Your S24O tent recommendation

[BenG]

State parks within 30 miles on 3 compass points, and I have yet to do an S24O. This is my year. What tent do you recommend, please? And thank you,
Ben

[Tim Gavin]

Light weight is a virtue when bike camping.  A small, light shelter will take up less cargo weight and space.

But you need to decide how light is too light, e.g. what comfort features are desired.

Bivy sacks are about the ultimate in light weight; they're not much more than a cocoon for your body.  You usually can't sit up in them, and they usually require staking out (they're not freestanding).

Hammock shelters are also very minimal.  But you'll have to insulate the bottom of your body somehow if staying out in cool or cold weather.  It seems to me like a hammock quilt would add bulk and negate the hammock's weight and space savings.  Also, hammocks require trees.

Single wall tents are lighter than double wall (light wall plus rain proof fly), but they don't usually ventilate as well.  You can usually open up the fly or remove it entirely for ventilation on a double wall tent.  Some tents are totally freestanding (no stakes required in calm wind), some require stake-outs.

Personally, I prefer to use a 2-person lightweight double wall tent.  I'm giving up about a half of a pound in weight and a couple cubic inches in space compared to a 1-person double wall tent, but I have enough head space to sit up and enough floor space to keep my gear inside with me.

I buy tents on closeout from internet sites like Campmor, Sierra Trading Post, the Clymb, or eBay (from reputable sellers).  

I'm very happy with the Big Agnes tent I bought almost 15 years ago.  Big Agnes has excellent customer service; I contacted them a couple years ago about a broken aluminum pole (some fool fell on it), and they sent me two pole sections without charge!

Cheers,

Tim

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 11:13 AM, BenG <bguth...@gmail.com> wrote:

State parks within 30 miles on 3 compass points, and I have yet to do an S24O. This is my year. What tent do you recommend, please? And thank you,
Ben

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[Jeff Lesperance]

If you know you'll be in spots that will support a hammock, and allow it, I recommend a Hennessy Hammock https://hennessyhammock.com/ - which is really more like a suspended tent than a traditional hammock. I have an Explorer Deluxe Asym Zip model, and it's really changed camping for me - as I get a bit older, waking up from the hard ground, even with a sleeping pad, is a bit less friendly than waking up in a hammock.There are smaller/lighter/less-featured hammocks, but I like the Hennessy as it has a mesh bug net attached and easy to attach/detach rain fly.

The tent I recommend, if you need to ground camp, is the Big Agnes Fly Creek - this is a light or ultralight backpacker tent, and I have the 2-person model, which allows me to fit gear and/or another medium-sized person, while still being lightweight. I chose the Fly Creek over other small/lightweight tents because it's a free standing design - it doesn't require staking or anchoring to stand up or to present the full footprint, which some other ultralight tents require, e.g. another popular model is the Mountain Hardware Sprite, which requires staking/anchoring.

Regardless of whether I take my hammock or tent, I bring along a sleeping pad, either a Thermarest when using the hammock, or an inflatable insulated Big Agnes pad for ground camping for extra loft.

Both hammock and tent (and ground pad) fit in my Ortleib panniers, which is also something you want to look at: pack size. Verify that pack size of your shelter solution fits in or on your bike in a reasonable manner. Even if I am being a bit hobo-like on an s24o, I don't endeavor to have my camping bits lashed haphazardly all over my bike - fitment inside a well-secured bag or on top of a rack are important when my adventures take me over rough terrain where stuff can get snagged or bound off, or through environs where less-honest folk might be inclined to abscond with a bit of easily seen kit if I'm away from my bike and luggage for a bit.

-Jeff

Silver Spring, MD

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:13 PM, BenG <bguth...@gmail.com> wrote:

State parks within 30 miles on 3 compass points, and I have yet to do an S24O. This is my year. What tent do you recommend, please? And thank you,
Ben

[Bill Lindsay]

Choosing S24O gear is much more about you than it is about gear.  On an S24O, you can go totally hobo-style, or you can go full ultralight backpacker style, or anything in between.  Do you enjoy geeking out about gear, and spending top dollar on optimal everything?  Cool!  Do that.  Do you like to get by on the bare minimum, spending as little as possible?  Awesome, take that approach.  Does S24O mean planning for a week every minute of the experience and carefully choosing exactly what to bring and exactly what to leave home?  Great, do that.  Does S24O mean shouting, "let's go on a campout!" and lashing random stuff to your bike and heading out?  That sounds fun, too.  Those are four radically different ways to do S24O, and have nothing to do with gear, and have everything to do with you.  My recommendation is to make your gear choices fit with your own attitude towards the activity.  

