The Riv low-normal derailer

[Joe Bernard]

The latest Blahg states that MicroShift has agreed to produce it, presumably making it possible for Riv to sell a rear derailer at a non-insane price. Which is great but now it looks like a MicroShift derailer and I have mixed feelings about this. Thoughts? 

Joe Bernard 

Clearlake CA 

[Bill Lindsay]

I think it looks splendid, and I am happy that the immense work they did will result in the existence of a bike part that would otherwise not exist.  I'll buy four.  

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[Bill Lindsay]

...AND the mounting bolt is 7075 aluminum!  Weight weenies!

BL in EC

[Jay Lonner]

I’ll probably buy one, even though I don’t have any immediate use for it — I just like supporting Grant’s little passion projects. I’m not put off by the appearance. (Sometimes the Riv aesthetic goes too far even for me, like the homebrewed “best grips ever” that’s some weird combo of twine, wool, and bar tape.)

It’s actually an interesting time in the boutique derailer market — kinda reminds me of the proliferation of CNC designs in the 90’s. There’s the upcoming Vivo Enduro (https://vivocycling.com/), which I preordered. I’ll probably install that on my Gus. The Madrone Jab is also in development (https://madronecycles.com/products/jab-derailleur), which offers a fair amount of customization.

I don’t have an axe to grind with Shimano/SRAM/Campy, but I like that there are alternatives, and I’m happy to spend a few bucks to support small domestic manufacturers that prioritize serviceability and a “right to repair” ethos.

Jay Lonner

Bellingham, WA

Sent from my Atari 400

On Dec 7, 2024, at 7:49 AM, Joe Bernard <joer...@gmail.com> wrote:

The latest Blahg states that MicroShift has agreed to produce it, presumably making it possible for Riv to sell a rear derailer at a non-insane price. Which is great but now it looks like a MicroShift derailer and I have mixed feelings about this. Thoughts? 

Joe Bernard 

Clearlake CA 

<Screenshot_20241207_072221.jpg>

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<Screenshot_20241207_072221.jpg>

[J J]

Yeah, I also have mixed feelings about the look in the drawing. I’ll reserve judgement until I see an actual product. 

Regardless of the looks, I’m still going to grab some. I’m so glad this extremely unlikely project is actually coming to fruition.

Jim

[Conway Bennett]

As Tom Hanks said in Big, "I don't get it".  Why would you want a derailer to move towards your wheel?  If some dunce loosens their low limit screw too much, their rear wheel is toast.  The upside is faster shifting uphill, but it just seems like diminishing returns to me.  More and more, Riv's products are not landing with me.  If I were riv, I would have just cosmetically redesigned the advent X rear to be smoother and silver.  I'll end by paraphrasing a quote from crust bikes, if you like it but it.  If not, complain about it online.

[Keith Paugh]

It seems to resemble a lot of the Shimano XTR 900 series rr derailers (which I quite like).

I only hope there will be less black parts than are depicted here.

A S!LVER derailleur, should be just that.

Regardless, I will be buying one on principle. 

k.

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[Joe Bernard]

I'm not a RapidRise convert, either, but I'll probably buy one even if it looks like a MicroShift. I'm a sucker for a good logo and Silver looks awesome! 

On Saturday, December 7, 2024 at 7:49:38 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

[Garth]

Of course it's rapid-rise and that is no surprise since it's been talked about for years. I wouldn't buy one for that reason alone. The aesthetics are acceptable of themselves. That it has SILVER on the side, yet with a black cage ....... ummmmmmmmmm ....... I won't hammer them for that as I wasn't in on the negotiations with Microshift to be aware of what options were on the table. I doubt that would be Riv's preference though. So give 'em a .... "brake" ... hah haha ! At least they'll have their own derailleur and won't have to be a the mercy of every whim of derailleur manufacturers, who have gone well over the ledge of what is a tasteful design and function for those who know what they like and won't compromise themselves for the sake of someone else's standards of what a bicycle is.

[Michael Connors]

Looks like it borrowed a lot from this model, with different cable pull and spring attachment.

[Dan]

If it looks anything like this I think it will be great. That’s quite classy and minimal compared to other RDs currently on the market. I mean, Cues and Sword look like robots!

