Tubesets: Rambouillet v Roadeo
reynoldslugs
lighter gauge, than the Rambouillet. Does any member of the tribe
have data?
thanks
TTM/RL 531
James Warren
I do know that whatever the answer is, it might be different for the larger size Roadeo. Someone at Rivendell would be able to answer if you call them.
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donald compton
sincerely, don c.
rperks
up are "a touch heavier" for what that is worth. When I ordered mine
they explained that it was quite similar to a Legolas, but possibly
lighter in the stays and fork because they do not have to braze on
brake bosses. As for the Main triangle I have email/asked in vain,
initially it might be .8 .5 .8 but that was never confirmed. Also, my
seat and down tubes bulge to a larger OD as they hit the BB. Bottom
line is I love the ride, I still wonder about the Ram, that one in CO
is tempting to tink about, but really I should just be riding what I
now own more often.
Rob
Aaron Thomas
with .6/.38/.6. butts and bellies.
My memory is not so good on the larger frame sizes, but something like
OS .8/.5/.8 seems to ring a bell (but don't quote me on it).
Grant outlined it in a post on this list, but I cannot find it right
off the bat in the archives. With a little digging I'm sure someone
could uncover it.
Aaron
On Mar 3, 8:12 pm, reynoldslugs <be...@perrylaw.net> wrote:
cleve...@gmail.com
for the main triangle, and I assume he was talking about a size that
fit him - maybe a 58cm? That would certainly make for a "lively"
ride!
I have a 54cm Rambouillet, and I too think it is overbuilt for
spirited riding. In fact, I use it for my commuter/grocery getter and
touring because of it's stiffness. I've learned to ride it with these
loads, but it requires a lot of attention.
This year I'm planning some touring with a front loading bike - we'll
see how that goes.
Horace
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "gr...@rivbike.com" <Grantmill...@gmail.com>
Date: Jul 9 2009, 1:21 pm
Subject: Frame-Bike Plans (some)
To: RBW Owners Bunch
Newlite Roadbike. TheROADEO<---final name, final spelling, thanks
for all your input and don't take offense.
This is really Mark's bike, by which I mean he asked for it/suggested
it as a bike for clubbies. He's a club rider a couple of days a week,
and rides his cross bikes--which to me are light enough, at 19-20lb,
even with fatty tires (and he's still the fastest by a good margin,
and the humblest). But he sees his fellow clubbies buying road bikes
with carbon this and that, and was thinking hmm, they should get a
nice lugged steel bike, and if we made it light enough and roadynuff
they probably would.
Originally,'twas gunnabe for short reach brakes, but nobody here
really rides with those anymore, so, with some input from Jay's,
they'll use standard reach brakes, which means...about 56mm reach,
about like the 'bouillet.
TUBING: The goal is a clubbie bike, so it's going to be clubbie light,
and it should, ideally, be ridding by somebody who is, if not clubbie
light, at least knows how to ride light. A Nureyev-like 225-pounder
who lifts over bumps and veers around pothholes and rides 32mm tires
at 85psi rides lighter than a Nagurski-like 150-pounder who rides 23mm
tires at 115psi and hits everything with a stiff body and locked arms.
So, it's hard to give this bike a weight limit. I should point out
that you aren't buying an engine with this bike; you're supplying the
engine, and it's good to somewhat match the engine's weight with the
frame's weight.
OK: Up to 57cm, the main tube butts are 0.65, with 0.4bellies. Bigger
than that, 0.8 butts with 0.6bellies. It's superstrong heat-treated
steel, so strength isn't much of an issue. Flex is more of an issue,
but nobody really anymore believes that flexless frames are the goal
(I never have). A more rigid frame matters if you're toting weight,
but not as much if you aren't, and as we introduce this as a
superlight clubbie-bike, its flex-under-a-touring-load shouldn't
matter.
Esteban
described as go anywhere road bikes, with photos of the bikes off
road. And many of us have discovered, the Ram/Rom can take a lickin'
off road. I'm not sure I'd do the same with a Roadeo, which is made
for the road. This being said, the Ram/Rom can be built into a light
build, and it's comfortable and it can haul. They are on the road
side of the all-rounder. The Roadeo seems more purpose-built... Which
is cool!
reynoldslugs
Now, for the last piece of the puzzle - and for the prize cigar and
kewpie doll - did Grant ever post the tubeset thicknesses for the
Rambouillet? I looked back in old Readers and couldn't locate
anything.
On Mar 4, 7:31 am, Horace <max...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
newenglandbike
frames have 8/5/8 main triangle tubes:
Which makes it seem strange that the Roadeo would have 8/6/8 tubing in
sizes above 57, since that would mean the tubing is beefier than in
their other, more trail-oriented frames such as the AHH (if the AHH
has 8/5/8 tubes) and the Quickbeam, for example.
Dustin Sharp
same if not beefier than the Rambos? If so, I'm not sure why so much is
being made of it being a light bike that isn't designed for any kind of a
load whatsoever.
> From: newenglandbike <matthi...@gmail.com>
> Reply-To: <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 09:21:37 -0800 (PST)
> To: RBW Owners Bunch <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com>
> Subject: [RBW] Re: Tubesets: Rambouillet v Roadeo
>
> I remember from this post that most of Rivendell's frames are 8/5/8:
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch/browse_thread/thread/9b63d62ff
> d368e31/829ef6df4ed06b49?q=#829ef6df4ed06b49
>
> Which makes it seem strange that the larger sizes of the Roadeo would
> be 8/6/8- since that would make it beefier than their other more
> trail-oriented frames such as the AHH (if the above post implies that
> the AHH 8/5/8 and the Quickbeam).
rperks
cross sections in relation to a bike's ride and the physical abilities
of the frame. I am speeking from my own conclusions in progress,
based on armchair engineering and too much re-reading of BQ. Bicyle
frames while appearing basic are really a fairly complex collection of
three dimensional tubes with more possible combinations than I can
really get my head around.
