backs!!!

[Adam]

Hi all,

I'm curious to hear any comments thoughts, etc on back issues and riding.

The context is that this fall I've had some nasty lower back/hip pain. Rest and some stretching & PT has "solved" the issue, but I'm still having trouble getting back on the bike without a little stiffness in the lower back.

I have thought about swapping out my drops for alt bars and have an old bosco setup ready to go. My issue is that I've tried sweptback bars before and always end up back on HIGH drops. I really like my current setups and have ridden many long stretches on these  configurations, so I'm not excited to change what's taken a lot of tweaking to accomplish.

My current strategy is to raise my current bar height a bit (already above saddle height) and to do shortish (under 1hr) rides indoors on rollers being mindful of core muscles, etc. That seems to be working, but I still have a bit of stiffness post ride.

I'm curious to hear anyone else's experiences. Not really looking for advice, but curious to hear what other folks have tried, etc.

Thanks!

Adam

[Mathias Steiner]

I'm not sure I can be helpful to you, but I do have relevant experience.

I've had back pain for most of my life, since at least when I was 15 years old. It was bad enough to get me a nick name in high school because I occasionally walked around bent forward at the hip like a chicken.

Later in life I found that lower-back pain correlated with times when I did not ride my bicycle. As long as I bike a few times a week, back pain is rare and transient. I started riding to work year-round in part because of this, and it's worked out well for this issue. As in, I mostly don't think about it, and haven't had real problems for fifteen or so years.  My handlebar is at saddle height, a couple, three inches higher than when I was young. Much higher and I feel awkward, but I do have long arms. The angle of my back is more upright than bent over, maybe 35, 40 degrees off vertical. That is comfortable for many hours.

I don't stretch, and I don't do any other regular workouts. There are some exercises I learned to do to help with acute back pain but I rarely need them now. I expect but don't know for sure that walking would more or less have the same effect. People gotta move, is my takeaway.

[Doug H.]

I've done some stretching, especially my hamstrings to alleviate a tight back. Building core strength is helpful as well. I use an upright bar, Bosco, but lean forward some during rides to stretch my back. One position for an hour or more ride isn't comfortable to me.

Doug

[Andy Beichler]

My experience is that there are many reasons for back pain so getting lots of ideas may be helpful. Keep trying until you find something that works for you.  I finally figured out about ten years ago, after 20 years of off and on lower back pain, that I was over-rotating my pelvis forward.  This compressed everything in my lower back.  When I finally started to really focus on stretching my quads, it got way better.  Once my quads are loose, it is easier to rotate my pelvis back a little and take the pressure off.

[Steven Sweedler]

I’ve lower bavk pain on and off tor years, seeing a chiropractor has been very helpful. Stretching, core strength yoga all help but the greatest relief cameftom chiropractic adjustments. 

Steven Sweedler
Plymouth, New Hampshire

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/31e70beb-76e6-4844-8f4f-c9f0974aa30bn%40googlegroups.com.

[Nick Payne]

My old yoga teacher, Pamela Brown (a good teacher, she was a direct student of Iyengar), took up yoga initially because of bad back problems. She eventually wrote a book titled "Your back, yoga and you". I have a copy in my bookshelf, but I suspect that it's probably no longer in print: https://books.google.com.au/books/about/Your_Back_Yoga_and_You.html.

Nick Payne

[Bill Lindsay]

"Not really looking for advice, but curious to hear what other folks have tried, etc."

I'll take that at face value and not offer advice.  Over the last ~30 years, I'm running a longer top tube, and a taller stack.  I'm 5'10" with pretty normal proportions, and I always thought of myself running as a "Medium".  I thought a 56cm road bike with a 56.5cm TT was perfecto.  Now I ride things more like 59-61cm with a 58-59cm top tube.  I use the normal randonneur training two-step:

1. any schmuck can ride 50km

2. for any distance that I can ride easily, then I can double that distance until that distance is easy

I have zero back related issues to cycling.  If I want to cause a back problem, I sit for a long time on a bar stool, or for a long time on the ground.  I'd like to improve my hip flexibility so that I can sit longer on the ground.  I believe the rule of thumb that being able to get on the ground and get back up off the ground is correlated to longevity, and I'd like to be alive for a long time.  

Bill Lindsay (55)

El Cerrito, CA 

[Adam]

Thanks all,

I appreciate hearing thoughts from everyone. It's easy for me to neglect leg stretches post ride, something I've been working on doing more consistently.

