Tonic Water & Panty Hose

[Andrea Matney]

Did I get your attention with the subject line?  : )

This was not some crazy theme party, but two tidbits I recently learned but have not tried.

- Neurologist said to drink tonic water for preventing muscle cramps because of the quinine. I think others of you have also mentioned this one. Anything more to say?

- Professional mtn. bike racer and military veteran told me a secret for keeping the moisture away from your skin during a rainy rides/hikes. He wears panty hose up to his calf! I'm sure you all have something to say on this one, but I'd like to hear your experience.

I'd love to hear your lessons on these tidbits and any other oddities that help. (and about your crazy theme parties ; )

- Andrea

[Steve Palincsar]

On Mon, 2013-05-20 at 21:52 -0400, Andrea Matney wrote:
>
> - Neurologist said to drink tonic water for preventing muscle cramps
> because of the quinine. I think others of you have also mentioned this
> one. Anything more to say?
>

Tastes better when you add a little gin?

[David Buzzee]

Wive's tale states that quinine water helps with restless leg syndrome. Personal experience throws cold water on that claim. No experience re: quinine water and cramps but I drink a lot of quinine water and do not get cramps. This observation proves nothing. It is not easy to do a controlled experiment on topics like this. Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android

---

From: Andrea Matney <andrea...@gmail.com>;
To: randon <ran...@googlegroups.com>; dcr...@googlegroups.com <dcr...@googlegroups.com>;
Subject: [Randon] Tonic Water & Panty Hose
Sent: Tue, May 21, 2013 1:52:26 AM

-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "randon" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to randon+un...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to ran...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/randon?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.

[coachgrainger]

Very good points, Andrea.

I have told my clients, for years, to do both of these.

Pedialite works well, too, to balance the electrolytes and I have a client/athlete that made it through the very rainy Rocky Mt. 1200km using panty hose-at east that's what I told him to do. They are warm and pack up really light!

Michelle (cycling coach)

[William Beck]

Dr. Mirkin's web site has had a number of summaries of research about
cramps. This recent one
http://www.drmirkin.com/public/ezine070311.html says that most cramps
are caused by "muscle fatigue or tearing of the muscle itself."
Dehydration or lack of minerals is a less common cause. "Research in
athletes after they ran in 52-mile races showed that the runners who
suffered cramps had the same level of dehydration and blood minerals
as those who did not get muscle cramps."

The summary also notes that "Quinine has been reported to help relieve
muscle cramps in non athletes, but it can burst red blood cells."

Bill

> --

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups

> "DC Randonneurs" group.
>
> To post to this group, send email to dcr...@googlegroups.com
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com
>
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/dcrand?hl=en
>
> ---

> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups

> "DC Randonneurs" group.

> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an

> email to dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com.

[Nicholas Bull]

I'm sure that overexertion is a factor.  But since the choice may be between overexertion and DNF, sometimes you just have to do what you have to do.  And in my experience, eating enough electrolyte pills -- sodium, potassium, calcium, and magnesium -- has had a one-hundred percent success rate in offsetting the effects of overexertion and making cramps go away.  As to whether there are deleterious effects of eating too many electrolytes, when I asked my doctor about it he said something rather formal about "in a person with normal kidney (liver?) function, excess electrolytes are just excreted in the urine."

How do I "know" that electrolytes are effective?  OK, ride too hard all morning without eating many electrolytes.  Now pushing up a big hill (like Catoctin), I start to develop cramps.  Eat a Salttab or an Endurolyte and a packet of salt, and the cramps go away.  Ten or fifteen minutes later the cramps start to come back.  Repeat electrolyte treatment, cramps go away.  The harder I ride, the faster the cramps return -- so that's consistent with overexertion as a cause.  But the fact that I can ease off for just a few pedal strokes, eat electrolytes, and return to riding hard without going into a full cramp tells me that electrolytes are effective in counteracting the effects of overexertion.

