50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18

[Esteban]

I did about 50 miles on the Quickbeam today up the San Diego coast -
from near Downtown to Encinitas. I usually take it a little slower on
my Protovelo, set up with Albatross bars, B66, etc. I rode the same
ride last weekend with my brother and he took my (now sold) Kogswell
P58, and really kicked some butt. He's very fast, and there are
usually racing (or racing-dressed) riders on this ride. I got the
idea to take the Quickbeam (set up with Noodles) and ride it pretty
hard for the coast ride today. The Q usually serves as my "getter"
with a Wald basket and has seen 30-35 mile fun rides, but mostly 10-20
mile errand/transportation trips.

It was wonderful the whole time. I've gotten better at spinning as
well as coasting - and I was passed on some of the big downhills. But
I passed the same riders on the uphills. I charged up Torrey Pines
road without too much trouble. I was exhausted when I got home, but
thrilled with the simplicity and fun of the day. Never went down to
my smaller chainwheel, but if I went up into Torrey Pines State Park,
that would have been the call.

I just wanted to say how great the stock gearing is on the bike. When
I first got it, I was frustrated about having to spin so much on flats
and coast downhill. Now I really appreciate it, especially because
40x18 gets me up almost any hill, including those on this ride, and
even up Potrero Hill in San Francisco. Actually, mid-grade ascents
seem *easier* on the Quickbeam. I can't explain that. 40x18 also
seems to be a great touring set-up. Its fun to learn to love things
that you might initially shun.

[Patrick in VT]

hmm . . . 40x18 seems like a very casual gear for a single speed road
ride, no? A good gear ratio for getting around town or on a studded
tire winter bike, but I can't imagine a longer, spirited ride in such
a low gear.

[Elfardo]

I was thinking that stock was 40/17.

Sounds like a fun ride. I'm jealous of you guys and your coast
rides. :-)

[Andrew Karre]

I rode in to work today on studded tires running 38 x 19 on my San
Jose through a couple inches of compacted snow and ice. I've got a
couple hills and I like to spin, so that's where I end up.

On Dec 8, 8:34 am, Patrick in VT <psh...@drm.com> wrote:

[Mojo]

The ride sounds like alot of fun Esteban. I imagine your geared riding
partners were quite impressed with your one speed. And I am too, with
a 60 inch gear.

Back in the day, the winter training fixed gear was a 42X16 which is a
71 inch gear. I built my Quickbeam up from a frame, and that is my
baseline gear ratio (as a 45X17). Even at my advanced age of 52 and
less power output, it seems like a good open road riding gear with
rolling terrain and gentle climbs. I get dropped pretty quickly with
that gear on our summer groups rides. That probably says more about
the cutthroat nature of group rides in this valley, or the more
brotherly nature of your rides.

Over the last few years, watching ebay for deals, I have successfully
fully complicated my nicely-simple Quickbeam with too many gears. I
have settled on 45/39 up front. Two flip-flop rears: freecog wheel
with 17-19T Dos Eno and 22T on the flop, fixed wheel 17-21T Dingle
with 23T on the flop. That has made it a 4 speed free
(71-63ish-55-48), and 5 speed fixed (71-61-57-50-46). I can do alot
without flopping, but any ride into the local mountains does require
the other side of the wheel.
Right now I am favoring the free wheel. http://tinyurl.com/43md96

Its a fun bike!

[Dustin Sharp]

That ride can have a few monster hills on it, depending on the route you
take. If you go up Genese from my house, for example, you have to do four
big climbs before you even get to Torrey Pines State Park and begin the true
coastal portion of the ride. I had a low gear of 36x29 yesterday and I was
still wishing for something a bit lower! But that may be more an indication
of my fitness level than anything.

Dustin Sharp
San Diego, CA

[Larry Powers]

I switched last year to a 40x17 for my main gear and it worked out well for me.  I have been riding some hilly 20 to 30 mile riese.  You need to balance out the need for speed against the ability to climb.  For now I will stick with the 40x17 but when I try and tackle some hilly century rides next year I may reconsider this.
 
I have installed my studded Nokians for the winter and because they are heavy and slow I did put the 18 back on.  The 18 is also old and worn so I don't mind usnig it in the salty slush for the next few months.

Larry Powers "just when you think that you've been gyped the bearded lady comes and does a double back flip" - John Hiatt



> Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 18:55:13 -0800
> Subject: [RBW] 50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18
> From: Prot...@gmail.com
> To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com

[Larry Powers]

What part of the country do you ride in?  I am trying to get a gauge on the type of hills you are riding on.  I am using the QB with a 40x17 and have found this to be a pretty good gear.  I am a bigger rider and find that this leaves me enought for the hills and still lets me move fast enough on the flats.  I am in central Connecticut.  Not to many real long climbs but alot of short steep stuff. 
 
