Fedora 29 has reached EOL

[Andrew David Wong]

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Dear Qubes Community,

Fedora 29 has reached EOL (end-of-life). [1] We strongly recommend that
all Qubes users upgrade their Fedora 29 TemplateVMs and StandaloneVMs to
Fedora 30 immediately. We provide step-by-step upgrade instructions for
upgrading Fedora TemplateVMs. [2] For a complete list of TemplateVM
versions supported for your specific version of Qubes, see the Supported
TemplateVM Versions page. [3]

We also provide a fresh Fedora 30 TemplateVM package through the
official Qubes repositories, which you can install in dom0 by following
the standard installation instructions. [4]

After upgrading your TemplateVMs, please remember to switch all qubes
that were using the old template to use the new one. [5]

Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS version in
dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and EOL. [6]


[1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/End_of_life
[2] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/template/fedora/upgrade/
[3] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#templatevms
[4] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/templates/fedora/#installing
[5] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/templates/#switching
[6] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#note-on-dom0-and-eol

This announcement is also available on the Qubes website:
https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2019/11/29/fedora-29-eol/

- --
Andrew David Wong (Axon)
Community Manager, Qubes OS
https://www.qubes-os.org

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[tetra...@danwin1210.me]

On Fri, Nov 29, 2019 at 04:17:39AM -0600, Andrew David Wong wrote:
>Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS version in
>dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and EOL. [6]

There have been a lot of dom0 updates recently. Is this related to EOL?

[Andrew David Wong]

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Hash: SHA512

No, those were not related to EOL.

P.S. -- Please do not write to both lists.

- --
Andrew David Wong (Axon)
Community Manager, Qubes OS
https://www.qubes-os.org

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[tetra...@danwin1210.me]

On Fri, Nov 29, 2019 at 11:58:03PM -0600, Andrew David Wong wrote:
>No, those were not related to EOL.
>
>P.S. -- Please do not write to both lists.

Ok thanks. Sorry for sending to both, I hit "reply all" and didn't look
at the result.

[Claudia]

Andrew David Wong:

> Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS version in
> dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and EOL. [6]

> [6] https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#note-on-dom0-and-eol


Is it *possible* to upgrade dom0 to, say, F30, if we wanted to? I seem
to remember reading somewhere it's pretty much impossible, but I haven't
been able to find that article.

I have a newer machine, and I've found several hardware features that
work under F30 but not F25 and not under Qubes even with the same kernel
version as tested in F30 (suggesting the Fedora userland plays a role too).

It seems like the 5+ version lag could be holding back a lot of
potential Qubes users. Especially considering Qubes/Xen is quite
hardware-sensitive to begin with.

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[Andrew David Wong]

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Hash: SHA512

On 2019-11-28 1:16 AM, Claudia wrote:
> Andrew David Wong:
>> Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS
>> version in dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and
>> EOL. [6] [6]
>> https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#note-on-dom0-and-eol
>
>>
>
> Is it *possible* to upgrade dom0 to, say, F30, if we wanted to? I
> seem to remember reading somewhere it's pretty much impossible, but
> I haven't been able to find that article.
>

Not as far as I know, but Marek and Frédéric (CCed) would know more
about this.

> I have a newer machine, and I've found several hardware features
> that work under F30 but not F25 and not under Qubes even with the
> same kernel version as tested in F30 (suggesting the Fedora
> userland plays a role too).
>
> It seems like the 5+ version lag could be holding back a lot of
> potential Qubes users. Especially considering Qubes/Xen is quite
> hardware-sensitive to begin with.
>

It sounds like your best bet might be to try R4.1, which will run
Fedora 29: https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/4225

- --
Andrew David Wong (Axon)
Community Manager, Qubes OS
https://www.qubes-os.org

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[Frédéric Pierret]

On 2019-12-02 01:01, Andrew David Wong wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA512
>
> On 2019-11-28 1:16 AM, Claudia wrote:
>> Andrew David Wong:
>>> Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS
>>> version in dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and
>>> EOL. [6] [6]
>>> https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#note-on-dom0-and-eol
>> Is it *possible* to upgrade dom0 to, say, F30, if we wanted to? I
>> seem to remember reading somewhere it's pretty much impossible, but
>> I haven't been able to find that article.
>>
> Not as far as I know, but Marek and Frédéric (CCed) would know more
> about this.