And yes, getting on/off the ground is an excellent goal!

Adam

[Jay]

Hi Adam - I hope this gets better for you.

Curious on where your drop bar is in relation to your saddle and what you would say is your spine/back angle when riding (90, 75, 45 degree)?  I've had the bars more aggressive years ago and they're more upright now (hoods 2cm above saddle), but any position has never impacted my lower back.  It certainly impacted my neck/shoulders, and that is now much better.

I've had my saddle too high, and that has led to over-use of posterior chain and lower back issues.  After going for a fit, with this issue in mind, the saddle is now lower and it has been a while since any back pain (fingers crossed).

Lastly, I like using a foam roller on my back (carefully), and stretching glutes and back muscles 2x daily (I have always stretched a lot).

Good luck!

[Patrick Moore]

One aspect of bike fit that you might want to check is sufficient saddle setback. I’ve found over the decades that sometimes sliding the saddle rearward so that your core torso muscles support your upper body’s weight — of course, this means that your torso core muscles have to be sufficiently toned, but this means simply normal strength, not something out of the ordinary.

 I’ve been super stiff in the back since my 40s if not 30s — comes from doing little exercise but riding (*) — and I suffered from back pain (muscular) in my early 40s, but found that with suitable saddle setback the typical 45* angle while on the hoods with elbows slightly bent was a comfortable refuge while standing upright or lying down might be painful. Now, a couple months shy of 70, I still find that a sufficiently butt-back saddle keeps my back happy with bar ~3 or 3.5 cm below saddle and 8 cm stem on road bikes or 0.5 cm below saddle with 10 cm stem on my dirt road bike.

As always, YMMV, but perhaps something to look at.

(*) Nowadays I find that walking — as in walking the dog briskly 1 mile/20 minutes or so 3X a week, and occasionally walking instead of riding to the grocery store 1/4 mile from my house (but easier to carry loads when riding) helps loosen up my legs and lower back — as does very occasional weed pulling, leaf cleanup, and picking up dog shit daily from the xeriscaped gravel. Oh, and sitting crosslegged when I say my prayers. My brother, 64 and 1/2, practices (South) Indian squatting to great benefit; the typical traditional South Asian sitting posture is to squat with soles flat on the ground and knees around one’s ears. I can’t come close to that; nor to the lotus position.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/31e70beb-76e6-4844-8f4f-c9f0974aa30bn%40googlegroups.com.

--

Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing services

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When thou didst not, savage, know thine own meaning,

But wouldst gabble like a thing most brutish,

I endowed thy purposes with words that made them known.

[Patrick Moore]

+1. I’ve verified this by neglect. As in my earlier post, walking is a great therapy for overall and especially back and leg stiffness.

On Fri, Jan 3, 2025 at 8:06 AM Mathias Steiner <mathiass...@gmail.com> wrote:

… People gotta move, is my takeaway.

[Adam]

Thanks all.

I can post a mediocre pic of my setup here, but the angles are probably too skewed to give a accurate sense of positioning. I tend to split time between drops, ramps, hoods (these are towel racks). I think the drops are maybe 1-2" below the saddle, but haven't measured in a while. They were higher at one point, but I dropped them slightly over the course of the last year or so.

I can't say exactly what my back angle is, but on the ramps it's VERY upright, 70-80 degrees I suppose.

I appreciate the recs for stretching, walking, yoga, etc. I think that's probably where the best help lies. I wouldn't be shocked if I could improve my position slightly, but the fact that I've had so many trouble-free rides on this setup makes me hesitant to change anything significant for now.

[RichS]

Adam, lots of helpful remedies offered here. I hope you'll figure out which ones are most beneficial for you. Once you do that being consistent is essential. For me, at 75, yoga three times a week, at least three walks ranging from 2-4 miles each and the recent addition of monthly massages are all helping me remain fairly flexible (somewhat less so than five years ago). I have to get better with strength training though! 

My bikes, one being a Hillborne, have drop bars with the saddle/bar height like yours. Currently my rides go from 10-40 miles. Best of luck to you.

- Rich in ATL

[KenP]

Could try a saddle with springs and move the seat up or the bars down to put more weight on the arms/torso.   Use the widest volume tires that will fit the bike.

On Friday, January 3, 2025 at 9:44:48 AM UTC-5 Adam wrote: