Fast(er) road tire setup for a Platypus?

[Stephen Martinez]

TL;DR: Looking to make my Rivendell Platypus faster and more efficient for long century rides on rough chip seal without losing comfort. Considering narrower/faster tires (38–40mm) and possibly a lighter wheelset. Curious what’s worked for others.

Spring rides are coming up, and I’m thinking about taking my Rivendell Platypus out for a few local century charity rides this year.

In past years, I’ve done these rides on my faster steel road bikes with ~28mm tires, but several of the routes have long stretches of chattery chip seal, potholes, and general road roughness. Comfort can become a limiter later in the ride. I’d like to try the Platypus instead—ideally still riding in sandals on flat pedals—but with a setup that’s a bit quicker and more efficient over distance.

Right now the bike is very much in winter/comfort mode:

*Rear: René Herse Antelope Hill 29 × 2.2 (700 × 55)

*Front: IRC Marbella 29 × 2.25

*Wheels: Velocity Cliffhangers (30mm) with a Peter White Cycles dynamo hub up front and a Rivendell Silver hub in the rear.

It’s extremely comfortable and stable, but once I hit a certain pace, it feels like I’m pushing against a speed ceiling—especially on longer climbs.

I’ve been considering swapping to something narrower and faster, like:

*René Herse Barlow Pass (38mm)

*or Pirelli P Zero Race ~40mm

I’m also curious what something in the 32–35mm range would feel like on a Platypus—whether it would still play nicely with the geometry while offering a meaningful bump in speed and climbing efficiency.

I’ve also briefly thought about a lighter wheelset, but I haven’t gone very far down that path yet. I’ve even wondered about putting together a second, more performance-oriented wheelset—something like a carbon deep-section setup—and what that would look and feel like on a Platypus.

Has anyone here experimented with setting up a Platypus (or similar Riv geometry) with lighter, faster road-oriented tires or wheels? I’m not chasing aero road-bike speed, but I am hoping to improve cruising speed and climbing comfort over long endurance rides while still keeping the Platypus character intact.

Would love to hear what’s worked (or hasn’t) for others.

[Kim H.]

@Stephen,

Interesting to see you over here from your Reddit post on r/Rivendell_Bicycles. I hope you find what you are looking for.

Kim Hetzel. 

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[Steve]

I say go for it - the lighter wheel set and 38 - 40 slicks - but please share your results. As a Platypus rider I'd love to hear your assessment of the difference. (if you don't mind running plastic rims and 32-35mm tires, that would also be interesting to hear about).  

I'll share that the 42mm RH slicks I initially built my Platypus with were possibly maybe a bit faster than the current RH 48mm  Switchback Hills. Both were on Velocity 650b Quills with White Industry hubs (a sweet wheel set).  The bike is fully fendered with a random rack and bag up front.  

Steve in AVL

[Hoch in UT]

I would highly recommend getting a second wheelset.  It makes it so much easier to swap, which keeps me from being lazy in swapping the set up, and the difference in performance, especially at the century distance, is very noticeable.

The set up I'd recommend is Velocity Quill and Pirelli P Zero in 35 or 40.  They are my favorite road tires.  They're fast and you can set them up tubeless very easy (especially on Quills).  I've not tried Barlow Pass, but I've had Bon Jon's and they've also worked well.  But I did get less flats on the Pirelli's and they rode about the same (meaning, they both rode really really well).

Last thing:  I'm assuming you've ridden longer distances on an upright bike.  For me, my sit bones take too much of a beating.  I need to be leaning slightly forward, so if I were doing this on my Appaloosa, I'd swap handlebars so I'm not so upright.

[Tom Wyland]

I've tried a lot of different tires on my Platy for my 95% asphalt commute. I have Velocity Dyad wheels, which are lighter/narrower than the cliffhangers. I mostly stick to 42-45mm tubed tires (various schwalbe, sawtooth, RE knobbies, RE slicks, etc). I'm currently running  45mm Schwalbe Energizer plus at 70(!) psi, which are stout and not particularly plush. The frame really sucks up much of the chatter when the roads are bumpy (or on sidewalks). I can still hop curbs just fine with this setup, and I've seen generally quicker times on my rides. I personally find 45mm to be the sweet spot, but your results may vary. Taking weight out of your build (handlebars, racks, saddle, etc) is also a better way to gain speed, of course. Off topic for this thread, I guess. I'm mostly a commuter, so my priorities are different.

Tom

Reston, VA

[Michael Cinibulk]

I've been thinking about this on and off for several years. I don't have a good suggestions but here is some anecdotal info for you to consider. 

I ride three of my bike on the road regularly.

Bike 1 is a Waterford 1250 sport tourer with ~1700 g wheelset, not including the 700x28 mm Conti 5000 tires. Total bare bones weight ~22 lbs.

Bike 2 is a Rivendell Sam Hillborne with ~2300 g wheelset, not including the 700x38 mm Gravel King slicks. Total bare bones weight ~27 lbs.