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[drew]

i like my nemo gogo le for bike stuff. not quite a full tent, but big enough. has no poles and packs down super small in a compression sack. 

[Tim Gavin]

Oooh, those Hennesy Hammocks look well thought-out.  And their Double Bubble pad looks like an efficient insulation solution.  Although I imagine that it makes crinkly noises when you roll around...

[drew]

forgot to say that i also like the big agnes copper spur UL1 for more of a full tent feeling.

[Will Ashe]

I really like my Big Agnes Fly Creek HV UL2. The HV models have steeper wall structures for more room inside. It's a great one person tent at just over two pounds but also works with two people if you're ok with being cozy.

I really want to try a TarpTent Moment DW. MUSA goodness, relatively inexpensive, fast setup and great ventilation.

If you want super lightweight take a look at the ZPack Duplex.

[Steven Sweedler]

Another vote for Big Agnes, I have a very light, very roomy 3 person tent, about 4 lbs. the comfort level makes up for the extra weight, especially on a short ride. I did carry it for last years Great Divide ride. Steve

On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 12:47 PM drew <drewbe...@gmail.com> wrote:

i like my nemo gogo le for bike stuff. not quite a full tent, but big enough. has no poles and packs down super small in a compression sack. 

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Steven Sweedler Plymouth, New Hampshiret

[Palmer]

Hi Ben,
I have been using a Hennesey hammock for 15 years. They are great for bike camping. There are a lot of camping hammocks now. For a tent I have a Eureka Zeus 2 EXO that packs small and light, sets up quickly and has a small vestibule. As Bill said (and Grant Petersen too), do not get hung up on equipment, its only one night and you will figure out what works for you quickly.
It is a great way to take a little vacation almost anytime.
Go for it and have a great time.
Tom Palmer
Twin Lake, MI

[Deacon Patrick]

Hilleberg the Tentmaker's Akto.

Hands down. Should you ever need shelter in any conditions this tent will give it. 3.7 pounds is a small price to pay for that. http://us.hilleberg.com/EN/tent/red-label-tents/akto/

At a full pound less, the Enan is the same design with lighter weight materials. http://us.hilleberg.com/EN/tent/yellow-label-tents/enan/

Neither tent is one you want to buy before you know bikepacking and other camping is going to be a love in you life. Test the concept first with lesser tents. If you love it, graduate and celebrate with Hilleberg.

With abandon,

Patrick

[BenG]

Thanks, friends. "Riding there" is the new part of this for me. We started in a Sears tent, upgraded to a nice Eureka for 10yrs, got a second Eureka when daughters needed some space, then went along with a pop-up camper to preserve unity. Itching to go back to a tent, and S24O is an ideal way. Something to keep the bugs away at night is the essence.

[dstein]

For a while I was more concerned with packed size rather than weight. I care less about the overall weight I'm carrying on the bike as I am about the limited amount of space available (and how that is distributed throughout rear and front, high and low bags) on the bike. Lightweight or not, tents run the gamut of packed sizes.

Somehow I just recently realized that packed size matters a lot less if i cram all the gear (tent, pad, sleeping bag, pillow) directly in my rear bike bag rather than try and pack them all up individually in their respective stuff sacks and try and play tetris to get it all to fit. I upgraded from a medium to a large saddlesack to fit them all (packed in their respective stuff sacks). But just realized I could use a much smaller swift zeitgeist (smaller than a medium saddlesack even) and stuff them all directly in there without the stuff sacks. This helps immensely.

That being said, I spend way too much money on nice gear I hardly ever use and have landed on using a big agnes copper spur ul1 with a 30" klymit statucv pad (super wide, it takes up the whole tent with litte room for extra gear in the tent w/ you) and a quilt from jacks r better. Like others mentioned, Big Agnes is great, although not MUSA, and you can go ultralight with just the footprint and rainfly (skip the tent) or use the whole kit.

[dougP]

For S24Os & short, casual tours:  whatever single person tent is on sale at the REI outlet online.  However, for longer tours requiring more gear, weight & size become important,   Then you need to really analyze your personal needs for the type of environment where you're going, and that gets into more specialized, spendy types of shelter.  I bought an REI Quarter Dome 7 or 8 years ago for an extended tour.  Not overly compact or light, it was cheap, but it's gotten probably 100 nights of use, with only minor wear & tear.  If it ever falls apart, I'll research "nicer" tents.  Until that happens, I'm a happy camper.

dougP

On Wednesday, February 15, 2017 at 9:13:51 AM UTC-8, BenG wrote:

[Eric Daume]

I really like the Eureka Spitfire 2. Not super light, but cheap, simple, and easy to set up. Roomy, too. It can actually fit two adults, or 6'3" me and two of my elementary age kids. 

