Well, I finally drank the Rivendell KoolAid

[Russell Duncan]

Well, I guess that I’ve joined the Rivendell “In” Crowd (I had to say it because I’m currently listening to Ramsey Lewis). I’m nearly finished with this Hillborne build and hopefully I’ll get to take my first test drive this weekend in the Sage Creek Basin of Wyoming. All that I need to do is fine tune the MiniMotos to stop me when I want to. Except for the pedals, I had all of the parts in my barn waiting for some build. Except for the wheels, most of the parts were slated for a 1973 Raleigh RRA that I was converting to a 650B, but that has been languishing for many moons. Then, when this previously owned but unbuilt 2025 Hillbourne came up for sale in my size and in the only color that I would have chosen among the many (two) color choices, sage green, I had to have it. To see for myself. The color will match nicely with the dominant vegetation type around here where I work in Wyoming, sagebrush. 

So, I bit the bullet, drank the kool aid, and joined the Rivendell Owner’s Club. Currently it’s shod with Hutchinson Caracals in size 35 (purchased from Rivendell of course). I want to first see how the bike performs with “skinny” tires. Then I’ll try it out with 40s. All in all, I’m happy with the build and how he looks. Except for some differences in geometry, it kinda reminds me of my mid-1990s Mercian. 

I’ll keep everyone up to date on my journey on pavement and off in the not so populated State of Wyoming,.

Russell Duncan

Carbon County, Wyoming.

[Ron Mc]

Congradulations, that's a beauty.  

I have a CX frame that won't fit larger than 35-mm tires, and it makes a great gravel bike for my use.  

I also have 35-mm Rene Herse light casing on my new RoadUno.  

Regards

[Patrick Moore]

That’s a nice looking build; please do report more fully on how it rides with the build pictured. I’m always intrigued by drop bar builds on current Rivendell models.

What length of stem is needed to get a comfortable reach to your bar?

And tires: From my experience with a ~2010 Sam (quite different, I know) I’d guess that 44s or 48s would be nice sizes for that build. I recently installed 44 mm Rene Herse Snoqualmie Pass extralights on my Matthews “road bike for dirt” as an alternative to the “main” wheelset shod with 54 mm (actual) Thunderburts. With the 44s (45 actual with pressure a bit low, just now) it handles much more like a Rivendell road model, as I’d asked Chauncey to make it do; in fact, rather like the Ram, a  bit more staid than with my Riv customs or the Roadeo, and very nicely indeed, while being perfectly shod for combined pavement and firmish dirt instead of the very sandy soil that the Thunderburts are meant for (tho’ the TBs do roll very well on pavement for knobbies).

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Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[R. Alexis]

Nice bike! Welcome to the club! What size 40 tires to you have on hand? I have a Heron Touring/Wayfarer and a 1987 Schwinn Voyageur that I wish could fit bigger than a 35c tire. Actually, the Schwinn has some 38c tires on there and I haven't tested the Heron to see if it will fit bigger than a 35c. That is on my list along with trying to get the build completed. Keep us updated on the progress. 

Thanks,

Reginald Alexis

[Toshi Takeuchi]

Congrats Russell! Enjoy your Sam. Hopefully you'll become a "True Believer" after you ride the Riv!

Toshi 

Drinking the KoolAid in Oakland for 15 yrs

[dave nawrocki]

Very nice Russell and welcome!

Dave

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[Guy Jett]

Lovely build.  I especially like the SunTour Cyclone derailleurs, which bring back fond memories.  I still run a Sun Tour Superbe front mech on my 2010 Hilsen which is perfect for my 1/2-step + granny.

I spent about 3 years in Laramie decades ago and am also fond of sagebrush.  When you mention the Sage Basin I assume you mean the Sage Creek Basin in Carbon County as indicated by your signature block.  Closest I've been is to Saratoga a couple of time for the hot springs, but spent much time in the Snowy Range between Saratoga and Laramie.  Indeed, spent more time there in the winter than the summer --  it's easier getting around sliding over the brush than bushwhacking through.  