[Johnny Alien]

Tried the reverse thing a few times and I haven't been converted. Actually I will say that i never really got converted to friction being superior to index and thats probably part of the problem. On top of that I agree that these don't visually appeal to me as much as the original designs that Grant did. Mainly (and by mainly I mean totally) due to the small pulley. One thing I DID get converted to was loving the look of a big pulley RD.

[Josh C]

It looks good. It's not quite as good as my favorite, the Shimano xtr M960, but I'll buy a few. I'm not quite happy with whatever came on my wife's complete Platy, so swapping that with a Silver component would be nice. 

[ian m]

On Saturday, December 7, 2024 at 11:32:54 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

I think it looks splendid, and I am happy that the immense work they did will result in the existence of a bike part that would otherwise not exist.  I'll buy four.  

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

I'm with BL here, and if this is anywhere close to Microshift pricepoint I'm very excited indeed

[Jason Fuller]

I don't find it unattractive, though it would have been more fun if it kept the older vintage style. I have tried to embrace rapid rise but it's not for me, never worked as flawlessly as my M952's. Glad it's happening and their Silver brand continues to expand. 

[David]

Out of the hundreds of bike components I’ve owned in my life, I can’t think of one that’s better than the trusted 952. Shimano should reissue it and keep it in production forever. 

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[Josh C]

I agree that the 952 is a good derailleur, same with the m951 and m960 (the best-looking xtr derailleur), but now you have to buy one used with 5000 miles on it and scratched all to crap on eBay for $80 plus shipping and then replace the old sticky jockey wheels for another $18 plus change. It'd be nice to have another option that will continue to be produced. I personally don't care much about rapid rise or not. I am not one to notice small details like that and tend to adapt quickly to subtle differences. I've got both on different bikes, and after a shift or two (friction shifters), I adjust, and it doesn't bother me either way. 

[Josh C]

 https://www.ebay.com/itm/256708285037?_skw=shimano+xtr+m+960&itmmeta=01JEJ25KM6XZGZYZ1S1K1G5XT0&hash=item3bc501926d:g:qcAAAOSwJAtnLpkR&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA0HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKmAjD0nzdjYQ2wGtuMDIir%2FiqwXFOemmDgGp5jm3KeLCwh%2Bq5pK61feHZ2MXkoTyzmKKKqM7%2BwKZY%2FXSfzzwrB0CEAyDw1oH8N2%2FCaQM4sh32pYhF9AnjLbevVGihqQpe1fmtA%2Byjwb9xBvuiYRrhtgmRF2QgI5wPCOnPPyIBr8iOyHymkEZWz3w3Cn3WAayzvGAU6ARyuf0jLbfeFcwpqocyJQUGzG9frtKVomdu45d9qnMpWI1g1s3%2BBluyFNzhw%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5S6lsL0ZA

[Johnny Alien]

In hindsight I feel like my comments came across as too harsh. Despite it not being for me, I am very excited this is going to happen for both RIvendell and fans of rapid rise

[Ian Buckley]

As a product designer, I know how difficult it is to bring quality, mechanical products to market, so I see it as a huge accomplishment that any version of the design is going into production. That said, I'm actually more excited about this product now that it's going to be a collaboration between Riv and Microshift. 

In my opinion, the two companies share a lot of values, but Microshift has reached a broader audience thanks to their product offering (shifters and derailleurs) and their democratic ethos. Their products are affordable, well-made, easy to use, and widely available. The first derailleur I installed was a Microshift and I was able to do it thanks to Microshift's beginner-friendly video instructions and the fact that my local shop had them. While it would have been cool to see Grant's platonic derailleur manufactured, I don't think it would have ended up on nearly as many bikes as I suspect it will now. I enjoy the thought that someone will buy this RD from their local shop purely because they're intrigued by the concept of OM.

[Eamon Nordquist]

I've never used a low normal derailleur, but I love the idea and will definitely get one if and when they get them in. I love that they've put time into this. It's too bad they couldn't get their own design over the finish line, but I'm happy to see MicroShift has picked up the baton.

Eamon

Seattle

On Saturday, December 7, 2024 at 7:49:38 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

[R. Alexis]

My guess, or hope is that the Microshift der is to get the derailleurs they want with Shimano and such moving away from traditional looking and operating offerings and that the retro stylized version will come out down the road. A bit like the Silver 2 shifter after the Soma/Interloc(IRD) friction thumb shifter that was the modified Silver 1 on a flat bar mount. I liked the looks of the prototypes they showed.  

