Glider for tall pilot

[Matthias Jaffe]

I am 6'2" and 220# flying mostly my club's SGS 1-34, where I fit very tightly in the most reclined backrest position.  Having recently completed the SSA bronze badge, I am looking to move to the club's glass ship which is an ASW19.  I noticed that with a parachute, fully reclined backrest and pedals as far out as they go, I end up with about 1/4" clearance to the canopy.  I sat in a friends' 304CZ with a parachute on my back and could not get the canopy closed.  Three questions:

1) I am as concerned about mid-airs as the next guy, but considering that (i) I believe the number of lives saved by a parachute in gliders in real life is very low and (ii) I am not interested in either acro or comps, how critical is flying with a chute?  I guess even if I drop the parachute, I will still need some type of cushion.

2) I have read that some tall pilots remove the backrest of their gliders altogether to gain some additional space.  Any tips on this?

3) As I look to potentially buy my first glider, are there any models that are better suited for a relatively new (200 flights / 30 solo hours) and tall pilot like me?  I would prefer something with self connecting assembly, a nose hook, preferably no flaps, in the $50K (+/- $10K) range.

Thanks!

[Uli N]

>> ...  how critical is flying with a chute? <<

I guess you will find out when you need one and don't have it! 

Have you tried sitting in a glider with a 'ThinPack' or 'ChairChute' chute, where the canopy is spread out more resulting in an overall thinner package? 

I have not flown one but I hear that the cockpit of the Genesis G2 is huge and can accommodate tall pilots. It is a modern standard class ship but they are probably not available at the price point you mentioned.

Uli

'AS'

[j zak]

One of the reasons for wearing a parachute is that glider pilots thermal in close proximity to one another. So the risk level goes up a little. Mid airs do happen I can remember one at a contest in the UK where the pilot had a mid air with another glider at 3000 ft. The parachute saved that guys life. So contests, acrobatics, rigging errors, and very congested air space are issues.  That said the parachute is useless below a 1000' in a glider, head on with another glider, large aircraft collision etc a parachute likely won't help. There was an accident in Alberta at the canadian championships last week were the pilot bailed out and his chute didn't deploy in time. 

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[fbcompton (null)]

For larger pilots . . . My 1972 Schempp-Hirth Standard Cirrus for sale at Marfa in southwest Texas. Generous useful load.

May 2024 “wings off” Annual Inspection, polished by glider A&P-IA. AD’s complied. Only one recurring AD due in 453 more hours.

Serial # 187 with the factory wing incidence modification. Double panel airbrakes.  Water Ballast system fully functional.

Hangared (even the trailer) since 1999. Original Schwabelack gel coat in excellent condition. 830.8 hours with all logbooks. 

Favored sailplane for 15 meter Club Class contests with almost zero handicap rating. Three recent XC flights over 300 km.

Very nice enclosed trailer. Delivery possible. Photos and complete details by Email (preferred) to burtc...@aol.com

[John DeRosa]

DG gliders (100,200,300, etc) are known to fit taller pilots.  Find one and have a sit.

[Cliff Hilty]

Im 6' 2" and, when I started 220, I fit in the 19 with a chute with a modified backrest. It was a straight piece of 1/4" luann plywood from the lip of the seat pan up to and resting on a 1 inch square piece of hard foam glued to the luann. I also fit in a LS3, Ls4,  Standard Cirrus, Grob 102 Asw20, asw24, asw27 Dou discus, nimbus 3 nimbus 2, PW 5, PW6,  easily, much tighter in LS1, and can not fit in libelle, phoebus and other early glass ships. Hope this helps. 

CH

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[kevin anderson]

I know of at least 2  people that have bailed out successfully, I love a chute, softie paraphynelia, pretty thin, and I am even now considering equipping with a static line like Sean's article was talking about, because the guy that got knocked out was one that  I know.
 

92

[George Haeh]

Since the recent tragedy has been mentioned: It's usually several months before we will have any information from TSB Canada on the lack of canopy deployment when the pilot bailed out at the Canadian Nationals. The public information is that his body was found appropriately 100 metres from the glider. 

The family and people at the contest and club have been hit hard. The pilot was a great guy. 

-

  George Haeh

 

[krasw]

Removing backrest altogether is the standard practise for us tall pilots. Sometimes you need to make a custom pillow to flatten the cockpit backwall. Car racing shoes have thin soles that might give you extra room. I have flown this way most of the glider cockpits manufactured, except Schempp a-model cockpit. It is designed for 70% scale humans. 

Discus b or LS4 might fit you needs.

Always wear parachute. 

[Uli N]

>>  I know of at least 2  people that have bailed out successfully.... <<

Same here! They bailed out of a L13 after its left wing almost departed the rest of the airframe in mid-flight. They were using static-line chutes and the instructor in the rear-seat made it out at around 200m (650ft).

Uli

'AS'

[John Brake]

I'm 6'3" and hefty; fit nicely in a LS-4 / LS-4B, with parachute on.

