Valuating modified 2003 Curt Goodrich 26" wheel custom frame FS

[Patrick Moore]

It has long horizontals and no derailleur hangar, tho' I can supply a claw. It doesn't have shifter bosses or housing stops, but it does have rear brake stops. It does have the original under-bb "grooves" for f and rear derailleur cables.

The under-seatstay bridge and under-fork-crown threaded fender bosses are rounded out (rear) and broken (front threaded plate) but the VO hammered fenders are well mounted with sheet metal clamp for brake bolt (rear) and daruma (front).

Custom f and rear racks, front with "arch" that supports front of rear fender. Internal wiring, tho' simply holes in "arch" and in rear rack members; wire guides along tt and right seat stay. Rear rack holds 40 lb without shimmy.

More-or-less sage green powdercoat is in good condition; a few scuffs but not bad. Dropout ends were modifed after powdercoating and have gray primer on them.

If this had shifter bits, I think it would be in effect a very much upgraded XO-1 (handles a lot better on pavement and in dirt, especially loose dirt, than my 1992 XO-1 did.

What do you think is a fair value for this, if I want to split the difference between screwing as much as I can out of the buyer and a quick sale?

Chauncey is building up the new bike as we speak, and is finding some -- er, um, "issues" in swapping over the parts to the new frame, so I shall probably have to buy a new high end crankset -- Pro 5 Vis with 113 mm Phil gives good chainline but apparently arm won't quite clear the stay.  But I will have photos of the 2003 Curt, Dave and Chauncey modified frame, seul, in a little while. Meanwhile, feast on the bike.

What $$ do y'all think, ballpark?

Thanks

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Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

[Patrick Moore]

Frame + fork + racks f/r + fenders, only.

[Patrick Moore]

Ach. 58 cm st c-c, 56.5 or 57 effective tt, c-c. Fits me who am 5'10" with long torso, and whose "classic" fit is 60 C 56-57 c-c. Ordinary bloke size.

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:27 PM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Abcyclehank]

Patrick,
Unless there is another Patrick Moore in the world I think your bike has limited resale value. Maybe I do not understand your unique preference for single speed fixed gear cycling. However one of my favorite Rivendell’s is my 68cm Quickbeam which I will never part with.
I see your Goodrich modified Rivendell personally as a fancy Quickbeam or Frank Jones.
Frame and fork I would estimate as $900-$1200.
Racks and fenders may or may not be of interest to a buyer.

Just one large man‘s (100 PBH) opinion.

Ryan
West Michigan

[Ian A]

Tire clearance with/without fenders might be of interest to a potential buyer.

No idea on value, but good luck with the sale. If it was a 56x56/57 I'd be tempted.

IanA Alberta Canada

[A. Douglas M.]

I love your customs, Patrick, but they are tough sales as single speed unique geos by a low production builder.

Looking on eBay custom frames have been going for $500 (No rad racks). The only two recent sales going for 1200 and 2000 were a Pegoretti and Vanilla respectively.

I’m sure you could get more but I’d imagine it would take a while. I’d list it for $1500 and start a dialogue with any potential buyers.

FWIW I always have at least one single speed in my quiver. 👍🏻

Best,

Aaron

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks, and good point about the tires. It takes 1.35 mm Kojaks and fenders, so 32s and fenders with normal reach calipers.

The frameset is a progression from the XO-1, in fact the second iteration of that progression. I rode a 55 cm XO, and this is designed to get the bar high at need with sloping tt, extended ht, and longer steerer. Again, it handles better by far than the XO-1 on pavement and in dirt; in fact, both this and its 1999 older brother have since 1999 been my handling benchmark.

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[Patrick Moore]

Thanks. I'd not ask as much as $1,500; we'll see. The geometry is pretty standard: 73* sta, 72.5* hta instead of 73* to compensate for the light, short wheels (a 32 mm tire measures about 25" tall; the current 29 mm Elk Pass about 24.75").

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[Brewster Fong]

I too agree that $500 is about the right price. One issue is tire size. Your tires are 26" (559mm) and most bikes today run "29ers" or 700c (622mm) wheels. There is even a single speed CX racing category, but again, it uses 700c wheels.

Still, it might fit in the vintage mtb category where 26" wheels are still king! LOL

Good Luck!

[A. Douglas M.]

What is max tire width? 559 with a narrow tire is relatively uncommon.

Best,

Aaron

[Dave Grossman]

I too am a single speed/fixed gear junkie.  I think that bike is beautiful.  You find the right buyer, it will move.  If it was a 61-62ST/59-60TT I might be that buyer.

[Patrick Moore]

I should add in response to some of the questions and comments that this is a road frame, though one whose distant parent was my 1992 XO-1. It can easily take 32 mm tire with fenders, and I daresay 38s, only the calipers, even if you choose widely-arched ones like the old Dura Aces I have on it now, will be the limiting factor, not fork or stays. 