I do have a fixed 15 on the flip side.  I don't do enought riding on the fixed to be comfortable on long rides but if we will be doing a relatively flat 15 to 20 miles that is the gear of choice.

Larry Powers
 
"just when you think that you've been gyped the bearded lady comes and does a double back flip" - John Hiatt

> Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 07:25:12 -0800
> Subject: [RBW] Re: 50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18
> From: gjtr...@yahoo.com
> To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com

[PATRICK MOORE]

On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 9:10 AM, Larry Powers <lapow...@hotmail.com> wrote:

What part of the country do you ride in?  I am trying to get a gauge on the type of hills you are riding on.  I am using the QB with a 40x17 and have found this to be a pretty good gear.  I am a bigger rider and find that this leaves me enought for the hills and still lets me move fast enough on the flats.  I am in central Connecticut.  Not to many real long climbs but alot of short steep stuff. 
 
I do have a fixed 15 on the flip side.  I don't do enought riding on the fixed to be comfortable on long rides but if we will be doing a relatively flat 15 to 20 miles that is the gear of choice.

I started with a 63" gear (that's what you get with a 40/17 and say a 28 mm tire), but despite being a spinner at the time found it very annnoying down grades and especially with tailwinds. I've pretty much found a 70" is a fine all round gear even for hills; a 46X18 will give you this. For faster rides on a light bike, even a 75" gear is good if I'm in shape and warmed up. The surprising thing -- again, when I started riding fixed 12 years ago I was a spinner, whose favorite cruising gear was 65" at 110 rpm -- about riding fixed for me was that it quickly turned me into a masher, so that even my off road bike has a 64" gear. Granted I don't ride in the mountains, but short, steep hills are still quite doable; I just stand.

So, for me, in ascending order: 64" off road, 66" grocery bike, 69" commuter, 75" gofast. I can do the 7 mile Tramway climb in a 70" gear, taking it slowly. Pushing 54.

[CycloFiend]

on 12/7/08 6:55 PM, Esteban at Prot...@gmail.com wrote:
> I just wanted to say how great the stock gearing is on the bike. When
> I first got it, I was frustrated about having to spin so much on flats
> and coast downhill. Now I really appreciate it, especially because
> 40x18 gets me up almost any hill, including those on this ride, and
> even up Potrero Hill in San Francisco. Actually, mid-grade ascents
> seem *easier* on the Quickbeam. I can't explain that. 40x18 also
> seems to be a great touring set-up. Its fun to learn to love things
> that you might initially shun.

One of the benefits of switching to a single-geared system is that finding
that you as the rider possess a number of gears as well. Roughly speaking,
when using the Quickbeam, I figure there's roughly four - Cruising on
flattish surfaces, Seated Climbing, Climbing using your body weight in a
long, lopey cadence (an excellent way to recover on longer climbs, btw),
Serious Climbing (which probably has three phases: sweating, cursing, and
about to pop). (And, since I run the QB fixed a lot, there's the
exponentially-increasing-cadence-while-trying-to-keep-smooth zen state
thing...)

What's great (if you indulge in the heresy of geared/coastable riding) is
that this carries back into geared riding, along with a better sense of
maintaining momentum. Catching folks who blew past on the flats while
grunting out a 53x11, but climb at at 39x32 is just a happy coincidence.

The Quickbeam remains my favorite bike. So simple, yet so danged adaptable.

- Jim
--
Jim Edgar
Cyclo...@earthlink.net

Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com
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"I had to ride slow because I was taking my guerrilla route, the one I
follow when I assume that everyone in a car is out to get me."
-- Neal Stephenson, "Zodiac"

[Patrick in VT]

I don't consider myself a masher, and anything less than a 70 inch
gear ratio is a real drag for me on ss road rides, especially if I'm
riding fixed and/or for distance.

What kind of cadence do you have to spin to sustain a moderate pace,
say 15mph, with a 60 inch gear? Personally, intense spinning wears me
out much, much faster than powering up hills.

With a 60 inch gear, I figure I'd lose about an hour off of what it
would normally take me to do a ss 50 mile club ride with a 70ish inch
gear (about 3 hours) - and I'd be absolutely cooked!! I'm exhausted
just thinking about it!

[Bill Connell]

Terrain and riding style matter a lot, as do expected average speed. I
rode 42x16 as both my fixed and ss gear for a few years, and just last
year found it more comfortable for my usual city riding with a 42x18.
I think part of it was a lack of strength in the spring from not
riding much last winter, and part an improved spin from a few thousand
miles on a single. I don't often do fast club rides at all, and rarely
fast road rides on a single, and the 42x18 gear lets me comfortably
spin 18-20mph on most terrain around here but still get up any road
hill.