In town I biked back and forth to school year 'round.  Toughest time was March / April during the spring melt.  At that time it was hard enough simply standing on the ice-sheeted roads than staying upright on a bicycle, but I did it anyways.  And there's something magical about biking through snow when it's deep enough to "explode" over your toes at the bottom of you pedal strokes.  Another memory of Laramie is how we considered days with winds below 25 mph as the calm days.

Yours,

G.A. Jett

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[Tim Butterfield]

Congrats, Russell.  Nice Sam.

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[Ron Mc]

Hi Guy, 

I have four bikes with half-step triple (another with compact double x9, and 6th bike with alpine 2x8).  

While my '57 Lenton has SunTour FD, it's because the position of the band clamp bolt let me swap a computer-board stand-off to hang a Simplex chain guard.  

I'm a major fan of SunTour RD, though by 1988, the last holdout, Campy, copied Suntour '64 patent.  

The best half-step FD by far is Shimano 600, and on 3 bikes, I have FD-6200 (Arabesque), FD-6207, and Ultegra FD-6401

 

[iamkeith]

Hey, congratulations and hello from another Wyomingite and Rivendell owner.  Good choices, all the way around!  The first time I saw a Sam Hillbourne in the wild, right after the model was released, was during a Tour de Wyoming ride.  I was riding my Rambouillet and we immediately understood we were part of a fraternity.  Welcome!  

[Guy Jett]

To all 1/2-step+granny aficionados out there.

The retrogrouch in me is devoted to 1/2-step + granny gearing.  My inspiration was  several articles by Frank Berto in '70's issues of Bicycling magazine.  Since back then I wouldn't  have it any other way.  Benefits are the incredibly wide range of gearing,  close spacing of gears on the two large chainwheels with few duplicates, and what I find is a more logical way of shifting.  Think of it as an ultra-compact double that can be fine-tuned at the top.  Most of the time I ride the middle chainwheel shifting to the granny as needed.  But may times I fine tune at the top for the 'half-step" change to account for small changes in gradient or wind speeds.  At this point I don't really understand how to shift "standard" or compact gearing and don't like the inevitable many duplicate gears.

I currently have two main bikes set up this way.

My original setup was on a now 50+ year old Raleigh Competition  with "racing" gearing and Huret Jubilees front and rear.  In the late '70's I converted it for touring running a SunTour Cyclone II, then a Superbe, over a 49-46-26 TA with a 13 - 26 6-spd SunTour Ultra 6 freewheel.  Rear mechs were an assortment of SunTour Cyclones.  (The Shimanos back then were UGLY!)

My 2010 AHH is running the Superbe (stolen from the Competition) over a 44-41-24 Sugino chainset and a 9-spd 12 - 36 cassette.  Rear mech is a long cage, rapid rise, Shimano Deore XT.  

This year I changed the gearing on the Competition and now run the original Huret Jubilee front mech over a 50-46-26 TA chainset with a same Suntour Ultra freewheel body now with 14-32 cogs.  It has a long-running Huret EcoDuoPar rear mech, partly to honor the all Huret derailleurs originally fitted.

But it takes dedication to build a 1/2-step + granny anymore.  
1.  Current front "racing" derailleurs rarely shift over three chianwheels while triple front mechs have deep inner cages that can't sift over the small tooth differences required.
2.  Odd toothed chainwheels are getting harder and harder to find.  TA used to provide odd rings from 26 to over 60.  Only a few are left.  Sugino also still carries a few.
3.  Rear cogs are also difficult to deal with.  In most cases you're "stuck" with pre-built choices and individual cogs are hard to source.  In ancient times you could pick the body you want then pick the cogs from a cog board to get just what you wanted.  No longer.  One niche maker does have a relatively wide selection of cogs, but each range of cogs only fits one of the four or so positions on the body.  For example 11-15 fit the outer position, 16-22 fit the next in, 23-30 the next, and 31 and up the position next to the spokes.  So, if you want low cogs of 12-14-16, you're out of luck.

So to all 1/2-step + granny aficionados out there, treasure what you have.  

