Quickbeam improvement ideas

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Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 21, 2024, 2:43:51 PM8/21/24
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So as I mentioned, I am considering a Roaduno, but since I’d love not to spend the $$$ on a new frame, I’m considering just fixing some of the issues I am having with my Quickbeam instead. Right now it is set up with a short Dirt Drop and albatross bars. 

Aside from the gnarly aesthetics of the well-loved frame, my main issues with it are:

1. A slightly too-big frame. It’s a 56, and my PBH is 83cm. The standover is close, but I do just clear the top bar with my feet on the ground. Worse is that I think the top bar is a little long, so I’m constantly sliding forward in the seat to reach the bars (the seat, a B68, is as far forward on the post as possible). 

2. Squirrely steering.

What do people think about the idea of replacing the Albatross bars with Boscos and the Dirt Drop with a 110mm Faceplater, with the idea being that it would bring the bars both up and back to keep me in the seat, and the longer stem would provide more steering stability? I figure I can always trim the bars down if they come back too far.

Thanks!

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Andrew Janjigian
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Patrick Moore

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Aug 21, 2024, 2:56:21 PM8/21/24
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My opinion, fwiw, this from someone who for decades spent $$$ trying to make the imperfect perfect: if it's too big, sell it and get something that fits. There are all sorts of more minor imperfections that, even if not so central, nag at one during each ride, rather like a rubbing brake or an underinflated tire. These are bad enough. But proper fit is so central to the pleasure of cycling that me, I'd get something that fit better.

From my experience of the wonderful, signature handling of Grant-designed bikes, I'd guess that, if your QB feels squirrely, this is largely if not entirely due to a bad size and resulting improper and compensating setup. 

Warning, anecdote, lengthy, old: a long, long ago I had a very nice upper-middle-class Falcon, my right size, but in obsessively chasing KOPS with short Asian femurs and a penchant for full leg extension I ended up with a Ritchey mtb seatpost, saddle slammed all the way forward, and bar 6" below saddle on 140 mm Cinelli stem (later dialed back to 135). 

This was a bike with relatively long stays and very short front-center, designed for a butt-back position; set up properly it probably would have been delightful. But with the weird all-the-way-forward weight distribution I recall skipping the rear tire when standing up to torque up hills, and the really frightening handling on fast, downhill sweepers, especially with gusty sidewinds. Grant fixed my setup problems after I sold the bike.

Your situation is the polar opposite but the same principles apply.

Good luck!

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iamkeith

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Aug 21, 2024, 3:06:43 PM8/21/24
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Well, a longer stem normally only adds stability because it puts your weight further forward.  If you use a bar where the grip area is further back than you were before  -  despite having a longer stem - it's not going to do what you want.  

I have been wrestling with how to set up my quickbeam for decades.  I don't want to get rid of it, because it has some sort of magic ride quality that not even my other Rivendells have.  I just want it set up in a way that I'll be inclined to use it more.   Like you, I "barely" clear the top tube.  I wouldn't even consider another size though. That clearance issue is mostly because of a higher bottom bracket - to accommodate somebody who wantes to ride fixed gear - not the rest of the frame size.   Compared to my 60 Ram, my 60 AR and my 60 Saluki - all from the same general era - it is still ideally sized other than that. It does have a longer top tube than the ohterwise-similar-geometry Ram, and I think that's where some of the magic comes from.  It's closer to the AR and Saluki in that dimension.

I do think the frame works best with a bit of forward lean, rather than upright, posture.   I'm kind of over drop bars though, so I'm considering Chocos or a "three-speed" type bar.  Both of those are similar to moustache/albastache bars, except for having the brakes on the rear part of the bar.   If those fail, then a moustache is always my default choice, and probably perfectly suited to the bike.  If you haven't given them a fair try - experimenting with differnet stems - I'd suggest that first.   The only hesitation in my own case is that I already have them on so many bikes and want some variety.

iamkeith

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Aug 21, 2024, 3:08:52 PM8/21/24
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(I wasn't clear, but my QB is the same 60cm size as my other Riv bikes.)

Bill Lindsay

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Aug 21, 2024, 3:38:35 PM8/21/24
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" Worse is that I think the top bar is a little long, so I’m constantly sliding forward in the seat to reach the bars (the seat, a B68, is as far forward on the post as possible). "

This sounds like a conceptual problem.  If you are "sliding forward", that tells me your hips are too far forward so you are falling in that direction.  