For hilly routes on a singlespeed, i'd certainly understand gearing
lower, and i think that's how a lot of QBs are used - and for mixed
road/dirt too. In those cases, you can coast down the hills and the
40x18 is low enough for a pretty good variety of dirt too. Not
coincidentally, that was my preferred singlespeed CX gear this year.

You'll almost always want a higher gear for road fixed riding - but of
course, who would want *less* time on a bike? :-)

--
Bill Connell
St. Paul, MN

[Dan]

I run my Quickbeam as a 40 x 16. It works well for me. Sometimes I
would like a little larger gear but I usually change my mind after a
large hill. I found the stock 40 x 18 a little too low for my taste.
I have run a 40 x 18 on a different bike in the winter with studs and
that works fine.

Dan Abelson

[Elfardo]

I run the same gearing as you Dan. 40x16 runs as a pretty good
compromise for my fitness level. I'm rarely forced to change to a
lower gear for climbs unless I want to. Puts the lower gear in the
optional category. Yes, I can get a bit frustrated on spinning out on
long downhills and my average is lower which can add quite a bit of
time on a long ride. But hey, SS riding isn't about always having an
acceptable gear for the terrain your riding. Sometimes you're
spinning, sometimes grunting, and sometimes just cruising right
along.

[Jeremy Till]

I only have two fixed gears right now, and the bike that i take on any
ride that isn't commuting or errands is geared at 40x19 (56"). It is
true that this is considerably lower than what is "normal" for a road
going fixed gear, but as others have said, it's all about your
personal terrain and riding style. I love climbing, and I live on the
hilly california coast (San Francisco) where others seem to favor low
gears. Most of the rides I enjoy involve long (anywhere from a mile
to 10+ mile) climbs that simply wouldn't be enjoyable if i had to
grind up them in a 70+" gear. They're still a grind at 56", but it's
just low enough to let me relax and enjoy myself. I do have to spin
on the flats, and i probably would have a higher average speed on a
geared bike or higher-geared fixed, but I enjoy the challenge of
working on my spin and finding the small efficiencies to go faster on
the flats.

All that being said, cyclofiend rides in the same area as me and does
just fine on his QB geared at 77", so it really is personal
preference.

[Patrick in VT]

"Hilly" seems to be a rather relative term, which is understandable
given differences in geography, physical fitness, etc. - but is there
some standard definition of hilly taking these variables into
account?

Where I live, hilly means riding in terrain that includes long and/or
steep climbs in the Green Mountains, Adirondacks or Berkshires - an
example would be the D2R2 randonee in Deerfield, MA, which I think
clocks in at about 11,000 ft of climbing over about 100 miles. I
think long and hard before heading out on a hilly single speed ride.

All other terrain, unless it's mostly flat, is called "rolling," and
includes short climbs/rollers of varying gradients - some gentle, some
brutal. But, I don't consider a route with a bunch of rollers to be
hilly and I don't think twice about riding single speed over such
terrain regardless of the distance.

What does everyone else consider to be hilly?

[Esteban]

Interesting discussion.

I lived in Western Massachusetts during grad school, and there are
lots of wonderful hilly rides, and some great steep climbs. Of
course, is riding old three speeds at the time so I can't say I took
on any real monsters in the Birkshires. Here in costal California, we
don't have too many hilly up-downs. Maybe in the central coast near
San Simeon. We have lots of canyons and big climbs - sometimes just
to get to the cafe. I don't know grades - but there are pretty big,
steep hills between neighborhoods. Other folks might know more.

40x17 would be my choice for the big ring if I went with a dual cog
from White Industries. But I'm just delighted with 40x18. I have a
geared bike if I want to be quick or competitive. My Quickbeam is
just "enjoy the view and get up that hill" kind of riding as currently
set up.

[RM]

I too ride my Quickbeam on that same coast route (from Coronado). I
use a White Industries 16 + 19 DOS freewheel and, for the coast ride,
always keeping it on 40x16. When I head to the back country (say
Honey Springs Rd, Lyons Valley Rd, or Sunrise Highway), I'll put it
down to 32x19 when I get too worn on a long climb.

I Quickbeam up to Oceanside or Dana Point and back quite frequently
and even did the 300K brevet to Huntington Beach and back earlier
this year--and stayed on the 40x16.

Go for a ride together sometime Esteban?

Rob

[franklyn]

My fixed gear bike is my main bike and main training bike in the
winter. I have a strange set up: double crank with 40/36 rings, and a
surly dingle cog with 17/19 cogs. I also have a 22T freewheel on the
flop. I have had this set up on two different bikes for more than 18
months and I have yet to use the 36/19 combination. I have used 40/22
free combination once in San Francisco riding up some 15% hills.

