Brutal Doom V21 Gold

[Jayme Bostic]

Whatis the best Brutal Doom version? I really wanna know whats the best version out there and if you guys can possibly attach any file so i can try it out. If you came here just for saying "brutal doom is bad just play vanilla" then just dont write it please, i already know all the controversity behind Brutal Doom so... I would even like other Brutal Doom mods like BD Platinum or Black Edition, not just "vanilla" Brutal Doom. ALSO any suggestion for some Brutal Heretic, Hexen and Strife mod?

If you want the real, modern Brutal DOOM experience, than you should play Brutal DOOM V21 Gold or Project Brutality. There is also an older version that competes with the new one, but I am not sure which version that is.

If you want a more vanilla and more DOOM version, of course, the main V21 version is the way to go, along with Brutal DOOM Lite, which removes some fluff from the original mod in order to make it a bit more smaller and vanilla.

Personally, I like "Call Of Doom", that is something like mashup of "Brutal Doom" & "Real Guns Hardcore" (that was previously a "Real Guns Advanced 2" by Voltlok).

There is also "Operation Inhumanity", that like "Call Of Doom", but there is less weapons to play with (I think).

My earliest spinoff of Brutal Doom addition into the BD universe is Perfect Dark Brutal Doom+ Brutal Monsters. Its a fusion mod in one file because it wasn't compatible with BD21, and its best with the monsters. Perfect Dark Brutal Doom is a fork off of Perfect Dark Weapons Reloaded in Doom.

I am planning to play DooM, Sigil, DooM II, TNT, Plutonia and the Hell on Earth Starterpack with Brutal DooM because 1) I really enjoy BD and 2) I already know all of those MegaWADs without the BD-Mod - with the exception of Hell on Earth Starterpack, this one is completely new to me.

How exactly does Brutal DooM alter the WAD files? I mean, how does Brutal DooM know "when" to change something? For example, in the very first DooM Level E1M1 there are already minor changes in the first room with warning lights at the ceiling and a giant burning aircraft standing on the outside field right to the starting position (where the blue armor is).

Can't be arsed to download Brutal Doom and confirm this, but my best guess is an ACS script that checks which level is loaded and applies the necessary alterations accordingly. That's one of only a few possible methods without ripping the maps themselves right out of the IWADs and modifying them, but I doubt SgtMark would tread that path. It is a major legal gray area after all.

Out of topic, but if you're looking to play wads built specifically for Brutal Doom (rather than vanilla wads with BD slapped on), I can link you my one. But it only works for Brutal Doom v2b. Any other version will cause bugs or even break it, as the scripts are very dependent on the resources that version has.

I'd fancy both - Brutal DooM features slapped upon already existing WADs and specially built WADs for BD. Since it's no big deal swapping out a BD.pk3 you can of course link me to your maps, I've already downloaded v20bR3.

I also tried playing Hell on Earth Starterpack without Brutal DooM just to check out the differences. Ammunition is so scarce even in the first level that I doubt it was ever in the creators mind being played without Brutal DooM ^^

ITs quite a grey are, kinda bordering the Illegal, but well...

Also, there is a more advanced version of Hell on Earth Starter pack called ''Extermination Day'', maybe you want to check it out.

About the legal problems of doing it, there is nothing stopping you from doing this. You just won't be allowed to upload it to idgames. Mr Chris used literally all Doom maps from all Doom games to make his popular Maps of Chaos, and as far as I know, Bethesda never tried to throw him in jail for it, despite the fact that it allows you to play literally every doom map from every classic doom game using FreeDoom.

The real question is... should you work on it?

See... in 2015 I started working on a new feature for Brutal Doom called "The Map Enhancement System". Same idea as yours, improving Doom maps by adding new stuff to them. But I wanted to get around the limitation of modifying Doom maps. So how I did it? I wrote about 30,000 lines of DECORATE code to make a system that could read what map has been loaded.