Each of us is an experiment of one.

Nick

On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 7:13 AM, Barry <av8...@gmail.com> wrote:

I just read a short Q and A in Outside where some "expert" said that salt tablets and electrolytes didn't serve much purpose in the prevention of muscle cramps. He said the research suggested that sugar may help, but that cramping was the result of overexertion and the only real remedy was to back off and slow down.  Let me see if I can find it.

Sent from my iPhone

--

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "DC Randonneurs" group.
 
To post to this group, send email to dcr...@googlegroups.com
 
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com
 
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/group/dcrand?hl=en
 
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "DC Randonneurs" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
 
 

[Eric Keller]

It has never taken more than one enduralyte to fix cramps in my case.
I really don't care why, placebo effect is right there at the top of
my lists of things to consider. The cause of cramps probably is
overexertion, but it doesn't seem to me that term means much to a
randonneur. Randonneuring is all about recovery. I have felt so bad
on the bike that in the past I would have thought my day was done.
And then an hour later felt just great, like I could ride another 150
miles. And then I did.

> "randon" group.

> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an

> email to randon+un...@googlegroups.com.

> To post to this group, send email to ran...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/randon?hl=en.

[Lynne Fitz]

Packing panty hose...

[thirty-six]

The quinine levels in modern tonic water are so low, there is there
risk of encouraging potassium and magnesium depletion through tissue
flushing, and the problem will just return, probably in under 6
hours. It may well be that any water (with a little soda) will have
similar effect. I have tried tonic water and was not convinced
either way.

What I immediately suspect is that many, if not all, are consuming
little saturated fat and perhaps much meat. The lymph relies on fat
to cleanse tissue of metabolic waste and move it through the lymph
ducts. A low fat diet will have the ducts clog (due to high protein
to fat ratio) and the build up of waste in the muscle leads to
weakness, soreness and ultimately cramping as it tries to shift the
coagulation of waste in the lymphatic duct. Most of the disturbance
may simply be calcium, which is drawn by the muscle as it acidifies
under high output levels. When easing off, the lymph ducts should
then be drawing on the calcium and moving it up the body to the
bowels. This AIUI is aided by the interstitial fluid returning to an
alkaline state so that the calcium bond are released.

I have found that my instant "cure" is pickled chillies or prepared
mustard. There also seems to be some benefit in eating chilli,
turmeric or mustard in protecting against the interruption in
circulation and so the spasms during a sustained effort. Green tea
is also very helpful, so tat is my standard drink and the basis for
soups I make. Boneset (comfrey), whether made into a tea, soup or
chewed I suspect is probably THE remedy for this problem, but don't
expect any herb working for more than a few hours without saturated
fat in your belly.

For long term protection against spasms and future osteoporosis (if
the calcium is in the muscle, it's not returning to the bone) I feel
it is important to get enough quality fat, such as butter, lard,
tallow, dripping or coconut oil to make one's skin oily and to eat an
alkalising diet containing greens and spices with little (if any)
meat. In addition, while recovering, it is helpful to dry brush the
skin and lightly massage (lymph ducts are just under the veins) with a
little spit or water to dryness.


Stop drinking milk and eating cheese. Don't let the indoctrination
shackle you.

> help. *(and about your crazy theme parties ; )*
>
> - Andrea

[thirty-six]

that'll be one of those feeble "tonics". With good gin and good
tonic I find 1:1 good for me. The most of Fever Tree I use is less
than twice the gin. Saves drowning with the water that's "tonic" only
in name.

[thirty-six]

Ingredients: Water, Dextrose. Less than 2% of the Following: Citric
Acid, Potassium Citrate, Sodium Chloride, Sodium Citrate, Sucralose,
Acesulfame Potassium, Zinc Gluconate, and Artificial Flavor.