My regular workout on my fixed gear bike is here:
http://www.bikely.com/maps/bike-path/Grizzly-Peak-Fixed-Gear-Workout

On 40/17 I can get up to the top of Grizzly Peak and ride through many
parts of san francisco without too much problem. On flats with the
same combination I regularly ride between 15-21 mph, but that's
because I am usually riding to catch a transit here or there. I
sometimes commute on a relatively flat 16-mile route (from Palo Alto
to Fremont via dumbarton bridge, for those of you living in the Bay
Area) and with 40/17 I can get there just a shade under an hour. I am
not so small (5'10", 195 lbs) but find that not having to work through
upstroke on the fixed gear help me on most terrains.

Franklyn

[John McMurry]

On Dec 8, 11:49 am, Patrick in VT <psh...@drm.com> wrote:
> What kind of cadence do you have to spin to sustain a moderate pace,
> say 15mph, with a 60 inch gear?

A cadence in the mid-80's would get you to that speed, in a 60-inch
gear.

On our ride yesterday I was spinning the jb-welded-fixed-grocery-
getter at 100rpm just to keep up with you guys at that pace (52"
gear).

I wishing for a set of foot pegs and a sprung saddle half the time.

> Personally, intense spinning wears me
> out much, much faster than powering up hills.

Yep, me too. If it weren't for Cliff St. I face every morning, I'd
raise the gearing quite a bit on that bike.

John McMurry
Burlington, VT

[Patrick in VT]

John -

all things considered - boots, baggy pants, 100rpm cadence - you're
lucky you didn't start a fire!

With my 48x17, I really felt like I was in slow-motion everytime I saw
you whizzing around yesterday. Watching you in the cornfield was a
trip!

I'm starting to think that I do "mash" and have a low cadence riding
style compared to what others are stating is comfortable - 40x17/18 at
anything over 15mph sounds like spin class intensity to me.

I usually ride a fixed gear at 48x17/18 and wouldn't want to spin much
more than that.

Interesting discussion.

[PATRICK MOORE]

On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 11:44 AM, Patrick in VT <psh...@drm.com> wrote:

"Hilly" seems to be a rather relative term, which is understandable
given differences in geography, physical fitness, etc. - but is there
some standard definition of hilly taking these variables into
account?

Albuquerque can fairly be described as rolling, unless you go all the way east to the mountains. It's a river valley (5,000 ft) that rises eastward about seven miles to about 6500 feet, and westward climbs sharply to the West Mesa whence the land rises gradually to the continental divide. Still, the WM is far hillier than the eastern part of the city. Altogether, sharp and steep or long and gradual hills, with, on the west, terrain of a more varied nature; and, of course, our winds -- my 21 mile ride begain with a stiff headwind, turned into rain and a bit of hail at mid point, and finally turned into another but slight headwind or sidewind on the way home.

[RonLau]

Jim,

So, when we did the Riv. weekend and you used your QB, what was the
gear going up?

I myself use 44x18 or 48x20, spin out around 28 mph and do the South
Bay training ride on fixed all the time.

My feeling is find the gears you like for what you do. If you ride
the track, 40x17 is a joke, but 50x15 is also a joke for the road.

Ron

On Dec 8, 8:41 am, CycloFiend <cyclofi...@earthlink.net> wrote:

> Cyclofi...@earthlink.net
>
> Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries -http://www.cyclofiend.com

[usuk2007]

I ride 40/32 up front with a 16/18 White Ind dual freewheel on one
side and a 22t freewheel on the other.
In that mode I do credit card touring

[Ray Shine]

I ride the San Francisco Bay Area hills and small mountains.  Some relative flat areas, but really probably more like "rollies."  On my Quickbeam, I primarily use the 40x18. However, one of my fav rides is from home in SF through southern Marin, up Bolinas Road past Alpine Lake, summit Mt. Tam, then return home via Mill Valley.  Door to door about 56 miles. My QB is equipped with a White Industries 18/16 free on the drive side, and a single 20 tooth free on the flip. Standard chain rings. I leave home on the 40x18, and stay on it all the way through Fairfax, where the real climb begins. That is a 20 mile spot for me, and depending on how I feel, I either gear down to 32x18, or if I am not wholly up to it at that point (I'm on the sunny side of 60 years old), I flip the wheel and use 32x20 to ascend to the summit, another 10 miles or so, with one long drop to the dam, before another long and steeper climb. At the summit, I switch to the 40x16 for the "fast" and nearly all down grade ride home.  Sounds like a lot of work, but I enjoy the stops to change gears, eat a banana, look around, etc.  I love the Quickbeam.  Oh, I rode the QB in the Spring Death Valley Century two years ago.  I did the whole rde on a 40x17.  I have since replaced that freewheel with the above mentioned 18/16.  But it was quite doable on the 40x17.  Of course, Death Valley is pretty flat, and there was only one significant climb of about 1200 feet.  To be honest, the return trip head winds were more difficult for a sustained cadence than was the climb to the pass. --- On Mon, 12/8/08, Larry Powers <lapow...@hotmail.com> wrote:

