State of Ramaze?

[John]

Hi,

What is the state of Ramaze these days?

Do we still want it to progress and grow?

I was reading this well publicised article by Piotr

<http://solnic.eu/2016/05/22/my-time-with-rails-is-up.html>

...and was wondering how come Ramaze doesn't feature anywhere in the future of Ruby web frameworks and how it should.

Have we given up? Should we start looking at Hanami or build something on top of Sinatra or Padrino instead?

just my thoughts.... 

what do you think?

/pagojo

[James Britt]

John wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> What is the state of Ramaze these days?
>
> Do we still want it to progress and grow?

Maybe, though I've not written a Web app in perhaps five years.

I'm sure at some point I will, and If don't figure out how to do it in
something like Haskell then it will be Ruby+Ramaze. (That's not quite
true; I tend to start with a simple Rack app and then see if I really
need more.)

But maybe Ramaze is feature-complete.

>
> I was reading this well publicised article by Piotr
> <http://solnic.eu/2016/05/22/my-time-with-rails-is-up.html>
>
> ...and was wondering how come Ramaze doesn't feature anywhere in the
> future of Ruby web frameworks and how it should.

That article makes some valid points about the impact of Rails, but I
was a Rubyist well before the advent of Rails. I saw Nitro[0] and Rails
come up at the same time, and the Ruby world, and Rubyists, would have
been better off if Nitro got the attention that Rails did. Nitro struck
me as better thought out, less cumbersome, more Ruby-like. But Rails had
slick videos and catchy phrases.

Nitro would let you start with a single plain HTML file and evolve it
into a full-blown MVC (or whatever) app as your project needs dictated.

No installing a dozen gems just to get started.

No obligatory brain-dead "sock drawer"[1] file organization either. :)


There was a strong "winner take all" mentality among a fair number of
influential community members, whereas most devs would have been better
off with exposure to a variety of Web tools. (Even at the time of Nitro
there were a number of interesting Web-dev frameworks. None of them had
slick marketing.)


Water under the bridge, but this monoculture was a big reason for
stepping away from general Ruby activities (though I still run
ruby-doc.org).

>
> Have we given up? Should we start looking at Hanami or build something
> on top of Sinatra or Padrino instead?

Having not bothered to keep up with Ruby stuff in a while I really can't
comment on whatever Web tools there might be. But I'm quite skeptical
when sites tell me they are simple and beautiful and the like. I'm also
skeptical when I see that starting a new project means a bunch of
folders and files are created for me. Please don't assume I'm using a
DB, or want to use your preferred testing framework.

Since I haven't used Ramaze in many a year, I have to ask if there's
anything in the current code that no longer works.

Sometimes projects are just done and don't need constant updates.


James


[0]: Nitro was (more less) what became Ramaze
[1]:
http://cliffmeyers.com/blog/2013/4/21/code-organization-angularjs-javascript
--

jamesbritt.com - Live curious
justthebestparts.com - Feed your head
neurogami.com - Hack your world

[desbest]

Ramaze seems to be supported as when I emailed the creator of Ramaze last year, he gave me support.

Why does Ramaze need any more features? I created a website with Ramaze and it had all the features I need.

[Michael Trommer]

I still develop my apps with Ramaze and have some running and maintaining for some years.

I told manveru (the original dev) like a year ago in IRC that i still use Ramaze and he was like: 'who the Fuck uses ruby for Web stuff?

Guess me.

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[tynamite]

I love the Ramaze framework and wish there was a php version of it, but what I don't like about developing in ruby is how each app is its own web server. Is there a way to install multiple scripts or apps on the same ruby account?

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[Michael Trommer]

I deploy my apps via nginx and unicorn.

You might want to have a look at into that.

[chris]

I think having the apps in separate pids is beneficial for administrative purposes and just proxy a web server in front to make all the apps cohesive and load balanced through proxy balancer.  normally apache and thin for each running app.

[James Britt]

tynamite wrote:
> I love the Ramaze framework and wish there was a php version of it, but
> what I don't like about developing in ruby is how each app is its own
> web server. Is there a way to install multiple scripts or apps on the
> same ruby account?

Yes, but then every app shares the same global space. If you are in
control of all the code, and the code for every site is the same, then
this probably doesn't matter. But if any code is changing the behavior
of core classes then it gets changed for every app running in that same
shared Ruby process. (

There are likely other issues, such as safely tracking user state.

There used to be mod_ruby but it seems to have vanished (likely because
of the shared process issues)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mod_ruby

I imagine you could make a single Ramaze app that returned the
appropriate site page and user state based on the domain name.

I've never done it; I'm thinking out loud here.

Closest thing I've done was a tool called Catapult

http://catapult.rubyforge.org/

I haven't publicly updated the code in forever, but I still use it at home.

I wanted to be able to execute assorted long-running ruby apps (not
necessarily Web/HTML stuff) but didn't want a new Ruby process for every
one, so I decide to use a single Web app that dynamically loaded and
executed scripts based on paths and such.

That was back in 2004; there are probably better options now. :)

(Cringing at the parentheses in the example code on that page. What a
nubie. Too much Java on the brain back then.)


James

[John]

On Thursday, 23 June 2016 14:33:56 UTC+3, Michael Trommer wrote:

I still develop my apps with Ramaze and have some running and maintaining for some years.

I told manveru (the original dev) like a year ago in IRC that i still use Ramaze and he was like: 'who the Fuck uses ruby for Web stuff?

 

Guess me.

This sounds worrying :-/

Is Michael Fellinger still onboard? I think he is. I just wish he was more vocal.

Any ideas?

/pagojo

/pagojo

[Michael Trommer]

Not not really. I don't find that Ramaze lacks any features. So I still use it. Manveru basically made a joke about it ☺️

Hit him on irc/ freenode or Twitter if you like.

--

[John]

On Friday, 24 June 2016 13:41:20 UTC+3, Michael Trommer wrote:

Not not really. I don't find that Ramaze lacks any features. So I still use it. Manveru basically made a joke about it ☺️

Hit him on irc/ freenode or Twitter if you like.

Right, so that was a joke??!!! ok then :-)

Still, we don't have an answer about the state of Ramaze really? Do we?

Is there anything we should / could do about it?

/pagojo