Every time I use this tent, I'm pleased with it. 

Eric

Who didn't use his tent at all last year, but will do better this year. 

On Wednesday, February 15, 2017, BenG <bguth...@gmail.com> wrote:

State parks within 30 miles on 3 compass points, and I have yet to do an S24O. This is my year. What tent do you recommend, please? And thank you,
Ben

[Ian A]

I toured extensively with the Eureka Spitfire II. It was roomy and the double doors are nice, but it's not freestanding and has to be pegged in to stay upright. I wore mine out over the course of two years, but next time I'd rather out the money toward an Akto.

IanA.

[Ginz]

I like the Hennessey Hammock. The bubble foil insulation is probably quiet but the space blanket is definitely noises. In warm weather I bring only a bag. In cooler weather I bring a foam pad for extra insulation.

I also have the spitfire tent. If I could do it again, I'd try to find something free standing and possibly with a vestibule in case of rain.

[Mark Reimer]

Another vote for Big Agnes. I have the Fly Creek UL 2 Platinum. Pricey, absolutely. But it fits two people (pretty squished, but there is a vestibule for your gear) or one person (with room for a bit of gear inside), weighs LESS than many bivvy sacks, and has held up beautifully for the last 3-4 years I've had it. I've used it in snow storms, thunderstorms, 2-week bikepacking tours in the mountains, all over. It's an amazing tent. If it ever dies on me, I'm getting the exact same one again. 

[Jon BALER]

Hammocks are great.   A 3/4 pad works well, but an underquilt is even better.   Neither is needed for summer camping, and a hammock will feel cooler on the hot summer nights.

We did a 5 week west coast trip, and all three of us used hammocks.  My buddy has also through hiked the AT, and rode across country and back with a hammock.

WarBonnet Blackbird hammocks come highly recommended

https://www.warbonnetoutdoors.com/product-category/hammocks/

[Bill Lindsay]

I can't get to sleep in a hammock.  Getting bent into that "C" (or "V") shape makes my knees ache from hyperextension.  Am I the only one who can't do it?  Am I just doing it wrong?  I use my hammock for lounging, but couldn't fall asleep trying to do an overnighter in the backyard as an S24O shake down.  

Bill hammock-challenged Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[Tim Gavin]

Bill-

A wide enough hammock can allow you to lie down diagonally, so the curve is less extreme.  

But yeah, that hyperextension bugs the hell out of my knees.  When lying on my back in a hammock, I usually end up with my legs splayed instead of straight.  Or, I just sleep on my side (I'm a side sleeper).

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[Eric Norris]

I would look to an expert—it seems the proper way to lay in a hammock is to have your legs hang over the sides, which allows the knees to bend naturally. Problem solved.

--Eric N
campyo...@me.com
www.CampyOnly.com
Campyonlyguy.blogspot.com
@Campyonlyguy

On Feb 16, 2017, at 9:57 AM, Tim Gavin <tim....@littlevillagemag.com> wrote:

Bill-

A wide enough hammock can allow you to lie down diagonally, so the curve is less extreme.  

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[Bill Lindsay]

I did try to sleep in my mummy-shaped bag, which puts my legs in to mermaid mode.  It completely prevents me from splaying my legs to either side.  Perhaps I need to try one of those quilt things?  Yay!  More gear!

B

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[Jeff Lesperance]

Diagonal space or asym desgin of the Hennessy hammock (and others I'm sure have this too), is the secret sauce to not getting bent up while sleeping. I put my thermarest pad in the hammock with me, and that helps flatten the bottom a bit more as well if I wiggle around a bit. I sleep comfortably on my back and on my side in my Hennessy hammock, and I'm a bit of a princess and the pea sleeper at home, where I've invested in a "sleep number" bed that allows me to adjust firmness on a whim.

[doc]

Take a look at a Montbell bag.  They have diagonal elastic seams which normally keeps the bag snug against the body (quicker to heat up) but will also expand when you stretch out.  I believe they are now made in Viet Nam.

