Frank Jones, latest Knothole post

[Patrick Moore]

Queries: 

it’s for single-speed freewheels, not fixed gear bikes. 

But with long (and slanted!) track ends, why not fixed? What am I missing?

6 or 8 tooth accommodation; that's enough to give you quite a range, from 16 t to 21 t easily; with a 42 t ring, 72" to 55", 16 t one one side, 17/20 or 21 t cogs on the other.

the top tubes for the 48.5, 51.5 53, 55, 57, and 59 are 53.5, 54.4, 56.2, 57.5, and 58.

There seems to be a tt length missing: can anyone supply it?

It sounds very nice and I am tempted, but ... but... shouldn't ... shouldn't ...

But wouldn't it be nice with some light wheels and a pair of Barlow Pass extralights?

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Alburquerque, New Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique

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[Belopsky]

Monday or Tuesday we should have geometry/ordering info.
With shipping it costs more than I can get a custom for..what is a boy to do?

[iamkeith]

>"But with long (and slanted!) track ends, why not fixed? What am I missing?"

I had to read it a couple of times to understand, not being a fixed gear rider. Basically, he's saying there's too much chance of pedal strikes with such a low bottom bracket. Think corners without the ability to keep your inside pedal elevated

[Bill Lindsay]

Probably buy both another custom as well as a Senor Frank Jones, if history has taught us more than aught. 

[Patrick Moore]

Aha; got it.

On Sat, Dec 16, 2017 at 5:13 PM, iamkeith <keith...@gmail.com> wrote:

>"But with long (and slanted!) track ends, why not fixed? What am I missing?"

I had to read it a couple of times to understand, not being a fixed gear rider.  Basically, he's saying there's too much chance of pedal strikes with such a low bottom bracket.  Think corners without the ability to keep your inside pedal elevated

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[RandoNate]

He did mention that if you run 33’s or larger you can still go fixed, so you Barlow pass el’s would be great!

[Clayton.sf]

consider me very tempted. need geo. at 6" I might be pushing it. though I am not in the super high bar camp

Clayton Scott

SF, CA

[christian poppell]

If I didn't already own a Quickbeam I would be picking one of these up. It might be the most fun bike I own.

[Joe Bernard]

I love that the Blue Lug people were like, "Yeah, we'll take the random American name, let's go with that."

[Belopsky]

Looks like there are more numbers now:
/quote

Frame size    TTcm      conservative PBH range

48.5               53.5            64.5-67

51.5               54.4 !          66.5-69.2

53                  55.3 !          68.5 - 72

55                  56.2            70.5 - 73.5

57                   57.5            72.5 - 75.5

59                   58.1            74.5 - 79.5

These recommendations are rough, loose, and assume a Nitto stem with at least a 190mm quill. We now stock the Tallux with 225mm, which is probably too long for the 53cm and smaller. With the Tallux on the smaller bikes, you won't be able to get it even level with the saddle. I'm not computer-modeling any of this, sorry, but it's pretty close to right.

/end quote

I assume that by PBH he means seat height?
The 53 is looking mighty good, but the 55 may work as well.

How does Rivendell typically 'measure' their frame size? Is it bb center to [theoretical] top?

[Grant @ Rivendell]

You can ride fixed, but since there's no coasting you have to be careful about clipping pedals. With a 75 drop (track bikes have 60, commonly) and a wider-than track cranky (presumably) there's more risk. That is hugely abated by the larger tires--which more than makes up for the increased drop. But as a maker - designer, I am always concerned about somebody putting on a high Q factor crank, 700x22;s, wide pedals, and pedaling while leaning over speed bumps. Then that person crashes, blames us, we get sued, party's over.

If all that makes sense and you still wanna ride fixed, it'll be a better fixie ride than a normal fixie bke, I'm pretty sure!

53cm has 54.4 top tube, by memory. I don't want to re-look it up now. Friend's on his way, we're going out to play. (And I hope my dissing of the importance of the length of a top tube without regarding the other variables that affect how much you have to bend and reach... is legendary!)

[Dave Small]

Yes, it has to be saddle height.  

[Clayton.sf]

dibs on a 59!

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks for this. What is the sta -- does anyone know? It looks like a 57 would be nice ...

PAM

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[Grant Petersen]

Back from my short playdate...

Going out again soon, but thanks for the correction on the PBH which should've been SH, or the other way around. It's fixed now.

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[Belopsky]

ooh a geometry of the 53.
Given the 553 top tube I think that's the ticket...83 PBH is I.
Will have a tad bit seatpost showing than my Gunnar probably (~1cm more maybe)

My wallet's ready. Lets get itttt

Curious to see what build kits you guys think of Grant!

On Sunday, December 17, 2017 at 4:22:27 PM UTC-5, Grant @ Rivendell wrote:

Back from my short playdate...

Going out again soon, but thanks for the correction on the PBH which should've been SH, or the other way around. It's fixed now.

On Sun, Dec 17, 2017 at 11:39 AM, Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks for this. What is the sta -- does anyone know? It looks like a 57 would be nice ...

