfee got a favorable review in BQ recently. Why not a Waterford,
Gunnar or Bilenky? Or just go with the Roadeo. The Soma/Riv San
Marcos?

--mike

[cyclotourist]

Robert, I did that with my All-Rounder. I now kind of regret it. I
would rather have gone the two (or three!) dedicated bikes route than
the one bike to rule them all way I went.

On 1/1/12, robert zeidler <zeidler...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Kelly, as usual, makes sense.
> The next bike, if there is a next bike, I get will be another Riv Custom,
> set up to accept multiple wheel-sets for knobbies, smooth road light and
> skinny, rough road fat and comfy, 700 and 650 if possible. A Swiss Army
> knife kind of thing.

--
Cheers,
David
Redlands, CA

**

[robert zeidler]

I have 2 Bilenkys. Stephen is great to work with but has missed the promised date both times.
You can see my first one (they called it Big Blue) in Google images, pictured with his daughter Bina.

[robert zeidler]

Maybe you're right.... More is better.
My nod to consumerism.

[Steve Palincsar]

On Sun, 2012-01-01 at 18:02 -0500, robert zeidler wrote:
> Kelly, as usual, makes sense.
> The next bike, if there is a next bike, I get will be another Riv
> Custom, set up to accept multiple wheel-sets for knobbies, smooth road
> light and skinny, rough road fat and comfy, 700 and 650 if possible. A
> Swiss Army knife kind of thing.
>

As you know, the tools on a multi-tool or Swiss Army knife are typically
inferior to dedicated tools. What you're describing can only end up a
half-assed compromise, inferior in every aspect to a bike designed for
that role.

However, if you want a bike that can be fast and comfortable on pavement
and also competent on gravel, let me suggest a bike built around the
650B Hetre tire, like my MAP Randonneur, or Jan's new Herse.

[robert zeidler]

Intetesting thought.

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[Pondero]

In early fall, I wanted a bike like that, but couldn't afford the
Roadeo. So I found a 1984 Trek 660. I cleaned it up, put some Grand
Bois Cerf's on it, and was pleasantly surprised (astonished) by how
good it rides. It met my objective perfectly.

[robert zeidler]

And let me say, Sir, that I enjoy your blog and would love to come out for your group ride next (this) year.

[robert zeidler]

I have several bikes with Cerf's and love them. I enjoy the ride although I don't buy the "they're just as fast as skinnier tires" for a second. They are, though, very good.

On Sunday, January 1, 2012, Pondero <cj.sp...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Steve Palincsar]

On Sun, 2012-01-01 at 18:51 -0500, robert zeidler wrote:
> I have several bikes with Cerf's and love them. I enjoy the ride
> although I don't buy the "they're just as fast as skinnier tires" for
> a second. They are, though, very good.

What do you mean? Cerfs /are/ skinny tires.

[robert zeidler]

As opposed to 20, 22 etc. Too narrow for me but the TDF guys use them for a reason.

[Kelly Sleeper]

z-man.. stiff racing wheels, light narrow tires, and that aero riding position do make a difference.. when you think the at going from drops to hoods at say 20ish mph is a 2 mph penalty then taking the riv and raising the bars then adding the weight of the tires and tubes.. yes sir you will be slower.
get ride of the odometer and it still rides and feels quick.. and for sport riding I don't really notice it.. but it is slower.. not just tires through... it's a package.

So a century takes 45 minutes longer.. I'm much more comfortable.

Kelly

[Kelly Sleeper]

The ROADEO isn't a swiss army knife. It's a lite go fast bike. With more to offer than most other lite go fast bikes. Come on down to ST Louis and take an extended test ride.. have a 61 cm in the garage.