Happy and Safe Riding,
G.A.Jett

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[Patrick Moore]

+ 1 for 3-tooth differences between half-stepped big rings. Before I went whole-hog and fix-ified it, I built my 1995 Riv Road custom into a commuter with both 48/45 and 47/44 rings combined with a 7 speed Ultegra (I think) rear hub, half-stepping the middle 5 cogs and using the outer and inner as downhill and uphill gears respectively. With Kelly Take-Offs I could do most of my commute (gradual inclines/declines, 9 miles of gradual climbing outbound with a few steep but short hills) in the ~70” and ~65” gears on the middle 17 t cog simply by throwing the left shifter back and forth. 

I used Sugino rings, and Sugino then (very early 2000s) used to carry odd teeth, at least 47 and 45.

I agree that half-stepping has an appealing logical tidiness about it, compared to the, say, Ultegra R8800 11 speed crossover on my Roadeo, but I’m not doctrinaire, and I have to say that, with 11 cogs in back, I do enjoy the range + close gaps that a customized cassette allows.

Which brings me to the third point. If you use a freehub, you can mix and match. I haven’t used a stock cassette since about 1990; it’s easy to find individual cogs to build one that meets your preferences. QBP used to offer individual Miche cogs, then there was a vendor of Miche cogs in England during COVID, but most recently I’ve bought from Ali Express, tho’ I’ve read that many AE cogs are of inferior metal. Still, at $3-$4 per cog, you can stock up. And there are threads about scavenging cogs of your choice from available stock Shimano cassettes.

[Ron Mc]

The point of half steps is maintining momentum on grade, anticipating shifts, nominal single-digit gear-inch steps.  

Shifting algorithm is up or down, shift first in the front, then shift the rear if needed.  .  

Here are x7, x6, x5, and x1 (flip-flop hub) gear charts.  

On the multiple rear, the granny gives you perfect single-track gearing, and narrow steps for extreme climb (18%) with load.  

The NOS SunTour freeewheel x7 was tuned by Yellow Jersey for me, swapping-in 24t and 30t vs. larger 26t and 32t.  

The x6 is new Grand Bois 126-mm cassette hub with Miche cogs.  

x5 is IRD freewheel. 

Flip-flop hub with single freewheels - 16t rear will pace 18 mph - 18t gives a switchback granny and won't exceed 15mph speed limit on greenways.  

.  

[Patrick Moore]

But one can be more pragmatic in one’s shifting. One benefit of half step gearing is that in hilly terrain where you generally don’t need the equivalent of 1-tooth jumps in back, the wider cog spacing lets you adjust to hilly terrain with single shifts in the rear, while fine-tuning front shifting gives you just the right gears for small differences on short inclines or from winds. It’s these very small jumps that make me like 3-tooth ring gaps.

Aside, Kelly Take-Offs were excellent for shifting half-steps; from ramps, hoods, even hooks.

[Aside#2 : 1-tooth jumps in cruising gears IME make a huge difference in energy expended on the flats, allowing you to get just the right ratio for wind gusts, changes of wind direction, and small terrain variations. I notice this emphatically when I ride my 11 speed Roadeo with in effect an 8 speed straight block (14-21) with 23-25-32 at the back end, compared to riding in the same conditions on fixed gear, single speed or with even 2-tooth jumps between cruising gears. I can see why back in the old days time trialists used straight blocks even with very small cog numbers; or witness the SA AR  with 93.24-1.0-107.24 ratios.]

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[Ron Mc]

Patrick, I have a pretty good result database there, with 30,000 mi to boot.  

The x7 is a great load hauler, though the frame will only haul a front load.  

the x6 is the fastest overall 

the x5 is everything you can do with x5 and perfectly split - the 47T chainring is original TA hens' teeth - every combination is singular and you won't find a duplicate on the chart.  

The RoadUno began 40/44T, and I found the 46T swap to shift better and  much more beneficial pace, especially in group rides.  

The opposite, sequential, is happy in my 2x9 compact double - my only index bike - and functions as a pair of 1x - one for road, and one for off-road.