Hmm, looks familiar. Potassium citrate IIRC is the principle
activator to make citrated milk. The rest of it may as well be what
I settled on through self experience with a glucose based rehydration,
only I also used MgSO4 (magnesium sulphate) and NaHCO3 in addition to
lemon and NaCl2
Today, I would still use the glucose, lemon or lime with sea salt,
magnesium chloride and sodium bicarbonate. A molasses based drink is
probably all there and just the lime will balance it.


If low zinc is your problem, it is available from oysters and
grapefruit in more than sufficient amounts. Then there is also
coconut water (no sugar or sweetener) and sugar cane molasses.

you could do well to remember coconut and lime: http://youtu.be/Tbgv8PkO9eo

> > help. *(and about your crazy theme parties ; )*
>
> > - Andrea

[thirty-six]

On May 21, 1:12 pm, William Beck <william.a.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dr. Mirkin's web site has had a number of summaries of research about

> cramps. This recent onehttp://www.drmirkin.com/public/ezine070311.htmlsays that most cramps

> are caused by "muscle fatigue or tearing of the muscle itself."
> Dehydration or lack of minerals is a less common cause.  "Research in
> athletes after they ran in 52-mile races showed that the runners who
> suffered cramps had the same level of dehydration and blood minerals
> as those who did not get muscle cramps."

Cramps are due to lack of circulation, and if it's not because of
blood, then there is that other great circulatory network, the
lymphatic system. Our muscles can't dump metabolic waste (including
acid) into our bloodstream, it must be returned, with acids
neutralised, at a regulated rate so as to keep the blood balanced. If
the lymphatic duct is stagnant, the muscle must seize else tissue
damage occurs due to localised crystallization of the salts. Muscle
fibre in good health is immensely strong and only tears because an
imbalance in salts and the pain it produces is somehow ignored (can't
understand what could do that).

[thirty-six]

On May 21, 2:45 pm, Nicholas Bull <nick.bike.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm sure that overexertion is a factor.  But since the choice may be
> between overexertion and DNF, sometimes you just have to do what you have
> to do.  And in my experience, eating enough electrolyte pills -- sodium,
> potassium, calcium, and magnesium -- has had a one-hundred percent success
> rate in offsetting the effects of overexertion and making cramps go away.
> As to whether there are deleterious effects of eating too many
> electrolytes, when I asked my doctor about it he said something rather
> formal about "in a person with normal kidney (liver?) function, excess
> electrolytes are just excreted in the urine."

During overexertion, kidney output is suspended. Getting an excess of
any electrolyte into the blood may be dangerous under such
circumstances. Potassium and magnesium are constantly lost through
kidney output and also sweating (with sodium) but calcium is generally
preserved. So when we become dehydrated, our calcium to magnesium
tissue ratio will rise and lead at least to slowness if not spasms
(occasionally fatal). While sodium depletion may cause problems in
itself, it is usually being used as a replacement for potassium.
While it is best to keep potassium levels high, once one gets into
dificulties the use of sodium will give faster relief, but fluid
levels should be kept up and a return to a potassium dominant
working. Eat more fruits.

>
> How do I "know" that electrolytes are effective?  OK, ride too hard all
> morning without eating many electrolytes.  Now pushing up a big hill (like
> Catoctin), I start to develop cramps.  Eat a Salttab or an Endurolyte and a
> packet of salt, and the cramps go away.  Ten or fifteen minutes later the
> cramps start to come back.  Repeat electrolyte treatment, cramps go away.

That's dangerous territory you playing in.

> The harder I ride, the faster the cramps return -- so that's consistent
> with overexertion as a cause.  But the fact that I can ease off for just a
> few pedal strokes, eat electrolytes, and return to riding hard without
> going into a full cramp tells me that electrolytes are effective in
> counteracting the effects of overexertion.

More accurately, they give temporary relief for you.
What happens if you eat an organic orange and have a mouthful of
molasses water within 20 minutes of the climb?

