apologies

[Myles Byrne]

Really sorry I pulled out last night. It was poor form.

Also the feedback I got from the guys in the office (before it became
evident we weren't going to make it to the meeting) was that no one
wants to hear a talk with XML in the title, so I'm happy to give the
talk next month re-titled as "Good Abstraction, Bad Abstraction - A
Jovial Jaunt Through the Dark Side of Software Engineering"

[Lachlan Hardy]

Also the feedback I got from the guys in the office (before it became
evident we weren't going to make it to the meeting) was that no one
wants to hear a talk with XML in the title, so I'm happy to give the
talk next month re-titled as "Good Abstraction, Bad Abstraction - A
Jovial Jaunt Through the Dark Side of Software Engineering"

It's still the same talk, though, right?

[Adam Salter]

I did think the mention of XML in the title was a bad idea...
You might as well have called it:
"Going back to SOAP - the good old days"
or
"Why XSLT was actually a good idea"
or even
"COBOL for fun and profit (and brain hurt)"

I've got sooo many more...
-Adam

[Dave Newman]

Xml is like violence. If it's not solving all your problems you're not using enough of it.

[Ryan Bigg (Radar)]

XML: The Language From The Deep.

[Myles Byrne]

yep

[Ben Schwarz]

Myles, I think I witnessed a similar response to my talk
which was pretty loosely on the subject of abstracting before
understanding the domain, rather than bashing / a personal opinion
of one technology or another.

[Andrew Snow]

For those who missed this week's Sydney meetup, we started a new section
of the evening for "Rants".

Perhaps any talks about XML should go in that section?

- Andrew

[Adam Salter]

Classic.

-Adam

[Myles Byrne]

On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Ben Schwarz<ben.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Myles, I think I witnessed a similar response to my talk
> which was pretty loosely on the subject of abstracting before
> understanding the domain, rather than bashing / a personal opinion
> of one technology or another.

Yeah except my title was not "Why XML sucks" apparently (for reasons I
don't entirely understand) everyone read it as that anyway.

[Adam Salter]

Myles,
Your talk was a good excuse to poke fun at XML. I don't/didn't
personally think you would be anything more than tech agnostic.
I guess I can see some uses (HTML)...

Anyway, I didn't really see your talk as knocking XML. For me it's
just that XML can be have kind of unpleasant connotations because of
it's 'overuse' (IMHO).

http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-ref/
http://www.w3.org/TR/2000/NOTE-SOAP-20000508/
http://www.w3.org/TR/wsdl

... Maybe XML is the best way of describing these things?? It is sure
fricken complicated... and pretty unpleasant to parse or translate
into Ruby objects.

-Adam

[Korny Sietsma]

You can't really list all those wonderful w3c pages without also
linking the classic article "The S stands for Simple" - sure, it's
about SOAP not XML, but the problems are similar:
http://wanderingbarque.com/nonintersecting/2006/11/15/the-s-stands-for-simple/

- Korny

--
Kornelis Sietsma korny at my surname dot com
"Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part
that wonders what the part that isn't thinking
isn't thinking of"