Trigger shifters on swept-back bars - Jones or others

[Melanie]

Has anyone found a trigger shifter that works well with swept-back bars? I may have to install bar ends or go the oddly mounted thumb shifter route. But triggers near the brake levers would be ideal. Thanks.
Melanie

[A CT Cyclist]

Funny you should ask, I've been thinking about the same thing. I'm looking at the Sun race trigger shifters for 10 speed road because they look clean and would be compatible with my shimano road derailleur. Has anyone used trigger shifters from them. If I was building the bike up from scratch I think I would go with Dram triggers.

[Tim Gavin]

I'm using 3x9 Shimano MTB trigger shifters with the Jones Loop 710 bars on my '88 Schwinn KOM.  There's plenty of real estate on the ends of the 710s to fit brake levers, shifters, and grips.  

Narrower bars may not have enough real estate; I have a set of early Jones Cut Loop bars in 560 mm which don't have enough space there.

The angle of the under-grip shift levers isn't as good as it would be on a flat (un-swept) MTB bar, but it works fine for Just Riding Around and occasional trails.

I could take a picture later if you'd like to see the setup (quill adapter to threadless stem, FYI).

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 10:00 AM, A CT Cyclist <amee...@gmail.com> wrote:

Funny you should ask, I've been thinking about the same thing. I'm looking at the Sun race trigger shifters for 10 speed road because they look clean and would be compatible with my shimano road derailleur. Has anyone used trigger shifters from them. If I was building the bike up from scratch I think I would go with Dram triggers.

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[Jay Connolly]

There a ton of room on the Jones bars and on the Ospreys. I use Shimano 9 speed on the Joe with Jones. They work great. I got a deal too good to pass up on a 1x crank, and someone gave me a brand new 11-42 cassette for free, so my Clem L will be a 1x11. It strikes me as a little absurd, somehow, and a little anti-Riv, but I’m looking forward to it.

Jay

[Joe Bernard]

I don't have triggers on my Jones Loop, but I've used them (Shimano RapidFire) on a bunch of bars with a similar sweepback. I think they work well this way, the front trigger you pull back with your index finger is actually a little easier to reach at this angle.

I've used them on Albatross, too, but that was less successful.

[Jim M.]

I use XT 9-speed triggers on bullmoose bars. Works well, imho.

jim m

walnut creek, ca

[Melanie]

Thanks, for the responses. Tim - I’d love to see your pictures. I’m a novice at doing my own builds and I seem to have created a losing combination of Choco Norm and Shimano M590. Back to the drawing board.

[Clayton.sf]

Use triggers on Jones bars for both the dropper post and the 11 speed shifter (integrated via i-spec with the brake lever).

Trigger on Choco- and Bosco-mooses too. They work great and there is enough real estate on the bars to make them not get in the way.

On the Choco I ran the shifter right by the right side intersections of the "V" bar and the main bar. On the Bosco I run the shifter on the right side about 2/3 down right before the bar bends into the flat bar portion.

Personally I like triggers over bar ends as they are in a less vulnerable position. Plus a lot of miles are on bumpy terrain where indexed shifting works better for me. Less trimming and more control since I can actually keep my hands on the bars while shifting.

Best,

Clayton Scott

SF, CA

[Ed Carolipio]

I've used Deore 3x9 shifters on a 710 Jones Loop and a Bosco, and it works well for both.

I found the best position for shifters on the Jones is pretty darn close to the loop. A superlong grip (like the ESI Chunky, which they sell) or just bar tape gives a myriad of hand positions across the outside of the bar, along with the associated shift in saddle position and/or angle to the back. The indicator window on the Shimano does sneak up over a part of the "loop" portion, which may restrict the secondary position on the inside grips on the Jones bar.

On the Bosco, because of the wrist position, the triggers are about a 1/4 turn rotated with respect to the ground. If you see folks with pictures of the Ergo grip positioning on the Bosco - Grant has some photos posted on the Blug with his wrapped Dutch paddle grips, https://www.rivbike.com/blogs/peeking-through-the-knothole/last-one-of-march-2017 - just imagine how the triggers have to rotate around CW on right and CCW on left to be under the brake levers.

--Ed C.

On Monday, October 23, 2017 at 7:51:43 AM UTC-7, Melanie wrote:

[Joe Bernard]

That's a nice shifter, Melanie, but I agree it's a bad fit on Chocos..I tried a similar shifter on a Choco-Moose. The only way it sorta worked was to move up on the curve, which then felt far away and awkward for me. I think they work better on bars that don't sweep straight back.

[iamkeith]

Melanie, do those shifters detach from the mounting clamp? If so, I'm wondering if something like this would work, on the straight section near the stem clamp:

https://paulcomp.com/shop/components/sram-shifter-adaptor/

These are 31.8 and possibly sram specific, but i can't believe someone hasn't come up with an elegant hack solution for this. I'm hoping you find a way, because id like to use a similar combination on a specific bike.

[iamkeith]

Clayton, how did you get the clamps past the bend on the choco bar? Could you share pictures?

[iamkeith]

Couple more thoughts, Melanie: I'd forgotten about a very short-lived experiment i did with trigger shifters on an albatross bar. Ironically, on the same bike i now wish to try boscos on now, i posted pics in this thread a couple of years ago:

https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/rbw-owners-bunch/acdHkcHzz8c

Seems i didn't hate the shiters as much as the bars.

Other thought was that, if the concern is simply with the amount of room left for grips, you could just get some control tech terminators. (1" extenders). Since the bosco was intended to have bar end shifters, it probably needs them anyway.

[Clayton.sf]

They just slide around the bend, similar to how a quill stem slides around bend. They are regular XT and Saint shifters and DON'T have a hinged clamp. but are easy to get around. 