>
> Each of us is an experiment of one.
>
> Nick
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 7:13 AM, Barry <av8n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I just read a short Q and A in Outside where some "expert" said that salt
> > tablets and electrolytes didn't serve much purpose in the prevention of
> > muscle cramps. He said the research suggested that sugar may help, but that
> > cramping was the result of overexertion and the only real remedy was to
> > back off and slow down.  Let me see if I can find it.
>
> > Sent from my iPhone
>

> > On May 20, 2013, at 9:52 PM, Andrea Matney <andrea.mat...@gmail.com>

> > wrote:
>
> > Did I get your attention with the subject line?  : )
>
> > This was not some crazy theme party, but two tidbits I recently learned
> > but have not tried.
>
> > - Neurologist said to drink tonic water for preventing muscle cramps
> > because of the quinine. I think others of you have also mentioned this one.
> > Anything more to say?
>
> > - Professional mtn. bike racer and military veteran told me a secret for
> > keeping the moisture away from your skin during a rainy rides/hikes. He
> > wears panty hose up to his calf! I'm sure you all have something to say on
> > this one, but I'd like to hear your experience.
>
> > I'd love to hear your lessons on these tidbits and any other oddities that

> > help. *(and about your crazy theme parties ; )*

>
> > - Andrea
>
> > --
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "DC Randonneurs" group.
>
> > To post to this group, send email to dcr...@googlegroups.com
>
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com
>
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/dcrand?hl=en
>
> > ---
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "DC Randonneurs" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> > email to dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visithttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.

[NickBull]

Please tell my doctor.  I'm sure he'll respect your medical training more than his own.

And also, please inform my kidneys that during overexertion their output is suspended.  That will save on all those pee stops I have to make.

How about citing some sort of scientific evidence -- any kind of scientific evidence -- for the stuff that you say.

I can make up scientific-sounding stuff on any topic you'd like me to.  Assertion does not equal evidence.

Nick

[NickBull]

Just to be clear on what I'm asking for:  Either you are doing your own independent research and coming to your own conclusions, or you are basing your statements on information you have obtained from others.  If you are doing your own research, then either provide a citation to where it is published, or write a paper that properly describes your methodology and results.  If you are basing your statements on information you have obtained from others, then cite their publications/books/lectures/whatever so that we can go look for ourselves and make up our own minds whether there is any evidence for their claims, or not.

Just asserting things in a newsgroup has zero credibility.

Some of what you say may possibly make sense.  But you gotta back it up, man.

Nick

[thirty-six]

On May 22, 7:05 pm, NickBull <nick.bike.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Please tell my doctor.  I'm sure he'll respect your medical training more
> than his own.

His medical training is to make money from sick people...

>
> And also, please inform my kidneys that during overexertion their output is
> suspended.  That will save on all those pee stops I have to make.

really then, you are not riding so hard that you are overexerting.
If you are making frequent stops then that indicates soft tissue
calcium deposits.

>
> How about citing some sort of scientific evidence -- any kind of scientific
> evidence -- for the stuff that you say.

Try and use google.

>
> I can make up scientific-sounding stuff on any topic you'd like me to.
> Assertion does not equal evidence.

I'm not going to make a courtroom argument.

> > > > To post to this group, send email to dcr...@googlegroups.com<javascript:>

>
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> > > > dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>

>
> > > > For more options, visit this group at
> > > >http://groups.google.com/group/dcrand?hl=en
>
> > > > ---
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups
> > > > "DC Randonneurs" group.
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> > an

> > > > email to dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>.

> > > > For more options, visithttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
> > > >  --
> > > > --
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups
> > > > "DC Randonneurs" group.
>

> > > > To post to this group, send email to dcr...@googlegroups.com<javascript:>

>
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> > > > dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>

>
> > > > For more options, visit this group at
> > > >http://groups.google.com/group/dcrand?hl=en
>
> > > > ---
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups
> > > > "DC Randonneurs" group.
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> > an

> > > > email to dcrand+un...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>.

[thirty-six]

I suppose you want it authorized in Latin too?

[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2013-05-22 at 22:41 -0700, thirty-six wrote:
> I suppose you want it authorized in Latin too?

Only if you are the Pope and are speaking ex cathedra.

[Steve Palincsar]

On Wed, 2013-05-22 at 22:37 -0700, thirty-six wrote:
>
> On May 22, 7:05 pm, NickBull <nick.bike.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Please tell my doctor. I'm sure he'll respect your medical training more
> > than his own.
>
> His medical training is to make money from sick people...

Whereas, your medical training is...?

> > How about citing some sort of scientific evidence -- any kind of scientific
> > evidence -- for the stuff that you say.
>
> Try and use google.

If that's your source, provide some citations.

> > I can make up scientific-sounding stuff on any topic you'd like me to.
> > Assertion does not equal evidence.
>
> I'm not going to make a courtroom argument.

So far, you have made no argument at all. And after all, why should we
trust anything you say? You won't provide any evidence, you don't
provide your name, just an alias that is a number, and your email
address appears to be fake.

Is there any reason at all we should trust a word you say? Nick didn't
put it quite this way, but I think it's time for you to put up or shut
up.

[thirty-six]

On May 23, 12:26 pm, Steve Palincsar <palin...@his.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2013-05-22 at 22:37 -0700, thirty-six wrote:
>
> > On May 22, 7:05 pm, NickBull <nick.bike.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Please tell my doctor.  I'm sure he'll respect your medical training more
> > > than his own.
>
> > His medical training is to make money from sick people...
>
> Whereas, your medical training is...?

I have much experience with the medical profession, I hold no
fondness for the illusions upon which they relied at the founding of
the London College of "Physicians" or that which have developed since.

>
> > > How about citing some sort of scientific evidence -- any kind of scientific
> > > evidence -- for the stuff that you say.
>
> > Try and use google.
>
> If that's your source, provide some citations.

I have a mixture of sources, but most notable is my own experience.
In recent months I have had chalk powder coming from my legs and
forearms, I have had milk protein (cheesy) from other areas. I note
the foods which promote this expulsion and ease muscle tension. I
feel the spasms when stretching. I feel the movement along my lymph
ducts towards my abdomen, I feel the pain in my abdomen as resolution
of acids takes place. I fart with the resulting gas. I have seen the
calcium in my stools, which tends to occur when not eating legumes.
The thick skin that has been on my legs for years is diminishing as I
maintain an alkalising diet. The spasms get less powerful and shorter
each week, except when I've eaten cheese. I am the experiment and I
have taken control away from the "physicians" who specialize in
tomfoolery, fraud, mesmerism, conjouring and "professional" lying.

Perhaps in a year I'll get a DEXA scan to show that I have reversed
osteoporosis which has been caused through heavy exercise, wrong diet
and for the final piece in the puzzle, the willy-nilly administration
of "medicines" by physicians. I am currently respecting the pain and
vibration which is occuring as part of my healing (lymphatics at
work) and see no urgency in pursuing evidence from a magic box usually
reserved for the use by members of the physicians secret union. .

>
> > > I can make up scientific-sounding stuff on any topic you'd like me to.
> > > Assertion does not equal evidence.
>
> > I'm not going to make a courtroom argument.
>
> So far, you have made no argument at all.  And after all, why should we
> trust anything you say?  You won't provide any evidence, you don't
> provide your name, just an alias that is a number, and your email
> address appears to be fake.

READ THE FUCKING MANUAL

start with Gen 1:29

>
> Is there any reason at all we should trust a word you say?  Nick didn't
> put it quite this way, but I think it's time for you to put up or shut
> up.

My word is from my heart, to give strength and power to those willing
to accept it.

We are not designed to consume the products of industry which is why I
keep returning to the book of Genesis and find that simple guidance of
great value. Eat the seeds from herbs and eat fruits, not grass,
it's seed, milk or animal flesh.

There is NO PUZZLE when one retains (or returns to) the pleasures of
ignorance of the "health-care" industry. They are either the
greatest fools or are complicit in pulling off the largest illusion,
putting the magic circle to shame.

The "health-care" industry is the biggest war in this world, sapping
the energies of men so they remains subservient to their masters.
The words from God have been put into the Saxon language so that we
may understand the freedom for which we have, not the illusion of
commercial practice (a cover, using government, for slavery). You
need to open your eyes and see, not be persuaded by the lying
persuasive words of corporate rule. In each document I read which has
medical connotations, their has to be a grain of truth (oops, noMonsta
bust that saying) else it could not be persuasive. Trouble is that
the practicing physic bases his medicine on the basis of infection.
We are being infected all the time and God gave us a system of waste
management, namely the lymphatic system.

For illustrations of the lymphatic system see Gray's Anatomy.

[Ian Hoffman]

A'right folks...  nothing's been gained by arguing over the 'net. Nor by continuing to state contrasting positions.

Let it drop, or take it off list and have fun privately.

This kind of 'discussion' is not what I signed up to read on a rando email group.  I'd rather read about the pain and fun of finding saddles and shorts that work, and I ride a recumbent!

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "randon" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to randon+un...@googlegroups.com.

To post to this group, send email to ran...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/randon?hl=en.

[Andrea Matney]

Thank you all for your input on the topic of tonic water and muscle cramps. Let's end this conversation stream please.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "randon" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to randon+un...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to ran...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/randon?hl=en.

[thirty-six]

The truth is stronger than you or your professional illusionary
practice. Why did you join them?

[Daniel Ridings]

On Thursday, May 23, 2013 7:58:09 PM UTC+2, Andrea wrote:

Thank you all for your input on the topic of tonic water and muscle cramps. Let's end this conversation stream please.

Rats! We never got around to the panty hose. Oh well, win some, lose some :-)

Daniel 

[Bruce...@gdc4s.com]

Any chance the language here could remain more professional than
profane? This digest is my main means of keeping in contact with the
randonneuring community, and I'd be disappointed to see it deleted for
inappropriate content or have the sending address blacklisted by our
spambot.

thanks, Bruce

[thirty-six]

If you suspect your legs are not waterproof, eat more fat. If,
despite eating 3oz butter a day, your skin has no oil then dry
brushing followed by massage will help. If there's no time for
massage and an external oil application, wear the pantyhose. They
have been a common item of wear for builders in the north of England
during winter for over 20 years. Probably started by those poor
souls who gave up their morning fry-up to "be healthy".

[thirty-six]

I was just making it clear by using the Saxon language that I have no
want to be entertained by "clinical practice". When the truth has to
be rammed down your/our/my throat, it rarely comes with politeness.
I've struggled for too long to be understanding of medical illusion
and specialists. The truth is written in the scriptures. Eat the
seeds from the herbs and the fruits from the trees. Make it easy on
yourself.

[TommyBFromSC]

To get back on topic, the last time I wore pantyhose on the bike was in 1983 on a tour from Montreal to Quebec in early May.  This was in the days of running shorts, tennis shoes and no helmets.  It was much colder that expected, and a pair of pantyhose from the local grocery store was the second best purchase that I made that trip.  (The best purchase was my first experience with Canadian beer, which at that time was far superior to the college town swill I had been drinking.)  I'm not sure if the pantyhose helped with cramping, but wearing them was more comfortable than I would have expected.

OK, back to medical bickering...

[Steve Palincsar]

On Fri, 2013-05-24 at 14:04 -0700, TommyBFromSC wrote:
> To get back on topic, the last time I wore pantyhose on the bike was
> in 1983 on a tour from Montreal to Quebec in early May. This was in
> the days of running shorts, tennis shoes and no helmets. It was much
> colder that expected, and a pair of pantyhose from the local grocery
> store was the second best purchase that I made that trip. (The best
> purchase was my first experience with Canadian beer, which at that
> time was far superior to the college town swill I had been drinking.)
> I'm not sure if the pantyhose helped with cramping, but wearing them
> was more comfortable than I would have expected.

