Goodbye Railo - Hello Lucee!

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Igal @ getRailo.org

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Jan 29, 2015, 1:33:01 PM1/29/15
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Hi everyone,

It is with great sadness that I announce today my departure from the Railo project.  In the past year or so the project has taken a different direction from its original course, and the people with whom I enjoyed working, like Micha and Gert, seem to have little or no control over that direction. 

After much contemplation I decided to leave the Railo project, and I will no longer provide support for Railo.  So goodbye Railo.

But as the old saying goes: "every ending brings with it a new beginning", and this ending brings with it the beginning of a new and exciting project.  So Hello Lucee!

Lucee is a new open source CFML engine, that continues from the point where Railo has lost its way.   It takes all the good things from Railo, and discards the bad ones. 

The best part, though, is that the project lead of Lucee is no other than Micha, the very same person who started the Railo project back in 2002.  Lucee is therefore fully backward compatible with Railo -- and migrating your servers is extremely easy if you choose to do so.

I encourage you to check out the Lucee project at http://lucee.org

I thank you all -- it's been great being part of this community.

Best,


Igal

-- 
Igal Sapir
Railo Luceee Core Developer
http://lucee.org/

Adam Cameron

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Jan 29, 2015, 1:35:31 PM1/29/15
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Sad news and really excellent news, Igal.

I look fwd to arguing with you about Lucee :-)

-- 
Adam

Matthew Williams

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Jan 29, 2015, 1:47:40 PM1/29/15
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I'll be interested to see what the comparison is.

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ADK

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Jan 29, 2015, 2:49:10 PM1/29/15
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May I ask who is still left at Railo? Will it be actively developed? Can you comment on the "change of directions"? (not looking for drama, just some clarification on what that precisely means?)

phi...@eyb.ch

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Jan 29, 2015, 2:51:28 PM1/29/15
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Hi all,

One good day today ... happy birthday Lucee! Warmest congratulations to Gert, Micha, Igal, Tanja and to all supporters and contributors of Lucee!


My heart always goes with poeple@Lucee and my business too ;-)

__
| \
| $$ __ __ _______ ______ ______
| $$ | \ | \ / \ / \ / \
| $$ | $$ | $$| $$$$$$$| $$$$$$\| $$$$$$\
| $$ | $$ | $$| $$ | $$ $$| $$ $$
| $$_____| $$__/ $$| $$_____ | $$$$$$$$| $$$$$$$$
| $$ \\$$ $$ \$$ \ \$$ \ \$$ \
\$$$$$$$$ \$$$$$$ \$$$$$$$ \$$$$$$$ \$$$$$$$




Mark Drew

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Jan 29, 2015, 2:51:51 PM1/29/15
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Paul Kukiel

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Jan 29, 2015, 3:02:27 PM1/29/15
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Wow, recently I haven't been following Railo but it seams like everyone has left?  What happened?

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Jordan Michaels

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Jan 29, 2015, 3:09:17 PM1/29/15
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Nothing that hasn't happened before it seems. Consider the stories of
OpenOffice & LibreOffice, MySQL & MariaDB, etc.

Warm Regards,
Jordan Michaels

On 01/29/2015 12:02 PM, Paul Kukiel wrote:
> Wow, recently I haven't been following Railo but it seams like everyone
> has left? What happened?
>
> On Jan 30, 2015 5:33 AM, "Igal @ getRailo.org" <ig...@getrailo.org
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/railo/54CA7CD1.7090901%40getrailo.org?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
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> Did you find this reply useful? Help the Railo community and add it to
> the Railo Server wiki at https://github.com/getrailo/railo/wiki
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> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/railo/CAHX0TS4VKBmrr-0zc_GDcux14Zb9JJ8PzJX4R2Cm63SD60FTVg%40mail.gmail.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/railo/CAHX0TS4VKBmrr-0zc_GDcux14Zb9JJ8PzJX4R2Cm63SD60FTVg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

Matt Quackenbush

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Jan 29, 2015, 3:11:51 PM1/29/15
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+infinity

Mark Drew

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Jan 29, 2015, 3:27:24 PM1/29/15
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Node.js

Mark Drew
> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/railo/54CA9368.2070503%40viviotech.net.