Kelly

[robert zeidler]

Kelly,
I'm down in Fl on vac and doing a 200k brevet with the Gainesville Cycling Club this Saturday. I want to ride it fast but want to enjoy it, which usually means latching onto a group of riders and riding with them.
I'm on a titanium Serotta I keep down here, on 23's ( the roads are flawless). Will speed or the social aspect prevail? Probably somewhere in the middle.
When I return to CT I plan on doing some rides in the Boston, Berkshire, and Vermont Brevet series. When I do them I want to enjoy them. More Cyclotourist than Randonneur.
When I read Jan's description of riding across the Pyrenees, I was saddened by the fact he rode through the night, sacrificing all for a e.t.  
That pretty much landed me in the Cyclotourist camp, or at least in the "daytime hours only" Rando camp.
As Pondero has said, "fun is the highest priority".
Sayin'?

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[robert zeidler]

That won't work for me brother!  I'm 64cm at a minimum. I have one of every Riv that will fut me.
I've drunk the Kool-Aid.
But I have some Serottas, Bilenky's, and a Calfee that are also great.

[Kelly Sleeper]

Z-Man.. I've made all my speed goals and done to many centuries.. did RAIN and realized I didn't want to do ultra long distance riding.. Everyone in my groups are basically go fast bikes but my AHH keeps up with a dyno light. It's the engine not the bike... but the hammer head group I used to ride with is no more for me... for those I would and do see the need for 11 speed cassettes.. I hated getting caught in-between gears while barely hanging on.. so more closer better ...

I do regret selling this one.. oops other thread.. but just because it was pretty and had some truly high speed downhills on it... for me anyway 65 mph is really fast..

http://www.flickr.com/photos/tksleeper/5155759637/in/set-72157625210417815

It did fast very very well... and for that type of bike it was comfortable. shrug

I'll keep the AHH all day long.

Kelly

[robert zeidler]

Amen!

On Sunday, January 1, 2012, Kelly Sleeper <tksl...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Kelly Sleeper]

My 67 is a tad small for me .. but I can make the 61 ROADEO work for a test ride.. just lots of seat post.. then lower the bars and give it that aggressive plastic bike look.. lol

That won't work for me brother! I'm 64cm at a minimum. I have one of every Riv that will fut me.

- show quoted text -

[robert zeidler]

If only I could get GP to make the Roadeo in a bigger size.

On Sunday, January 1, 2012, Kelly Sleeper <tksl...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Bill M.]

Patrick,

I am lucky enough to have both a Calfee Tetra Pro and a 1995 Riv Road
Standard. The Calfee is lighter by several pounds, and feels more
responsive and racy. The first time I rode it up a short 8% climb
(the only 'hill' within 20 miles of my house) I was astonished at the
gear I used, a couple or three cogs higher than I was used to using.
That evens out on a longer climb, of course, but the Calfee really
jumps when I try to crank up some speed. I also find I have fewer
problems with hand numbness on the Calfee despite the bars being a
couple of cm lower. I credit that to a different fit, the compact
bars on the Calfee vs. Noodles on the Riv, and the Brooks on the Riv
vs. the modern saddle on the Calfee. On the Brooks I'm always hunting
for that magic adjustment that will keep me in place without hand
pressure, but not squish my softer bits. I may never find it. Too
bad, the Brooks looks so good on the dark green Riv.

I bought the Calfee frame slightly used for about 1/3 the price of a
new one, or 1/2 the price of a new Roadeo. For that price it was a no-
brainer. I use it strictly for club rides where I will be pushing
myself hard, and don't carry more gear than will fit in my jersey
pockets. I's a great bike for that kind of behavior.

The Riv is currently outfitted quasi-Passhunter style, with low
gearing (46/30 x 11/32) and 32 mm Rando Hypers (they *barely* fit). I
ride it when I'm out solo, and have a more relaxed attatude. The
Riv's drivetrain and wheels should eventually move over to a Rawland
Nordavinden that will handle the bigger rubber with some room for
error, and the Riv will revert to use as a fixed gear, maybe with an
S3X IG hub.