Even if in theory, this is possible but that would mean to patch R4.0
with a lot of adjustments in upstream R4.1. I would discourage such
attempt because there is major differences between fc25 and fc30. That
would also mean doing the work we have done for going to dom0 fc29.

We are going to use dom0 fc31 instead of fc29 for next release 4.1 and
there is also other troubles like python3 migration as python2 is
assumed deprecated in Fedora 31.

[Andrew David Wong]

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Hash: SHA512

On 2019-12-02 2:32 AM, Frédéric Pierret wrote:
>
> On 2019-12-02 01:01, Andrew David Wong wrote:
> On 2019-11-28 1:16 AM, Claudia wrote:
>>>> Andrew David Wong:
>>>>> Please note that no user action is required regarding the OS
>>>>> version in dom0. For details, please see our Note on dom0 and
>>>>> EOL. [6] [6]
>>>>> https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/supported-versions/#note-on-dom0-and-eol
>>>> Is it *possible* to upgrade dom0 to, say, F30, if we wanted to? I
>>>> seem to remember reading somewhere it's pretty much impossible, but
>>>> I haven't been able to find that article.
>>>>
> Not as far as I know, but Marek and Frédéric (CCed) would know more
> about this.
>
>> Even if in theory, this is possible but that would mean to patch R4.0
>> with a lot of adjustments in upstream R4.1. I would discourage such
>> attempt because there is major differences between fc25 and fc30. That
>> would also mean doing the work we have done for going to dom0 fc29.
>
>> We are going to use dom0 fc31 instead of fc29 for next release 4.1 and
>> there is also other troubles like python3 migration as python2 is
>> assumed deprecated in Fedora 31.
>

Ok, thanks. I will update the documentation accordingly.

>>>> I have a newer machine, and I've found several hardware features
>>>> that work under F30 but not F25 and not under Qubes even with the
>>>> same kernel version as tested in F30 (suggesting the Fedora
>>>> userland plays a role too).
>>>>
>>>> It seems like the 5+ version lag could be holding back a lot of
>>>> potential Qubes users. Especially considering Qubes/Xen is quite
>>>> hardware-sensitive to begin with.
>>>>
> It sounds like your best bet might be to try R4.1, which will run
> Fedora 29: https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/4225
>

- --
Andrew David Wong (Axon)
Community Manager, Qubes OS
https://www.qubes-os.org

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[Claudia]

Frédéric Pierret:

Thanks for the responses. That's pretty much what I was expecting to
hear. I did install 4.1 on this machine at one point, but after
installation it would hang at the boot splash, so I couldn't test if the
hardware worked. Incidentally, I ran into that same issue when I install
4.0.2 and was able to fix it, so I may be able to get 4.1 running this
time around. (In case you're interested:
https://www.mail-archive.com/qubes...@googlegroups.com/msg31199.html)

Is there an ETA on the F31-based 4.1 build, or is it still going to be a
while? Is there a specific build or milestone or something should I be
watching for? (I plan on getting the iso from openqa)

[Frédéric Pierret (fepitre)]

Before end of the month we hope to have a testing ISO for dev purpose.
Currently we are on upgrading Fedora installer which have drastically
changed the way of creating ISO.

[Claudia]

Frédéric Pierret (fepitre):

> Before end of the month we hope to have a testing ISO for dev purpose.
> Currently we are on upgrading Fedora installer which have drastically
> changed the way of creating ISO.

Awesome. I'll keep my eye out for it. Thanks.