Risto

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Jan 29, 2015, 4:15:08 PM1/29/15
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Lucee da' bomb!

Igal, congrats and you have 3 e's in your Lucee title:)

Paul Kukiel

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Jan 29, 2015, 4:17:19 PM1/29/15
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There a new mailing list?

On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 8:15 AM, Risto <ck.web...@gmail.com> wrote:
Lucee da' bomb!

Igal, congrats and you have 3 e's in your Lucee title:)

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Judith Barnett

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Jan 29, 2015, 4:23:10 PM1/29/15
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Yes, from the website at luc.ee this following link:

http://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/lucee

Ryan Hinton

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Jan 29, 2015, 4:26:59 PM1/29/15
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Congratulations. 

Along with others, I would like to understand what the differences are in direction between both Open CFML.  Our company was just ramping up to use Railo from ColdFusion and receiving this news is encouraging to know who the founders are for Lucee but discouraging to know that there is a disconnect somewhere in the Railo / Open CFML community.  Would any of you mind elaborating for those of us a little hesitant to move forward until we have some more knowledge wrapped around these differences, please?

Thank you,
Ryan Hinton

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Walter Seethaler

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:00:47 PM1/29/15
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Have you read Adam's blog post and the comments? http://blog.adamcameron.me/2015/01/lucee.html 

Brad Wood

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:21:52 PM1/29/15
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ADK, Ryan, you're unlikely to get an official reply here.  At least not from any of the "old" people. I can provide you with my opinion/viewpoint but you need to understand I don't speak on behalf of The Railo Company, this is my personal viewpoint.  I would start by reading Adam Cameron's blog post and the comments here:

> May I ask who is still left at Railo? 

What you probably never realized is that Micha, Gert were never employees of "The Railo Company" who is the current trademark owner of Railo.  Instead, they worked for Railo Switzerland who was the major contributor to this project.  "The Railo Company" (TRC) was formed a few years back and is a group of companies.  The Railo Company as it were still exists and owns Railo.  Railo Switzerland no longer exists and Gert and Micha now contribute to Lucee via their new company, Rasia Switzerland-- the founding member of the Lucee Association Switzerland (LAS).

> Will it be actively developed? 

Not to my knowledge.

I would like to understand what the differences are in direction between both Open CFML

Well Lucee is a fork of Railo, so out of the box it's literally the same product with a new name.  At a deeper level, Lucee is owned by LAS and anyone can become a paying member of that association.  At that point, you literally have the right to vote on the direction of the language.  As Micha announced today in the Lucee kickoff- Lucee could support the CFClient tag if the community wanted it.  All you need is a majority vote :)

> disconnect somewhere in the Railo / Open CFML community.

I wouldn't say there's a disconnect.  My understanding is, change was needed in order to allow Railo (now Lucee) to have the flexibility it needed.  I don't know the details so I won't comment any further on what the issue was.  Railo is open source, so forking was easy.  Gert no longer owns the Railo trademark though, so there is no choice but to pick a new name.  See Libreoffice, MariaDB, io.js for mainstream examples of what happens when a large OS project forks.

My personal opinion is to make the lateral switch to Lucee right now while the projects are basically the exact same.  Upgrade is basically just swapping a jar file.  In fact, Sean Corfield already has newworldsingles running on Lucee. 

Obviously this whole thing isn't ideal, but I can assure you it would have been avoided if possible.  As far as I'm concerned, it's the same project, same people, different site, different name.  Well, that and now you can actually become a voting member :)  I'll probalby hang out on this list for a while to see if people have questions, but I've already joined the new Lucee mailing list and all my sites will be running Lucee very soon.  ColdBox 4 already supports Lucee and CommandBox will be converted very soon.