As Grant was quoted above the way you ride will play a huge roll.
How you pedal, natural cadence etc. may or may not have a certain
synergy with different bicycles in different conditions.
Heat treated steels will flex to a greater extent without plastic
deformation than a non heat treated steel, and therefore are used in
lighter or thinner sections, but the tube OD is generally increased to
moderate flex. So does that infer that I can bounce around on my
Roadeo, it will flex more, but not retain a cold set from the
bending? Do I want to experiment with a $2k inventment and increased
risk? hell yeah, otherwise i would buy a bike build out of 1mm
straight gage and have giant legs.
It is common knowledge that a surly cross check is overbuilt as a
cross bike. Where does the Legolas fit in? How far is a Roadeo from
a Legolas? or a Sachs for that matter? and what kind of abuses is one
willing to put into the bike with respect to replacement cost and
personal risk?
Back to the OP's question, I would still love to have all the historic
data to, overthinking it is part of the fun
Rob
P.S. something like this:
http://www.olympus-ims.com/en/35/
would let you disect a frame with tube thicknesses 0.5mm and greater,
even map out the butts, I keep meaning to ask Jan if they can get
their hands on one, he made his way into a wind tunel for goodness
sake he should be able to get one of these.
> > matter.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
reynoldslugs
triple-non-blind study, as follows:
Take the Rambouillet, Legolas, and Roadeo to the hill (about 5 miles,
2100'). Over the course of 3 - 4 hours, ride each bike up and down
the hill. Do it again three days later, riding the bikes in different
order. Repeat every three or four days for the next 2 months. For
longer weekend rides, rotate the bikes. Report to list.
This experiment will result in no useable or defensible data, but will
help me get my "bucket" (that's what my tailor calls it) in shape.
RL 531
nathan spindel
my '90 RB-1? The brochure just says Ishiwata 022E quad-butted. I'm
curious. :)
-nathan
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Aaron Thomas
http://www.vintage-trek.com/refurbish.htm
The Ishiwata in the table doesn't have the qualifier "E" after the
number; I don't know whether it's the same thing as the 002E of the
RB-1.
Patrick in VT
> It is common knowledge that a surly cross check is overbuilt as a
> cross bike. Where does the Legolas fit in? How far is a Roadeo from
> a Legolas? or a Sachs for that matter? and what kind of abuses is one
> willing to put into the bike with respect to replacement cost and
> personal risk?
a sachs cx frame weighs about 3.5 lbs. i get to see a lot of his cx
bikes in action and they are ridden *hard.* riding tubies at 30psi
helps to soften things up a bit and take the edge off the rough stuff
- but still, i think it's proof that a high quality lightweight steel
bike need not be relegated to paved roads/smoothish surfaces.
benzzoy
>
> a sachs cx frame weighs about 3.5 lbs. i get to see a lot of his cx
> bikes in action and they are ridden *hard.* riding tubies at 30psi
> helps to soften things up a bit and take the edge off the rough stuff
> - but still, i think it's proof that a high quality lightweight steel
> bike need not be relegated to paved roads/smoothish surfaces.
Are the Sachs race bikes replaced annually? I believe they are, based
on Richard Sachs' blog entries about building team bikes for his
sponsored riders. Most of us aren't looking for single-season frames,
softie tubies or otherwise; but like you stated, a 3.5 lb steel race
frame can be done.
Patrick in VT
> Are the Sachs race bikes replaced annually?
I don't think so. New framesets for new team members, of course - but
each rider gets 2 bikes (one for the pit!), and there's no reason to
replace annually unless one fails.
the columbus spirit for lugs (aka "pegorichie") tubing strikes a
really nice balance between weight/strength - framebuilders seem to
like it, and riders do too. I think sachs uses a slightly lighter
version of these tubes for his team bikes, but off-the-shelf
pegorichie tubes seem like a great option for anyone that wants a
lightweight road bike that can handle gravel grinder/dirt road/mixed
terrain action.
Dustin Sharp
Does this mean that a Roadeo has at least an extra half a pound of overly
stout tubing? Or does the weight savings on the Sachs frames come from
other things? I mean, all those baroque touches on Riv lugs must weigh
something, right? ;)
Patrick in VT
> Does this mean that a Roadeo has at least an extra half a pound of overly
> stout tubing? Or does the weight savings on the Sachs frames come from
> other things? I mean, all those baroque touches on Riv lugs must weigh
> something, right? ;)
seems like artisan framebuilders are at liberty to shave every gram
they possibly can - Waterford probably doesn't have that luxury with
the Roadeo.
I only chimed in to comment that high quality lightweight steel bikes
need not be babied - especially ones that fit 35mm tire! big tires
like that makes things easier on the frame, wheels, etc. (not to
mention the rider!). To me, the roadeo seems like nearly a perfect
bike for hard ride that includes some mixed terrain (ride 33mm
tires). it's obviously a great candidate for a rando/brevet bike
(ride 30mm with fenders). or a club rider (ride 28s). it's a super
bike and design. if I had the need, I'd be all over it!
Jeremy Till
rider and riding style. When sachs builds frames for his racers, he
has the advantage of knowing their weight (and since they're racers,
they're probably not overly stout themselves) and can build the
lightest bike that will still be durable and reliable under that
individual rider. W'ford building the roadeos has no idea if the
person riding it will be a featherweight or a clydesdale so they
probably build the lightest bike that will still be durable and
reliable under a range of riders; I think it's amazing that they are
as light as they are. Being on the heavier side myself, if i ever
bought one (hah! a guy can dream, right?) i'd probably never load it
up with anything more than a small seat bag.