Yes, I opened every Doom map from the classic games and checked the position of every object, so I could find the X and Y world coordinates of them, feed them into the code, and manually add every new detail through DECORATE code. Spawning them in every specific point of the map. Techbase levels have shinny new textures, the cities of Doom 2 have Terminator-like post-apocalyptic debris, the jungles of Plutonia looks like an actual jungle, and so on.

Here is a picture of what it looks like:

How long it took? 3 fucking years.

3 years of my life wasted into a stupid obsession developing an useless feature. Time I regret wasting. Time I should had spent with my family and friends, or working on my own stuff, my own maps, my own games. Before this I had this other stupid idea of a project called "Recurring Nightmares" that I probably spent another year on it.

The system also works with a switch in the options menu, you can turn it off and just play normal Vanilla levels. To my surprise, half of the people who record playthroughs of Brutal Doom disables this feature. Another highlight of how useless it was.

Also there is a golden rule: A polished turd is still a turd. I learned the hard way that no amount of new lights, textures, and cluttering decorations will improve maps like The Chasm or Unruly Evil. There is just no point in trying to save them. They can't be saved.

So here is my advice: Don't do it. Go make your own stuff. Don't waste a portion of your life working on something this irrelevant. Whatever map you make, no mater how bad it turns out, is still a better idea than trying to polish the game's original maps. At least you can improve your mapping skills through trial and error. But you won't learn anything trying to copy somebody else's work.

Are there ANY other (Mega)WADs that have been out for maybe a couple of years, got infamous throughout the fanbase and got a proper "polish", as SgtMark himself calls it? Or are there any other MegaWADs with Brutal DooM already and packed with those extra stuff only available through Brutal DooM?

Let's not turn this thread into another "here's my opinion on Brutal Doom" shitshow, please. The whole point of this thread was simply a technical curiosity about how a thing in the mod works, and the OP's question was answered swiftly. There's no need to take it further than that.

Judging by Gez's linked thread to Mark's comments about the map enhancement system, I'm pretty sure the answer is no. As said, you will have to boot up a map editor and do a ton of tinkering and alterations for these impressive visuals to work.

I'm not aware of any more megaWADs specifically made with BD in mind besides what's already been mentioned. As for the IWADs, all BD does is muck with the textures thanks to its Map Enhancement System and changes demon behaviour. It should also be noted that BD has a habit of breaking maps in terms of progression, causing things to not function properly, so you might find lifts not going up or down or sometimes a door might not open, that sort of thing.

Regardless of whether you think it's an improvement or not, SM4 said it covered every Doom map from the classic games, which I suppose means doom.wad, doom2.wad, tnt.wad and plutonia.wad. And nothing else.

It's just add decorate stuff on the maps, it's to your perception if you find it more fun or not. They can also alter the way the game it's played, as car dervis on MAP 15 in DOOM 2 may stop you circle strafes.

If anything, i only like to use that with gameplay mods, not a reason to play MAP ENCHAMENT in vainilla.

Please read the description in moddb. If you want to unlock all special rooms / full content you can replay in a higher difficulty. There's lots of scripting specifically tailored to Brutal Doom. 9 level wad.

I don't play Brutal Doom so I can't comment on good wads that would work with it. There are hundreds and hundreds of good megawads though.

Going through the Cacowards will give to a lot to play:

Some quick recommendations: Alien Vendetta, Doom 2 Reloaded, Scythe 2, the Community Chest megawads, Hell Revealed 2, Plutonia 2. yes a lot of 2's in there.

Memento Mori 1&2 and Requiem are (along with HR and AV) the "classic" megawads often recommended, they're not so hard but still worth playing IMO, especially Requiem.

Also I just finished playing the NOVA beta, I thought it was very good and they might be interested in hearing how it plays in BD even though that's not the focus. Not too hard until the last few maps.

-mods/66581-nova-the-birth-beta-playtesting-thread-were-ready/

I don't know why Plutonia would crash often, what port/version are you using?

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