Thanks!

~Brad

Matt Quackenbush

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:26:35 PM1/29/15
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+infinity to what Brad said.

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Mark Drew

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:50:55 PM1/29/15
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It's late here and we have finished the Lucee meetup and brad has nailed it. Same product, same developers new name and a more focussed direction. 

Mark Drew
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Geoff Bowers

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:57:03 PM1/29/15
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RE: mailing list/support forums


On Friday, 30 January 2015 08:17:19 UTC+11, Paul Kukiel wrote:
There a new mailing list?

With any luck we should be moving to a Discourse forum instead of Google Groups.  We're having a slight hiccup getting the final sub-domain in place (http://discourse.lucee.org) but for now http://lucee.org:8080 works just fine.

You can register with a local account, twitter or github -- google oauth 2 soon.

Also for those who find web forums painful (even one as cool as discourse):
All the best,

-- geoff bowers
Daemon Internet Consultants
Sydney, Australia
 

David Panzarella

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Jan 29, 2015, 5:57:59 PM1/29/15
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Sounds very exciting guys! Congrats! I'll be sure to update my servers, and let you know how things go. As usual, thanks for all that each of you do!

Ryan Hinton

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Jan 29, 2015, 6:05:39 PM1/29/15
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Thank you, Walter, and thank you, Adam! Excellent read. My mind is a little mor at ease.

Lucee, it is then!

Martin Schaible

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Jan 29, 2015, 6:15:33 PM1/29/15
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Welcome Lucee, the new kid in town.

As a CFML-Hosting company located in Switzerland, we will support Lucee.

Railo was the product for me to step into the CFML-Hosting. Railo was also the chance to offer CFML for the same price like our PHP-friends do. CFML for the masses? Not really, but the market is growing. Lucee will have a bright and big future, i'm pretty sure about this.

Thanks to the Railo people and the community for all the help in the past years.

Cheers

Martin

Owen Knapp

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Jan 29, 2015, 7:18:29 PM1/29/15
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Looking forward to the future! OSS FTW.

Andrew

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Jan 29, 2015, 8:09:22 PM1/29/15
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I'm thinking a good parallel is Jenkins (formerly Hudson).  All the team left and formed Jenkins, which is where the good stuff happens now.

Desmond Miles

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Jan 30, 2015, 9:52:29 AM1/30/15
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Hi all (I'm new here...),

Congrats and long live for Lucee ! Nice to see that there are people still believing in CFML.

Sorry asking this if the answer may be obvious or trivial but I wanted to know if Lucee is possible then "Can everyone fork Railo, rename it with another name and use GPLv2 ?"

Thank you :-)

Mark Drew

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Jan 30, 2015, 10:11:27 AM1/30/15
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The short answer is yes. 

I have forked it. and I can commit to the project and have my own source. Where the trademark comes in is the name and the fact that the expertise and the community would go for the main project rather than my LuceeRoxors version of it. 

That is the nature of Open Source 

MD

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Jochem van Dieten

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Jan 30, 2015, 10:34:22 AM1/30/15
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On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Desmond Miles wrote:
Sorry asking this if the answer may be obvious or trivial but I wanted to know if Lucee is possible then "Can everyone fork Railo, rename it with another name and use GPLv2 ?"

Yes. Yes. No. You do not own the copyright on Railo, therefore you do not own the copyright on your fork, therefore you can not change the license from LGPLv2.1 to GPLv2. Only copyright owners can change the license.

Jochem


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Michael Dinowitz

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Jan 30, 2015, 11:04:56 AM1/30/15
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"Oops, it looks like that file doesn't exist "

Michael Dinowitz

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Jan 30, 2015, 11:05:54 AM1/30/15
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lucee / Lucee / wiki / Migrate from Railo — Bitbucket
    https://bitbucket.org/lucee/lucee/wiki/Migrate_from_Railo

Desmond Miles

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Jan 30, 2015, 11:12:28 AM1/30/15
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Very clear ! Thank you
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