[Ray Shine]

Frankyn - I have ridden a portion of that several times on the Quickbeam.  I live in SF, my son and his family live in Alameda. If it is a Sunday or a holiday (to avoid the truck traffic) I leave my home in SF, climb to the top of Skyline, throgh Woodside, drop down to Palo Alto, across Dumbarton, then north past Oakland Airport into Alameda.  The ride is 74 miles. I usually meet my wife there and come back with her in the car.  As you know, from Palo Alto to Alameda is virtually flat as a pancake, and I ride that section in 40x16.  Frankly, even a slogger like me could go higher than that for a section of flats that long. --- On Mon, 12/8/08, franklyn <frank...@gmail.com> wrote:

From: franklyn <frank...@gmail.com> Subject: [RBW] Re: 50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18

[CycloFiend]

on 12/8/08 8:49 AM, Patrick in VT at psh...@drm.com wrote:

>
> I don't consider myself a masher, and anything less than a 70 inch
> gear ratio is a real drag for me on ss road rides, especially if I'm
> riding fixed and/or for distance.
>
> What kind of cadence do you have to spin to sustain a moderate pace,
> say 15mph, with a 60 inch gear? Personally, intense spinning wears me
> out much, much faster than powering up hills.

After building up my first fixed-gear, I recorded a couple of points of
reference:

Fixed Gear Speeds at Specific Cadences
GEARING Revolutions Per Minute - Speed

Parasonic w/ Speedblends
42 x 15T
w/ 700x32c tires = 75g" 60 - 13.5 mph, 80 - 18.0 mph, 100 - 22.5 mph,
120 - 27 mph

Dawes w/ Conti's
42 x 16T
w/ 700x25c tires = 69g" 60 - 12.4 mph, 80 - 16.5 mph, 100 - 20.6 mph,
120 - 24.7 mph

Quickbeam Gearing
40 x 18T/16T/15T/14T
w/ 700x32c tires = 60 - 67.5 - 72.5 - 77g" @90 rpms: 16.1 mph - 18.1 mph -
19.3 mph - 20.7 mph

AASHTA - From Sheldon's Gear Calculator (pull down menu, after "Meters
Development")
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gears/

His advice for gearing selection still is the most cogent ever given:
"low enough that I can make it up the hills where I usually ride, but high
enough that I can go reasonably fast down the other side."

Oh - Gino made a vid once, too:
http://vimeo.com/1381858

- Jim

--

Jim Edgar
cyclo...@earthlink.net

2009 Current Classics Calendar - Now Available to Order!
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[PATRICK MOORE]

Climbing the 4/10 mile hill up the west mesa to Rio Rancho city limits, the road behind Don Chalmers Ford and parallel to 528: 66" geared Motobecane with (last load weighed) 25 lb of cheap organics and gourmets from Sunflower Market: 44/18X27, speedo readout 6 mph: that works out to about 31 rpm. Standing, of course. I've climbed it in a 75" on the gofast, but at about 7-8 mph.

53 9/12 year old knees are fine!

[charlie]

I haven't a Quickbeam..........yet....... but I do own a two speed
conversion bike using the White Industries 16-19 and 36x39 dual chain
rings. I get a 50 and 65 inch gear set up this way using 27" wheels
and so far its been good for most terrain within 20 miles of me
depending on the direction. Being 50 years old and 255 lbs. I try to
avoid climbing steep grades in these gears but I do alright. What I
have noticed is that the rhythm of the ride changes using a
deraileurless bike and that's okay by me. I like coasting down hills
and spinning comfortably between 13-18 mph on the flats.
I did some preliminary testing with my geared bike and most of the
time I found myself in a mid 60 inch gear for relatively flat
sections. I wanted a lower gear for steeper grades, head winds and
when I am tired so I elected to go with the setup I have now. When I
get a QB frame I will set it up with a 16-18 and a 22 tooth on the
flip side with stock rings. This gives 39, 48,60 & 68 inch gearing.
Perfectly suitable for my type of relaxed riding. I am not racing and
to me, if I can average 10-15 mph I am happy enough.
I like the idea of not having to think about shifting and I use my
bikes to go places, not just for riding around. I am lately using more
normal clothing (jeans and wool shirts etc.) for the winter and I am
riding with a more relaxed pace. I don't seem to go a whole lot slower
(maybe 1-2 mph) but I don't sweat so badly either and I can ride a lot
farther when I don't use up the 'rocket fuel' so fast.

