Re: Chinese High Speed CW Operator

[Raymond Lee]

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. <djri...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Raymond Lee <vr2u...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

Enjoy.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

[R/O David Ring - N1EA]

This message failed to make the group as it was sent directly to me, and I bounced (redirected) Ray's reply to me to this group and not the original message as it had a huge attachment which I uploaded to youtube.com.

From Ray VR2UW

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

https://youtu.be/LW99OmWvr9A

73

R/O Ray VR2UW
sent via your conductor of this forum, R/O DR N1EA

On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 2:58:16 PM UTC-5, VR2UW wrote:

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr.  wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

[Gilbert R. Bossé]

I watched the video. I'll have to practice up some before I even get up to 25. Watching his wrist you see how he can rattle it off that fast. His wrist moves about 1/8 inch whereas most of us move ours much more, thereby reducing the maximum speed. His keying is pure music to me with perfect spacing. Thanks for uploading it.

Gil in Metis VE2BTT 

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:41 PM, Raymond Lee <vr2u...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. <djri...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Raymond Lee <vr2u...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

Enjoy.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

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[Mike Zbrozek]

 

 

Hello Group -

 

Regarding the Chinese guy sending Morse....I cant copy that at all. The clacking, chirping, etc is terrible.

This fellow isnt my cup of tea (pun intended)....to work on the ham bands....sorry to say...

 

73

 

Mike K8XF

Paddle Opr with keyer

Never Bug, Sideswiper or hand key

this is 2015 U know

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: R/O David Ring - N1EA

To: Radio Officers

Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2015 3:41 PM

Subject: [Radio Officers, &c] Re: Chinese High Speed CW Operator

This message failed to make the group as it was sent directly to me, and I bounced (redirected) Ray's reply to me to this group and not the original message as it had a huge attachment which I uploaded to youtube.com.

From Ray VR2UW

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

https://youtu.be/LW99OmWvr9A

73

R/O Ray VR2UW
sent via your conductor of this forum, R/O DR N1EA


On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 2:58:16 PM UTC-5, VR2UW wrote:

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr.  wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Raymond Lee  wrote:

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

Enjoy.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

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[D.J.J. Ring, Jr.]

Mike,

This fellow's sending with a keyer would sound about equal to what he is sending here. This fellow is doing something that so far no one on this list can equal.

I do not know how to transcribe the code he is sending, but I quickly recognized it as four character code groups.  I'm sure some of our members who were armed forces Intercept operators have heard this before and copied it for hours.  I can certainly copy it and easily, I just don't know what it means.

I get it Mike, you cannot copy perfectly formed Morse code if it has clacks or chirps.  I don't think you would have found employment at any of the coast stations because this fellow has an excellent fist, and the instability isn't bad at all, I've heard and had to copy much worse.  Also we had to have perfect copy because copying messages from ships was our bread and butter.  Shipping Companies would really complain if you sent in a message that you did not copy correctly, and rightly so.  Many operator's were fired for not being able to copy.

In addition - from your tag line, you say "never a bug, sideswiper or hand key", which reduces your options to an electronic keyer or keyboard.

However, I challenge you to open up this file (with Firefox you can obtain extensions for downloading youtube videos and converting them to sound only formats) in Audacity (or other) sound editor and examine the length of the dots, inter-element spaces, and dashes, and word spaces for deviation from perfect "machine" Morse.  (I haven't done this either.)

Speaking of hand key, the FCC required that you send 20 wpm English error free for your 2nd Telegraph license certificate, you did at one time send with a hand key didn't you?

Do you dislike your own fist with a straight key?  This man does wonderful sending in my opinion.

Certainly you cannot do as well as this man, neither can I, but do you have a beautiful 20 word per minute Morse fist?  That at one time was a matter of pride on both sides of the Atlantic and Pacific.

I understand that it was more so a matter of pride and accomplishment because it was a requirement of the UK Post Office and BT to operate at their coast stations.  In the USA we were allowed to use a semi-automatic key, sideswiper, keyer or keyboard at RCA / MCI.

I personally used a bug on 500 kHz at WSC per management's request, but I sent the traffic list with my DGM keyboard at 20 wpm - repeating twice callsigns of ships we held traffic for, I also sent out traffic for ships with a keyboard.  However, I have been told that I have one of the best bug fists around too.

Mechanical keys require practice to send near perfect code, did you have enough pride in your profession to master the bug, side swiper as well as the keyer?

Many of the shipboard radio transmitters could not be keyed with a normal keyer unless a heavy-duty relay was used.

I know of many USA radio officers that could hold their own and our national pride against the excellent fists of our brother radio officers of all nations with any type of key.

Can you say the same?

73

DR

[D.J.J. Ring, Jr.]

Mike,

Here's one of our member's comments - I can't understand why everything is doom and gloom from you!

	Conor Daly November 21 at 4:54pm
I've watched this a few times and it's amazing. No wasted movement, perfect economy of motion. It would sound even better with a decent oscillator instead of that duck call he's using.