Clayton Scott

SF, CA

[Marc40a]

On Monday, October 23, 2017 at 10:51:43 AM UTC-4, Melanie wrote:

Has anyone found a trigger shifter that works well with swept-back bars?  I may have to install bar ends or go the oddly mounted thumb shifter route. But triggers near the brake levers would be ideal. Thanks.
Melanie

I use a Deore M590 9 speed right shifter on the right/rear derailleur and a bar-end mounted on a Paul Thumbie on the left/ front derailleur so I can friction shift and trim. Great combo. 

[Scott McLain]

I would stick to 9-speed and go with these shifters for an upright bar w/o bar ends.

MicroShift Flat Bar Double/Triple 9 speed Thumb Shifters https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CJXMFK4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_wC87zbK9C5E8A

I would go with 9-speed to avoid snags with road versus mountain components not working together.

IMHO

Scott

[Clayton]

Melanie, I found with swept bars, it's best to rotate the trigger shift lever up, so the throw is about 45 degrees downward. (If looking at the end of the bar, rotate the shifter clockwise so the paddle is higher. It's easier to shift this way for me, and I have carpal tunnel and I am ulnar positive (birth defect where my ulna is longer than the radius, which gives me hand issues). Give it a try.

Clayton (Bend-ite)

On Monday, October 23, 2017 at 7:51:43 AM UTC-7, Melanie wrote:

[Tim Gavin]

Melanie-

Sorry for the tardy response, but here are some pictures of the current build (Jones bars with M590 shifters) on my '88 Schwinn KOM-10.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/uziENhoNRlEvl6ws1

Hopefully that link works.

Look at the most recent photos (scroll to the bottom) to show the Jones bar cockpit.  I mounted the bars with a ~20 degree nose-up tilt (on a threadless stem adapter and uptilt stem).  I mounted the shifters and brake levers about ~90 degrees down from the plane of the bar, or about ~70 degrees from the horizon.  

This seems to get the thumb shifters in a comfortable position.

Other stuff about the build:

The bike is a 1988 Schwinn KOM-10, a high-end lugged MTB frameset made at the new plant in Greenville MS under Richard Schwinn.  It was made as the '86-87 Paramountain, and raced to NORBA championships by Ned Overend.  For '88 they renamed it since they couldn't keep making the Paramountain with Ned's name on it after he left for Specialized.

Its tubeset is Tange Prestige MTB, same tubing as the Stumpjumper and other top MTB of the mid-80s, and the lugs were cast by Schwinn's Paramount group.

It has weird angles (which were a radical new design for NORBA competition); 71 degree headset and 74 degree seat tube angles, a long top tube (24"/61cm vs 22"/56cm seat tube) and low stack (due to flat top tube angle) makes for twitchy front end handling.

It also has the signature oddball feature of the mid-80s MTB:  U-brakes on the chainstays behind the crank!  Thankfully, mine are the Deore XT M730s, which were regarded as the best of the breed.  They work well with new Kool-stop pads, but they're still a pain to set up.

The build was complete Shimano Deore XT M730, including headset, BB, hubs, pedals, etc.  For that very first production run, it was 6-speed indexed, on a Uniglide hub.  I still have the wheels; that hub is a weird one.

I bought the bike about 4 years ago for only $75!  It was used but not trashed, except for the huge scratches in the paint from some cruel storage hooks.  The paint damage and eventual rust is what urged me to blast off the awesome bomb pop paint job and I had it powder coated clear with a little sparkle.

I've kept much of the original equipment (brakes, headset, crankset (Biopace 48/38/26), but I've replaced other components that I've worn out (RD, BB) or replaced with upgrades.  It was a fun and sporty ride with Nitto B135 drop bars, but now that its fast gravel duties have been taken over by my plastic (CF) 'cross bike, the upright bar build makes more sense.

I changed the wheelset to a modern Deore XT T780 set with a dynamo front hub, and the RD to a 9-speed Shimano.  The M590 9-speed shifters work great with both the modern rear and vintage front (original crank and FD).

I mounted a B&M Cyo premium headlight to the threaded eyelet on the side of my Nitto M12 front rack using a Sheldon's nut.

I mounted a B&M Topline tail light to a Tubus Logo Evo rear rack.  I ran the tail light cable along the down tube, left chain stay, and up the rack leg, and I glued it on with Shoe Goo (holding for 2 years now).

The front bag is a Sackville small Trunksack, which fits perfectly on the M12 but doesn't hold much.  The frame bag is a custom from RuthWorks in SF; I bought it from a listmember who had it made for his identical Paramountain frame, but later sold the frame without the bag.  It's a custom fit (which is great, because the geometry of this bike is weird and a modern frame bag would fit funny) and fits a fair amount of gear.  I add some Ortlieb rear panniers for cargo.

By using bottle cage adapters and side-entry cages, I can still fit two full bottles under the frame bag.

The tires are Schwalbe Thunder Burt liteskin in 26 x 2.1.  The low-profile knobs (and light construction) make them very fast for MTB tires, yet they still have enough tread for dry dirt trails.  The fenders are SKS P65 longboards.

This bike is a big klutz (38 lbs and twitchy front end).  But I'm a big klutz too so it fits.  I've done a lot on it (single track, fast gravel and dirt rides, touring, commuting, winter riding, just riding downtown) but it has gotten elbowed out of the common rotation by my other lighter and more specialized bikes.  Any more, I ride it when I want to take a leisurely ride down to the library or brewery.

Cheers,

Tim Gavin

Cedar Rapids, IA

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:02 PM, Melanie <myo...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks, for the responses. Tim - I’d love to see your pictures.  I’m a novice at doing my own builds and I seem to have created a losing combination of Choco Norm and Shimano M590.  Back to the drawing board.