Bike 3 is a BMC Mod-Zero with ~1700 g disc wheelset, not including the 650x52 mm UD Cavas in JFF casing. Total bare bones weight ~27 lbs.

After riding the first two for over 15 y over the same routes at similar effort in SW Ohio, I consistently avg 1.5 mph faster on the Waterford.

After riding all three the past year on the same routes at similar effort in SW Ohio, I seem to avg maybe 0.5 mph slower on the Mod-Zero than on the Hillborne.

Routes vary from hilly to fairly flat and the difference in avg speed is about the same regardless of route. I suspect that the main difference has more to do with rider position than anything else, since the bars on the Waterford are 1 cm lower than saddle, on the Hillborne are about level, and on the Mod-Zero are about 2 cm higher.

-Mike

Bellbrook OH

[Eric Daume]

According to RH, you're not going to gain any speed by going to a narrower, supple tire:

https://www.renehersecycles.com/bq-tire-test-results/

Eric

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[Garth]

Sure, a light-er wheelset would be noticed, but at what price are you willing to pay for it ? I mean will it really make enough difference to justify it for a relatively stiff/heavy frame to begin with ?  Only you can answer that for yourself. A 38mm tire is as low as you'd want to go on the frame. Mostly you'd be reducing weight on the rim and possibly the freehub, depending on what you already have. 

Dare I say if you rode a frame in which a 32mm(+/-3mm) tire is optimal, those GP 5000's sure would be a fast tire. I know that isn't what you asked, but the Platy isn't a great choice for long ride and caring about the speed/effort on a regular basis. 

[Armand Kizirian]

Some extralight barlow pass's are available just a few threads down: https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/h9h5TnWoA8g 

I say do what you want, experiment, and see what the results are, especially if you have the money to spare. I saved just shy of 3lbs in wheels/tires/tubes alone from the stock alex wheelset on my platypus to a white ind/velocity quill/herse setup. That's significant. My intention was just for a more pleasurable feel of the bike, not speed. 

If you're attempting to ride centuries on a platypus, try it with what you have first, then decide. Forget the deep dish carbon, that's just nonsense, especially on a rim-brake bike.

I'd recommend the 44mm version of the herse tires, the extralight variant is the same weight as the 38mm. I would say that is the best combination of rolling resistance/comfort they offer in their catalog. 

[Tom Powell Davies]

Hi Michael,

Thanks so much for these interesting observations!

Without getting too much off track - I'd be very interested to hear any reflections you might have about how the Sam handles compared with your Mod.Zero!

I ask because I have a Mod.Zero (like you, in a reasonably upright position) and am contemplating getting a Sam as an addition. I'm after something really smooth and compliant, and wondering if the Sam would add anything there, or if you find it similar to the Mod.Zero.

Thanks in advance for anything you're happy to share, and apologies one and all for going slightly off track!

Tom 

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[Stephen Martinez]

Hi all — thanks very much for the thoughtful replies. This has been really helpful, and I appreciate the range of perspectives.

Kim — yes, thank you! I did end up joining the RBW group as suggested, so it’s good to be here.

To give a little more context: I do have a Waterford 1200 road bike with 28mm GP5000s that comes in around 9 kg, and that bike is very comfortable and capable for faster rides and 100 km–style endurance days. I know what this lighter, more performance-oriented setup feels like, and I’m not trying to turn the Platypus into that bike.

That said, I’m also quite comfortable on the Platypus for 4+ hour rides and can cover ~100 km on mostly flat routes at a social group ride pace. I’m running what I believe are Nitto Tosco bars, and on solo rides I’ll sometimes bring my hands in close to the stem and tuck down for a sort of faux TT position. I’m sure it looks a little goofy, but it does help with wind and feels fine for me over distance.

The main takeaway for me right now is that I probably want to start with tires. I initially went as big as I reasonably could—55mm René Herse (which I managed to destroy one of…) and now a grippy IRD up front—but over the past year I’ve realistically done almost no gravel or mixed surface riding. Since I’m sticking to pavement, it makes sense to tone down the size and gravel bias and move toward something more road-oriented.

So I’m leaning toward a simple tire swap first: either P Zero Race in 35 or 40 mm, or an all-road René Herse option in the 35 / 38 / 44 mm range. I don’t currently have a spare wheelset with an ideal rim width for those tires, nor a rear wheel that works with the 135 mm spacing, so I’ll likely keep my eyes open for a suitable second wheelset while starting with tires on the existing rims.

Longer term, I agree with those who mentioned that wheels and tires are where the biggest gains are likely to be. Dropping a few pounds of rotating mass would be very noticeable. I’ve already stripped the bike down and can always add my racks, dynamo light, bags, and fenders back as needed. I could save more weight by swapping the Brooks saddle or removing the kickstand—but those are staying. This isn’t a weight-weenie project, just a reasonably lightened Platypus meant for enjoying a well-paced century: scenery, spring air, and not slogging up hills or overheating unnecessarily.