Bill

On Jan 1, 1:32 pm, PATRICK MOORE <bertin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Several listers have mentioned Calfee. Maybe this would be a place where a
> CF bike would be appropriate. I'd love to hear comparos of Calfees with
> other, more Rivendellian models.
>
> Tho' I fear to hear what a Calfee costs ...
>
> On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 2:23 PM, robert zeidler <zeidler.rob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > It's a nice problem to have.
> > When I went that route, I went Calfee (gasp!)
>
> > RGZ
>
> > On Sunday, January 1, 2012, PATRICK MOORE <bertin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hardly have sold the Herse and I am salivating at the thought of
> > something new. What I need, I say, *need*, is a gofast multispeed bike
> > (with coasting capability); no gd fenders, racks -- I've got plenty of
> > bikes that will take fenders, racks and loads. This would be for fair
> > weather, no-load, cycling-kit-wearing (but wool kit), lightweight rides. No
> > tire fatter than 28 and 26 acceptable.
> > > Now I am sure that the Roadeo is a better bike and I know that fender
> > and 32 mm clearance won't take from its speed; but the R would run upward
> > of $4K minimum built with used parts, and I would hope to find a RB1 or
> > similar classic for less.
> > > I want something that is fast to accelerate, climbs well, corners
> > "intuitively" and that will well fit a long torso and short limbs.
> > > Perhaps I ought to convert my 1999 650C Joe Starck fixie custom to a
> > gearie (having converted my '03 Curt gearie to a fixed commuter). Actually,
> > now that I think of that, this might make sense -- unless I convert the '99
> > to a trike.
> > > Seriously, Rodeo or RB1 or clone?

>
> > > --
> > > Patrick Moore
> > > Albuquerque, NM
> > > For professional resumes, contact
> > > Patrick Moore, ACRW
> > >http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
>

> > > --
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> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>

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[Mike]

On Jan 1, 6:48 pm, robert zeidler <zeidler.rob...@gmail.com> wrote:

> When I read Jan's description of riding across the Pyrenees, I was saddened
> by the fact he rode through the night, sacrificing all for a e.t.

I just read that article last night and loved it. It's probably my all-
time favorite BQ article so far.

One of the most beautiful and surreal experiences I ever had on a bike
was riding solo over Ochoco Pass a few years ago on a 600k. I summited
around midnight after starting at 5am and riding through 100 degree
weather.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/41335973@N00/3585178807/in/set-72157619102429316/

I should add that if I were riding the route Jan road I'd much rather
take my time and enjoy it, maybe do it over 3 or 4 days.

--mike

[ted]

Though it may sound heretical here, if you want a light quick road
bike w/o fender and rackability old quill stem steel race bikes can be
very nice. I have a late 70s or early 80s Gios that is fairly light
(sub 20 I think) and very fun for rides with race clubs, crits etc.
It may be the only steel bike round here with a powertap on it, and
tends to draw comments and questions, but it just works.

[Bertin753]

Thanks, Bill -- useful perspective. I will consider used cf (as well as titanium) if and when. My problem is that I've not ridden a racing bike with modern geometry, so it's good to have esperienced opinions from those who share certain fit and handling preferences,

Fwiw, my experiences with Brooks saddles is the same as yours. I went back to Flites and Turbos.

Patrick Moore
Typed with two thumbs on my
iPhone

[Jim Mather]

On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:48 PM, ted <ted....@comcast.net> wrote:

Though it may sound heretical here, if you want a light quick road
bike w/o fender and rackability old quill stem steel race bikes can be
very nice. I have a late 70s or early 80s Gios that is fairly light
(sub 20 I think) and very fun for rides with race clubs, crits etc.
It may be the only steel bike round here with a powertap on it, and

tends to draw comments and questions, but it just works.--

I second this motion. You can get a 70s or 80s stage race bike for a pretty reasonable price. I've seen complete Colnagos in the $1200 range, or frameset for $400. If you go for a less well known brand, like the Dutch Gazelle, you can find a frameset for $200.


jim m
wc ca


“Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.”  C. Hitchens

[René Sterental]

My butt has found happiness on the Berthoud touring saddles, FWIW. I believe both Wallingford and René Herse offer a 6 month return period, so you may want to try them I you want to keep the leather saddle and be comfortable at the same time.