73

DR

[Eric Weber]

The sending sounded great, although I would have preferred something other than the buzzer he used.

 

At high speed minimal gap and high spring worked best for me, preferably on a Junker key…

http://www.morsex.com/junker/

 

Rgds:

Eric

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[Mike Zbrozek]

 

 

Dave -

 

I knew my e-mail to the r/o group would get your hackles up....HI.

I knew the tag line would generate a reply from N1EA.

I have a few high class hand keys in my possession, e.g. Swedish HandKey from Hi-Mound.

If I say so myself I have a wonderful if not awesome fist on a hand key that goes beyond

25 wpm. The reason that I dont use this handkey is that its a tiresome thing to use.

I prefer a paddle and a keyer. Call me lazy if you wish but I prefer sending with less

effort.

 

As for working at a coastal cw stn...the only stn we had here was WPD in Tampa.

Don Berger and his xyl ran this place. The receiving site was in back of a porno

theater. I am not kidding....the xmtr site was near the banana docks in Tampa.

So U can see that I didnt have a local interest in running cw from location like this.

Altho, the famous Bob Wright (never returned my telegraph study book) worked at

WPD for a time.....You could not hear the audio from the porno flix since this back bldg

had a separate thick brick wall but I could only imagine what was being shown on the screen

when you sent/recd  cw..... And frankly I was sailing at that time and would have no interest

in working at a cw stn. That would have been a big pay cut. Also, after hearing some of the fists

on 500 I had no interest in trying to copy rotten fists from rotten Radio Ops.....

 

 

I will admit that I dont mind copying a bug or handkey if the opr has a talent to send

well. Too many hams dont, you know that Dave.....

 

BTW, in the early 1980's I won a left foot sending contest at my local ham club meeting

once. A guy built a giant handkey and it was placed on the floor, I stood above it and sent

perfectly for 3 minutes at about 10 wpm...this was something....never in my life have I

sent code like this...the prize was a magazine subscription to qst. Thats before I became a

life member.....1978 I believe.....

 

Have a good Sunday...........

 

 

73

 

Mike K8XF

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: D.J.J. Ring, Jr.

To: radio-o...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2015 6:11 PM

Subject: Re: [Radio Officers, &c] Re: Chinese High Speed CW Operator

Mike,

This fellow's sending with a keyer would sound about equal to what he is sending here. This fellow is doing something that so far no one on this list can equal.

I do not know how to transcribe the code he is sending, but I quickly recognized it as four character code groups.  I'm sure some of our members who were armed forces Intercept operators have heard this before and copied it for hours.  I can certainly copy it and easily, I just don't know what it means.

I get it Mike, you cannot copy perfectly formed Morse code if it has clacks or chirps.  I don't think you would have found employment at any of the coast stations because this fellow has an excellent fist, and the instability isn't bad at all, I've heard and had to copy much worse.  Also we had to have perfect copy because copying messages from ships was our bread and butter.  Shipping Companies would really complain if you sent in a message that you did not copy correctly, and rightly so.  Many operator's were fired for not being able to copy.

In addition - from your tag line, you say "never a bug, sideswiper or hand key", which reduces your options to an electronic keyer or keyboard.

However, I challenge you to open up this file (with Firefox you can obtain extensions for downloading youtube videos and converting them to sound only formats) in Audacity (or other) sound editor and examine the length of the dots, inter-element spaces, and dashes, and word spaces for deviation from perfect "machine" Morse.  (I haven't done this either.)

Speaking of hand key, the FCC required that you send 20 wpm English error free for your 2nd Telegraph license certificate, you did at one time send with a hand key didn't you?

Do you dislike your own fist with a straight key?  This man does wonderful sending in my opinion.

Certainly you cannot do as well as this man, neither can I, but do you have a beautiful 20 word per minute Morse fist?  That at one time was a matter of pride on both sides of the Atlantic and Pacific.

I understand that it was more so a matter of pride and accomplishment because it was a requirement of the UK Post Office and BT to operate at their coast stations.  In the USA we were allowed to use a semi-automatic key, sideswiper, keyer or keyboard at RCA / MCI.

I personally used a bug on 500 kHz at WSC per management's request, but I sent the traffic list with my DGM keyboard at 20 wpm - repeating twice callsigns of ships we held traffic for, I also sent out traffic for ships with a keyboard.  However, I have been told that I have one of the best bug fists around too.

Mechanical keys require practice to send near perfect code, did you have enough pride in your profession to master the bug, side swiper as well as the keyer?

Many of the shipboard radio transmitters could not be keyed with a normal keyer unless a heavy-duty relay was used.

I know of many USA radio officers that could hold their own and our national pride against the excellent fists of our brother radio officers of all nations with any type of key.

Can you say the same?

73

DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 4:50 PM, Mike Zbrozek <k8...@verizon.net> wrote:

 

 

Hello Group -

 

Regarding the Chinese guy sending Morse....I cant copy that at all. The clacking, chirping, etc is terrible.

This fellow isnt my cup of tea (pun intended)....to work on the ham bands....sorry to say...

