Further steps to diagnose boot / install failure?

[sub...@grey-panther.net]

Hi all,

I'm trying to install QubesOS on a Lenovo Yoga 370. The given CPU (i7-7500U) should be compatible (since https://www.qubes-os.org/hcl/ mentions multiple other laptops with the same CPU as being compatible). The laptop also nicely boots other Linux distributions (like Debian).

The problem is that the GUI of the installer just doesn't come up. Even if I choose the "debug" boot, a bunch of messages scroll by and then the screen becomes black and nothing happens any more. Again, I don't have any problems with booting / installing Debian for example.

Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot this further?

Best,

G.P.

[Tobias Killer]

Am 05.04.25 um 16:07 schrieb subqub via qubes-users:

Hello G.P.,

I also experienced that behavior (GUI installer does not show up; black
screen) in the past. It turned out that the ISO image on the USB stick
was slightly different from the ISO image I “burned” to the USB stick
using dd.

So, I tried to “burn” the whole ISO image again onto the USB stick
(using dd) but with similar failure. Finally, I wrote a program which
fixed only the differences and then it worked!

You can find my program here:

https://codeberg.org/tokideveloper/ddpolymerase/

The GRUB menu of the Qubes OS installer also offers to check the media
before installing. You can also try that.

See also:

https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/4840
https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/7030

Best regards,

Tobias

[Catacombs]

Tobias Killer seems more knowledgeable than myself.  Still, I have had some trials trying to install Qubes to different computers in the past, and I am, a person who just tries things.

Things I read on the Qubes Forum of folks who have problems,  newcomers sometimes try to install Qubes before verifying the BIOS/EFI on their target computer has the Virtualization turned on. 

I am surprised to read that DD could have a failure.  I don't use  dd myself.  I am apprehensive about using dd when I write to a USB on a computer that has several drives, as I might get confused and write over something I really did not intend to. 

So I use the tools in Mint Linux for USB.  If Mint is running, on all the programs, type in USB.  Natively Mint has a USB formatting program, which I use to write FAT32 format to the USB stick.  I want it pristine.   Then I use the USB image writer tool to write Qubes to the freshly formatted USB drive.   I guess if I really carry out my fantasies of really top notch security.  I would use a newly broken open package of a USB key, which I bought from a random store at least a hundred miles from where I live.  and use dd to write the Qubes install.  (from a freshly installed Linux computer)

I am guessing you are using the latest stable version of Qubes, with the latest kernel, (select-able at the beginning of install)?? 

Some folks have had issues with graphics chips or graphics cards needing a setting,  to be made a the beginning of the Qubes install.  

I have some computers which will not allow for two internal drives to be used at the same time, and some which don't seem to care, I can have Qubes on one drive, and almost anything else on the other drive.  Librem 13v2 has both the original drive, and a later added M2.   Qubes requires one of the drives to be formatted and not used.  the original drive is simply formatted, empty, and unused.  Probably some means to use both, but I don't bother. 

I also have had problems trying to install some of the earlier versions of Qubes on a drive, which had another operating system already on it.  So I have used some Live Linux USB to overwrite the entire SATA drive with FAT32, and because of my fantasies of Security, have overwritten all the target drive with ones.  I choose FAT32 to start the install to make sure the Qubes installer will write its own boot sector. 

This is not like a hard and fast rules to install Qubes, it is like my recipe.  and some of this may be a waste of time for you to try.

Please state all the exact specifications of your laptop.  Not just processor, but RAM, BIOS/EFI, graphics information.  Well, that is for folks more knowledgeable than myself. 

I thought I would jump in as a Sunday is the day a lot of folks have time to fiddle with computers.  Even though we have some more knowledgeable folks on Qubes and Qubes install to your exact computer.  later today.

There is some re-writing documentation, although the documentation on this now is not wrong. 

It would be easier for others to give answers if you joined the Qubes Forum.

I tip my hat to Tobias Killer, and OP.    I am off to waste money at the store. 

[Tobias Killer]

Am 06.04.25 um 14:18 schrieb Catacombs:

> I am surprised to read that DD could have a failure.

I don't want to claim that `dd` is the culprit. Maybe the USB stick is
faulty. Or the combination “`dd` + USB stick” doesn't work well. I don't
know.

I also tested “burning” an ISO image onto a USB stick with other
programs. Surprisingly, `pv` worked flawlessly with USB sticks where
`dd` failed. So, maybe `dd` is in fact the culprit and (for an old tool)
not ready for modern media like USB sticks. Maybe it does something
different from `pv` but I didn't compare the sources yet.