All my bikes now have them.

René

[Ely Rodriguez]

Hi Patrick,
Happy New Years!
I wonder what the geometry and tubing differences are between the two? I've always liked my RB-1's, my fastest brevet was on one.
Does anyone know the tubing specs?
Ely

[William]

Responding to Patricks original post.  

I filled that description with a 1984 Trek 770.  It features standard diameter 531 tubing, and takes 28s (Roly-Poly).  I bought the complete bike from the original owner for $600.  I then parted out the Campagnolo Super Record stuff through the regular channels.  At the moment my running total has me owning the frame/fork/headset/saddle/wheelset/handlebar for a total outlay of $25.  It takes 28s and doesn't even hint at racks or fenders, because it has no brazeons.  I'm supremely happy with it.  It's got a 2x7 compact double drivetrain on it now, and I will be using it on brevets this year.  I've even got it set up with a decaleur and have ridden it with a sizeable handlebar bag, despite the guarantees that such a setup is absolutely unrideable.  

As willing as you've demonstrated yourself to be in parting things out, I think this route could be fruitful for you as well.  There are good geo-charts available for both Trek and Bridgestone online, so you could buy off craigslist without having to ask a bunch of sizing minutia from your seller.  

I keep a 1992 RB1 at a family vacation home in the midwest as well.  No need for compact double out in the cornfields.

[PATRICK MOORE]

Thanks for all the replies, suggestions and offers of various bikes (too poor for the nonce to buy one). I like the old racing bike idea and, actually, before I bought the Herse, had thought of priddying up the '73 Motobecane that I in fact sold to Eric Norris of this list -- light, toute 531 leger and nice handling with long stays and nimble front. Which brings me full circle to the original thread: I rather regret now (20 years after the fact) selling my 1989, Sante equipped all 531C Falcon: shitty, Britain-in-industrial-decline paint job and wheels and tasteless Sante powdercoat, but a nice, long-stayed, short front-center frame that would have made a very decent gofast with some decent wheels and properly set up.

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Albuquerque, NM
For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW

http://resumespecialties.com/index.html

[Kelly Sleeper]

Unless its just to save money I don't believe the older race bike are equal or even close substitute for the Roadeo. My opinion of course..

Kelly

[PATRICK MOORE]

OK: That's what I want to hear. Please give reasons -- details: handling, fit, comfort etc. -- as to why one might want to pay $4K minimum for a Roadeo compared to half or less for a nice, high end but old road bike like some of those mentioned.

I love my customs' handling; the handling of the Sam Hill was disappointing; the Herse fit like my customs but didn't handle quite as well (tho' that may be due to my preference for higher trail); the '73 Motobecane was lighter, uglier and handled almost as well as the customs and fit not quite as well. The Falcon would probably have been a wonderfully fitting and handling bike if I had known (thanks to Grant's intervention) how to set it up. The Calfees and Treks and RB1s have been praised for their handling and fit.

So please give details about why the Roadeo is the unquestioned reasonable choice.

I am not interested in fenders or tires larger than 28, nor am I interested (for the purposes of this discussion) in fineness of joinery or cosmetic details. Just fit (or potential for fit) and, above all, handling.

Thanks.

On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Kelly Sleeper <tksl...@gmail.com> wrote:

Unless its just to save money I don't believe the older race bike are equal or even close substitute for the Roadeo.  My opinion of course..

Kelly

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[robert zeidler]

This reminds me of that clasdic scene from Animal House. CF on one shoulder, Steel on the other...

[James Warren]

Well, this decides it for you then: RB1.