PAM

On Sun, Dec 17, 2017 at 7:51 AM, Belopsky <belopol...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looks like there are more numbers now:
/quote

Frame size    TTcm      conservative PBH range

48.5               53.5            64.5-67

51.5               54.4 !          66.5-69.2

53                  55.3 !          68.5 - 72

55                  56.2            70.5 - 73.5

57                   57.5            72.5 - 75.5

59                   58.1            74.5 - 79.5

These recommendations are rough, loose, and assume a Nitto stem with at least a 190mm quill. We now stock the Tallux with 225mm, which is probably too long for the 53cm and smaller. With the Tallux on the smaller bikes, you won't be able to get it even level with the saddle. I'm not computer-modeling any of this, sorry, but it's pretty close to right.

/end quote

I assume that by PBH he means seat height?
The 53 is looking mighty good, but the 55 may work as well.

How does Rivendell typically 'measure' their frame size? Is it bb center to [theoretical] top?

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[John G.]

79.5 max saddle height? I think I can make that work!

[Joe Bernard]

Yes, get that one. I'll buy it from you in a few months!

[John G.]

Hey now—I hold on to my Rivs! Just having a bit of holiday impulse control...

[Joe Bernard]

That's ok, I meant Igor. We ride the same size bikes and he's always selling one 😋

[Mark in Beacon]

Not completely random. It has a hidden message: Frank J(ones).  Frank J. Ones. One's enough. One speed. Okay, maybe a stretch. I should go do some bike maintenance.

[Mark in Beacon]

Frankly, Jay, Ones enough. Okay, I'm (d)one.

[Belopsky]

The real question is - will we see more about the Frank today?

[Ken Yokanovich]

Anxiously awaiting any announcement.  Finger exercises and stretching for quick-click reaction time so I can buy one as a LONG awaited replacement for my dearly departed Quickbeam.

[Belopsky]

well its announced, get your finger ready for the 12pm pst post

[Belopsky]

Well, I ordered the 53.

I was hoping to see geometry for the 55 but I think the 53 is right.

[Clayton.sf]

Sucks. Had it in the cart and once I hit submit after entering payment it said inventory issues. 

Oh well.

Clayton Scott

SF, CA

[Belopsky]

Interesting - there were 5 total did the 59 really go that quick?

[tc]

Maybe they'll do another run.  I wonder how many to make it worthwhile?  

On Tuesday, December 19, 2017 at 3:06:28 PM UTC-5, Clayton.sf wrote:

[Jeremy Tavan]

I had my LBS order a 55, but I think I was too late to get the silver one (my preference). That was fast. Oh well, the blue looks nice, too.

Now here's the fun question - do I build it up as a single speed or a 3-speed IGH? 

[Belopsky]

they said, absolutely, positively, there will not be another run.
This was at least 1 year in the making and Blue Lug for 2/3s of them

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

I'm too tall for 'em but just wanted to see additional pics and the 59cm showed sold out only about 5 mins past the hour.

[Brewster Fong]

On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 4:13:36 PM UTC-8, iamkeith wrote:

>"But with long (and slanted!) track ends, why not fixed? What am I missing?"

I had to read it a couple of times to understand, not being a fixed gear rider.  Basically, he's saying there's too much chance of pedal strikes with such a low bottom bracket.  Think corners without the ability to keep your inside pedal elevated

Thanks. When I saw the name JONES, I thought this thread was about a Jones Bike, like those built by JEFF Jones.  I didn't know or realized that Riv is coming out with a "Jones" bike of their own.

Good to know. So is it going to be lugged or is Riv going tig-welded like what they seem to be headed.

Good Luck!

[Joe Bernard]

The blue is pretty. It reminds me of the old Ram color, although I think it's an old Hilsen hue. Alas, I'm all full up on on bikes with my 2-speed Cheviot and Bike Friday cargo bikes on the way. Enjoy, Jonesers!

[Belopsky]

they said its a homer blue and thats what i ordered

[lconley]

57cm Blue, I don't understand the preference for silver, but it worked out for me.

Now I need to order some rims to lace to the NOS Campy hubs - definitely polished finish on the rims. I also have an NOS Spidel Crankset (French Campy copy that is actually nicer - it is finished on the backside of the crank arms, just like the front). In fact, think I have everything I need except for the rims and handlebars. Not sure about tires yet - likely 38mm Compass Barlow Pass Extralight. This is going to be old school, lightweight and stripped with dropped bars, but with comfortable tires. Given the low BB - this may be the bike for my Lyotard Marcel Berthet platform pedals.

Laing

[iamkeith]

I'm just catching up - but that sounds like what i expected to happen with the 59.  Glad I didn't want one, because work would have kept me away at  the crucial moment - not unlike trying to sign my kids up for after-school clubs.   Such a bummer that Grant couldn't get one though.

I'm not sure I've ever understood the chosen allocation of sizes in a given order.  Is it an attempt to be equitable to all body types, or do manufacturers require minimums in each size, whether you want them or not?  It's not just Rivendell or even bikes, for that matter.   Ask any man with a 10 1/2 size shoe.

For those of you who might have missed out, I wonder if Blue lug would have any extras?  A little more shipping  cost, but maybe worth it?

[iamkeith]

Glad to hear you pulled the trigger, after all that.   Congratulations