[Chip Bearden]

It's not just overall height. Also relevant is the torso-to-leg-length ratio. I'm 6'3" (well, until I got old). For years, I flew a 201 Libelle with the higher canopy and a thick US Navy surplus backback parachute. Ironicallyl, the bulge in the canopy for taller pilots was in front of my head. Yet I couldn't' close the canopy in an early Ventus even without a chute. My friend Robert Robertson flew a Ventus A despite being only slightly shorter than me. But when we sat next to each other, I towered over him. He was all legs. You have to check.    

I've flown an ASW 19 and 20 by removing the backrests. The 27 is much better for me. Sometimes it's not so simple. My ASW 24 has the factory "Gerhard Waibel" mods: an aftermarket panel with higher cutouts for the knees, thinner pedals (actually no pedals, just the bars), and no backrest (the covers over the storage areas on either side of the rear cockpit from the motorglider version are installed instead to form a backrest). But there are at least 3, possibly 4 different versions of the 24 front fuselage involving different landing gear mountings and, as a result, cockpit dimentions. Later versions are more accommodating. You have to check.

Chutes count. Most of us are fine with the traditional backpack: about the same thickness top to bottom. I use a Softie Wedge model, much thinner behind my shoulders  and much thicker in the lumbar area: perfect for my ASW 24 where allowing me to recline a bit more makes it possible to close the canopy, and also fly comfortably. You have to check. Borrow friends' chutes. When I was shopping for a chute for my 24, several vendors shipped me chutes to try on. I just had to pay the shipping to return them. 

Being tall is mostly an advantage in life, they say. Not necessarily in soaring. :)

Chip Bearden

JB

[Chip Bearden]

And, as others have noted, the LS3 and LS4 are big cockpits. I could wear a chute and adjust the backrest/headrest to suit me fine.

Chip Bearden

JB 

[cbb...@sbcglobal.net]

The Standard Cirrus also seems to have a huge cockpit.

 

The plane I fly, HpH 304CZ, has a fairly large cockpit and was purchased from a tall man about 6’2”.

Be sure to check out where the CG will be at if you are a heavier big guy as well. While there are solutions such as a brass tail wheel to offset, and also water tanks in the fin, it is good to know BEFORE you buy where the CG will be.

And a parachute adds @ 15lbs, more or less.

 

Kind Regards,

Chris Behm

304DD

CH

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[kevin anderson]

And shopping for a chute really consider a Softie with the aerobic harness. NOT the ratchet down one, but just the one where you have a webbing loop down at your groin that the webbing goes through and then the hardware ends up on your chest crossed  over.  I replaced my old standard one with it and LOVE IT. 

I can finally tighten my straps enough and NOT have hardware being shoved i to my groin by my glider belt. 

92

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[John Ackerson]

I'm bigger than you and love my DG-303 and DG-800S.   I wear a National Flat or 425 back parachute.  It's a little hard reaching the radio.  The DG-303 is a great starter ship.

John

[gary O'Neill]

I am over 6ft and broad, I flew a glasflugel Kestrel 17mtr H401 ,performance same as an ASW20, prev owner was 6ft 4

a really nice ship to fly, lots of flaps ,and drag chute as well ,its bigger cousin the 19mtr wing is a bit of a floater so it doesnt go much better than the H401

[Curt Lewis]

It would be hard to find something more suited for larger pilots than the Genesis 2.  It meets all of your stated criteria:

" 3) As I look to potentially buy my first glider, are there any models that are better suited for a relatively new (200 flights / 30 solo hours) and tall pilot like me?  I would prefer something with self connecting assembly, a nose hook, preferably no flaps, in the $50K (+/- $10K) range."

Curt - 95

[Matthias Jaffe]

Thank you all for your advise.  This has been very helpful!!!  Removing the backrest from my club's ASW19 made a huge difference.  Thankfully, that can be achieved with two fingers and doesn't require any tools.  Should check where the CG ends up though.  Will also need to figure out how to fill in the back as it is no longer straight.  Am looking at some comfort foam ideas.  Going forward, I will be looking out for any Genesis2 comin up for sale.  Sadly, those are few and far between.

Matthias

[Rick Roelke]

Matthias, if you find removing the backrest leaves an uneven surface I suggest you fill the lowpoints with a firm foam like pool noodle foam in flat sheets.  I think you can find it as a cheep camping pad.  After all you are trying to simulate somthing that was firm (the seat back).  Memory foam is great under your butt, but this other foam is light and you don't want it to change shape behind your chute.

RR

[Michael Opitz]

Just came up on W&W.  Someone is going to get a great deal on this one.

https://wingsandwheels.com/classifieds/gliders/group-genesis-genesis-ii1223158042.html

[John Usher]

The LS-4 is a great glider for both a tall and low time pilot.  I’m 6’3” 200lbs, long in the torso and legs and fit very comfortably with a standard parachute and the seat back still in the cockpit.  The LS-4 has very docile and forgiving flight characteristics! 

John Usher “JU” 

[Armand Charbonneau]

I am 6'1" and do not put the peddles all the way forward on my Ventus 2c.  It has a cockpit that is slightly larger than the Ventus 2cx.

https://wingsandwheels.com/classifieds/gliders/schempp-hirth-ventus-2c1634508917.html