It's a lot stiffer than the XO-1, and I daresay (love that word) that the tubing is stouter; f + f + hs was 7 lb for a 58 cm frame. But -- this is the important thing -- it handles immeasurably better on pavement, and it also works a lot better (IMO) on dirt, especially sandy surfaces; the XO was scary in sand, since it would immediately plough; the 2003 is no sand bike, but the front end is far more stable in sand; this while handling both quicker and more stable-ly on pavement -- signature Grant handling, tho' quicker than, say, a Ram, at least my Ram.

Carries 40 lb loads on the rear rack with, if not aplomb, at least dignity, tho 30 lb is the limit if you don't want to affect the handling. 20 lb on the front lowriders.

I think I've come up with a price, but I want to get the frame back and examine it closely and photo it in detail before I decide finally. I won't aim to screw the greatest amount out of the buyer. (And someone is at that head of the queue, since he made me a cash offer; I feel obliged to give him right of refusal if he accepts my ultimate price demand.)

One more thought. I was so delighted by Joe Starck's 1999 fixed gear 26" wheel gofast Road custom that I had Grant design and Curt build this one as a derailleur analogue ("analogy"). It has been delightful, but over the 17 years of riding there has always been a wee, little nagging doubt that it didn't feel quite as spritely as the 1999, and I don't think this has been merely because of the weight and air drag of fenders, lights, bags, etc. I think I am in great old age finally experiencing "planing", or rather, realizing that I have been experiencing the absence of it. Still, it feels ("feels") no slower than the XO-1 did, and it certainly handles better. The Chauncey clone has been built of normal gauge, .8 .5 .8 (I told him, not .7 .4 .7) 531, so I hope to get a "feel" more like that of the 1999.

(Regarding "planing." I'd not hesitate to attribute the *lack* of sprightliness to the 2003's excessively stout tubing --- except that one of the bikes that felt "planey" to me and in spades was that 1958 Herse that others had sold on because it was too stoutly built for them. It was a tank, but it consistently made me choose a cog 1 tooth smaller than "usual." Likewise the Matthews "road bike for dirt:" tho' made from thinwall heat treated tubing, it is a tank; but it feels fast! So I don't know where tubing comes into the "faster" equation.)

Over and out.

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:27 PM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

[S. Greco]

Is this bike for sale?

[Patrick Moore]

It will be, eventually, after I get around to taking photos and deciding on a price.

Aside: Thanks all for the feedback on a price to be asked. Will post it FS before too long.

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 8:43 AM S. Greco <steven...@gmail.com> wrote:

Is this bike for sale?

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[Jason Fuller]

Patrick, how are you feeling those Elk Pass vs. say, a 1.25 Pasela?  Inquiring minds, etc etc :D 

[Patrick Moore]

I have to laugh, not in scorn or derision, but in exhilaration. I've used the 559 X 32 (non-Tourguard) Paselas extensively, and while they are -- I'll go so far -- "acceptable" tires, ones I'd use in the absence of anything better -- they are in a wholly different universe from the Elk Pass. The Elk Pass "feels" so much easier to pedal, the metric or KPI being the perceived ease of maintaining a given cadence with a given crank in a given gear in similar conditions; they allow me to pedal a cog 1 tooth smaller with similar effort in similar conditions. (In fact, on my 1999 Riv Road custom gofast, the EP feels faster by this method of comparison than some top-of-line racing tires, notably the 650C (571 bsd) X 23 mm model of the Michelin Pro Race 4 -- at least, the one from some ~3 years ago when I made the switch.)

Here's an interesting metric. The Paselas have a very small "nice pressure" range of some 10 psi, IMO; higher and they are harsh, softer and they bounce. Anecdote: I was riding the 1999 gofast with Elk Passes in a group and a rider behind me said, "Don't you know that your rear tire is going flat?" She had noticed the shape of the tire flattening. But I had not noticed any change. Reason? Because the EPs are so supple that even severe underinflation doesn't cause a big increase in drag; I don't notice flats until the EPs are so low that they start to bounce. Try running Paselas at 20 psi!

In short, there is no comparison, they are 2 different animals. The Elk Pass is fully worth the quantum difference in price. FWIW, I get ~1,500 miles out of a rear Elk Pass, often carrying heavy rear loads with a ~10% mix of dirt and smooth gravel, and a ~ 25% mix of rough pavement. The front of course would get close to double that, if I didn't rotate f to r when I replace the worn rear -- that is, when rear wears out, move original front to rear, and put new tire on front.

Forgive my short-term memory loss, but is that your '92 XO-1? V nice!

[Jason Fuller]

It is, Patrick - thank you for the detailed info that just feeds into my predisposition to buy Rene Herse stuff :D  This bike was on the sale list for a while, but I'm thinking about hanging onto it a bit longer--and if I do, I know those tires are on the list!

[Patrick Moore]

Steve: I see that you emailed the list about the frameset a couple of weeks ago, so please forgive the caution. There is one person in line ahead of you; if he doesn't like the $750 shipped price, it is yours if you want it. I'll give the OP another day.

Thanks, Patrick

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 8:43 AM S. Greco <steven...@gmail.com> wrote:

Is this bike for sale?

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