[CycloFiend]

on 12/8/08 4:32 PM, RonLau at ron...@ronlau.com wrote:

>
> Jim,
>
> So, when we did the Riv. weekend and you used your QB, what was the
> gear going up?

First day was in fixed mode, at 40x14T. Stalled on the last steep pitch and
took a few loopy-headed breaks. Second day was 40x18T freewheel mode, which
was much more pleasant.

http://flickr.com/photos/cyclofiend/collections/72157600243017970/

Not sure I could do that fixed ascent right now. But that was a good
weekend!

- J

[Dr. Bill]

Interesting discussion indeed. With my QB I've settled on a single
42t chainring with a WI 17/19 on one side and a WI 16t on the flip for
faster club rides. That gives me gearing of 60, 67, and 71 gear
inches. 90 percent of my riding is in the 42/17 gear, but it's nice
to have the other options. I would like to go up to around 75 inches
for the fast Tuesday night summer club rides, but that would entail a
chainring swap.

Dr. Bill

> Development")http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gears/

>
> His advice for gearing selection still is the most cogent ever given:
> "low enough that I can make it up the hills where I usually ride, but high
> enough that I can go reasonably fast down the other side."
>
> Oh - Gino made a vid once, too:http://vimeo.com/1381858
>
> - Jim
>
> --
>
> Jim Edgar

> cyclofi...@earthlink.net

[Doug Peterson]

Last Friday, rode from downtown San Diego to Oceanside, lightly loaded for
credit card touring, on my Atlantis, fully geared, racke'n'packed. Had an
interesting experience on the rolly section between UCSD & Del Mar. I was
catching a rider while I was coasting on the downhill & the rider was
pedaling. Pretty even on the flats. When I'd shift down to lug my loaded
butt (and luggage) up the hill, I'd lose ground. We eventually came
together at a stop light in Del Mar & it was a woman on a single speed just
out for a fun ride. With no racks, packs, & the simple drive train, her
bike was a stark contrast to mine. And we seemed to be making about the
same average speed, despite the equipment differences, FWIW.

dougP

-----Original Message-----
From: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Dustin Sharp
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 7:46 AM
To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: 50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18

That ride can have a few monster hills on it, depending on the route you
take. If you go up Genese from my house, for example, you have to do four
big climbs before you even get to Torrey Pines State Park and begin the true
coastal portion of the ride. I had a low gear of 36x29 yesterday and I was
still wishing for something a bit lower! But that may be more an indication
of my fitness level than anything.

Dustin Sharp
San Diego, CA


On 12/8/08 6:34 AM, "Patrick in VT" <psh...@drm.com> wrote:

>
> hmm . . . 40x18 seems like a very casual gear for a single speed road
> ride, no? A good gear ratio for getting around town or on a studded
> tire winter bike, but I can't imagine a longer, spirited ride in such
> a low gear.
>
>
>
>
> >
>

[franklyn]

Ray,

I could certainly ride a higher gear on the flat; in fact, it would be
a lot faster; usually when I ride 40/17 on the flat, I get passed by
people on their geared machines mashing their higher gears. I keep
such a low gear for the hilly workout I do here in the Berkeley Hills.
I have climbed golf course dr. up to Grizzly Peak on this gearing,
though at times I need to do switchbacks to stay on my bike. Spinning
downhill from the top of Grizzly Peak will wake you up! I average
about 25 mph downhill, but maintain a 30 mph on that gear for at least
a couple of stretches of 30 secs or more.

When my 40T rings wear out, I am inclining to replace it with another
40T, but may consider 42T. We will see.

Franklyn

[RonLau]

Jim,

Yes you can. I don't worry about going up on fixed, coming down is
another matter...

Ron

On Dec 8, 8:43 pm, CycloFiend <cyclofi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> on 12/8/08 4:32 PM, RonLau at ron...@ronlau.com wrote:
>
>
>
> > Jim,
>
> > So, when we did the Riv. weekend and you used your QB, what was the
> > gear going up?
>
> First day was in fixed mode, at 40x14T.  Stalled on the last steep pitch and
> took a few loopy-headed breaks. Second day was 40x18T freewheel mode, which
> was much more pleasant.
>
> http://flickr.com/photos/cyclofiend/collections/72157600243017970/
>
> Not sure I could do that fixed ascent right now.  But that was a good
> weekend!
>
> - J
>
> --
>
> Jim Edgar

> cyclofi...@earthlink.net

[lum gim fong]

If i ever ss i hope twill be on a Qbeam.
I will try the 40x18stock option.