[dpco]

Patrick,
I can't justify the cost of a new Roadeo to you, but I can explain my opinions regarding my feelings about the Roadeo being a dramatic improvement over the 531/sl frames of the past. By the way, I still own a Basso Loto SLX frameset. First, the my Roadeo frameset is lighter than my Basso frameset.
Second, my Roadeo is much more stable on high speed turns( especially on ruff surface). Third, I have experienced shimmy on my Basso( the frame has very little lateral stiffness). With the modern large diameter, thin walled steel tubes, the Roadeo is very stiff laterally( no shimmy, whatsoever). However, the frameset still has the vertical springy,steel feeling. And this is with a fairly, stiff fork. Some people will not feel these differences, but to me, I notice this immediately. This may not justify the cost difference, but to me it was worth it. "To each its own"
Don C.

[William]

He should just buy my Trek (or my RB1) so I can get a Roadeo.  :)

[Kelly Sleeper]

Well then Patrick maybe you should try the ugly bike fitness forum. I'm sorry last I looked I was in a Rivendell owners forums where Riv's need not be defended. Really you think anyone else on here can give you a review of how a Roadeo will fit you? Do you really think a 20lb bike is too heavy for you 28mm tires?

Consider your baiting a success.. and thanks for the laugh.. :)

Happy New Year

Kelly

[Joe Bernard]

I vote for the Roadeo because Kelly's right, this is a Rivendell forum; and they're totally bitchin.

[newenglandbike]

"I am not interested in fenders or tires larger than 28, nor am I interested (for the purposes of this discussion) in fineness of joinery or cosmetic details. Just fit (or potential for fit) and, above all, handling."

In that case you should just get early 80's Centurion LeMans, Raliegh Comp., Nishiki International, Panasonic, or similar for like half what you will pay for the RB1.   Great bikes.  There are plenty of bikes just as good if not better than an RB1 in the above respects, without the RB1's attendant cache & price tag (which is in no small part due to the subsequent success of Rivendell).   Not to downplay Bridgestone-   cool catalogs, innovative ideas (but the RB1 was not one of them).

[PATRICK MOORE]

I'm puzzled: baiting? Not the slightest intention of doing that. I do want to know why Roadeo owners prefer that bike to other road bikes.

Anyone?

Kelly

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[PATRICK MOORE]

Ah, I get it: mine came across as denying the superiority of the Roadeo with the various models listed as counter examples. Sorry; I merely wanted Kelly to be more clear about his reasons.

I've long thought of a Roadeo but the cost also makes me wonder if it is really so much better than RB1, Calfee, etc etc etc (all used), or for that matter a, say, new Dave Porter.

[Tim Whalen]

Patrick,

I can well understand your desire to get the "right" bike and spend no more than the "right" amount of money doing so.  Perhaps though your question is moving into a kind of bicycle metaphysics where there really is no completely rational way of deciding?  That being said (asked?) I'll try to help with my own completely subjective Roadeo experience.  ;-)

Subjectively then:  My Roadeo's ride is somehow more energetic/responsive than a Rambouillet's, and I love that ride too.  It's a beautiful bike, feels great to ride, and I wouldn't be too fast to discount those wider tires either.  I ride mine sometimes with 35'ish xc tires on the packed dirt Santa Fe trail and it's a fast blast.  I bet you might find the same on the Bosque.

Plus I imagine you could always sell it just fine.  This being the Riv forum, maybe the useful philosophical question for you is isn't life too short not to try this end of the Rivendell bicycle spectrum?

Good luck with your excellent quandary!
Tim Whalen

[Patrick in VT]

On Jan 4, 9:46 am, PATRICK MOORE <bertin...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Ah, I get it: mine came across as denying the superiority of the Roadeo
>with the various models listed as counter examples. Sorry; I merely wanted
>Kelly to be more clear about his reasons.

> I've long thought of a Roadeo but the cost also makes me wonder if it is
> really so much better than RB1, Calfee, etc etc etc (all used), or for that
> matter a, say, new Dave Porter.

"Better" is often simply a matter of personal preference, assuming one
has been it at it long enough to develop preferences. Nobody is going
to be able to tell you that a bike is objectively better than another
and you probably know that. which is why it seems like baiting.
spending a few afternoons test riding some new road bikes and getting
a sense of how they feel based on your preferences will probably get
you closer to a decision than soliciting opinions from folks that may
have very different preferences than you, especially when it comes to
fit (which is highly variable) and handling (which is highly
subjective).