 

73

 

Mike K8XF

Paddle Opr with keyer

Never Bug, Sideswiper or hand key

this is 2015 U know

 

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[D.J.J. Ring, Jr.]

You should have made a recording of your straight key fist, as there is the perenial challange here for any recording in excess of 25 wpm.  Our friends from the UK where they did not offer the alternative to take the 1st class certificate with a semi-automatic key, excelled at hand key sending but most of them can no longer send at that speed when they tried to demonstrate it.

No doubt it takes constant practice and a stiff spring.

I have to admit that arthritis has made what used to be limber, quite stiff and what was - well you get the idea.  I need a stiff spring these days to achieve what I used to do in my foolish youth.

Make a nice recording - either a nice or raspy buzzer is OK for me.  I'd love to hear it.  Videos are OK too, but send them direct and I'll post them to youtube under my account as I did the one from Ray.

73

DR

[Stan Barr]

On 11/21/2015 23:11, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. wrote:
>
> I do not know how to transcribe the code he is sending, but I quickly
> recognized it as four character code groups. I'm sure some of our
> members who were armed forces Intercept operators have heard this before
> and copied it for hours. I can certainly copy it and easily, I just
> don't know what it means.
>
>

Chinese codes for their characters. In military use these were usually
encrypted with a subtractor which changed daily, and for very secret
stuff from a one-time pad, so copying them is probably no help!

Some of their old transmitters had a pronounced chirp which didn't
help copy, one of them was so bad we christened it the"Funky Chicken"
as that is what it sounded like :-)

--
Stan Barr g0...@bluesomatic.org

"Never leave well enough alone." - Raymond Loewy

[Peter VK4QC]

It's just amazing, perfectly timed and nothing special for a key which looks like a Chinese copy of Junker (Or maybe the Junker was copied from the Chinese!!).

Thanks for sharing Ray.

73, PH

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 5:41 AM, Raymond Lee <vr2u...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr. <djri...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Raymond Lee <vr2u...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

Enjoy.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

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[D.J.J. Ring, Jr.]

I used Audacity to measure the dots; they're just over 60ms in length - probably about 62 ms.

Maybe our official R/O mathematician can compute the speed from dot speed for us?

73

DR

[Raymond Lee]

If the dot duration is 62 ms, then his speed is 38.7 WPM, i.e. he could pound out 967.5 dots per minute.  This means he could transmit 38.7 numbers of "PARIS" per minute with 7-dot length as inter-word space.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

Hong Kong

DR

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[Harry Wilson]

Thanks for the post and re-post, Ray/DR.  Amazing sending!  This guy must have a wrist and forearm like “Popeye the Sailorman”.

Appears to be sending letters in the English alphabet.  I would listen closer if I thought there were a clue embedded to winning tonight's Mega Millions lottery.    

Are there CW codes for each alphabet:  like Chinese, Greek, Cyrillic, Arabic, and Cunieform?  How do you send, “ß“ in CW in Deutsch?

HW

From: R/O David Ring - N1EA
Sent: ‎Saturday‎, ‎November‎ ‎21‎, ‎2015 ‎3‎:‎41‎ ‎PM
To: radio-o...@googlegroups.com

This message failed to make the group as it was sent directly to me, and I bounced (redirected) Ray's reply to me to this group and not the original message as it had a huge attachment which I uploaded to youtube.com.

From Ray VR2UW

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

https://youtu.be/LW99OmWvr9A

73

R/O Ray VR2UW
sent via your conductor of this forum, R/O DR N1EA

On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 2:58:16 PM UTC-5, VR2UW wrote:

Hi Dave

He is not a ham.  In the video, he was pounding 4-figure numeral group of Chinese characters with the revised Chinese military cut numbers prevailing in the early 1970s.  The said cut numbers were no longer valid in China nowadays.  The prosign AR at the end of the video is really fast.  

The audio oscillator in the video deems drifting and thus blemishes his QRQ.

His fist is professional as his Morse key is not bolted down on the table top yet the key itself still stays put under QRQ manipulation with a super hard tension spring! 

73's de Ray, VR2UW

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:49 AM, D.J.J. Ring, Jr.  wrote:

Wow I wish he'd make an error once and a while!

Is this you?  Is he a ham operator?

73
DR

On Sat, Nov 21, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Raymond Lee  wrote:

Hi Dave

Attached please find a video in which an ex-military radioman manually transmit with a speed exceeding 35wpm!

Enjoy.

73's de Ray, VR2UW

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[Raymond Lee]

Well, the typical Chinese military key is modeled as K-4 and it looks like a German M-99 key of 1899 era.  The general features of the wooden based M-99 is entirely different with the Continental hand key but resembles the American's!  The weakest part of the K-4 is its fragile hollow phenolic base.

Experienced Chinese military radiomen generally achieve manual keying speed of more than 30 WPM.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/radio-officers/CAKvRJAVqtD1joO%2Bs1pDdPh8CqQY6CZxd3Wk4d7YKKeF_JZsQ-g%40mail.gmail.com.