[C.J. Filip]

Good discussion!

To provide further data point for your collective qualitative consideration:

40x17 in the rolling Palouse of N. Idaho with 40x19 option.  My rides consist of spirited solo jaunts, usually connecting bits of trail with primarily gravel roads.

[Esteban]

Thanks for lifting this post out of the past. Just an update: I still love love love my Quickbeam although I have another one from this original post - a 60cm which fits me better. Running 39x16 and can still make it around town. 

Happy holidays, folks!
Esteban

[Patrick Moore]

What tires do you all commonly use on the QB? A rough guesstimate using Jim's trail calculator says that a 35-to-42 (actual) mm tire, the width I assume you'd choose for the QB, gives a wheel diameter of 27.5" to 28", so a 40 X 18 would give you a 61-62 inch gear, which is certainly usable, but IME rather low for all 'round pavement and dirt road riding -- ie, the sort of riding you'd be likely to do on a 35 mm or 42 mm tire. 

I started off riding fixed/ss with a 63" gear, and rather quickly ramped it up to 67/8" and then to 70/71" for commuting and grocery getting; in fact, I found 63" quite nice for my Monocog 29er. IME, the 65 to 70 gi range is a good one for all rounder riding, though I use a slightly higher gear for the gofast. Note that 70" and 76" do very well in firm dirt with gradual inclines.

On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 12:18 AM, lum gim fong <john1...@gmail.com> wrote:

If i ever ss i hope twill be on a Qbeam.
I will try the 40x18stock option.

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Jack Brown Blues.  I'm on my second set.  I had considered JB Greens and some flavor of Compass, but love the JBB enough to keep them rolling.

On Monday, December 11, 2017 at 1:23:40 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

What tires do you all commonly use on the QB? A rough guesstimate using Jim's trail calculator says that a 35-to-42 (actual) mm tire, the width I assume you'd choose for the QB, gives a wheel diameter of 27.5" to 28", so a 40 X 18 would give you a 61-62 inch gear, which is certainly usable, but IME rather low for all 'round pavement and dirt road riding -- ie, the sort of riding you'd be likely to do on a 35 mm or 42 mm tire. 

I started off riding fixed/ss with a 63" gear, and rather quickly ramped it up to 67/8" and then to 70/71" for commuting and grocery getting; in fact, I found 63" quite nice for my Monocog 29er. IME, the 65 to 70 gi range is a good one for all rounder riding, though I use a slightly higher gear for the gofast. Note that 70" and 76" do very well in firm dirt with gradual inclines.

On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 12:18 AM, lum gim fong <john1...@gmail.com> wrote:

If i ever ss i hope twill be on a Qbeam.
I will try the 40x18stock option.

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[Ian A]

Patrick,

Slight thread drift:

Was the ramp up in gear inches from 67 to 71 and 76 due to an increase in strength/familiarity with riding fixed? Or was it the result of trial and error.

I'm planning a fixie build, once the Christmas season passes and finances settle, and I'm wondering about my best gearing options off the bat. I live in a relatively flat city, that has a few noticeable acute climbs (river valley topography).

Also, it looks like there are more options in the 3/32 chain width standard for cogs. Can I get away with using 8 speed chain rings, or is that asking for derailment issues?

Thanks for any insights
IanA

[Philip Williamson]

This old thread was a nice surprise!

Philip
www.biketinker.com

[Deacon Patrick]

Ian (because Patricks might be interchangable. Grin.), I just got back from a 35 mile fixed gear mountain ride. I rode my 40x17 (65”) to the trail, which was 10 miles, 2,000 elevation gain, and generally 3, 5, and 8% grades on paved and dirt roads. See attached map and elevation/grade profile.

Getting stronger: I’m definately getting stronger both climbing and descending. I stayed aerobic the entire climb (limiting myself to nose breathing helps a lot), and I used my front brake twice, once on the trail, once on the road coming down one of those 8% grades.

I’d suggest starting with a 70” gear for the terrain you describe. You will have a learning and strengthening and endurance curve to climb. Know this up front and enter into it. You’ll do great — and remember ... ride till you can’t, walk till you can. Grin.

With abadnon,
Patrick

[Patrick Moore]

=On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 1:38 PM, Ian A <atte...@gmail.com> wrote:

...

Was the ramp up in gear inches from 67 to 71 and 76 due to an increase in strength/familiarity with riding fixed? Or was it the result of trial and error.

Both, really. I started low, afraid that if I went any higher than my 63" gear, I'd have to get off and walk at each hill -- which was silly, because even back then -- circa 1996 -- I tended not to downshift a great deal for hills.