[Bill Carter]

Kelly writes:

"Well then Patrick maybe you should try the ugly bike fitness forum.
I'm sorry last I looked I was in a Rivendell owners forums where Riv's
need not be defended. Really you think anyone else on here can give
you a review of how a Roadeo will fit you? Do you really think a 20lb
bike is too heavy for you 28mm tires?"

Don't be so touchy, Kelly. Patrick doesn't really need defending,
but I've read countless of his posts over the years and he is always
entertaining, very pro-Riv, and a valuable asset here. I think he
really just wants to hear your reasoning.

[Joe Bernard]

I think coming to the Riv forum to state you don't care about how the tubes are connected; or how good it looks; is ever so slightly "baiting". The fact that the Roadeo is meticulously designed, built, painted, and ends up gorgeous..is at least half of what you're paying for. Nobody buys a Rivendell simply because it "handles better".

 

Joe "I should buy one" Bernard

Vallejo, CA.

[Allingham II, Thomas J]

Best to consider the source in evaluating a comment or remark.  Patrick is a (rightly) respected member of this group (Kelly, too, for that matter); to me, at least, that would argue for opting for the more constructive of two competing interpretations. 

 

But there's a world of difference between modestly edgy comments (perfectly acceptable to me, including a comment that one doesn't care how tubes are connected) and the sort of flaming which is blessedly absent from this forum.  I think we mostly know it when we see it.

---

From: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com [mailto:rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Bernard
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 11:20 AM
To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Roadeo or RB1?

I think coming to the Riv forum to state you don't care about how the tubes are connected; or how good it looks; is ever so slightly "baiting". The fact that the Roadeo is meticulously designed, built, painted, and ends up gorgeous..is at least half of what you're paying for. Nobody buys a Rivendell simply because it "handles better".

 

Joe "I should buy one" Bernard

Vallejo, CA.

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[Joe Bernard]

And Patrick knows darn well that it's the dead of winter; full of holiday stress and not enough riding; and thus the perfect time to throw a little bait to a frustrated pack of riders. The boy ain't stupid. ;-)

[PATRICK MOORE]

Thanks for all the replies. I am by turns hurt, angered and amused (and edified) by turn this discussion took and the various responses to what was probably indeed rather naively particular questions, and I will respond with my own resolution to adopt Eric Platt's very worthy new year's resolution, to wag more and bark less.

I suppose my questions were rather too particular for me to reasonably expect clear replies from everyone, but on the other hand I myself do have very clear ideas about how the various bikes I've ridden differ in handling from my two later customs (they are Rivs, as most of you know) which are my benchmarks for bike handling comparisons. I can say in detail how, for example, the Herse, Sam Hill and Motobecane handled differently.

I suppose that the reasonable option, right now at any rate, is to get the necessary clamp on bits to add to my Joe gofast fixie and make it into a gearie; all the more in that I won't need more than one chainring. Or maybe not ...

As for the Roadeo, the only possibility right now, anyway, is to have listmember Ryan Watson buy it, dislike it, and sell it to me at a steep discount.

Happy new year to all from Patrick Moore who promises to analyze less and ride more in 2012.

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[William]

Patrick

From my perspective the discussion went sideways because your position came off as:

A Roadeo costs >$4k

I will not spend that much

I want a used racing bike

I challenge you to convince me that a used racing bike is guaranteed to make me unhappy in the ways that a $4k new Roadeo is guaranteed to make me happy

Anything about tire clearance fenders, aesthetics, construction quality are explicitly off-limits 

That might not be a fair restatement of your intent, but it is a truthful summary of my perception of your position.  I didn't engage because it looked to me like a rhetorical trap.  

[Philip Williamson]

I thought it was a fair question. I stayed out of it because I had no
input. The couple posts with descriptions of the handling differences
between Roadeos and other light, "fast" bikes were interesting and
instructive to me.
It is wintertime, though, and I've been discarding some of my replies
without posting them. Maybe not enough of them!