[doc]

I have two smaller tents that get pressed into service for bike camping.  The first is a used Kelty Gunnison 2 person that runs about 4 pounds and sets up lightening fast.  I take that if I'm going to be out more than a few days (because of the extra room for changing clothes, etc...) or if it looks like there might be rain so I can pull all the gear inside.  Its proved to be a very cost effective "start-up" tent.   I also have a used BA Seedhouse SL1 which is very light and compact, and just big enough.  That's good for S240's as well as backpacking.

My biggest wish for a small tent is camouflage, so I can blend in to the landscape.  I like to avoid the campgrounds and stick to forests for the solitude as well as the costs (free).  Most army surplus is pretty beat and rather heavy, and most tactical stuff is way overpriced.  The ideal would be for BA to offer camo print flys as an option. 

[doc]

Forgot to mention:  The Kelty is free standing, meaning you can set it up without using any stakes, and the fly is still off of the netting.  Only you can't use the vestibules.  The BA requires about 5-6 stakes with the fly section to keep it off of the netting, plus you have some guy-cords that require staking.  This can be an issue on rocky ground.

[BenG]

Having fun with choosing. One of the onliners lists the BA Seedhouse SL2 at 3lbs 16oz. Marketing...

[Surlyprof]

Ben,

I haven't ventured into S240 world yet but used to backpack a great deal.  I use a 2 lb. 2-person Marmot (or as my wife likes to call it a one-person, one-dog, I'm sleeping in the car tent) that is fairly similar to the Big Agnes that many are suggesting.  Having a little headroom is nice over a bivy.  A couple of other key features that I looked for, based on past experience, is the bathtub bottom with no seams until you are 3-4" off the ground.  Helps keep life a little dryer.  The other thing I found helped were tents that had pole straps that not only tightened up nicely but had a buckle that split the webbing in two parts.  Any moisture wants to wick up the webbing to the tent.  The buckle in the middle of the strap keeps that from happening.  Didn't know it would be such a nice feature until I started using it.  I also found that the mesh mattered.  I've had tents where the mesh actually obscured the view at night.  The Marmot has a darker purple mesh that is almost completely transparent when star-gazing at night.  That was an incredible upgrade after the previous tents.  

If you are interested in saving some money, REI's online garage is good but their garage sales are even better.  We bought a larger tent for car camping from an REI Garage sale.  They run them every couple of months to get rid of returned merchandise.  Go early, read the tags carefully (in case it says "ripped") and have a list of tents you are looking for before walking in the door.  We had a list of 4 tents we'd be happy with and found the 1st and 3rd on our list.  Got our top choice for about $60-70 for a $400 tent.

Good luck!

John

[Les Lammers]

Here are the two person tents at Sierra Trading Post. Some have a 25% off coupon. http://www.sierratradingpost.com/s~tents/specdataor~sleep%20capacity!2-person/

[BenG]

Helpful, thank you all. In case my wife joins me, a big 2-person sounds right, although she wants to just meet me there with the camper :) Wanted a Hilleberg (seemed like the Rivendell of tents) but taking good advice to start cheap. Eye on a Eureka Spitfire - under $200, long and tall, not too heavy.

[John Rinker]

Tent shopping!? Lucky! I've been enjoying my Sierra Designs Flashlight 2 (just under 3 lbs). I bought the 2-person for when my wife and I go backpacking, but when I go bikepacking it's just me and the bike all cozy inside. It packs small, fits in my basket and stands strong through wind and rain. I'm a tall guy (195cm) and there's plenty of room for me to lay down or sit up inside. It can collect condensation being a single walled tent, but nothing that's ever been more than a slight annoyance.

Check them out at REI: https://www.rei.com/rei-garage/product/115975/sierra-designs-flashlight-2-fl-tent

Cheers, John

[Clayton.sf]

tarp tent double rainbow is another great option. MUSA and very light for the size. I use their Contrails model for places I can't use my Hammock (mine is a Dutch, with a tadpole tarp). Hammock takes slight longer to pitch, but is superior in just about any other situation - especially in pouring rain!

Clayton Scott

[Sofia Torres]

FWIW I just sold my Seedhouse SL2 (to get a Fly Creek) and can confirm that the Seedhouse is exactly 48oz with everything, all stuff sacks, 6 stakes - foot print not included in that weight.

[Clayton.sf]

also, ditching or not buying the ground sheet and replacing it with some hand-cut Tyvek saves a little weight and bulk and money. works great and if you wear it out you can just cut a new one. it has many more applications too.

Clayton Scott
SF, CA