I was on the fence for the OM/Rapid Rise movement, until I read Grants thoughts on it. Made more sense to me after. I had a Shimano C201 rear hanging around. I put it on "Issue Bike" my Trek 5900 OCLV carbon just because. Was already building bike with parts that had random issues. Have only rode that bike a few times. 

I put thoughts into getting one when released. Will see. I am overrun with stuff at the moment that I don't really need anything and my Rivendell Mountain is where I want it. Every time I think of changing something I change back. Swapped the SunTour XC-Pro thumbies for XC-Pro level Wishbone shifters, then changed back. Swapped out Wilderness Trail Bikes (WTB) SST saddle for Brooks B-17, changed back. Changed out the WTB Racing Raptor tires for some Ritchey Megabite 1.4 tires, went back to a proper sized similar type with the Schwalbe Sammy Slick. 

I am surprised Rivendell hadn't leaned more into MicroShift, or SunRace sooner. Pretty sure pricing, function and availability worked in favor of Shimano up to this point. SRAM proprietary shifting pull was probably a no go. Had they kept Sachs stuff around may have been a different story. 

Thanks,

Reginald Alexis

[Eric Daume]

I’m not a fan of reverse action derailers. I don’t see any benefit in using them. My Dahon has this type—I think they did it for the package benefit, but I’m not sure—and it seems like every other shift is a triple shift: whoops, wrong way, double shift back the other way to the gear I want. 

I do wonder if Riv considered making this with a clutch.  Derailers with a clutch are amazing off road. 

Eric

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[Johnny Alien]

I think the only reason Rivendell has not leaned into Microshift before is because 1. Grant has a long history of liking Shimano stuff and has not had a huge problem finding some really good cheap ones from what they offer and 2. Microshift (I think) are made in China and Rivendell at one point had a "nothing made in China" stance to what they sold but I think that loosened when that became the only source for certain products.

On Wednesday, December 11, 2024 at 6:52:38 AM UTC-5 Eric Daume wrote:

I’m not a fan of reverse action derailers. I don’t see any benefit in using them. My Dahon has this type—I think they did it for the package benefit, but I’m not sure—and it seems like every other shift is a triple shift: whoops, wrong way, double shift back the other way to the gear I want. 

I do wonder if Riv considered making this with a clutch.  Derailers with a clutch are amazing off road. 

Eric

On Saturday, December 7, 2024, Joe Bernard <joer...@gmail.com> wrote:

The latest Blahg states that MicroShift has agreed to produce it, presumably making it possible for Riv to sell a rear derailer at a non-insane price. Which is great but now it looks like a MicroShift derailer and I have mixed feelings about this. Thoughts? 

Joe Bernard 

Clearlake CA 

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[Jeffery S]

Speaking of xtr rapid rise, not mine and no relation

https://www.ebay.com/itm/375832978434

I’m curious about the silver OM and will probably get one. When it came out that Riv was working with microshift, I felt it was good news to have it available to a wider market. Maybe it will catch on and Grant can have some influence on looks.

Some if the MS derailleurs look like some spooky transformers, but the 3D drawing doesn’t look bad IMO. More like an Deore XT M750

[John Dewey]

JD velos equipped with low-normal for many years now. The idea to have that beefy spring help movement up the cassette & up the hill makes good sense IMHO. LN works well so I accumulated a collection of spares along the way. 

However, going back and forth between low / high-normal may play tricks with your head if you’ve got bikes with both. All but one of mine are LN and when I hop on the one that isn’t I occasionally pull when I should push and visa versa. 

Jock

On Wed, Dec 11, 2024 at 3:52 AM Eric Daume <eric...@gmail.com> wrote:

I’m not a fan of reverse action derailers. I don’t see any benefit in using them. My Dahon has this type—I think they did it for the package benefit, but I’m not sure—and it seems like every other shift is a triple shift: whoops, wrong way, double shift back the other way to the gear I want. 

I do wonder if Riv considered making this with a clutch.  Derailers with a clutch are amazing off road. 

Eric

On Saturday, December 7, 2024, Joe Bernard <joer...@gmail.com> wrote:

The latest Blahg states that MicroShift has agreed to produce it, presumably making it possible for Riv to sell a rear derailer at a non-insane price. Which is great but now it looks like a MicroShift derailer and I have mixed feelings about this. Thoughts? 

Joe Bernard 

Clearlake CA 

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