Philip

Philip Williamson
www.biketinker.com

[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2012-01-04 at 10:43 -0700, PATRICK MOORE wrote:
>
> I suppose my questions were rather too particular for me to reasonably
> expect clear replies from everyone, but on the other hand I myself do
> have very clear ideas about how the various bikes I've ridden differ
> in handling from my two later customs (they are Rivs, as most of you
> know) which are my benchmarks for bike handling comparisons. I can say
> in detail how, for example, the Herse, Sam Hill and Motobecane handled
> differently.

What could a Roadeo give you that your two custom Rivs don't already do?

[PATRICK MOORE]

Gears and coasting!

Patrick "otherwise mum forthwith on this topic" Moore

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[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2012-01-04 at 15:42 -0700, PATRICK MOORE wrote:
> Gears and coasting!

Seems to me I recall they came from the Maker equipped with both, until
some Vandal took a dremel to them and ground off the fittings.

[PATRICK MOORE]

But ahhh, the thrill of it! No, the '99 was built as a fixie and the '03 was converted by Dave Porter. I want to keep the '03 as a commuter/errand bike (since 2/3 of my riding is that sort) because it has rack and fender braze ons, but perhaps I can convert the '99 to rear gears. Unless I convert it into a trike ...

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[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2012-01-04 at 16:07 -0700, PATRICK MOORE wrote:
> But ahhh, the thrill of it! No, the '99 was built as a fixie and the
> '03 was converted by Dave Porter. I want to keep the '03 as a
> commuter/errand bike (since 2/3 of my riding is that sort) because it
> has rack and fender braze ons, but perhaps I can convert the '99 to
> rear gears. Unless I convert it into a trike ...
>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUmZp8pR1uc&ob=av2e Amy's singing your
song, Patrick...

[Kelly Sleeper]

Actually it was relating to the subject line.. ROADEO or RBI.. then when the Roadeo is suggested it is treated as being no different than an 80's whatever. I disagree with that and that you get the Rivendell ride from all of those bikes.
Not a matter of anger or being snarky, just thought it was funny. I've seen my wife and she had the xtralight Merlin, and a Lemond. Both sat there and were never ridden after she got the Rodeo. Eventually she sold the Merlin extralite.
Every review I've seen on the Roadeo from other owners on here has been very positive. The few short rides I've had on the Roadeo have been impressive. Just wish they made won big enough for me.
Considering is a "swiss army knife" no different than an 80's trek or just an over priced steel wannabe is ok.. just surprising since we are in a Rivendell forum. Figured some other owners would have spoke up.

Patrick, yes I took it as baiting and didn't think you were serious about wanting an honest review or thought as you've read the same posts and more as I have. I also know that how a bike feels to me may not be the same as it will feel for you.
Just as I don't believe a long haul trucker rides the same as an atlantis. For me it's a fact I've ridden them side by side... other disagree. Take the silver brakes off and put on a dura-ace group, thread less headset and 700x25 tires and go.
Bicycle magazine indicated they didn't think the roadeo was smooth enough when they made the tires hard instead of the pressure that was recommended.

So as much as I enjoy your posts about your trikes and other bikes and such.. yes this one felt like a bait people into giving information that you had no intention of using. Since you already had the information about the Roadeo posted on here many times with outside reviews that you've read.
With the large list of objections and reasons and price to not own a Roadeo why ask about it even? That was my perspective on it. So ya baiting and funny.. not a slam on you.. just an observation.

Sure as heck not a word in anger.. see all of this typing to say what I said in what a sentence.. :) When I bought my AHH I took a 14 hour round trip drive to ride one before ordering. I don't care if GOD himself said it road great I wasn't spending that kind of money without riding it.
I'm glad the Country Bike Shop was there or I would have ended up flying to California to ride one first.

kelly

[robert zeidler]

All of this just about has me ready to pull the trigger.
On a new Calfee with the Adventure set-up.

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[Seth Vidal]

On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 4:32 PM, PATRICK MOORE <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks for all the replies, suggestions and offers of various bikes (too
> poor for the nonce to buy one). I like the old racing bike idea and,
> actually, before I bought the Herse, had thought of priddying up the '73
> Motobecane that I in fact sold to Eric Norris of this list -- light, toute
> 531 leger and nice handling with long stays and nimble front. Which brings
> me full circle to the original thread: I rather regret now (20 years after
> the fact) selling my 1989, Sante equipped all 531C Falcon: shitty,
> Britain-in-industrial-decline paint job and wheels and tasteless Sante
> powdercoat, but a nice, long-stayed, short front-center frame that would
> have made a very decent gofast with some decent wheels and properly set up.
>

RB's
RB2:
http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/bik/2776927409.html

RB1:
http://providence.craigslist.org/bik/2767749207.html

Not sure on the sizes - just what craigslist tells me.

No affiliation at all.

-sv

>
> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 2:25 PM, William <tape...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Responding to Patricks original post.
>>
>> I filled that description with a 1984 Trek 770.  It features standard
>> diameter 531 tubing, and takes 28s (Roly-Poly).  I bought the complete bike
>> from the original owner for $600.  I then parted out the Campagnolo Super
>> Record stuff through the regular channels.  At the moment my running total
>> has me owning the frame/fork/headset/saddle/wheelset/handlebar for a total
>> outlay of $25.  It takes 28s and doesn't even hint at racks or fenders,
>> because it has no brazeons.  I'm supremely happy with it.  It's got a 2x7
>> compact double drivetrain on it now, and I will be using it on brevets this
>> year.  I've even got it set up with a decaleur and have ridden it with a
>> sizeable handlebar bag, despite the guarantees that such a setup is
>> absolutely unrideable.
>>
>> As willing as you've demonstrated yourself to be in parting things out, I
>> think this route could be fruitful for you as well.  There are good
>> geo-charts available for both Trek and Bridgestone online, so you could buy
>> off craigslist without having to ask a bunch of sizing minutia from your
>> seller.
>>
>> I keep a 1992 RB1 at a family vacation home in the midwest as well.  No
>> need for compact double out in the cornfields.

>>
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>
>
>

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> Patrick Moore
> Albuquerque, NM
> For professional resumes, contact
> Patrick Moore, ACRW
> http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
>
>
>

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[Joe Bartoe]

Robert Zeidler said:

"All of this just about has me ready to pull the trigger.
On a new Calfee with the Adventure set-up. "

I say: Great idea! I love mine!

Joe Bartoe
Synaptic Cycles Bicycle Rentals, Inc.
email: j...@synapticcycles.com
website: www.synapticcycles.com
Twitter: @synapticcycles
phone: 949-374-6079

---

Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 19:37:41 -0600
Subject: Re: [RBW] Roadeo or RB1?
From: zeidler...@gmail.com
To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com

[PATRICK MOORE]

Here are the numbers for a 1993 RB1: 

http://yojimg.net/bike/equipment/bikes/rb1_geo.php

and for the Roadeo:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjehUKAztnO8dEFRVEYxUWpxeXNPMHZMeDZINmNUMWc#gid=0

The 57 cm Roadeo would fit me perfectly ...

On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 11:05 AM, Ely Rodriguez <ely...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Patrick,
Happy New Years!
I wonder what the geometry and tubing differences are between the two? I've always liked my RB-1's, my fastest brevet was on one.
Does anyone know the tubing specs?
Ely

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[William]

Patrick.  Let me know if you desperately want my 56cm RB-1.  The only non-stock items are the handlebar tape, chain and the tires.  It's a 1992, so no 'gd fender' braze ons.  It's living in Illinois, so it would take some doing to get you connected with it, but again, if you're truly motivated, things can be done.  

Sheldon has the full 1992 catalog for you to peruse.  http://sheldonbrown.com/bridgestone/1992/1992.pdf