I quickly found out that I disliked having to pedal so fast on flats (this was back when I could maintain 21-23 on the open road at 108-120 rpm -- I used to count cadence) and geared up.

OTOH, I was also, back then, a spinner, and I am convinced that riding fixed helped make me into a masher, so in my own analysis of my gearing progress, there are conundrums I haven't figured out myself.

At any rate, I do know that there was indeed a physiological adaptation that happened relatively quickly; certainly within 6 to 12 months if not sooner; there also was a psychological adaptation -- eg, don't "automatically" try to maintain speed against winds and on hills -- that took several years -- I recall complaining to myself how I hated headwinds when riding fixed; but after several years, I'd learned or reprogrammed to simply maintain a level of effort instead of a level of speed.

And of course, there is the physiological adaptation to standing for longer periods and remaining aerobic; and the psychological adaptation of simply learning to "thinking ahead" to conserve energy for what is to come; ever more important as I age.

None of this is rocket science; I find fixed and all its various ramifications very interesting, since I love riding fixed so much, but really, it's simply a matter of getting on and doing it -- and, of giving yourself enough time to get used to it before you say, "I don't like it."

Eric Norris, sometime of this list, did PBP fixed, and toured across the Rockies fixed; he should chime in.

As to rings and cogs: One other advantage of fixed drivetrains is that you can get by with just about anything. 1/8, 3/32, 10 speed chains -- it all works. You can put a 1/8" chain on a 10 speed ring to pull a 3/32 cog, no problem. I once used a 10 sp chain on an old 5 sp-era (? Old Pro 5 Vis) ring pulling a 3/32 fixed cog; the 10 sp chain had a 8 speed chain masterlink. It worked fine.

The only finickiness is if you use a Dingle cog; these require a chain no wider than one made for 9 speed cassettes; 8 speeders and older rub the adjacent cog.

 

I'm planning a fixie build, once the Christmas season passes and finances settle, and I'm wondering about my best gearing options off the bat. I live in a relatively flat city, that has a few noticeable acute climbs (river valley topography).

Also, it looks like there are more options in the 3/32 chain width standard for cogs. Can I get away with using 8 speed chain rings, or is that asking for derailment issues?

Thanks for any insights
IanA

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[Joe Bernard]

I love that this thread started in the midst of the SS/fixie thing, then sat out 9 years until it became a thing again ;-)

[ted]

Ian, unsolicited advice (I'm not a Patrick) but ...

Gearing, particularly fixed gear gearing, is very particular to the rider. How strong are you, what cadences are you comfortable with, etc.
The best way to get a handle on where to start is to pay attention to what gears you use on your multi-speed bike, and try putting it in one gear and leave it there for a while. Also accept the idea that in time you will likely end up with a collection of rings and cogs, which can be a good thing and not really all that expensive as bike fetishes go.

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

Interestingly, I also started out fixed with about a 63" high gear (40x17/19 dingle with 170 cranks and 700x32) and also quickly ramped up to 70" by increasing chainrings to 42t, then 44t.  I'm in central NJ and 63" feels great in my local park (expansive network of flattish trails right outside my neighborhood) but once I get out on the roads and venture further away from my usual leisure routes and on more rolling terrain it feels way too low with too much spinning for my taste.

Starting with 63" was more a result of just having the 40t 170 crank and wanting a dingle to start.  17-19 was the smallest Surly dingle cog available and a perfect match to the available WI Eno 17-19 freewheel.

I've messed around with this gearing quite a bit the past couple years and more recently divided the fixed cog and freewheel between two different wheelsets and replaced the 170 crank with a 172.5 39t I scored in a trade and running this with the WI Eno 17/19 for approx. 61-62" high which has felt fine while freewheel only on my recent rides. 

When I convert back to fixed (Still deciding which of 3 frames will get exclusive winter duty this year) I'll go with the Surly 17/19 cog paired with the original 170t double crank and 44/46 chainrings for approx. 63" low and "72-73" high to get the best of both worlds.

If I had a Quickbeam with the long, angled rear ends I'd consolidate back to one wheelset with the matching 17/19 fixed/free flip flop but use an "Inverse Double Dingle" set up I previously tested by installing the larger of 2 chainrings on the INSIDE and the smaller chainring on the OUTSIDE of the double crank since the fixed cog sits further inboard of the hub vs the thicker WI freewheel so their chainline is actually off between the two sides and this would allow higher fixed gearing and lower freewheel gearing with the same cogs in back but cleaner chainline in each with the preferred chainring size.

I came up with this after learning about the chainline difference between the surly cog and ENO freewheel the first time I tried a 40/42 x 17/19 dingle drivetrain.

Brian Cole

Lawrenceville, NJ