So, how would pantyhose compare with lightweight cycling tights?

[Alan Walker]

----- Original Message -----
From: "thirty-six" <thirt...@live.co.uk>
To: "randon" <ran...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 25, 2013 6:43 AM
Subject: [Randon] Re: Tonic Water & Panty Hose


"I was just making it clear by using the Saxon language that I have no
want to be entertained by "clinical practice". When the truth has to
be rammed down your/our/my throat, it rarely comes with politeness.
I've struggled for too long to be understanding of medical illusion
and specialists. The truth is written in the scriptures. Eat the
seeds from the herbs and the fruits from the trees. Make it easy on
yourself."

"The truth is written in the scriptures."

Hey, that's great! Where do I find advice about antibiotics, anaesthetics, the circulation of the blood, the germ theory of disease
or homeostasis? I've got through the Pentateuch but nothing so far.

[Daniel Ridings]

So, how would pantyhose compare with lightweight cycling tights?  

 I get a feeling that the main difference would be color, if your cycling tights are black ... and they don't run as easily.

[thirty-six]

Exactly! Those words only bother those who have faith in the
illusion called medical practice. Germs digest protein waste
collected in lymph nodes, which is why such areas are commonly
acidic. Germs are good for health, it's protein coagulation and
congestion of the lymphatic ducts which causes disease. If man wished
to inflict harm on his fellow man, perhaps to shorten his life, he
would serve him pasteurized/sterilized food with much protein. To
convince man to change his ways of eating direct from the forest
floor, he would need to be persuaded of the "dangers of bacteria".
The common use of bactericides could also be frequently applied
directly to the skin to assist with the demise of man's immune
system. Obviously "needed" to get rid of the pong caused by the
breakdown of excess proteins, particularly milk. NO PUZZLE once "germ
theory" and "clinical practice" is put rightly out of one's mind.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Does this Google group have a 'member or thread ignore' option or do I have to use the old analogue method?

[Steve Palincsar]

Two other obvious differences are that cycling tights, even the
lightest, are significantly heavier than pantyhose, and they are not to
be found on sale in randomly selected local grocery shops along the
route.

[Lynne Fitz]

Panty hose come in many colors. I was advised that black support hose are a good choice.

I forgot my knee warmers on our 400k. Didn't need them during the day, but I was a bit worried about the early am hours when the temperature drops. Fortunately we passed a Factory Outlet mall. Running capris work great... So if you pass through a town with a sporting goods store, or some such, that would be an option.

[BykMor]

I've been enjoying this thread. It's a little like checking out that 'people of Wal-Mart website' to feel a bit better about the way I dress :-)

Of course, after about 5 seconds of reading, that nifty scroll wheel on my mouse comes in handy :-/ I'm going to continue to get my scientific and medical information somewhere other than a Dr Bronner's bottle.

To return to topic, I love Gin&Tonics, but have not yet tried them as endurance fuel and I've only ever worn fishnets, which are not especially insulating.

Cheers,

BykMor

[thirty-six]

On May 27, 3:37 pm, BykMor <byk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I've been enjoying this thread. It's a little like checking out that
> 'people of Wal-Mart website' to feel a bit better about the way I dress :-)
>
> Of course, after about 5 seconds of reading, that nifty scroll wheel on my
> mouse comes in handy :-/ I'm going to continue to get my scientific and
> medical information somewhere other than a Dr Bronner's bottle.

My choice is Sunlight soap, but been difficult to get hold of for
years. Not heard of Dr Bronner's, but it's interesting you should
raise the issue, I'd been thinking earlier today of getting an avocado
soap. What is your choice concoction?