However, even if the USB stick is fine with a verified ISO image on it,
some of my USB sticks seem to produce bit flips after a couple of weeks.
So, `ddpolymerase` is still useful when you want to rewrite the ISO
image since it saves write cycles.

[Ulrich Windl]

Hi!

One should be aware that the Linux kernel may use write caching, so when dd returns to the prompt the kernel may still write data to the stick. Blessed those who still have a stick with an activity LED...

Ulrich

[qubist]

It is always a good idea to run a 'sync' before unplugging.

[Tobias Killer]

The issues I mentioned remain, even with `sync` before unplugging.

[qubist]

> The issues I mentioned remain, even with `sync` before unplugging.

Are you probably using a cable between the USB stick and the USB port? Some cables can cause problems.

Have you tried the whole operation on a different USB port?

Just thinking aloud... what I would check.

[Tobias Killer]

Am 07.04.25 um 18:41 schrieb qubist:

>> The issues I mentioned remain, even with `sync` before unplugging.
>
> Are you probably using a cable between the USB stick and the USB port? Some cables can cause problems.

No, no cable used.

> Have you tried the whole operation on a different USB port?

Good point. I'm not sure. But a faulty USB port is like a faulty USB
stick: no reliable hardware. And I don't want to buy more and more of
new hardware. And even if I had “reliable” hardware, it could break
tomorrow in a subtle way.

[Ulrich Windl]

Hi!

A final idea: Did you check the stick? Once I had a problem and it turned out that the stick was dying, even though not used much.
You could try h2testw (https://www.heise.de/download/product/h2testw-50539) in Windows. Even though English sites offering it exist, I'd recommend to download from the original site.

Ulrich

[qubist]

On Tue, 8 Apr 2025 15:50:48 +0000 Tobias Killer wrote:

> And I don't want to buy more and more of new hardware.

Unfortunately, hardware always fails regardless of our desire.
I hope you find the culprit.

[qubist]

On Tue, 8 Apr 2025 15:50:48 +0000 Tobias Killer wrote:

> No, no cable used.

BTW, I don't know how it is on your laptop but I had a desktop on which
the USB ports were connected to the MB with a cable.

[Catacombs]

i tried to use this to PM you.

I wanted to suggest, please create a login on Qubes Forum.  https://forum.qubes-os.org/

PM me, and I will communicate more. 

That is, If you want.

[qubist]

I already have an account.

No need to PM me through forum though. This is a mailing list, so...
email addresses are public.

[Catacombs]

Thank you for replying.  I intended to suggest Original Poster, get a Qubes Forum account, and Personal Message me when he did so, as I had a dialogue intended just for OP.

[sub...@grey-panther.net]

Hello all,

I used the latest ISO available from the Qubes-OS website (Qubes-R4.2.4-x86_64.iso). I verified with sha256sum that the ISO is complete / not corrupted (checking against the hashes published by the qubes-os project: https://mirrors.edge.kernel.org/qubes/iso/Qubes-R4.2.4-x86_64.iso.DIGESTS). The ISO was written to the USB stick using DD + sync, as recommended by the Qubes-OS projet (see the "Linux ISO to USB" section here: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/installation-guide/). I even checked the contents of the USB by reading it back and comparing it to the ISO byte by byte: sudo dd if=/dev/sdb count=14191416 status=progress | diff --binary - Qubes-R4.2.4-x86_64.iso (the number 14191416 comes from dividing the ISO size by the default block size of dd of 512). I did this across two different USB sticks, no luck. At this point I don't think it's an issue with the USB sticks.

At some point it did display some more messages, but then it hung again:

Again, the same laptop works perfectly with Debian Bookworm for example.

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[Catacombs]

Laptop mode switched on?

I do not know anything about such dual boot. 

1. I wanted to PM you, but this google groups does not show all of your email address. and apparently the PM section on google groups, no one replies to. 
   

It would be easier to offer to help you if you were registered on Qubes Users Forum.  

If you needed to accomplish a secure communication, like if you had a need to,  Might be better to use TAILS OS, a live Distro. 

[Tobias Killer]

Hello,

maybe your computer hardware is the reason. Or `dd` when it writes
larger ranges. I don't know.

The symptoms may vary as long as the USB stick is not properly “burned”.

I can only refer to my first post in this thread. Good luck!

Best regards,

Tobias

Am 13.04.25 um 14:31 schrieb subqub via qubes-users:

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