For reference, I rode the Trek Pedal Around Dallas event last year on the Platypus and completed the full route (ended up around 87 miles). The posted 16–17 mph B-group pace seemed reasonable for me on this setup—especially if I could sit in and draft—but I don’t think I fully accounted for the amount of surging required to maintain that average, along with the frequent stop-and-go accelerations from traffic lights and the repeated regrouping when lights and small hills split the group. I would get dropped at some point after each regroup/rest stop, but I did finish the complete route—at least 20–30 minutes behind the B group. There were a few others who also got dropped that I could link up with between stops, and quite a few riders who didn’t end up finishing the whole route. The hot dogs at the end were worth it, and every Trek rest stop was very nice. I’m confident I could have stayed with the B group on a road bike, and that really highlighted the “wall” I hit on the Platypus—where beyond a certain speed, repeated interval, or gradient, the required effort ramps up quickly compared to a lighter bike with a more forward position.

Anyway, lots to think about. I appreciate everyone sharing real-world experience, and I’ll be happy to report back once I’ve made a few changes and logged some miles.

I also have a few bike photos here, for anyone curious: https://www.instagram.com/stephenfromchico/

saginawsteve

[Rusty Jefferson]

I think the sweet spot for comfort and speed is the RH 32mm Stampede Pass in Extra-light. I couldn't quite fit these on my Waterford RS-22 so I picked up another frame that will allow me to run them with fenders. You can certainly try them on your current wheelset. In fact the 25mm (inner) width of the Cliffhanger should give them excellent shape. Decide then if you need another lighter wheelset if you like the ride.

Jim in Annapolis

[Gabe]

Hi Eric et al., 

Sometimes i feel like Jan's experiments always lead to the conclusion that one should buy something he is selling!!! However, he DOES sell tires of various widths, so his research could go either way on this one. I currently have Rene Herse 48mm tires in the endurance casing (the knobby ones) on a big Appaloosa. Before, I had some 37mm WTB tires with a fine tread of mini knobs. The narrower tires definitely made the bike "feel" a little lighter and more appropriate for a longer road ride. The bike was still close to 40 lbs but I'd say the skinnier tires felt better on the road.  And I feel like nice quality 38mm tires should still be fairly forgiving on crappy roads, while, at the very least, being lighter. I can't imagine the lost "suppleness" / squishiness/ bounciness would cost you much speed (if any) and if the bike feels easier and more spry that could help morale the last hour or two of the long ride. I feel like that could be a middle ground without putting 23mm slicks at 105psi on the bike!  Feel lighter, still have not-to-skinny tires. 

Happy Friday!!!!

Gabe

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[Michael Cinibulk]

Tom,

To be honest, it’s difficult to compare given the different setups. I think the ride of the Mod.Zero is similar to the Hillborne, in stripped down mode. Both ride well. I would not call the Hillborne ride compliant, that would be apply to my Waterford with 753 tubing. But the Hillborne is definitely a smooth ride, as is the Mod.Zero with the wide tires. I have the two as I bought the Hillborne some 15 y ago as a commuter and road touring bike. I built up the Mod.Zero last year as an off-road tourer. Both could be great all round road bikes if built up for that purpose. 

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

Tom Powell Davies <tom.powe...@gmail.com>: Jan 10 02:32PM +1100

[Josiah Anderson]

Gabe, this sort of thing comes up a lot with people accusing Jan of bias in his studies, but what people miss is that the science came before the products. Compass/RH sells the products they sell because they like them and because the Bicycle Quarterly research says they work well. The first several rounds of tire tests happened before Compass even existed, and the tests are what informed the design of the tires, so OF COURSE the tests say that RH and similar tires perform well - that's the point of the tires!

I don't work for RH/BQ and am only vaguely acquainted with most of that crew, I just don't like seeing false accusations go unchallenged. 

Josiah

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[Tom Powell Davies]

Thank you so much for sharing those comparisons, Mike, I really appreciate it! Sounds like we are both lucky to have either one or both of the bikes :)

Tom in Sydney

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[Will Boericke]

I think total system weight is a significant factor here as well.  At 150# on my 17# carbon bike, a nice 28mm tire is totally comfy for me for 100 miles.  I can't really tell the difference if I move to a 32mm tire, but my 220# friend for sure is not going to give up his 32s.  I have a bike with 38s that's otherwise light and stiff, but I can tell I'm pushing around more tire after about 1.5 hours on that bike.  Perhaps if I was confident I could get away with an extralight tire, that time frame would be larger.  On a platypus, I think maybe 35-38 would be a sweet spot, and there are many more manufacturers making good tires in that size range (Conti Urban Contact is one I am planning on trying soon).  You could probably get a lighter wheelset, but I'm not sure you'd notice that difference as much. 

Will near Boston, relishing those 38mm today on winter-pockmarked streets

[Peter Oberbreckling]

I picked up a 55 Platypus in the last lottery, and recently built it up with 38 mm RH Barlow Pass tires on Velocity a23s.  I can't speak to how that setup compares to others.  But, I do live in Plano, and if you find yourself in the neighborhood you are  welcome to take my Platypus for a spin, or if you brought your bike we could see about swapping my wheels into yours.