I recommend you try shifting the saddle all the way back and make sure the nose is tilted up a little.  Report back on that zero-dollar experiment, and don't be surprised if it's a lot better.  Shifting a Brooks saddle all the way forward is pretty much guaranteed to make you feel like you are falling forward, because your weight is forward.  I think you'll be more comfortable BALANCED.  Your hips back to counter balance your upper body.   Give that a try

BL in EC

Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 21, 2024, 3:44:59 PM8/21/24
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Alas, this was not the solution for me. I actually moved the seat forward in the hope of avoiding this problem (I do have a slight upward tilt to it). The issue is more that I am pulled forward when I am holding the bars in the most comfortable position, which lifts me off the back of the seat. It’s entirely possible that once I get bars that are better placed, I may also find I can keep the seat further back.


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Andrew Janjigian
twitter/instagram: wordloaf
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Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 21, 2024, 3:48:38 PM8/21/24
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Keith - 

Thanks. I was under the impression that one way to get less-squirrelly turning was to extend the length of the stem, so that it requires more rotation to turn the wheel. The reason I considered pairing it with Boscos was to bring the ends of the bars backwards at the same time.

- Andrew



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Bill Lindsay

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Aug 21, 2024, 4:04:21 PM8/21/24
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OK, good luck with your future experiments.  

BL in EC

CMR

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Aug 21, 2024, 4:04:34 PM8/21/24
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Boscos on a quickbeam might come back too far, especially with an 11cm stem. I think an albatross on a dirt drop would be too close for me too honestly, even on a big bike.

Brooks can be slippery, which is a good and a bad thing. A cheap experiment might be a non-leather saddle further back on the rails.

Do you have any other bikes with upright bars that fit well?



Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 23, 2024, 8:55:34 AM8/23/24
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Made some adjustments last night and gave it a long-ish ride, to see if I can pinpoint the issues. I moved the seat back a bit and lowered it slightly, and staying seated was a little easier, so perhaps it was on the high side. 

As for the twitchiness, which seems new, I am wondering if I need to replace the bearings on my headset. While it is a little wobbly generally, where it is most noticeable is if I hit a bump while the wheel is turned, it seems to “jump” a long way in the direction of the turn, like it is notched. When not moving, the headset seems smooth, so I’m not sure it is a bearing issue or something not headset related. 


Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 25, 2024, 8:29:22 AM8/25/24
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Made some adjustments last night and gave it a long-ish ride, to see if I can pinpoint the issues. I moved the seat back a bit and lowered it slightly, and staying seated was a little easier, so perhaps it was on the high side. 

As for the twitchiness, which seems new, I am wondering if I need to replace the bearings on my headset. While it is a little wobbly generally, where it is most noticeable is if I hit a bump while the wheel is turned, it seems to “jump” a long way in the direction of the turn, like it is notched. When not moving, the headset seems smooth, so I’m not sure it is a bearing issue or something not headset related. 

On Aug 21, 2024, at 4:04 PM, CMR <cmiller...@gmail.com> wrote:

JohnS

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Aug 25, 2024, 2:57:45 PM8/25/24
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My experience to test the status of the headset, is to remove the front wheel, stem/handle bar, front brake and any other accessories like a rack or fenders. Then turning the fork is only the weight of the fork nothing else to throw it off. I'm usually amazed at how crappy the headset can feel when I do that, even though it felt fine when all the other components where there.

JohnS

Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 26, 2024, 8:53:50 AM8/26/24
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Thanks, John. Will try this. I am going to replace the bearings either way as part of a full refresh of the bike. First I have to saw off the stem and dissolve the remainder, so I can get the fork off the bike. 


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Andrew Janjigian
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Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 26, 2024, 5:15:04 PM8/26/24
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I've been riding my QB with an upright posture for forever, though it's more of a slight lean rather than a full seated upright, using albatross bars. But recently I've had a back issue that is exacerbated by exactly this sort of position, so ideally whatever modifications I make will allow both positions. 

I was under the impression that the longer the stem, the more you needed to turn the bars to get the the wheel to turn. But I can see that forcing a forward lean would also make the front end more stable in the general sense. I don't ride hands-off, but it certainly *used* to feel like I could if I wanted to. I'm going to try replacing the headset first, to see if that might be part of the problem. When I tighten it beyond the point that it moves freely, it barely moves, but as soon as I back off from that point, it seems very loose; it seems to have less play than it used to.

Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 26, 2024, 5:17:47 PM8/26/24
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I don't have any currently built out, but I have ridden with upright bars exclusively for the last 20 years, and it's only recently that I've had this problem (even my QB used to ride fine!)

Andrew Janjigian

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Aug 26, 2024, 5:18:49 PM8/26/24
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thanks, Patrick! lots to think about. I am tempted by a new frame, though I am leaning toward trying to get the QB working the way it once did. If not, then I'll have no excuse!

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